saturday night, i'm ali velshi. coronavirus cases are continuing to spike, especially in the south and southwest after yesterday saw the single biggest day increase of the pandemic thus far, with the 45,000 new cases reported nationwide. over 2.5 million americans have now been infected. more than 125,000 people have died in america. florida was one of at least four states to post a record increase in cases today, along with south carolina, nevada and georgia. beaches around miami dade county will now be closed ahead of the july 4th holiday, but florida isn't the only state shutting things down. texas governor greg abbott, who back in april moved to reopen the state at the height of pandemic says he'd go back and fix just one thing. >> if i could go back and redo anything, it probably would have been to low down the opening of bars. >> and amid this jump in cases,

texas, florida and other southern states have come to embrace the idea that masks are actually necessary and not a political statement, putting governors of those states at odds with the president, who seems to think the exact opposite. but some members of the administration are taking precautions. the vice president is cancelling planned campaign events in arizona and florida amid the rise in cases there. he'll still travel to those states to check up on the coronavirus response, though one wonders why he needs to do that either. it all comes as trump as focused on taking away health care from more than 20 million americans right in the middle of a pandemic. after his administration asked the supreme court to strike down the affordable care act, the president says it can be replaced with something better and less expensive and promised people with preexisting conditions would be protected. his administration has produced no plan for an alternative to obamacare. joining me is dr. irwin

redletter, an msnbc political analyst. this president and a number of republicans campaigned on the idea that they would repeal and replace obamacare. there was never any replace. there still isn't. the federal government is now party to a lawsuit against obamacare, which is very, very unusual for the government to join a lawsuit against its own policy. so the idea that the president's got something better up his sleeve than obamacare a little hard to swallow. >> yeah. not only, ali, have we not seen a plan, there's been no evidence of even discussion of an alternate plan. he's not going to be able to pull this out of his hat a week before the election. this requires a tremendous number of work, number one, and, number two, we have a very, very good plan in place that could be expanded, could, improved and

that's what biden's been proposes. but the idea of dismantling our one existing safety net for americans at this moment of crisis with the pandemic is beyonds not going to happen. we're hoping this is just another blustering comment by president trump. ali. >> let me ask you about this business of wearing a mask. i mean, it kind of -- y's kind e to troll around the internet to find it. there are people going to public hearings in various cities and discussing that it's somehow politicized. for a guy like you who has worked in public health, how did that happen? >> who knows. it's hard to explain this. we're in the run up to a very serious presidential election in november, and i think the trump administration's trying to get their act together and how this

is coming together is a mystery but it seems to be falling apart. if you think about that rally in tulsa last week where it was less than half full and nobody wearing masks and the president supporting people not wearing masks. people who are wearing masks in places in texas and florida and arizona are being ridiculed by the non-mask wearers. it's almost as if they're showing their support for the president by not wears a mask we've mentioned this before, it's like remaplacing a maga hat. the defiance in wearing a mask is one of the things increasing the cases and hospitalizations across the south, ali. >> it speaks to a bigger issue

to prevent the spread of coronavirus is an entirely different thing as prevents the coronavirus. there are some viruses that never see vaccines. we're certainly not going to see one by november, as the president suggests or by the end of the year because of testing required, but you're warning this new normal may be new normal maybe not for a year, it may be longer than that. >> we don't know what it's going to be. some time before the week or two before the election, we're going to get a covid october surprise where the president is going to announce they're about to turn final key and we'll have a vaccine by the end of the year. it's preposterous. people should not fall for it. pence was talking about all kinds of sunny, cheery things about controlling this covid pandemic yesterday at the

