country side emphasized the emotional break up of the society. not everyone gets to leave a national treasure behind. at the time of their passing. paul was able to do that. he is gone now at age 89. that is our broadcast on this wednesday evening. with our thanks for being here with us on behalf of my che colleagues at the net work. good night. one of the remarkably consistent features of this country is absolutely catastrophic coronavirus pandemic is whatever the president might be saying on any given day, that the virus will just disappear, or keeping businesses closed, the owner operating safely, is worse than tens of thousands of more americans dyeing or the nation's schools should definitely all reopen in the fall and he will pull their funding if they don't because that's what everybody

wants the cdc's guidelines on how to do that safely, those guidelines are too tough and we should just ignore them, regardless of what the president is saying on any given day and how much his stuff is parroted by republican officials in congress in the states and conservative media, regardless of all of that, the american public is and consistently has been very, very united in our view that the situation is really bad, that the coronavirus is really dangerous, and we should be doing everything we can to protect ourselves from it and to end this pandemic in our country. i mean, check out this ap poll just out today. for all of the insistence from the white house that schools must reopen in person on time this fall, this poll out today finds precisely 8% of americans -- less than one in ten americans -- think school should open as normal, school should open as usual this year,

8%. where as nearly half of americans think major adjustments will be needed to safely reopen schools. more than a third of americans think in-person teaching should definitely not happen at all this fall. and that's just a wildly different picture of where the american people are at on this subject than you might guess from the way the president and republican officials all talk about it. there's also a new national politico/morning consult poll out that republicans, quote, support wear a mask order, that are mandatory and enforced with jail time or fines. 72% of americans overall support that. big majority of independents, even republicans support that. mandated forcible wear a mask rules, supported by large majorities even of republicans. and check out this quinnipiac poll from texas today. quote, texans say 2/1 that coronavirus spread is out of control. yes, this is texas.

it's not the governor of texas, the republican leaders there or the president of the united states, this is the people of texas. nearly 70% of texans think local officials should be able to issue stay-at-home orders to control the virus, which right now local leaders in texas can't do because the governor is blocking them. fully 80% approve of requiring face masks in public. we're having this giant political fight about masks in this country, but even in texas, 80%, the vast, vast majority of people in texas approve of requiring masks. you know what, if you are a republican president running for re-election and you're on the wrong side of policies that have like 70%, 80% support in texas, well, there are likely to be political consequences of that. so check this out from that same texas poll. in the president's race in this poll that's out today, joe biden

is ahead of president trump. again, we're talking about texas. yes, it's only one point and it's in the margin of error and it's only one poll, i know. but for context, this same poll shows republican u.s. senator john cornyn, who's up for re-election this year, this poll, for example, shows john cornyn beating his democratic senate challenger handily in that race, by almost ten points. but among those voters who say that about john cornyn, donald trump is losing statewide in texas. what? i mean, we're just over 100 days from the election. a lot can happen in 100 days. literally, anything can happen in 100 days. think about what's happened in our country over the past 100 days. but right now the incumbent president's re-election campaign is struggling, and one of the interesting emerging dynamics about the president's 2020 re-election campaign, interesting in particular given how much the campaign is struggling, is that the

president, who more than anything is famous for being a rich guy, the president has apparently decided that he is not going to spend any of his own money on his re-election campaign. you might remember back in 2016, donald trump spent a lot of breath saying he was going to spend let's and lots of his own money on his campaign. it was actually one of his favorite things to talk about, one of the ways he tried to distinguish himself from the rest of the republican field. >> i don't need anybody's money. it's nice, i don't need anybody's money. i'm using my own money. i'm not using the lobbyists. i'm not using donors. i don't care. i'm really rich. i'm self-funding my own campaign. it's my money. it's my money. and i will just keep funding my own campaign. i'm okay with that. that's the easy way. for me, that's the easy way. >> i'm self-funding. it's so easy. yeah, it's just easier to self-fund. who needs the hassle of other people writing you checks. who needs the hassle of taking other people's money? it's so much easier, i will self-fund.

