get a winner on election night, what are you going to do? >> we'll put them down very quickly. we have the right and power to do that if we want. look, it's called insurrection. it's very easy. i'd rather not do that, but if we had to we'd do that and put it down within minutes. >> good morning, it's "a.m. joy" and i'm jonathan capehart. after saying whether he'd ensure a peaceful transition of power, donald trump is now vowing to unilaterallily shut down any potential riots on election night should he win. during a rambling interview on fox with judge jeanine pirro saturday night, he praised the idea of retribution and even suitably suggested the supporters would eventually revolt against so-called left wing violence. >> we're not there yet, but we have people that very angry.

you start seeing them. the trucks come in and this comes in and that. all of a sudden, you're going to see backlash the likes of which you haven't seen in many, many years. because people aren't going to take it. you know, a lot of people -- this is all a left movement, not a right movement. >> right. >> but a lot of the people on the right are watching their television set, looking at kenosha and looking at chicago where they shoot people and kill people by the dozens every week. >> right. >> it's not even believable. >> trump's affinity for law and order, foreign dictators and unilateral federal power make the revelations in bob woodward and his threats of national security all the more clear. he bragged to bob woodward about saving the saudi prince who was accused of ordering the murder of "washington post" column khashoggi and he fawned over kim jong-un, calling him far beyond smart. but donald trump's rhetoric and

admiration for men like these is even more alarming. when long-time trump associates like roger stone publicly advised the president to declare martial law and seize total power if he loses the election. >> if someone were to study the president's authority in the insurrection act and if there's widespread -- he'll have the authority to arrest the clintons to arrest anybody else who could be proven to be involved in illegal activity. >> all right. we have to talk about that. joining me is jeh johnson, and dan rather, access tv host and author of "what unites us." thank you very much for being here this morning. and jeh, i want to start with you. because that quote from roger

stone and also the clips we just heard from president trump to me are deeply alarming. you are a former secretary of the homeland security. how do those two sound bites hit you? >> first, jonathan, thanks for having me on. >> sure. >> mr. rather, nice to see you. jonathan -- >> okay. sounds like we're having -- i think we're having -- we're going to fix secretary johnson's audio. so dan rather, let me come to you. as veteran journalist, and particularly when you started out your career you were covering the civil rights demonstrations. the last time we went through social and racial upheaval in this country. when you hear the president of the united states speaking like that and associates of the president like roger stone talking about the insurrection act, what do you think? >> well, what i think is that it

helps us give the proper framing to this presidential election. what this presidential election is about is whether the country's going to move more in the direction of white supremacy or move more in the direction of a multiracial, constitutional republic based on the freedom and the democracy. that's the proper frame, in which we now should put this election given what the president says, what he's been doing. this long list of things. no sense going through the litany, but, you know, he knew in early february how serious the coronavirus was, but he repeatedly misled the american people. he said using an excuse and a lie he didn't want to spread panic. well, throughout his entire presidency and particularly during this presidential re-election campaign he's been trying to get people panicked.

panicked about dangerous people moving into the suburban neighborhood, panic over immigration. he's asking us to believe that when it came to the coronavirus he just didn't want to spread panic. anybody who believes this will believe that rocks grow and we're going to find out how many people are dumb enough to believe that. i'd like to think that most people in the country recognize it for what it is and that is an excuse and it's a lie and it's outrageous and it's very dangerous. >> dan, i'm so glad you said what you said at the beginning of your answer that this election is really a choice between american democracy and white supremacy. that is the way i wrote a column about that. this is the way i have been viewing -- viewing this election. this -- we have only two choices. my big fear and again because of your sweep of reported history

you can talk more about this. my big fear is that white supremacy will win. am i being pessimistic or being realistic? >> no, i think you're being very realistic. i have this argument with people all the time about -- well, listen, the country would never buy this. listen, richard nixon used a version of this in 1968 to beat hubert humphrey and he won with it. ronald reagan used a version in '80 and '84 and he won with it and then of course we have donald trump winning in 2016. so the record of those who -- you have to keep white supremacy in order for the country to maintain itself as we'd like it to be, the record of those who win on it is very clear and that would be foolish to overlook the record. there is hope that this time it won't work. but donald trump has looked at the record and said, this is a winning strategy for nixon.

it was a winning strategy for ronald reagan. it's one for any number of candidates over the years and it's the reason he's following so it closely. >> we have secretary jeh johnson back, former secretary of homeland security. i want to bring you into this part of the conversation, and a that as dan rather said, i don't know if you can hear when we were getting your audio fixed, but this is an election that's a choice between american democracy and white supremacy and i just said to dan that i think my -- i'm afraid that white supremacy is going to win. you as a cabinet secretary and particularly of homeland security you have a bird's-eye view into this that neither of us have. from your perspective what do you think? >> dan made the very point -- hopefully there's no echo here, which is that the various campaign strategy is to create panic. though he says in talking to woodward i didn't want to create

a panic when it came to covid, you know, talked about how if biden gets elected he'll destroy the suburbs it's on the assumption -- >> okay, we're still having issues with secretary johnson's audio. we'll try to reconnect with him. mr. rather, i want to bring this question to you. the whistle-blower complaint that came out from dhs where a whistle-blower is complaining that officials in the department of homeland security have been telling folks within the department to basically skew their findings, to skew as you can see there on the thing -- on the monitor there from the dhs spokesperson who is saying that the department generally does not comment on the specifics of oig referrals but we flatly deny there's any truth to the merits of mr. murphy's claim and the

claim is that the department is downplaying the role of white supremacists and downplaying the threats to the national election. how dangerous is it that we have federal departments that are -- you know, actively manipulating intelligence, but also manipulating information that is meant for the american people? >> well, you say how dangerous is it? it's plenty dangerous and we all know this is very dangerous. this is the red lights blinking. the massaging of facts, and by the way, this is further proof that when president trump tries to compare himself to churchill and roosevelt in trying to defend himself about hiding and keeping from the american public how serious the coronavirus was, listen, churchill and roosevelt

spent their lifetime battling people like president trump, that's to say autocratic, deceitful people who try to keep things from the people at large. this is very dangerous. but i would like to say, jonathan, i think while it's easy and very tempting to express outrage at this, we need to keep a calm demeanor and try to explain to people how dangerous it is to have people with the responsibility of getting information to the public at large to help their health are massage or manipulating that information to fit the campaign re-election for anybody. i don't care if it's democrat or republican, independent, but this is dangerous. we need to have a calm demeanor and explain to people how dangerous it is to have this kind of thing happening. having the president saying in effect sending a message down to the ranks i want you to tailor

the health information to fit my campaign message. your question how dangerous is it? anybody who stops to think about that no matter what their political persuasion has to think that's very dangerous indeed. >> in the less than 90 seconds we have left, i want to get your reaction to finding out about the saudi prince and saying, quote, i saved his ass, president said following khashoggi's murder. quote, i was able to get congress to leave him alone. i was able to get them to stop. khashoggi was a colleague of mine at "the washington post" in the opinion section. he was a journalist, trying to speak truth to power, to saudi arabia. as a veteran journalist what does it say to you that the president of the united states is siding with someone accused of butchering someone in the united states writing for an american newspaper? >> well, jonathan, i want to give a measured response, as

difficult as it is to give a measured response because it's outrageous. i think the word to describe that is despicable given the facts of what the saudi government did and the very top of the saudi regime. this idea of american presidents, by the way, almost continually playing up to the saudis sooner or later this has got to stop. this takes it to the whole new low. >> also, having an american president not stand up for freedom of the press is also to me very concerning. thank you very much and we'll try to reconnect with jeh johnson a little bit later on in the show. coming up, joe lieberman explains his support for susan collins. that's next. ns his support for n collins. that's next.

we made usaa insurance for veterans like liz and mike. an army family who is always at the ready. so when they got a little surprise... two!? ...they didn't panic. they got a bigger car for their soon-to-be-bigger family. after shopping around for insurance, they called usaa - who helped find the right coverage for them and even some much-needed savings. that was the easy part. usaa insurance is made the way liz and mike need it- easy.

