♪ welcome to a very busy thursday. it is meet the dress daily, i'm chuck todd continuing msnbc breaking news coverage of the coronavirus pandemic. at least 85,000 americans have now died in this pandemic. that threshold we crossed today. today we also learned that more than 36 million americans have now lost their jobs because of this pandemic as well. both of those grim figures are expected to get worse,

potentially much worse. and the dysfunction and political impulses of this administration threaten to exacerbate this crisis even more. right now, president trump is downplaying warnings from scientists inside his administration and yesterday he claimed dr. fauci was playing all sides of the reopening debate. today, he's claiming that the testimony from dr. rick bright, a top vaccine expert, is simply not legitimate. >> our window of opportunity is closing. if we fail to improve our response now based on science, i fear the pandemic will get worse and be prolonged. there will be likely a resurgence of covid-19 this fall, and it will be greatly compounded by the challenges of seasonal influenza. without better planning, 2020 could be the darkest winter in modern history. >> he's nothing more than a really disgruntled, unhappy person. i watched him, and he looked like an angry, disgruntled employee who, frankly, according

to some people, didn't do a very good job. >> we should note, according to dr. bright's lawyers, the government watchdog says they'd, quote, found a substantial likelihood of wrong doing at hhs based on a complaint he filed with the inspector general. this is not just one he said versus another he said. this is an inspector general saying strongly that there was something here. the white house says it strongly disagrees with bright's allegations. now, as the president breaks with experts inside his administration, he is cheering on movements in this country eager to roll back local restrictions, notably, though, in states that will be key to his re-election like wisconsin, pennsylvania, and michigan, a state he visited today, just a few days after tweeting that the great people of pennsylvania want their freedom now and they are fully aware of thwhat that entails. the white house is now effectively pulling a 180 on its pandemic response messaging, apparently. they've gone from saying that this pandemic caught everyone off guard to now suggesting they were prepared from the start.

as if 85,000 deaths and 36 million jobs lost is somehow all going to plan? >> what our administration did under the leadership of president trump was do an entire 2018 pandemic preparedness report. beyond that, we did a whole exercise on pandemic preparedness in august of last year, and had an entire after action report put together. in other words, the obama/biden paper packet was superceded by president trump's style pandemic preparedness response. >> it was much better, which was much more complete and which was a lot tougher. >> and after telling the cdc to basically water down its reopening guidance, drafts of which did end up leaking out, moments ago the agency finally posted recommendations for communities, schools, workplaces and events. we're going to dive into that in a moment so that you get all of it. but we've got every corner of the story covered. joining me now from capitol hill

is nbc's garrett haake. dasha is in pennsylvania, one of our county to county project counties that has seen some clashes over reopening and robert costa, national political reporter for the "washington post" and also an msnbc political analyst. let's start geographically and move up pennsylvania avenue. so garrett, i want to start with you and the rick bright testimony that got things started today. and apparently, at least, motivated the white house to say, hey, that's not true. we had plans. and then we heard from secretary -- the hhs secretary disputing a lot of rick bright's testimony. whatever one wants to make of the bright testimony and the whistle-blower complaint, it got the white house's attention. >> reporter: it got the white house's attention before the bright testimony even started with the president preemptively tweeting, essentially trying to discredit bright, arguably drawing more attention to him in the first place. i think the bright comments that perhaps were most likely to get

under the white house's skin are the ones we have all seen play out in realtime and the keyword from him was planning, all the elements where the administration did not have a plan on things like nationwide testing, where we still don't have a nationwide testing program, to the production and distribution of ppe, which we all, as americans, saw play out in realtime with governors from all over the country scouring the globe to get ppp. that was one of the more damning parts of dr. bright's testimony. and then one that we haven't seen played out yet but i think we have to pay enormous attention to because it is dr. bright's specific area of expertise and that's vaccine creation and distribution. he expressed a lot of concern that the models aren't there to make 300 million doses of vaccines and distribute them around the country to the people who need them most in a timely fashion. so we've seen his concerns play out with our own eyes in realtime on two out of those three things, and he's raising a red flag about thing three, vaccine distribution, that i think we would all be wise to

