stop the virus. >> reporter: for now a modified new normal as the school year begins. >> thank you, katie for that report. that does it for me this tuesday morning, i'm yasmin vossoughian. "morning joe" starts right now. under the dome of the u.s. capitol we have bid farewell to some of the greatest americans in our history. it is fitting that john lewis joins this pantheon of patriots resting upon the same catapult of president abraham lincoln. john lewis became a titan of the civil rights movement and then the conscience of the congress. here in congress john was revered and beloved on both sides of the aisle, on both sides of the capitol. we knew that he always worked on the side of the angels and now we know he is with them. >> even though the world around him gave him every cause for bit

erness, he treated everyone with respect and love. all so that as his friend dr. king once put it, we could build a community at peace with itself. today, we pray and trust that this peacemaker himself now rests in peace. >> do you plan on going to show respect to congressman lewis either today or tomorrow at the capitol? >> no, i won't be going. no. >> good morning, and welcome to "morning joe." it is tuesday, july 28th. along with joe, willie and me. we have white house reporter for the associated press jonathan lemire. columnist and editor of "the washington post" eugene robinson. and historian, john meacham, the author of the forthcoming

biography of john lewis, entitled, "his truth is marching on" which accomplishes in october. >> john meacham, obviously as nancy said, john lewis was considered the conscience of congress. he also was a christian who was christ like. you look at the attitudes and so many of them apply to the life day in and day out for those of us who knew and loved john up close, those of us who only knew him from his public image, this was a man who always understood blessed are the meek, blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness. blessed are the peacemakers.

john, he was all of that and so much more. and how fitting that he was remembered the way he was yesterday in washington d.c. >> you know, the secular and the sacred intersect in the rotunda at moments like that. and lewis was, in fact, i believe, a genuine saint in the classic new testament sense of the term. a man who was willing to die, to suffer for that vision, joe, you quote from jesus. he heard the gospel in troy, alabama as a young child. his life in troy was so complicated and so difficult that, actually, families weren't expected to go to church every week. that was considered too much of a burden. it was every other week. and they would go from one

church to the other. the bible was the main book in the house, until he discovered biographies of great black americans in school. and he lived that gospel in a way that i certainly can't think of another american offhand, certainly of our time, who ever has. and i also believe that what we saw yesterday and what we'll see over the next couple of days is the burial of a war hero. not every war hero faces fire abroad. he faced fire in the states you and i call home. and what we see there in that rotun rotunda, where eisenhower and lincoln and grant and jefferson and washington and king and reagan, is a man who served the cause of the nation and the cause of liberty nonviolently,

consistently, and in a way that offers a life of exemplary vir which y -- virtue. and the reason it's so powerful, we knew him. this is not a stained glass figure. this is someone you served with, everyone there knew so well. and he told the old story because he wanted the story to remain ever new. >> and, you know, willie geist, i was moved by what -- by john's description of him as a war hero. because he did fight a war. he fought a war in the region where john and i was raised. and he was the perfecter, as hanna nicole jones said, he was

the perfecter, along with other civil rights heroes, of the promises that were made at the founding of this republic. that we, as a country, did not fulfill. and he, john lewis, along with so many other civil rights heroes throughout the ages, were the ones that said, okay. this is the promise that has been made to us. all men are created equal. with certain inalienable rights. and that promise -- that promise has been given to us. we're going to fulfill it. and that's what john lewis has done. and because of john lewis, and others like john lewis, we stand and our children stand and future generations stand on the

shoulders of this giant. >> amen. and there was so many moments over the last two or three days that almost made you have to stop and catch your breath because they're so emotional and heavy. and among them two days ago when his body crossed the edmund pettus bridge. and 55 years later were alabama state troopers were in 1965, when he was 25, he was beaten by state troopers. that day, on sunday, he was saluted. so there you have it. there's the scope of his life, the scope of his work, the scope of american history. gene robinson, i thought yesterday watching the beautiful service they had in the rotunda and looking at the shot from atop, looking down on his casket is almost the way i feel watching a d-day ceremony these days where you look into the faces of these men and think

about the sacrifices and say we're losing something in this country in a generation of men and women who revolutionized our country, made it better, and john lewis certainly is in that category. >> it was almost another founding of this country as the civil war was the second founding, the civil rights movement was yet another founding of this country to bring it closer to its stated ideals. it was incredibly moving, i thought, yesterday. and i think the war metaphor is absolutely right. but he went into battle armed only with principle and faith. those were his weapons. when i think of his life story and what he accomplished and what he did, i am always in awe

of the courage it took to go into battle -- literally into battle knowing he would be attacked, knowing he would be beaten with a determination not to fight back. not to strike back in anger. it's something that i couldn't do. most of us couldn't do. it was extraordinary man among extraordinary men and women. who took on this crusade and who changed the nation. and in many ways changed the world. it was an incredible life, one that we continue to celebrate this week. but yesterday at the capitol was particularly moving for me. especially seeing him among the colleagues and realizing how few of them are left.

he was the last of the speakers at the march on washington in 1963 to pass away. and we are losing that generation. but we can't lose them without fully recognizing and celebrating their monumental achievement. it was just an incredible, incredible thing that they did. >> all right. we will continue to follow the legacy of john lewis that last ride across the bridge, joe, with the state troopers saluting him, instead of beating him, shows that we at least need to show -- know still how to show our growth and respect, and do things symbolically well compared to what is happening in washington and the way the president treated the passing of

john lewis, which was as if nothing had happened. it's very sad parallel, but a beautiful good-bye on capitol hill and at the edmund pettus bridge. and we're seeing a reflection of that parallel, of what's happening, in politics. in the latest new look at battleground polls that shows joe biden gaining ground on president trump or expanding his lead in several states. the new morning consult poll shows that nationally joe biden leads president trump by eight points, 51% to 43%. and here's a look at some of the key states. in all of them, note the movement since may. in arizona biden sits ahead of president trump by seven. a nine-point swing. in colorado by 13 points. in florida he's up by three. trump had been up by one in may. in georgia, biden and trump

remain statistically tied. in michigan biden increases his lead to ten points. this poll has minnesota tightening. another poll we showed you late last week had biden up double digits. this morning, the morning consult poll has north carolina now tied, wiping away trump's three point lead from may. ohio has tightened with trump's margin by three points. in pennsylvania biden's lead by seven. in texas, biden is up by 2 points. so joe, biden doing well. i wonder then how trump reacts. because as biden goes up in the poll, i worry he goes down in terms of his reaction, his behavior. his racial sort of pushing the

boundaries. using race and budgigotry. >> you go through the numbers, arizona biden plus seven, colorado biden plus 13, florida tighter, biden plus three. georgia basically within the margin of error. michigan plus eight. minnesota plus three. but, of course, we saw a poll last week that had that in double digits. north carolina tie. we had a poll the other day showing biden up seven there. pennsylvania, biden plus seven. texas biden plus two, within the margin of error. wisconsin plus seven. these obviously taken together are disastrous results for donald trump. and it is early, but it is not as early as it once was. and jonathan lemire it seems from everything i'm reading and

i hope you have reporting for us on this count but everything i'm seeing we're paying attention to what's happening in portland, around that federal courthouse in portland, the chaos there and people thinking this is where donald trump is hitching his wagon, hoping that's going to carry him over the finish line. and yet he sees the law and order numbers and sees this really isn't moving the needle. from what you've reported, from what i'm hearing, it all comes down to the fact that he knows that this country has to turn the corner on this pandemic or his presidential race is doomed. what can you tell us about yesterday's event? >> joe, i'll start with adding to the conversation about congressman lewis, i was on the lawn when we asked if the president was going to attend to pay his respects to the congressman lying in state at the capitol, and he said no. that took aides by surprise

because there had been discussions about the president going over there at some point today, they thought that might be something he would want to do. we should note that vice president pence, who served with congressman lewis in the house, did go over there yesterday. >> did they provide any explanation why he is, in fact, doing something that no other president would do? republican or democrat alike. you heard mitch mcconnell offering glowing words to john lewis. why would the president be so obat t obcity innocent about going over to see a civil rights hero? i know he's been playing the race card aggressively. does he think going to see a civil rights hero, an american saint, does he think that would hurt him with white voters? >> publicly aids are saying it's the president's decision.

privately they feel the president is too mindful of that, the signal he might be sending to white voters. and also it's someone with whom he feuded before. we know how he holds grudges. he did the same when senator mccain died, he did not pay his respects in any public way then either. he had to be convinced to put the flag at half mast at the white house when james mattmcca. for john lewis, it was put at half mast but only half a day. you're right, there's a growing recognition among his advisers, they're going to lean into the cultural efforts, the preservations of the statues, confederate bases and the real push of law and order using federal troops in the cities, most notably portland. it's part of a piece, a signal to white and suburban voters, the same ones he's trying to

court there, we've seen out of the 1950s, a message to white families about black and brown families moving to the suburbs. to this point the polling has not suggested that's working. so therefore we return to the pandemic and how he is handling it. and to this point he's receiving a failing grade from the voters of this country. yesterday he was in north carolina. there's a real effort here to push forth and put a lot of money into the vaccine development, suggesting that both the vaccine could be manufactured while the distribution mechanism is worked on at the same time, to try to speed it up. in part because they know in the trajectory of the race he is loosing and he'll need, his aides believe, an october surprise. something big from the outside to change the game. maybe that's a stumble by his

opponent, joe biden, who we should also note paid tribute to john lewis yesterday. or more likely they feel they need to put their eggs in the basket of a vaccine. that it's developed or close to give hope to voters and also so the president could take credit for it. though would that be enough credit to overcome the months of mistakes he's made handling the pandemic? >> the president in terms of handling the pandemic again spreading disinformation about coronavirus. last night he retweeted a video of a group of white people in lab coats calling themselves front line doctors spreading fake claims. one of the speakers identified herself as a doctor promoted the drug, hydroxychloroquine, as a, quote, cure while also claiming, quote, you don't need a mask. twitter since has removed the video but not before it went viral. the fda revoked the drug's

emergency use authorization last month saying the potential benefits are not worth the risk. the president has promoted the drug aggressively and claims to have used it himself. he also retweeted a post of steve bannon's podcast that accused dr. fauci of lying to the public by dismissing hydroxychloroquine. this is for all those who made comment about, quote, the president's change in tone last week. here now he's tweeting about false cures and doctors saying don't wear masks. yesterday also i point out joe in north carolina, president trump said it's time for these governors to reopen their states. based on no new information -- >> no new information. >> -- as coronavirus continues to explode. >> no. >> everyone learns, and we know this, he is a day trader.

