good day. i'm andrea mitchell in washington. as vladimir putin claims russia has a covid-19 vaccine ready for

use. but he is providing no scientific data to back up that claim. here are the facts at this hour. the world has now surpassed 20 million confirmed coronavirus cases. the u.s. with 4% of the global population has 25% of the world's case and more than 164,000 deaths, including a new single-day record, 276 deaths now reported in florida. the debate over school reopenings is intensifying as students from the midwest down to florida return to the classroom. dr. anthony fauci is calling for a universal school mask mandate as georgia's governor brian kemp says he will not institute any such order for his state. and today, russia is claiming, as we say, that they have a registered coronavirus vaccine ready for use, with president putin saying one of his daughters has already been inoculated. the alleged vaccine has no published data, no critical phase iii trial, and both the long term effects and safety concerns remain unclear.

we are still on veep watch. this hour i'll speak with democratic national committee chair tom perez on their virtual convention lineup on speakers from president obama to alexandria ocasio-cortez and joe biden's running mate decision that could drop at any moment. we begin today with the coronavirus and nbc white house correspondent and "weekend today" co-host kristen welker, and "washington post" white house bureau chief phil rucker. welcome to both of you. the president is pushing for schools to reopen, college football to kick off this fall, even as the conferences are making their decisions. we wait to see if sports can really push cases and deaths further down. and we're also looking at this vaccine and the announcement from vladimir putin, interestingly they're calling it sputnik v, for "victory," i guess, or "vaccine." but the fact is that sputnik is a particularly important name and brand in russian

iconography. of course, it is the time they beat us to space with the sputnik in 1957 at the height of the cold war. >> that's right, no doubt the term is aimed at taunting president trump and the united states. but as you point out, andrea, there are so many questions about how effective this purported vaccine would really be. it comes as the white house has launched its own efforts to fast track a vaccine, operation warp speed, president trump saying he hopes to have a vaccine even potentially by election day. of course you have medical experts saying that may not be possible. but bottom line, andrea, this does come as the president continues to try to turn the page on covid-19. he wants to see schools to reopen in the fall, in-person learning. and yesterday he doubled down on the claim that children are immune from the virus, when he was pressed by nbc's carol lee, despite the fact that you have

nearly 100,000 kids who became infected with covid-19 at the end of july alone. and so that is more mixed messaging, which complicates, some administration officials feel, the president's intended goal which is to look like he is on top of this crisis. now, we know he's going to have a briefing a little later on today. i'm told he may add another event related to covid-19 if not today, later on this week, andrea. but he's also trying to put the focus on testing, tweeting today a little bit different message as it relates to testing. he says, more testing, which is a good thing, we have the most in the world, equals more cases. of course this is something that he's said before which is not the case. they use cases to demean the incredible job being done by the great men and women of the u.s. so the president really digging in on some of his defiant messaging for yet another day, andrea. >> and with the president now coming out again at 5:30, you were there, so i just want to

ask you about this incredible scene in the briefing room, when the president was pulled off the podium or asked to leave the podium by the secret service. >> it was a truly remarkable moment, andrea, and of course i've covered two administrations, i've never witnessed anything like this. secret service agents eevacuating president trump to the offal office. there were shots outside, according to a statement by the secret service. apparently a 51-year-old man approached the agents. he said he was armed, even though agents say they later learned he was not armed with a gun. and he seemed to be making movements that would indicate he was ready to pull some type of weapon on them. so they wound up firing at this man. he is still in the hospital. a secret service agent was taken to the hospital and released. for his part, president trump was out of the briefing room for a few minutes. he came back in to tell us about this shooting that had occurred

outside of the white house grounds. and then he continued with his briefing, focused on covid-19 and the latest executive actions that he has taken, andrea. >> quite extraordinary. and you were amazing, kristen, in the midst of that, which of course was right up against your deadline for "nightly news" and all the rest. there were lockdowns so nobody could go out to their cameras. phil, let me also ask you about this mixed messaging as the president again tries to revive his messaging. he was there yesterday, and without the doctors around him at all, and with some new adviser on coronavirus that he has brought in who is a fox commentator from the hoover institution, who has also been warning against lockdowns and against a lot of the public health messaging. >> yeah, that's right, andrea, we're seeing a continued push by the president and those in the administration to try to get schools reopened, even as some of the larger school districts in this country, los angeles and san diego being two of the earlier ones, have been saying