i want to ask senator collins who she thinks should be leading this country. she has neglected to answer that question. >> let me say this.

i don't think that the people of maine need my advice on whom to support for president. last week, i was on a bus tour all over the state of maine. not a single person asked me who should be our next president. >> friday night senator susan collins refused several times to reveal who she'll be voting for come november. i guess the truth is hard to reconcile with her political record of criticizing the president. while simultaneously voting with him a whopping 94% of the time during his first two years in office. this is after all the person who cast the deciding vote that put brett kavanaugh on the supreme court for life. polls show collins in a tight race for re-election with most polls actually showing her behind her democratic challenger, sarah gideon. but collins did recently win an endorsement from an unlikely source. a former democratic vice

presidential nominee. >> i'm a life long democrat but i put my country first, always. that's why i'm supporting susan collins for senate. i served with susan in the senate. she's independent, thoughtful, and a fighter for women's issues. susan always stands up for maine. she's worked to create jobs and improve health care and protect maine's environment. you don't get many like susan collins and when you do, you keep them. >> and joining me now is former vice presidential nominee, joe lieberman. thank you for being here this morning. >> thanks, jonathan, good to be with you. >> so senator, please explain why endorse republican senator susan collins over democrat sarah gideon. >> yeah, well, being a democrat is important to me and i have

been a democrat since i registered when john f. kennedy, my hero, was president. but -- where the problem in washington these days is people have become so loyal to party they forget other things. one of the things is friendship and susan collins and i worked very closely together. we were the top two members of our party on the homeland security committee. we got a lot done together. the second is that susan is by any independent estimate the most bipartisan person in the united states senate. in either party. and that's what washington needs today to get things done for the american people. so when people ask me about -- why i endorse her, i said of course i would. america needs her there. i know that susan collins will be what she's always been a

bridge, we worked together on homeland security. we worked together to repeal don't ask/don't tell. we did a lot of things together and she'll continue that bipartisan work. >> but senator lieberman, one of the things that send senators and representatives to washington to do is to stand up to power and speak truth to power no matter what the president is and what party that president is from and one of the problems people are having, why senator collins is having a hard time in her re-election is that she has not stood up to this president or said anything to hold him accountable. so why do you think she deserves to be -- to be sent back to washington when she at least on that measure that i just mentioned she's failed? >> well, jonathan, i don't have an answer, you have to ask senator collins about how she feels about president trump. i can tell you this, i'm for joe

biden. very strongly for joe biden for president. but that doesn't stop me from thinking that joe biden as president will need a republican senator like collins to work with to get his program enacted. >> that's interesting. you are clear. you are supporting joe biden? >> absolutely. >> so does it not -- go ahead. >> no, i served with joe for 24 years. he's honorable. he's effective. he has a program. look, president trump has been a disrupter in some ways as president that's been positive. in a lot of ways i disagree with the result and -- >> wait. does disrupter -- how has he been a disrupter in a positive sense? president trump. >> for instance, on some questions of foreign policy i disagreed with the iran nuclear agreement and he took us out of

the agreement and i think that's been good for our security, but in a lot of other ways the ways he's handled the pandemic or he's handled the response to the murders of african-americans by police, that's a disruption that i think has been negative and i think joe biden is the perfect person to step in and bring some unity not only to our government, or our country and frankly to bring a kind of calm which america needs right now to progress and have a better future. >> you know, we were talking in the first block about the president and his saying that he might have to invoke the insurrection act and sending in federal troops if there's so-called rioting on election night. how concerned are you that the president is itching for

confrontation, violent confrontation on election night or even through transition in order to hang on to power? >> well, i hate to hear that kind of conversation. i mean, the very thought that we're talking about a kind of violent uprising against the result of an election in america is a threat to our history, our constitutional order. i'll give you a personal moment. in 2000 i was honored to be the vice presidential nominate with al gore. when the supreme court made the bush v gore decision which i thought was unfair, it opened up a path for gore to go back to the florida supreme court to appeal and he said to me that night as we talked about it, we have to end this. i mean, we may have a chance in the florida court but it would mean that the country probably would not have a president on

inauguration day and we can't jeopardize the future of our country. incidentally, the fear that i have about the division of parties, exactly what leads me to support susan collins who's a bridge builder. president trump talks about the only threat is from the left. the threat is also from the right if he should be defeated on election day and i -- what i want to hear from him and everybody else is we will accept the result of the election. that's the way we do it in america. and anybody who suggests otherwise is really un-american. >> we have less than a minute left but i have to get your comments on something that's come out from the atlantic article about the president and what he had to say about members of the military and what speckly he had to say about your friend, the late senator mccain. trump told his senior staff according to three sources with

direct knowledge of this event, quote, we're not going to support that loser's funeral and he became furious when he saw flags lowered to half-staff. what the "f" are we doing that before? the guy was an f'ing loser the president told aides. you, john mccain and lindsey graham were the so-called three amigos. how does it feel to have the president of the united states talk about a statesman and a leader like john mccain but also someone who was your close friend? >> well, i have find it very offensive and i don't understand it. it's so irrational, even in the sense of doing something for political reasons. there's no political benefit in it. and i'll tell you what sustains me as i read these quotes. john was alive when -- during the campaign in 2016.

that was when then candidate trump called him a loser. john almost laughed at it because it was so crazy. he knew and everyone else knows, a great war hero and a great patriot who always put -- really john mccain always put america first. so his record speaks for itself and he's kind -- these kind of nonsensical comments i don't think really would affect john at all. you might -- he might get angry because he had a temper but i think it's so over the edge that he probably at some level would laugh at it. because he realized how ridiculous it is to call him a loser. >> senator joe lieberman who has endorsed republican senator collins for president who won't say who she's going to support for president, but joe lieberman

said he's voting for joe biden. >> absolutely. >> thank you so much for being on the show this morning. >> thanks, jonathan. coming up, donald trump's losers and suckers is still resonating. next up, we'll speak with some veterans who plan to take their talents to capitol hill. when the world gets complicated, a lot goes through your mind. with fidelity wealth management, your dedicated adviser can give you straightforward advice and tailored recommendations. that's the clarity you get with fidelity wealth management. no uh uh, no way

come on, no no n-n-n-no-no only discover has no annual fee on any card. (burke)) this? eh, nothing happened. (driver) nothing happened? (burke) nothing happened. (driver) sure looks like something happened. (burke) well, you've been with farmers for three years with zero auto claims. (driver) yeah? (burke) so you earned your policy perk: accident forgiveness. now instead of this being something, it' s- (driver) it's nothing! (burke) get a whole lot of something with farmers policy perks. they should really turn this ride off. ♪ we are farmers. bum-pa-dum, bum-bum-bum-bum ♪ with safe, convenient service. we're here for you >> tech: we'll come right to you. ♪ upbeat music >> tech: you'll get a text when we're on our way. >> tech: before we arrive, just leave your keys on the dash. we'll replace your windshield with safe, no-contact service. ♪ upbeat music >> tech: and that's service you can trust

when you need it the most. ♪ upbeat music >> tech: schedule at safelite.com. ♪ upbeat music >> singers: ♪ safelite repair, safelite replace. ♪ a lot of folks ask me why their dishwasher doesn't get everything clean. i tell them, it may be your detergent... that's why more dishwasher brands recommend cascade platinum... ...with the soaking, scrubbing and rinsing built right in. for sparkling-clean dishes, the first time. cascade platinum.