but it's just absolutely staggering that the president of the united states -- not staggering. it should be staggering. it is no longer staggering that the president of the united states actually pushes out a conspiracy theory video that tells people not to wear masks. that pushes a drug that several studies have shown is not effective, that his own government has actually said could cause heart problems and to avoid taking it as a way to mitigate the effects of hydroxychloroquine. and john meacham, we have seen the impact of this across the country. we have seen the impact of donald trump telling everybody at first this was a hoax whipped up by the media, this was one person coming in from china, it

was going to go away. it was 15 people coming in that had it. that was going to go away. that it would magically disappear by april. when things warmed up it would magically go away. started talking about disinfectants, putting uv lights in people, hydroxychloroquine even after his own fda and his own cdc and dr. fauci warned against it. but what's staggering to me is 150,000 people are dead. well beyond two vietnams. well beyond even the number of combat deaths and total deaths in world war i. and there are still people out there, like the president of the united states, like sin claire broadcasting, who were actually pushing conspiracy theories. saying dr. fauci -- that dr. fauci started --

>> what is that? >> -- this pandemic to make billions of dollars. or, in donald trump's case, retweeting a video of doctors at a fphony press conference. we think it's a phony press conference. twitter took it down. saying don't wear a mask. this is surreal. i could ask you what the historical parallel was, but i mean, do we have to go back to the salem witch trials for people so moved by superstition that they ignore medical advice? they ignore scientific advice, and they ignore the caskets of 150,000 fellow americans going to the cemetery or being crem e cremated. >> it's riveting, right, and if it weren't happening, it would be interestingly fascinating.

because this is the great triumph of fear over fact. right. that's the big thing that's unfolded. not only the numbers you said, 150,000 more than 4 million cases. but 50 million americans at least are out of work. this is depression level joblessness. the hopelessness, the anxiety, the sense of a lack of direction is pervasive. i think that's a significant part of what's driving the presidential polls you were talking about. but one of the things we have to figure out is we have two bigotry bbig tri bow tears of american life, we have john lewis and the work of the civil rights movement, and the 1960s, gene mention another founding. absolute lily right. we live in the country that 1965

brought about because of the voting act and the immigration act of that year. but then we have a president of the united states who has embraced superstition and prejudice and the worst parts of the american character as a reaction to that country. and so, we have a very clear choice here. politics doesn't often do this. politicians always say it does, right, i'm sure you didn't, but most politicians say, this is the most important election since x or y, if you don't elect me to the school board, everyone is going to be ignorant forever. if you don't make me president, the country is going to fall into an abyss. this is pretty much that. i don't think you can be too hyper bo hyper boll hyper bollic about the stakes of the election. it's about what joe biden and donald trump represent. joe biden is a figure out of

1965. he wants a great society, wants to sign big legislation. that may terrify some people but it helped the country in many ways and you have to be smart about it. donald trump wants it to be 1955. right. he wants a reaction to this changing demographic reality. and what i would suggest to everyone, particularly to lawmakers who may find themselves in a position if trump tries something with the election of having to actually take a stand again is think about what happened yesterday in the rotunda. was that a ceremony about someone who wanted to defy fact? was that a ceremony about someone who wanted to segregate america? who wanted to keep us apart and point fingers? no. the man the country is honoring, the man history is honoring, is somebody who was about opening

themselves up and being smart. it's a very clear choice. >> yeah. it is a clear choice. and willie, john talked about the triumph of fear with the conspiracy theories that spread. and earlier jonathan lemire was saying the president of the united states was banking on a vaccine as an october surprise. there's a clash of two forces because several people i've spoken with over the past month or so that are trump supporters, as i talk and try to stay away from politics and instead ask, how's your family doing? how are you getting through the pandemic? everything going okay? it always ends, let's hope we

can get a vaccine soon so we can go back to our normal lives. far too many of those people i speak to, i'm not taking the vacci vaccine. are you going to let your children take the vaccine? so the anti-vaxer, anti-science movement that donald trump has exbraced is going to -- embraced is going to cut against if he thinks this is his october surprise. he has to convince people he's not part of a greater conspiracy because of anti-vaxers that follow it. and the lies about dr. fauci that he's in it to make money and he killed people in the aids epidemic and he's going to push out a vaccine because it's going to make him and the george

soros' of the world billions of dollars. these lies are going to have to be dealt with if donald trump wants the vaccine. because the age of ignorance, fear that he has rush erred in, that has a lot of his strongest supporters skeptical of any vaccine. >> i'll steal a line from dr. ja, who's on our show quite a bit, vaccines don't save people, vaccinations do. it's great to get a vaccine, but if millions of americans don't get the vaccine, it doesn't mean anything because we have millions walking around not vaccinated and could be carrying the virus. all the garbage you've been talking about on the internet, that's been there for years, on major platforms like we saw yesterday, not in a dark corner

of the internet. it comes to a head here. do people trust the government or a corporation making a vaccine that could save the country, the world, or do they fall back on what they read on facebook saying i'm not taking that because i don't believe on vaccinations because i heard dr. fauci is making a billion dollars off that stuff, and people read it and believe it and internalize it and it has real world implications. >> before we go to break, just to put a pin on the reason why trump doesn't show up at the funerals of great men like john mccain, elijah cummings or john lewis, he's jealous. he can't handle it. it's impossible for him. he can't do it, that's a big lack we've seen throughout his leadership, empathy, as well as the inability really to rise up and see the greatness of someone else. john meacham, thank you very much. still ahead on "morning

joe." we touched on portland but there's new information that the trump administration is reportedly sending new federal agents to the area. we'll have the latest on the growing unrest there. plus our next guest is a medical expert in miami who says florida's coronavirus outbreak likely won't be improving any time soon. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. right back. ♪ ♪ growing unrest there. growing unrest there ♪ the open road is open again. and wherever you're headed, choice hotels is there. book direct at choicehotels.com. ♪

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dugout has been tossed. remember it was dyson who had words with the home plate umpire and it may be the manager. part of the argument is you have to put on your mask and stay socially distanced. you can't ghetto-to-toe et toe- these arguments. >> a little difference in the way sweet lou did it and this year. maybe the red sox end up 1 and 3, or 1 and 4. >> you can go down the list, they wouldn't do well. the pirates manager got thoun thrown out of the game. he walks up the steps, pulls up his mask and the umpire pulls out his mask. major league baseball will postpone two games after several

members of the marlins test positive for the coronavirus. it affects their home opener. the change was announced after eight players and two coaches tested positive for covid-19. in addition to the four players who tested positive over the weekend when the marlins played the phillies. the marlins are currently quarantined in philadelphia. so this is what we feared. this is what we maybe expected to happen. we just hope they can isolate the marlins and this doesn't become something that ends the season. they made it through one weekend in major league baseball. you see the ripples of one group of players and coaches getting coronavirus, go out to the next team, the team coming to down, the team that played previously, the city they were. so this is a very difficult situation for any sports league

to manage. baseball stepped out first and we're seeing the challenges in front of us. >> and the challenges of playing without the bubble the nba has. put a bubble around and you make people stay inside that bubble if they want to play the sport, that's something that major league baseball was not able to do. it's obviously causing problems. but this is a reminder and sometimes we forget because so many people have been responsible, sheltered in place, kept their families at home, stayed away from having contact with a lot of different people. here you have the baseball players free to play baseball but then go home and go wherever they want to go, and we are seeing again, as if we needed a reminder, of how contagious covid-19 is. speaking of that, the president's national security adviser has covid -- >> can you believe that? >> -- and we hear right now that herman cane is on oxygen about a month after going to that tulsa

event. our prayers and our thoughts are certainly with him. >> absolutely. >> but this is, as one person after another who gets this disease who is a skeptic says, take it seriously. as i was talking about yesterday, there is a 27-year-old kid, an athlete, the red sox's best pitcher who has covid-19, thought he was going to recover and comeback. now he's suffering from a heart ailment. this is dangerous. take it seriously, ignore the idiots, the fools, and the snake oil salesmen who are telling you that it's much a do about nothing. >> joining us dr. nadia, also with us, professor of clinical medicine at the university of miami, dr. erin marcus.

she has an op-ed in "the washington post" entitled, "i'm a doctor in miami. here's how i know florida's covid-19 outbreak won't improve anymore soon". let's start right there, dr. marcus, because florida obviously a hot spot, the numbers globally significant. we stand out in the world in florida in terms of how bad this is, in terms of children returning to school and the numbers not improving, what can you tell us? >> well, it's exhausting for the physicians and the nurses and the respiratory therapists, and all of the important staff at the hospital who have been involved with taking care of covid patients. we're really concerned about, you know, our man power and people are exhausted. and we're -- it's a very scary

condition the patients come in, they are very scared. they can't be with family when they're in the hospital. they're scared about what's going to happen. it's also just a scary sensation to feel that you can't breathe. so, you know, we're concerned and we're swamped. i'm a little bit protected in that i'm working in a primary care clinic. i did my inpatient back in june when it wasn't bad. and there, actually, we are quite protected. ironically i feel safer at work where everybody is taking precautions, everybody is masked, wearing their mask appropriately and socially distanced, than i do when i go out to the bank or the post office where i may see somebody's nose sticking out over their mask or wearing a mask that has a plastic valve on it that allows you to -- allows

your exhalation to escape the mask. which is great for construction but not -- or for doing things around the house but not so great when you're trying to use for public health purpose of protecting others. >> so, doctor, talk to me about staffing shortages, what you're hearing about that, and also where you think this is heading, because florida is beyond frightening. can it get worse? >> thank you for having me again. i think generally what dr. marcus just mentioned, our doctors, nurses, hospital staff, they're tired, exhausted, and they're really being worked to the core at this point in the epidemic. what we're seeing now in terms of the epidemiology is increases in cases in many parts of the southern united states, including places like kentucky, tennessee, mississippi. where our numbers are

actually -- numbers of cases are actually increasing week by week. and this is really quite concerning. it speaks to the need for continued staffing of our hospitals, continued staffing of our icus, making sure that we have enough ventilators and beds. this is not something that's going to go away any time soon, unfortunately. i feel like a broken record saying that because we've been saying it since the spring. but this needs a concerted national effort to get this under control. >> dr. marcus, it's willie geist, as a public health expert, as a doctor, what would you like to see from the governor in the state of florida? what type of action would you like to see from the citizens in florida? as you write in your washington post piece, this was a sense in many states once the numbers came down in new york where the crisis was accuse in march and april people let their guard down. what needs to happen on the

policy level from the governor's mansion in the state of florida? >> on the policy level there's a few things. one, we need roll modeling from the highest levels, that goes to the federal leadership also. remember, you're trying to get the population, an extremely diverse population with many different beliefs, sets of understanding about health and science, you're trying to get people to make, you know, a major behavioral change in a very short period of time. and remember, there were some conflicting messages that went out initially when there was concern about the availability of medical masks. but we want the whole population to be wearing masks appropriately. and we need role modelling from the elected officials at the top, across all levels. the other thing that we really,

really need is faster testing and more testing. i know that some testing centers have opened up in miami-dade. but if a person goes, waits hours to get a test, gets the test and then doesn't get the results for a week, you know, that's a week where they -- most likely they probably haven't isolated themselves and exposed more people. and then we also need more contact tracing and more resources put into our department of health and into our public health service. >> these are all things that are happening in real-time in florida, there are people who can't get their results back in a decent amount of time. sometimes a week. which causes, obviously, the virus to spread. these are all the things happening in florida as the numbers are shooting up. so what are your thoughts on -- there are some schools that are