continue to monitor really closely. >> and then i want to play a clip here, and shannon, it may or may not be related to the plan that kayleigh mcenany was talking about, but here's congresswoman susan brooks asking dr. bright about various plans that he participated in. take a listen. >> the window is closing to address this pandemic because we still do not have a standard, centralized coordinated plan to take our nation through this response. >> that was not the byte. let me see right now. i think we've got the byte i was looking for, specifically. susan brooks and dr. bright. do we have that now, control room? all right, let me read it to you. read to you. she asked this. the white house put forth, in september of 2018, shannon, a national biodefense plan.

did you participate in that national biodefense plan? he said he did. many of us did. then he added, those plans have been in place. it's disappointing they were not pulled out in january of this year and followed. they were not put on the table with a strong leader, indicating these are our plans, everyone fall in line. do we now know what plans kayleigh mcenany is talking about? is it these various exercises and afteraction reports that the "times" reported on last fall? >> reporter: well, i mean, this is what i can tell you about plans at this point, chuck. there were a number of different plans throughout the government. we don't know exactly which one kayleigh mcenany was talking about. we haven't been able to get any clarity from that from white house officials or from people in the press office here. but yes, i mean, to the point, there were plans in the government, but the problem was, was anyone following those plans? you know, there's people in the government whose entire job is to prepare for this. you know, sadly, some people would say the white house got rid of some of those people. but you know, i think even when the administration presents

plans like mcenany said they will do tomorrow, the question remains, all right, so you had these plans in place, did you follow them? and if so, why was there such a shortage of ppe? why are we just now getting this marshall project for a vaccine really up and running? these questions remain, despite what various plans might have been going around the government into this pandemic. >> robert costa, this issue of testing and contact tracing, it is something that many on capitol hill believe is needed, bipartisan belief. many business leaders believe it. the president is not convinced. he seems to be skeptical. again, today, he's in pennsylvania, and he says, oh, testing's overrated. you know, the more we test, the more cases we have. he doesn't seem to get -- he doesn't seem to understand why that's necessary or is there some other reason?

>> here's -- here's how the white house is seeing this. they know that businesses, to reopen, are asking the white house, through their different advocacy groups, to have testing at a certain level in all of these states so they can bring workers back without being sued. and so in response to that, many congressional republicans, including leader mcconnell, have privately told them, look, we're going to push for liability protections in this next round of legislation, so if we don't have the testing capacity, we're going to still be able to try to get you reopened. at the same time, many of these businesses, they want to have that liability shield, but they still need a long-term testing strategy, because you may be protected from lawsuits to some extent but if you don't have a test and the swabs and the contact tracing plans, federally, for september, october, later this year, then you don't really have a long-term strategy for survival as a business. >> robert, is his allergy to owning the testing issue simply because he's getting bad press over testing?

>> it comes back to what dr. bright was testifying about today. listen closely to the testimony, and you hear him talking about peter navarro, the white house trade advisor, who was warning, in his series of memos earlier this year, about the need to expand testing across the country, about this coming pandemic, and he was working closely with dr. bright, but the white house, in terms of its action, they're very defensive about the action they took on china and flights. but when it comes to testing, every governor, almost to a t that i have interviewed in recent weeks, has said testing was not there when they needed it and that's why they've been turning to all these different companies and foreign countries. >> as we said at the top, the president himself seems to be more focused on reopening states -- particularly states that matter to him in his bid for 270 electoral votes. here's what he said -- i want to go over to dasha burns in beaver county, pennsylvania. here's what the president said yesterday about states and about

what he thought was politically happening here on these reopenings. take a listen. >> they want to get their states open. some governors and some, perhaps, partisans, maybe for election reasons, don't want to have their states opened, and then some shouldn't open them quite yet, you know, they're not ready. they went through a lot and they're not quite ready. but no, we're opening our country. people want it open. >> dasha burns, you've been in beaver county in western pennsylvania, it was a big, important county to donald trump's path to carrying pennsylvania in 2016. it is the only county in western pennsylvania not allowed to open by the democratic governor, so it does seem as if it's become a political hot potato there. >> reporter: yeah, chuck, i mean, president trump stepped into a pretty divided state today. the governor, somewhat cautious in reopening the state. other people are none too pleased about that, especially