briefing but almost every statement he made was shown to be follows, including his cheery attitude about conquering this disease. we're not conquering all we have, ali, are these public health interventions like wearing a mask, keeping socially distant and we certainly opened far too early many of our businesses and that's part of what's generating this new surge in cases, ali. >> and the important reason to talk about this, irwin, is because i know you've got some involvement with the task force that joe biden will have and even if joe biden is president, if he somehow came into office and said we'll have a vaccine in two months without evidence that that should be the case, i'll be right here holding him to account. this isn't partisan. it has nothing to do with who's in office. it's about the idea that there is zero benefit of giving people

a false sense of security around this. >> except if you're looking a it the entirely from a presidential campaign or reelection campaign in trump's case. because if that's the case, if that's what's driving all this b.s. basically about a vaccine coming right around the corner here, then it's really -- it's a deception i think for the american people that's so unacceptable, ali. i'm just very concerned that people won't accept it as truth anymore than they should have accepted using hydroxychloroquine a aor any ofe other preposterous statements that have come out of the president's mouth. i don't care who is making a story about how quickly we'll get a vaccine. there are built-in limitations. you have to test it for a long

time and then wait for a long time to make sure it's safe. we are far from reaching that conclusion. >> other than the things we can do, which are social distancing, it's not pleasant. i'm the first to agree it's not pleasant but it can be done and it does work and wearing a mask and personal hygiene. these things can be done. what's the closest thing to a holy grail prior to medication or a vaccine? is it better contact tracing? what's the thing that is going to make us feel most secure and allow us to get back to something that feels like normalcy? >> so one of the things i've been saying since late april and we issued a report on this from my center at columbia is that we have to be able to do point of care testing. i actually went to my barber yesterday. but after he got confirmed that he was negative for covid and he also had antibodies to it so he had it in the past and he was

fine. we need to be able to do that virtually everywhere where we reopen, especially personal services and close contact with somebody providing a service. we have capacity to do the testing and the contact tracing is critical to control the spread of the disease. people have said this over and over again that we just don't have the ability to do that yet. why we don't? that's going to be written and rewritten in the history books about the incompetency of this president, of this administration, in handling this major threat. donald trump didn't cause the coronavirus to appear, but he did cause so much incompetence, misinformation that it's put america at greater risk, by the way, than any other country let's say in europe. our curves are out of control. they have gained control. it's just simply an international embarrassment and

a real danger to our fellow citizens. >> irwin, good to see you as always. by the way, compliments to your barber. he did a fine job. thank you, sir. i was pushing for a compliment. coming up, as president trump continues to boast about the new ball bei-- wall being built at southern border, a court rules he does not have the permission to use multifunds ilitary funds construct the wall. ilitary fundso construct the wall it's going to help you, with all of... this! yeah, here you go. thank you! oh, i like that one! [ laugh ] that's a lot of storage! perfect. you're welcome!

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we won. we're building it. fully funded. i could build numerous walls with all the money i have. fully funded. >> fully funded. that was president trump on tuesday bragging about the border wall and the money he's got to way for it while

addressing a conservative student group in phoenix. he also visited part of the wall earlier that day along the u.s./mexico line in uma, arizona, something his administration perceives as a remarkable accomplishment leading up to the november election little did he know that three days later the ninth u.s. circuit court of appeals panel would rule his administration does not have the authority to divert $2.5 billion in military funding to pay for the wall. the ruling called transfer of those funds unlawful. joining me now, retired four-start army general and military analyst barry mccaffrey and jill winebanks, an msnbc contributor. jill, just the controversy around this, anyone who remembers the election remembers

donald trump saying the mexicans are pay for the wall. there was some kind of renegotiation in trade negotiations with nafta that was going to cause mexico to pay for the wall. then he did something conservatives wouldn't like and went digging into other piles of money, including military money, to get the money to build this wall and now the court has said that's not kosher. >> that is illegal is what they said, not just not kosher. the power of the purse belongs to congress. it's very clear article i of the constitution says that all appropriations must go through congress. the president cannot in any way change what they say the money should be used for and use it for whatever he feels like. what's the point of congress doing it? that's how the constitutional framers set it up. i said this when he first announced he was going to be using the military budget that, number one, the military budget is very carefully crafted to

