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good morning. and welcome to "am joy." as of this morning, more than 930,000 americans have tested positive for covid-19.

in a little over a month, the death toll in the united states has gone from 41 reported deaths on march 15th to more than 53,000 today. the number of unemployed americans also skyrocketed with an additional 4.4 million new unemployment claims just this week. bringing the five-week total to more than 26 million. congress passed yet another relief bill, which replenishes the paid protection plan for small businesses. and allocates more funding for hospitals and testing. critics of the bill say it doesn't go far enough. the bill leaves out crucial funding for state and city governments, snap benefits and rent relief to name a few. without that fund, state and local governments are bracing for and in some cases already enacting major layoffs and budget cuts that could impact essential services. congress is already looking toward the next relief bill, while back at the white house donald trump skipped out on his daily campaign rally, disguised as a press briefing on saturday

for first time in two weeks. trump blamed the media for his absence in a tweet, but new nbc reporting tells a different story. the white house is considering reducing trump's briefing appearances, apparently aides are concerned the briefings are backfiring politically. especially after the president suggested people ingest disinfectants to cure covid-19, forcing companies like the makers of lysol to issue warnings to please not ingest their products. after the comments, which he later tried to rewrite as sarcastic, despite the entire exchange with the scientific team during the opening part of his briefing were on tape, new york city poison control center reported that calls about exposure to bleach, lysol and other household cleaners more than doubled. joining me now is speaker of the house nancy pelosi. speaker pelosi, good morning. thank you for being here. >> good morning. my pleasure. i wish it were under different circumstances. >> i do indeed as well. this is an extraordinary

circumstance that we're seeing in which a president of the united states has had to walk back and pretend he did not suggest that the american people ingest disinfectants and shine uv light on themselves which could burn people, and that the white house is scrambling to prevepr pretend that wasn't real when we all saw that happen on live tv. can you comment on the seriously of what we have seen happen and what comes out of donald trump's mouth these days. >> i just want to say how sad it all is, the numbers are staggering in terms of the infections, but also, of course, the deaths so serious, every family a tragedy. and yet we have these comments coming out of the white house of the president has been irresponsible and we have insisted on the truth. he said it was a hoax, he said it would go away magically, he said all kinds of things that

were not true. and people believe him, he's the president of the united states, the president's words have weight. they have weight. so now that he's gone to this limit, at least it means that lots of scientists and medical professionals have come forth and said, no, he has gone too far this time. as i said, as a mom and a grandmother, i'm embarrassed sometimes how the president talks, he's crude in that you don't want children to hear that, but this is dangerous. this is dangerous. so speaker we have put forth four bills in a bipartisan way to help take us into the future. ignoring some of his comments and instead paying attention to science, evidence, data, fact and truth, insisting on the truth. >> let's talk about those bills. we do know there has been this next bite, we know there will be further bills, in the current

relief bill, here are some of the highlights of the bill for the audience, the paycheck protection program has been renewed with $320 billion in fresh funding, $75 billion for hospitals and healthcare workers, providers, economic disaster loan fund of $60 billion and covid-19 testing of $25 billion. some things did not make it into the bill. take a listen. >> where is the permanent sick leave? where is the salary protection? where is the represent forgiveness? where is the guarantee that utilities can't be shut off? where is the money are undocumented workers and the homeless? where is the direct money for those communities people of color that are being hurt the most and poor communities like up in appalachia and kentucky? we're making a fundamental

mistake. the data tells us pandemic spreads through the officials of this society and these bills are a dereliction of duty. it says too many people are still too comfortable with too many other people's deaths. >> what is your response to that, madam speaker? >> well, i'm a gradeeat admirer listen to stories from -- and he's absolutely right, we have to have many more things in this. and we did in c.a.r.e.s. one. we were preparing for c.a.r.e.s. two when along came this intervention. and i really wish the people would understand better what maxine waters and nydia velazqu velazquez, the chair of the financial services committee and the small business committee chair, put into this bill to take it from a place of 250 first come first serve from the

banks to community development, financial institutions now being able to lend to those who are previously had been underbanked. they don't have sophisticated relationships with banks. this is a specific interim bill and we changed it from ppp, which we all support, and we want to renew that, not without removing the hardening of the disparity to access to credit for so many of the underbanked, some of whom the reverend mentioned there. we -- it is hard to understand but we will get it in the next bill, why we couldn't get snap in this bill, snap that is food stamp program. first of all, it is a moral thing to do. people need it. third of all, it is a stimulus to the economy. the -- in c.a.r.e.s. one and we will do it again in c.a.r.e.s. two, in our bills, we have had

legislation about evictions and mortgage foreclosure and the rest. that agenda is our agenda as well. so of it will be possible. some not now. and depending on the timing. the president said he would do state and local. this bill we wanted to just do and move on. chuck schumer fought very hard in the senate as i did in the house, but he, being the senators, you know, they speak from a state perspective, he fought very, very hard for state and local in the bill that we did. and they said, you know, you're having another bill, we'll do it then. and we will. and we will do it in a significant way. and why we will succeed is because the governors -- democrats and republicans, are insisting upon it. they have made outlays for the coronavirus that are extraordinary. and they have lost revenue and we want that covered because of the coronavirus. and what that covered too.

state and local, let's say our heroes our heroes are healthcare workers, first responders, police, fire, transportation workers, emergency services, postal service, food folks. all of the people who make our lives possible, many of them risking their lives in order to save lives and now they're in danger of losing their jobs. so that's what -- when we say state and local, we're talking about jobs. jobs in the front line of the coronavirus. and that's what chuck fought for to ensure we would get it as soon as possible. the president, you know, understand, you have to have a signature from the white house. president says he's going to do it now. and we take -- take him at his word. but not only that, we are advocating in a bipartisan way governors, mayors, democrats, and republicans, to make sure

that happens. snap, for sure, rent assistance, the list -- everything is impacted here. we have to, again, working with our friends and labor talk about safety in the workplace, job security, pension security, we have an array of concerns that are other priorities of all of us and we have to get as much of it as possible. but understand, we're two different parties, they do not share many of our values or our beliefs. so we just have to get the public as engaged as possible in that, and i always welcome the beautiful values based statements of the reverend. >> yeah. and, you know, to that very point, i think that it is clear that the parties are markedly different in terms of values and what they value, what each party values and donald trump has mitch mcconnell fighting for what it is that he wants.