here in beaver where they really feel -- they feel left behind by the governor, and they're behind president trump, and he really added fuel to the fire today in what has already been a pretty big clash. we're going to see a big protest in the capital tomorrow, and people here are also going to be protesting at the courthouse locally, but one thing that struck me out of some of the images coming out of other states like wisconsin, as i've been traveling across the country, talking to people about this reopening issue, the most common argument i hear from local officials that want their counties reopened is that, look, residents are going to know what to do. they're going to know how to keep themselves and their communities safe. well, first of all, i've heard from a lot of residents that they do want a little bit more guidance from authorities as to how to do that. but also, i think what we saw out of wisconsin, when they lifted that stay-at-home order and you saw those bars packed wall to wall with people celebrating, i wonder if those images won't become sort of a

counterargument to that, chuck. >> and dasha, how much are you hearing, the belief that somehow politics is behind the inability of beaver to be reopened and we know that beaver county has had an outbreak at a senior living center, which is what -- why that lone county, the governor wasn't ready to let them open. >> reporter: yeah, chuck, i got to tell you. people are pretty unhappy with this democratic governor and they're telling me that this might not be so good for joe biden and the democrats, but really, these small businesses on this main strip here, they are sort of caught in the cross fire right now between local and state governments, so the government says beaver stays in this red, restricted phase, but the county commissioners came out and said, listen, if these businesses, if you all want to move from that red phase into the yellow phase of reopening like the rest of the counties in this area, we are not going -- you're not going to see any consequences from us. the governor, though, had some pretty harsh words about that.

he said counties that are bucking his orders might see funding withheld and businesses reopening prematurely could see sanctions so that leaves all these folks, the people i've been talking to all day, pretty confused and scared, chuck. they feel like they'll see terrible consequences to their livelihoods if they can't reopen but also bad consequences if they do choose to reopen too early, chuck. >> and robert costa, i want to put up these poll numbers an anthony fauci right now. this is from cbs/ugov. 83% of democrats trust him. 51% of republicans, a majority, bare majority, but 49% of republicans say no. has fauci been benched by the president? is that your understanding? >> well, the president's not a baseball manager, but he certainly sidelined, politically, dr. fauci. you've seen the white house in terms of its communications

message no longer have these coronavirus briefings. they're news briefings dominated by the president. his exchanges with reporters. dr. fauci, though, still has a strong voice, testifying before the senate this week, but you don't see the white house rallying behind dr. fauci as a team member. you see him cast aside in the way they describe him. he's a nonpartisan official. he's not part of the trump team, but those close to dr. fauci say he's very comfortable not being part of a partisan team. he's there to serve the country. >> and shannon pettypiece, about debra birx, we haven't seen her publicly in a while. what is -- it does seem as if the scientists in general are not being put up front as much. >> reporter: right. yeah, they've moved away from this daily coronavirus briefing, which was really the only time reporters had an opportunity to, you know, ask these principal scientists questions, real, scientific questions. they did, on monday, have admiral gerard talk about

testing, so that was a technical, scientific front there, but it's absolutely true. we have not had an opportunity to really get an update and question these scientists. to the point of whether there's a growing disconnect as bob was talking about between the white house and fauci, i talked to kayleigh mcenany, the press secretary today, about this disconnect, potentially, between the president and fauci, and she took that as an opportunity to try and prevent the appearance of any daylight between them and make it appear like both of them are on the same page, so for whatever that is worth, she did not come out and try and attack fauci, but tried to find some common ground between the two of them. >> and garrett haake, i want to save the final question for you, because tomorrow, we're going to have a vote on the house bill. and i saw a report today about peter king, a republican from new york city, who's -- i think he said he's likely to vote with the democrats on this. are we going to see a lot of house republicans, you know, more than 10 or 12, are we going to see some breaks in there and

