we have gotten to where we have gotten because people have stayed home. they have gotten, i think, the vast majority of chicagoans have gotten the message that restricting our movements, avoiding large congregate settings, ones where you can't socially distance easily those are the very breeding grounds for the virus. and i'm -- i'm watching very carefully not just across illinois, but really across the country, and the world, places where they came out of these restrictions too soon, facing a

spike. >> good morning. and welcome to "am joy." chicago mayor lori lightfoot could do not have made it more clear why they're hesitant about lifting stay at home orders. while some are report a decline in cases of deaths, we are nowhere near out of the park. there are more than 1.1 million cases in the u.s. and nearly 67,000 fatalities. in illinois, more than 58,000 people have tested positive. the death toll there is a little over 2500. in chicago, accounts for more than one third of the cases in the state. in an effort to keep physical distancing measures in place, and at the same time allow high school seniors to celebrate a rather significant milestone in their lives, mayor lightfoot announced a city wide virtual graduation ceremony, and she teased the announcement in this light hearted video on ticktock and later told high school seniors their graduation ceremony would be held in june and will be keynoted by none

other than oprah winfrey. look at her. while elected officials like the mayor are doing everything they can to bring an end to this pandemic, the washington post is out with a damning report on donald trump's desperate attempts to reopen america come what may. one of the disturbing revelations illustrates how some of his close advisers regard the doctors advising the white house, including dr. anthony fauci, quote, there is a little bit of a god complex one senior administration official said of the group, they're all about science, science, science, which is good, but sometimes there is a little bit less of a consideration of politics when maybe there should be. unreal. no, no, actually completely real. these sentiments are being echoed throughout the country at protests aimed at pressuring governors to reopen the economy. many of the people showing up at these astroturf get togethers are hanging around with no protective face coverings, not practicing physical distancing

and going as far as to try to shame reporters covering the story. take a look at what happened to an msnbc reporter in laguna beach, california, as well as a particularly scary encounter, a reporter had at an nbc affiliate with a protester in columbus, ohio. >> people are very angry, this is one of them, and then there is people here as well. >> you know that the company that you work for is lying to the american people and you know that what you're doing is wrong at the end of the day. you know it. you see how nervous you are? you're shaking. you're sweating. you can't even see out of them. >> i'm wearing my mask. >> your mask is underneath your nose again. you are terrifying the general public. you realize that? >> shaking because droplet are how the virus are spread. in michigan, groups charged the -- armed groups charged the state capitol which was in session to debate governor

gretchen whitmer's orders. while guns are allowed in the state capitol, these images make it look like the point of those protests is intimidation, not persuasion. the images are frightening enough that one state senator tweeted this picture of her vantage point, once the armed protesters entered the chamber. finally, this picture which has been very fired by nbc news, shows a woman outside of the illinois governor's chicago office holding a sign featuring a nazi slogan, in german the phrase means work sets you free. nazis used that phrase at concentration camps. at the end of the phrase, the protester wrote jb, which happens to be the first two initials of the illinois governor's name. governor jb pritzker is jewish. joining me is senator tammy duckworth of illinois, a member of the armed services committee. thank you for being here.

i want to go back to where i started and talk about this -- the -- in chicago, what is happening in illinois, and, you know, yesterday was a pretty nice day and around the country, very difficult to keep people inside, obviously, because it was probably the first nice day in a while, nonrainy, and here is what the chicago mayor had to say warning chicagoans after yet another house party took place. take a listen. >> we're not playing games, we mean business, and we are going to shut this down, one way or the other. the time for educating people into compliance is over. don't be stupid. we'll shut you down. we will cite you. and if we need to, we will arrest you and we will take you to jail. >> you know, this reminds me, senator, of the -- all of the viral video clips of italian mayors doing the exact same thing, going on air and doing these clips where they were basically threatening people and saying, listen, don't be stupid,

you don't want to go get your nails done and look beautiful in a casket. we're at that phase now. what do you make of the status of where we -- we surpassed the number of dead in vietnam. so it is -- we're not in a good place. >> we're not in a good place and we're not out of the tunnel just yet. we need more test kits, more widespread and free testing for everyone who needs a test or wants a test. we don't have that yet. until we had that, we can't fully reopen the economy. i fully support lori lightfoot and governor pritzker. they're doing a fantastic and tough job. as a mom of a 2-year-old and a 5-year-old and i have my 79-year-old mom living with me, i'm glad these orders are in place because i happen to live with some of the most vulnerable population, just like so many other families out there. and i don't want my children and my mother exposed to this deadly virus. you shouldn't want your family members exposed to it either. >> absolutely. what about the -- i want to talk about the actions of the

administration here. there has been -- obviously nothing but criticism because clearly it is not been a success as jared kushner claimed, it has been the opposite of that. we now had this administration, this president replace the watchdog, the ig who identifies the critical medical shortages that we faced. here is the story on that. the white house waited until after business hours "new york times" piece, to announce the nomination of a new inspector general for the department of -- who when if confirmed would take over for christie a. grimm who was publicly asald by the president at a news briefing three weeks ago. trump is blaming the people who are telling the public about the shortages rather than fixing the shortages. what do you make of the firing of this inspector general and will there be potentially hearings on it? >> well, unfortunately it is a sad, sad firing in a long line of firings of people who are

doing their jobs and trying to protect and serve the american people that president trump has carried out. unfortunately i'm not surprised. this is after all an administration and president who when he found out and was warned about this pandemic, this crisis looming back in january and february, spent his time pandering and basically sucking up to the communist head of an authoritarian regime in president xi of china, talking to -- flattering the man instead of preparing our country for this pandemic. and those protesters that are out there want to protest something, protest the trump administration's failure to provide test kits all across this country, protest the trump administration's failure to seize control of ppe supply chain early on, three months ago, when they should have gotten this. they want to protect something, protest this failure of the president who has not done his job and continues to put politics in front of the health and well-being of hard working every day americans, all across the country. shame on him. >> yeah.

indeed. i want to -- i want to talk to about some of these other events going on. i hesitate to call them protests, they seem to be astroturf related. i want to take advantage of the fact that i have with me not just the united states senator, but a war hero yourself, senator, and what do you make of -- i want to ask about a couple of issues. one is bringing back these army cadets to campus for graduation. there has been a lot of criticism of it. i'll tell you what the army said about defending bringing these cadets back to west point, we have to bring the cadets back to west point to begin the process of the physicals they need to take of all the clearance procedures to clear barracks to get their personal items. army secretary ryan mccarthy told reporters during a pentagon news briefing, pressed on why west point couldn't hold a virtual ceremony, james mccondo replied we can't telecommute to combat. your thoughts on bringing the cadets back for graduation?