i think for a lot of people the question is whether or not democrats have at any point said to mitch mcconnell, said to the white house, look, this is what we're doing. we want there to be, for instance, we heard doctors and first responders say, you know, they love to have loan forgiveness, crushing educational loans in a lot of cases. people who are in places like appalachia, people who are poor or saying, some benefits would be good here too, gig economy workers, et cetera, need help. and make the republicans say no. make them say no publicly and make them pay the price for it. what do you make of that argument? >> well, couple of things, first of all, we do have to recognize that there are those who -- need debt forgiveness or some percentage of it. we also need -- some people do not have school debt or -- but they are in a hazardous situation and we will have

hazard pay. chuck schumer is taking the lead on that in the united states senate and that is a priority for us on both sides of the aisle. what i said to some of my, shall we say, our impatient relentless persistent dissatisfied advocates and that's what advocates are, i say to them one thing we have to do is just curate, prioritize what we must have, recognizing that we have to have the public with us on this. and, i've said this to the -- on any number of occasions, you have to be ready to walk. you have to just say, i'm ready to walk. now, what is the -- how do you weigh the equities in that? what do you lose? i had concerns they were not sufficiently committed to doing -- collecting the data so that we could see the disparity in how this was hitting coronavirus was hitting communities of color and the

rest. i said, i can't even get the votes for that. that's one way to -- we got that in the bill. >> right. well, let me ask you a couple of other specifics. that's a good point of what is the politics of the possible her. we know now coming out of wisconsin, that there have been 40 coronavirus cases that have been directly linked to milwaukee county and the forcing of voters in a lot of cases urban voters, black voter, to stand in line to vote. senator kamala harris was on this program yesterday, discussing her vote save act that she is right now getting co-sponsors for to try to protect the vote in november. what is the status of trying to get election protection and also help for the post office, which would be tied to that and making sure that the post office is not defunded because there are a lot of people who were worried we won't have a free and fair and safe election in november. >> we talk about this whole

coronavirus challenge in three ways. the lives of the american people, the livelihood in terms of the economy, and the life of our democracy. it is very important for us. we have $400 million in c.a.r.e.s. one. we wanted more. we had put in $2 billion. we wanted more. and maybe more than that depending on the -- how long this persists. so it is very essential, it is essential that we can vote by mail and we had in our bill, i'm glad you asked about this, we had in our house democratic bill that we sent over to the senate, we had requirements that states must send an absentee ballot to every registered voter. that they should have same day registration. other opportunities to remove obstacles of participation. instead, they took down the number, they took it way down, we got it back up to $400

million, which is a good start. just a start. down payment. and then we -- they put in -- in order for the states to participate in receiving those funds, they had to put up like 20% of it themselves. well, forget that. not only should they forget it, not only should i say that, but the state -- the national association of secretaries of state, which is bipartisan, led by a republican, said get that requirement out of the bill. and there is some other bad things too. they're not -- it is unworkable, not going to be able to use the money if you have to pay to get it. so this is important. what they -- what happened in wisconsin was unconscionable on the part of the united states supreme court. they turned themselves into party hacks. party hacks. the court said, the election had to take place on that day, the court -- the lower court also said, though, should be

consideration for more time for getting and counting absentee ballots. the supreme court even reversed that. they said you can't do the election, you have to do the election that day, but no accommodation and why? because they had a political purpose. disgraceful. however, under the leadership of wisconsin, the democratic party and the democratic establishment there, and the messaging that went out to the public, they won the election, thank god. but they taught us a lot of things about voter protection and actually what the supreme court of the united states said to the state of wisconsin is why don't we all just go to the mardi gras together. so we can all be contaminated. having those people stand in those lines for those hours having to interact with people and the polling place, unnecessarily, terrible. but in any event, they won, thank god, and they won a lot of

it with the absentee ballots. >> yeah. indeed. in a rare case, absentee ballots, more democratic than republican. on a couple of other issues, one of them is the incarcerated population. a lot of that population is federal. there is a concern this could be a fresh source of outbreak and there could be a disaster for incarcerated people because of this virus. is anything being considered for the next bill to deal with that? >> in our caucus, we are very devoted to the gospel of matthew when i was hungry, you fed me, when i was homeless, you sheltered me, when i was imprisoned, you visited me. and so this for us is a part of our value system. and our -- especially under the leadership of our congressional black caucus, and others, there has been a real focus on this.

we will have language developed by the judiciary committee to have some order and clarity so that some people can leave who don't really need to be there but clarity because what the administration is doing is confusing. and not clear. but it must be addressed. and it must be addressed. it is so very sad. but, again, a priority for us. everything should be about the truth and saying insist on the truth. what are the numbers? let's find out. let's find out what this is. what are the facts? what is the science of this, of these people being together there unnecessarily and then in cases some of them having served enough of a sentence to leave, but in any event, whatever it is, that they be protected, that their health be protected. shouldn't be a risk of life. and that's largely the issue from there. we want to protect everyone.

and we want it to be something that knows no economic, legal, ethnic, racial difference. and that's why we're very proud of what we put into this bill that people are saying didn't do enough in there. but we did get the mobile -- mr. clyburn our distinguished whip, was very much about getting the mobility of -- out there to test and to trace and the rest. but, again, let's come back. science, science, science, testing, testing, testing, tracing, tracing, tracing. isolation. treatment, prevention for everyone because that's the right thing to do. but it is also the safest. >> indeed. hopefully it will also -- >> insist on the truth. give us the facts. insist on the truth and ignore some of what the president said.

i'll tell you what the public wants us to see, they want to see our heroes protected and so that's part of our thrust as we go in for the state and local. they want their checks. their unemployment checks, their rent payment checks, their -- the small business checks. and they don't want any of our money. any taxpayer money being squandered by big industries who get this money, the money is to be spent, to keep people in jobs and not for enriching shareholders, dividends, bonuses, ceo pay or any of that. there are three things that in our -- what we're doing we try to -- we're very proud in c.a.r.e.s. one to take it from triple down to worker first bubble up. and that's what we did in the next bill by saying if we are going to do more on small business, we have to recognize what the small businesses are,

women, minority, native american, rural, veteran-owned businesses that have not had the same access and we must have hospital and testing to the tune of $100 billion. so we think we accomplished a lot in that few days that -- between the ask and the passage of the bill. >> indeed. madam speaker, i hope to have you back on. we're running up against a break. i want to thank you for being here. hopefully when we bring you back, we can talk about what is going to be done regarding -- we know there are a lot of migrants still -- no idea how many are incarcerated. we would like to figure out what is being done about that population. thank you. stay safe. >> thank you, joy. stay safe. >> thank you very much. coming up next, beto o'rourke joins me to talk about the response to the pandemic in his home state of texas. e pande s hihome state of texas. open road and telling peoplege that liberty mutual customizes your insurance,

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and here's one small way that you can help them in return. complete your 2020 census today. 2020 census data helps communities plan funding for hospitals, clinics, and emergency services across the country. an accurate count helps public health officials know who is at risk, and first responders identify the resources they need to protect our communities. complete your census at 2020census.gov and help shape our future.