does that apply pressure to mitch mcconnell? >> reporter: i doubt you will see significant breaks here beyond some of the usual suspects on this house bill. i think nancy pelosi had a press conference this afternoon, i asked her about the next phases of this. she acknowledged that the republicans will come to the table on this, that they're calling this a partisan bill, but even mitch mcconnell knows something else has to be done. there will be another relief bill. it's just a question of when. so, democrats are laying a marker with this vote tomorrow but i think the broader expectation is there's going to be a long way to go in negotiations before there's anything that attracts serious republican support in the house. >> and we know earlier today the white house is already signaling, you know, they're okay with some state aid, aid to states here, so it does look like you're starting to see, at least, the creaking of movement when it comes to negotiating. garrett haake, shannon, dasha, robert, thanks for getting us

started. up ahead, the cdc's reopening guidelines. they're finally out. they appear to be watered down from the originally leaked guidance the white house decided to shelve. we're going to talk to a former surgeon general about them. a sitting u.s. senator forced to turn over a cell phone. the latest on the fbi investigation into richard burr plus the other lawmakers facing new scrutiny. facing new scrutiny this is my body of proof. proof i can fight moderate to severe rheumatoid arthritis.

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welcome back. cdc just released new detailed reopening guidance for public places like schools, stores, and restaurants. this, of course, comes after the white house returned earlier cdc reopening guidelines for revision. and from a cursory glance, there appears to be some changes in language from the draft guidelines reported by the associated press. here's a side-by-side specifically for guidance on restaurants and bars.

the old guidance includes language asking if the restaurant or bar is in a community that no longer requires significant mitigation. it includes an asterisk about limiting service. in the new version of that guidance, those notes are gone. joining me now is someone who knows a thing or two about public health guidance, dr. vivek murthy. dr. murthy, i want to put up a couple more kircdifferences in too we have on the workplace and restaurant guidelines, is the workplace no longer in a community -- it was in the a.p. draft, not in the final. you're seeing these things in here. you'd see if feasible added in some places where it wasn't there before. they're not large changes, one by one, but the totality seems to make it more ambiguous. >> yes, well, i want to say, first of all, that i'm glad that something has been issued here by the cdc, but i think what we need is more specificity.

i will tell you, chuck, that in just the last few days alone, that i have been speaking to employers, to deans of universities, to people who run secondary schools, and they're all asking the same questions. do i need to test? how often do i need to test people? do i need to go and procure the equipment myself or can i rely on local labs? what do i do if somebody tests positive? do i have to shut everything down? how do i actually trace and quarantine within our campus or workplace? there's a great deal of chaos and confusion out there, and this is a time where we actually need more specificity. we can't just say, consult with local authorities or do your best to figure this out or do what's feasible. people need more direction and specificity when there's uncertainty and great fear out there and if we don't have that, what you're going to see is people taking many different pathways to implementing these guidelines and incurring risk despite the best of intentions and that will just mean we're in

a place where we may see an everyone higher second surge than we need to. >> well, let's talk about a specific guidance that is actually not clear, and it's the issue of masks. it has been this -- and it does -- it isn't clear how often should we wear masks, when should we wear masks, and oh, by the way, how should we wear masks? >> well, that's right. look, early on, the cdc did put out guidance, saying that if you are going in public, out in public, that you should wear a mask. and that is largely to protect others in case you happen to be infected, even if you don't have symptoms. but we also know that when you wear a mask, there's a chance it can help you as well. there's a small degree of filtering that happens in terms of the air around you, but it also seems to be that masks can prevent us from touching our face if used properly. but what's really important with masks is that we've got to be consistent in our guidance around them and we have to be