>> i don't disagree that the cadets need to clear their barracks and get their physicals and get all that in order. what i disagree with is the decision to put a thousand cadets in a single space for a prolonged period of time while president trump talks at them. you could bring these cadets back in a graduated series, one group, one small group at a time to get this done so they can then report to their next duty station and be the front line leaders of our army that they're supposed to be. but to take all thousand of them, bring them back all at once and put them into a confind area in a single space, so the president can talk at them, that's the poor decision-making happening right now. and as for telecommuting to combat, come on, this is talking about putting people into a graduation ceremony, graduation ceremonies are not combat. i don't think any one of those cadets would hesitate to run into combat, to lead troops into battle. but now you're exposing them to the dangers, and by the way, that's going to affect military

readiness. if any of them get sick, what happens to them? it is going to delay them reporting out to the units, out to the army as a whole, and if some of them get sick enough they have to be medically discharged, now you lost all that investment we made as taxpayers in their education for four years and they don't get to start the careers they worked so hard for. let's make some good decisions here. president trump shows why he's a failure as a commander in chief, why he's not someone who should be leading our troops in any way, shape or form, if he thinks him talking at them and putting them into a single space so that he can just stroke his own ego is the height of narcissism, but not -- it is not good leadership. >> you think he's doing it for a photo-op? >> of course he is. isn't that what trump does all the time? as that leeaked memo says, they put politics in front of everything else. he's willing to put politics and his own personal ego in front of

getting these thousand young second lieutenants out into the troops to lead the force, that's what we should be focused on. let's make sure we get these guys out there so they can show up at their next duty station and do the jobs they have trained so hard to do. amazing outstanding young men and women, they deserve better than to be needlessly exposed to a pandemic. >> let me ask you about these -- we'll call them protesters, you had some, we showed earlier a photo of one in which a nazi slogan was used. but just the armed mostly men, mostly white, showing up at these inside even the michigan state capitol, this isn't what a protest normally looks like. this looks like an attempt to intimidate. what do you make of this as a military veteran? what do you make of that? donald trump praised them. he tweeted yesterday the governor of michigan should give the put out the fire, see them, talk to them, they're angry,

they want their lives back, they're good people, sounds like the fine people of charlottesville, what it sounds like to a lot of people. what do you make of these armed gatherings? >> they're out there, they're out here to intimidate. that nazi slogan is not acceptable. we just ended asian eed asian-a awareness month. for me as an asian-american, really, i mean, it just strikes at my heart. as a soldier, it just strikes at my heart. that's not american. you want to be american, stand up and look out for your neighbors. want to be american, stand out and do the tough thing. tough thing is to, you know what, let's just take care of each other, respect law and order, let's take -- let's

follow the scientists and keep people safe and then together as a community, we can move forward. this president unfortunately continue to divide us. he just panders to the most outrageous, most extreme, when what he should be doing is -- you know what he can do? help us help working families. let's make sure families who have to stay home, who can't go to work, are able to afford to do that. let's help people who can't afford to pay their rent, folks on medicare and medicaid and people with disabilities. he's not doing any of that. >> are you -- are you concerned that these kinds of -- are you concerned that these kinds of protests, whatever you want to call them, are attracting a militia type activity? there has been increased sort of threatening, you know, language about asian-americans, communities more vulnerable now are you concerned this is going to attract more than what are being called protests?

>> of course. president trump is pandering to the extreme right. he's pandering to his extreme base now instead of leading the nation and uniting us as a country. this is why we need new leadership in washington. we need someone in the white house who is empathetic, who cares about the american people, all the american people, no what color your background or how rich you are, how poor you are, whether or not you live in michigan or florida or hawaii or anywhere else, we are a united nation. we should move forward that way. these guys out there, they're just trying to intimidate and divide us. we can't let them do it. >> i have to let you go. i have to ask, are you being -- are you being vetted to your knowledge potentially by vice president joe biden as he's picking his potential running mate? >> well, you'll have to ask him for that. i'm just thrilled that he is going to be our nominee and you couldn't have a more empathetic individual lead the country than joe biden and also in the first lady, dr. biden.

i'm just thrilled to have my name mentioned in the same breath as kamala harris or amy klobuchar, who is my personal hero. >> well, senator tammy duckworth, keep us posted. come back here first if you do think you're going to get the nod. thank you so much. be safe. >> you too. coming up, the impeached self-proclaimed stable genius thinks it is wise to withhold coronavirus related aid from states with sanctuary cities. that's next. states with sanctuary cities that's next. like way more vanities perfect for you. nice. way more unique fixtures and tiles. pairing. ♪ nice. way more top brands in sinks and faucets. way more ways to rule your renovation. nice! on any budget, with free shipping. wayfair. way more than furniture. no uh uh, no way

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last year, officers arrested more than 120,000 criminal aliens charged with nearly 10,000 burglaries, 5,000 sexual assaults, 2,000 murders and in the last year egregiously 5,000 human trafficking episodes. so american lives matter. our brave i.c.e. men and women matter. >> you raised that and the president's been kind of vague about this, are you explicitly

conditioning state aid on states or cities not saying they would have sanctuary city policys? >> no, not conditioning anything. saying that is a negotiating item that the president will certainly bring up. >> in the first white house press briefing, in more than a year, the brand-new white house press secretary caylkayleigh mcy backed up her boss. the courts are signaling that that won't fly. on thursday, a u.s. appeals court in chicago ruled against trump's attempt to withhold millions of dollars in federal law enforcement grants to sanctuary jurisdictions. the court ruled that just like it says in the old constitution, congress, not the executive branch, has the power of the purse. and added, quote, the separation of powers is a foundation of our government, not a formality, to be swept aside on the path to achieving goals that the executive branch deems worthy. joining me now, congressman eric

swalwell. here is donald trump's thoughts on why it is he thinks it is okay for him to try to withhold aid from states that have sanctuary cities in them. take a listen, please. >> explicitly will you seek to prevent that the next round of aid from going to sanctuary states and cities? >> well, number one, we shouldn't have to pay anything anyway, all they do is make it very hard for law enforcement. so that's number one. but i think in the bigger picture, i don't see helping cities and states if they're going to be sanctuary because all sanctuary means to me is it is protecting a lot of criminals. >> senator swalwell, your state battled with president trump on this before. your thoughts on his thoughts? >> good morning, joy. and, deb, nice to see you. it is cruel. first and foremost. but secondly, it is not wise. it is not goi ing to make us

healthier. the virus doesn't care about your immigration status. the economy is driven in california, one of the most thriving economies in the world by immigrants. thankfully governor newsom put in place a program where $150 million through a partnership with local charities will provide stimulus dollars to the undocumented. but cruel, not healthy, it could lead to the spread of the virus and it is not going to help the economy get back on its feet as immigrants are the ones who drive it. >> thank you very much. and i apologize for ripping you out of your designated chamber and putting you in the senate, you're in the house. congresswoman holland, same question to you. your state has a large number of immigrants, a large immigrant community, what do you make of this attitude of still trying to do this anti-immigrant business