having children come back. what are your thoughts on that? >> yeah, i just want to echo dr. marcus' comment, about the need for rapid testing and rapid test results. i honestly belief that is likely what might be to blame with regards to the issues they're having in the mlb with players getting sick is that the results are not being returned fast enough for people to respond to them appropriately. i think with regard to schools we need to be mindful about social distancing in the classroom, that's very difficult for young kids. but we really need to be careful about the number of kids we have classrooms, whether or not there's proper ventilation in classrooms. whether or not teachers and staff can actually protect themselves. we have seen cases where children can transmit, although the severity of the disease in children has been less than that in adults we need to be mindful

about precautions we're able to take in school settings. i think this also comes back to a topic you guys were discussing earlier, which is trust in the science and the scientists and the scientific community. i think it's really time for our leaders, or political leaders to trust the scientists, put them in the spotlight and have them relay proper scientific information at this time. i think that has, in the past, unfortunately eroded the trust in science and could potentially erode the trust in really potentially vaccines that may be in our future. >> doctors, thank you both for being on the show this morning. >> and jonathan lemire, tell us what you know about national security advisor o'brien testing positive for covid-19. >> that's right. it's the latest example of the reach of this virus. you were talking a few moments

ago about major league baseball, players tested every other day and people are still contracting it. here, where the white house, where everyone in the building who's going to have access to the president is tested every day. reporters, including myself, who will be in the press pool are tested every day. robert o'brien, the national security advisor, tested positive in previous days they believe he contracted it from his daughter who's also covid-19 positive. his symptoms are described as mild, he's working from home. but first, he did return from a trip to europe where he met with other official gs from other nations. he was seen not wearing a mask, not socially distancing. secondly, the president yesterday we asked when was the last time he had seen o'brien, wondering if the president had

been exposed. the president said he couldn't remember but it had been several days. which points to the fact, the national security advisor has some of the top access to the president of the united states of anyone in the west wing yet the president said he had not seen o'brien in several days, couldn't remember it. that's not how other administrations would have worked but it's reflective how this president is not, perhaps, listening to people around him, including his national security advisor who's expected to be out sick, working from home for several more days. >> jonathan lemire, thank you. joe, you remember my father talking about being in the president's office every morning. >> every day. >> can you imagine not talking to your national security advisor for, i don't know, it might have been several days? >> no. no. of course your father made sure that jimmy carter -- poor jimmy carter had to talk to him several times a day. >> that's quite right. >> i'm sure he's insistent on

the face time and jimmy carter was like seriously. >> they had a meeting for a reason every day. >> mika knows -- >> i know what you're getting at. i had a meeting with my dad every day, too. >> you have a president who doesn't read his national security briefings, his intel briefings, doesn't get briefed by experts. >> what a joke. >> everybody that i talked to that's interacted with this administration, be they foreign diplomats or people in d.c., people part of the republican foreign policy establishment say he doesn't listen to advisers, he doesn't take regular briefings. you remember, willie, early on when his secretary of state infamously called him a certain kind of moron, that came out of

donald trump becoming enraged because the secretary of defense had sat and literally given him nothing more than a history lesson from 1945 forward. a post-war history lesson to explain why things had evolved the way they had. why we had nato, why we responded the way we did to historical events. and the president became enraged, jumped up, started screaming at generals and wanted to create, as he always does, his own reality. that's why he doesn't want to listen to national security advisers, to intel officers. who does he halisten to? well, we have jonathan lemire who just left -- >> sure doesn't read.

>> -- in helsinki asked whether he believed america's own intel community or vladimir putin, and donald trump said vladimir putin, he had no reason to lie. that's who donald trump listens to. his national intelligence community, willie, here we are, over a month since we have learned that the intel community had been begging him for some time, his own staff had been begging him since march to take some action on vladimir putin putting bounties on the heads of young american heroes. and yet donald trump still has said nothing and said he trusts vladimir putin instead of his own intel community. >> i'm glad you brought that up because he was asked about it yesterday as you walked out on the lawn, did you raise on the phone call last week with president putin, the american intelligence agencies relaying to you that the the gru put out bounties on american soldiers in

afghanistan. he said, we don't discuss what we talked about on the call. the white house last week put out a read out of the call. noticeably not on the readout was any conversation about that alleg alleged bounty program on american troops in afghanistan. so the president says i'm not going to discuss the call, clearly he did not confront vladimir putin about that story. >> coming up it's been long awaited and repeatedly delayed, but this morning attorney general william barr will finally testify before lawmakers on capitol hill. and he's expected to take on democrats. that's next on "morning joe." i haven't seen him lately. i heard he tested -- yeah. i have not seen him. i don't know. ot n seen him. i don't know 11:05 endless-ordes migraine medicine ubrelvy for anytime, anywhere migraine strikes without worrying if it's too late or where you happen to be. one dose of ubrelvy can quickly stop a migraine in its tracks

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a live look at the white house. gene robinson your latest piece for "the washington post" entitled "republicans long-term vote heist matters more than trump's tantrums" you write, don't waste time and energy fretting over president trump's self-important threat not to accept a defeat in november. worry instead that he and the republican party will try to steal the election through a multi-facetted campaign of voter suppression. for more than a decade the gop's consistent strategy has been to identify citizens who tend to vote for democrats and deny them the right or the opportunity to vote. the covid-19 pandemic provides a new opening for republican attempts at voter suppression. in the april 7th primary in wisconsin, the city of milwaukee with a population of nearly 600,000 managed to staff and run just five in-person voting sites. yet turnout was still high,

roughly 80% of those who participated did so by casting absentee ballots. that's why trump is squawking so loudly and untruthfully about purported fraud in mail-in and absentee balloting. and why garn teeing a fair voting process will be the exception rather than the rule is the task that lies ahead for the democratic party at all levels. >> gene -- >> this has to go well. >> it does. but gene, we can just look to what's happened over the past couple months, not in states that republicans ran, but let's talk about new york state. andrew cuomo's state carolyn maloney there's an article in the paper today, still doesn't know whether she's been re-elected or not. there were small local raises in new york state that took a month

to resolve. and they still haven't figured out a congressional race. there are going to be 435 of those in the fall add on top of that all the senate races and the presidential race and suddenly there is reason to fear we may go into the new year not knowing who the next president of the united states is. >> well, let's hope we don't make it that far, but it's going to be a mess. it's going to be messy. it's not going to be a normal election night we get a winner and there's a victory speech and a concession and it's all over. unless, of course, it's such a massive wave and that wave really could only go in one direction, against president trump and against the republicans, that's the only massive wave that's potentially building out there. but unless that happens, it's

going to be a mess. so let's get into that mindset, get prepare for the mess. let's startm minimizing that mes to the extent we can. and let's worry about that rather than -- it's not really one tlaeelection, it's 51 elect, all 50 states and the district of columbia, they're going to certify their results and it's not for president trump to say i accept them or i don't. he doesn't have that power of the constitution. the states will certify the election results and then the electoral college will meet and vote and that will be that. we will have a president and -- one hopes we'll have a new one, but we'll have a president. but it's going to take time and it's going to be different and we need to start thinking ahead to how we're going to manage that process and make sure everybody can vote.

that's the -- that's -- you know, that's what has to happen in order for this to be a fair and legitimate election. there's no reason we can't do that because there are -- because state election officials, in general, want that to happen. they want to run elections the right way, whether they're republicans or democrats. >> gene, thank you so much. now to the concerns about another violent escalation in portland. amid the federal crackdown there, "the washington post" says it has reviewed an internal memo that shows the trump administration decided last week to send at least 100 additional federal agents to portland. senior officials tell the post that the administration is considering a plan to send an additional 50 i.c.e. agents to the city. the federal presence has intensified the anger of

protesters, sparking brutal clashes and other protests in other cities. portland's mayor is calling for a meeting with the department of homeland security to discuss a cease-fire and removal of forces from portland. president trump tweeted about it several times yesterday including threats of prison time for what he called anarchists and advocators. elizabeth dela vega tweeted this, portland protesters could really mess with trump, his plans and his mind, by staging massive peaceful protests against trump away from federal property, outside of federal jurisdiction. here's perspective from the agents. one deputy marshall who's been protecting the courthouse said, quote, it's scary. you open the doors and the crowd is shaking the fence and on the

other side of the fence is people that want to kill you because of the job we chose to do. he says, quote, i can't walk outside without being in fear of my life. another official said this, you see a lot of commentary on social media they're wearing protective gear so it's not going to hurt them. i'll put the same protective gear on you and throw a brick at your head and you tell me if you feel comfortable with that. we have a small village with us -- >> sometimes it takes a village. >> peter baker, professor jason johnson. msnbc contributor and author, charl charl charlie psychs. yamiche al cinder. and former u.s. attorney for the northern district of alabama, joyce vance. great to have you all on board.

joe, there is a fine line here. protesters need to protest peacefully and stay off federal property. >> if you listen to what the head of the n aaacp in portland said they need to keep it focused on george floyd's life. reverend al said the same thing yesterday. other leaders have been saying let's make these protests about george floyd, not about violence, about anarchists, outside agitators. but joyce vance, the images that we saw in the beginning when the national media started covering portland were frightening, where unmarked officers would scoop up people off the streets, throw them into unmarked cars without probable cause and whisk them away for interrogation. that's something you would expect to see, you know, out of turkey or out of russia.

a lot of the images we've been seeing over the past week show protesters crowding around the federal courthouse trying to knock down steel reinforced fences while you have the federal troops, i guess you call it, behind that, shooting fireworks in there, breaking windows, breaking glass, starting fires. and i thought it was interesting. you referenced elizabeth de la vega's tweet saying, listen, if you want to get at donald trump, move away from the federal courthouse. can you explain, joyce, how donald trump's jurisdiction does not extend to other parts of portland. he has jurisdiction that the supreme court would hold up as long as there is deemed a threat to the federal courthouse. but if they move away from the federal courthouse and peacefully protest, then no court in the land is going to

allow them to sweep through the city streets. >> that's exactly right, joe. the federal jurisdiction to be involved here stems from the federal government's authority to protect federal buildings or federal property. so if protests weren't centered on a federal courthouse. say they were held near a church or a state owned park. the federal government would have a far less compelling reason to send troops to portland and certainly send in troops without the approval of local officials. there's context here that's helpful because the federal government hasn't always been so concerned about protesters and federal property. in oregon, you'll recall the 41-day standoff led by amon bundy, by a group of oregon ranchers protesting the arrests of a father and son, the hammonds, who will be involved in illegal hunting on federal

lanes and setting a fire that went to federal lands. and ultimately president trump gave a pardon to the hammonds, the father and son involved in that action on federal land. this appears to be a pretext, a use of a few in the protest crowds, who are engaging in violence. if the protesters move away from federal land they remove any possible justification for federal action and will relieve i think many of the federal officers who are in a bad position being forced in between their leadership on the one hand and protesters on the other. >> jason johnson, let me ask you about what we're seeing in portland and who we're seeing in portland right now. our affiliate station kgw talked to a professor, dr. shirlly

jackson, she said i'm going to use the word many people are using, it seems the movement that existed now has been hijacked and she worries the black lives matter movement, the peaceful movement, is hijacked by people who have other intentions. what do you see when you look at the streets of portland? >> i have seen it live. i have former students out there protesting right now. it's important for the nation to understand there are lots of different groups there, there's row city justice, the youth city movement, members of antifa there. we saw it with the beginning of the george floyd protest, everyone gets conflated together and you have different groups with different motivations there. that's what's important for everyone to understand it's not just one group of people. a lot of protesters go home by curfew and who's out there late at night, those are

organizations who have a different agenda than talking about black lives. >> jason you're right. you read some of the accounts in the associated press and you have people running around constantly flashing lasers from beyond the fence into the eyes of the federal officers trying to cause damage there. shooting fireworks in, trying to break windows, trying to set the buildings on fire. those aren't people that are marching peacefully for george floyd. those also sound like people i've seen over the past 25 years that also show up at environmental protests -- >> yes. >> -- in seattle and in portland. >> yes. >> people who show up to protest the world trade organization. these people show up i mean, at just about every protest and often are the ones that are violent using these type of tactics. >> joe, you're exactly right. i saw these people in ferguson. i remember standing with a crowd in front of the police department in ferguson.