detailed. for example, i, right now, see many people in the community who are wearing masks that don't cover their nose or i see them constantly readjusting their mask by touching the front of it, thereby contaminating their hands. you know, people need more guidance on how to use these masks, but we also need to lead by example and that's why public officials should be wearing masks when they are out in public, and they should be demonstrating what it is that we need to do. what we saw during sars in hong kong, the people who wore masks were much less likely to acquire sars than people who didn't. there are good reasons to wear masks. we've got to do it. we've got to be safe. >> your successor right now, the surgeon general here, we have not seen him in about a month and he was very much very out front at first about the mask issue, even showing people how to make one, doing all this video, and then all of a sudden, we haven't seen the surgeon general be put in this public

role, which i -- i feel like that's one of the main parts of the job. is that your understanding of, in some ways, you're a public spokesperson for public health, dr. murthy? is that how you viewed it? >> yes. no, that is how all of us who have served in the role of surgeon general have understood our jobs is that we are supposed to be there as a resource to the public, especially during crisis moments like this. we have a responsibility to bring scientific evidence based information to people and their families so they can protect themselves, and i was certainly happy to see dr. adams out there early on. i would love to see not only him but also dr. fauci and dr. birx much more at the center of the public education efforts than they have been recently. i don't think it's their fault, necessarily. we know that who gets put out there, you know, is a complicated calculation done by administrations, but one of the key things you learn in pandemic responses is that you have to lead with science and

scientists. you've got to put them in front of the camera. you've got to make sure that science is what's guiding your decision making. it's when you let politics start pushing you one way or another that you run into problems and we're seeing that with masks. we're seeing use of masks has become politicized and has become a political statement and it should not be that way. it should be a public health decision about safety, and that's where we need the administration to really pull us back is to the track of science and away from politics. otherwise we're going to suffer. >> i read recently, you've been informally advising the nba. there's a lot of sports fans watching, including myself right now. so i'm curious, what is realistic? and you know, is it different for baseball versus football and basketball where there's more physical contact? >> well, there certainly is more contact in football and basketball, but that doesn't mean that baseball is somehow

sort of separate entirely. there is contact that happens between baseball players when you're getting close to the plate, you know, you're close to another person. when you're in the dugout, you could be close to others. so i think with sports in general, like we've got to approach this with real caution. look, i'm an avid sports fan. i have been for a long time. i desperately would love to see sports back up and running. but the truth is, we've got to do it safely, and one of the challenges that sports teams are facing is around testing. many of them are struggling to figure out how they should be testing people, with what frequency. they're also trying to figure out, is it right to be testing with a great frequency when people in the general population can't even get the tests that they need? and so there's a moral dilemma that many of them are facing. and finally, with positive tests, this is a big, big problem. teams are wondering, what do we do if there's a positive result? do we have to shut down everything all over again? nobody wants to go through all of the trouble of resurrecting a season or starting a new season with lots of new precautions

only to have to shut it down when you have a positive case. so, this is a complicated situation for sports teams. i'm gratified to see with the nba in particular that they are being really methodical and responsible and thoughtful about how they're making decisions, but really, the virus is dictating part of this, and that's why, in part, we've got to be really careful about what we do. we've got to get testing up and running. we've got to provide clear guidelines. >> yep. testing, clear guidelines, contact tracing. dr. vivek murthy, former surgeon general, thanks for coming on and sharing your perspective and your expertise. much appreciate it. up ahead, the whistle-blower's warning. what, if anything, will change after dr. rick bright's warning to congress about the outbreak getting worse? we'll talk with one of the lawmakers who questioned him next. e of the lawmakers who questioned him next

we need a national testing strategy. the virus is here. it's everywhere. we need to be able to find it, isolate it, and stop it. we need to have the right testing for everyone who needs it. we need to be able to trace contacts, isolate, quarantine and appropriately while striving to develop a cure. >> welcome back. with me now is massachusetts congressman joe kennedy iii. he was among those questioning dr. bright today in that hearing. congressman kennedy, good to see you. let me start by playing for you

what the secretary azar had to say about dr. bright's testimony and i want to get you to respond on the other side. take a listen, sir. >> dr. bright is out there testifying today. everything he's complaining about was achieved. everything he talked about was done. oh, and by the way, whose job was it to actually lead the development of vaccines? dr. bright. so, while we're launching operation warp speed, he's not showing up for work to be part of that. so, is this is like somebody who was in a choir and is now trying to say he was a soloist back then. >> congressman kennedy, i wanted to play that first. you've listened all day to dr. bright. i wanted you to hear that. now that you have heard that, you know, how credible did you