that did not last long. even at the time he was saying that stuff trump was raising millions of dollars for his campaign effort through a super pac, even while he was bragging he wasn't doing any fundraising or using anybody else's money. but eventually he gave up even the pretense. yes, he did kick in a little bit of his own money but by the summer of 2016 he was jetting off regularly to multi campaign fund-raisers. that is when he first ran in 2016, bragging that he wasn't taking anybody else's money, taking plenty of other people's money. this time around for his re-election, he's not even pretending he's going to spend any of his own money. and this far into his re-election effort, it's now clear he's not only not putting any of his own money on the line this time -- interesting, i wonder why not? this time he's making it clear that he's actually going to do the opposite of that. he's going to use donors' money

this time around not just to fund his re-election effort, he's also just going to take donors' money and put it in his own pocket, turn it into private profit for him and his family. here's the handy guide to how he's doing that, which was out yesterday from "forbes" magazine, headlined handily quote -- how donald trump moved millions from his campaign donors to his private business. donald trump has not given a dime to his re-election campaign, opting instead to fund the entire effort with his donors' money. his business, meanwhile, has continued to charge the campaign for things like food, lodging and rent. the campaign also paid trump companies for legal consulting, i.t. expenses like there's some i.t. powerhouse, right? airfare, even office supplies. the result is $2.2 million of contributions from other people has now turned into $2.2 million of revenue for president trump. and that's just counting the money flowing directly through the president's campaign. his re-election apparatus also includes two joint fund raising

committees when work with the republican party to raise money for trump. since he took office, those entitys have funnels another $2.3 million into the president's private business. they've turned into private revenue for the president and his family. then there's the national republican party, who spent an additional $2.4 million at trump parties. at it all up and the president working in concert with the party he leads helped push nearly $7 million into his businesses since taking office. you want to see a concrete example of this transfer of funds in action, if you would like to see what it looks like on paper when campaign donor money to the president just becomes the personal money of donald trump, well, for that thank goodness for national treasurer david fahrenthold, "the washington post" reporter who won a pulitzer prize for digging into the financial shenanigans of donald trump's company. this is a spread she'd fahrenthold recently got ahold of showing the trump campaign pumping $380,000 in all of these

separate weirdly related transactions. $380,000 pumped into the president's private business over the course of just two days. 43 separate payments, all booked separately, all going to trump's mar-a-lago hotel for a week-long donor retreat there in march. and voila, magic, campaign donations, campaign donors' money becomes trump business money, trump family money, the president's personal money. here's how david fahrenthold described it here last week. >> trump holds a lot of campaign events on his properties. he said the rate his properties charge his campaign, and, bingo, donors' money big his private money. same thing has happened with government money. when trump goes to his properties, federal officials come along, trump gets to charge his government whatever he wants and in some cases spends as much as $650 a night for a hotel room and so that's $970,000 at least we know of of tax money in his pocket. these are both things he controls that he turns somebody

else's money into his money. >> the same thing is happening with government money as with campaign money. these are things he controls. so the president of the united states, unlike other presidents who like disentangled themselves from their financial assets and obligations, who it blind tests or who dropped any sort of investments or any song of thing that might create a conflict of interest, in this case the president didn't do those things and he blatantly figured out how to blatantly campaign money into his pockets but also figured out how to funnel government money, our money, taxpayer money, into his pockets. and then there's this the, you know, straight up abuse of the powers of the president to try to use his office to boost his own private business interests. last night you will recall we led the show with this breaking news from "the new york times." they're reporting in 2018, president trump directed his handpicked ambassador to the uk,

guy named woody johnson, one of his billionaire fund-raisers trump became so fond of in 2016 after saying he would fund his own election effort himself, trump asked ambassador woody johnson in his capacity as ambassador to the uk, he asked him to get the british government to move the british open golf tournament to trump's golf resort in scotland. it's a very lucrative thing. it would be great for business at the trump resort in scotland. and incredibly, for some reason i think we're now demur to the idea the president would ask the state department to do this for his business. what's incredible about "the times" reporting is "the times" said woody johnson actually did it. as u.s. ambassador to britain, he actually did raise this issue with a top british government official. now, when the "the times" presented the white house with its reporting yesterday, the white house declined to comment. asked about it directly today in public, the president just denied the story. >> no, i never spoke to woody johnson about that.