there was a guy back there throwing molotov cocktails and the protest es are like he's not with us. he's not with us. i saw it marching with students in baltimore. there are people driving around handing out bricks. so we have to make a distinction between agent pro vok or thes, who have their own agenda and those speaking about criminal justice reform, police brutality and issues about how the criminal justice system oppresses and abuses people of color in america. >> as joyce vance suggested, let's hope those people that are protesting about policing, protesting about the death of george floyd, protesting about the need to move this country forward in the areas of racial justice, that they do that away from the federal courthouse. they do that somewhere else, where donald trump won't have

the ecckxcuse and william barr won't have the excuse to chase them in front of a state park. that will verify quickly who's there to cause chaos, who's an anarchist and instead who's marching and working and dedicating their lives to promoting racial justice. peter baker, it's interesting, we saw donald trump on june the 1st break up a group of peaceful protesters so he could hold up a bible awkwardly in front of st. john's church. that didn't work for him. his poll numbers actually collapsed. we may look at that point as when his numbers really started to go down. but even now with the confrontation in portland. look at the abc news, "the washington post" poll and donald trump is less trusted when it

comes to crime and safety by nine points. you go into that poll, white women, white educated voters with college degrees, suburb suburbanites, people over 65, all the -- the demographics that used to be the bedrock of the republican party that i belong to, are all now supporting joe biden on the issue of law and order. despite this show that donald trump has been putting on over the past month. >> i think you're right, joe, the number to look at is age 65 and older category that has been a bedrock of his constituency over the years. he has begun to lose them first because of the coronavirus and now they're not with him on the crime issue, the streets issue. he's been playing to them with the campaign aired an online ad

with an elderly lady at home, her house being busted in, she calls the police they're not there because of defunding the police. frightening ad but it doesn't seem to have turned people back to the president's campaign. the campaign is positive this will have traction. law enforcement and order is something that matters to his base to a lot of americans who see these pictures. they don't make the distinction that jason was talking about between provok tors and peaceful protesters. when the president talks about them, they're all anarchists. and the pictures of violence in the street are what he wants because that's what will fit into his narrative right now. he has made a point of castigating the media for not showing more of those pictures, doing more to cover what he is saying is the lawlessness in

portland. we're in a position that it hasn't gained traction but the campaign is going to give it, i think its all in the next couple weeks to push the issue out there and we'll see if it has a greater salience by fall. >> charlie sykes we look to past elections, a lot of people looking at 1968, the last time there was this unrest in the streets of america. but as i see the scenes of chaos, i remember in richard ben chamber's book, it was hubert humphrey because he was looking down from his hotel window horrified at the protests at the democratic convention asking why they couldn't just go away because he was afraid they would attach it to the administration he was part of. when people see chaos in the

streets, doesn't that just add to the wrong track numbers for donald trump? it seems to me it's at the very least a double edge sword for the trump administration that this sort of chaos is breaking out with a president in the white house who refuses to even attend a ceremony for john lewis, a civil rights legend that unites everybody. >> by the way, that was extraordinary the way the president said, no, i'm not going. >> awful. >> of course this is a double edged sword. but i think people need to understand -- i was in chicago for the 1968 democratic convention but a lot of the trump folks are thinking of it in terms of the 1972 campaign as well where you did have the weaponization by an incumbent of violence. i think jason's point is very important to stress that to a

certain extent, these protests have been hijacked by people providing donald trump with exactly the kind of viral video material that he needs to turn this around. and yeah, it's not working for him in the polls but look at that suburban number. it's only a four-point edge, 48, 44, biden over trump. that's one of the core audiences for the trump folks. every time you show a video of the american flag being burned or people attacking federal officers, understand you have the trump campaign that's going to weaponize that to get the suburban vote back. i do think again make the d distinctions it's very important. to the extent you can separate the peaceful protest rs and the george floyd protesters, it's very important. otherwise you play into donald trump's hand. >> yamiche we showed earlier in the show the morning consult

polls that showed joe biden in almost every state in the last couple months making up significant ground or widening his need and turning some states into battleground states. no mystery why, it's the coronavirus crisis that has touched the life of every american, whether it's your health, your job, someone you know or a member of your family. you had president trump yesterday tweeting about twitter trends, retweeting conspiracy theories about coronavirus, going to north carolina and saying without any backing for it with information saying the states need to reopen. it's clear he doesn't see a way out of this three months away from election day. this isn't going to suddenly go away for him as he wished the last several months. so what's his strategy right now in terms of coronavirus, what does he plan to do about it? if is he going to roll out a grand plan six months late?

>> it doesn't seem that way, willie. the president understands he's going to be judged on his response to coronavirus in november what's top of mind for voters is not going to be specifically other issues, other than the virus that is literally threatening their livelihoods and their lives. so the president is doubling down on the double down, he wants to put the virus in the rear view mirror. what's clear is there are a lot of americans including white suburban voters that he wants to convince to vote for him, that they are very worried by the tone and rhetoric coming out of the white house. the white house has been beefing up its communication staff. they are really trying to get ready for coronavirus, there are some new hires here to try to get the messaging together. but the issue at the white house continues to be that the person on the ballot, president trump, he is the person who has really had a messaging strategy that is all over the place. we might see another briefing today where the president will

read from some notes and a few minutes later contradict himself and say despite the things i told you about how it's going to get worse before it gets better, i believe in my soul it's going to disappear, even though there's no evidence of that. the president was retweeting podcast and commentary yesterday that was critical of dr. anthony fauci. we know that polls show that americans trust dr. fauci more than the president when it comes to the coronavirus as they should given the fact he is the nation's top infectious disease expert. joe biden's campaign they feel comfortable with his strategy of him staying inside, talking and doing virtual fund-raisers, virtual speaking engagements, putting out flashy videos of him talking with president obama, but not doing too much. in this case it's really president trump's race to loose in this case and the president will learn in november whether the political risk he took,

downplaying the virus and telling states to open up as quickly as possible, whether or not that strategy will work. >> and as you say, he doesn't have a new tone. there was no new nixon, there is no new tone. you have the president yesterday retweeting videos and tweets attacking dr. anthony fauci, phony doctors press conference where the doctors are saying don't wear a mask, where they're promoting hydroxychloroquine. and where donald trump is saying, once again, this is going to magically go away. that it's going to leave. it's just been absolutely devastating for his standing among many people who took a chance on him in 2016, who certainly aren't going to do that again as america crosses the 150,000 dead threshold for a virus he said was one person coming out of china.

peter baker, i'm looking at these morning consult polls. even if if you take away the states that are within the margin of error, states where other polls are showing that actually joe biden has a big lead, florida, north carolina, minnesota where one poll has biden up by 13 points. look at this, arizona plus seven, michigan plus eight. trump people have been suggesting that michigan was on the verge of being out of reach for some time. pennsylvania plus 7. wisconsin plus seven. things can change, it's still early but not as early as it used to be. but there doesn't seem to be any place to run or hide if you're a trump campaign manager trying to put together 270 electoral votes right now. what can you tell us, what's their plan, what's their strategy?

>> their strategy for one thing is to not believe those polls. not to believe those polls are an accurate reflection where things will be come november. they had a call last week where nay presented their argument to reporters and went through state by state of 2016 polls saying trump never led at all in this state in the entire race and yet he won in november. we shouldn't believe the polls are any more accurate this time than last time. the battleground state polls in 2016 were not good. the national polls in 2016 were good, though. the final number we got on the national polls in 2016 was pretty much what the popular vote was. this time around people are spending more time, more energy, more resources on the statewide polls. the presumption is they're more accurate these days. remember, polls only tell you where things are as best we can

determine them today, not the future. one thing to remember, voting starts basically in a few weeks. some of the states have early voting beginning by fall, long before november and that means time is running out for the president. time to turn things around, change the momentum is fading. we saw yesterday, the site of the first debate, notre dame, pulled out deciding it was not going to host a debate. a reminder the debate, assuming it happens, is a key event. yes, vice president biden is ahead, president trump is behind, they're looking for a strategy to gain traction, haven't found one yet but we have time left and we'll see what happens. >> peter baker, thank you so much, always great to talk to you. it is early, this is nothing more than a snapshot of where we are today. but it is a snapshot as we get closer to the destination out of

the november election but of early voting, which starts sooner rather than later. and just for people who keep going back to 2016, it's important to remember, there was a lot of fluidity in 2016. donald trump was still an unknown, hillary clinton was a known commodity. that election was a referendum more on hillary clinton than it was on donald trump, and people were willing to take a chance on donald trump. you look at the poll numbers now and you see voters' opinions far more set. and charlie, when we talk about pennsylvania, i'm looking at the philly suburb. i'm wondering how much give is there, what can happen between now and early voting or november to really move white voters in the philly suburbs who've always

voted republican. who have turned on donald trump in the midterm elections, who turned on donald trump's party in 2017? are they really -- is something going to happen over the next two or three months that it's going to really get him to cut into that vote or the black vote, which they were confidently predicting they'd get 15 to 20% of just six months ago? same with wisconsin, you look at some of the wisconsin numbers. i don't know they're completely solid. they're not as solidified as michigan is. but there are people who voted for donald trump, walked away from donald trump and they're not coming back. what can you tell us about wyoming voters in particular? >> i think what you just said there. there's not a lot of undecided voters in places like wisconsin. so the question is what is the level of intensity, how aggressive will republicans be,

