prevent this level of violence and death and attacks and assaults on black bodies in our country, we have to have a deeper conversation that is far more focused on a more substantive type of love that is evident in policy and investments and true caring in children to prevent problems from happening before we read about them in our newspapers and our statistics. >> senator, corey booker of the great city of newark, new jersey, thank you for joining us tonight. >> thank you, my friend. i am grateful for you, more than you know. >> thanks. that is "all in" for this evening, the rachel maddow show starts right now. >> thank you my friend, and happy to have you here at home. i would like you to meet dr. david chancil, he is the medical director of infection prevention, integras health, which is in south oklahoma city.

>> this is what we look like before we go in the room. hair bonnet, respirator, face, shield, gown, gloves and attitude. this is one of our most seriously ill patients. on a bed to help them rotate. move their lungs around so they can try and breathe better. this young man is very ill. this is our covid step down floor. for patients who don't need intensive care unit. the crack squad here today. taking care of what is again, a very full unit. which was empty for a few weeks and now has plenty of patients all over again. so, anything to say to anybody? >> wear your masks! >> wear your masks! there you go. >> watch your hands. >> don't end up on the floor. wear your masks, wash your hands. that's right. this is a covid room with the

negative pressure unit. trying to blow the air outside. >> and this is the super awesome sign that our nurses made so that this patient's family could pray outside of her room. so they have set up a siren on that outward facing window there. says pray here. to let the family of the patient in that room know, okay, this is the place, this is the place for you guys, here, outside, this is where you should pray. due south of oklahoma city, it is starting to feel like the state of texas has a big pray here sign on its windows as well. this footage we just showed again, was from south oklahoma city, and we had a bunch of front line footage from struggling texas hospitals in houston, and in san antonio, this first bit of of footage i

will show you is from cnn, it's from san antonio methodist hospital heading in to the holiday weekend that we had. one thing to note here, medically, when the doctor you hear here refers to an ecmo-machine, it's a machine that, it's basically a super intense element syfy life support machine that takes your blood out of your body in great quantity very fast and it then pumps oxygen in to your blood with a machine and then it pumps the oxygenated blood back in to you. and it happens in really large quantity fast through these huge tubes. an ecmo is an external heart and lung machine. right, it's the most intense, invasive mechanical life support thing you can possibly imagine, particularly if you are not a

doctor. that's what the doctor here is talking to this reporter about, trying to get patients on to ecmo machines. patients that are so sick that are so close to dying, that their best hope is getting on to an ecmo machine, that is what he is talking about here. this is methodist hospital in san antonio, texas. >> yesterday, was probably one of the worst days i have ever had. >> why? >> i gotten calls, all of whom young people who otherwise would be excellent candidates to be able to put on ecmo, they are so sick that if they don't get put on, they don't get that support, they are probably going to die. i had three beds. and just, in making that decision, being able to figure out who really is going to benefit -- it is a level of decision making that i don't think a lot of us are prepared for. >> right now, we are so full up stairs that we are having some delays in getting the patients up stairs because there are just not beds prepared and ready to

go for covid patients. we are holding a lot of them in the emergency department right now. some for hours and some for days. 14 rooms how many are filled? >> 14. >> wow. >> with a waiting list. >> how long is that list? >> it's long. >> the last few weeks has just been overwhelming is how i would describe it. there's more and more patients than we know what to do with. the patients are getting younger, and they are more sick, and -- >> how much younger? >> it's gone from, you know, probably 50s and 60s for the first wave, to, i have lost how many people in their 20s. >> i don't think i have seen anything like this ever. and i would say that if you want to see august 1st, then maybe you should stay in doors and isolate on july 4th. >> if you want to see august 1st, maybe you should stay in doors and isolate on july 4th. that initial claim from the doctor, ten patients who will die without getting on to an

ecmo machine, and three available, how do you make those decisions? again, that is some of miguel martinez's reporting for cnn from san antonio's methodist hospital. things look different now as we see the footage coming in from the earliest days of new york through what we are in now. that same, you know, not just frustration that you saw there from the doctors but even angerer from doctors who are being pushed to the brink like this. you are seeing that frustration and anger when you, when we are getting in footage now from other texas hospitals as well. we are seeing it from the doctors and even from the patients. including and some of this footage from houston, from sky news and the new york times, united memorial hospital and houston methodist hospital in houston, texas. >> tell me about your experience with coronavirus? you look good right now. but you're breathing with some extra help. >> had a little party for my

