hey there. i'm joshua johnson. americans are clamoring for help as coronavirus pandemic claims more than 130,000 lives. some are getting it, but not all. roger stone also clamored for help as a court prepared to send him to prison and he did get it, thanks to president trump. the stated reasons dovetail

somewhat. the white house says commuting stone's sentence spares him from coronavirus exposure behind bars. without the president's help, stone would have served a sentence of more than three years on a range of convictions, starting this tuesday. >> this is a man who obstructed justice, lied to congress, threatened a witness, and the purpose of that was to protect president trump. >> as for covid-19, ppe is still in high demand, including face masks. the president has avoided wearing masks, but that could change today during his visit to walter reed medical center. confirmed covid-19 cases are rising in 36 states. yesterday, the nation added at least 70,000 more, a new daily high. but is that a sign that america's fight against coronavirus is going badly? depends who you ask. >> is the united states losing the war against covid-19? >> no, we're winning the war, we

have areas that flamed up and they're going to be fine over a period of time. >> as a culture, when you compare us to other countries, i don't think you can say we're doing great. we're just not. >> meanwhile, schools are preparing to get back in session either in person, online, or a bit of both. president trump is demanding kids return to campus this fall. how are teachers and parents deciding what to do? we'll speak with two of them in the hour ahead. we begin this hour at the white house where we just learned that multiple officials opposed the stone commutation, and attorney general bill barr recommended against it. josh letterman is there with the latest. josh, what more have we heard about the opposition? >> reporter: what we're learning more and more throughout the day, about strong opposition from multiple corners within the trump administration to the president's move to grant clemency to roger stone.

trump administration official telling our pete williams and kara lee, he had nothing to do with offering that to roger stone. also telling us that bill barr, typically a very close ally of the president actually had spoken to the president prior to this decision and urged him not to grant clemency to roger stone. the president obviously did that anyway. another person close to the administration is also telling us that chief of staff, mark meadows, at the white house also opposed the move, although it was not due to concerns necessarily about abuse of power, more about the political blow back, some of the optics of how this would be perceived, headed into the election. what is clear is that the president was essentially acting on his own here. this is not something that was broadly supported with his administration, certainly not something that's enjoying support from democrats or even

republicans on capitol hill today either. >> do we know why attorney general barr suggested he not commute the sentence? do we know the rationale? >> we know bill barr on the record as recently as wednesday saying he believes the prosecution by the justice department that he runs of roger stone was in his words righteous, and that the sentence that the judge ultimately gave to roger stone was a fair one. we should note, this was after attorney barr had intervened, so to speak, to get a lesser sentence than what the prosecutors originally suggested for roger stone. we had four prosecutors of the federal government yank themselves off the case. one of them left the justice department all together because they were so upset about attorney general barr's intervention there. at the end of the day, he did think the underlying prosecution was fair. that seems to be the reason he didn't think the president should reduce his sentence. >> president trump plans to visit wounded veterans and health care workers at walter

reed today. what more do we know about the visit? >> the president got back to the white house from playing golf. he will turn around in a couple hours to head to walter reed to pay a visit to wounded warriors as well as health care workers there that have been caring for covid patients. the big change is that we expect the president to wear a mask during the visit. he said yesterday, he has no problem wearing it in this situation. we do expect he will likely be photographed wearing a mask. the real question is, is this a one and done photo op or is this the new normal for the president. trump said yesterday that he is wearing it today because it makes sense in a hospital setting, but of course we know that public health officials are not telling us we need to wear a mask only in a hospital setting, they're telling us you need to wear a mask anytime you're in close proximity with people that are not in your household. the big question, will this be a new pattern for president trump, will he wear a mask going forward. >> and we'll let you put your

mask on in a second. thank you, josh. that's josh lederman from the white house. many states that stepped up reopening plans are stepping back as coronavirus cases rise faster and faster. by our count, the country had the largest single day increase yet, more than 70,000 newly confirmed covid-19 cases. coronavirus related hospitalizations are at the highest level since may, up at least 5% in at least half of the country. let's focus on the nation's largest hot spots, namely texas, california, and florida. all three states are seeing death tolls continue to rise at rates that have health care officials worried. first, we go to nbc's priscilla thompson at the houston fire department station 17, east of downtown. and priscilla, more than 260 firefighters are off, either sick with coronavirus or

quarantining. that's about 7% of the city's firefighters. how is the department handling that? >> reporter: joshua, as the fire chief put it to me, there's no easy shift right now. you know, they're working with a fraction of their staff at a time they're fielding more calls for service than ever before, around 1100 calls per day. so these men and women that are first responders and firefighters are really working around the clock, picking up a lot of extra shifts. one emt earlier today told me he worked ten days in a row at the end of last month. that's really the situation on the ground here in houston. overall, as case numbers continue to climb. one of the things complicating firefighters and first responders' jobs now is the hospital capacity issue that is being dealt with in houston where capacity is maxed out. take a listen to what the fire chief told me about that.