the trump campaign be pushing back on mail in voting. they're all in on pennsylvania, attacking the mail-in vote process. at this point, if you're losing like this, you can't run a morning in america campaign. you can run a fear and division campaign and try to create as much chaos in the voting as you can. looking at the same polls, i think the president is in a lot of trouble. i just hope the democrats don't get complacent when i say be concerned about the violence because the violence is about the only card he has to play here. but you are right, this is what is different about 2020. we have seen donald trump, we know donald trump, people have made up their mind about donald trump. i think this country has really come to the point, do they really want four more years of donald trump? i think the country is exhausted and i think the country is disgusted. the question, though, is whether we can fight through the next, i don't know how many days it'll be because it won't be over on

election day, through the fog of misinformation, misdirection from this president. joe, one of the things that's clear, there's not going to be a new tone, a pivot, this guy is not going to become somebody different between now and november. i think voters are increasingly recognizing that. >> charlie sykes, thank you very much. now to attorney general william barr who is expected to have a confrontational appearance this morning when he testifies before the house judiciary committee for the first time as a member of the trump administration. according to the opening statement released yesterday, barr plans to defend the use of federal police to quell protesters in portland saying what unfolds nightly around the courthouse cannot reasonably be called a protest. it is by any objectedive measure, an assault on the government of the united states. he will also tell the committee

that the white house has not interfe intervened in the justice department investigations. he's expected to criticize, once again, the foundation of the mueller investigation and accuse democrats of bias against him claiming ever since i made it clear i was going to do everything i could to get to the bottom of the grave abuses involved in the bogus russian-gate scandal, many of the democrats on this committee attempted to discredit me. let's bring in kurt bardella, a "morning joe" contributor and senior adviser to the lincoln project. kurt, where do we begin? any idea as to what lawmakers want to focus on with attorney general william barr who many believe has pushed the

boundaries of justice in many different directions? >> you know, mika, this is one of those times where the biggest challenge for democrats and the hearing like this is that there's so many areas of inquiry that members want to go on that it's going to be tough to appear to be focused. you have to understand after talking with a number of house judiciary committee members yesterday they know that william barr is seasoned, practiced, try to lean on the republican counter parts trying to relitigate as you alluded to the overall conspiracy theories about what happened with the mueller investigation, the russia probe. but you'll see there are about ten areas of inquiry that the democrats will focus on. including what happened with the sdny attorney berman being removed. he's done a sit down deposition, transcribed interview with the committee so they have that to

go off of. they have questions about the firing of multiple inspectors general. and questions whether or not barr is acting as the president's personal attorney, the role that michael cohen used to serve as, more than the attorney general. how he's wielding that influence what the legality and constitutionality of what we're seeing happen in portland, kansas city, chicago with the president sending troops to these areas, they're not welcome, but there they are with the show of force. so many areas so many lawmakers want to go down towards, i think it'll be a real challenge, honestly for these democrats to appear focused, to stay on some kind of message. this is the first time in 18 months we've had any kind of hearing with the attorney general. this has been a long time in the making and they realize this might be the only chance they get to get any answers from him on the record before the november election. >> joyce vance as kurt points

out it's going to be a wide-ranging day, a wild day where they'll talk about the 2016 russia investigation, federal troops on the ground in portland. we saw in the early draft that attorney general barr is going to talk about police violence and emphasize black on black violence is worse and go into that question. so on that panel what would you want to get at with attorney general william barr with the time you had? >> the problem is this attorney general has escaped anything that looks like oversight for so long that there's a multiple of really important questions and what we don't know is whether delawares will have deviced a strategy to bring focus to the issue. but the attorney general has a credibility problem. it started the first days in office when he mischaracterized or lied about what was in the

mueller report and pedaled that to the american people as an exoneration of the president, we know that's not true. so my hope is that congress today will focus on the credibility questions on whether this attorney general has so politicized the department that he's acting as the president's wing man not the people's lawyer. that needs to be exposed because it bears on every action that bar has taken that congress will otherwise choose to scrutinize and particularly his efforts to cast the actions of protesters exercising their first amendment rights in portland, people protesting against police excessive force under the black lives matter umbrella. the efforts of the attorney general to turn them into criminals is unworthy of the office he holds. i hope congress will focus there. >> kurt, what do you think one of the most revealing areas to

focus on would be? and what do you expect from the republicans who will also be asking questions? the. >> i think that for the republicans -- they're led by jim jordan from ohio, who is a seasoned hearing performer from his time both at oversight and now leading judiciary. i think you'll see really a play on fox news every night that they're going to try to play into if 2016 conspiracy theories. you won't hear a lot from republicans about events going on right now, the abuses of power, firing of inspectors general, u.s. attorneys, the role barr played directly in what we saw unfold at lafayette square just a few months ago. you'll see republicans talk about robert mueller and conspiracy theories and text messages between agents. everything they can do to try to prote protect donald trump, protect the idea that nothing happened in 2016 as far as russian

interference. they're going to be doing russia's job for them on national tv and repeating the propaganda, the idea that trump did nothing wrong, there was no communication with russians during the campaign. and they will give barr the opportunity to filibuster. the way they see it, the more time they can spend talking about 2016 and less thabout 202 the better off they'll be. kurt and joyce thank you for being on this morning. still ahead on "morning joe," one of our next guest calls it one of the most challenging parts of the entire pandemic how to get kids safely into the classroom. republican governor, larry hogan joins us to discuss that and much more straight ahead on "morning joe." ight ahead on "morning joe." no matter where you live, where you live has never mattered more. for over 100 years, realtors® have brought local knowledge and deep expertise

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1957, i metro a park at the age of 17.

in 1958 at the age of 18, i met martin luther king jr. and these two individuals inspired me to get in the way to get in trouble. so i come here to say to you this morning, on this beautiful campus, with your great education, you must find a way to get in the way. you must find a way to get in trouble, good trouble, necessary trouble. >> one of most poignant moments from yesterday's ceremony at the capitol honoring late congressman john lewis coming from lewis himself, his voice. as speaker pelosi played a five minute audio clip of a commencement address the congressman delivered at emery university in atlanta. following the death of george floyd and the pursuing protests demanding justice in this

country, gallup launched a new division, it's also making a 100 year commitment to listen and report on the black experience in america. joining us now director of gallup center in black voices camille lloyd. thank you for being on. tell us more, if you can, about the mission. >> awesome, thank you for having me, mika. the gallup center on black voices is a 100 year commitment to studying and understanding the black experience. it's more than just moment in time polls, but rather understanding how black americans are living their lives. what are the impacts that systemic exclusion and oppression has had on their ability for a life well lived and to track and monitor progress along key sustainable development goals to understand what progress we are making or not making towards black americans achieving eccquitable

life outcomes. >> thank you for doing this. as a college professor -- >> okay. it's not just me. nobody can hear jason johnson. we'll figure out his audio in a second. but camille, tell us more, especially listening to the words of john lewis, making good trouble, about the journey over the past 100 years and looking ahead to the next 100 years, exactly how will you focus in on the black experience in a way that really helps everybody understo understand it. >> it's an amplification of our research efforts to allow us to get at the nuances. one of the challenge we've had in research over the years is the inability to dive into the sub populations within the black

community. so our commitment is to revamp our research efforts to amplify those voices by increasing our investment, the studies we do that get at the nuance experiences within the subgroup population. so not just overall sentiments from black americans but really getting down to the nuanced experience so we can understand the different intersectionalties and the experiences occurring in the black community because it's not a monolithic experience but rather varies. >> yamiche alcindor, i think we can hear her. >> i have a two-fold question. i remember learning about the study that showed african-american, even they poured wealth and education into their children that the next generation would lose that wealth because of systemic racism it got me thinking about the lack of data that's really collected on african-american. can you tell me how this project fits into that lack of data and

what do you hope comes from this data? what's the mission for this data once we get the numbers and the information? >> so the idea from this data is so that we can provide insights and discoveries at more than just kind of overall levels but rather different sub populations. we have six key research pillars that we're coming up with, measures for sustainable development that we would track and monitor on a quarterly basis. this is a sustained effort, more than a moment in time. but any moment in time we'll be tracking equity, opportunity in the black community so we can say in 100 years what has happened, how have we moved and progressed on? more so rather than just moment in time or perception type polls but tracking our progress as a society towards change. >> it's willie geist, great to

have you on, i commend you for this this project. i want to ask you about what you're finding right now in america. we're seeing a lot of polling that has seen since the beginning of the movement in the streets since the killing of george floyd under an officer's knee in minneapolis, americans of different ages and races supporting this effort. what have you found in terms of attitude towards racial justice in this country say over the last three months or so? >> we're seeing that this movement and moment is meaningful we see two in three americans supporting the protests taking place since the killing of george floyd. what we also see that's different this time is most americans are saying they feel connected to the cause of these protests and also a majority saying that these protests have changed their views on racial equity and justice to some

degree. >> what about attitude toward police, camille? there's been talk about defunding police and parse into what that means. some have even called for abolishing the police. how do americans feel about those ideas? >> we recently, last week, released some studies on the sentiments about americans and what they feel about the different proposals that have been put forth related to reform. what we find is that an overwhelming majority of americans are in support there's change needed with the way we police our society. so we do see overwhelming support across the board for some type of reform. >> we want to try jason johnson one more time. >> i guess my question was too hot, camille. i wanted to thank you as an academic. one of the challenges we face is not having good sample data for black polling information. my question for you is, what are you specifically going to do differently at gallup to get the

hard-to-reach populations? many african-americans are mobile, may not have stable homes a large percentage of generation x is cell phone only and those can go in and out, so what are you doing to get a good sample size and a wide array of opinions in in the black community? >> certainly. thank you for that question. we are leveraging our entire research machine here at gallup to leverage all different methodologies whether it's address based sampling, telephone, local level, so we are amplifying our research efforts to get at those nuanced sub populations within black america. >> the director of gallup center on black voices, camille lloyd, thank you for being on the show this morning. we have much more still ahead. we'll be right back. ch more sti ahead. we'll be right back. how about no