there are more important things than living and that's saving this country for my children and my grandchildren and saving this country for all of us. and i don't want to die. nobody wants to die. but, man, we got to take some risk and get back in the game and get this country back up and running. >> earlier this week lieutenant governor of texas dan patrick made a claim almost as outrageous as, hey, maybe try injecting bleach to cure covid-19. his rational for opening the state didn't surprise us here on "am joy." we remember dan patrick as the former shock jock who pulled antics like undergoing a vasectomy during a live broadcast and being painted blue. video of that stunt was used in his one time opponent's campaign ad and makes a point even to this day. is this really the guy you want in charge of a whole entire state during an historic health crisis? joining me is former from el

paso, former texas congressman and former presidential candidate beto o'rourke. good morning. thank you for being here. i want to point you to a tweet that you posted on tuesday. you said, let's be clear on who he, dan patrick is asking to do the dyeing. blacks and latinos are dying at a much higher rate and because texas is dead last in testing, blindly reopening the state means sending many work pour minimum wage in texas $7.25 an hour in certain sickness and death. i don't understand this rational on the right that we should reopen the state other than to understand it as they know that it is not them who would be in jeopardy. your thoughts. >> that's absolutely right. you pointed out that texas is among the last if not dead last in testing per capita. we have no idea how bad the spread of coronavirus is in our state right now. but we do know if we reopen this state, we'll be sending people who earn $7.25 an hour, who are

going to desperately be trying to feed their families into harm's way, meaning it is much more likely that they and family members will get sick and will die. it is disproportionately going to be found among african-american families and latino families in this state. that's a trend we have seen borne out across this country. so when our lieutenant governor says there are more important things than living, let's remember who he's asking to die. >> let me play another sound bite, dan patrick on fox news, about sacrificing seniors. take a listen. >> no one reached out to me and said, as a senior citizen, are you willing to take a chance on your survival in exchange for keeping the america that all america loves for your children and grandchildren. and if that's the exchange, i'm all in. let's get back to work. let's get back to living.

let's be smart about it. and those of us who are 70 plus, we'll take care of ourselves, but don't sacrifice the country. >> there have been many people who pointed out on the show just in conversations i had with people who follow this kind of thing there is something cult-like about this movement that follows donald trump. there is also something about it that worships money. that worships the money that is made off of enin large part low income work. i wonder if in your state there is a counterveiling force that can fight for -- you're doing it, but is there a strong enough counterveiling force that can fight for the low income black and brown workers who would die if the state were to reopen. >> i'm grateful for the question. as nuts as our lieutenant governor is and as crazy as our president is, perhaps willfully

so, calling for insurrection in a number of states in country, inspiring people to show up in battle gear with weapons of war like ar-15s and ak-47s, you got people who are stepping up into the breach of failed leadership and are distinguishing themselves. the county judge of dallas county, clay jenkins, first leader in our state to issue a mandatory stay at home order. politically unpopular, but very necessary to save the lives that you and i are talking about right new. a 29-year-old county judge in harris county, home to houston, texas, issuing very strict public health orders. again, politically unpopular among some, especially those who would benefit most from reopening the economy more quickly than we should, but distinguishing herself in her leadership and to the point that you and the speaker were making about voting in the time of coronavirus, we have a district judge in texas, who said you can have mail-in ballot requests

from anyone in texas who fears contracting coronavirus. that can be the disability under state law you can claim. so there are people who are stepping up to make sure that we do the right thing at this moment of truth, this great test for our country, and try to save those who are the most vulnerable among us, most likely to contract coronavirus and to die from it. so i find my hope and optimism in those who step up, those in positions of public trust like those that i named. but also the healthcare workers, the folks who are volunteering at the food banks, where we're seeing lines that stretch two, three miles long to pick up food. in el paso, demand for food decreased 400% since coronavirus started spreading in our community. you have more unemployment filings in the state in the last four weeks than you did in all of 2019. this is a crisis of

extraordinary proportions and yet people are stepping up to lead despite donald trump, despite lieutenant governor dan patrick, despite greg abbott, our twice indicted attorney general ken paxon who wants to have in person voting despite what we have learned about -- from wisconsin, where more than four dozen people we know of for sure have been sick from voting in person. >> let me put up the texas numbers. these numbers are alarming. keep in mind what a large state we're talking about here, one of the largest states, one of the biggest populations in the country. 704 people have died. 1.3 million people left unemployed. the food insecurity is pretty staggering in terms of your state. into that breach marches one steven miller. you've seen the white house use this crisis from what they always use everything for, which

is to create another sort of immigration side story for his base. we have reported that steven miller sees this crisis as an opportunity to install his long-term vision of shutting down much of nonwhite immigration, that is a very -- a story very important to texas, very relevant to texas. what do you make of the fact there are people in the white house who see this as an opportunity to keep more brown people out of the united states? >> you're absolutely right about this being part and parcel of a much larger trend and a much more encompassing effort on the part of the trump administration to stop nonwhite immigration into the united states. we know from the leaked phone call transcript, reported by the washington post, that this is not just a 60-day order as we were led to believe by the president. this is part of a long-term plan to stop immigration. really important for us at this moment to remember that a quarter of those who are working

in our clinics, in our hospitals right now, were born in another country. if your life is saved during this pandemic, good chance an immigrant saved your life. at a time of increasing food insecurity, nearly 80% of the people working in the fields, those when our restaurants reopen working in the kitchens, born in another country. those who come up with the innovations including the cures for the vaccines, good chance they're going to be immigrants as well. so this is self-defeating, against the national interests of this country, but it is also morally repugnant because in addition to what you just described, we have what will soon be covid death camps on our southern border. the orwellian named migrant protection protocol, which forced those who traveled 2,000 miles to lawfully apply for asylum in this country. no money, no connections, no access to healthcare. this is a perfect breeding

ground for coronavirus. we should follow our own laws and higher moral calling and make sure we allow these people to apply for acai blusylum to sh families and in communities where they can be kept safe and by extension all of them can be kept safe. we're all connected at the end of the day. so this anti-immigrant rhetoric and anti-immigrant policies very dangerous, very deadly and one more point, joy, we knew before that what the president was signaling was being picked up by the far right white nationalists terrorists, one of whom drove 600 miles to el paso, texas and opened fire in a walmart last august, killing 22 people, trying to stop the invasion and the infestation that president trump has been warning everybody about. so very, very dangerous rhetoric, very dangerous policies, at a very dangerous time. >> yeah. and i wasn't intending it ask you this initially, i have to

ask you this, it would be, for a lot of texans, they would welcome the idea of a new administration in that state. if asked, would you serve, would you be willing to run for governor and try to replace the regime in charge now? >> what i'll do is i'll get behind anyone who will run and serve any one of the important positions of public trust. we're only nine seats down from commanding majority in the state legislature, the first time since 2001 and those seats represented by republicans, i got more votes than did ted cruz in 2018. not only can we do this, and in some ways we have done this before, my focus in this year is winning that state legislature. this happens in a census year, before we redistrict, in the most racially gerrymandered voter expressed state in the union. voter turnout was dead last before 2018. that's our first priority. that's what i'm focused on. we have an organization called powered by people who will help

the state rep candidates win the state house and we'll see what happens after that. >> you know what i call a census year presidential election year coming in the same year. it is an armageddon election what you call it. everything is at stake for a decade, not just for four years. hopefully people will find a way to get out and vote and find a way to mail in vote. thank you so much. please stay safe. wishing you and your family the best. >> you as well, thank you. coming up, over the last few weeks, the who's who of biden vp short listers have been right here on "am joy." we'll handicap the roster next. . we'll handicap the roster next i just love hitting the open road and telling people

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it remains a mystery who former vice president joe biden will select as his running mate other than his commitment to choosing a woman and a reported may start for his selection committee. but given the way black voters

pulled a lazarus come forth for his primary campaign, a lot of black americans believe the woman he should pick should be coming up next, my panel will discuss who they think biden should pick, who they they think he will pick and why. y they thik he will pick and why now more than ever, you need technology you can rely on. and people you can rely on. i'm a dell technologies advisor. me too. me too. me too. and if you're a small business, we're with you. we are with you. we're with you. we want to help. so we'll be right here. at home. answering your calls. providing support. and standing by you every step of the way. bye bye. in these uncertain times, look after yourself, your family, your friends. but know when it comes to your finances, we are here for you. what can i do for you today?