even in the midst of a pandemic? >> well, of course, it shows the lack of his leadership and, eric, i'm happy to see you. i miss everybody. and so happy to be on the show with you. look, the president is doing his best to distract from his own failures. he failed to act when this virus got to our country, people have died, we have the highest rate of infections in the entire world, because we don't have the leadership that we need. so he's trying to distract from his own failures, and, look, joy, if any community is at risk, every single community is at risk. this is a serious pandemic, we need to approach it as an entire country and make sure we get the rate of infections down. this is a dangerous move for him, and it absolutely will put people's lives at risk. >> congresswoman, to stay with

you for a moment, speaking of communities at risk, business insider has done a little bit of the math here, and finds that native american and alaska native tribes that were supposed to receive $8 billion in covid-19 relief have not received a dime as of yet. do you have any updates on that? i know there say considerable community, indigenous community in the state. >> well, here in new mexico, native americans are 11% of the population. and over 50% of the positive cases. so getting this funding to tribes is so important and it is urgent. and representative rubin gallego and i wrote a letter to the treasury urging them to hurry up, figure out their formula, so that this funding can be distributed amongst tribes

equally and, look, every -- every tribe is different. but it is up to the treasury to hurry up and get this done and that's what we have been urging them to do. it is imperative that we care about every single community. communities of color are at higher risk. we have seen that in the data that has come out, and indian country is no different. and one of the reasons why indian country has the highest rate of cases is because we're so behind. we start way behind the start line, no running water, no electricity, no broadband internet service, these are issues that are endemic in indian country and one of the reasons is because the united states has not lived up to its trust responsibility and we need to make sure they have what they need in this emergency. >> yeah, indeed. congressman swalwell, you sent a letter yourself, and 72 members

did send a letter to secretary betsy devos urging quick release of emergency grants to students including daca recipients to stay with the theme we were discussing. the department of education announced $6 billion was available to immediately assist students who need urge end relief, however as of april 20, only $6 million of that funding was dispersed to colleges and universities, leaving thousands of students across the country to continue struggling with unforeseen expenses. we have difficulties in getting money into the hands, not just of students and schools, there is also issues with unemployment, california is having to struggle with that as well. why is it so hard for the federal government to get money into the hands of students and individual people when they got it to the banks so quickly. >> joy, i could not imagine a lesser confident administration than this one for a crisis like this. $6 billion was funded for these students and only 6 million has

gone out and, again, they have excluded daca students. and so they were just ill prepared. they ignored the playbook on pan democratics give pandemics, it is an administration that is cruel and competent, it is all about ego. this president, when he was supposed to make us healthier, he made us sicker, when he is supposed to make us wealthier, he made us poorer. when he's supposed to unite us, he's widened the division in this country. governors and members of congress in a bipartisan way, i think are working together to bring about the best of us, but these students, they're food insecure, housing insecure, for daca students, immigration status insecure and we need to do all we can to protect them and lift them up. >> and very quickly before i lose you, congresswoman holland, you and congressman joaquin have sent a letter urging them to adopt an expansive definition,

more expansive definition of who is an essential worker. how is that going? is there any progress on that? >> i mean, well, we'll keep pushing it. essential workers are the backbone right now of the, you know, the work on this coronavirus. we can't -- we have to respect the danger that they put themselves in every single day. we have to make sure that they have what they need in this emergency. because we rely on them. so we'll keep pushing for that. we'll do everything we can to make sure that essential workers have what they need, so that they can protect themselves because, look, at the end of the night, they go home to their families this will stop the spread and the main issue right now is to make sure that we are stopping the spread of this virus, and one of those keys is

to make sure essential workers are safe and stay healthy. >> indeed. congresswoman deb holland, thank you, stay safe. congressman swalwell, stay with me on the other side of the break. thank you very much. coming up, remember when donald trump said he was sending investigators to hawaii to find president obama's birth certificate? well, now he's on another conspiracy field mission to try and make himself look like he's not incompetent. i'll tell you about that next. t. i'll tell you aboutht at next. to america's frontline responders, thank you.

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i wanted to ask dr. fauci, can you address the suggestions or concerns that this virus was somehow man made? >> there was a study recently that we can make available to you where a group of highly qualified evolutionary virologists looked at the sequences there, the sequences in bats as they evolve, and the mutations that it took to get to the point where it is now is totally consistent with a jump

of a species from an animal to a human. >> just weeks ago, dr. anthony fauci rejected the conspiracy that coronavirus was man made in a lab in wuhan, china. yet this week, donald trump is still pushing the debunked, despite his own intelligence community's findings that it isn't true. it is not like trump has a history of going against the words of his own intelligence community or anything. >> the director of national intelligence said it was naturally occurring, not man made. >> who said that? >> the director of the national -- >> who in particular? >> my question is, have you seen anything at this point that gives you a high degree of confidence that the wuhan institute of virology was the origin of this virus? >> yes, i have.

yes, i have. >> what gives you a high degree of confidence that this originated from the wuhan institute of virology? >> i can't tell you that. i'm not allowed to tell you that. >> the mind reels. eric swalwell is still with us, and joining us now is dr. ashwin wusan, physician who is stationed in africa and now president and ceo of fountain house in new york city. listening to that is -- the intelligence community statement on the origins of covid-19 -- concurs with the wide scientific consensus that the covid-19 virus was not man made or genetically modified and yet donald trump doesn't seem to believe it, not only that, per "the new york times," senior trump administration officials have pushed american spy agencies to hunt for evidence to support an unsubstantiated theory that the government laboratory in wuhan was the origin of the coronavirus outbreak. doctor, to you, your thoughts.