>> as we take more people to the hospital, the more people that are having to be triaged at the hospital means delay for ambulances in transferring patients, which means they're not available to respond to the next call. >> reporter: to breakdown what he's saying, essentially a lot of ambulances are told to divert to different hospitals because of the icu capacity and er capacity being full. when there are no other hospitals to divert to, they're still having to go to hospitals and often wait with patients that are on the gurney from the ambulance while they wait for the hospital to find a bed, stretcher, somewhere the patient can go. then the emt is able to leave, respond to the next call. they can't do that until there's a place found for the patient they're with, so it is causing backlog here in houston as folks are continuing to work to navigate the covid crisis. >> even some hospitals that barely get emergency cases

through a normal year or summer are finding themselves having to turn people away. thank you, priscilla. that's priscilla thompson in houston. now let's go to california. in the past, they released thousands of inmates to relieve the overcrowded corrections system. now they're releasing more inmates, up to 8,000, in hopes of containing the coronavirus outbreak. san quentin state prison saw more than a third of prisoners and staff test positive for covid-19. a third. gadi schwartz is in los angeles. where do things stand? >> reporter: as we see the spike, we're looking at another round of wide scale inmate releases. they announced a program that allows for release up to 8,000 nonviolent offenders to prevent further spread of covid-19 in lockup, and that includes up to 4800 releases by end of july.

so far, out of 110,000 prisoners incarcerated now, there have been 5800 cases, 31 deaths, including some on death row, at least three deaths on death row. the worst of the outbreaks now at san quentin, at a correctional facility in chino. so far the plan is to begin releases in phases, first to nonviolent inmates with less than 180 days on the sentence, and are high risk, then those with less than a year that are also high risk of covid-19, those serving time for violent crimes or domestic violence, sex offenders are not going to be eligible under new release programs, but the new plan comes after more than 10,000 state prisoners have already been released across the state. local counties like los angeles have dramatically reduced people being held in jails from 17,000 to 12,000, down 5,000 here in los angeles alone.

los angeles county sheriff saying over a thousand of those still held in jail are murder suspects, just to give you a perspective of the scale, along with thousands of others who will not be eligible, who are violent inmates and possibly sex offenders. the sheriff is saying that they have been monitoring the situation, they're aware some inmates have purposefully been infecting themselves to get out of jail early. there's video of people caught on surveillance camera, the sheriff saying they'll not be released early. authorities are working on a plan, a program that would incentivize good time credits for those that helped stop the spread of covid-19. >> that's gadi schwartz from los angeles. disney calls it the most magical place on earth.

today the magic kingdom reopened. some notable changes. if only pixie dust made it safe to hug mickey and minnie again. the park looks much the same but feels quite different with temperature checks and required masks. costumed cast members will serve as social distancing squad to enforce rules politely, of course. chris pallome is outside the resort with the latest. chris, disney is the latest park to reopen. seaworld reopened, universal orlando is back to business, universal is a corporate cousin of msnbc. how is all of this going in light of florida's outbreak? >> reporter: yeah, joshua, great question. a lot of health officials are looking to find the answer to that. yesterday, the orange county health commissioner said that since the other parks reopened, he has not been able to, even

though he's been looking, he has not been able to find widespread outbreak from reopening parks. people that attended that may have had it, yes, but outbreaks, no. he says he is more concerned instead of theme parks, he is more concerned about places like gyms, people that dine indoors, things of that nature being more spreading events for covid-19 here in the state of florida. but of course, people going here today know that this is certainly a risk. disney is doing everything it can, far different than four months ago before the pandemic hit. people are seeing rides with seats left open, seeing plexiglas in stores, asked to do contactless payments, they're social distancing. everybody has to wear a mask. they're having temperatures checked. disney insists its plan is sound. they opened two parks today, two more open wednesday. health officials will be