8-year-old. just a birthday cake. >> reporter: this is rosa hernandez. like many people she had really tried to be careful, but she would let her guard down and she got sick and was very closes to having to have a breathing tube yesterday. >> people are not taking it seriously. they are like, oh, my god, i got to party hardy, and go to the beach and eat out, really? like you never have done it before? please, please, please. take it serious. >> i isolated myself from everybody except one family, the family across the street. when you are staying at home and you are isolated, there's better management. but, our governor went along with the president so, we got

screwed. >> we are fighting two wars, war number one is covid virus. war number two is stupidity. because there's people out there that just really i don't know how they are still alive. >> a lot of people are going to die being ignorant. and ignorance is never a defense. so, they are going to die. and they are going to be made the example for the rest of the country. whenever, if they don't take this serious, they are going to die. point blank. and they are going to get sick and it's going to be bad. >> i don't have enough beds for you. let's just put it that way, okay. i don't have enough beds and you will die. i mean, it's simple as that. there's no more mr. nice guy, no more please, no, no, if you go out had ththis fourth of july t gathering you have the potential of dying yourself or killing somebody else. >> houston hospitals new york

times footage, doctors are allowing cams ra eras in the t full newly created covid floors and wards, we are starting to reelds th realize that they are doing it now, because forgive me, they are pissed, they are angry, they are coping with something inside these hospitals that's getting worse, quickly. and we are getting access to this kind of footage now, we are being allowed to see what is going on in there, and hear from the doctors themselves, because the only thing that can fix what these doctors and nurses are going through is if people stop themselves from getting this virus and stop themselves from spreading it right now. and so, they are trying to convey this sense of urgency, of desperation of anger, right? and so, we are seeing this in all of this footage that we are starting to get in from the new front lines now, from doctors and pell directors from paramedics from nurses. we are also seeing it in the national level now,

interestingly, even from former trump administration officials. former trump homeland security adviser, tom bossert set up a red hot flare saying we are in trouble. he posted it along statistical estimates of how much of the entire population is potentially infected already in certain states. california, 1% of the entire population. georgia, 1.4% of the whole population. texas, 1.4%. florida, 2.3%. arizona, 3%. and what are do those estimates mean per tom bossert, once a state is over 1% prevalence, it's a huge effort to put out the outbreak fires, more than masks alone. we could top 500,000 u.s. deaths this year if this trend continues. and again, that's a former trump

administration official. that is tom bossert the former homeland security adviser in the trump administration. >> tom, what is different about this spike than the ones or more worrisome than the ones in new york and new jersey? >> just the numbers, the shear numbers. what we saw in february and march in the northeast was among and between, a population of 39 million people. we are talking about 90 million, in three of the states we have covered this morning. florida, texas and arizona. add an additional 49 million, 39 and change if you add california. here's the perspective. we are now as a country, adding a wuhan a day to the case totals of this world. wuhan collectively, klum la acti -- cumulatively had as many cases in the country as we posted in one day, in the next week or two, we will get to a level where we add a new china a day.

it's president trump's former homeland security adviser pulling the fire alarm, again, that is tom bossert, here is president trump's former fda commissioner doing the same thing, but perhaps more dramatically. two months ago, there were about ten states that, where the reproduction number was about 10, they had expanding epidemics now it's 40. there's not a clear line of sight of how we get it under control. we have so much infection around the country we will see a lot of lethality, we will take all of the infection in the fall and winter, it's not clear that it will get better. we will have epidemics that come and go across the nation in different cities, they will light up at different times. but we are not going to be able to crush the virus at this point, there's so much infection around, we don't seem to have the political will to do it. >> scott gotlieb was fda