turnberry is a highly respected course, as you know. one of the best in the world. >> one of the best in the world. why did you say that? when answering a question about misusing your office to boost your business, do not forget to use the white house briefing room to boost your business while answering that question, right? he's denying that he's using the presidency to hype turnberry and he's like, by the way, as president, you want to know how great turnberry is? that's how he denies it. that's the kind of salesmanship i bet they taught at trump university before it was shutdown as a multi state fraud. but "the times" publishing this reporting and the president denying it, this was not anywhere close to the end of the story. one thing we know from "the times" reporting and our own followup reporting and reporting from nbc news is there are witnesses and documents and evidence that could shed light

on what actually happened here. and it does appear that what actually happened here might be a violation of the law. "the times" reports woody johnson told multiple colleagues about the president's request in 2018, that he should ask the british government to move the british open to his private golf club. "the times" also reports the episode left several diplomats at the american embassy in london unsettled, including ambassador johnson's deputy, who advised the ambassador not to raise this issue with the british government. but then there's this, quote, complaints were raised with the department's office of the inspector general last fall. state department's office of inspector general when a team of investigators began a review of diplomatic operations at the embassy. the findings were submitted in february and the complaints are expected to be included, according to one of the investigators. meaning the complaints about this golf course shenanigans are expected to be included in that report. it's not clear why the review has not been made public. but what happened to that review?

the inspector general looked into this, including into the allegation that the president had the u.s. ambassador to britain try to move the british open to his personal business? the state department inspector general looked into that? and we've got contemporaneously u.s. state department officials complaining about it and putting it on the record? what happened to that report? what happened to that investigation? nbc news further reported today the inspector general report was, quote, completed and marked classified as of may. an unclassified version has yet to be released. now nbc news has asked the state department inspector general's office whether that report includes investigation of the allegations about the president asking the british government to move the british open golf tournament to the president's personal club, but hasn't received an answer to that question specifically. but we now know there is an inspector general's report sitting somewhere inside the

state department, a report that reportedly addresses some variety of complaints about the american embassy in london under woody johnson, and per "the times," is expected to have included contemporaneous complaints about other state department officials about the president pulling off this rank first grade level -- first grader's understanding of what it means to be a interrupt president request where he tells the ambassador to go get his private business some golf club from the british government. i mean, first of all, there is a question. let's get it confirmed. let's get it nailed down as if the british open at trump's golf club episode has been investigated. if so, what what happened to that investigation? and it also puts a whole new angle on the fact trump outrageously and blatantly without explanation fired that state department inspector general. who would have been the guy who did that report. right? we know the president fired him in the middle of that inspector

general conducting multiple investigations into secretary of state mike pompeo but that appears to also be the same inspector general who investigated this, who investigated the president telling the u.s. ambassador to britain to have the british government give him the british open at his private business. and that, of course, is tuesday in the trump administration. now wednesday in the trump administration. this kind of trying to use the u.s. government, trying to use the powers of the presidency literally just to make money for himself and his business, it is something we have seen president trump try to get away with over and over and over again. but in this case, what we're looking at may also be an active cover-up right now. we may actively be seeing a cover-up for this new corruption scandal involving the president right now. did the inspector general look into this specifically? why was that report marked

classified months ago? what happened to that report? will any of it classified or otherwise be released? why is it being sat on? in normal times you would expect this kind of thing would be the basis for an impeachment inquiry, right, almost for any president no matter which party was controlling the house where impeachment proceedings originate. and this is a really basic obvious alleged act of corruption by the president to put money in his pocket. the question now is whether there are threads here that can be tugged on, whether this can be fair to that, whether someone can actually find out what happened here, including the cover-up part involving this inspector personal's investigation, the cover-up part of this, which appears to be ongoing. joining us now ask congressman jamie raskin, democrat from maryland, member of the house oversight committee. congressman raskin, i appreciate you making time to be here tonight. thank you very much. >> it is totally my pleasure to be with you, rachel. >> so let me just get your top line reaction about this report

by the president. he denied it today but what "the times" is reporting and what other news outlets are now confirming the president asked the british ambassador whether he could get the british government to throw some business to his private company. i know this sort of seems like the thing we expect the president to do at this point but how serious does this strike you? >> well, it certainly does not seem out of character in any way. it follows the ukraine playbook pretty much to a t, right? you apply coercive pressure to the u.s. ambassador in order to extend coercive pressure to the governor to do business, in this case to just enhance his financial enrichment. and that has been the extreme of the trump administration from day within is he refused to divest himself from 200 businesses he owns all over the world and basically turned the presidency into a money-making

operation. the founders of the country warned about this. you have to go back and check out ben franklin, who was very clear about it. he said there are two main passions that can corrupt public affairs. he said one is the love of power, ambition. he said there's nothing you can do about that, that's what politic as tract. he said the other is the love of money, avarice. so we have to take care to make sure the president is not drawn to the job or candidates are not drawn to the job because they can make money at it. so the domestic emoluments clause, the president can make no money from the government other than his or her salary and the foreign government emolument clause said the president cannot accept any present emolument office, title of any kind whatever from a foreign government without the consent of congress. and this president has been violating both on an almost daily basis since the administration began.