they're going to do digital only learning this fall, that it's simply not safe to have children, to have adult teachers, packed into these classrooms where they cannot ensure social distancing. nonetheless, the president is adamant about getting schools reopened, he sees that as really important not only for children's health and social wellbei wellbeing, being in the classroom, but as a sort of confidence boost for the american people, as a sign that they're getting some control over the virus. >> phil, as they try to get control over the messaging, what about the fact that there is this stalemate with the hill? it seems that the white house team now thinks they've got the upper hand, even though the national governors have turned -- led by a republican, larry hogan, have rejected this plan on the unemployment which would require the states to kick in. >> andrea, the most meaningful

relief for millions of americans suffering economically through this pandemic right now is going to have to come in legislative form. it's going to have to come from congress, because they approve and authorize the spending, that's the way our system of governing works. the white house was not able to get a deal with congressional democrats last week. the president acted over the weekend on his own with some legally dubious and controversial orders. and we'll see if they can come back to the table over the next couple of weeks. but there is a great gulf between the two sides right now. >> phil rucker and kristen welker starting us off, thanks to both. let's turn to that news from russia. nbc news chief foreign correspondent richard engel on the news from moscow this morning. richard, what is vladimir putin saying and what is the credibility? it's not matching up to the test of american medical officials. >> reporter: well, the problem is russia is not releasing a lot of data.

russia says that it has this vaccine. this came from vladimir putin himself. vladimir putin came out today and said the vaccine is safe, it's effective, it provides long term protection from the coronavirus. he said that one of his two daughters, and he's very protective, he doesn't talk about his two daughters hardly at all, there are very few photographs of them, one of his two daughters, he said, he didn't identify which one, took this vaccine, two shots, that she got a slight fever of just one centigrade extra after each shot, but that it went down and otherwise she's feeling well. and russia says it still needs to do phase iii of this trial, but it registered the vaccine, the first country to have a registered vaccine, and says it is approved for use by russian health officials, even though the trials are ongoing. so many health critics,

scientists, public health experts, are saying this is troubling and also potentially dangerous because now you have a vaccine that russia says is okay and is ready to go, even though we don't exactly know how many people have taken it but it seems like a relatively small number, perhaps only a few hundred. not much, if any, data has been published. and now russia says it's ready to go. and it's already getting interest. the president of the philippines, duterte, said he would take it. and if he takes it, the implication was, he would be happy to give it to his people. and a state in brazil said it's looking forward to signing a manufacturing agreement to produce the vaccine. so yes, it's a sputnik moment, and it is called sputnik v for vaccine, but with sputnik, 1957, there really was a satellite, the first artificial satellite, it really went up in space. now we have a detailed claim from putin putting his family

into it but we don't know the data. >> i can tell you that really was a sputnik moment, in 1957, we were ducking and covering under our desks. thank you very much, richard engel, a little bit of history there. delaware democratic senator chris coons serves on the foreign relations committee and joins us now. senator, vladimir putin, what do you think he's up to here? we know that there are trials of 30,000 people in stage 3, done in multiple countries where they have reached stage 3, 15,000 people get the vaccine, 15,000 people don't get it, they get a placebo, that's how you proceed to post-stage-3 and actually make sure it's not only effective but safe, so side effects. that's not happened here. maybe what he's talking about is effectively a stage 3 involving his own daughter, one of his two daughters. >> andrea, that's right, stage 3 clinical trials are a critical

part of testing a vaccine, to make sure it's safe and effective, to understand the side effects, to understand how it impacts a very wide range of different groups, and for russia, for vladimir putin, to try and jump to the head of the line and say we've got the vaccine that works, isn't a sputnik moment as much as it's a reminder of the conduct of the soviet union during the olympic contests during the cold war. i'll remind you that russian athletes had a long history of doping, of cheating, of being conver coerced by their government to do things that may have won the gold medal but skirted the rules and put their own health at risk. i think only time will tell whether the russians have in fact developed the first effective and safe vaccine or whether they're at it again, putting their number on the scale and cheating. president trump has a long history of taking putin's word for it even over the input or advice of our own professionals