we began this show talking about donald trump's threat to put down any violent protests that might erupt on election night. i want to bring in former secretary jeh johnson. thank you very much for coming back. >> good old land line on the telephone still works so here aim. >> well, great, because it's more important to what you have to say than to see your face. can i get you as a former cabinet secretary and in particular the former secretary of homeland security, your thoughts on the president of the united states actively talking about invoking the insurrection act and sending troops into

american cities on election night. >> let's be fact and law-based here. the president's authority to do what he is threatening to do is actually quite limited. he's all over the place in talking about this. but, first of all, it is actually illegal to send members of of the military in uniform to a polling place in america. except if they intend to exercise the right to vote themselves. that's number one. number two, the insurrection act of 1807 is basically when all else has failed, all systems of government have failed when it comes to public safety and there's nothing left. the secretary of defense himself, mark esper, in june said exactly that. the insurrection act is a measure of last resort. and so when it comes to elections, when it comes to

polling places, the military should have nothing to do with that and when it comes to public safety, first and foremost, it is up to mayors and governors and police chiefs to keep the peace when things get out of control. the governors have the authority to use the national guard. then there's something called title 32 status where the governors continue to use the national guard but the feds pay for it, and only rarely does the national guard come under the control of the president. when there is something in the nature of an insurrection, which is truly a measure of last resort. >> one thing you -- i'm glad you took us down sort of the legal and -- the legal basis and the facts here. but what happens if the president's right wing followers hear what he says and on election night take it upon themselves to go to polling places and to go to cities as we

saw -- as has happened in portland, oregon, and kenosha, wisconsin. is there anything to stop those folks from doing things on their own? >> this is where national leadership really does count. people do listen to their president. he has the largest microphone and i find it absurd that in trying to find an excuse for not making a bigger deal of covid in march and february in his comments to bob woodward he said i didn't want to create a panic. his entire campaign strategy is based on trying to create a panic. on election day, in the event joe biden is elected. so there's going to be a real challenge if the president keeps sounding this alarm for state and local authorities to allow people to exercise their right to vote. i really do hope that our

national leaders if not the president do their best to tamp things down here. particularly joe biden who i know has been talking about this. americans have a right to vote either by mail or in person depending on what the state law permits in this covid crisis and those of us with a voice i believe have to encourage americans to exercise their right to vote in a peaceful, orderly manner consistent with our democracy. >> we have a minute left and i want to get your comments on this nbc news report that we have a whistle-blower said top dhs officials distorted intel to match trump's statements, lied to congress. you were the department of homeland security secretary. what do you say or how troubling is it to you that your former colleagues are tailoring information, tailing intelligence, to match up with the -- what the president says and not that the intel says?

>> jonathan, nothing could concern me more about my old department. when it comes to election interference by the russian governments, all lights are blinking red right now on the dashboard. if we believe the intel that has gotten through and has become public, they're attempting to hack into election infrastructure, they're engaging in the information aimed at the american people and americans need to be aware of that. congress needs to demand hearings on this. the americans have a right to know about this. and i'm concerned that if they're doing this at dhs, what else is our political leadership doing when it comes to the rest of the intelligence community? this is a big, big deal. >> jeh johnson, thank you very much for coming back to "a.m. joy." >> thank you. and more "a.m. joy" after the break. ou and more "a.m. joy" after the break. the chase mobile app, your bank can be virtually any place.

so, when you get a check... you can deposit it from here. and you can see your transactions and check your balance from here. you can save for an emergency from here. or pay bills from here. so when someone asks you, "where's your bank?" you can tell them: here's my bank. or here's my bank. or, here's my bank. because if you download and use the chase mobile app, your bank is virtually any place. visit chase.com/mobile. hold on one second... sure. okay... okay! safe drivers save 40%!!! guys! guys! check it out. safe drivers save 40%!!! safe drivers save 40%! safe drivers save 40%!!! that's safe drivers save 40%. it is, that's safe drivers save 40%. - he's right there. - it's him! he's here. he's right here.

- hi! - hi. hey! - that's totally him. - it's him! that's totally the guy. safe drivers do save 40%. click or call for a quote today. i'm a sustainability science researcher at amazon. climate change is the fight of our generation. the biggest obstacle right now is that we're running out of time. amazon now has a goal to be net zero carbon by 2040. we don't really know exactly how we are going to get there. it's going to be pretty hard. but one way or another we're going to reduce our carbon footprint to net zero. i want my son to know that i tried my hardest to make things better for his generation. -always have been. -and always will be. never letting anything get in my way. not the doubts, distractions, or voice in my head. and certainly not arthritis. new voltaren provides powerful arthritis pain relief to help me keep moving.

and it can help you too. feel the joy of movement with voltaren. we have different needs.y. feel the joy of movement but one thing we share is wanting to make our lives the best they can be. if you have medicare and medicaid, a dual complete plan from unitedhealthcare can help. giving you more benefits. at no extra cost. and a promise to be there for you. whatever your story may be. to learn more, call or go online. dual complete from unitedhealthcare.

when it comes to veterans, he's downright unamerican. i never said that about a president ever, ever, ever. but calling those who served, risked their lives, even gave their lives to our nation losers and suckers, these are heroes. i'll tell you something. my beau wasn't a loser or a sucker.

>> suckers and losers. last week, we learned in "the atlantic's" bombshell expose that's what he calls those who died in battle. and the president denies this and recent polling shows that the military families might be sticking by him. it used to that be that prior service was a de facto requirement for public service, but yet the total number of veterans dropped below a hundred in the congress since 1950. joining me now are veterans and congressional candidates pam keith, jackie gordon, and josh hicks. pam, jackie, josh, thank you all very much for being here. pam, since you have been here quite a few times i'm not going to start with you. let's start with jackie.

jackie, tell us, who are -- well, where are you running and whose seat are you trying to take? >> thanks, jonathan. thanks for having me. thanks for being here with josh and pam. i'm running in the new york second congressional district and i am -- will be taking congressman king's seat. he has announced his retirement so it's an open seat. >> josh, where are you running and whose seat are you trying to tyke? >> yes, sir, first, thank you for having me as well and it's an honor to be here. i'm running in kentucky, sixth district, running to take down incumbent andy barr. >> and pam, where are you running and whose seat are you trying to take? >> i am running in florida's 18th congressional district. i'm running against a veteran who supports everything donald trump says. florida 18 is the seat that delivers the state of florida. >> and so, josh, i'm going to come back to you and i want you

all to respond to this since you're all veterans. hearing what the president had to say about folks like you, just personally, not as a politician, but personally how disease it feel to hear those words attributed to the president of the united states? >> it's disgusting, jonathan. when you do something like military service, you are entering into a career, a field where you feel like you were serving something larger than yourself and to hear someone spit on that, to hear someone put that down, make derogatory comments about your services is just disgusting and worse than that, jonathan. it is disgusting that mitch mcconnell and my opponent barr won't stand up and say, no, no, we do support our veterans and not just when it's convenient or at election time but all the time when they come under attack from a commander in chief who doesn't know what service is.

>> jackie, is it surprising to you, are you surprised that we have a president of the united states who couldn't care less about your collective sacrifice on behalf of this country? >> it's disheartening, and it's really concerning for me as a blue star mom. right now, my daughter serves overseas. she's an air force captain and i'm concerned about her well-being. he is her commander in chief and as well as her colleagues. their safety is his responsibility and so i am truly concerned not only for my daughter, but for all of the service members that are out there serving. as a battalion commander it was my responsibility for my soldiers and service members safety so i know how important that is and i should hope that the commander in chief should take it as serious. >> so pam, i'm -- and anyone

else who wants to answer after pam answers, please jump in. why should anyone take into account your military service when trying to figure out whether to vote for you or not? why is serving in the military something that is needed on capitol hill right now? >> jonathan, i follow in my father's footsteps who served as naval officer in the early 1950s and he said, pamela, you don't serve the country you have. you serve the country you want to have. and that's why it matters to vote for veterans, because each one of us decided to get in the game, to put ourselves at service to make this country better. the gift from our founding fathers was not a perfect country. it was a country that could be made more perfect by those who are willing to invest of themselves to do so and that's