the virus happened. there was the spanish flu, h1n1, these things happen. what do you make of the fact that this president thinks that someone cooked this thing up instead of it being a naturally occurring thing? >> i think dr. fauci said it a few weeks ago, correctly, i think there is pretty good consensus among virologists and people who study this thing for a living every day that there is a suggestion that this jumped from animals to humans. there is no suggestion that this was cooked up in some sort of lab, and as congresswoman holland said this is just another example of the president trying to change the narrative from his own failings, from his own failure to respond to the virus to provide the ventilators, the ppe and for his persistent failure to listen to scientists and public health experts. we have 30,000 cases a day, we have 2,000 deaths a day, both of those numbers are likely to be

vast underestimates based on the amount of testing we're doing. and we're nowhere near the end of this peak, we're in this long extended plateau, 19 states are still increasing their epidemic while even -- while new york, my state, is improving, you know, we need massive increases in testing, and tracing and investments in treatments and in healthcare, improvements in testing. but this president seems hell bent on distracting the american public. i don't know who took out that new york times ad yesterday, that full page ad, but they're right, we're at war with this virus and states don't fight wars. the federal government does. and until we accept that, until we have someone in charge who actually steps up and takes responsibility for the job they they were hired to do, then we're going to be spinning our wheels for a while. >> congressman, you ran for president, you sit on house intel, the reality is when you

elect a president, you do give them control of the fbi, the nsa, the irs, and the spy agencies and the -- people maybe want to think more carefully when they're making these kinds of choices, because he is now using his control over the american spy agencies to try to make people run and investigate this. this is almost like the birtherism request, except he has the power of the presidency. can congress do anything about that, to stop him from misusing the spy -- our spy agencies this way in. >> yes, we will and we have a plan to do that. this is a guy who got in a fight with the national hurricane center over where a hurricane was going last year. but, the intelligence committee led by chairman schiff, what we're doing is we're looking at, you know, the holdings of the intelligence community had, meaning what intelligence was the administration receiving about covid-19, when they were receiving it, and what were they

doing about it. we're also looking at generally how prepared was the united states for a pandemic and we want to make recommendations so that any future president is better prepared and better able to handle a pandemic like this, than this president. it is a fair question what did china know what did they do with the information they had, but not to beat them up over it right now, we still need to cooperate with them to find and trace this vaccine and to find a vaccine -- find and trace this virus and found a vaccine, there is going to be a day to hold them accountable. right now, you know, today, we are looking at the -- yesterday was the deadliest day in america for covid-19, so we're not out of this yet and i think we need leadership from the president, not again just looking out for his own political interests. >> and dr. vasan, we had the fda issue a caution against the president's favorite treatment,

hydroxychloroquine, outside of a hospital setting, for clinical trial due to a risk of heart rhythm problems, yet there is a story from "the washington post" about the extensive failures of the trump response including this passage, a vitamins executive who socializes with trump at his mar-a-lago club said the president asked him to call california governor gavin newsom on his cell phone to try to make a deal for the nation's largest state to buy millions of tablets of hydroxychloroquine from an indian manufacturer. california did not agree to tate drugs being offered. luckily not all the governors listen to donald trump. donald trump is in a position of here being a pitch man for his favorite treatment and he got the recommendation for that treatment from fox news anchors, not from doctors. your thoughts. >> yeah, i mean, again, another example of him failing to heed the warnings and the advice of

our scientific experts and conflating that or introducing krikz conflicts of interest with his or his friends' business interests. epidemiology 101 is that, you know, good response is based on clear, strong communication, led by scientists, led by data, and clear enough to compel the public to action. what we're seeing is a scattered and very confusing approach that is leading to decisions like, you know, or at least arguments to mass purchase hydroxychloroquine, in my experience is something that we reserve for people who really need it, like people who live with lupus and people who live with other autoimmune conditions. this was always a rush to judgment on this particular medication and, you know, it is having effects not only in the fact that it is not proven to be safe, nor effective, but it is

also draining supply from people, millions of people, many of color, who live with lupus who are unable to get access to the medication they need to stay healthy. so i don't think this administration and this president thinks two steps ahead or three steps ahead about the consequences of the words they say in public because the words matter. >> yeah. indeed. absolutely indeed. thank you very much. i'm sorry we're out of time. congressman eric swalwell rocking the lead from home beard, thank you for being here and dr. ashwan vasan, thank you. be safe. a trump supporter who has seen the light, you'll get to meet him right after the break. meet him right after the break it's best we stay apart for a bit,

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is wrong at the end of the day. you know it. you see how nervous you are. you are shaking. you're sweating. your glasses, you can't even see out of them. your mask is down underneath your nose again. you're te rrifying general public, you realize that. >> the confrontation between an anti stay-at-home protester is an extreme tactic as demonstrators enraged not getting haircuts and manicures leave their homes and flaunt their unmasked faces to demand states are open. why unbreakable to the president whose handling of the pandemic has been a disaster since day one? what are trump supporters really thinking? my next guest is david weisman, former trump supporter and u.s. army veteran. david, who has come to me live

and living color from twitter. i have tweeted with you many a time. thank you very much for being here. before i bring you on, i want to read just a -- the statement from -- a reporter you just saw, she had the mask on. her name is adrian robbins a reporter at nbc 4, our affiliate in columbus, ohio. she tweeted, i asked this woman to respect my space after she was spitting in my face. she said i had no right to social distance in public and continued to follow me. now, we don't know who this woman voted for. we are presuming she might be in the maga camp but people like that, you know, we see them around and that kind of attitude. can you explain what that kind of attitude is about? >> sure. first off, i'd like to thank you for having me on. what this attitude mindset that

comes from maga is they've been led to believe for so many years that democrats wants to take rights away, they want to take freedoms away, so they feel this is a plot by democrats and msn that that's what they're doing, their taking their freedoms away. they want to stay at home. they don't realize this is to keep people safe. it's a totally different world. >> and, you know, because i wonder, aren't people afraid of getting sick? even going and doing food runs around here, you'll see people walking around with no masks on, you know, sort of with kind of an attitude look like, i'm not going to wear a mask. who's daring me. they scare me because you're thinking, this person could be sick for all we know, but aren't people like that afraid of themselves getting sick? do they just not believe covid-19 is real?

>> not at all. a lot of this fear i mentioned about, a lot comes from propaganda from conservative networks downplaying the virus. they don't think the virus is as serious as it really is. a lot of people do not believe in the numbers of the fatalities from the virus. we have trump even called it a hoax. he called it a hoax for a long time. he waited until 70 days to finally act on it. you see people like sean hannity, laura ingraham, they were calling it a hoax. that's why you have so many thinking that this is not as serious as it really is. why they have no problem going into public and protesting. >> but, you know, at a certain point, even fox news anchors have admitted that it is real, right? so, if they change their minds and say it's real and if trump says, no, covid-19 is real, does that actually -- the people you know who are still trump

supporters, does that change their mind when their favorite anchors on fox say, yes, it's real? >> no. they think that the mindset is, this is the media, they're trying to get trump to follow through with all the experts. they don't see it that way. they believed trump for a long time this is not as serious. so, the anger and fear these people have actually came along before trump and they believe that, you know, democrats have always been trying to take their freedoms away. this mentality is something that's been going on for many, many years. >> before i let you go, what turned you to finally drop your support for the president? >> well, i had a very interesting dialogue that pretty much changed my world view with sara silverman on twitter.

i led to -- that democrats believe in, even politicians like obama and hillary clinton. i learned a lot of the stuff i believed for many years that's false, what in the real world is really going on. so, when my world view changed, i learned who trump really is. i realized he is not this patriotic businessman. you know, he had business failures, you know, he's like this -- the person that fox news and other media outlets made him out to be, he's not that in real life. when i realized that, i learned that that's not who i voted for -- when i voted for trump, i was picturing somebody else. >> well, he is a tv actor -- not even an actor. reality show guy. david, thank you. stay safe out there. coming up in our next hour -- thank you. coming up in our next hour,