in the intelligence committunitr the health community. i would encourage president trump to rely on the broad and deep community of innovators who know how to deliver safe and effective vaccines and therapeutics in our country. there is a reason that the fda requires long, expensive, complex, and scientifically sound tests before we distribute any vaccine in this country. >> and we have a new surveymonkey polling result on people who feel that the election will not be fair. let me just share this with you. a majority of adults now say that they do not think it will be fair. this includes 46% of democrats and 56% of republicans as well as 56% of independents. so -- or 65%, i should say, of republicans and 56% of independents. that should be alarming to everybody who cares about a free

and fair election. is the president's messaging about a rigged election and against mail-in ballots penetrating? >> it is. and andrea, this is gravely concerning to me. it's not just that president trump is tweeting and speaking in ways that suggest, as he has for a long time, that somehow the system is rigged against him and that this election will be unfair. it's that there are now concrete action being taken by the postmaster general, president trump's appointee, which are changing the way mail is delivered in our country. i've got constituent calls and emails here in delaware from folks of all backgrounds in our counties complaining that their mail has been delayed, that they haven't gotten materials that were mailed to them. we've got shut-in seniors who rely on the postal service for their medication, for written communication with loved ones and family. and they are complaining that the changes the postmaster general has made have made it slower and more unreliable. there are five statewide primaries today, andrea, around

the country, and delaware recently had our primary, surprise, joe biden won, and it was the first time we've had a majority of ballots cast by mail. and for many states, knowing that the postal service can swiftly and reliably deliver mail-in ballots is going to be critical to the outcome here. the postmaster general has a sacred duty to our democracy to not interfere with how the postal service is operating and instead make sure that this vital part of our election machinery functions. we've had mail-in ballots, absentee ballots, posted by troops going back to the civil war, by americans overseas, in every election. there's no reason we can't conduct an election safely in this pandemic. but the president's tweets and speeches against it are steadily eroding public confidence. and andrea, that's dangerous. >> senator, i want to ask you about joe biden. you mentioned joe biden and

elections in delaware. there are a lot of indications that we're very close. is this imminent, the choice of a running mate? we understand the decision could have been made. >> joe's got all the information he needs. he's gotten all the input from the vetting teams and a chance to have conversations with the folks he's most seriously considering. i don't know who he's going to choose. but i know that it's coming very soon. this is one of the most consequential decisions former vice president biden will ever make, it will literally make history and change i believe not just the arc of this campaign but the trajectory of history. joe is the next possible candidate to be president and his running mate will play a critical part in shaping his administration and in how a biden administration will respond to this pandemic, to the recession, to very real concerns about racial injustice and inequality. i'm excited to stand alongside vice president biden as he makes this announcement, to stand by him virtually as he and his

running mate are introduced to the country. >> you said it will make history. there have been women running mates before, sarah palin, geraldine ferraro. the only way it would really make history is if it is a black woman. >> andrea, let me just say, i'm optimistic that he will make the right choose and choose from among a pool of very capable and talented potential running mates, someone who will really contribute to making history, by making great decisions and by being a strong and capable leader. >> i think i have pushed you as far as i can for any clues. well-done. you could qualify for the cia, senator coons, nothing pejorative implied there, lots of respect. >> thanks, andrea. >> thanks very much. as a rising number of kids are testing positive for covid-19, new concerns about whether children can go back to school safely. and we know when joe biden's running mate will speak at next week's virtual democratic

convention. we just need to know who it is. the answer to all of the dnc questions, the party's chairman, tom perez, when we come back. this is "andrea mitchell reports" on msnbc. ports" on nbm. you doing okay?