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if joe biden asked me to serve as his vice president, during such a critical and tough

time for our nation, of course i would say yes. >> i'm in that fight 110%, no matter what. to me, that's what public service is all about. and i'm happy to fight that fight alongside the vice president. >> i want the vice president to put on that ticket whom ever gives him the best chance of beating donald trump in november. >> i believe it is very important to have a woman of color or a woman as he has said on the ticket. >> we have had a cornucopia of vice presidential candidates appear here on "am joy." i'm not the only one bringing attention to the question of ultimately a black woman will be the one to share a ticket with joe biden. this week, more than 200 black women including prominent names like susan taylor of "essence" magazine, la tanya richardson jackson, vanessa williams, signed a letter call on biden to

chose a black woman running mate. three major publications published pieces about whether a racially diverse ticket is necessary for biden to win in november. in an interview with the daily beast, congressman marsha fudge took it one step further, in a nod to black women's overwhelming loyalty to the democratic party, she asked, at some point, when do you reward your good soldiers? it was black people who turned joe biden's campaign around. and joining me now is michael harriet, senior writer for "tth root.com and tiffany cross at harvard kennedy school and author of "say it louder ." i'm going to go through -- reverse order, ladies first, start with you, tiffany. let's start with the question of does joe bide be need to have a black woman be the woman he

chooses in order to win? and i'll start with you, tiffany. >> well, that's not a hard ball question. yes. let me say it louder, shameless plug, yes. listen, let me go back to february, which now seems like two years ago, but just a few months ago, when black voters resuscitated joe biden's campaign. you'll remember the media landscape had all but dismissed his campaign and called it dead. and they simply forgot as they often do that the people who shaped this democracy, particularly when it comes s s democratic politics, had not yet weighed in. black voters were the people who breathe life back into the campaign. i have to say, i feel like the conversation, a lot of groundswelling around amy klobuchar. that is so disrespectful to the black people who elevated his campaign. moreover, look, there are a lot of policies and policy proposals in place that would excite the base. joe biden, it would be a mistake for joe biden to campaign and

for the media to assume that joe biden has black voters. there were people excited about the idea of a president joe biden. but overwhelmingly black voters are pragmatic and they elect somebody voters are practici pragmatic. now, when you say, oh, but amy klobuchar could win midwest voters, she could win rust belt voters. all the euphemisms for white voters. but for them to say that and suggest that, prove it, because we haven't seen that happen yet. and black voters must be saying, hold up because we thought joe biden was the great, white hope that was to appeal to these people. so, now folks who breathe life into this campaign are summarily dismissed by all the speculation in the media and it shows how out of step they are with this democracy. i believe he needs to pick a black woman if he wants to excite the base and maintain that ground swell he was gifted in february. >> that's one vote in.

let's go with brittany cunningham. before i let you answer this same question, this is the "new york times" piece about black leaders who want a black woman as his running mate. donna brazile is quoted in this piece as saying, biden has street cred, but at the same time it's important to send a message, to send a signal and brand the democratic party as a party of diversity. i think any other message will sound as rejection. you know it sounds awful but it's true. she says it will be seen as rejection of viable black women. do you agree, brittany? >> i do agree. tiffany's point is so well made. look, people were so excited about the fact that we had the most diverse presidential field we have ever had in the history of this country in the democratic party just to whittle it down to two older white men. joe biden has a chance to actually say, no, that diversity matters and black women matter. to understand and recognize the importance black women -- the

important role that black women have played in the democratic party, certainly in his ability to clinch the democratic nomination. honoring that is critically important. i think we have to remember that we were told in 2016 that a kind of middle of the road white choice would get hillary clinton to the white house and tim kaine wasn't the answer. i don't think tim kaine lost the election for her but he didn't bring the boldness she needed on that ticket. i don't think amy klobuchar is the answer to do that right now. we see black women saving themselves all the time. right now is no different. we see kamala harris leading from the front on coronavirus, making sure the vote is not further suppressed in this crisis. we see bottoms courageously working against brian camp not keeping her constituents safe in atlanta. we see those that recognize the

difficulty in her community and stepping forward boldly. black women lead from the front all the time and we're constantly saving people from themselves. it's high time that black women are reflected in the leadership in the ways we've been pushing things and holding things together from the background. >> let me go to michael harriet who writes about politics in a way that sometimes terrifies democrats if they read what you write in "the root" because you're telling people the real, real, real, real. let me read you a little more -- well, let me skip that and go to the fact that right now elizabeth warren is actually the leading pick among democratic voters in michigan and wisconsin. just in the polls. so, when axios has a piece that says, according to polls it is elizabeth warren who is actually the top choice of most democrats. that is democrats across all demographics in michigan and wisconsin. so in your view, with the pop layer elizabeth warren brings to

the table, is that not a compelling argument for an elizabeth warren or do you feel that joe biden needs to pick a black woman? >> well, i think there is a kind of compelling argument for warren but let's be clear. we could talk about what joe biden owes to black voters and what joe biden owes to the black community, but when it comes down to it, it's numbers. and, i mean, in the last 20 years we've seen the only way for the democratic party to win is to excite the black vote and the most loyal part of that is black women, right? when we swept the nation in the 2018 midterms, it was black women who turned out. when barack obama won two presidential campaigns it was black turnout and mostly black women who turned out for barack obama. so, it is -- i don't know how you would play this political

calculus without landing squarely on black women. it's like the bulls getting to the finals and asking steve kerr to get all the shots instead of michael jordan. we know black women are the jordan of the democratic party. why are you going to pass the ball to dennis rodman? elizabeth warren, she can rebound and she can pass, but we know who jordan is of the democratic party, so why wouldn't you pass them the ball? >> steve kerr fans, stay out of my mentions, go in michael's mentions. let's just read a little data backup for what michael just said and this is in "the new york times" piece. in 2016 black turnout rate in the presidential election declined for the first time in 20 years. it was seven percentage points lower than the record high of obama's 2012. it slipped from 12% in 2016 to

13%. to look at the three key states donald trump managed to squeak through and win, michigan, wisconsin, by himself without a running mate biden is ahead and doing well with white working class voters on his own. that's the case that a lot of black voters who want a black woman on the ticket say, biden is carrying the white voters. he needs something else. i'm sorry, i interrupted you. >> sorry, i interrupted you. sorry. i just wanted to make the point about that, the fallout in those thr three states. in michigan there were 75,000 people in detroit whose votes did not count. it concerns me when some in the media repeatedly say the black voting turnout decline, we also have to acknowledge it was gop-led voter suppression that helped that. there was foreign election interference that helped that. literally people did cast a vote. had hillary clinton gained those

75,000 votes she would have carried michigan and, thus one. we have to keep that in mind when we talk about that. >> indeed. you will all stick around. maybe later on i'll have them tell me who they think he might pick. o they think he might pick ls and playgrounds. all those places out there, are now in here. that's why we're still offering fast, free two day shipping on thousands of items. even the big stuff. and doing everything it takes to ensure your safety. so you can make your home everything you need it to be. wayfair. way more than furniture. i've always loved and i'm still going for my best, even though i live with a higher risk of stroke due to afib not caused by a heart valve problem. so if there's a better treatment than warfarin, i'll go for that. eliquis. eliquis is proven to reduce stroke risk