consider dr. bright, and how credible do you consider him after hearing secretary azar's pushback? >> i consider dr. bright credible. i think dr. bright has also acknowledged the fact that he has been in government service for quite some time and said that there were parts there where everybody deserved responsibility and that everybody -- that the system broke down. what he was also very clear about, which secretary azar conveniently decided not to comment on, was the multiple times that senior leadership of this administration was warned, was told or should have been told about the facts that this virus was a clear and present threat, that it was going to come to the united states, and that it was going to be devastating once it got here, and chuck, one of the questions i asked him came up was this report around crimson contagion. if you can believe this, there was a report that hhs ran, a simulation done in january of

2019, begun then, with a large interagency simulation, that examined a flu-like virus that started from china, initiated in china, and spread around the world through global air travel and resulted in 110 million americans getting sick and nearly 600,000 people dying. they had that test. they had that simulation, and they did nothing with it. they were told over and over and over again by senior members of their own administration, and they didn't do enough about it. and they still haven't done enough about it. and i brought that up not because i'm trying to kind of poke a finger in their eye but because we have major challenges we need to confront in order to prepare ourselves for the fall and then for the development and distribution of a vaccine, which they still have yet to answer how we're going to do that. >> do you think that this is a case where we have -- we have the infrastructure in government, we have plenty of people with the knowledge to do this, and we don't have the

leadership that will let them execute, or do you think we actually also have a infrastructure problem too in order -- and we can't execute what we need to do? >> so, both. i think we have a -- our basic -- so, at a very basic level, our healthcare system was based off a doctor-patient relationship. you got sick, you weren't feeling well, you called up the doctor, went in, got examined, maybe got a test, you got some medicine and you went home. you got better. that does not work when you have hundreds of thousands if not millions of people getting sick at the same time. it's not enough doctors to do that. there's not enough tests to do that. and when you have a novel virus, you can't protect against other people getting infected. there's no vaccine. there's no people that have already been exposed and are healthy. so our system was literally not set up for this. but any -- any astute observer of either foreign policy or healthcare system knew that to be the case before this happened, which is why there

were warnings about this and why folks like billgat gates were sounding alarm bells on this for a long time. the obama administration, in january, while they were leaving, ran a simulation with senior officials of the incoming trump white house. and the obama administration officials said they took that very seriously. all of those senior officials that participated in it are gone. they were -- they left. >> they're all gone. >> so i have a hard time understanding where -- there's legitimate issues as president obama has said, this would be a test for any administration. the repeated failures of -- and of doing what is needed to get our industry behind it has made it devastating. >> one final question, and i know you're voting on the house version of the next round of rescue money, however you want to classify this, as rescue or stimulus. i think we're still in ask yres mode. anything in there that you wish were that isn't.

some people say everything's in there. i know some members are not happy that their idea didn't make it. is there anything that you think should be in there that is not? >> there's -- i think there's additional things in there that should be in there, yes. but i think on the whole, i do think we're going to get more, unfortunately, more bites at the apple here because i do think that we are still in rescue mode and we still need to get to recovery mode. and what recovery mode really is about, chuck, and what i'm focused on here is, one, yes, making sure that, you know, we can supply our first responders and we get our healthcare system under control and we provide american families with flexibility they need to get through this. but we cannot go back to where we were. where we were, that old normal, got us to this point. we have to be far more intentional and deliberate about how we're going to make sure that we do not have the exploitation of workers that has led to so many first responders or so many frontline and essential workers getting -- contracting this virus. if you look at the areas in my

own state, communities like chelsea and lawrence and brockton that have been devastated by this, they're lower income communities, immigrant communities, communities that face multiple barriers. we have to put in place these structures to make sure we build on it and don't fall back. >> the pandemic mri. it has really exposed things that we've all known were there and we now see it in a very stark reality. congressman joe kennedy, democrat from massachusetts, thank you for coming on and sharing your views, sir. i appreciate it. up next, senator richard burr steps down as head of the senate intel committee as the fbi investigation into his stock sales moves forward. open road and telling peoplefe that liberty mutual customizes your insurance, so you only pay for what you need! [squawks] only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ and i recently had a heart attack. it changed my life. but i'm a survivor. after my heart attack, my doctor prescribed brilinta.