what our veterans do. they invest their entire life, their security, their future, their safety to making this a better and more perfect union. >> josh, i read something in your bio that jumped out at me and hit me in the heart. you didn't graduate -- initially you didn't graduate from college and you -- you didn't do well as a student in college and you left and you came home and you worked with your father. later on, as a father yourself, you didn't want your children to see -- to think that not going to college was something -- that was something that was okay. and you went and you worked and you went to school at the same time and that jumped out at me because the president of the united states in his comments about folks like y'all is that you guys went into the military because you didn't have other options, because you are somehow

deficient. if president trump were right here on the set next to me, what would you say to him in reaction to what he said about you? >> i would say i wasn't deefficient. service was an extension of my family's service and it was something i could show a dedication to something larger than myself and frankly it was learning that dedication that helped me come back home, work a full-time job and go to school full-time to provide a better life for my children because there are far more people like that take a stab at college and don't make it and live at poverty level wages to serve something larger than themselves than there are like mitch mcconnell or donald trump. i think folks like me have to have a voice in the halls of power so that folks who are so much like us get the benefit of

leadership that knows where they are. >> jackie, i want to put up this poll here and it's -- >> jonathan, before the poll, i'd like to respond to that. >> yes, ma'am, sure. >> i'm an immigrant and my parents brought me here for more opportunity and i think i'm the epitome of patriotism. i decided to serve while i was in school and i continued to serve while working as an educator. i did it simultaneously with four deployments so i gave back to this country that gave so much to me and every service member that i served with i would turn to them as an american service member if i was in need of anything and trust and believe they are not losers or suckers. >> all right. >> amen, amen. >> well, forget about that poll. pam, go ahead. >> well, my story is different. i graduated from boston college

law school and one of the top 25 law schools in the country, before i commissioned in the navy. i had other options but i decided that serving the community and country was better than my bottom line. some people have a tougher life history and they choose the military. some people choose it because it makes them feel like they're giving back. but all of us, all of us have each other's back and the back of our country because we love it and we believe in it. >> okay. we have less than a minute left so i'm going to do what i did the last time, pam. what's your website? >> it's pam fl for the state of florida.com. please give to florida. >> josh, your website? >> josh for congress.com and we'll be the swing district that gets rid of mitch mcconnell.

>> what's your website? >> jackie gordon for congress.com. thank you. >> good luck on the campaign trail, stay safe. thank you for being here this morning. >> thank you. coming up, 51 days until the presidential battle ground states that could hold the key. we have the experts who know the real story behind the latest polls. and to make sure your vote counts, be sure to visit nbc news. counts, be sure to visit nbc news false alarm. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ ever since darrell's family started using gain flings, their laundry smells more amazing than ever. ah, honey! isn't that the dog's towel?

hey, me towel su towel. there's more gain scent plus oxi boost and febreze odor remover in every fling. gain. seriously good scent. i've been involved in. communications in the media for 45 years. i've been taking prevagen on a regular basis for at least eight years. for me, the greatest benefit over the years has been that prevagen seems to help me recall things and also think more clearly. and i enthusiastically recommend prevagen. it has helped me an awful lot. prevagen. healthier brain. better life. >> tech: when you've got ...safelite can come to you. >> tech: and you'll get a text when we're on our way. >> tech: just leave your keys on the dash and we'll replace your windshield with safe, no-contact service.

>> tech: schedule at safelite.com. >> singers: ♪ safelite repair, safelite replace. ♪ go go go on a real vacation. visit go rving.com or your nearest rv dealer. that gives me cash back onesome new aeverything.akuten that's ebates. i get cash back on electronics, travel, clothes. you're talking about ebates. i can't stop talking about rakuten. pretty good deal - peter sfx [blender] ebates is now rakuten, sign up today. and when you save up to 60%, let's play! you're always a winner. you got... up to 60% off your hotel! >>but isn't that the only one? you're a winner! priceline. every trip is a big deal.

check this out,

pennsylvania, let's go right through the rust belt, the upper midwest here, pennsylvania has gone republican, 1988 is the last time pennsylvania went for a republican. michigan right now hillary clinton is losing in michigan, it's not official, we haven't called it yet. michigan 1988 last time george bush sr. the landslide over michael dukakis. wisconsin donald trump has won t last one to do it, ronald reagan 1984 over walter mondale. we have seen a brand-new way of looking at and thinking about this electoral map, it goes through the rust belt, through the upper midwest. welcome back to "a.m. joy," i'm jonathan capehart. all eyes are on the rust belt come november. those midwestern states, wisconsin, michigan and pennsylvania that were previously thought to be democratic strong holds before donald trump won them all in a historic sweep. but his surprise victory over hillary clinton in those states were by raising thin margins, combined less than 80,000 votes decided the outcome of the race.

for both trump and biden these states are crucial to win and both tickets are campaigning aggressively there. both mike pence and kamala harris visited wisconsin this week, a state hillary clinton notably did not visit in 2016. and in a recent visit to michigan trump even sounded more desperate than usual, his pleas replete with characteristic lies. >> after the last administration nearly killed the u.s. auto industry i saved the u.s. auto industry. >> we brought you a lot of car plants, michigan. we brought you a lot of car plants, you know that, right? >> on november 3rd, michigan, you better vote for me. i got you so many damn car plants. >> now, for what it's worth it was actually the obama/biden administration that famously bailed out the auto industry, which is perhaps why polls show trump in trouble. right now almost all polls show biden leading in those key battle ground states, but when the margin of error is accounted

for, the lead is not much more than a statistical tie. joining me now are rachel bittekoffer, john nichols, national affairs correspondent for the nation, and author of "the fight for the soul of the democratic party." connie schultz, fuel let'ser prize winning journalist and professor in residence at kent state. ken coleman senior reporter from the michigan advance. and lynn hayes freelan. thank you all very much for being here. i've been looking forward to this segment all weekend. rachel, i will start with you because the intro was all about these polls in the battle ground states and how once you apply the margin of error it's a statistical tie. you are an election forecaster. when you are looking at polls like that, what do you see?

>> yeah, i mean, these are polls that are very similar to the last cycle, except for this time they are accounting for weighting for non-college educated voters, so they're really not comparable, right? they are taking an adjustment that was not made last time, the people need to contextually understand and they are also really dealing -- there is an issue last cycle where we had atypical numbers of undecided and third-party voting that we aren't seeing in this cycle, too. so we have a much more settled electoral coming down the final stretch, but that said it's ultimately always going to come down to the percent of republicans that show up versus the percent of democrats and if democrats don't have a good turnout they would be in trouble. >> i want to go to michigan. ken, you are there in michigan and i was struck by that poll we were just talking about where biden is up plus seven from your vantage point in michigan. does that ring true to you?

>> i think the race is going to tighten. i do think the polls -- the polls that i've seen are essentially right. jonathan, what it's going to do is come down to turnout. if democrats come out the way they voted for president obama in '08 and in '12, i think biden has a strong chance of winning michigan. if they don't, it's going to be a very close race. >> ken, to that point, because one data point that blows my mind from 2016 is that 50,000, 5-0 thousand fewer people went to the polls in 2016 compared to 2012. from where you sit do you think turnout will bump back up to 2012 levels right now? >> i think so. i think there's an excitement about this race that we didn't necessarily see in '16. there is a lot of dissatisfaction about donald trump in michigan and it's just not in urban areas, it's in

outlying counties like oakland and macomb on the eastern side of the state and kent county on the western side of the state. i think there's sufficient excitement. now, the question becomes the mail-in process. >> right. >> the fact that covid-19 will have, that's an unknown we don't know right now. >> lynn, you are in pennsylvania. in that poll biden is up plus 3. pennsylvania was that state that trump won that had everyone gasping for air because that was supposed to be the ultimate fire wall. from where you sit right now, does that plus 3 make sense to you? >> i think it does make sense, but i think what's going to be interesting in this race is the mail-in ballot. i mean, right now everyone is talking about this thing called the red mirage. 90% of donald trump supporters are expected to vote in person, which is going to give one indication on election night,