take care of our military needs and shouldn't be messed with but, secondly, that the power of the purse belonged to congress. i'm getting to wear jill's pin twice now because the courts ruled that the power of the purse is indeed congress's. >> and the pin today is in fact the purse. jill, i think people know that you were the former general counsel for the u.s. army. barry mccalf rccaffrey, retired four-star general. for a president who talked so much about the fact that he is so pro military, there are people think that if you're that pro military, then don't take the military's money to build a wall that has a dubious purpose. he said the wall was paid for and we took billions of dollars out of military budgets that actually will have a detrimental effect to do this. >> well, it's astonishing. and i totally agree with jill. the real question at stake here

isn't the wall, it's the ability of the president to disregard the power of the purse. this was $2.5 billion. it's a $10 billion overall piece of change we're talking about. to take it out of a military budget that both houses of congress negotiated, argued over and then passed, how can he do that? i've been in the pentagon, the joint staff and the army staff. if you even move minor amounts of money, you go back to the congressional committee and request their permission to do it. that's only with certain types of funds. so, again, it looks lawless to me and it's politically ill advised because all those construction projects, that are now going to the wall were in places like fort stewart, fort campbell, fort carson, colorado. he just unilaterally disregard, the congress on this matter. >> jill, the president -- we're

going to talk about it later in the show, the president has not had the remarkable luck he thought he would have in a supreme court that is now stacked with conservatives. whenever it's a ninth circuit court of appeal, the president invariably will have some comment about how it's a bunch of liberals. but the fact is their decision, their ruling is actually well grounded in, as you said, law and the way we understand budgets and government spending to have to take place. >> exactly. and general mccaffrey is completely correct. this is just one more episode of lawlessness by this administration. we've had a whole series of things from the department of justice, we've had some -- some courts have gone along with the president, but most of them have not. the daca ruling this week, i lost track, it could have been last week, is another example of them saying the president cannot

do just whatever he wants to do, he has to follow the rules. and this is a time when we really all need to be paying attention to the rule of law and how important it is to our country and to our government forum and to having oversight that we need. and there's no point in having the congress pass a budget if the president can just say i don't like that budget, i'm going to use it differently. that's not how it's intended to be and it's not how it should be. >> of course you remember from watergate it's something nixon tried to do at one point and congress was very, very clear about the fact that you can't do that. general mccaffrey, the president tried to make the case, in fact if you recall, he declared a state of emergency over the immigration situation on the southern border, which most people didn't believe rises to a state of emergency but it does give him some, in his mind, some justification for this being something that is militaristic or that he can use national

defense money for. how does that play in the military? >> well, it's playing very badly. again, these military budgets are programmed out over five years to come. the congress debates them. they finally allocate the money to the department of defense and then they track it to make sure it goes for the purpose for which it was intended. what surprises me most, ali, is the reaction of congress. you would think they would be outraged at taking away their most important constitutional responsibility. i might add also the other constitutional responsibility of congress, of the senate, is to approve senior officers of government. mr. trump appears to be running the country in many cases unilaterally with acting officials. so congress has really given up many of their powers to constrain this president.

>> barry mccaffrey, retired four star u.s. army general, thank you for joining us. and jill wine-banks, author of "the watergate girl, my fight for truth and justice against a criminal president." coming up, a police reform bill doomed in the senate. e refm bill doomed in the senate. long-lasting protection. because your strength is supported by ours. depend. the only thing stronger than us, is you. did you know liberty mutual customizes your car insurance ta-da! because your strength is supported by ours. so you only pay for what you need? given my unique lifestyle, that'd be perfect! let me grab a pen and some paper. know what? i'm gonna switch now. just need my desk... my chair... and my phone.