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this virus is testing all of us. and it's testing the people on the front lines of this fight most of all. so abbott is getting new tests into their hands, delivering the critical results they need. and until this fight is over, we...will...never...quit. because they never quit. welcome back. senator richard burr stepped aside from his post as chair of the senate intel committee after his cell phone was seized as part of a federal investigation into the large amount of stock the senator off loaded at the beginning of the coronavirus pandemic. this comes after burr and three

other senators, dianne feinstein, kelly laughler, were accused of using information learned in briefings to make stock market decisions, triggering a federal investigation. senator loeffler's office says no search warrant has been served. >> senator loeffler, were you contacted by the fbi over your stock trades? >> joining me now for the latest on this is nbc news capitol hill correspondent kasie hunt and obviously, that very specific denial from kelly loeffler does leave an opening there, and i guess there's been a question here. is richard burr under a criminal investigation? >> reporter: chuck, you know, honestly, i defer to pete williams and our legal team on exactly how this would be

characterized, but probable cause to get a search warrant seems to suggest that that's the track they're on. now, it would be really tricky to prove something like this in burr's case. the insider trading laws are written in such a way that they apply pretty much only to specific stock trades, so if you know something about a particular company's future and you make a decision based on information not available to the public, you can get yourself in trouble. now, senator burr asserts through his lawyer that he made these decisions based on public information, watching cnbc, reading the news about what was unfolding in china, and that's how he made these decisions, and presumably, the fbi is looking for information on his phone that could either confirm or contradict those claims that burr is making, because of course, you can get ensnared in other problems when you find yourself in the midst of a federal investigation. we know, of course, from our experience covering mueller that people got tripped up because

they made misstatements to the fbi or there was some other problem along the way. so, you know, i think we're still learning more about where this investigation stands. i find senator loeffler's nondenial denial to be a bit confusing, and i feel like there's another story to be written there, potentially. she, of course, is facing a competitive primary coming up really soon. >> right. >> unlike some of the other folks who are involved here. burr, of course, has said he's not running for re-election. but you know, the question, chuck, that my sources are raising with me is what does politics have to do with this? how is this going to impact the senate intelligence committee's investigation into russia, which is still not wrapped up. >> and of course, who could become intel chair and there's obviously a couple things that could happen there? probably a lot of maneuvering on that and for that, that will give us something more to talk about tomorrow and in the week ahead. kasie hunt, our capitol hill correspondent, thank you. up next, as some states open back up, we're going to look at where we are and where we should

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discover all the ways we're helping members today. welcome back. testing and tracing, tracing and testing, the two t's. you're going to hear them a lot. it's what we keep saying needs to be happening for confident reopenings across the country whether you walk into a store or a school campus. and experts agree the communities need to ramp up both. joining me is the chief medical officer for partners in health,

which has launched a new initiative to support state and local governments as they implement their own contact tracing program. and we also have nassau county executive lauren curran. nassau county is looking to hire hundreds of contact tracers. working with new york state partnering with johns hop inside the bloomberg school of health. to give a national and sort of on the ground perspective here, doctor, let me start with you on sort of explain what you're trying to do, and how much of this should you be doing and are you filling a role that the federal government ought to be filling? >> yes, we are filling a role that the federal government ought to be doing. partners in health is a medical charity that works mostly in countries in africa, latin america and the caribbean, and adds such, we have often done contact tracing for diseases from ebola to cholera to hiv, and we often were working side