commissioner under this administration. and even when it comes to trump administration former officials everybody who can reach a proverbial fire alarm is reaching it and pulling it. here is dr. fauci speaking today. i think we have all seen that there seems to be an increasing number of cases in certain parts of the country, is this the second wave? is it a surge? what do we call this had? and what should we know about the current state of the outbreak? >> well, francis, thanks for that question, it's important. the current state is really not good. in the sense that, as you know, we had been in a situation where we were averaging about 20,000 new cases a day. and then, a series of circumstances associated with various states and cities trying to open up in the sense of getting back to some form of normality, has led to a

situation where we now have record breaking cases. two days a ago, it was at 57,500. so, within a period of a week and a half, we have almost doubled the number of cases. so, in answer to your first question, we are still knee deep in the first wave of this. and i would say, this would not be considered a wave. it was a surge or a resurgance of inaffections super imposed on a baseline that never got down where we want ed it to go. europe went up and down to baseline and now they are having little blips as you expect as they reopen. we went up and never came down to baseline and now are surging back up. so it's a serious situation that we have to address immediately. >> a serious situation that we

have to address immediately said the top infectious disease doctor in the u.s. government, dr. anthony fauci. a serious situation that we need to address immediately. good idea, and a idea that we are hearing consistently from every level of the health profession that is dealing with it. from the doctors in the icu wards, to the top doctor in the u.s. government. right? this is a serious situation we must address this immediately, this is not good we are in trouble. we need to do something. we are hearing it at every level, including from former trump administration officials and current trump administration officials. it's just that the trump administration is doing nothing in response. it was four months ago today that president trump went to the cdc, remember back when he talked about the epidemic and did photo ops about it, he said anybody that wants a test, anybody that wants a test can get a test. anybody that needs a test can get a test.

that was four months ago. wasn't true then, still not true now, four months later. which is an astonishing failure from the man that spoke the words. here's the headlines at the times new orleans. coronavirus test site runs out of tests minutes after opening and others turned away. you can find this all over the country right now. times reporting, new orleans does not have enough testing materials to keep testing people even at the rate they were testing before. they had to lower the number of tests they do each day. so, today, they opened their testing site at dillard university in new orleans at 8:00 a.m. on the dot. there were more than 150 people standing in line when they opened. every one of the testing slots for the whole day was then filled between 8:00 a.m. and 8:02 a.m. today in new orleans,

that was your 2-minute window in which you might have had a chance to get tested. had you been lining up for enough hours before the 8:00 a.m. opening. that's what our testing situation is in this country. that's how we are doing this now. even as of july. >> anybody that wants a test can get a test. >> was not true, and still not true now and the wasted time and effort and sacrifice between then and now that got us to a place now where it's still not true, will go down in american history, not just as a presidential fail you'ure but a american president failure of epic proportion. 130,000 dead and we still can't get people tested in july? phoenix, arizona, is the fifth largest city in the country. it's new york, l.a., chicago, houston, then phoenix. really big city. phoenix's positive rate for

covid testing is well over 20%. you want to aim for like less than 2%, right? or even less if you could. they are well over 20% of all tests coming back positive in phoenix. and the huge city phoenix. that's the highest of any city in the country, although, houston may be giving them a run for their money on that any day now. phoenix residents have been trying to do their part. they have been lining up for five, six, seven, eight hours in 110 degree heat hoping that they have enough gas in the tanks of their cars to stick it out for the number of hours it takes to get to the front of the line to maybe, hopefully get a test. because that's the status of testing in the country right now, this many months in to it. the mayor of phoenix said this weekend, she has been begging the federal government to please help establish more testing sites more capacity, more testing capacity in phoenix. the mayor's office said that she was told in response that fema is quote, getting out of the

testing business. arizona and texas both hit hospitalization records this weekend as did south carolina, and mississippi and california, and montana, and nevada, and probably some others that have hit it since i last checked. the texas tribune reports today that in the rio grand valley in texas, there are 12 hospitals there. ten of the 12 are full. this is hidalgo, cameron and starr counties in texas, 10 out of 12 hospitals were on with a is called diversion status, that means all beds are full, any patients are diverted elsewhere, no more room in the inn, ten out of 12 hospitals. its two hospitals in other areas are not only at capacity, they are above 100% capacity right now. hidalgo county, and starr

county sent out emergency alerts to all residents of each of the countys this weekend warning that the long feared worse case scenario has arrived. one from starr county's top elected official, the starr county judge said this, the local and valley hospitals are at full capacity and have no more beds available. please shelter in place, wear face coverings, practice social distancing, and all caps, avoid gatherings. again, that went out in starr county this weekend in texas. it's a crisis all over texas. i mean, ten hours northwest of starr county, by marpha and alpine, texas and big ben national park. we just obtained this voicemail that was sent to all residents there in brewster county texas. >> sunday, 2:21 p.m., alert, stay home, the covid-19 virus is spreading rapidly across brewster county.