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. when it comes to the debate over police reform on capitol hill, maya wiley summed it up best. she writes, quote, democrats and republicans agree that police misconduct should be better tracked, but the agreement appears to end there. on thursday house democrats approved a sweeping police reform package that would ban choke holds and no-knock warrants but republicans say that bill has no chance of

passing the senate and the white house has threatened a veto. that legislation was approved one day after senate democrats blocked a gop-sponsored reform bill that would, quote, encourage police departments to revise their practice, not mandate any changes. they blocked a bill to encourage police to do a better job. joining me now, joyce vance, professor at alabama school of law and msnbc contributor. jill, thank you for being with us. i'm always fascinated by the low hanging fruit we can't get down, right? with daca, with basic gun laws, the stuff that an overwhelming number of americans support, but we can't get past even the basics on this one. i want to put up for our viewers the difference between the gop suggestions and the democratic suggestions. the democratic side would ban choke holds. the gop would incentivize dopts

do -- departments to do so. the dems would amend the federal civil rights law, the gop wouldn't. the dems would change qualified immunity that prevents police from being sued, the gop wouldn't. and the same thing with no-knock warrants. it would be banned in drug cases and the gop would collect state data. it's not even terrible the gop suggestions, but the fact somebody we can't find common ground on this. why? >> well, it's a difficult question to move forward on, but the republican bill in this case was such weak sauce that the democrats feared that if they agreed to let it move forward, the republicans would pass it, claim victory, move on and be done without solving any of the underlying problems. the interesting thing here, ali, is that criminal justice reform has been one of the few issues where there's been broad-based

bipartisan collaboration for close to a decade now, right? >> yes. >> where else do you see the aclu and the koch foundation folks in the same room? so we know what needs to be done. the question is one of political will. >> but criminal justice reform and correct me if i'm wrong, you've been working on this a long time, part of what got bipartisan support is there's a return on investment things. for republicans, we just spend too much money on incarceration and they come out ill prepared with no training so there was some basis for fixing this. we should have some basis for fixing policing right now because the whole country is seeing the same stuff. >> and policing is very much part and parcel of the larger criminal justice reform landscape. if you think violence against

black men is limited to policing, i'd like to introduce you to d.o.j.'s report on alabama's prisons, which calls them cruel and unusual punishment and there's an enormously high rate of cases where inmates there are killed by people who are supposed to be protecting them. so we need to look at all of these issues together. there is appetite to reform policing. and, look, i don't really care how or why people approach this, whether it's from a cost effectiveness standpoint because you're absolutely right, that's often what brings republicans to the table, or if it's a make your community safer, do the right thing sort of view, which has often been the democrats' approach to criminal justice reform. that's what makes this country great is compromising, finding common goals and moving forward. here we simply have to at this poi point. >> i'm not in the habit of playing donald trump ads but there's one i think democrats,

particularly those like who p y -- you who are involved in criminal justice and alysisanal. let's listen to it. >> mass incarceration has put hundreds of thousands behind bars for minor offenses. joe biden wrote those laws. >> every major crime bill that's come out of this congress has had the name joe biden on that bill. we do everything but hang people for jay walking in this bill. >> joe biden's policies destroyed millions of black lives. joe biden may not remember but we do. >> so, joyce, this is interesting. it's not attacking dukakis on willie horton. it holding joe biden responsible for the hand that he had in crime bills, which were part of

the zeit geist back then. joe biden's got some agesinswer to do and so does society, because we were all in on the ideas that police needed bigger guns to be tougher. how does joe biden actually respond and address that sort of accusation? >> you know, this whole mentality of tough on crime emanates from something in the 1960s, the crime report the last time before president obama's 21st century policing report there was really that sort of national convening. the zeit geist was fear of crime and that us in the predicament with some of the highest rates of incarceration in the world. here's what democrats and republicans alike have to do.