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for more information on how you can stay connected, visit xfinity.com/prepare. i just think the country is too complex to ask a couple hundred people and ask what they think. there are so many ways and different people that are going to show up to vote now. the way turnout works and abilities we have to turn out voters, it's not -- the polling

can't understand that. the world's changed. none of these polls mean anything. it's the biggest joke in politics. it's the fakest thing. it's the fakest thing. >> then why do they get in the president's craw. >> you have to ask him that. >> you know him. >> because it makes it look like the media matter. they don't. >> welcome back. poll numbers may not matter to donald trump's campaign manager, but they do to president trump. trump had a complete and utter meltdown over his poll numbers. it looks like he took out his frustrations on mr. parscale. during a call, trump lashed out at parscale and other aides who show trump trailing joe biden in battleground states. according to "the new york times," trump was apparently so angry, he even threatened to sue his own campaign manager. trump also insisted the rnc's own internal data was somehow

wrong and that parscale was the one to blame for the flack waiting numbers. not his incompetency. trump denied it in a tweet. this comes the same week trump announce his plans to travel for the first time since the outbreak began. he says he will visit arizona next week and possibly ohio, two states important to his re-election campaign. congressman and former tea partier justin amosh who left the gop last year says he's now considering a run for president as a libertarian. >> you're very anti-trump. you've made that very clear. so the question then becomes, is it worth the risk of running and getting president trump back in office for another four more years? >> what i'm offering is another option for people to vote. and they deserve that option. i represent millions of people who aren't represented by these two parties and they deserve that opportunity. >> joining me now is election

forecaster, msnbc political analyst michael steele, elise jordan, former george w. bush aide, rick wilson, author of "running against the devil" and tom nichols, "usa today" opinion columnist. i'm going to you, chairman steele, because you were chairman of the republican committee. i'm going to get your opinion on this first. i'm going to do a round robin of what you think the outcome of justin will be for donald trump and that can include your take on how you think he might respond to that emotionally. what do you think the outcome will be of having amash running as a libertarian? >> first, can i say this, i love this panel. this is like an incredible panel. oh, my god. >> me, too. >> holy moly. >> right? >> i just -- okay. >> it's like i'm in the rnc from five years ago. it's like it's the rnc but eight years ago.

>> oh, you got all my faves on here. rachel bittercoffer, come on. here's my deal. i had to catch my breath. amash -- i get it. i get it. >> i used to fight with at least two of you on twitter, by the way. two of you used to be my twitter adversaries. isn't that fun? yep, there's one right there, right below me on the screen. >> i love it. this is so wonderful. the reality is this, look, let's start with the whole thing with the president erupting over his polls. come on. that happened. and the reason it happens is because the internal polling for a while has been showing the president is hemorrhaging support in some key places. he doesn't want to hear that. so, to brad parscales and the others, just tell the man what he wants to hear. just tell him what he wants to hear and move on. in terms of amash and what his

entry does, it's a little early to see. he's not formally announced. i think he's sort of fishing to see what level of support is out there. the libertarian party is not going to generate the kind of energy behind the campaign largely because of just the history of how these things work out. but starting when he's starting makes this a much tougher hurdle to overcome and pull the votes he's going to need from both democrats and republicans in a way that it could have an impact on the election. i'm sort of holding off on assessing exactly what his entry means at this point because i'm not even sure if it's actually going to ignite to the extent he declares he's in, raises the money and becomes competitive to the degree to even 3%, 4% of the poll. >> okay. since we're all on screen today we look like the brady bunch, i'm going around the brady bunch line here. tom, you're next.

you're next, mr. brady. what do you think is going to happen with justin amash in? >> for, the trumpers, this is more like a meeting of spectre. >> yes. >> i was really against joe walsh running a primary and letting that go too far into a third-party candidacy, which he didn't, to his credit. i think he did the right thing. i think amash is doing the wrong thing. when you're up against a cult, basically, when you're up against a really form bloc, you're not going to pick up the defections. i think the goal is to help down-ballot republicans because there would be people that wouldn't have voted but trump is on the ballot, i wouldn't vote for trump but amash is on the ballot and i'll vote for amash and republicans down the ballot. i'm curious on rachel's take on this, but i just think he takes votes probably enough to help

trump in marginal states rather than somehow taking his votes away from trump. >> let's go to rick wilson, who's next on our wheel here, our wheel of answers. let's go, rick, what do you think is going to happen with amash in. >> right. i think one of the things we learned, unfortunately, in 2016 is the parties are now so intensely polarized that the third-party pathway is a very difficult, very steep hill to climb. there's almost no circumstance where amash gets to a viable pathway. we know from a lot of polling from 16 and elsewhere that when you say that the person can't get to 270, they can't win the presidency, it cannot happen, that breaks off a lot of people even those who would be naturally inclined to support him. so, i think that amash, it's not a great thing, but i'm also not in a -- you know, the first day i was a little cranky about it but i've contemplated, run some of the numbers. i think there's another factor going on here.

we've already seen -- there are a certain pool of republicans who have broken away from donald trump. they did it in '18. we're seeing it in the polling now, as his endorsement by republicans is starting to break down over covid and other factors. this will be a race between joe biden and donald trump. and justin will likely be a footnote. that's about it. >> let's go to elise, you worked for the george w. bush white house. were you on the campaign as well? >> no. but i was on senator rand paul's campaign, so i have -- i'm familiar with the libertarian world a bit. i really admire representative justin amash. i think there has been a bit of an overreaction to his entry. i think he stands to potentially take votes from donald trump in michigan more so than joe biden. you look at justin amash's policy stances, he's pro-life. he has a foreign policy to the

left of joe biden. he's going to push a conversation on deficits and the ballooning deficit. it's too early to tell. we don't even know if justin amash will get the libertarian nomination because that nomination process is in flux because are they going to be able to have a convention in a month as planned? they aren't. what's going to happen with all the state organizers and -- at that convention and how is the nomination going to end up being divvied out? i think there are too many unknowns but i welcome his entry into the race. >> see, that's what i think. i tend to think he hurts trump more because the kind of people who would vote for him, this sort of tea party voter, are not in any way going to vote for biden. maybe a little tempted but probably more likely to give their vote to him. they'll only give it to the expert. you have written a piece about this, rachel, so i'm very