but 64% of the democrats are expected to vote by mail-in ballot. so could it give one impression on election night, but, in fact, an all together different impression come the day or the week after the election? so that's what everyone is talking about and, in fact, the president even tweeted just last night about attacking the governor, his position on mail-in ballots and the lieutenant governor pushed right back. so far we haven't heard from governor wolf on that tweet from the president yesterday. >> let's go to wisconsin. john, in that poll wisconsin was plus 5 biden. in wisconsin from where you sit right now, does that -- does that make sense? >> it does make sense. it fits with four or five polls we have had recently that have shown it four, five, six points difference, almost always in that range. frankly, it's been around there for quite a long time. so the bottom line is that

wisconsin is a highly competitive state, it remains so, but it's fair to say that biden probably has a little bit of an advantage right now. the challenge, of course, is going to be how easy it is to vote and particularly on these absentee ballot issues which we've got a big fight going on right now. >> connie, you are at a disadvantage because i don't have any poll numbers for you, but you are there in ohio. how is the race looking from your vantage point in ohio? >> well, jonathan, fortunately i do have some poll numbers. >> oh, good. >> they are reflecting very similar, it is neck and neck at this point. six months ago i would not have been as optimistic that the state could flip for biden, now i am, in part because of the polls. for me when i look out here and what's going to matter is workers, workers, workers, not

just male or white workers. the majority of workers we are talking about are people of color and they are women. he promised, he vowed, remember that pledge about auto plants, he stood in lordstown and told the workers at the gm plant don't sell your homes, the jobs are coming back. that plant closed, 3,000 jobs were lost. recently he went after good year workers and encouraged the country to boycott good year tires. the other they think i keep thinking about is, you know, i'm married to u.s. senator sherry brown and i want to reveal that because i want to explain why i said in focus groups with trump voters all through 2018 during sherry's ultimately successful reelection the men were lost to us, the women towards the end started peeling off, their two issues were family separations and health care. health care before covid. as i keep saying every chance i get you cannot undie people and we will have lost clearly more than 200,000 by election day and this issue is going to be the make or break issue for donald trump and he can't recover.

>> there is one of the reasons why i was excited about this poll and especially having lynn and ken being a part of this panel is because when we talk about the industrial midwest, we talk about the rust belt, we talk about working class voters, people tend to forget that there are black people in wisconsin, michigan and pennsylvania and that they, too, are working class voters. i'm showing you this "new york times" piece here, stop pretending black midwesterners don't exist and it says it's not just the white working class that is suffering, it is the working class, period. we can't solve the problem if we refuse to see who those workers actually are. by 2032 according to the economic policy institute the american working class will be made up mostly of people of color, including black workers. ken, i'm going to come to you because in michigan there is -- there is detroit, and, you know, you are a journalist.

does it bother you that sometimes -- a lot of times the national conversation when it talks about the midwestern voter erases black voters and black workers? >> i'm always concerned about it. i'm happy to write for a news outlet "am i advance" that values diversity within our reporting and within our staff, but, yeah, i mean, you can go across the state in michigan and see african-americans and people of other ethnicities across the state. we make up african-americans about 15% of michigan's population, but all too few times do you see that reflected a lot in polling, national polling. sometimes even statewide polling. >> lynn, let me get you in on this as well. being in pennsylvania. >> you know, it's kind of

interesting because people tend to focus on pittsburgh and philadelphia and then there is the rest of the state, which tends to be largely white. it is not very diverse. but recently the naacp has launched an effort to do voter registration, to reach out specifically to black and brown people in that middle part of the state because they feel like that was a large part of the disenfranchised voter that didn't come out four years ago. so the goal is to reach out to them, make sure they're registered and encourage them to get to the polls. >> john, let me show you this poll that we have here among wisconsin and minnesota voters and you will see a range of things, race relations, unifying america, handling protests, violent crime and law and order. when it comes to violent crime and law and order, former vice president biden an president

trump are pretty close there. how as we go -- get closer to election day, how likely is it that those numbers will flip when it comes to violent crime and law and order, especially when you have the president of the united states fanning the flames of both fear of both of those things? >> look, the president is trying very, very hard to exploit every angle he can and so he has pushed the law and order issue very, very that are. he has brutal ads up in wisconsin right now that talk about what happened this kenosha late last month, the killing -- or, i'm sorry, the killing of two protesters, the shooting seven times of jacob blake in the back by a police officer, instead of trying to calm circumstances trump has tried at every turn again to exploit and basically try to drive wedges there. but what's important to

understand is that the polling we are looking at now, especially some polling that just came out in the last few days, comes after kenosha, after trump has thrown everything he can into it. so i'm not sure, jonathan, that those numbers are going to flip. i think that in reality what we're seeing is the playout as it is. one final thing i would put in the mix, though, and i think this is important, we're talking about african-american voters, we're talking about voters in -- not just our big cities but rural areas. in wisconsin our state supreme court halted the mailing of absentee ballots on thursday. we had a million people who had requested absentee ballots and that's really critical to this whole thing because when we talk about those voting, the early absentee ballots, that's votes locked in. so the polling you're seeing now is accurate but will it be

accurate if we mess up the absentee voting pattern and folks have to wait longer, if there are all the complexities to it? so making predictions at this point is of course rooted in polling but it must also be rooted in the very complex request he in wisconsin and i think a number of other states of whether we have a free and fair and functional election. >> you know, connie, i was just reminded of a report from syk the abc affiliate there in columbus, ohio, about president trump pulling his ads, the ad buy, in ohio. quote, if donald trump is pulling tv from ohio because he thinks he's got it here or can't win here i think that would be a mistake said david pepper. ohio right now is an arm wrestling match. that matches what you were saying in your previous answer. what i'm asking you about this, though, is if the president is pulling his ad buy from ohio, do

you think that means that, as you said, the state actually is going to flip? >> well, it certainly shows a lack of confidence on the part of the trump campaign, i think, right now. that was a $5 million ad buy that they pulled. i keep -- i was listening as you were all talking about the violent images that donald trump is trying to use to -- how do i say this? we are already terrified in this country. covid has done that to millions of americans since march. we're tired of being scared. i don't think he's going to gain from this law and order. first of all, the mess that he keeps talking about is the mess that is his to deal with. he is the reason -- the only positive for black lives matter out of this is trump because of his policies we are finally at a place where it has been prioritized across the country and it is a movement and it is going to keep gaining steam and the thing is we're really tired

of him pretending that black people are the problem. the problem -- part of it, though, and the discussion is we keep talking about the black communities as if it were separate from those of us who are white. this is my community, too. these are my kids getting shot, too. the more we think about america as opposed to these little silos of communities, the more dangerous it is for donald trump in his reelection bid to keep [ inaudible ]. >> connie is not even a preacher but she just took -- you took me to church there with that answer. rachel, i want to end the conversation in less than a minute that we have left and put the question to you that i put to dan rather and secretary jeh johnson earlier in the show. to me it seems like this election is going to be a choice between american democracy and white supremacy. you are the election forecaster, you also agree that this is going to be about turnout. so from your perspective right now which one is going to win? >> it's going to be a matter of which ballots get counted ultimately, jonathan, and that's

going to be a major theme of this forecast. update that's going to be released on tuesday at 6:00 a.m. where i go through my forecast update, which is some revised modeling with my new co-author samuel epstein which still shows an overwhelming advantage for biden, for democrats all across the country, but we have already seen an 8% rejection rate of african-american ballots in north carolina compared to a 3% or 1% rate for white ballots. we really can't model that and i talk about how nate silvers' model, the economists model, all of these models are measuring some version of public sentiment or voter sentiment or voter turnout, right? and it's not -- they're not designed to measure can these ballots reach an electoral board and get counted accurately and fairly. so those are things that people need to keep in mind and all the party organizations really need to follow up with these abs tease, especially, that are filed early that don't get counted and let voters know, hey, your vote is not yet

counted. >> 6:00 a.m. tuesday, your next election forecast comes out. if you know who rachel is, you better crash that website on tuesday because she's got an excellent track record. rachel, john, ken, lynn, thank you very much for being here this morning. >> thank you. >> connie schultz will join us again later in the show. coming up, a group of fairytale actors are ready to storm wisconsin to support badger state democrats. n to supt badger state democrats >> bye-bye, boys. >> have fun storming the castle. >> think it will work? >> it would take a miracle. bye-bye. from fidelity. now you can trade stocks and etfs for any amount you choose instead of buying by the share. all with no commissions. stocks by the slice from fidelity. get your slice today. an army family who is always at the ready. so when they got a little surprise...