watching it closely. it all happens on the backdrop of florida being one of the fastest growing coronavirus hot spots in the united states. 95 new deaths reported on friday. more than 400 new hospitalizations and 10,000 more cases. for a time, things were pretty level here the last couple of weeks, both cases, deaths, and hospitalizations are starting to rise. so it is something that bears watching in florida, joshua. >> interesting to watch the parks adapt. even universal studios has a new stunt show, actors on stage, throwing punches, hanging from helicopters are wearing face masks. they're leaning into the changes. chris, it sounds like a series of problems that have to be solved, not the least of which reason being the nba is planning to start playing in central florida, major league soccer. what's your sense of the confidence level right now in terms of how safely these

mass events can move forward? >> reporter: well, i think that people are cautiously optimistic but i think it was the nba commissioner adam silver the other day that said yeah, we're hoping for the best. we're doing everything we can. but there certainly can be an outbreak. you mention the nba, they're just on the other side of the park at the wide world of sports espn complex. it is a bubble they're calling it because players, coaches are not allowed to leave their hotel area, not allowed off property. the problem with the bubble is that employees that are serving the players are not in the bubble. they're going home. so of course something can be brought in from the outside. i think people are cautiously optimistic. but the move for a lot of sports leagues and other entities that say we're going to florida and isolate to start the leagues up and get things going, it looked smarter a month or two ago when

numbers were very flat. now it is a growing problem. it doesn't look so great. we'll see how it goes. >> word to the wise, as much as the parks are eager to have your business, if you do not have a mask or you have a temperature of 100.4 or higher, they'll turn you away at the check point politely. that's chris pallome outside walt disney world resort. there's much more to come on msnbc. up next, more on president trump's decision to commute roger stone's sentence. why a commutation? why not a pardon? who could be the next person to get the president's help? on to get the president's help ♪ [ engines revving ] ♪ ♪ it's amazing to see them in the wild like th-- shhh.

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children in many cases, the immune system is so powerful, so strong, but the young and healthy can safely return to work and to school. we have to open our schools. open our schools. stop this nonsense. we open our schools.

>> children seem far less likely to die of covid-19 than adults or seniors do. the president is pushing for school campuses to reopen, partly using european nations as success stories. those countries responded to the pandemic quite differently than the u.s. has and they have differed from each other in how they send students back into the classrooms. here is nbc's molly hunter. >> reporter: in recent weeks, hundreds of millions of students across the globe returned to school, more than a billion kids, including americans, have not. almost every country is doing it differently. some have imposed strict limitations on contact. schools in denmark started with pods of four or five kids. south korean schools opened, closed, reopened with temperature checks, dividers and masks. some schools stayed open as infections cropped up. when outbreaks swept through a dozen schools two weeks after

opening, they were shut. the country's infection rate was also on the rise, and that's key. when we visited paris as their cases dropped, the city invited kids of essential workers and the most vulnerable back first. >> no ipad or laptop at the home, they can't make distance learning. >> reporter: at the end of april in denmark, they've chosen youngest students to return first. >> hey, guys. hi. are you happy to be back, are you excited? >> yes. >> reporter: the curve flattening and the weather cooperating. >> we have to do as much outside teaching as possible. >> reporter: two and a half months later, it is still working. no new spike in infections. we met this woman in april with her daughter. how has it been going, how have the last two and a half months

been? it was methodical and clear, social distance lowered from six feet to three, and older kids have now returned. >> the first thing you think about are the kids and whether they're going to be okay, but then at some point i think i also let go quickly the need to do everything. >> reporter: so far, data is limited. opening schools doesn't necessarily mean there's a rise in cases when the local infection rate is already low. but it is not one size fits all. denmark has been able to keep pods small by drafting assistant teachers, pe teachers, caree people to help. it was a way to keep the kids separated. molly hunter, nbc news, london. let's continue with maxi hollingsworth, a teacher in

houston, and erica, a mom of three in indiana, northwest of indianapolis. good to have you with us. maxi, your school in houston is in an area with surging covid cases now. what options are on the table for you for the school term that's coming up? >> well, first i want to respond and say i don't think it is nonsense at all that teachers, school staff, and parents are concerned about safely and equitably reopening our schools. here in texas where we have seen up tick in cases and hospitalizations, we are being asked to reopen schools in a little more than a month without funding, additional funding, without infrastructure in place to support the most vulnerable student populations and without additional funding for precautionary measures we need to reopen safely. >> is there anything, erica, being done to make the reopening