local hospitals are approaching capacity. protect yourself and your family, stay home except for essential activities and avoid gathering with people outside your household. stay safe. end of messages. >> end of messages. it will not be the end of those messages. but that's from brewster county, which is alpine, texas is the county seat there in big ben national park. but, it's all over texas. i mean, it's not only texas, look at texas. in austin, texas, capitol, the mayor in austin said it's ten days to two weeks before the austin hospitals are overwhelmed. in san antonio, the express news said it's a week or two before the hospitals are overrun there. there's right now, morocco individu -- more covid patients in hospital rooms in their area, than in new york city. in forth worth, it's reported

that they may have three weeks maybe there before the tarrant hospitals are overrun. and laredo reporting their hospitals are full. corpus christi is down to 12icu beds for a population of 600,000 people. nine beds. and in houston, in harris county where we are starting to get in the front line footage from the covid wards and the ers and the icus and harris county, houston, texas, we are already seeing it. houston'ses the fourth largest city in america. this is where we are. and this is what we are going to keep barrelling further and further in to without a change in course. let's talk about that change in course. next. i don't keep track of regrets and i don't add up the years,

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this is the headline in the

arizona daily star over this fourth of july weekend. as covid-19 explodes in arizona, sonora to close border to nonessential travel. sonora is specifically sonoro, mexico. we are at the point where mexico is hardening its border against americans. maybe they will pay for a wall after all. this from the washington post, another versions of the same story. as cases have increased in southern california, arizona, and texas, mexican boarder states have seen the outbreak in the u.s. as their biggest threat in controlling the epidemic. mathematic mathematically, you cannot blame them. arizona passed 100,000 cases. and mexico would like to keep that over here by keeping arizona residents out of their country. so they are blocking their border between mexico and arizona. americans are also for what it's worth, not welcome in europe. not like our president is not

welcome there, it's us, all americans. we are banned from europe, now. because of our government's c catstrauphic handles of the virus. in europe, they have got it under control, they have done it right. here is how the "wall street journal" summed it up. estonia has detected only 12 infections and iceland 40, and norway and ireland are comparable in population to south carolina. over that same period, south carolina reported almost 17,000 new cases of coronavirus infection. aside from restrictions covering large gatherings. estonia has lifted all the measures it put in place to suppress measures of the virus. having brought the virus to low level wills they are having test, trace and isolate programs to find new cases before they can spread the virus. and the journal was told, our

job is to identify small waves and hit them down before they are regional or national waves. imagine that. imagine that, being able to see and respond to small waves instead of drowning in multiple tsunamis. is it possible for us to even aim at let alone replicate what the successful other countries are doing? and if not, what do we do other than dispair? joining us is a doctor, a professor at harvarder medical school and director of the global health institute, i appreciate you making time. i'm sort of in the depths of it tonight, we have talked through a couple of dark moments but i feel like the situation in the u.s. feels hopeless and i want to get you are expert take on it. >> yeah, so, rachel, we are in a very difficult time. no doubt about it. and we are, i think, at an

inflection point. if we begin to get our act together, and i believe we still can, we can turn it around. but if we don't act in the up coming days and weeks, we are signing off on all of the fall and winter in terms of kids not being able to go back to school. and a horrible economy. and of course, hundreds of thousands of americans dead. and this is not a decision that we have to make in four or eight weeks, we have to make a decision in the up coming couple of weeks to turn it around. now, there's states in america that are doing well, probably about a dozen of them. so, we know we can do this. the problem is, 35, 38 states are not doing very well. and you know, i think what we need is, at least a state level leadership, ideally we would have -- it seems that it's a bridge too far. >> for states that are not doing well, it's not good enough right now, though to just imitate what the states that are doing well