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northern florida says it's a dangerous situation. >> it doesn't make sense for our health department to have these signs and tell everyone you need to be six feet apart, tell everyone you need to wear a mask, and now somehow at schools you don't need to be six feet apart, you don't need a mask. for some reason they think school is a magical place. >> a former health official, doctor, thanks for being with us. we have colleges pulling back from decisions where they thought they could have residential programming in the fall. you have schools pushing ahead, mixed messages from the white house, other than get them back in school, it's what we need for the economy. teachers are afraid. parents are afraid. as well as being eager to get their children in school. and the president is saying that children are almost immune when we see incredible numbers of children becoming infected. can you give us some real facts,

medical facts? >> sure. well, we certainly know that kids can get the coronavirus infection and they can get sick. more than 500 have been hospitalized. less than half of those had preexisting conditions. the other half really weren't sick before. so kids can really get sick. they can also pass on the virus to their family members, to people at home, to their grandparents, as well as to teachers. so there are real risks. on the other hand, there are real benefits if kids can go to school, particularly for younger kids. we really want to see kids in school. how do you put all that together? there are really two points. number one, community transmission has to be low before you can open schools. and number two, you do have to take all those precautions. like that teacher said, school is not a magical place. keep kids separate, wear a mask, reduce class size. those are the keys to doing it safely. that's the path that other countries who have opened schools safely took, keep

transmission levels low and take precautions. >> and would you permit children to go back to school without masks? >> in general, if they're old enough to wear a mask, i don't think i would. i think it would be a smart move to have kids wearing masks. that's really the recommendation of the cdc. and, you know, what you don't want is a lot of transmission in school. and what you saw in places like israel, when they kind of went back to business as usual, is that european tens, dozens, scores of kids were getting sick and bringing it home. and that's what you want to avoid. we don't want to see school openings make everything worse and then you have to shut down schools and then, you know, it's just a never-ending cycle of problems with the coronavirus. >> what are your cautions about college campuses with residential living and students sharing rooms, bathrooms, having physical relationships? >> yeah, well, i'm worried.

i'm worried also that in some college towns, they still have bars open. it's very, very clear from just the little bit we've seen of kids on campus this summer that there can be major outbreaks. kids in that age group, young people, can really transmit the virus. so again, you would want to see community levels low and a lot of extra precautions this year. hopefully maybe the threat of having to go back home with your parents will keep kids in line. they're going to have to realize that it's their behavior that will determine whether or not schools can stay open. >> and finally, how seriously do you take vladimir putin's announcement that they have -- that they are the first to have a successful vaccine and a safe vaccine? >> so this is not actually an announcement of a scientific achievement. there's no scientific achievement. there's no safe and effective vaccine until the studies are done to show that a vaccine is safe and effective. it's just an assertion on his

part that you don't really need data on safety and effectiveness. i think the united states and other countries are right to wait for data to know whether a vaccine works and is safe. >> thank you so much, dr. sharfstein, always good to talk to you. we believe joe biden has made his choice. when will the world know who it is? a preview of the democratic convention with dnc chair tom perez, coming up. and more one . it all ships free. and with new deals every day you can explore endless options at every price point. get your outdoor oasis delivered fast so you can get the good times going. ♪ wayfair. you've got just what i need. ♪ find your get-up-and-go. find pants that aren't sweats.

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it's down to the wire with just six days before the democratic national convention kicks off virtually. joe biden is set to announce his vice presidential choice as soon as this afternoon. we're told it is imminent. nbc news correspondent mike memoli joins me from wilmington where he's been watching everything, on top of every development. he's done this before. mike, you are the biden watcher. >> reporter: yeah, andrea, well, at this point everything we're seeing, we're hearing, and just as importantly, perhaps, everything we're not seeing and not hearing, suggests to us, as you say, this choice, this announcement is imminent. having covered joe biden over the years, we know over the weekend he spent time huddling with his family, their counsel so important in any big biden decision. i would expect over the last week or so, he's been sounding out his closest and most loyal political supporters as well on this choice. we should also note what we've

seen over the last week, since the announcement of biden moving his convention acceptance speech to delaware, obviously a relocation of staff to help build that out, but in the last 24 hours also seeing the arrival of some of the most important biden staffers who would help facilitate a major public event as well. our colleague seeing a significant activity downtown at the hotel dupont. why is that important? it's the site where joe biden celebrated his first election victory in 1972. we've been expecting virtual announcement of this choice, the campaign encouraging people to sign up for their email and text list, but perhaps an in-person component as well that the campaign is readying here. you'll be speaking with the dnc chairman, we notice in the order