excited to hear what you have to say. what do you think the result will be -- the likely result will be of mr. amash being in this race? >> one thing i would want to be clear is he won't be competitive to win the presidency. so we're talking about how much of the tea party will amash siphon off. as i point out in my analysis, this is no gary johnson from '16. johnson really had a lot more support because he was pulling from the left side of the spectrum. amash, even after his exodus from the party and some votes he took with democrats that were on pretty big issues, he is still more conservative than 84% of house republicans. so, you know, that's a problem when you're trying to market him to a biden audience. and then i'm a little bit more -- i've always been bearish about the soft support we see

about right holding biden up in the swing states and reminded about abortion and guns. i always thought those people might not follow through anyway. we know for sure parscale, and by the way, this panel is the nightmare for parscale. i hope he sees this and he can't sleep for a week. so, you know, parscale strategy -- what he was talking about with polling, what he's trying to say is, look, identify got this social media hunting machine. it's $100 million financed new voter turnout machine. i mean, it's basically what i argue democrats should do but parscales is doing it and he's been doing it for a year and he's hoping to god it's going to bear fruit. i think it's wrong to expect it won't bear any fruit. he's using algorithms of people

who agree with trump. there's a lot of non-white, college educated for him to pick off. he's planning to taking votes from biden to the left to the green party. that's a huge element of their strategy. having somebody on the other side of the ticket that is ideologically attractive to hard-line republicans, assuming democrats were to utilize it and advertise and target the base of the gop with ads to support the third-party candidate in places like michigan where it can make a difference, i don't see it -- i certainly don't see it as something similar to the 2016 issue. >> interesting. gary johnson, people forget, got 3% where jill stein got 1%. >> right. >> he pulled in all of those young, white, male pot smokers, right? >> yes, exactly.

exactly. he got from the left. let me just go around again because, michael steele, you lived through the tea party movement the first time around. we've now watched as a lot of those principles have gone over the boards, right. with trump there, the spending deficits don't matter. a lot of the stuff that were sort of depicted as hard core principles aren't anymore. i wonder if that idea holds. do people at some point revert back -- i'll ask you first and then elise her experience with rand paul. do people revert back to their principles or is the loyalty to trump the most powerful thing on the table for republicans? >> my estimation at this point is that the loyalty to trump is more important than pretty much anything else. there are those who are trying to at least fake it until they can make it again on some of these subjects. we hear mcconnell now, some republicans in the senate

expressing concern about debts and deficits as they already spent $3 trillion the country doesn't have and now looking to spend more. the reality about gets and deficits, that new reality for republicans is the public doesn't believe them on the subject anymore. it's hard to make that case in the traditional manner. i think the fallback position is going to be trump. >> that seems right to me. i want to get the other two guys in as well. >> joy, i think the calculation made by so many republicans was that in steve bannon's words, donald trump was a blunt instrument that they could use to achieve all their policy ames because he had -- because he has no core, he has no real beliefs. you know, you watched as various republicans from senator paul to senator graham, polar opposites on foreign policy and how you watch donald trump just be

yo-yoing about, one day believing one thing and the other day believing the next, so i think we're just going to see more of that and republicans hope on a good day they can influence him and other days they just have to shake their heads. >> i'm running out of time but i'm going to try to get everybody in. rick wilson, the lincoln -- the lincoln initiative. tell me the name -- >> lincoln project. >> lincoln project. do the ads -- is there a temptation because justin amash is more ideologically aligned to shift to something like that? encouraging more republicans to vote for justin amash, is that a strategic choice you think is viable or just, nope, biden for the win? >> that would be a long way down the path, but this is -- the great trope of 2016 was the -- it was an exteistential choice

between hillary clinton who would drive the country into great depression and led to thousands of death or donald trump, he might be bad but it might work out okay. this really has become the flight 93 election. this has become the existential choice. look, those of us in the lincoln project are working very hard to make sure we're communicating with voters that can be moved. it's a game of small numbers. we're playing in the electoral college states where it matters. we're going to target, identify, use the messages that work. we'll see what those turn out to be as we go down the track. we've envested a lot in the front end. it's not at the scale of brad parscales. our own version of voter analysis and working to identify people. there are a lot of them. a surprising number of them in the swing states who are broken away from trump or soft trump supporters and who have reached a point where when you have peace and prosperity, it's kind of fun to have the transgressive

jerk sometimes, the guy who tweets and calls people names but right now we have 70,000 americans dead. it's not funny anymore. they're not taking it in a way you can excuse all things trump is and does. >> tom, the issue is that trump is encouraging these going to a militia look by keeping everyone on board by, i don't know, threatening legislatures in michigan. i don't understand it. you tweeted about it. we're going to look like a militia which isn't going to make lawmakers do anything other than be afraid. i don't understand the strategy of that, trying to use that and that tough guy move. does that end up working with voters? >> i think it just underscores the reality that this election is not about policy. it's about culture and resentment. the distraction of someone like amash is that he will go out there and say, both sides are

terrible. when both sides aren't terrible. this isn't a choice between two equally bad options in this election. but trump and amash will both take the same position, but for me, terrible things will happen. there's a whole other subtext under these militia guys about -- there's a whole bad story in there about what's happened to masculinity and responsibility among young american men that trump is explo exploiting. the idea this is about policy and the real debate that we'll have somewhere along the line in the next seven months is about deficits or foreign policy, i don't think is right. i think this is a referendum on donald trump and it has to stay that way. >> yes. well, i have run out of time. i'm sorry. i've gone over. this is a great panel. it does look like the brady bunch a little bit. rachel, rick wilson, tom, thank you all very much, michael and

elise come back later on. jared takes a break from playing peace broker in the middle east with -- and hanging out with a murdering saudi dictator and starring in memes to pay homage to his father-in-law's dreadful handling of a pandemic. father-in-law's dreadful handling of a pandemic e with its irresistible scent. looks like their dog michelangelo did too. unfortunately for him, it's more of a forbidden love. new gain ultra flings with two times oxi boost and febreze... seriously good scent. ...and if you love gain flings, you've gotta try the dish soap.