are having in place in terms of policy, right? for example, new hampshire or massachusetts or one of the states that either had very little virus or had some and brought it down. the other states right now, where things are exploding, look at a state like arizona, or texas or georgia or the carolinas. if they just started doing what massachusetts has in place or what new hampshire has in place, they would not get there. the part of the thing that is hard to get your head around, is once you have huge epidemics and huge numbers of people who are actively infected in the state, it seems like the tool kit must have to be different or somehow more acute to try to bend that curve down to try to get it at all under control so you can start doing things like contact tracing and isolating and getting things under control. >> so, absolutely right. so the model for a state that had a horrible outbreak and now has one of the lowest levels of new infections in the country is new york. new york did turn it around and

it's a big state, but of course, what new york did was shut everything down for quite a period of time and opened up very, very slowly. this is exactly what those of us have been tracking iter worried about when the states opened up too early with too many cases. they didn't meet the white house's own guidelines. so then the question is, are there any options left for texas and florida and arizona short of a shelter in place, complete shutdown? the window is looking pretty narrow here. maybe with true mandatory mask orders, cancelling all indoor activities, and bumping up testing as much as you can, maybe they can turn it around. but i'm worried they are all heading toward a shelter in place order. and having to try to replicate what new york did. >> and having to try to enforce it. which is a different thing to do practically, after they have been through what they have been through with their, lighter

friendlier shelter in place orders earlier. it just feels like the tool kit is getting so narrow here doctor. >> it is, and what is, i think to me the most frustrating part about this, is the lack of a consistent message from our political leaders. look, it's hard enough to get people to change behavior in, under the best of circumstances. but when you have been hearing for months that this is nothing but the flu, that this is a hoax. that it's no big deal, it's going to go away. then, to turn around and expect people to change their behavior on a dime, i don't really blame the party goers. i understand i look at them and i think, this is a message they have been given by their political leadership for months, it's not a big deal. so the hill here is much steeper to climb because of the misinformation that has been coming from the political leaders from washington to state houses across the country. >> yeah, and that should be curable in a day if anybody started paying a attention. thank you for making time for us

tonight, i realize i gave you a lot of dark news to try to make sense of, but you speak with a lot of clarity, it's help had f -- it's helpful. thank you. a lot more to come, speaking of dark, we will talk about a little eternal damnation in your news cycle, don't say i never gave you anything. we will be right back. and i'll tell you some important things to know about medicare. first, it doesn't pay for everything. say this pizza... [mmm pizza...] is your part b medical expenses. this much - about 80 percent... medicare will pay for. what's left... this slice here... well... that's on you. and that's where an aarp medicare supplement insurance plan, insured by unitedhealthcare insurance company comes in. this type of plan helps pay some of what medicare doesn't. and these are the only plans to carry the aarp endorsement.

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there's a lot of competition for the worst thing this administration has done since they have had power and for starters how about running the worst coronavirus response of any industrialized country in the world, killing 131,000 americans in the process and heading in to month six, month seven of the crisis with americans still not even reliablely able to be tested for the virus. that is a pretty good competitor for worst thing they have done. that has got ton be a

front-runner, right? how about botching the response to hurricane maria. then blaming puerto rico. here's another, a crowd favorite. another competitor for the worst thing they have done. how about soliciting, accepting and trying to leverage further help from the russian government to help trump's election effort against hilary clinton and spending his entire four years in office doing everything that the russian government wanted from him, and firing and demonizing anybody that was involved in investigating what happened there. all of the three things, the roan coronavirus, the hurricane maria toustuff, it's all so terrible and nuts and unprecedented that we were not even prepared to defend ourselves against those things for the most part. there's another top contender though, that was, i think,

foreseeable. people in the obama administration told me to worry about it before it happened and that's the thing that trump is overseeing in terms of the rule of law. the end of the independent justice department. it's transformation in to a tool that both hunts the president's enemies and protects and rewards the president's criminal allies. right, that may be should have been foreseeable. and it should be noted that's the one that rushes you right to the end of history in terms of your statuses as a rule of law country. except there's lots and lots of competition if you try to rank the worst things they have done. the most damage they have done to our country and to the american experiment. lots of competition. but here's the one. here's the one where, if you are a person who believes in hell, you have to think this is the one for which multiple trump administration officials are most likely to spend eternity in cosmic pen answnance and damnat. this will be in the obituaries