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nationality you are, what political preference you have. it's serious. and it will devastate you. >> you know, i cry, you know, all day, i cry all night, i cry in my sleep. i slept with, you know, my baby little teddy bears, so i slept with the teddy bears. teddy bears she slept with at the hospital. i just hold onto them. >> good morning. welcome back to "am joy." the couple in that heart-wrenching interview are the parents of 5-year-old skylar herbert. they have both first responders in detroit. last week their daughter was the youngest to die from complications of covid-19. skylar's parents were with her when she died in the hospital. her death further exposes the sad reality but not exactly a surprising one, that african-americans are contracting and dying from covid-19 at disproportionate rates, particularly in the

midwest. in michigan african-americans account for 41% of covid-19 deaths, but make up just 14% of the state's population. the lopsided numbers are about the same in illinois. in minnesota, the star tribune reports at first glance the numbers don't appear out of proportion but officials say the actual number of victims in the state's minority communities are likely higher. a day after skylar's death, michigan governor announced a task force to study the virus's disproportionate impact on communities of color. lieutenant governor gilchrist dedicated the initiative to the 5-year-old saying skylar lived in a predominantly black neighborhood. this task force will serve in her memory to make sure we can limit the expositiure for those. what will it reveal about the uneven health, economic and environmental factors that could have prevented these numbers

and, more importantly, will there be actual solutions to help us fix those. joining me is congresswoman talib. thank you for joining me. >> thank you for having me. >> the stories out about the deaths here in your community and around the country are so heartbreaking. a piece of another story out of detroit and here it is. hours before 56-year-old gary fowler died in his rocking chair, his father, david, also slipped away. covid-19 came for david, a grandfather of 11, and great grandfather of 2, while he lay alone in a hospital bed about a dozen miles from his son, who was his best friend, his grandson said, and he was 76. and, you know, there are two different kind of disparities that i think are apparent when we look at these cases. one of them is racial. the other one is wealth-based,

is money-based. and there's one other story i'll read to you about wealth disparities during covid-19 and it says, let's stop pretending billionaires are in the same boat as the rest have us. more than 22 million americans lost their job over the same three weeks, according to a new study for the institute of policy studies, u.s. billionaire wealth increased by $282 billion, a 10% gain. what do we do about a crisis that'sdy porti that's killing people of color and enriching the wealthy. >> it's so important that people understand the ugly face of the economic divide in our country, structural racism, environmental racism, all of which in many ways were present in this beautiful black city. and it's now resulting in what doing nothing looks like. when we do nothing about

predominantly african-american communities living in polluted areas, they have the most polluted zip code in michigan, where my folks already have high rates of asthma, respiratory issues, lack of access to health care. there's so much disinvestment in those communities while the corporate polluters continue to get tax abatement, continue to get a handout, rolling of the red carpet while our folks have to pay the toll on their public health and quality of life. so much of the broken systems that corporate greed is really festered into, people are making money off the pain of the oppression of not only african-americans but all communities of color. i've seen it not only in latino communities and other communities of just kind of turning their back away from those communities that are disconnected. joy, you know, majority of my colleagues are millionaires. they don't understand nor will they feel, no matter their backgrounds, they won't understand people live paycheck

to paycheck or he they live in a community where they can't go out on their back porch because it smells like hydrogen sulfide. they get nosebleeds and headaches and they can't sleep through the night. this is exactly what's happening in a lot of these predominantly african-american communities are surrounded by pollutants already. you should know this. thousands right now have no access to water. freedpredominantly african-amer have no access to water in the city of detroit, to wash their hands, to provide formula for their children. this is something we've been talking about and struggling, the united nations was in our backyard but it takes covid for people to say, this is going on? absolutely. that's why so many of my water warriors and those on the ground have been saying, we've been telling you all for years, do something, because you're going to kill us. that's exactly what's happening. >> i don't believe it's part of your district but to say nothing of flint that had four years, four going on five years, of unclean water.

it's not even clear that the water is sufficiently restored so people can follow the order to wash their hands or that turn-off orders have been rescinded so people can't get their water cut off when washing your hands is one way to keep yourself safe. do you have any information on that? >> the flint crisis is still very much present. many of the folks impacted, irreparable harm, have not got real relief. there are still currently folks that do not have clean water in their homes in flint. let me tell you. this is a broad issue across the nation because even in detroit, i have 60 plus public schools that had to shut down their water fountains because they have no clean water. although, a block away, joy, is a stadium, little cesar's arena, who got $400 million from school aid fund, right, directed to a for-profit adult playground hockey stadium, while our folks still continue to suffer. the continued disinvestment. what's really frustrating, joy,

is they continue during this day during a global pandemic, wait, we'll get the water crisis addressed in the next package. we'll deal with the fact that your local communities are going to go bankrupt if we don't care of it. recurring payments, we don't have time for that now. i'm telling them our folks are going to die at a higher rate than you can ever imagine. it's not just skylar's family, who are the essential workers, the amount of guilt listening to her grandmother on the phone, just weep for her grandbaby. they have been suffering for years and now they're seeing their country turn their back on them when we tell them to wait even more. >> you know, congresswoman, i did speak with the speaker this morning and asked about this question of, you know, there are a lot of folks -- we spoke with bishop barber yesterday, and i think for a lot of ordinary people who resident in

washington and don't see the sausage making on a daily basis, i think a lot of people don't understand why everything gets pushed to the next bill. as you said, there are people who need a check now, who are still waiting for the first check from the c.a.r.e.s. act to come in the mail, who don't understand why trillions of dollars were immediately given to the banks, cruise ships, airlines, big businesses were able to get money, ruth chris gave back $20 million, meaning they had $20 million and why ordinary folks can't get rent relief or relief from back bills or they get a three-month-delay on having to pay the rent and have to pay it all in one go afterwards. can you let us inside the process of these negotiations in the house. >> just know the process is tainted. corporate greed is within the government, and it has tainted our process. it's wiped away this lack of urgency to put people first. when there's a sense, let's

focus on people, the workers, the folks that are getting sick, you know, irreparable harm, the structural brokenness of the sba loans, all of it is being exposed right now. one of the hardest things is this lack of urgency i tell you about, but the process is broken. until we can wipe out and push out the special interest groups, the lobbyists and corporations and tell them to wait, tell them to wait, completely be laser focused on saving lives is the only way we can fix that process to making sure our folks are still not waiting for recurring payments, which is so important. we have proposals like automatic boosts to community act, we have proposals to fix -- to make water a human rights crisis and make sure there's a permanent fix. there are proposals at the table but folks are telling us to wait. we say, we don't have time to wait. people are dying.