of speakse speakers, kamala har elizabeth warren, but not susan rice and some other contenders. >> thanks so much. joining me now, tom perez, chair of the democratic national committee. mr. chairman, thank you very much. we want to talk about your convention, the big speakers. but let's talk about the choice of running mate. senator coons just told me it will be an historic choice, this will not just be the first woman on a major party ticket, we know that, but the historical choice would be a black woman. >> it will be historic when we win in november and we have the first female vice president in american history. and i've had the privilege, andrea, of working with all of the people who are in contention, and it's a deep bench. and whatever the vice president decides, when we win in november, that will indeed be historic.

and this vice president has been very bold. i remember march 15 when he said at the presidential debate, i'm going to put a woman on the ticket. i remember in south carolina when he said i'm going to put an african-american woman on the supreme court. the vice president has always led. and i think this is going to be a really exciting moment. our convention is going to be about uniting america, bringing everyone together. it's a convention for everyone, regardless of who you voted for in the past. it will undeniably be different. but i think it's going to be absolutely exhilarating. when we elect our first woman in the history of this country as vice president, that will be a legacy of joe biden that will live on forever. >> and when we talk about it being imminent, we're talking about today, do you think it will be announced today? >> i'm not sure. i think that's really up to the

vice president and his team. i know this process pretty well, it's a very thorough vetting. and joe biden, more than anyone in america, knows what the job of vice president is. and i know, knowing him, he wants to dot his i's, cross his t's, and that's exactly what he's doing. but obviously it will happen this week, and i couldn't be more thrilled moving forward. this is going to give us even more momentum going into our convention next week. >> i know you've got a huge, wonderful list of speakers in terms of democratic star power. you've got barack obama at the end of the week and you've got michelle obama and as well as dr. jill biden, president clinton, hillary clinton. we're talking about about a big schedule, we've put it up on the board. how impactful can they be, though, since they'll be virtual, you won't have

audiences, you won't have balloon drops, you won't have hoopla from the delegations on the floor, you won't have the floor reporters, us correspondents going around and getting great moments with people. so how do you make up for all of that? >> oh, we're going to have a convention, obviously partially in milwaukee and across america. i think it will be really exciting. yes, there will be less podiums. but there will be more union halls. there will be more kitchen tables. there will be remarkable excitement. you put out the leaders, many of whom have been leading us through this pandemic, governors and mayors. and then there are also the unsung heroes, the dreamer who is a paramedic, saving lives every single day. the people who were lifelong republicans, average americans. one person who, a big trump supporter, big opponent of the aca, lost his job, lost his

health care, got diagnosed with cancer, and now understands the aca 15i achla saved his life. we will have an array of democratic stars and an array of equally important people who are ordinary people doing extraordinary things. our convention is going to be about unity. it's going to be about bringing our country together. it's going to be about hope. joe biden is a chronic optimist. he is the uniter in chief that we need. this is a convention for everyone, regardless who have you voted for in the past, because our democracy is on the line. that's why joe biden is truly in my judgment the person for the moment, because he can bring us together, he can restore honor to the white house, he can restore competence to the white house, and he will do that. and he will fight for everyone. we so need a uniter in this country right now, and that's what joe biden will do. and that's what we're going to do next week. and i'm excited about it. it's going to be an exhilarating

moment, set of moments. a few surprises. and i think people are going to come out of this with a real sense of what the democratic party is. we're fighting for an america that works for everyone. we're going to make sure we deal with this coronavirus. we're going to make sure we put science first and we put people first. >> one final thing, bringing the party together, very important. does bernie sanders get prime time? >> oh, senator sanders is one of the speakers next week, and we're excited to have him. >> no, my question is, at what hour -- my question is whether -- what time of night he'll be speaking. >> between 9:00 and 11:00 east coast time. senator sanders will be i believe it's tuesday night, but i'm not 100% sure, i forgot what night he will be speaking, it's monday or tuesday night. and again, the thing that -- one of the many things we have going

for us is the unity of our party. all of the presidential candidates have been full-throated for joe biden and i'm thrilled that senator sanders will be one of our speakers next week because, again, he speaks for so many millions of people who want to make sure the democratic party works for them. >> tom perez, mr. chairman, thank you very much, a big week coming up. we're all going to be tuning in. >> look forward to it. >> we thank you for being with us to preview it. >> take care. while women top joe biden's vice presidential contenders list, being a woman in politics can make you a target as well. former katie hill found that out. she joins me next. she joins me .