of many, this is one thing that will never slide off of our conscious as a country. and this is something we first found out the specifics of below the fold on the front page of the "new york times" on april 21st, 2018. over 700 children taken from parents at the border. new york times is first to report on 700 kids had been, who had been separated by policy from their parents. after crossing the southern border the white house had carefully guarded that number, they insisted that kids being taken away from their families that was rare. the number was low. and it turns out, it was not low, it was north of 700, and it turned on out that the whoite house had been keeping track and as of 2018, more than 700 kids and the contours of the story from there on out is familiar and still to this day, almost unspeakablely terrible. little kids, taken away from their moms and dads.

babies and toddlers and teenagers, taken from their moms and dads. and sent to live in jail like conditions. sleeping on the floor under space blankets by order of the federal government, in the name of us the american people. it was, it was an early but unspeakablely ugly chapter of theed ed administration that wi never be forgot en. there's a part of the story we did not know until right now. this is new, it's from a book that comes out tomorrow that, is called separated, inside an american tragedy. it's a book written by my dear colleague. correspondent jacob soborov, he was on the forefront of reporting the child separation story. in this stunning new book from jacob, he has broken news of what happened after the "new york times" first reported on the list of kids the trump administration was keeping. how many of them had been taken

away from their parents. and this piece of the book, is about a trump official named scott lloyd, scott lloyd was in charge of keeping the list of kids who had been taken away from their parents and for the first time, it's revealed in the book, what happened when scott lloyd, this trump administration official saw his list. this list of the separated kids reported on the front page of the new york times. this is how jacob reports it, quote the reporting in the new york times made scott lloyd irritated. he was left to stew about the leak over the weekend. embarrassed scott lloyd knew the leak came from his department, on his watch, under an an minute stragz that appointed him to the position. he a drastic reaction. let's get through of the list. if he did that, it would destroy the link of the children and their parents.

despite the fact that the list itself was the best hope of reuniting them. scott lloyd knew to discard the list, he to instruct his staff to do so. lloyd wanted to hear from them before deciding on a course of action. he asked why can't we e-mail on a case by case basis. you see the problem this created. how can we prevent another leak. wanted to destroy the list. because it looked bad, bad publicity. might get him in trouble. destroying the list would have made it impossible for the kids to be put back with their parents again. hey, maybe it would have made the story go away. the story obviously did not go away. neither did the policy. the list of several hundred-s of kids taken away from their parents turned in to a list of several thousand. you might remember after all the public outcry and disgust about this policy, the trump administration said, okay, yeah, fine, we will stop doing that.

and they have not actually stopped doing it. since the quote unquote end of family separations more than a thousand more kids have been taken from their parents at the southern border and put in to u.s. government custody in our name, and those are the kids we know about. the white house is not doing this, in the open anymore, this time, they are doing it quietly. which is of course, important to know just on its face, that taking little kids from the moms and dads is operational policy, it's still in affect. but it's also important for another reason, one that jacob smartly unlines in his new book. part of that is that this whole idea was supposed to deter people from coming in to the country. if you are doing it secretly, how are you deterring them? if you are doing it secretly and trying to get away with it, how are you using the policy to keep people from coming in to the country? but it's also relevant, because the most vocal and vehement

defenders and enablers of the policy and all of its garbled mystery, these people are still employed by the federal government, by the trump administration, they are the people most highly visible and actively directing the mismanagement of the response to the coronavirus epidemic which has killed 131,000 americans. take, for example, the health and human services secretary. scott lloyd's boss, his job was to take care of all the kids. the ones sleeping on the floor under aluminum blankets now he is in charge of leading the public health response to the coronavirus, and how about katy miller, she was a vocal unwaivering defender of what we were doing taking the kids away from their parents. here is how he recalls a conversation with her in his new book. previously unreported but in jacob's new book.