they need to acknowledge that we were wrong in the past. that's not one party, that's the national mood got this wrong. we've got to look at the data which tells us that, which shows us what the path forward is and we need to correct those mistakes. nobody likes to say that they were wrong. sometimes you just have to have that moment of honesty, that recalibration if you're really committed to moving forward. if all you care about it saying that everything that you've ever done was dead on target and that you got it right, you're not going to make much progress. >> in the streets when i was covering the protests in the last several weeks, there were a number of people while they may have had signs about the police and about george floyd and about ahmaud arbery, a lot of people came up to me because they could see we were journalists and said it's not just policing, it's the whole justice system we have to look at. you're absolutely right when you say that, joyce. always a pleasure to talk to you. joyce vance is a former united

states attorney and an msnbc contributor. >> coming up, president trump wants the republicans who control the senate judiciary committee to call president obama to testify, but republicans won't hold the senate forever and one senator has a warning for president trump, be careful what you wish for. that's next. at you wish for. that's next. ♪ copd tries to say, "go this way." i say, "i'll go my own way, with anoro." ♪ once-daily anoro contains two medicines called bronchodilators that work together to significantly improve lung function all day and all night. do not use anoro if you have asthma. anoro won't replace rescue inhalers for sudden symptoms and should not be used more than once a day. tell your doctor if you have a heart condition, high blood pressure, glaucoma... prostate, bladder or urinary problems. these may worsen with anoro. call your doctor if you have worsened breathing, chest pain... mouth or tongue swelling, problems urinating, vision changes or eye pain,

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no uh uh, no way come on, no no n-n-n-no-no only discover has no annual fee on any card. this week while discussing the michael flynn case, president trump repeated baseless accusations about

president obama. >> i'm very happy about general flynn. he was treated horribly. he was treated very, very horribly by a group of very bad people, and i think you'll see things are going to start to come out. but what happened to general flynn should never happen again in our country. he was persecuted and many other people were persecuted. they spied on a campaign and they should never spy on a campaign to put it mildly. it never happened before in the history of our country. the obama administration spied on a campaign. >> now, obviously this is well worn territory for trump. in may he sent out this tweet directed at south carolina senator lindsey graham. "if i were a senator or congressman, the first person i would call to testify about the biggest political crime and scandal in the history of the united states by far is president obama. now, lindsey graham is chairman

of the judiciary committee. he later told politico, quote, i don't think now is the time for me to do that. i don't even know if that's possible. i have grave concerns about the role of executive privilege and all kinds of issues. i understand president trump's frustration, but be careful what you wish for. just be careful what you wish for. that warning indicating that while republicans can investigate what they perceive to be skeletons in the obama administration's closet, while they hold on to the senate majority, that could change in november or some time and democrats could begin doing the same thing to trump. in other words, that effort could seriously back fire under a judiciary committee chairman named amy klobuchar or cory booker or kamala harris. and as we've already seen, the president's overconfidence in his current grip on power back fire when it comes to the supreme court after it dealt a number of blows to conservative efforts in recent weeks. joining me now is nyu law

professor melissa murray. good to talk to you about this. i want to put some context around this because what has happened here is that republicans, the republican senate, has nominated and approved more judges than at any point in recent years and there are now no federal judge vacancies. they've set some kind of record, and donald trump brags about that at every opportunity, i've stacked the court. his answer to everywhere is the economy or the courts. well, the economy is not working for him as an answer right now. in the last couple weeks the courts haven't worked for him as an answer either. >> well, i don't know it's entirely true that the courts haven't worked for him. it is true in a couple decisions the supreme court has gone against the administration, but president trump has been enormously successful in packing the lower federal courts, which is where most of our federal cases go to. they rarely get to the supreme court, which has a discretionary

docket. most of the action is in the lower federal courts and president trump has been enormous li enormously successful with packing the lower courts, many of whom who are not women and not people are color but are white men. >> so he can continue to claim that as victory, they happen to be mostly male, mostly white and happen to be mostly young, too. does that mean a democratic administration or a democratically controlled congress and senate, will they have similar opportunities in years to come or has this tilted the balance? >> this has definitely tilted the balance. president trump at this point in his career as president as the most successful president since jimmy carter in actually putting people on the court. president obama only appointed