katie hill was considered a rising hair in the democratic party in 2018. she flipped a republican district in california blue, and was part of a wave of women elected to congress. but less than a year later she

resigned from congress after nude photos of her, allegedly leaked by an ex-husband, appeared online, sparking allegations of an inappropriate relationship with a staff member. in a resignation speech on the house floor she said she was stepping down because of what she called a misogynistic culture that lets men keep their jobs despite far worse behavior but punishes women unfairly. >> i am leaving. but we have men who have been credibly accused of intentional acts of sexual violence and remain in boardrooms, on the supreme court, in this very body, and worst of all, in the oval office. >> joining me now is former california congresswoman katie hill. her new book out today is "she will rise: becoming a warrior in the battle for true equality." katie hill, it's great to see you, thank you very much. thank you for telling your story, it's a difficult story, but there's no denying that women in politics in particular

are faced with an incredible double standard. we're seeing that even in the vetting of these extraordinary women being considered for the vice presidential ticket. >> absolutely. and that's one of the biggest reasons i decided to write the book, is that i feel like my experiences are, you know, it's just mine, but they're so universal across -- whether it's experiences around sexual assault or an abusive relationship or even the way that power manifests and how women are treated once they are in power. so we need to have a plan to dismantle those systemic blockades that women are facing. and the only way that we're ultimately going to get there to true equality, as we're facing 100 years with the right to vote, and this vice presidential pick is so monumental, so important, and i hope it causes us to reflect on the ways women are treated differently and open up pathways to move forward.

>> how would you advise the women, the action group, the coalition who have come together to try to support the woman chosen, potentially today, from these attacks and star eereotyp? >> it's so important that they formed this group, and know that the misogynistic attacks are about to begin, they've begun already. the advice i would give is just that -- and i don't think they need this advice at all, but just that we have to stand strong and that we have to call it out wherever we see it. we need to say these are tropes, these are the same kind of things that you hear only about women. we do not hear it when the same kind of thing happens with a man. those of us who are not necessarily in that group but who are allies and supportive of the ticket overall, we need to chime in and say, whether it's within our party or outside of our party, this isn't okay.

and the truth is, it's something we're going to continue to face for a long time. the more we can elevate the discussion, that this isn't equality until we actually face all these issues. >> do you regret quitting congress? >> i felt at the time that it was the only option that i had and that it was the right thing to do. so i don't regret it. but i think it's really important for me to have the right mission and path moving forward. that's why i started the pac to help women candidates and to help mobilize young women as voters and to help push forward this legislation that i outline in the book, that i think will really be key for us achieving equality. so i'm focused on that. i'm excited that the book is out today. and i'm excited for the future. >> congratulations on the book, and thank you so much for your transparency. it's very valuable. thank you, katie hill. >> thank you, great to see you.

joe biden set to make his choice for running mate. what does history tell us about the importance of the vice presidential choice and how biden could make history with his selection. you're watching "andrea mitchell reports" on msnbc. tchell reports" on msnbc. silence our p. who knows where that button is? i don't have silent. everyone does -- right up here. it happens to all of us. we buy a new home, and we turn into our parents. what i do is help new homeowners overcome this. what is that, an adjustable spanner? good choice, steve. okay, don't forget you're not assisting him. you hired him. if you have nowhere to sit, you have too many. who else reads books about submarines? my dad. yeah. oh, those are -- progressive can't protect you from becoming your parents, but we can protect your home and auto when you bundle with us. look at that. when you bundle with us. the countdown has begun... 'til everyone can enjoy a professional clean feel... at home.