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president trump has labeled

himself a wartime president for his efforts against the coronavirus. our next guest is taking a closer look at the last republican wartime president. joining us now, writer at large for "the new york times" magazine and contributor to national geographic, robert draper, the author of the new book out today entitled "how to start a war: how the bush administration took" excuse me. how the bush administration took america into iraq. very different than how to. >> thank you, robert. thank you so much for being with us. you know, we've talked about this book offline once or twice, but very excited to read it once it came out. tell me what new you have discovered. here we are, it's hard to believe, 17 years after the initial invasion. what have we learned about the

lead-up to the war and how we blundered into such a colossal almost vietnam-style disaster. >> thanks for having me, joe and mika. the words of congressman lewis are resonating with me now. the words, find a way to get in the way. that was not an exortation taking place in the bush administration. i think among the sort of big-picture things i noticed in reporting this book was that far from dissenting voices being encouraged, far from the president soliciting what could go wrong, instead there was a culture of consensus. that's the case not only in the administration but within the intelligence community and within the legislative branch. and i think part of that was because a lot of people around bush believed, not entirely

inaccurately, that his mind was already made up. so, rather than bring him the what-ifs or alternatives, they facilitated a case for war, and basically that was the only -- that was the only path that was created. there was no real path for preventing war. no real path for giving a close examination to what turned out to be grossly false pre-war intelligence relating to saddam as it turns out nonexistent weapons program. >> one of the most striking quotes i heard from the time in real-time is when george w. bush was asked why he didn't go to colin powell and ask his direct opinion whether they should go into iraq or not. and his response was, correct me if i'm wrong, maybe 17 years later my memory fails me, but i believe president bush's response was, i knew how he felt. basically, he was against the war, so i didn't have to ask him. >> sure. and, you know, what's

infuriating about that is that, yes, he knew, but it wasn't intentionally interesting to the. the to find out why it was that powell was that was. powell wasn't being that way to be difficult. powell didn't embrace the point of view this was a bad idea just to be a contrarian. he was deeply concerned about what it would do to the region, that it could be sloppy. now, the one thing powell did not point out, because i don't think powell recognized it himself, was just how off-base the intelligence was. i think powell, like everybody else in the administration, was of the belief that saddam possessed weapons of mass destruction. in a lot of ways 9/11 is referred to as a failure of the imagination. i think what happened here was the opposite. in the wake of 9/11, the president and those around him relied too much on their imagination. they assumed saddam had weapons. they assumed saddam would turn those weapons over to al qaeda and all of that turned out to be

a factually inaccurate set of assumptions. >> yeah, of course, willie -- >> robert, it's willie -- >> before they had gotten information from the intel community that saddam hussein from, i think, his son-in-law, saddam hussein was trying to develop a nuclear weapons program. and they believed a lot of other things that ended up just not being true. >> well, in fact -- >> that was all false. >> right, right. that's one of the fictions also that i think that i pierce in my book. you're referring to hussein kamel, the son-in-law of saddam and the head of his weapons program who defected to jordan. what happens is when saddam's regime learned he defected, they proactively came to the american weapons inspector -- the weapons inspection team and said, look, we want to -- we want to disclose all of what we had in our weapons program. what they did was showed a bunch of documents.

there were no weapons to be shown. those, in fact, had all been destroyed in 1992 and 1993. so, the notion that saddam was hiding something simply because kamel had defected and had some stories to sell didn't, in fact, bear out to any kind of active weapons program. it had been gone for years. >> robert, reading through your book, you're reminded how quickly some people in the bush administration immediately after 9/11 turned to iraq. deputy defense secretary paul wol if. owitz reached out to dia and said, get me everything you have on saddam hussein and links to terrorism. that was the mindset right in the hours after, 17 hours after the planes hit the buildings. >> you're right, willie. what's remarkable about that is at that point wolfowitz had already seen the manifest of the 9/11 hijackers.

these were people principally of saudi arabia origin. they weren't iraqis. there was no discernible tie between the 9/11 perpetrators and saddam. wolfowitz who was pushing for a military overthrow of saddam for years and years saw this as an opportunity to make a case that essentially amounted to changing the subject. >> robert, forget me -- or alex, forgive me. we have to bleed through a break because i need to ask this question. i, of course, supported the war. donald trump, although he lies and says he didn't support the war. you have quotes that suggest he wanted it both ways. 70% of americans supported the war. the overwhelming majority of the washington community supported the war. there were very few voices -- brent scrocroft, dr. brzezinski,

very few opposed the war. dr. brzezinski spent his entire life as a cold war hawk, wanting confrontation with the soviet union, wanting to bring down the soviet union, yet in this case he drew a red line very fast saying this was going to be a very terrible mistake, same with brent scrocroft. >> you're right. dr. brzezinski stood alone in sounding that cautionary bell. part of it was the unintended consequences of invading a country that had not attacked us in the middle east, but dr. b dr. brzezinski did not believe saddam hussein posed any threat, that he might have any weapons of mass destruction, which turns out he did not. he was a contained threat. on the heels of 9/11 when our principle job was to go after islamic extremists who attacked us to essentially change the subject by going after a secular dictator in iraq was ill-advi d

ill-advised. you're right, joe, very few people were bringing that up. part of it was they were -- they felt nervous and stifled as voices in the wake of 9/11. they were concerned their patriotism might be questioned. i think be that is a through-line between these, frankly to put -- not to put too fine a point on it, two republican administrations in which truth is not really being sought out. instead, a narrative is being fashioned and embraced. >> the new book is "to start a war: how the bush administration took america into iraq." robert draper, thank you very much. still ahead, the president continues his coronavirus disinformation campaign. what happens to the supposed change in tone? we're looking for it. plus, new polling shows joe biden increasing his lead in some key battleground states. and chipping away at donald trump's lead in others. we'll have the latest numbers. our next hour starts right now.

under the dome of the u.s. capitol, we have bid farewell to some of the greatest americans in our history. it is fitting that john lewis joins this pantheon of patriots resting upon the same catafalk of abraham lincoln. john lewis became a titan of the civil rights and the conscience of congress. here in congress, john was revered and beloved on both sides of the aisle, on both sides of the capitol. we knew he always worked on the side of the angels and now we know that he is with them. >> even though the world around him gave him every cause for bitterness, he stubbornly treated everyone with respect and love. all so that as his friend, dr. king, once put it, we could build a community at peace with

itself. today we pray and trust that this peacemaker himself now rests in peace. >> do you plan on going to show respect to john lewis either today or tomorrow at the capitol? >> no, i won't be going, no. >> good morning. and welcome to "morning joe." it is tuesday, july 28th. along with joe, willie and me, we have white house reporter for the associated press, jonathan lemire. pulitzer prize-winning columnist and msnbc political analyst, eugene robinson. and historian jon meacham, he's the author of the forthcoming biography of john lewis entitled "his truth is marching on," which publishes in october. i look forward to that. >> jon meacham, obviously, as nancy said, john lewis was

considered the conscience of congress. he also was a christian who was christ-like. you look at the beattitudes and so many of them apply to the life, day in and day out. for those of us who knew and loved john up close, those of us who only knew him from his public image, this was a man who always understood blessed are the meek, blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness. blessed are the peacemakers. john, he was all of that and so much more, and how fitting that he was remembered the way he was yesterday in washington, d.c. >> you know, the secular and the

sacred intersect in the rotunda at moments like that. and lewis was, in fact, i believe, a genuine saint in the classic new testament sense of the term. a man who was willing to die, to suffer for that vision, joe. you quote from jesus, he heard the gospel in troy, alabama, as a young child. his -- life in troy was so complicated and so difficult, that actually families weren't expected to go to church every week. that was considered too much of a burden. it was every other week. and they would go from one church to the other. the bible was the main book in the house until he discovered biographies of great black americans in school. and he lived that gospel in a

way i certainly can't think of another american offhand, certainly of our time, who ever has. and i also believe that what we saw yesterday and what we'll see over the next couple of days is the burial of a war hero. not every war hero faces fire abroad. he faced fire in the states you and i call home. and what we see there in that rotunda where eisenhower and lincoln and grant and jefferson and washington and king and reagan are, is a man who served the cause of the nation and the cause of liberty, nonviolently, consistently, and in a way that offers a life of exemplary virtue. and the reason it's so powerful is we knew him. this is not some stained glass

figure. this is someone who you served with, that everyone there knew so well. and he always told the old story, because he wanted the story to remain ever new. >> and, you know, willie geist was moved by jon's description of him as a war hero because he did fight a war. he fought a war in the region where john and i was raised. and he was the perfecter, as hannah nicole jones said, he was the perfecter along with civil rights heroes of the promises that were made at the founding of this republic, that we as a country did not fulfill.

and he, john lewis, along with so many other civil rights heroes throughout the ages, were the ones that said, okay, this is the promise that has been made to us. all men are created equal. with certain inalienable rights. that promise has been given to us. we're going to fulfill it. and that's what john lewis has done. and because of john lewis, and others like john lewis, we stand and our children stand and future generations stand on the shoulders of this giant. >> amen. and there were so many moments over the last two or three days that have almost made you stop and catch your breath because they're so emotional and so heavy. and among them are two days ago

when his body crossed the edmund pettus bridge one more time. at the end of that bridge, 55 years later, waiting were alabama state troopers where when he was a 25-year-old in 1965, he was beaten by state troopers. that day on sunday, he was saluted. there you have it. there's the scope of his life. there's the scope of his work. there's the scope of american history. and gene robinson, i thought yesterday watching the beautiful service that they had in the rotunda and looking at the shot from atop, looking down on his casket, you know, almost the way i feel watching a d-day ceremony these days where you look into the faces of these men and you think about the sacrifices and you say, we're losing something in this country in a generation of men and women who revolutionized our country, who changed it and made it better. and john lewis is certainly in that category.

>> it was almost another founding of this country. as the civil war was the second founding, the civil rights movement was yet another founding of this country to bring it closer to its stated deals. it was incredibly moving i thought yesterday. and i think the war metaphor is absolutely right, but he went into battle armed only with principle and faith. those were his weapons. and when i think of his life story and what he accomplished and what he did, i am always in awe of the courage it took to go into battle -- literally into battle knowing he would be attacked, knowing he would be beaten, with the determination

not to fight back, not to strike back in anger. it's something i -- i couldn't do. most of us couldn't do. an extraordinary man among extraordinary men and women, who took on this crusade and who changed the nation, and in many ways changed the world. it was an incredible life, one that we continue to celebrate this week. but yesterday the capitol was particularly moving for me, especially seeing him among the colleagues and realizing how few of them are left. he was the last of the speakers at the march on washington in 1963 to pass away. and we are losing that generation. but we can't lose them without

fully recognizing and celebrating their monumental achievement. it was just an incredible, incredible thing that they did. still ahead on "morning joe," the new poll numbers show joe biden leading the president nationwide. and in a host of key battle grounds. we'll run through the map next on "morning joe." ♪ book two separate qualifying stays and earn a free night. the open road is open again. and wherever you're headed, choice hotels is there. book direct at choicehotels.com. ...to soccer practices... ...and new adventures. you hope the more you give the less they'll miss. but even if your teen was vaccinated against meningitis

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in the latest new look at battle groground polls that sho joe biden gaining on trump or expanding his lead in several states. the new morning con sult poll shows nationally joe biden leads president trump 51% to 43%. here's a look at some key states. in all of them, note the

movement since may. in arizona, biden sits ahead of president trump by seven. a nine-point swing. in colorado by 13 points, adding four points. in florida he's up by three. trump had been up by one in may. in georgia biden and trump remain statistically tied. in michigan, biden increases his lead to ten points. this poll has minnesota tightening. another poll we showed you late last week from that state had biden up double digits. this morning -- the morning c consult poll has trump's margin down to three points. in pennsylvania biden's lead increased to seven. in texas, another statistically tie but it was a different story in may, when trump was up in texas by seven points. and biden added to his lead in virginia and wisconsin.