55 appellate court judges in his two terms as president. president trump has far exceeded that and he's not even done with his first term. in order to make that up, you'll need vacancies on the courts of appeal and lower district courts and that's not likely to happen in the same numbers. one of the reasons why president trump has been so successful is because the senate republicans were so successful in stymieing president obama from appointing his judges when he was president. so there are a lot of vacancies left over when president trump came in that he has happily filled with his own nominees. >> so in the vein of lindsey graham warning the president watch out what you do because when the other guys are in charge, they might do the same thing, dos that apply to what the republicans did to obama to only allow him 55 appointees

whereas a republican senate has allowed donald trump 200? >> it all depend on the democrats taking back control of the senate. it's almost as important as the democrats taking control of the white house itself. one of the things the president has been able to do because he has control of the senate is that all they need to get their judges through is to have a simple majority. in years past the rules of senate have changed to do away with a super majority. that means when you no longer have to go to the other side to peel off votes, you are don't actually have to put up more moderate nominees. you can be as extreme as you like. that's been exactly what president trump has wanted. but if he loses the senate, if the republicans lose the senate and there's a democratic president going forward, that means the democrats are playing with those same rules and they, too, can put up younger judges more ideologically to the left and that's if they're able to gain back the chamber and to do

so with a comfortable enough majority. >> is it your opinion that doing so has not historically or at least in recent history been as important to democrats in general or democratic lawmakers as it was to doctrineare or ideological conservatives or as it has been to mitch mcconnell. it's been his stock in trade, stopping the process. >> the republicans have always put the court on the ballot. the democrats have been much more laissez faire about the courts. even democratic presidents haven't been that great about it. president trump came in with a list of federalist society approved judges he was determined to have nominated and appointed. it took the clinton administration a lot of time to get going on their nominees. it took the obama administration a lot of time to get going. they said it was because they

were working on the affordable care act but you can do two things at once and the democrats have just not been as attentive to the court and they really need to be. >> do you see that changing? do you see efforts afoot to say napdi notwithstanding all the other things that need to change including the climate and health care and all these things, is there a list? donald trump waved paper around, talked about a list, he held a prime time tv event to unveil a supreme court judge nominee. is there something happening in democratic circles that feels that coordinated and organized an effort when it comes to judges and nominations? >> i don't know if we're going to be able to see the bachelor supreme court edition like we saw with president trump but the democrats seem to be taking the court more seriously. there has been a group talking about advancing a group of

judges that have included those who typically aren't considered like public defenders or those who have worked with social justice organizations there's some appetite there. there's also been an interesting debate on the left about reforming the court, whether that means imposing term limits. these federal judges are appointed for life, which makes president trump's young nominees even more impactful going forward and they've also been talking about not just these term limits but also packing the supreme court itself to rebalance and recalibrate the court, which has really shifted to the right with president trump's appointees. >> melissa, always a pleasure to talk to you. melissa murray is a professor of law at new york university. still to come, what role can media and entertainment play for nonblack americans looking to educate themselves about a community they want to learn about and an experience they want to learn more about? want to learn more about

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helpful to bank from almost anywhere. deposit a check with your phone or tablet. check balances, pay bills, and more. send money to people you know and trust with zelle. explore all you can do with our digital tools from almost anywhere. pnc bank. as protesters gather to demand sweeping police reforms, many nonblack people are looking for ways to support and educate themselves about the experiences of black americans. streaming services like netflix and prime have developed specific play lists that nonblack people can use. they are all full of painful