by side with the centers for disease control on these efforts in other countries. but unfortunately, for 40 years, the public health infrastructure in the u.s. has been progressively weakened. and so we found ourselves with excellent hospitals and nurses, medical staff, but kind of passively waiting for sick people to roll in and then to take care of them. and there are public health measures that need to simultaneously be taking place to stop the community spread of the virus. it's only about 20% of all people with coronavirus who will need to be hospitalized, and the other 80% are just going about their daily business, mildly or even presettlementatically. so unless you figure out who those people are and help them quarantine safely before they spread the disease, there is no way to control the epidemic. . >> laura curran, you're trying

to obviously figure out if you've met the guidelines to reopen in your county or close. what's missing? >> well, we have seven metrics that we have to meet. we had five. today unfortunately we're down to four. nassau county and suffolk county together is one region on long island. so we have to meet those together. and one of those that we're expected to meet is contact tracing. so our health department, we're a suburban county population of about 1.4 million. we have an excellent award winning health department that already has a solid team of contact tracers. so when we got our first case of covid-19 on march 5th, they jumped into action and they traced the person's contact, reached out to everyone who may have been exposed, and that is a way i think we really contained it as much as we possibly could. we're really right in the epicenter here. we're just east of new york city. >> laura curran, do you -- so what would be your quarantine plan going forward after you

reopened? do you have hotels set aside or are you working with a university? where would you quarantine people that you find in the contact tracing process? >> people are generally isolating at home. that's how it's been. we were using hotels at the very beginning when travelers were coming from overseas. but right now it's working at home. we have an excellent health care system here, and we will find, of course, as society does begin to open up, the whole point of flattening the curve was slow the spread. so when we begin to open up again, we expect to see perhaps a little bit more infection happening. we want to control that, slow it down so that we can open in a safe way. >> dr. mukherjee, some of us envisioned that the federal government would come out and say we need 300 of an army health corps, basically, 300,000 contact tracer, that's the number we've seen, 100,000 to

300,000. but tell us, what are you looking for in a contact tracer? and how much of a jobs program could this be? >> yeah, well, first of all, i want to commend what ms. curran is saying and what nassau county is doing, because the real lift is local, and in my experience for 25 years as an infectious disease doctor and a public health specialist, all epidemics are very local. so yes, we need federal money and federal support, but departments of public health all over the country do know how to do this. they're experienced professionals. this is their job. but the size and scale and speed of this epidemic has made them need a lot of help and additional hands to control this thing. so i think you can still have a localized response and have federal support for that. and we've seen that in epidemics around the world. and that's a very important

thing to have local control. in massachusetts, where we are supporting the public sector, there are 351 local boards of health, and they're excellent. and we work to support their work because at the end of the day, this is something that should be done by departments of public health, and they want to do it, by and large. >> laura curran, how many -- the contact tracers does your plan to hire these folks locally? >> yes. working with the state, working with the bloomberg foundation, we are -- they're doing the hiring. there is a curriculum, an online curriculum they can follow and then a test that they take. so we're going make sure even though we have a team of very experienced contact tracer, that they do the curriculum as well so everyone is playing by the same set of rules, everyone is speaking the same language. >> yeah, no, dr. mukherjee, what you just said about having it to be almost hired locally, that

makes a lot of sense. people respond to members of their own community if members of their own community are the contact trars that makes a lot of sense to me. dr. mukherjee, laura curran, unfortunately i am out of time, but thank you very much for sharing your experience and expertise with us. that's all we have tonight. we'll be back tomorrow with more "meet the press daily." thanks for tuning in and being with us. "the beat with ari melber" starts right after this short break. ari melber" starts right after this short break. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ theand we want to thank times, the extraordinary people in the healthcare community, working to care for all of us. at novartis, we promise to do our part. as always, we're doing everything we can to help keep cosentyx accessible and affordable. if you have any questions at all, call us, email us, visit us online. we're here to help support you when you need us. take care, and be well.

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♪ welcome to "the beat." i am ari melber, and we have a big show right now tonight. an exclusive with a key player emerging from a major political scandal with a huge ruling from the supreme court is breaking his silence for the first time on this show, on this live hour, later tonight. also, new twists in the flynn case. a new focus on potential perjury, and a big reason why there has already bee