katie miller told jacob, quote, my family and colleagues told me that when i have kids i will think about the separations differently. i don't think so. homeland security sent me to the border to see the separations myself to try to make me more compassionate, but it didn't work. jacob responds, it didn't work? i will never forget what i saw. seriously. are you awhite nationalist? he asked, exasperated, no, but i believe if you come to america, you should asimulate, why do we need to have like little havana? that was katie miller in the throws of the national up roar over this government prying kids out of their parents arms. today, she has a new job. today, she is the press secretary for the vice president of the united states. and in charge of all communications on coronavirus for the federal coronavirus task force. as the nation continues to

blunder murderously through the worst coronavirus epidemic on earth. 10s of thousands of cases a day. it's helpful to remember who was at the wheel here, and where was the last business crisis they got their training. make that new good book, not just a telling of the dark time, an instruction manual to inform us. ♪ [ engines revving ] ♪ ♪ it's amazing to see them in the wild like th-- shhh. for those who were born to ride, there's progressive.

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i have been inside a federal prison before. i have been inside several county jails. this place is called a shelter, but effectively these kids are incarcerated. there are over 1,400 of them that are spending not weeks, months inside this place. they're not actually literally in caging or in cells, but i kid you not one of the first things an employee of the shelter said to me when we walked inside, can

you try to smile at these kids because it's weird to see people from the outside. they feel like animals locked up in cages being looked at. it was an extraordinary thing to see. >> that report two years ago was one of the first glimpse we as a country got inside the trump policy of taking kids away from their parents. he announced he was ending it and now the trump administration continues it. jacob's book is called "separated," and it is out tomorrow. i'm so glad you wrote this thing and i'm so glad that you wrote about it in the way that you did. >> thanks, rachel. thanks for having me. >> let me just ask you the -- i kind of want to go right to the part of it that has sort of kept me up since reading your book, which is the sort of moral

quandary about people who were in the administration who took part in this because you tell a number of stories i had never known before about people that did the right thing inside the administration. people who said, yeah, i'll do that and then didn't do it. people who resigned. did you have any clarity in this as to whether or not there was a moral way to be inside the trump administration when this was happening? >> well resist is what the individuals who tried to stop this policy would say to me time and again. you know, i wrote this book to basically try to answer that question. i saw all those things you described before the commercial break with my own eyes, the kids under the mylar blankets. even though i saw it myself and that's a vision that will never leave me for the rest of my

life, i get sick every time i talk about it, i wanted to know how this happened and how it could have happened and how nobody tried to stop it. and i often said during our coverage at the time, there is no plan. there was no plan to separate these kids and there was no plan to put them back together. in reporting this book and in talking to officials throughout the trump administration, both career officials and political officials, in some measure i was wrong. there were people all throughout the government who tried to stop this. they tried to stop this on multiple occasions, whether it was from within orr and commander jonathan white talking about the fact that was going to create lifelong trauma for these people and telling people about what he believed to be the dangers of this program or ice who knew that the systems, the technology systems wouldn't be able to put people back together and talked about this openly. nevertheless, the administration moved forward with this policy.

she denied that it existed and despite the fact she was warned by her own general council that this was potentially going to violate the constitutional rights of migrants coming to this country and violates their rights to due to process. resist is the short answer, do everything in their power to stop this from happening and unfortunately, they obviously were not successful. >> they were not successful in stopping it from happening, but they were successful in stopping some of the worst things that still could have happened beyond this from happening, including the mass expansion from this program, which you report they had floated. jac jacob, i want to say congratulations on this work. i want people to buy it and read it. it's stunning. puts it book in context and does give us the moral center we need for this story. thanks, my friend. congratulations. >> i'm grateful to you, rachel. thank you. >> jacob's new book is called

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iowa senator chuck grassley announced he will not attend the republican national convention this year because of covid. after his announcement, we called the offices of all of the other republican senators over the age of 80 today. there are a bunch of them. we called them all. we did get one response from the youngster of the group, lamar alexander, who turned 80 years young on friday. senator lamar alexandealexandere saying he is an honorary chair of the campaign, but he will not be attending because he believes the delegate spots should be reserved for those who have not had that privilege before. he's just giving someone else a shot. but lamar alexander is a second republicaner