>> indeed. come back to michigan for a moment. governor whitmer extended and somewhat loosened the stay-at-home order. she's been under tremendous pressure, including some astro turf protesters thrown at her door, getting her to loosen the restrictions. it would allow in-state travel, motor boating and golfing, landscaping, lawn service companies, plant and nursery and bike shops would be able to resume operating but all are subject to social distancing orders and would allow stores not selling nonessential items to open but with curbside and delivery. 61% say they trust her more than they trust donald trump, which is a low bar. 18% support loosen, the restrictions. this sounds concerning because when you think are golfing, landscaping and lawn service,

that's usually very low income, mostly brown and non-white folks that are out there that would have to be doing that. can you make sense of the idea of loosening these restrictions in a way that would make white wealthy folks comfortable, they could golf, but put others in danger? >> one thing i admire about the governor is i know she's listening to the health experts, the doctors, they are the ones leading the policy to talk about loosening up. i'm not sure how they made that decision. i know this much. many of our folks, and i tell you -- my 13 strong residents. if you are afraid to go to work, do not go to work. i know this is hard but you have -- you have every right to make sure your life is put first and to fight back. i don't care if it's labor organizing this late in the game or if it's demanding that your

life is not treated as if it's disposable, but i want you not to be afraid to go to work. you should not at all ever feel like, i don't care if it's a president, i don't care who it is that tells you, we need you to go back and we need you to start back with the economy and everything. your life is much more important. i always tell my residents when they call, you know, they're sha making us do this, making us do that. do you feel safe? if you don't feel safe, you don't have to go to work. i know folks will push back on me but put yourself in their places. some have family members -- in my predominantly communities of color, my african-american communities, it's multigenerational, a great grandmother, an auntie, you can't bring back coronavirus to that person. you can jeopardize their lives. people kept saying kids can't get it. let's not test kids.

skylar is 5 years old. it puts these communities who are marginalized their lives at stake. i urge a lot of my neighbors and other folks that have called me and reached out to me and said, i don't feel safe, i want you to organize with your other coworkers and demand your life is put first and your health is put first. i would push back no matter what these decisions and other folks on the task forces being put together, your gut feeling, follow that. it's probably much more credible than what you might see coming out of various administrations. >> i want to acknowledge michigan has a 24% unemployment rate, nearly 24% of michigan workers are unemployed because of covid-19 pandemic. there is also an economic concern. it's not as if people are not happy to be taking in a paycheck. people also don't want to die

doing it. before i let you go -- yes, go on. >> joy, you know, like 30% of my folks are automotive workers. they're in a plant with hundreds of other people. there's no possibilities to social distance. even in grocery stores. many of my folks in an amazon warehouse, do you know how many folks call me telling me they're not practicing what they need to be doing at amazon. they were giving people one piece of wipe until we fought to get more. those are the things we need to organize and push back against. it's impossible because this is a working class. these are folks -- they don't work in small cubicles or have their own offices and can telework. these are real folks on the ground, what i call front-line workers, that cannot do what the cdc is asking them to do. but the ceos and corporations and those folks keep pushing against that. that's where i say, organize at workplace, push back against it, your life matters. >> and the last question before i let you go, congresswoman, i know you were a supporter of

senator sanders' campaign and yourself and alexandria ocasio-cortez were strong supporters, i think those that were skeptics about medicare for all going into this crisis now see quite clearly and in sharp relief that linking work to health care is extremely dangerous and economically calamitous for a country that that's the way the majority of people get their health care. now fwheer a crisis. you have a lot of people that can't even get tested. they don't have insurance. they are afraid of the $39,000 bill if you have to get treated for covid-19. has the biden campaign been in touch with you to secure your support and have you had conversations with anyone on the campaign about maybe changing his opposition to medicare for all, or at least dramatically expanded medicaid -- a medicare?

i know you're in a heavily un n unionized state, and i know that's important on the other side of that, people who want to keep their union plans. >> even some of my union members have said, we need access to closer to universal health care. before me, congressman john conyers was introducing single payor resolution for a decade or more. this is something the 13 district had birthed around the universal health care. we see hospitals closing down because it is not profitable to take care of sick people. so, if it becomes a covid hospital, they're not making money off it. folks are thinking, this is kind of hard to believe, but look it up. hospitals are closing because now that they have to actually take care of sick people and not make money off discourages and other kinds of schemes, you see that happening. right now, joy, i'm really focused on turning out the vote. i focus on issue campaigning, i

focus on -- right now we have sick care in our country, we have had it for decades. i'm telling people, share your stories now. this is a way to demand whoever runs for president that we need to do something to fix our health care system. when i say something, i mean something transformative. something where it takes the corporate greed out of it, the property out of it. people shouldn't be making profit off people's death, off people's illnesses, so forth. we need to get away from that. if there's anything that's showing and exposing the need for medicare for all, it's this global pandemic. >> congresswoman talib, i want to say ramadan mubarak to you, as i assume you're celebrating, to all viewers out there celebrating, as we know a substantial number of african-americans are part of the muslim community. you stay safe. >> thank you. you too. safe.

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can i walk on it? >> go ahead. >> oh, my goodness. >> what do you think of the red carpet? >> that's adorable. the tampa bay buccaneers' new offensive linesman tristan wirfs propsed a mom to las vegas for the nfl draft. when that couldn't happen, he brought a little of it to iowa. it's not clear there will even be an nfl season, even concerts or movie theater or public outings of any kind. they say it depends on the availability of widespread testing and a vaccine. to that point, a poll last week

found a whopping 72% of americans won't even consider attending a sporting event until a vaccine is developed. joining me now, a neurologist, epidemiologist, doctor at boston medical center, a medical contributor for msnbc, and former senior adviser on hiv/aids at centers for disease control. thank you all for being here. let me just go in order. let me start with you, dr dr. feher, this seems obvious you have to have widespread testing so you know who's sick and who has the antibodies and a vaccine would make people feel a whole lot better. walk me through, when you think about a vaccine, what kind of a timeline is realistic for developing that? >> well, there's what's realistic -- let me characterize it in two ways.

there's what's historical and historical precedence we have for vaccine development. that's on a minimum, four to five years to 20 years to get it to market and get it widely out into people. that was, i would say, changed with the ebola vaccine following the 2014-15 outbreak where an experimental vaccine -- the outbreak was considered so bad that an experimental vaccine was actually introduced into humans. that really took around 10 to 12 years of development, but it took around five years to get it into humans widely and it's now commercialized. we would really be pushing that up significantly if we got a vaccine in, say, a year to 18 months. to really for the outbreak to stop, we have to have both. we have to have enough diagnostics -- think of enough diagnostics to have on the order of a pregnancy test or drug test as well as a vaccine introduced in the broader public or if we have some type of herd immunity,

which we don't know if that will happen at all scientifically. >> well, that's frightening. let's ask this, "newsweek" has reported -- there's a story that says 20 million coronavirus tests a day might not be enough to fully protect the u.s. public from covid-19. this is per harvard university report. here's a bit of it. in order for social distancing measures to be eased without a spike in infections, 5 million tests must be carried out each day in the u.s. by early june, the office of a harvard report said. according to oxford university run our world and data, the u.s. has carried out 4 million coronavirus tests since the outbreak started in late 2019. the authors of the report said this number will need to increase ideally by late july to 20 million a day to fully remobilize the economy. we acknowledge that number may not be high enough to protect the public health. that's terrifying. 4 million tests sounds like nothing in a country with 326 million people. it feels like we are failing at

doing thing one before we can even get to a vaccine helping us. >> that's right, joy. and i think it's not just the availability of the tests but really a testing strategy. it's not one and done. the reason you see these numbers they're talking about currently needed versus those that might be needed later in the summer, that's reflecting if we open up society, you have to serially test people. if you have a test that's negative now and then continued exposures to people, potentially, you know, even if the presence of some protection, when you're going out and working as a front line worker and as we're expanding the cadres of these front-line workers, if we're thinking about opening up society, you're talking about a continuous serious strategy where you're testing people in the workplace, testing people in the community. right now we don't even have enough to test every single patient that comes into every single hospital simply to see if we have this disease or not. i think we're closer to that strategy but certainly not there for opening up as much as we would like.