two!? ...they didn't panic. they got a bigger car for their soon-to-be-bigger family. after shopping around for insurance, they called usaa - who helped find the right coverage for them and even some much-needed savings. that was the easy part. usaa insurance is made the way liz and mike need it- easy. come out of the dryer wrinkled? usaa insurance is made the way liz and mike need it- next time try bounce wrinkle guard dryer sheets. the world's first mega sheet with 3x more wrinkle relaxers. the wrinkle guard shirt has less wrinkles and static, and more softness and freshnes*á bounce out wrinkles with bounce wrinkle guard dryer sheets!

all otc pain relievers including volthave one thing in common none are proven stronger or more effective against pain than salonpas patch large there's surprising power in this patch salonpas dependable, powerful relief. hisamitsu.

i got this mountain bike for only $11. dealdash.com, the fair and honest bidding site. an ipad worth $505, was sold for less than $24; a playstation 4 for less than $16; and a schultz 4k television for less than $2. i won these bluetooth headphones for $20. i got these three suitcases for less than $40. and

shipping is always free. go to dealdash.com right now and see how much you can save. he can farce. >> farce. farce. alas. >> probably he means no harm.

>> he is very short on charm. >> you have a great gift for rhyme. >> yes. yes. some of the time. >> enough of that. are there rocks ahead? >> if there are, we will be dead. >> no more rhymes now. i mean it. the cast of the 1987 classic film "princess bride" will virtually set sail tonight with a live stream script reading for joe biden. "princess bride" super fan senator ted cruz didn't appear too thrilled as he expressed his sadness that his favorite movie was supporting the democratic party, quoting it as, quote, the ultimate -- the sound of ultimate suffering. i can't believe i messed up the classic line from the movie. one of the stars carrie ellis tweeted, ted cruz, if you only

left the fire swamp you could join us. well, joining me now is the director of "the princess bride" rob reiner and wesley carrie ellis who played wesley in the film. thank you for being here. >> our pleasure. >> so, rob, you are here all the time, but carrie is not here all the time so i'm going to start with him. why is it important to you to do this for the wisconsin democratic party? >> well, i have a very good friend who is from wisconsin and i learned from her that wisconsin is a key battle ground state in this election and i also learned that before the pandemic wisconsin led the nation in farm bankruptcies, one in seven people have lost their jobs and with it their health insurance, income inequality is at the highest since the great depression and suicide rates are up by 40%. 12% of people and 20% of kids in wisconsin are food insecure.

that is all a result of president trump and this administration. >> and, rob, i mean, we all -- everyone watching this show knows how much you care about this country and care about the party and the direction of the country, but why do you think it's important that this be done for the wisconsin democratic party? >> well, this election is going to come down to six or eight states, as you know, wisconsin being one of them. key battle ground state and we have to win it. we lost it last time and we have to win it this time. you know, jonathan, you were talking earlier and you've been talking throughout the show about this is a fight for democracy versus white supremacy. you've been saying this over and over. and that's true. i believe that is 100% true. the problem we have now is that when we had this civil war back in the 1860s, we had abraham lincoln in the white house. now we've got jefferson davis in

the white house and so it's very scary the idea that we are engaging in this modern day civil war and we have the president who now controls the levers of government. that's my fear. we're going to get turnout. nout just the volume of votes we're going to get between 5 and 7 million more votes, i believe than trump but the problem is, he controls all the levers of government he is perverted all of the agents, whether it's the jus at this time department, state department, homeland security, even our health departments, to the point where i'm frightened he is going to try to do anything to pervert this election he stole it last time with the help of the russians. but this time, he is doing it on steroids because he has -- he controlled the government. so that's my fear.

we have -- this is all hands on deck from now until election day. because the democracy depends on it and whether or not we sustain the 244 years of self-rule that we have started during the birth of our country. there couldn't be more at stake than what's here at this election. i know i sound hyperbolic. >> not to me. >> i believec. everything i'm saying here is true. >> i want to read a quote from you that's in a statement released by -- through the wisconsin state party. you said, donald trump has abdicated hisas duties. he failed to keep the country safe from covid-19 and as a result, he is responsible for the devastating chaos, violence and economic collapse that we are now experiencing. you are an actor. there's some folks who think actors should stay on the small screen or stay on the big screen and stay out of other stuff.

why is it or was it important for you or is it important to you to be vocal about where things are in the country andl vocal in your opposition to the current president? >> yeah. first of all, i don't consider myself an actor. i'm a a human being first and a actor happens to be my profession. as a human being, i care about my family. i have a 13-year-old daughter. and i care about what's going to happen to her. and i feel, as rob says, that if we allow this president to get back into office for four more years, you can see honestly the beginning of the end of this great democracy. there's no question as rob says he is going to create a constitutional crisis if he doesn't win. c i'm very concerned for the future, for my family. yeah, it's all hands on deck as rob says. >> rob, it's all hands on deck.

but there are a lot of people whose hands are -- they are shaky. they are actually trying to figure out whether they're going to vote for the incumbent or vote for joe biden. what would you say to those folks who either say they're independent or say they're not quite sure ifor they're going t vote for trump for re-election? >> to me, it's astounding that you can't make that decision. there couldn't be a greater contrast between these two men. joe biden is a solid citizen. he doesn't c lie to people. he is compassionate. he has empathy. he has experience. he has respect around the world. donaldrl trump has none of thos things. you can't have a greater disparity between two human beings. i would say to people, if you have trouble making up your mind, i don't know what to say to you, because the contrast

couldn't be more stark.co all you have to do is say, look at where we are, by election day, there's going to be close to 250,000 to 300,000 americans dead, hundreds of thousands of those did not have to be dead. if we had joe biden in there, hundreds of thousands less woul be dead because he had a very specific national plan on how to save those lives. this is gave up his responsibility. >> cary, you have the last word. what would you say to the undecided voter right now? >> well, i heard your previous guest talk about the supreme court possibly trying to interfere in wisconsin now by making people redo their absentee ballots. this is a clear case of voter

suppression and trying to create confusion at the ballot. i would say to all the people in wisconsin who are not sure about what's going on, make sure that you are registered to vote. make sure you reregister if the supreme court does try to invalidate those ballots. the last time there was apathy in the vote. this time we need to make sure we put an end to the chaos and corruption. >> i'm sure there are wisconsin voters who say, as you wish. with that, thank you very much. great to see you, thank you both for being here. >> thank you. >> thank you so much. next up, a fact check on the trump sunday morning show players. keep it right here.tr

facing leaks takes strength, so here's to the strong, who trust in our performance and comfortable, long-lasting protection. because your strength is supported by ours. depend. the only thing stronger than us, is you.