so, joe, biden doing well. again, i just wonder, then, how trump reacts, because as biden goes up in the polls, i worry he goes down in terms of his reaction, his behavior, his racial sort of pushing the boundaries using race and bigotry. >> you go through the numbers. florida, biden plus three than most polls we've seen. georgia basically within the margin of error. michigan plus eight. minnesota plus three. but, of course, we saw a poll last week that had that in double digits. north carolina tie. we had a poll the other day showing biden up seven there. pennsylvania, biden plus seven. texas, biden plus two within the margin of error. wisconsin plus seven.

these obviously taken together are disastrous results for donald trump. and it is early, but it is not as early as it once was. jonathan lemire, it seems from everything i'm reading and i hope you have some reporting for us on this count, but from everything i've seen, we're all paying attention to what's happening in portland, what's happening around that federal courthouse in portland, the chaos there and people thinking this is where donald trump is hitching his wagon, hoping that that's going to carry him over the finish line. and yet he sees the law and order numbers and sees this really isn't moving the needle. from what you've reported, from what i'm hearing, it all comes down to the fact that he knows that this country has to turn the corner on this pandemic, or his presidential race is doomed. what can you tell us about yesterday's event? >> well, joe, i'll start with

adding the conversation about congressman lewis. i was on the white house lawn when we asked if the president was going to attend to pay his respects to the congressman lying in state at the capitol. he, of course, as you played in that clip, said no. that took some white house aides we surprise because there had been discussion of the president going over there some time today. they thought that would be something he would want to do. vice president pence who sevened with congressman lewis in the house did go over there. >> did they provide any explanation why he is, in fact, doing something that no other president would do, republican or democrat alike? you even heard mitch mcconnell offering glowing words to john lewis. why would the president be so obstinate about going over to see a civil rights hero? any mranexplanation from the st? i know he's been playing the

race card aggressively. does he actually think going to see a civil rights hero, an american saint, does he think that would hurt him with white voters? >> publicly white house aides are publicly saying it's the president's decision. privately there is some frustration that they do feel the president is too mindful of that, of the signal he might be sending to white voters. also it's someone with whom he had feuded before. we know how he holds grudges. we know he did the same when senator mccain died. he did not pay respects in public either. he had to be convinced to put the flag at half-staff at the white house for senator mccain. for congressman lewis it was lowered, but only for half a day and then put back up. joe, you're completely right. there's a growing recommendation among his advisers, they're going to continue to lean into some of these cultural efforts, the preservation of the statues, confederate bases and of late, a

real push into the idea of law and order and using federal troops in these cities. most notably portland. and it's all part of a piece, a signal to white voters and suburban voters, the same ones he's trying to court with policies lifted out of 1950s, sending signals to white voters about black and brown voters moving to the suburbs. again, playing upon white fear, suburban residents, senior voters. the polling is not suggesting that's working. therefore, we refer to the pandemic and how he is handling it. to this point, he's receiving a failing grade from the voters of this country. yesterday he was in north carolina. there was a real effort here to push forth and to put a lot of money into the vaccine development suggesting both the vaccine could be manufactured while the distribution mechanism is also worked on at the same time to try to speed it up. in part, because they know, in

the trajectory of this race, he's losing and he's going to need, some of his aides believe, an october surprise to pull this off. something significant and big. something from the outside to change the game. maybe that's a stumble by his opponent, joe biden. we should also note, pay tribute to congressman lewis yesterday. or, more likely, they feel like they need to put their eggs in the basket of a vaccine. they need to be able to show it's been developed or is close to give some sort of hope to voters and also so the president can take credit for it. though, would that be enough credit to overcome the months of mistakes he's made handling the pandemic? coming up, president trump retweets anti-mask conspiracies and false claims that hydroxychloroquine is a cure . r what if i sleep hot? ... or cold?

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the president in terms of handling the pandemic yesterday again spreading disinformation about coronavirus. yesterday he retweeted a video of a group of people in white lab coats calling themselves front-line doctors spreading false claims during what appears

to be a fake news conference. this amplified by the president of the united states. one of the speakers identified herself as a doctor, promoted the drug hydroxychloroquine as a, quote, cure, while also claiming, quote, you don't need a mask. twitter since has removed the video but not before it went viral. the fda revoked the emergency use authorization last month saying the potential benefits are not worth the risk. the president has promoted the unproven drug aggressively and even claimed to have used it himself. he also retweeted a post yesterday of steve bannon's podcast that accused dr. fauci of misleading the public by dismissing hydroxychloroquine. so, joe, this is for all those who were impressed by the president's, quote, change in tone last week. here he is retweeting, amplifying to 80 million people all these false claims about drugs being cures and a doctor, in quotes, saying, don't wear a mask when every public health expert on the planet says wear a

mask. yesterday i point out, joe, in north carolina, president trump said it's time for these governors to reopen their states. based on no new information as coronavirus continues to explode. >> no new information. >> no. >> he never learns. and we know this. he is a day trader. but it's just absolutely staggering that the president of the united states -- not staggering. it should be staggering. it is no longer staggering that the president of the united states actually pushes out a conspiracy theory video that tells people not to wear masks. that pushes a drug that several studies have shown is not effective, that his own government has actually said could cause heart problems and

to avoid taking it as a way to mitigate the effects of hydroxychloroquine. and, jon meacham, we have seen the impact of this across the country. we have seen the impact of donald trump telling everybody at first that this was a hoax whipped up by the media. that this was one person coming in from china, that it was going to go away. that it was 15 people coming in that had it, that that was going to go away. that it would magically disappear by april. when things warmed up, it would magically go away. started talking about disinfectants, putting uv lights in people, hydroxychloroquine, even after his own fda and his own cdc and dr. fauci warned against it. but what's staggering to me is 150,000 people are dead, well beyond two vietnams, well beyond even the number of combat deaths

and total deaths in world war i. there are still people out there, like the president of the united states, like sinclair broadcasting, who were actually pushing conspiracy they'res saying dr. fauci, that dr. fauci started this pandemic to make billions of dollars. or in donald trump's case, retweeting a video of doctors at a phoney press conference. we think it's a phoney press conference. twitter took it down saying, don't wear a mask. this is surreal. we are -- i could ask you what the historical parallel was, but, i mean, do we have to go back to the salem witch trials for people -- >> the inquisition -- >> -- who were so moved by

superstition that they ignore medical advice, they ignore scientific advice and they ignore the caskets of 150,000 fellow americans being -- you know, going to the cemetery or being cremated. >> it's rivet, right? if it weren't happening, it would be interestingly fascinating because this is the great triumph of fear over fact. that's the big thing that's unfolded. not only the numbers you said, 150,000, more than 4 million cases, but 50 million americans, at least, are out of work. this is depression level joblessness. the hopelessness, the anxiety, the sense of lack of direction is pervasive. and i think that's a significant part of what's driving the presidential polls that you were talking about. one of the things we have to

figure out is we have two big tributaries of american life that we've talked about this morning. we have john lewis and the civil rights movement and the work of the 19 -- mid-1960s. gene mentioned another founding, absolutely right. we live in the country that 1965 brought about. both because of the voting rights act and because of the immigration act of that year. and so that's created the demography where we are now. but then we have a president of the united states who has embraced superstition and prejudice and the worst parts of the american character as a reaction to that country. and we have a very clear choice here. politics doesn't often do this. politicians always say it does, right, i'm sure you didn't, but most politicians say, this is the most important election since x or y. if you don't elect me to the school board, everyone's going to be ignorant forever. if you don't make me president, the country's going to fall into

an abyss. this is pretty much that. i don't think you could be too hyperbolic about the stayikes o this election. it's not just about joe biden and donald trump, but it is about what they represent, right? joe biden is a figure, as a friend of mine likes to point out, out of 1965. he wants a great society. he wants to sign big legislation. that may terrify some people, but it helped the country in many ways. and you just have to be smart about it. donald trump wants it to be 1955, right? he wants a reaction to this changing demographic reality. and what i would suggest to everyone, particularly to lawmakers who may find themselves in a position if trump tries something with the election of actually having to take a stand again, is think about what happened yesterday in the rotunda. was that a ceremony about

someone who wanted to defy fact? was that a ceremony about somebody who wanted to segregate america, who wanted to keep us apart and point fingers? no. the man the country is honoring, the man history is honoring, is somebody who was about opening themselves up and being smart. it's a very clear choice. coming up, republican governor larry hogan of maryland is standaing by. we'll get an update on his state's fight against the pandemic and how the white house is handling the national response. "morning joe" is back in a moment. oe" is back in a moment

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and simon pagenaud takesed, the lead at the indy 500!. coming to the green flag, racing at daytona. they're off... in the kentucky derby. rory mcllroy is a two time champion at east lake. touchdown! only mahomes. the big events are back and xfinity is your home for the return of live sports. why is funding for the fbi building in this bill? >> i'm not sure that it is, is it? regardless of that proposal, obviously we had to have an agreement with the administration in order to get

started, and they'll have to answer the question of why they insisted on that provision. >> you'll have to ask them why they insisted that be included. >> nbc's leigh ann caldwell catching mitch mcconnell offguard, apparently unaware that the senate republicans' coronavirus relief package includes request for $1.7 billion for a new fbi building in washington, d.c. joining us now, chairman of the national governor's association, republican governor larry hogan of maryland. his new book is officially out today entitled "still standing: surviving cancer, riots, a global pandemic and the toxic politics that divide america." great to have you on the show. so, governor hogan, let's start with the last part of your title, the toxic politics that

divide america. how would you describe what those are today. >> well, i've been very frustrated with the -- kind of the anger and divisiveness that we've seen, frankly, on both sides of the aisle. and i think a lot of people in america are just frustrated with the current debate and would like to see a more, you know, civil discussion. and i think they're really more interested in trying to find a better politics where we can reach bipartisan common sense solutions to some of the serious problems that are facing the country. >> who do you think bears the most responsibility for that toxic culture over the last three or four years? >> well, look, i've been talking about this for six years, so long before the current occupant of the white house. it was the main theme of my inauguration address in january of 2015. i think our politics has been heading in that direction really for quite some time over the past at least decade or two.