so, it is a little depressing. the antibody test, the availability of those and really the reliability of those is being questioned as well. even if they're positive, do we know if people are actually -- if they have antibodies are they immune or not? that's a sin tifk question that needs to be answered. >> indeed. there's some alarming new information. the more we learn, i feel like the less we know but the more we learn, the more frightening it is for people. in south korea, a call center -- this is a study. south korea call center suggests person-to-person contact is the primary mode of transportation. of 1,143 people tested for covid-19 in building x at this call center, 97 had confirmed cases. . of these 94 were working in an 11th floor call center with 216 employees, translating to an attack rate of 43.5%, according to this study.

do we really know for sure how this virus is passed from person to person? there's a lot of rumors out there. is it airborne, living on surfaces for weeks? no one seems to know, or do we? >> i think we do know a lot of this by this time. i think it is fair to say that this is still a new infection, a new epidemic, and we will continue to learn things. we do know that most of what we have seen is through droplet spread, not through airborne spread. you know, we know a lot about what it takes to protect on oneself. you have to go back to core basics and basic principles. we know if people stayed far apart from each other, regardless of the mode of spread, you are much more unlikely to contract this

infection. we know if you practice hygienic principles, washing your hands frequently, coughing into your elbow, wearing protective face masks. we know that's not 100% but it probably reduces your chances of getting it as well as your chances of spreading it. i think while we'll continue to learn things, we do know the things that can keep us from being at risk and spreading. much of that is about the social distancing that people have put so much priority on, which is stay away from other human beings unless necessary because it is human-to-human spread that carries this infection. so, yes, we will learn more, but we do know enough about what we can do to reduce the spread of this infection. while we're waiting for better testing, better treatments and ultimately a vaccine.

>> very quickly. we know from sort of looking at the way that hiv/aids, the response of the country to it, initially denial and sort of, you know, deflecting the seriousness of it is what the reagan administration initially did. and the analogy is the way the trump administration has responded, responded initially just saying, oh, it will go away, it's not a big deal and not addressing it for quite some time. a lot of people have made that analogy. we have now discovered through reuters that the u.s. says it will not take part in the w.h.o. global drugs vaccine initiative launch. i want to let each of you respond to that. don't we need to be part of the global solution to this as this is a global pandemic? i'll ask you first, dr. gayle. >> yeah, clearly, as you said, this is a global pandemic. where we made the big strides in health and attacking epidemics is when we had that global

collaboration. it's critical. we must, as the united states that has always been a leader in global health and preparedness, we have to be part of this system. that's where we're going to get the kind of global solutions. you mentioned the slowness of reaction. i think it really does highlight. we put a lot of focus on the importance of having a health care system, but equally important is that we have to have a public health system that has disease preparedness as a high proert because we could have been further ahead had we had the systems in place for early detection, testing, screening, contact tracing and all these things we know are critical for curbing epidemic spread. while we have to think about access to health care, we have

to put as much if not more focus on preparedness -- epidemic preparedness and having a public health system that is in place so we can get ahead of things like this and not be playing catch-up like we are now. >> it didn't help firing the person at nsc who is in charge of preparedness for a pandemic. that didn't help, what the trump administration has done. on that point, most of the world, as the world is trying to grapple with this collectively, has a health system that's universal, much more closer to universal than what we have. is that the reason you're seeing the outbreak numbers so much lower in other countries? people are contracting it as well but is access to health care that's a lot easier in other countries helping them grapple with this better than we are? >> i think that's one of the basic determinants.

at the terminal end of all surveillance for infectious diseases are communities that potentially don't have access to care, who don't have -- they're not connected to the ability of the public health system to deit ekt when there's a cluster of disease in those communities. going back to the w.h.o. meeting, part of the reason they got this meeting together is to allow exchange of science, to allow a commitment about equitable, fair distribution of vaccine or treatment when it's available to really come up with a global strategy of deployment that over time because a disease anywhere -- an outbreak anywhere is an outbreak everywhere. to not be at that table, it doesn't -- from a selfish perspective, we're missing out on that information about the science, we're missing out on information about adverse effects if we were to deploy a vaccine, we're missing out on the ability to be a leader for public health. >> doctor, last to you because you felt with this in dealing with the ebola outbreak, how much better off would we be if

donald trump was not taking this a adversarial attitude toward the w.h.o. and allied countries and are, frankly, having better outcomes than we are? >> i think history has taught us global strategic alliances are required for global fights and global wars. right now we are in a global war on covid-19. even if we ourselves may see a dip in the summer months, which may be predictive from what we heard in the latest presidential briefing held by homeland security science director. that being said, even though we may see a dip during those months, the southern hemisphere will go into its cold and flu season and we'll see presumably a lot of cases of covid-19. this is going to be a global fight for some time to come so we need to be part of the global strategic alliance to fight that and bring together the best minds in the world that bring together different technologies and different manufacturing capabilities and to not be a part of that kind of leaves us

not -- not only out of a leadership role but out of it all together including the benefits of it. >> yeah, hopefully somebody in washington can talk to donald trump and maybe he -- maybe he will heed those warnings coming from you smart people. thank you very much. a quick programming note to let you know that it appears we will have the briefing by governor andrew cuomo at noon at the top of the hour. and so we are awaiting that. meanwhile, donald trump's aides are desperately trying to keep him out of the briefing room. we'll discuss more about that next. just because someone grows older does that mean they have to grow apart from their friends, or from the things they love to do? with right at home, it doesn't. right at home's professional team thoughtfully selects caregivers to help with personal care, housekeeping, meals - and most of all, staying engaged - in life.