tonight, our hearts are with

all of the communities in the west battling devastating wildfires. i'm going there the day after tomorrow. i'm staying in your state tonight, but i'm going to california. spoke to the folks in oregon. they'ring a they never had anything like this. it's about forest management. remember the words, forest management. please remember. it's about forest management. and other things, but forest management. >> donald trump is doing his level best to make sure his followers keep the words forest management, as you heard four times there, locked in their brains as they watch the wildfires ravaging the western united states. joe biden thinks americans should pay attention to a couple other words. biden posted this on his website. science is clear and deadly signs like these are unmistakable. climate change poses an

imminent, existential threat to our way of life. president trump can try to deny that reality, but the facts are undeniable. trump's forest management versus biden's climate change argument may be a preview of the upcoming debates. yesterday, we showed you how climate change is supercharging problems all over the globe. just to be fair and balanced, today we will show you where donald trump's forest management theory might come from. this is how he put it while touring fire damage in california back in 2018. >> take care of the floors. the floors of the forest, very important. you look at other countries where they do it differently. it's a whole different story. i was with the president of finland. he said, we have a much different -- we're a forest nation. he called it a forest nation. they spend a lot of time on raking and cleaning and doing things. they don't have any problem. when it is, it's a very small

problem. very small problem. with fidelity wealth management, your dedicated adviser can give you straightforward advice and tailored recommendations. that's the clarity you get with fidelity wealth management. they're going to be paying for this for a long time. they will, but with accident forgiveness allstate won't raise your rates just because of an accident, even if it's your fault. cut! sonny. was that good? line! the desert never lies. isn't that what i said? no you were talking about allstate and insurance. i just... when i... let's try again. everybody back to one. accident forgiveness from allstate. click or call for a quote today. ♪ eve♪ going faster than a closerollercoaster ♪ accident forgiveness from allstate. ♪ love like yours will surely come my way ♪ ♪ a-hey, a-hey-hey

[music playing] ♪ love like yours will surely come my way ♪ with safe, convenient service. we're here for you >> tech: we'll come right to you. ♪ upbeat music >> tech: you'll get a text when we're on our way. >> tech: before we arrive, just leave your keys on the dash. we'll replace your windshield with safe, no-contact service.

♪ upbeat music >> tech: and that's service you can trust when you need it the most. ♪ upbeat music >> tech: schedule at safelite.com. ♪ upbeat music >> singers: ♪ safelite repair, safelite replace. ♪ to save you up to 60%. these are all great. and when you get a big deal... ♪ ...you feel like a big deal. ♪ priceline. every trip is a big deal.

the president should have been straightforward. >> go back to february and march. we're in the fog of war from the china virus. there are competing views as to whether this is simply the flu or whether this is very serious. >> what do you mean competing views? you are talking about something else. >> nancy pelosi dancing with

scarves saying, come on down. you had de blasio and cuomo saying, come on down. >> why wasn't the president straightforward? >> he was. >> no, he wasn't. >> trump's surrogates are doing cleanup as the fallout continues. the revolution that trump downplayed the risk of covid to the american people. back with me connie schultz and elise jordan and erin haines. we just heard peter navarro with jake tapper. >> is there any way to look at this and say we have done better than other countries? >> i will just tell you right now, if democrats were in charge, if joe biden had his way, look at his statements in january when he said the president was being xenophobic.

>> he is not the president. >> he was running for president and had the same information. while democrats are trying to impeach this president, this president was taking decisive action. i think it's disgusting to take a crisis in our country and try and lay it at the feet of the president. >> he had the same data. he didn't. not according to the audio from bob woodward. elise, i will come to you, because you are not still in the republican party. or are you? but you just -- >> no. i left around the time that roy moore was given 300 grand. >> i wanted to come to you first in that, these are folks who remain in the republican party. are they doing what they're doing simply because they have to defend the president? or do they actually believe the words that are coming out of their mouths?

>> right now, you see republicans upholding the power structure. they have cast their lot. they had determined that they are going full-fledged with trump. she wants to see the rnc succeed in down ballot races and in the presidential. they have cast their lot. you can see how facts change. you can see no matter what really happens. it really reminds me a lot of when we were stuck defending the iraq war during some of the worst times. i think it's unfortunate i was part of it, part of the bush administration. we could have levelled more with the american public about what the ground reality was. so i really just have very bad deja vu to those days and have watched that just lock down on the party, winning at all cost, no matter the facts. >> erin, are these efforts to

divert attention away from the president and divert attention from what we heard with our own ears, the president of the united states speaking very candidly and lucidly about the danger of coronavirus in february, now they're trying to distract from that, peter navarro and the rnc chairwoman, will they succeed? >> i think that remains an open question. 51 days until the election. i think what we know is to your point. peter talked about the fog of war. the president didn't sound foggy when he was talking to bob woodward about what his understanding was of the threat of coronavirus privately. yet, we know what his statements were publically. we talked about characterizing this as him downplaying the threat of the virus. really, misleading i think is probably the appropriate word for what he was doing with the

american people given what he said to bob woodward at that time. we are seeing these surrogates out here echoing the president's message. peter navarro not really answering jake tapper there this morning. i think at the end of the day, because we do have the president in his own words and his own voice in those recordings talking to bob woodward, that's a powerful counterweight to a lot of voters affected by this pandemic, whether they get sick or not. >> connie, i love what you said earlier when we were talking about voters in the midwest. you were talking about voters in ohio and focus groups you got to sit in on and saw that women were peeling away from the president because of family separation at the border and health care. hearing the president of the united states say what he said to bob woodward, what impact do

you think that has on those voters you saw and voters in ohio in general? >> well, i think voters in ohio are no different from voters around the country in this way. we are a nation of mourners. we are getting close to 200,000 who have died of covid. this is not counting now the hundreds of thousands of other people who died of something else but because of covid restrictions their family members also could not be with them at the end of life. my mom is a hospice home care worker. i have written about death and dying for more than two decades. this nation is full of people who are having to listen to these spokes people for the president in this most heartless way pretend this isn't happening. we will live with the ramifications of this for years because in so many instances -- if you are not directly grieving the loss of someone during this

time, chances are very good at this point you know somebody who is. the president, we are used to his lying. it's watching republicans gather around and not speak out against this. in fact, try to throw it off to anyone else. there is one president in this country. joe biden in january was not the president of the united states. nancy pelosi was not the president of the united states. we had one. he knew how dangerous this was. and he pretended it wasn't. people died. that, i think, is a message -- i hate to say it's a message. this is the reality. this is what happened. i think joe biden needs to address this. because they understand grief. they understand loss. anybody who has lost somebody before covid who had -- i stood at my mother and father's bedside holding their hands when each died. to not be there for your family at the end, it wears on you. it's a weight on people.

i am hearing from people every day who feel so guilty they couldn't be there. >> connie, as is always your way, you bring these conversations that are way up here and involved in numbers and theory and bring it to the human level. we see that there's an abc poll that talks about where the american people are on trump's handling of the pandemic. you see there, 65% disapprove of his handling of the pandemic. as we know, all the polls are going -- state polls and national polls, we are ready for them to tighten and to shrink. do you think if the president's disapproval rating in terms of his handling of the pandemic stays that high that it then becomes a very -- an issue that the president cannot surmount going ahead? >> well, again, i think that

that is an open question. the pandemic is absolutely on the ballot for voters, particularly the women voters that i'm speaking to headed into this election who have been disproportionally impacted by and are responding to coronavirus. both from a public health perspective and an economic perspective. we know that women are the essential workers. women are the caregivers of the children who are either attempting to return to school, either virtually or in person, or of elders who have been disproportionally affected and dying in these nursing homes. this pandemic is just in sharp relief every day for people whether they get sick, whether they die or whether they know someone or not. this is touching every single person. so many of those people are voters who will have this on their minds. early voting is underway. it's going to start here in pennsylvania where i am on monday. i don't think that the voters are letting either candidate,

whether it's this incumbent president or joe biden. >> elise, i will give you the last word. will the handling of the pandemic really impact voters in terms of whether or not -- especially those who say they are on the fence, whether they vote for the incumbent or vote for joe biden? >> this has shown up in numerous polls as the pandemic and the handling of coronavirus supersedes economic issues now just because economic issues are so tied into the pandemic. whereas, pre-pandemic, donald trump was benefitting from a strong economy and had the headwinds of a strong economy propelling him probably to re-election, that's changed in the aftermath of this incredible human and economic disaster. while donald trump might keep

35%, he might keep that base approving of how he is handling the pandemic, other americans just aren't buying it. >> we are done with this block. but we're coming right back. up next, who won the week? verizon knows how to build unlimited right. start with america's most awarded network. i'm on my phone 24/7. then for the first time ever, include disney+, hulu and espn+. we're a big soccer family. "handmaid's tale ." i love "frozen ". then give families plans to mix and match, so you only pay for what you need. and offer it at a price built for everyone. plus, get the samsung galaxy s20 5g uw on us when you buy any note20 5g. and $300 when you switch. the network more people rely on gives you more.

to deliver your packages. and the peace of mind of knowing that important things like your prescriptions, and ballots, are on their way. every day, all across america, we'll keep delivering for you. they fell in love with itsusing irresistible scent. looks like their dog michelangelo did too. gain ultra flings with two times oxi-boost and febreze.