truths and sobering realities. also including are shows starring and created by black show runners such as "the shy" and "black af." joining me author of "race-baiter" how media uses dangerous words to define a nation. and author of the upcoming book coming out in just a week from now "say it louder," out on july 6, you two are my great friends in this one. the reason i wanted to have this conversation is because there are lots and lots of well meaning allies out there who want to learn, and there are lots and lots of african-americans say it's not my job to teach you. there's books, tvs, movies, all sorts of stuff. but there are people saying there are places we can point you if you want to learn the

history of black slavery, current black literature, plays written by black people or if you're just me and you're low brow and you want basic tv shows, there's that, too. >> well, i mean, frankly i think this is a great opportunity to reacquaint or acquaint yourself with a lot of amazing work out espn's amazing documentary about o.j. is a ton of great books

out there. how to be an antiracist. you mentioned one of them. my own book. there's a great book that talks about the history of african-americans on television. there is a lot of great stuff out there. rather than see it as some sort of term paper or you got to study or i got to know this stuff or, you know, i'll embarrass myself, enjoy it. >> right. >> think of it as a way, expose yourself. >> that's right. >> expose yourself. these books are so wonderful. you'll really enjoy them if you are interested in this stuff. >> and that is really the point, right? this could be as heavy as you want it to be. there are some people who will read the hardest, toughest, most important, biggest, thickest books out there. it doesn't have to be for everybody. if you are a simpleton like me who watches "chicago p.d." on nbc, right? i love the show but it is really about police and many of their interactions with black people.

or you watch the chi which is about black people and many reactions with police from a different perspective. you can find your level anywhere if you can -- where you can get a bit of the black experience if you don't live it. >> i never use the term fake news but ali velshi. >> a simpleton, is fake news. [ laughter ] there is a lot of content out there that informs and educates and i would just say, you know, for nonblack people who have an intellectual curiosity about the black experience, it is not that black people don't want to engage in the conversation, but i think many people want to make sure it is a good faith effort. when you have this content at your finger tips if you don't want to read something, there is video content people can consume. i would recommend, "i am not your negroo the documentary on james baldwin. sometimes if someone is holding the question to you, and, you know, is it like are you really

curious or do you want to feel better about yourself that you had this exchange and then you feel like okay my work is done. it is not black history. this is our shared history. this is american history. we have a unique patriotism in this country. it would behoove everybody to understand it. we talk about diversity. when i say black people i mean black people but i also say there is a shared history in learning and responsibility in learning about all communities of color because this country hasn't been -- i think what a great time in this moment to understand because we have to figure out how to live together. there are things that are not so high brow. you look at hbo's "insecure," this beautiful body of work, and this is something that talks about being a young woman in your late 20s and early 30s and dating and what life is like for you, navigating career path when you're the only black person. there is a wide array of things from documentaries to entertainment that people can

consume and feel better informed. >> i just want to talk to you guys for an hour and get smarter about it while understanding that i can enjoy it because i just love to consume media and books and movies and tv. and there is a way to do this without switching off your enjoy button. you can just get smarter and get smarter about different experiences. your book is coming out about this. you're talking about narratives, white narratives. >> right. >> we see a lot of this stuff and that is the narrative. all we're asking people to do is broaden it out. i am out of time. thank you my two great friends. a tv critic for nrp and msnbc contributor and author of a great book "race-baiter how media wield dangerous words to divide a nation." true. read it. and my guest, tiffany cross, author of "say it louder" out july 6th. before that i think you are going to see tiffany cross

hosting a show here next weekend on msnbc. that is definitely not miss tv. thanks to both of you. up next on msnbc, watch global goal. unite for our future. the concert. it supports access to covid testing, treatments, and vaccines. dwayne "the rock" johnson hosts. it is coming up after a quick break here on msnbc. have a great weekend. because our way works great for us! but not for your clients. that's why we're a fiduciary, obligated to put clients first. so, what do you provide? cookie cutter portfolios? nope. we tailor portfolios to our client's needs. but you do sell investments that earn you high commissions, right? we don't have those. so, what's in it for you? our fees are structured so we do better when you do better. at fisher investments we're clearly different.

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