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and i think we've achieved all the different milestones needed. so, the government -- federal government rose to the challenge. this is a great success story. and i think that that's really what needs to be told. >> donald trump's son-in-law, jared kushner, along with fixing the middle east and solving the opioid crisis, is also involved in the administration's coronavirus response. though he could use a little lesson in timing. even as he appeared on fox to declare, mission accomplished, the situation on the ground was veering toward catastrophic. on tuesday, the day before kushner spoke, u.s. cases topped 1 million. and on wednesday alone 2,000

more deaths were recorded. joining me now is susan rice, former national security adviser to president barack obama and author of "tough love:my story of the things worth fighting for." ambassador rice, thank you for being here. you called jared kushner's comments about mission accomplished ridiculous, to say it was a great success. you called it laughable. >> yes. >> you said it would be laughable if it weren't so deadly serious. >> right. >> feel free to expand on that. >> well, it's really, joy, offensive when you digest the reality that now nearly 70,000 americans have lost their lives. as you said, well over 1 million infected, 30 million americans have lost their jobs. we know that number is an underestimate. how one could possibly declare that a success of any sort, mission accomplished is

bewildering and it is offensive because so many americans are suffering. we're suffering loss of life, loss of loved ones, and the degree of our suffering in human terms and economic terms is, frankly, far greater than it needed to be because of this administration's incompetence, the president's denials and dishonest statements and their refusal to act on the information they had beginning in early and mid-january, when we learned this was a major problem in china. any person with knowledge and experience of pandemics knows this was going to come to us in a major way. >> if you were still in your former job, would you ever hire anybody with jared kushner's skill set for a job at that level? >> no, but that's nepotism. that's not something we practiced in the obama administration. >> speaking of the obama

administration, donald trump has tried to blame a lot of people -- as you said, he's tried to blame the world health organization, tried to blame china and tried to blame the obama administration for where we find ourselves today. let me let you listen to him trying to do that very thing. take a listen. >> the last administration left us nothing. we started off with bad, broken test stops. >> your thoughts on that. >> it's, of course, preposterous. the notion that we left them faulty tests when we left office in january of 2017 and there wasn't a novel coronavirus to test for at that time is false on its face. but the broader narrative that somehow the obama administration left this new administration unprepared is ridiculous. first of all, this is 3 1/2 years into the trump administration. they own whatever the situation

is. secondly, we understood very clearly the real likelihood of a pandemic. president obama spoke to it publicly in december 2014 as we were wrestling with the ebola epidemic. i set up an office at the white house, solely for the purpose of tracking global health events and possible pandemics and responding to them. we left them a 69-page playbook which i called "pandemics for dummies" which was designed to enable an administration to walk through a set of issues and questions and begin to prepare a response. they dismantled the office, discarded the playbook. they disregarded the exercise we prepared for them to enable them to work through these kinds of issues in the transition, and they never prioritized pandemics as the catastrophic threat we all knew it could be. and that, more importantly, joy, they wasted the months of january and february in terms of

gearing up our response. that's the time when we should have been surging the acquisition and procurement of ppe and ventilators and tests and all of the things that we now know, that all americans now know are so badly needed. we knew that to be the case. we left a whole and complete national strategic stockpile. for the trump administration to blame the obama administration or blame anybody else is purely an effort to cover up and distract from their own extraordinary failings. joy, i'm not hearing you, i'm afraid. nearly 100 years serving the military community, we've seen you go through tough times and every time, you've shown us, you're much tougher your heart, courage and commitment has always inspired us and now it's no different

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we have fixed our gremlins and we are back with former national security adviser susan rice. i was going to say before we cut out that it appears that your

add -- that the obama administration hid the pandemic response sort of playbook in the one place donald trump couldn't find it. this is not my original quote, you hid them in a book, and that may be the problem. i want to -- point on the op-ed you wrote in the "new york times." you wrote it's not enough to get back to normal. normal is too costly and deadly for all americans. can you explain what you meant by that? i think for a lot of people, normalcy is what folks crave right now. they're stir crazy and scared. what did you mean by that, that normal will not be enough? >> normal's not enough because what we've seen, joy, is how we're all affected when many among us don't have health care, the access to treatment. they live in poverty and deep insecurity. in a health crisis, those

disparities mean all of us are more vulnerable to be infected. we've seen what it's done to our economy. you know, people who weeks ago had secure employment are now, you know, out trying to figure out where their next meal is going to come from. the structures that we had in place looked on the surface to many to be, you know, best in the world. what we realized is that they aren't working. so, when i say we have to do more than get back to normal, i share everybody's desire to be able to go out and socialize and all those things, which one day eventually we will be able to do safely. once there's a vaccine. in the meantime, we have to take more incremental steps. but if we're going to come out of this crisis a better nation, as we have from other crisis after world war ii, after the upheavals of the 1960s and so many other times when we've put in place mechanisms to be more supportive of the least among us, that's what we have to do now to build national unity, to

strengthen our democracy, and to build back better. so, what i'm suggesting is that we aim to come out of this stronger and more whole. that's going to require a kind of leadership that we don't have now. and it's going to require a vision that's important and utterly lacking. >> before i let you go, i feel obliged to ask you, to your knowledge, do you know if you are being vetted to be potentially joe biden's running made? >> i don't have any direct knowledge of whether or not that's the case. i have seen some of the same press stories that you have. and i'm honored even to be in the company of such distinguished and accomplished women, but i have no direct knowledge beyond that. >> thank you very much. hopefully you will keep us posted on that if any of those developments change. susan rice, thank you. please stay safe. >> thank you, joy.

>> cheers, thank you. coming up in our next hour, new york governor andrew cuomo will give his coronavirus update, and we talked to ruben stimulus checks into the hands of small business owners. checks of small business owners high protein. low sugar. tastes great! high protein. low sugar. so good. high protein. low sugar. mmm, birthday cake. and try pure protein shakes, with 24 vitamins and minerals. and try pure protein shakes, when you think of a bank, you think of people in a place. but when you have the chase mobile app, your bank can be virtually any place. so, when you get a check... you can deposit it from here. and you can see your transactions and check your balance from here. you can save for an emergency from here. or pay bills from here. so when someone asks you, "where's your bank?" you can tell them: here's my bank. or here's my bank. or, here's my bank. because if you download and use the chase mobile app, your bank is virtually any place. visit chase.com/mobile.

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how we're helping restaurants open pop-up markets. and encouraging all americans to take out to give back. adversity came to town. so we looked it in the eye. and it won't be us... that blinks first. the way florida has approached this, even though our hospitalization and infection and fatality rates are much lower than many of these other

big states, particularly in the northeast and midwest, we did not necessarily, you know, quote, shut everything down. i had construction going. we had a lot of retail that was open. we're starting, i think, a little ahead of where other states are. i think that will help us as well. >> oh, yes, the same governor who couldn't figure out how to properly place a protective mask on his face is ready to reopen florida tomorrow because for him it's all about the economy. back with me, michael steele and elise jordan. elise, i want to start with you. let's go to the governor of your native state, mississippi, here is governor tate on fox news sunday about their plans to reopen the state. here he is. >> governor, why are you reopening mississippi at all when you haven't met the white house guidelines of a steady, downward trajectory for two straight weeks? >> well, that's a great question, chris. and it's a fair question. what i would tell you is that

you have to understand mississippi is different than new york and mississippi is different than new jersey. i spoke personally with dr. birx. we agree sometimes the models are just different for different states, just like they're different for various counties. we believe that that particular criteria doesn't work in states like ours who have never had more than 300 cases in any one day with the exception of friday in that data dump. >> you know, i wonder, in what way is this state different from the point of view of a virus? i didn't know viruses could tell what state they're in and behave differently in a different state. your thoughts. >> and also i'd point out that the reason we haven't had more than 300 cases a day is because the population is a teeny, teeny fraction of the rest of the country, and especially the new york metropolitan area. governor reeves is resistant to instituting a stay-at-home policy in the first place.