easier on teachers, any kind of guidance being given, any resources being provided, anything like that? >> yeah. here in zionsville, they came out with the school reopening plan as of yesterday and they're going to add additional cleanings. they did require mask wearing, and it was a very impressive reopening document, very thorough. but it was also -- there's still so much danger that exists and those teachers are at the most risk, they're really the ones putting their life on the line. as she said, we are not getting additional funding that's required to keep our teachers and staff safe. >> maxi, what are your biggest concerns about the coming school year? is your district doing anything to ease your primary concerns? >> well, i think now we're

waiting for more specific guidance, a word from the state about what funding and supports we're going to get. i am a parent as well. any child of an educator can tell you how much we value classroom instruction. but if we're going to do that, in order for that to happen, schools open safely and with the lowest risk, we need to have more funding and infrastructure in place and that word has not come down. we have only been told we're going to be required to reopen, and there are no guidelines in place for masks. we don't know about sanitizing the classrooms. we don't have any word about how we're going to pay for all these things. that's a great deal of concern to me and also to the support staff i talked to. i talk to bus drivers and aides, i talked to classroom or cafeteria workers. they're all concerned how we're going to reopen again safely and

equitably. and that needs to start with a realistic virtual learning plan. >> before i have to let you two go, what are you doing to prepare your kids and yourself mentally and physically for what could be a very unusual school year, especially if schools have to close and everybody has to stay home for more than just this semester. >> we are doing -- we have been practicing all summer about hand washing and wearing masks and wearing masks for long periods of time. we've been getting out slowly, carefully, being cautious about who we expose ourselves to. and it is really an education process, and teaching them how to be careful, how to have good hygiene, being cautious of other people. >> that's lesson number one for sure. maxi, before we go, have you or anyone in your school considered just not showing up in the fall,

just putting your foot down, saying i am not going to campus, period, when the fall term starts? >> yes. i got a text message about two hours ago from two teachers saying they're not coming back. they're concerned. the reality is this. we need to see at least 14 days of decline in new cases. we need to see less than 1% transmission rate. these are the things we need to look at. we need to see reduction in covid-19 cases before we talk about entering the school building. >> sounds like they're willing to risk their jobs for that. >> some of them are, some are talking early retirement, some are talking about some plan to take off. they're asking a lot of questions. a lot of them are just concerned, don't have an idea what to do. but the reality is if we place a priority on reopening, if the

economy is more important, then what are we teaching? what message are we sending? we don't value our students, we don't value our teachers, we don't value education if we push the reopen. if the economy is paramount, then we need to take care of people running the economy in 20 years. >> i appreciate you both making time for us. do stay safe. thanks very much. straight ahead, president trump's gift to roger stone. we take a deeper look at the power of commutation. look at te power of commutation as a caricature artist, i appreciate what makes each person unique. that's why i like liberty mutual. they get that no two people are alike and customize your car insurance so you only pay for what you need. almost done. what do you think? i don't see it. only pay for what you need.

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roger stone will not go to prison next week after all. president trump commuted the sentence of his friend and campaign aide. the move may be questionable but it is legal. the presidency grants him the powers to do that. this morning, mr. trump tweeted that roger stone was in his words targeted by an illegal

witch hunt. he wrote that barack obama and joe biden are criminals that spied on his campaign. presidential commutation is lawful, but is it right? let's discuss with cynthia objection knee, former federal prosecutor and legal contributor. good to see you. let's get the basic definition out of the way. what exactly is commutation, is that like a pardon or something else? >> it is something else. what it says is he doesn't have to go to jail but that his felony conviction still stands. what i don't think people realize is that often when a person is convicted of a crime, they go to jail, then through a separate process, appellate process going forward about different reasons on why their conviction should be overturned. in this case, he can continue to do that in the appellate process, but doesn't have to go to jail. i might say, this is a guy that likes being a fixer, he likes his reputation as somebody who works outside in a gray area.

he has a nixon tattoo on his back, borderline disgusting. it is not clear to me he really cares if he gets his conviction overturned. what he cares is that he didn't have to go to jail tuesday. and he got what he wanted. >> there have been criminal investigations into other pardons and commutations that went nowhere, like with mark rich, bill clinton pardoned him in the last few hours of his presidency. he was convicted of tax evasion, but he was a big bill clinton donor, but in the end nothing really happened. was this with roger stone a done deal or could there be a next chapter to it? >> you know, the smart money is it is a done deal because the power is so broad. you can make an argument that this is a bribery or part of an obstruction case, and after all, roger stone is the guy who knows the president lied to bob mueller, after he did not tell what happened with his