i mean, i think it's reached a fevered pitch, there's no question in that today it's worse than it's ever been. and it's gotten way off track. >> i want to get to your book, but of course i have to ask you this question or else i will hear for the rest of the day why i didn't ask you this question. and that is, doesn't donald trump bear the disproportionate responsibility at least over the past 3 1/2 years for the constant attacks against republicans, democrats, people in the media, calling people enemies of the press, charlottesville. you know i could do the litany, the familiar litany. it continues even today. >> well, i have probably spoken up more than any other republican in america about my frustrations with the president's language and his tone and the way he goes about tweeting and the things he says. it frustrates me. i've long given up trying to

change his behavior. i talked about it during the campaign when he was running for president. i talked about it right after he became president. people said, what's your -- what's the best advice you can give the president? i said, stop talking the way you're talking, stop tweeting. but, you know, i'm not here just to criticize the president. >> well, of course. it's not fair for republicans to come on this show to have to defend the president of the united states in every single tweet, which is a mistake that i think we in the media make far too often. let me ask you about your battle with cancer. talk about, if you will, just for those that are struggling through it right now, talk about your low point and how you got through that. >> well, so, this is something that really touches so many different people in america. i think almost everyone. it's either been through it or has someone they love that's gone through a struggle like this. i had just been governor for five months. i had won the biggest upset in america and had my first legislative session and then

battled the riots in baltimore in 2015 and 16 days later got hit with this very personal struggle that i wasn't expecting, with life-threatening cancer spread throughout my body. i tell you, it was a very difficult struggle, but i met so many incredible patients going through much more difficult battles and met their families and learned about incredible doctors and how important it is to have a support network. and i'm going to continue to work as hard as i can to work with different groups to raise awareness until we find a cure for some of these terrible diseases. >> how did you facing death impact the way you looked at life? >> it really did make me think about the important things in life. it makes me appreciate every single day. and i try to make the most out of every day. i think it probably made me more empathetic and to the struggles people go through. and i'll tell you, i'm not afraid of taking a tough political stand. going through cancer and

chemotherapy, somebody tweeting or saying something that disagrees with you isn't all that scary. >> governor hogan, it's willie geist. congratulations on the book. now that it's officially out, we've been able to comb through some more of it beyond the excerpts we had in the last couple of weeks. one of the stunning passages is when you write that in 2019, you were approached not just by republicans across the country to run for president, but by president trump's cabinet secretaries. so, in other words, the people who worked for donald trump and work with donald trump approached you and said, you ought to run and primary our boss. can you say more about who they were and what their message was to you? >> well, i could but i probably won't. but it wasn't -- i don't want to give the wrong impression. it was a passing reference. i was surprised this happened, but it wasn't the whole cabinet coming to me, begging me to run. it was a passing conversation about a couple of folks saying, you know, hey, we can't tell you

how important it is that you're speaking up and you're saying the things that you're saying and it's important to the party and the country. and we sure wish that you would consider this. that's all. but i don't want to, you know, get into detail about personal conversations that were off the record. but i thought it was important just to throw that out there to say that there were other people that maybe weren't speaking out that were concerned about some of the things that were going on. >> what were their concerns? what did they relay to you? and they were sitting cabinet secretaries? >> yes, there were a couple cabinet secretaries. i'm not going to get into the specifics of that, as i didn't get into in the book. >> okay. let me ask you, governor, about what's happening in your state right now. yesterday president trump was in north carolina saying a lot of these governors need to open up their states. it's time to open. he's talking about companies that need to get their people back to work. he's talking about schools, as you know, he wants schools open across the country coming up in the next few weeks just in your state. do you feel like maryland is

ready to open in the way donald trump believes it should? >> well, look, right now i think we're seeing at least 22 states that had opened that are now reshutting because the virus is growing out of control. in our state we've been following the advice of the public health doctors and the scientists. we've gone about a safe, gradual and effective reopening based on that in a very careful way. we've got a lot of our economy back on track and people back to work, but with very, you know, important restrictions and safety measures and precautions and capacity restrictions and masking. and so, you know, our state is in a different shape than many others across the country. this kind of goes against the president's messaging. he's been changing his message over the past week or so to take the virus more seriously and to start finally talking about the importance of masking. many of the republican governors are now reshutting things in their states in the south. and then the president kind of stepped on his own message by

saying, again, we need to reopen. it reminds me of when his entire coronavirus task force and all the cabinet secretaries were saying, we had to take action to stop the virus and then the president was tweeting, liberate and open up. they've got to get on the same page. and the virus is getting really back to where it was in the early stages. we need consistent messaging out of the white house. >> more on the coronavirus, governor. the baltimore sun is reporting about a baltimore doctor who's been working on the front lines of this pandemic who died from the virus on saturday. 56-year-old joseph costa was chief of critical care at mercy medical center. the sun reports, quote, as he lay dying, about 20 colleagues held a vigil and placed their blue-gloved hands on him. his husband told the paper that, keep thinking now there's one

less doctor to care for pandemic patients in baltimore. the hospital says, costa came on board in 1997 and held several leadership roles over the years, including president of the medical staff. we are hearing, governor hogan, of staffing shortages, of front line workers dying, just like this incredibly vital doctor who was working on the front lines. if you were president, would you have immediately gotten the defense production act going on testing and on other measures to help mitigate this pandemic? >> well, first of all, you know, my heart goes out to the family and friends of this incredible doctor. all of these front-line health care workers really are the heroes of this crisis, this pandemic. every one of them deserves our

undying thanks for being out there and risking their lives for the rest of us. but, yes, i've said this, that one of the biggest mistakes was, first, not taking it seriously at the beginning but also not developing a national testing strategy at the beginning. all the states were kind of on their own. we've tried to play catch-up, but we're still back in kind of the situation we were early on. we now have ten-day waits for testing. we're not finding out where the virus is. we're starting to see the flare-ups again. in our state we built 6,000 new hospital beds and built up capacity and we've been able to tamp down the virus. our positivity rate is declining. we're so far keeping it under control. but this thing is coming back around and it's traveling from other states. and if we had gotten it under control earlier, we might not be in this position right now. and we have a call today with the white house, again, with all the governors. we're going to again push for more funding, not less funding.

and possibly utilizing the defense production act to try to help these private labs get up to speed and catch up because we're behind the eight ball. >> well, let us know if it happens, especially on the defense production act. thank you very much. the new book is entitled "still standing: surviving cancer, riots, a global pandemic and the toxic politics that divide america." it's out today. governor larry hogan, thank you very much for being on the show this morning. up next, finding humor through the pain. how one comedian is preparing for a new netflix special amid very tense times. keep it on "morning joe." ♪ book two separate qualifying stays and earn a free night.

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can it help keep me asleep? absolutely, it intelligently senses your movements and automatically adjusts to keep you both effortlessly comfortable. can it help with snoring? i've never heard snoring. exactly. no problem. ...and done. will it help me keep up with mom? you've got this. so you can really promise better sleep? not promise... prove. and now, no interest until january 2023 on all smart beds. only for a limited time. i've got to tell you guys, if you haven't protested, you should. it's so much fun. it's so much fun. find any protest. you march. it's so much -- i swear to god. he's been president, every weekend i find a protest. it's great. they give you cookies. it's delicious. and it's good exercise. i've been getting really good exercise. people go, you've been doing pilates? no, i do the trumpates. >> joining us now, actor and

comedian maz jibrani. his latest "immigrant" is currently available on netflix and it looks really funny. he's out with a special soon entitled "pandemic warrior" that covers a wide variety of topics from social issues to parenting to the coronavirus pandemic. he is also the host of the podcast, back to school with maz jobrani. welcome to the show. >> thanks for having me. >> your show looks hilarious. i'm not sure how you make these topics hilarious, but you do it, and i noticed that you had roots in the news business. how much do your newsroom roots help create the comedy that you're putting out today? >> well, you know, first of all, thanks for having me. secondly, i studied political science in college, so i think as a comedian, it allows me to get into the political side of

stuff. i'm a big fan of comedians who did social issues such as richard pryor, george karlin, even jon stewart. so i feel like you're a comedian or artist and you aren't saying something with your comedy, then you're missing out on an opportunity. >> totally agree. mike barnicle, jump in. >> you were born in iran. you came here as a child. you probably realize that the united states has had sort of an up and down, kind of a rocky relationship with iran for, you know, a couple of decades. i'm wondering, has your background, has it ever affected your ability to get a part, a role, to get some stand-up comedy club to take you in? has it ever disrupted you at all in terms of your professional growth? >> well, you know, i would say that -- it's not that it stopped me but when i first started, we saw a lot of roles that were written for middle eastern actors that were terrorist parts. parts that were all negative.

and i have been doing this for 22 years now, and i'm so excited now to see tv shows like "ramy" on hulu. there's all other types of representation of brown people in the media. so i think we've come a long way. and i personally at a certain point early on in my career, i did a chuck norris movie of the week. of course, i was playing the bad guy, and i died, and i decided not to do those terrorist parts anymore. and i think we've made progress. but, listen, being iranian american, it's constant. earlier this year, we almost went to war with iran and that was a crazy time for all iranian americans and thank god that didn't happen, but it's constant. it is happening all the time. >> maz, it's willie geist. congratulations on the new special. we've gotten so used to watching news but also comedy in settings like the one you're in now, sitting in your bedroom.

we're watching our late night shows, the hosts are at home. so what's it been like trying to create, one, but, two, perform comedy in these times. obviously the special coming out that you shot, but how do you -- there's so much there. it's so rich, and you want to have something to say about this moment in history. but just the performance of comedy. what's it been like for you? >> willie, it's been very strange because, as comedians, we need a live audience. and that disappeared. and so we started doing zoom shows. and those were weird because you are going, i'm doing comedy into a computer. i got into comedy so i wouldn't have a desk job. now i'm sitting at a desk telling jokes into a computer? but some of it has been successful. people come on and you turn on four or five of the audience members so when you're telling the jokes you can hear them laugh. that helps a little bit. then it's funny for us because we're seeing the audience. so you'll be doing your jokes and there's someone in their

pajamas, someone is in their bed, whatever, having snacks. start doing crowd work like that. and then you can use the background. i've got here a little pinball machine my kids made. obama pinball machine. and you can include things like that. this is for any parent who is out there. if you get your kids away from electronics, they invent stuff. so my son designed that. my daughter colored it. they are 9 and 12. so i have been able to integrate my life into the comedy because i can't bring my family on the stage with me but now i can bring them behind me and talk and do jokes and tell the world about them. >> maz jobrani, we appreciate it. his current special "immigrant" is currently available on netflix. and he's out soon with another one entitled "pandemic warrior" so look for that. that does it for us this morning. stephanie ruhle picks up the coverage right now.

>> hi there. i'm stephanie ruhle. it is tuesday, july 28th, and here are the facts at this hour. at some point today, we expect to hit another sobering milestone in the battle with coronavirus. 150,000 american deaths. we saw 1200 deaths reported monday along with about 60,000 new cases. more than 4.3 million americans have come down with this virus thus far. at the very same time, the president of the united states tried retweeting, didn't try, he did retweet a conspiracy video alleging that there is a cure for the virus and that masks do not work. both of those claims are absolutely false. and the video was then removed by twitter, facebook and youtube. why? because it violated rules against spreading misinformation. the president of the united states. this came on the very same day the president talked about

reopening. said that states aren't reopening fast enough. this morning, dr. anthony fauci dismissed the president's tweets and insisted states need to take a step-by-step approach to reopening. >> some states are not doing that. we'd hope they all now rethink at what happens when you don't adhere to that. we've seen it in plain sight in the seven states that surged. so we've got to get back to a very prudent advance from one stage to another. >> finally, some good news. pfizer starting its phase three testing for a vaccine candidate. this morning, just like moderna, pfizer is looking for 30,000 volunteers at dozens of sites around the country. we could get results as early as october or november. but, remember, results doesn't mean the country will be getting vaccinated any time soon. i want to start with morgan chesky in texas. a state trying to bounce back from a hurricane, that's right, a hurrican