the whole thing has been a racket, a money-making operation from day one. now as he lurches into violent authoritarianism, all of that is about defending his power so he can keep the money-making operation going. >> if the president is doing this as you say as a regular part of the way that he conducts himself as president, and if he's doing this even after he's been impeached, if he's doing this even as he seems very troubled re-election effort, what is the real accountability here and what is available to the house oversight committee and other elements of congress if they choose to exert oversight responsibilities here and try to figure out what happened here and try to hold the president to account? >> i know chairwoman maloney feels exactly as i do, we owe this to the country, we owe it to the constitution and we owe it to our late beloved colleague elijah couplings, who was furious about the emoluments issue to get all of the facts about this episode.

we know this episode is in no sense unique but reflective of this way of doing business. and we encourage all whistle-blowers out there who know about the operations of the trump hotels and golf courses and various office towers and resident towers and so on to come forward with the information they've got because, of course, they've stonewalled us from the beginning. but congress is not without means to respond to this. the article one section eight of the constitution says, this is the foreign emoluments clause is the president cannot accept any money from foreign government as president. without consent of congress. we know he's accepted millions of dollars from saudi arabia, turkey, indonesia, india, fill philippines. on and on and on. we have the authority unilaterally, without having the

senate involved at all, to disapprove every single one of the emolument payments the president pocketed since coming into office. and i think we're very close to wanting to do that. certainly i've been wanting to do that for a long time but i think the corruption has so saturated the administration and the country that there's really no reason for us not to move forward to declare you cannot accept these emoluments, turn the money over to the u.s. treasury, basically disgorge yourself of all of the ill gotten gains you have been collecting from foreign governments. then we have to deal with the domestic emoluments side, the millions of dollars from the secret service, white house, department of state, directly to the trump hotel, mar-a-lago. every time they go down to mar-a-lago, it's millions of dollars going from the taxpayers of the country to directly to the the president's businesses. where did he get the idea to do the same thing to his donors? he's been doing it to the taxpayers the last four years. it's the same scam.

>> congressman raskin from the great state of maryland, oversight committee in the house. thank you for your time. i appreciate you being here. >> my pleasure, rachel. thank you. and in the political conflict over this as congressman raskin says, there's some way congress ends up hitting the president in the wallet on this, well, that would be an interesting turn of events. that might be the one place that would actually hurt him and he would go eke. much more ahead. stay with us. r. think about how you'll get there. and now that you can lease or buy a new lincoln remotely or in person... discovering that feeling has never been more effortless. the lincoln summer invitation sales event is here. they get that no two people are alike and customize your car

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we're exhausted, just exhausted. it's been going on almost 4 1/2 months now.

almost every single shift you work, you're running around like crazy trying to take care of your patient, trying to keep your patient alive, trying to keep them stable. for the last 4 1/2 months. you have your ppes on, you sweat on it. it's been very exhausting. sometimes you forget that we're humans too. our body needs to rest. our brain needs to rest to function properly. we're humans too. it's been hard. but we'll keep doing what we're doing. we'll take care of our patients. we'll take care of people as much as we can. hopefully we don't break down. we are exhausted. we are really, really exhausted. >> that is subwanana, a registered nurse working with covid patients in san diego, california. she worked 15 minutes where his grandparents lived when i was growing up. i used to spend a lot of time there.