conversations with the president. the president dangled a pardon, said he was great for hanging tough. roger stone has even recently as yesterday talked about how he kept quiet for the president and expected something in return and got it in return. those are sort of basically part of an obstruction or bribery case. who brings that is unclear. this justice department certainly is not going to bring anything against the president, and the next justice department that everybody has loves justice is holding out hope for is going to be pretty busy. they're going to have to make some decisions about what they're going to do. here we will be when we hope biden takes over, several hundred thousand americans may be dying, the justice department is trying to erase health care options for those people. i mean, there's a lot of things happening, and the president will have to make a decision on where he's going to use his

political capital. it is not clear this goes anywhere. >> with regard to political capital, "the wall street journal" editorial board is urging president trump to pardon michael flynn. what's your sense of where that might go? you should know, michael flynn pled guilty to lying to the fbi. >> michael flynn not only pled guilty but pled guilty twice. with incredible detail. then in an act of corruption, bill barr is trying to withdraw his guilty plea, i mean, is trying to allow him to withdraw the guilty plea and actually dismiss the case which is an offense against justice. right now that case is on appeal essentially because judge sullivan said no, not so fast, not so fast, sparky, slow down, i want to know what happened. that went up to d.c. circuit. they said sorry, you don't get to find out what happened. judge sullivan has now appealed that to the entire circuit.

right now we're in a stalemate situation. michael flynn's case has not been dismissed. he is not sentenced to go to jail, and we're creeping up in the timelines against the election. my hunch would be since judge sullivan made this move, if six of eleven judges vote to take the case, that kicks the can down the road until the election. was you'll see is michael flynn on stage with trump and i don't think there's any reason why trump would use political capital to pardon him because he doesn't need to because nothing is happening with the case now. >> fascinating to see this appeals court go from just an appeals decision to one of the judges demanding that his colleagues reconsider in a larger hearing. i will be interested to see where that goes. thank you. appreciate it. still to come on msnbc, black lives matter murals are

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add new york to the list of cities with a new black lives matter mural, it runs along 5th avenue by trump tower, not by

happen stance. that renewed tensions between mayor de blasio and president trump. activists across the u.s. are laying down murals to honor movement and demand equity. president trump lashed out at the artwork, calling it a symbol of hate that den grates the luxury avenue. gary, what's the mood like down there? >> reporter: hey there, josh. things got started in the past hour. supporters of president trump on this side and these are supporters of black lives matter on the other side. the mural outside trump tower has been closed off by nypd, but some murals across the country aren't lucky to have the nypd protecting them. starting in martinez, california, there have been defacing by trump supporters, in salt lake city, utah, a number of defacings as well. paint was thrown over the black

part to say all. there were tires put on the murals. lots of different opinions. here are some people i talked to earlier. >> he's the president, he's not doing nothing for this coronavirus, nothing to stop police brutality that's going on. so this is just a statement along with the coronavirus thing to the president. >> i think this is an amazing protest because you can actually see that they faced it towards trump tower. >> reporter: there are a lot of different opinions out here, josh. >> thank you, gary. outside trump tower on 5th

avenue in manhattan. the st. louis couple that went viral for pointing guns at protesters just had their home searched by police. yesterday, officers executed a warrant at the home of mark and patricia mcklaas key. they seized his rifle. they accuse them of escalating a peaceful situation. their attorney says the handgun she was holding will be turned over to police soon. background checks for firearms are all-time highs, amid concerns over coronavirus. new reports show that last month, americans prompted 3.9 million background checks to purchase or possess firearms. last month. the previous record was in march, 3.7 million. jordan jackson is in mount airy, north carolina, where background checks have nearly tripled. what's driving the increase? >> reporter: that's right, joshua. here in north carolina, the up

tick we're seeing is staggering. june last year, this state conducted just under 35,000 background checks. this same month this year, the number was over 90,000. that's 160% increase. i spoke to a local business owner who gives firearm training classes just about the demand they're seeing in this community. take a listen to what he told me. >> we've got more than we can do now. i have to make people wait six weeks almost to get some type of training. >> there are shortages for ammunition and firearms now. prices almost doubled if not triple the price they were five or six months ago. >> reporter: i also spoke to a local mother, she's actually a mother of four in this community. she just completed her conceal carry class, now has her first firearm. i want to tell you a little of what she told me this morning. >> specifically being out, going out into local grocery markets

or being stopped on the streets with protests, it just gave me an uneasy feeling that i may not have an option and i wanted to be prepared. >> reporter: now, many i have spoken to say they're primarily motivated by fear. this is one way this sense of instability is playing out in different parts of the nation. joshua? >> that's jordan jackson from north carolina. up next, joe biden is preparing to do battle on what the president sees as his turf, the economy. how does mr. biden plan to rebuild the job market, and how will the nation afford it. rket, will the nation afford it.