...i felt i couldn't be at my... ...best for my family. in only 8 weeks with mavyret... ...i was cured. i faced reminders of my hep c every day. i worried about my hep c. but in only 8 weeks with mavyret... ...i was cured. mavyret is the only 8-week cure for all types of hep c. before starting mavyret your doctor will test... ...if you've had hepatitis b which may flare up and cause serious liver problems during and after treatment. tell your doctor if you've had hepatitis b, a liver or kidney transplant,... ...other liver problems, hiv-1, or other medical conditions,... ...and all medicines you take. don't take mavyret with atazanavir... ...or rifampin, or if you've had certain liver problems. if you've had or have serious liver problems other than hep c, there's a rare chance they may worsen. signs of serious liver problems may include yellowing of the skin, abdominal pain or swelling, confusion, and unexplained bleeding or bruising. tell your doctor if you develop symptoms of liver disease. common side effects include headache and tiredness. with hep c behind me, i feel free... ...fearless... ...because i am cured. if you can't afford your medicine, abbvie may be able to help.

an army family who is always at the ready. so when they got a little surprise... two!? ...they didn't panic. they got a bigger car for their soon-to-be-bigger family. after shopping around for insurance, they called usaa - who helped find the right coverage for them and even some much-needed savings. that was the easy part. usaa insurance is made the way liz and mike need it- easy.

with priceline, you can get up to 60% off amazing hotels. and when you get a big deal... ...you feel like a big deal. ♪ priceline. every trip is a big deal. i know, i know, it's been too long. at least since we've done it here on this show, but without any further adieu, it's finally time for who won the week. connie, elise and aaron are back with me. i'm going to start with who's up here, connie, you go first. >> okay, i love this woman, michelle roberts. she is the executive director of the national basketball player's association. she was going to retire in march after six years then covid happened and you know what she

did? she became a leader yet again. she worked with some of the stars in the league including ohio's lebron james, i'm sorry, he'll always be ours, to give every court black lives matter pointed. she's also in the effort to try to couse some of the arena frs voting sites in november and there's a wonderful piece interview with her "the new york times" print edition this morning and as soon as i saw her, i thought she's the won. she's the winner of the week because everybody wins with michelle roberts. >> all right. that, that is, that is an exceptional choice. exceptional. i think you might be wrong. aaron. who won the week? >> i mean, that was a commendable nomination, jonathan b, but i mean who are rereally talking about if not talking about 22-year-old naomi osaka, tennis royalty, who won obviously the u.s. open last night, but she really had already won.

seven, you know, masks. seven matches. tamir rice, breonna taylor, trayvon martin. george floyd. elijah mcclain. she was wearing what i like to call personal protest equipment, to really raise awareness and use her platform to you know, challenge people. not only to think as she said last night about the message she was trying to send, but the message that they received by her sending it and i just think there couldn't be a better choice for this week's winner. both on and off the court. >> all right. naomi osaka, another excellent choice. excellent choice. but you're wrong. elise. elise. who won the week? >> well, and i salute naomi osaka's awesome mask game and good for her. huge tennis fan. always love to see woman at the top of her game, but i have to say that sergeant major thomas patrick payne, who was award ed

the medal of honor this week a at the white house for saving over 70 isis hostages in northern iraq in 2015, i have to say a that he won the week. he was on his 17th deployment, which shows the ongoing nature of these wars that the country has just completely turned our attention from as we deal with our domestic chaos, but someone like sergeant major payne is a true who row and is doing good in the name of america around the world and i salute his well received honor and his heroism, saving lives that would have perished to isis. >> that's an excellent choice and i'm not going to say you're wrong like i did for naomi and for michelle roberts, but i think you have not picked the right choice. the person who, oh, good, i thought i was going to have to go old school and play it in the

mic microphone. minot, north dakota, city council member evans. >> if you're not aware, and i think a lot of people in this room are not and have come here because this is a gay issue, i am proudly the first openly elected lesbian in north dakota. so that is why i'm not paying any heed to your crap. i am, we the people, i'm the people, i live in minot. i have a taxpayer. i am a person. i get to see myself represented on that flag pole just as much the people who got the juneteenth flag last month, as much the p.o.w. m.i.a.s will get this month. every single person is entitled to see themselves represented. we are not some group of people who live in san francisco or seattle. we are here. >> go ahead, carrie evans, the

whole point there a someone was making a big issue, a pride flag was flying on city property and i think she spoke for a lot of people in that instance, lgbtq people in minot, north dakota, but for all people who feel marginalized or not represented by their communities and reminding people who are motivated by animous or hate, that hey, we are in the community, we are paying taxes and we are done being disrespected. so, with that, we got to go. thank you very much, connie, elise and erin. thank you very much for spending sunday with me. and that is our show today. before we go, we have a special programming note. tonight, joy reid and andrew zimmer explore the food related crisis for americans. watch food and the pandemic, recipe for disaster, 11:00 p.m. tonight on msnbc. but up next, alex whit. msnbc but up next, alex whit

i'm a performer. -always have been. -and always will be. never letting anything get in my way. not the doubts, distractions, or voice in my head. and certainly not arthritis. new voltaren provides powerful arthritis pain relief to help me keep moving. and it can help you too. feel the joy of movement with voltaren.

feel the joy of movement a lotta folks are asking me lately how to get their dishes as clean as possible. i tell them, you should try cascade platinum plus the power of oxi. cascade platinum + oxi penetrates and breaks down food soils some detergents can leave behind, washing away even the smallest food residue, so it doesn't redeposit on your dishes. and oxi is cascade's most powerful clean, formulated without any chlorine bleach, for a deep hygienic clean you can see and feel. cascade + the power of oxi. the #1 recommended brand in north america. when you're miles from home...

...your bank should help you check on your account to see what's free to spend. henry... virtual wallet® is so much more than a checking account. easily see what's free to spend. and put money aside for your next big purchase... like a trainer for henry. stop it. carl, do you have those figures? yeah. henry sit! ...it's carl. virtual wallet® for digital banking from pnc. it's time to get more from your bank. virtual wallet® for digital banking from pnc. ♪ ♪ you can go your own way ♪ go your own way your wireless. your rules. only xfinity mobile lets you choose shared data, unlimited or a mix of each. and switch anytime so you only pay for the data you need. switch and save $400 a year on your wireless bill. plus, get $400 off when you buy the new samsung galaxy note20 ultra 5g.

a r very good day to all of you from msnbc world headquarters here in new york. we're approaching high noon here in the east. 9:00 a.m. in the west. welcome to weekends with alex whit. new numbers are out with a big week to come on the campaign trial. who's got the edge and where, ahead. a new threat for crews fighting fires in the west. why a bad situation may get worse. sheri sheriff's deputies shot in an

ambush. the search for the gunman in southern california. plus, it's first nfl sunday since the coronavirus pandemic. we'll take a look at how different it's going to be. but we begin this hour with the race to the white house just 51 days now until the election and next hour, the president will be r participate ng a round table with latino supporters in las vegas. this is on the heels of a rally in nevada last night where the president took aim at his democratic opponent. >> he's a pathetic human being to let that happen. where they put an ad like that where i'm standing over graves then he said this. they put an ad like that pup. they're a disgrace, but you know the good part? now, i can be really vicious. i can be really vicious. and we'll start by saying, we're going to start by saying that the democrats are trying to rig this election because it's the only way they're going