we were a week later than most places. i'm not surprised the economy is taking precedence over human lives. you've seen the response of governor reeves at an outbreak at a chicken plant and they say, we don't know it happened because of production on the line and the work day. it could have happened because workers are working in close quarters or being transported together. a lot of denial when it comes down to big donors. >> indeed. speaking of big donors, let me play larry kudlow. he is apparently behind the scenes wushing for a reopening because the economy is what matters most. here he is. he was on "state of the union" today. >> he himself has said in that story, that is not true. he was clarifying the situation. he was not changing the situation. we have, from day one, abided by the advice and guidance of our

top medical people, dr. fauci, ambassador birx and many others in hhs and fda. this idea that somehow we were creating a new model is simply not the case. >> just to explain what he's talking about, "the washington post" had reported that a small team led by a guy called kevin hassett had built their own model to guide response operations in the white house and many white house aides interpreted the analysis as predicting the daily death count would peak in mid-april before dropping off substantially and there would be far fewer fatalities than initially predicted. they said they created their own sort of good news model that said they could get the state back opening and they seem to be operating more on that than the science. your thoughts, michael? >> well, it's driven by one person and that's trump. trump has said before easter wanted to open the economy, as he put it, because he values the economy more than he values the

health and safety of the american people writ large. the reality is a lot of what you're seeing now is playing out based on leadership and the voice and ton of that leadership that has set the stage for where we are. here's the rub. i'd ask the mississippi governor, how many tests have you run in your state? do you know exactly where the infection rate is exactly at this moment in your state? how many tests have you run per day given the population of your citizens? how many tests do you have available to you? you know, you're sitting back and acting as if you're opening up the economy into this brand-new world. no, you're opening it up into a coronavirus world. because that's where we still are. we're not in a new normal. we're not in a new anything. we're in the same place we have been for the last two months because we don't have the tests on the ground. you don't have the information you need to do the kind of -- make the kind of decisions that impact people's lives the way

you plan. >> indeed. michael steele, elise jordan, stay safe. thank you for spending some of your morning with us. appreciate it. >> thank you. >> thank you. up next, a little coronavirus creativity. eativity

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here's a razor that works differently. the gillette skinguard it has a guard between the blades that helps protect skin. the gillette skinguard. ♪ first and foremost, use a lot of soap ♪ ♪ that's exactly what we want, talk of social distance ♪ ♪ riding in your car, the further you are away the better off you are ♪ the pandemic has artists jumping in to help. dougie fresh and artie green collaborated on a song and video, "20 seconds or more."

younger people and communities of color are at risk of exposure to the coronavirus. the video wants to change that. joining me is dougie fresh and dr. williams, chief of staff the neurology at columbia presbyterian hospital. co-founders of hip hop public health. i will try to act like i'm calm having this conversation with you. i'm not fan girling. i'm an original low key member of the get fresh crew from back in the day. >> that's right. i love it. >> tell me why you created this. >> first of all, i want to thank y'all for having me on here. i appreciate it so much. me and dr. williams got together. i got a call and he said, doug e., this thing is bigger than what you could imagine. he is on the front line and shot out to everybody on the front line, all of the families that's

been suffering from it. i said, you know, we have been doing this for a long time. we have been trying to use hip hop as well as his expertise to change the lives of others. this time, more than any other time, this is that time. when he gave me the call, creatively i just think that god blessed me -- i didn't even have to write nothing down. the idea just came in my head. i did everything that i could to get it done. dr. williams gave me the green light, because if it's hot, believe it or not, he is like an a & r. outside of being a doctor. you start seeing him go like this, you know it got groove to it. as long as we got a groove and we can get the message in, then our job is done. thanks to him, artie, laurie, the whole team. i'm telling you, i wanted to do this to change people's lives and help them save their families. you know how we are.

you know how the community is. sometimes we don't get it until it gets to the emergency level. when he gave me the green light, i said, well, i'm ready to go. that's how it started. >> absolutely. dr. williams, we are seeing these increased levels of death in our communities. it's a combination of the pre-existing health pathology, lack of access to health care. but can something like this -- can this help to flatten the curve within communities of color? how will that work? >> certainly. first of all, thanks for having me on, joy. hand watching is one of the fundamentals of infection control. we have known for some time in the health care industry that improper hand washing can lead to large rates of hospital-acquired infection. we know that proper hand washing

techniques can reduce the transmission of respiratory viral infections by up to 21%. we touch our faces about 23 times an hour. this virus lives on surfaces when it lands from the air. all we have to do is touch these surfaces and touch our faces and we can become infected. we also know, joy, that hand washing -- there are disparities in hand washing. we know women are better at washing their hands than men. we also know that people in poorer households and people are lower levels of education also don't wash their hands as often as they should. then there's the issue of hand washing technique. we know that proper hand washing technique, washing it for 20 seconds or more, is something that we don't practice properly. so this message has an incredible ability -- it's cost-effective. it's simple. it's widely accepted.

it has the unbelievable ability to help us push back this virus. even beyond covid, we have flu season coming on and hand washing plays a big role there, too. >> yeah. absolutely. doug e., tell us some of the people involved in this. we can see some of them. we are playing clips as we talk to you. give us some of the names involved. one of the things i have to say, artists have stepped up, whether dj on instagram to keep people entertain and encouraging people in the arts and stepping up. tell us some of the people involved in this video. >> thank you. one of the things that i wanted to do in this video is that i wanted to make sure that some people you may know and some you may not know. i put their names on in the video so that people could see the diversity, just the different lines of work and entertainment that everybody is coming from or political or just

being on the front line. you know, you have lisa ray in there, an actress. ez ad one of the founding mem r members, sedcedric the entertai. then the original run dmc. then at the last minute, one of my close friends, jamie foxx, he sent it in. he was like, doug e., whatever you need. everybody knows the seriousness of this situation. whether you are affected directly or indirectly, it's affecting all our lives. >> absolutely. do you know how difficult it was to not introduce you by saying six minutes, six minutes?

i didn't do that. i restrained myself. thank you very much. >> thank you. >> dr. williams, thank you very much. >> i couldn't help myself. stay safe. appreciate you. thank you so much. thank you for joining us today. thanks for watching. i couldn't help myself. stay tuned for more news. ♪ if you catch a fever, slight cough, feel it in yeah chest ♪ ♪ call your doctor, don't go running to the hospital because you could be a threat ♪ ♪ the virus is contagious ♪ you ain't see the movie, it's like --

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