in california today the governor announced land mark news that not only has to be worried by health care providers like that nurse who is stretched thin about this thing, it also has to be worrying for health care providers, doctors, nurses, providers for what's coming in the days, weeks and months ahead given how tired they are already. today in california the governor announced the largest every single number of new cases in a single day, more than 12,000 cases in california in the last 24 hours. california also today passed new york as the state with the largest total number of coronavirus cases since the american pandemic began. new york, of course, went through that apocalypse in infections and hospitalizations and deaths in mid-april. well, california now has over 415,000 cases, which is more total cases than new york has had from the beginning. and california is poised to run away with that record now because right now, new york is adding less than 1,000 cases a

day. california can now is regularly adding more than 10,000 cases a day. and, of course, it's not just california. the other most populous states in the country are also having their own new trouble. florida is approaching 400,000 cases as well. nearly a quarter of those in it miami-dade county alone. hospitals in miami-dade county are already, according to the state, operating at 130% of their capacity. texas today reporting both a record number of deaths and record number of new hospitalizations. america's hospitalization numbers did drop a lot after that mid-april apocalypse in new york and the tri-state region. new york, new jersey, connecticut. but nationwide, look, we're right back up where we were at that level again. it's just this time it's the whole rest of the country. the white house, the president is now inexplicably claiming death numbers for coronavirus is a good-news story.

the president said about the death numbers yesterday, it's a great number. and tweeted out fatalities have fallen nationwide. well, actually, this is the national chart of fatalities from coronavirus right now and while they did fall in the past, right now they are on the rise. and i want to show you something else because i think this is important, something i think that makes clearer, maybe even clear enough for the white house to understand what's going on here and what's in store. so look at this. what you're looking at here, we're going to put up on the screen here is basically the same chart, this is a graph showing deaths from coronavirus over time right up until right now, but this is us just breaking out the numbers for the tri-state area that i mentioned earlier. this is just coronavirus deaths in new york, new jersey and connecticut over time. and you can see how their death numbers soared when they got hit so hard so early. but in the tri-state area, new york, new jersey, connecticut, their numbers have since come way, way down, down radically.

today, in fact, was the first day since march there were zero deaths from coronavirus in new york city. the tri-state area did get absolutely walloped early on but now they're a success story in the way they've beaten this thing back and got it back under control. the now right here next to that, here's the rest of the country and the death numbers for the rest of the country if you don't include the tri-state area. this is the whole rest of the country minus new york, new jersey, connecticut. any solace you might have taken from seeing some not particularly steep rise in deaths in the united states over the past couple of weeks, well, what this shows you is that the whole country looks somewhat better because when you look at the numbers for the whole country, that includes the tri-state area that's done so well. if you break that part of the country out, well, yeah, look at the rising death toll in the rest of the country. just like we saw weeks ago where the national number of new cases really didn't look that bad until you realized the national

numbers only looked okay because the tri-state area were including those numbers and they were kicking butt while everybody else was doing terribly, now the same pattern holds not just for case numbers but in terms of deaths. that's the national on the left side of your screen, the national graph of coronavirus deaths. if you drop the tri-state area, you drop new jersey, new york, connecticut out of it, that's on the right. what we've got is radically declining deaths in those first three hard-hit states and we've got rising deaths in the whole rest of the country, steeply rising deaths. so why is this happening? why are all of these other countries on earth that initially got hit at the same time we did, why are they all over it now and we're doing so terribly? the center for public integrity is reporting tonight dr. deborah birx tonight got on a private call with local emergency managers to warn them that there are 11 major cities in the

united states that need to take, quote, aggressive steps to mitigate their outbreaks right now because their percent of positive tests is rising at an alarming rate. these are major u.s. cities and a lot of them getting this urgent warning from the white house tonight. baltimore, cleveland, columbus, indianapolis, las vegas, miami, indianapolis, nashville, new orleans, pittsburgh, st. louis. all major american cities, 11 of them reportedly being warned tonight directly by dr. deborah birx at the white house that they're in trouble in terms of rising positivity rates. they need to take, quote, aggressive action right now. why is this happening? why six months into this is california hitting its records, and texas and 11 major cities spiking to the to point where even the white house is on fire about it? why are we having such a hard time when other countries that got hit at the same time we did have basically beat it by now?

i mean, it took us basically 100 days to get from our first case to our first 1 million cases. then to get from 1 million to 2 million cases took us 43 days. then to get from 2 million to 3 million cases, took us 28 days. now we're about to get to 3 million to 4 million cases in in only 14 days. why are we still accelerating, still so snowed under while others, even the tri-state region that were hit so badly, they brought this thing to heel. and there is an answer to that, obviously. there's the governance answer. we had no strategy and no basic governing competence and the president of the country and largely his party treated it like a hoax and a virus and they're still doing that, right. obvious governance and political answer, leadership answer. but there's an epidemiological explanation too. there's a mass explanation as to why our country has handled this