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america's favorite infectious disease expert dr. anthony fauci said if s "saturday night live" parodied him, he would like brad pitt to play him. he got his wish. pitt channeled his inner fauci

to interpret donald trump's junk science. >> you can call it a germ, you can call it a flu, you can call it many different names. i'm not sure if anybody knows exactly what it is. >> we know what it is. >> and then i see the disinfectant knocks it out in a minute, one minute. and is there a way we can do something like that? by injection? >> supposing we hit the body with a tremendous -- whether it's ultraviolet or just very powerful light. >> i know i shouldn't be touching my face, but now there is a rumor that the president is going to fire me. let's see what he said about that. >> today i walk in, i hear i'm going to fire him. i'm not going to fire him. >> yeah, i'm getting fired. until then i'm going to be putting out the facts for whoever is listening and when i

hear things that the virus can be cured if everyone takes the tide pod challenge, i'll be there to say, please don't. >> we certainly miss the real dr. fauci at the coronavirus briefings. but maybe that's a good thing that donald trump has chickened out at appearing at them. we'll discuss. next. (j.k. vo) in 90 years at farmers we thought we'd seen it all. from fires and hurricanes to animal antics we could laugh about later. but we haven't seen this. so, farmers is reducing auto premiums by 25%, extending payment due dates, and expanding coverage for the delivery drivers who are carrying us through. and then we'll do the next thing, and the thing after that, until this is another thing we've seen and done. there will be parties and family gatherings. there will be parades and sporting events and concerts. to help our communities when they come back together,

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so it is quite it is quite we're okay we're okay . you said he was digesting

information at the time when that came out of his mouth. do you have any more information? and are you concerned that people might take bleach because of what the president said? >> i think i made it very clear on how i interpreted that. i also made it very clear, and so how dr. fauci and everyone associated with the task force and their clarity around, this is not a treatment. >> white house coronavirus response coordinator dr. deborah birx had to do some damage control this morning following the uproar over donald trump's bizarre comments about ingesting disinfectants to cure covid-19. on saturday trump skipped his daily brpress briefing for the first time in two weeks and, on cue, blamed the media for his absence. white house aides have been considering scaling back president's press briefings, which may save american lives,

given president trump's thoughts. joining me michael harriot, tiffany cross, author of "say it louder," who is tweeting me while i'm on tv. i'm going to you first. tiffany, you know, one might say that donald trump changing his mind about doing the press briefings, when originally he was going to do a radio show, that's how much he was into them. this has become a reality show he loves, yelling at the press. i'm surprised he doesn't yell, you're fired, at members of the media. but him scaling them back, it sounds like somebody might have put the kcane out like they use to do at the apollo and said you have to get off the stage. >> one reason he didn't want to do radio is because he would have to compete with rush limbaugh. these are things he's thinking about. he's governing like he's a reality tv star. let's pause and take a moment to realize that the president of

the united states is trying to jim jones the entire country by telling them to down disinfectant like they're doing vodka shots. i don't want to hear from president lysol anymore. he's not informing anybody. he is causing more confusion and trying to usher people into mass graves. so, look, i actually get it. as you know, joy, i was a producer previously. it's a tough call to say, do we carry these briefings live, at the point it becomes, this is now a campaign rally. this is now a vehicle for disinformation. we in the media cannot be complicit and help carry that disinformation into millions of homes. after he suggested that people ingest this disinfectant, the new york poison control center got 30 calls from people who tried to do this. this is -- look, i am happy to see him and scarf lady ride off into distoep yeah, wherever they want to go, but dr. birx has sacrificed her entire credibility coming out echoing or apologizing for his words.

i think the american public only wants to hear from dr. fauci and people who have not ot damaged their credit like the rest of his bizarre cast of characters. >> she does have all the scarves, by the way. >> all the scarves. >> in addition, not just, you know, brittany, has the new york poison control center started getting calls, larry hogan, governor of maryland, and gretchen whitmer, both said they're getting calls into their poison control centers following donald trump's comments. this is what both of them had to say. take a listen. >> we had hundreds of calls come into our emergency hot line at our health department asking if it was right to ingest clorox or alcohol cleaning products, whether that was going to help them fight the virus. we had to put out that warning

to make sure people were not doing something like that, which would kill people. >> when the person with the most powerful position on the planet is encouraging people to think about disfin f-- disinfectant, people are listening. >> that's on top of new york poison control calls for bleach, lysol doubled after trump made his comment. they can try to walk this back all they want. but donald trump supporters believe him. there was a couple that drank cleaning fluid from the fish tank because he said the chemicals that -- people should ingest certain chemicals to stop covid-19. whatever he says, his supporters, they just believe whatever he says. this is becoming dangerous for him to talk. >> it truly is. it has been a wild three or four

years during this administration. but when i joined the msnbc family, never in my wildest dreams or nightmares did i believe this could be a conversation we would be having. i didn't think we needed to say to people, don't drink disinfectant and yet, here we are. i am in a place where i believe two things are true. clearly, what he has been saying at these pressers has not been of much value and has been dangerous. we have been talking about the ways people have been ingesting literal poison into their bodies but we look at what he said about anti -malaria drugs. there is no proof that it can treat covid-19. there's proof it causes dangerous side effects. we know there are patients who need that medicine who are experiencing a shortage and can't get their hands on it. he skips test day because he has been failing the semester and refuses to do the homework and

says the tests are rigged. we're fortunate and he will be quiet so he can stop bringing the whole class average down and harming the rest of us. i believe in calling a thing by its name. this cowardice, plain and sim e simple. if he would do the homework and pay attention and read briefings that we know he has, he could actually give us powerful information. instead, he calls pressers and says it wasn't worth the time and effort. his strategy this administration has been to undermine the media and characterize journalists like a merry band of pirates ready to steal the truth. the fact is that in a country that embraces a free press, journalists are doing a public service. and in the time of coronavirus, every journalist and white house correspondent who steps into that briefing room is risking their life to hold power accountable, to ask the questions that matter and to give us the people the answers that we deserve. every single american should be

personally insult and offended that donald trump thinks it is not worth his time to answer to us. we don't elect kings in america. we elect presidents. we're in charge. we will not let him harm us. >> it's a monarch view. he will never read briefings. he is not going to change. he never had to do work because he has been handed money, power, everything he wants without having to work for it. i don't see him changing. the question i guess, mike am, is whether people around him change. here is dr. birx who is a highly respected scientist who has had to put her credibility alongside his credibility in order to do this job. dr. fauci managed to come through it clean because he just is who he has been. she has placed herself out there. here she is on another clip. this is from cnn trying to

defend donald trump's comments about ingesting disinfectant. >> that was a dialogue he was having between the dhs scientist and himself for information that he had received and he was discussing. we have made it clear and when he turned to me i made it clear and he understood that it was not as a treatment. >> first of all, that is not even a legitimate question to ask a dhs scientist. i don't understand that. do you? why would -- why -- can you get inside the minds of why people defend this rather than say, i'm done? >> i think it's part of that following people have throughout his presidency. you saw it with john kelly. we knew john kelly understood some of the things ec s he was

were wrong and still -- they had to balance the service to this country and try to -- with birx trying to fight a global pandemic with donald trump's long history of being anti-science. we saw it with global warming. now we see it with him perpetuating the myth about hydroxychloroquine, trying to get people to mainline. we see this with the people he surrounded himself with because you only have two choices. either you perpetuate the lies he tells or you are out. if you are out, someone -- the person who replaces is just another trump acolyte who will repeat his lies. i think you have to balance that service to the country with being a donald trump apostle. we have gone from fdr's fireside

chats to now with these dumpster fire press briefings. that's the state that we're in with this president. >> indeed. very interestingly, now he is tweeting, what's the purpose of having these white house briefings? media are mean to me. you get fake news. that's fake news from you. you are telling people to ingest cleaning solution. i said i would make you give me a name. who will biden pick as his running mate. >> i say kamala harris. if you have seen the way she takes it to people. she can take it. >> t tiffany? >> kamala harris or stacey abrams. >> he has a great new podcast.

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good day to all of you from msnbc world headquarters in new york. welcome, everyone. have we reached a nationwide