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learn from past choices about whether the running mate makes a difference? joining me is shawna thomas, content executive for quibi and nbc news political contributor and nbc news presidential historian, michael beschloss. with all the normal cautions, all the signs from a lot of reporting from our teams are that the decision is made, it could be unveiled very, very soon. it's imminent, we understand. shawna, we know among the choices, the final choices, were at least two women of color, two black women, kamala harris, susan rice, we also believe governor gretchen whitmer was in the mix. how important given the raised expectations, the conversation and announcement from 100 black men yesterday echoing what women had said, how important is it to make history with a black woman as running mate? >> i think it is pretty important. i'm not saying i am telling joe biden that he needs to choose a black woman, but if he doesn't,

it is taking a step back from the history for a sending and going to the politics, then instead of having a roll-out where you get to dominate the news cycle for a little bit with what is positive news, you're going to have a roll-out that will still be positive because he may be choosing the first woman vice president to actually, you know, live at the naval observatory. but he will have to deal with a bunch of articles about why he didn't choose a black woman and he'll have to deal with a bunch of articles about why -- and a lot of media coverage of, everything that was sort of said about senator harris, about is she too ambitious and what does that mean? what does that mean when that comes out of a white man's mouth? all of that. he has this added layer of media pressure to this because, going back to your original question, because it could be such an historic pick. he could be seen as the guy who helps black women get a real seat at the table, really in the room. and i'm not saying black people are going to vote for him

because he chooses a black woman, but i am saying, especially in the time period we're in now, there is something about that level of representation that would mean a lot to people. >> if it is kamala harris, of course, the energy and enthusiasm, the excitement that she had, at least in the roll-out in oakland for her presidential campaign, which didn't live up to expectations in terms of the execution of that campaign, but the fact that she is a good debater, that, in fact, we know she's had that experience. he did once say michael beschloss, that having a presidential campaign experience was one important factor, not all the factors. that governing experience and that the ability to be a governing partner, i should say, is the most important thing on his list. we think that we'll know very soon. you've looked at history for decades at this. and some people say it's not important because, if they don't

turn a state, a battleground state, it doesn't matter. but your argument in your great column today in "the washington post" is, it is important when it matters is when you have a carter or mondale, a team that really makes sense governing. >> right, totally changes history, andrea. and shawna is absolutely right. look at all these vice presidents of the past. is there one black person? no. is there one woman who served as vice president? no. there's only been one traditional practicing catholic in the whole history of the vice presidency. doesn't mirror our glorious diversity. when you look through history, not only do a lot of these vice presidents in various ways become future presidents, for instance, every vice president since 1928 has explored the idea of running for president. so these are possible future presidents. but at the same time, one choice can change history. ronald reagan, at the last minute, put george h.w. bush, as you well know and remember,

andrea. 1980, on his ticket. the result was that bush served for eight years as vice president, four years as president, and later on his son served for eight years, totally changed the whole history of the next 30 years. that could be happening today or tomorrow. >> and we also saw, of course, the kennedy/johnson, you know, partnership. we know how they were rivals. and joe biden has said he has long forgiven kamala harris going after him, michael, in that first debate. >> right. but it's -- you put your finger on it. it is really important for joe biden to pick someone he has personal chemistry with. none of us on the outside can know who that is. we will know very soon. i write in that "washington post" column today about the fact that in 2004, john kerry, the democratic nominee, was prevailed upon to choose john edwards who would run against him in the primary. kerry privately was uneasy.

he felt that edwards, he said, didn't add up. he felt he was undependable. at the last minute he even called up ted kennedy and said, make the case for chris dodd who is helping biden this year, although dodd was from a neighboring state, another catholic liberal. so all this happens. history shows us a lot, but each vice presidential selection unfolds in its own way. we'll see that soon. >> michael beschloss, shawna thomas, great to have you both. and that does it for this edition of "andrea mitchell reports." stay tuned to msnbc. we'll likely have breaking news. chris jansing picks up our coverage including a special report about education secretary betsy devos who has spent the summer living in her multi-million-dollar mansion, her summer resort in michigan with federal protection while being absent from the debate about how to reopen schools.

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hello. i'm chris jansing. we have got a lot to cover this hour. in just a few hours, president trump will be holding another news conference at the white house. we expect him to discuss the coronavirus vaccine development in the u.s. just hours after russian president vladimir putin claimed publicly, but without providing evidence, that