so badly and why it has worked out this way, where we're not done, where we're still getting worse, where other countries similarly situated are basically done with this now. there's a math explanation. and we learned about it right here on this show. we covered it almost four months ago whether we talked on this show to one of the world's most leading virus researchers who told us this is what would happen in the united states. that we had a simple choice to make. one which would end this fast and with less pain or one that would make it go on and on and on and on with tons of pain and death and a much larger death toll. he warned us about this four months ago. that those were our two choices. those were the two ways we could handle this. but we, of course, chose the latter. but we were warned. watch, this is from april 3rd. today dr. ho told us once again he's thinking about timing,

specifically the timing of all of these stay-at-home orders that are still being issued piecemeal and here and there across the country. dr. ho today sent us these elegant little graphs to demonstrate what happens when different localities shelter in place subsequently one after the other only when the virus gets demonstrably bad in their particular place, versus what happens when everybody everywhere shelters in place simultaneously and immediately. the difference is time. see how much sooner the pandemic is over for everyone if everyone everywhere shelters in place at once as soon as the virus begins to spread anywhere? that's the case he's making and he's in a position to know. dr. david ho is one of the world's most famous and influential virus researchers. he is right now working on a cure for coronavirus. just had a paper published in "nature" that has some very interesting news towards that end. he's been one of the most important contributors on earth

to the fight against aids. dr. david ho's breakthrough insights were significantly responsible for the change in the approach to that disease that led to hiv and aids becoming a chronic disease instead of a terminal one. he has been right on covid. he's been right on coronavirus, in simple and elegant terms from the very beginning in ways we should not have ignored at the time. it's painfully obvious now when we look at what he was warning us about and what we chose to do anyway. but tonight he's back here for the interview, and that's next. ♪ [ engines revving ] ♪ ♪ it's amazing to see them in the wild like th-- shhh. for those who were born to ride, there's progressive.

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it was the very beginning of april friday night, april 3rd, when one of the world's top infectious disease doctors, dr. david ho, showed us these graphs laying out the two paths we had to choose from in our response to the coronavirus outbreak in this country. and each line there, a different color line there is supposed to represent a different state in

the country. the first scenario was called simultaneous. showed what would happen if the whole country took simultaneous action, if the whole country basically shut down statement to get the virus under control, did it all at one. in that scenario the virus gets stamped out, with each state, less-hit states all parts of the country fighting the virus as a united front. scenario one, simultaneous action. the second scenario was called sequential. this shows what happened if every state shut down and reopened at their own pace, if we didn't fight the virus as one nation but instead did it as 50 different states, each one pursuing their own edge against the virus, when each one got demonstrably bad in that state. well, the consequential approach to that were clear in early april, they were clear to dr. david ho, the consequence of choosing a sequential approach, a 50-state strategy for the

virus would reduce -- would result in a prolonged epidemic, more infections, more death and look at what the time arrives at which this thing resolves. ultimately it would take us as a country much, much longer for us to get this thing under control after much more pain if we let all different parts of the country act on their own time frame instead of all acting at once. nevertheless, it's that second scenario that we chose. and it's the reason behind our sustained raging pandemic that just won't quit. dr. ho's prediction back in the first week of april about what a sequential response to the pandemic would look like was a devastating prediction. it ultimately turned out to be exactly right. imagine if we had listened to him then. imagine if we had followed that science. joining us now for the interview is dr. david ho, the scientific director and ceo of aaron diamond aids research center and leading the treatment for covid

vaccine. dr. ho, thank you very much for being here. thank you very much for taking time. >> hi, rachel. it's great to be back. >> i want to talk to you again about this idea of simultaneous versus sequential strategy to slow the spread of the virus. when we spoke back almost four months ago the government was just turning out to be a very sequential response, states doing their own timelines and we're living through the consequence of that strategy with a huge death toll and pandemic that just won't go away. can you explain a little bit more about the ramifications of not fighting this as a nation but rather as a group of states all doing their own thing on their own timelines? >> well, first of all, it's sad to see our country in the current state. the pandemic in the u.s. resembled that of a developing country.