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joe biden is preparing to challenge president trump on his two signature issues -- america's identity and america's economy. mr. biden has laid out his rescue plan to reinvest in american manufacturing. it's a $700 billion initiative called build back america. the goal is to spark a boom in manufacturing and tech jobs. joe biden proposes raising government spending on products made in the usa by $400 billion. he also wants to spend $300 billion on research and development for new technologies. president trump says his opponent's proposal would be a catastrophe. joining us to break it down further is sean sullivan, national politics reporter for the "washington post." good to have you here, sean. this is the first piece of joe

biden's economic plan that he's released. what do you think are the most important things within this plan that he's laying out? is it what we've mentioned or maybe something else? >> well, i think the most important takeaway now in the context of this election is the message that joe biden is trying to send here. basically, this is a response to president trump's america-first agenda. joe biden is trying to send a message that says to voters, look, we need to recover this economy, how are we going to do that? we're going to invest in jobs, manufacturing, research, things in the united states. and this is a message, of course, that president trump has since he was a candidate in 2016 tried to underscore. what you're hearing from joe biden is an argument that, hey, the president may say that he is the candidate who is the america-first candidate who is devoted to protecting american jobs and resources, but here's my plan, here's how i'm going to do it. we see these two candidates right now as we move toward the election trying to sell themselves as the champion of

the american people, as the champion of the working class, and that's a battle that we're seeing sort of unfolding rite now as this campaign moves forward. >> how does mr. biden propose to pay for all of this? >> yeah, that's a good question. we don't have a full accounting yet. his campaign says once they've unveiled this whole plan over the course of the next few weeks and months perhaps they will come up with the full accounting. what we know so far is the campaign said that one main way that they're looking to finance this is by rolling back some of president trump's tax cuts on wealthy americans, on big corporations, to flee up some of that money so that they can make these investments. and these are pretty sweeping investments that joe biden is talking about. as you mentioned, $400 billion on product and services in the united states. another $300 billion on research and development. this is over the course of four years. this is a very big and sizable investment that joe biden is talking about right now, which of course means it could be more

difficult to actually implement this in government down the line. >> yeah. absent a way to pay for this, do you get the sense that this is just one of those things that the biden campaign is putting out there to try to hit at the trump campaign? is this real? like are they -- is this money that the biden campaign says can and will actually keelerize from somewhere to help bring back jobs? or is this aspirational? >> well, they do say this is money that can actually be realized, that can actually be put forward. as we've seen in past campaigns, you see candidates in both parties come one big ideas. the reality is when candidates are elected, when they're in government, proves very, very difficult to implement these ideas. everything that is done in the campaign, you know, you can't ignore the fact that a lot of this is seen through a political lens. i think the bigger picture is what biden is trying to do. the message he's trying to send. it's interesting when you look at the polls now, biden has a pretty big advantage over trump across the board.

but the one area that republicans are somewhat optimistic is when it comes to the economy. when voters are asked about president trump's handling of the economy, they tend to give him higher marks than they do compared to his handling of the pandemic, his handling of other issues. i think the democrats see here some potential for trump. if he's going to come back in this race, probably going to be on the economy. and joe biden's trying to shut the door that president trump can't walk through it. >> before you go, it seems like there are a lot of people who are talking more about voting against president trump than voting for joe biden. it seems like, i don't know if you see it this way -- it seems like this might be one of the strategies that the biden campaign hopes will bring back voters who switched away from the democratic party in 2016 and who may even still feel that they are better off economically now with donald trump. >> yeah. that's a really good point. look at where he delivered the speech. it was in pennsylvania, a state that democrats were hoping they would win in 2016, a crucial

state, a state that they lost, a state that president trump won. pennsylvania, michigan, wisconsin, you've got a lot of working class voters in those states, states that trump won. these are crucial states for joe biden. he's trying to send a message that he is the champion of the workers in those states. >> thanks, sean. sean sullivan of the "washington post." thank you also for making time for us. former georgia gubernatorial candidate stacey abrams will talk about the uncertainty around voting this year. i will see you back tonight at 9:00 eastern. until we meet again, i'm joshua johnson. the news continues. the news continues it's pretty inspiring the way families

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