most of the developed world has managed to get the virus under much, much better control. this is certainly very, very sad to see. i think this also exemplified the lack of the national strategy, the lack of leadership at the very top with a single determination to control this virus. instead we have all sorts of different strategies being employed in a country that is pretty much open for its citizens to move about and this is creating a situation where no single state can relax. as you mentioned, the tri-state area has brought the outbreak under pretty good control, but

it's constantly threatened by the mobility of the u.s. citizens. and so as a scientist working on this, it certainly is tragic the situation we have today. >> dr. ho, one of the reasons i wanted to talk to you about this tonight is because the clarity the hindsight affords us in terms of where we are now and your presentation that you gave us four months ago in terms of the consequences of that choice that we had to make. but i guess i have to ask if the advice still holds, if we should still now keep in mind this idea of there being more power in synchronous action, in doing things that apply to the country as a whole, or is it too late for that? should we have a national mask mandate? should we have national restrictions on mobility?

should we have other national uniform interventions now, or is this too far gone for us to consider that the same principle that should guide our actions? >> the best time to have a uniformed strategy was several months ago but the next best time is now, and i think we should treat this as a pandemic rather than a political debate. we need to act in concert throughout 50 states to bring this under control. otherwise, we will see this pandemic continue to spread and when fall comes, perhaps we will have a worsening of the situation. we need a single uniform strategy, as dr. fauci has been advocating for quite some time. we must do it now.

>> dr. ho, i know that you have new research where you and your team looking for therapeutics, looking for potential gateways to a vaccine on covid-19, some new research that's out today. can you stay with us to talk with us after the break? >> it certainly. >> dr. david ho, scientific director and ceo of the aaron diamond aids research center is our guest. we'll be right back after this. the sleep number 360 smart bed is on sale now. can it help keep us asleep? absolutely, it senses your movements and automatically adjusts to keep you both comfortable save up to $900 on select sleep number 360 smart beds. plus, 0% interest for 24 months on all smart beds. only for a limited time. if your adventure... keeps turning into unexpected bathroom trips. you may have overactive bladder, or oab.

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back with us for the interview is dr. david ho from the research center who has been right from the beginning about what it would take for the u.s. to mount a successful case against covid. thank you for being here tonight. i know your lab has just announced that you isolated antibodies from recovered coronavirus patients that could help in terms of developing a treatment and could also potentially help in preventing infection. can you just walk us through what you have found and what this new paper that you have

just published means for our hopes for a therapeutic here? >> yes. we just published in "nature" today online a paper describing our work involving five sars-covid-2 patients from whom we isolated over 250 antibodies. and a number of these are extremely powerful in neutralizing the virus. and in particular, we have 19 of them that are -- that have shown exquisite potency. they're not only potent but diverse in that they target different regions on the spike protein on the surface of the virus. and we think these antibodies are great candidates to develop

into potential therapies as well as potential prophylactic agents. >> dr. ho, i was interested to see, and i'm no scientist, but i was interested to see that you and your team found particularly potent antibodies among people that had been the most ill, people that had to be on mechanical intubation and had survived. it feels significant just from a human perspective that the people that had to go to the edge of death might have the most to offer us in terms of building a vaccine to keep the rest of us alive. >> yeah. at first glance, it may seem counter intuitive. you would -- you might expect that those who recover nicely from covid would have the best antibody responses. but that wasn't the case. it turns out the individuals who

had more virus for longer period of time stimulated the immune system to mount a more robust response. and, in fact, this is what we have seen previously with hiv-aids infection. so to us, it's reminiscent of what we have seen previously. and it's telling us that if you are going to do this type of work to isolate powerful antibodies, you have to focus on certain patients or if you are doing plasma therapy, you have to focus on the right cases in order to get the best antibodies for the application. >> yeah. as a layman, again, knowing that the people who go through the most hell may have the most to offer us, the rest of us scientifically, it's a meaningful thing. scientific director, thank you for your work, doctor. thank you for helping us understand. >> my pleasure, rachel.

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that just about does it for us tonight. i will tell you one thing i will be watching for in the morning tomorrow at 11:00 a.m. eastern time. question of whether he was locked back up in federal prison last week specifically to stop him from making public criticism of the president in the form of a book that he is working on. if the judge con clouds that he was improperly locked up to stop him from exercising his first amendment rights, it's possible that the judge could spring him and put him back out on the street, at least back out on home confinement tomorrow morning. so i'll be watching for that at 11:00 a.m. eastern. i'll see you again tomorrow night. now it is time for "the last word" the lawrence o'donnell. >> neal katyal will join us to talk about what's happening in portland what might be happening in chicago if federal agents are sent to chicago. and neal katyal has not said anything about this publ