thanks for joining us tonight on "the beat" with ari melber. i'll be here tomorrow at 6:00 p.m. eastern. and right now "the reidout" with joy reid is up next. ♪ ♪ the laws of supreme court justice ruth bader ginsburg continues to reverberate throughout the nation with thousands of americans, most of whom had never met the iconic judge, taking the loss personally. now that makes sense giving the acutely personal impact her fiery decisions and dissents have made on countless lives, from the ability to pursue higher education as a woman, to where and to whom you can marry, to whether you can have access to the ballot box, to fair pay, or to contraception. ginsburg's passing also jolted us into an unknown future where

a conservative successor could move the supreme court into overturning the right to abortion, while also empowering donald trump to dispute the outcome of the november election. and critically, this empty seat will likely impact whether or not you, your parents, or your children will or will not have health care during a pandemic that has now taken 200,000 lives in the u.s. with ginsburg gone, there is no clear supreme court majority for these outcomes. we are now in a fight for our lives. trump knows that he's briefed on those numbers or at least he sees them on tv, and yet he shows no remorse, frankly, not even any interest, choosing instead to amuse himself playing golf and holding more super spreader rallies to remain entertained by his campaign. all while gleefully plotting to replace her seat. >> i don't know that she said

that or was that written out by adam schiff and schumer and pelosi? i would be more inclined to the second. that came out of the wind it sounds so beautiful. but that sounds like a schumer deal or maybe a pelosi or shifty schiff. so that came out of the wend wind. >> wow. i'm not sure it gets grosser than that. unsurprisingly the trump party, if we can even call it a political party at this point is marching right in step. mitch mcconnell, pushing his neck out to support a nominee that trump says could be announced this week, mind you, before justice ginsburg will even be laid to rest. the democrats are snapping right now mobilizing for an unprecedented fight over ginsburg's seat with donors contributing more than $91 million in the 28 hours following her death. joining me now is senator mazie hirano of hawaii. i'm just going to get straight to it. republicans have been straight

up hypocrites on this. you've probably heard many of these quotes before from our colleagues. >> we've advised the president that we're not going to consent to one of his nominees. we're going to let the american people speak. >> the american people deserve to have their voices heard. >> we think that the american people have a voice. that voice should be heard. >> we're not going to drop any nominee into an election year cauldron. >> the precedent that no president would be allowed to make a nomination to have a nominee voted on in the last year of their term is a precedent i want to protect. >> we don't nominate to the supreme court in the final months of a president's term. >> i don't think we should be moving forward on a nominee. in the last year of this president's term, i would say if it was a republican president. >> the goal is to let the american people pick the next president who will make the decision. >> i don't think at this point anybody's shocked by republican hypocrisy.

ted cruz has said the same thing. they have all said the same thing. they have now completely flip-flopped. wouldn't the appropriate proportionate response to that be, the armageddon option that chuck schumer said he'd be open to. get rid of the filibuster, add d.c. as a state and add puerto rico as a state and essentially eliminate their ability. add more justices to the supreme court, put 15, put 16, put 20 justices on the court. wouldn't that be the proportionate response if they do this? >> we only get to do a proportional response if the democrats take back the senate. and that's why -- i don't hold that much hope that we're going to have two more republicans to actually follow their conscience. because that is actually missing with the caucus. so what we need to do is take back the senate so that we can consider a proportionate response so that we don't let

stand trump and his minions steal two supreme court seats. and the first thing that's going to happen, for whoever the person that trump is going to nominate, she or he will strike down the affordable care act when already 55 million people are without health care, and all the millions of people with pre-existing conditions will be out in the cold. so that's the first thing that the trump appointee will do. the second thing is to cut back roe v. wade. either to totally undo it or restrict it to the point where it's basically no protection at all for a woman's right to choose. those are the two criteria that the trump appointee will have. and that is why mitch mcconnell is rushing so hard to get this person on the court for life. this person will be on the supreme court making decisions that impact our lives for

decades. now, joy, you know that we have a pandemic. over 200,000 people have died. millions are out of work. we have small businesses closing. and, yet, we confirmed six more federal judges to lifetime appointments last week. mitch mcconnell sits on the heroes act for over four months. but we keep confirming judges to our courts. and that is mitch's goal in life, apparently. so they are going to do what they're going to do. a proportionate response only gets to be discussed when the democrats take back the senate. this is why -- this is really important for the american people not only to keep seeing those tapes of all the senators, seeing what they did, going back on their word, which means that they can't be trusted. they can't be trusted to protect our head care. they certainly can't be trusted to do the right thing to help millions of people with the covid response.

we can't trust them, and that is why democrats need to take back the senate. american people i think get it. it's sinking in. >> senator mazie hirono, thank you so much. we will definitely be watching the senate judiciary committee very closely. i want to bring in now the president and director counsel of the naacp. there is not even a certain reverence for the life of this woman. i saw the texts that they sent out to their campaign saying fill that seat with all caps and asking for a $30 donation. so at this point it's already a meme to them. so, there's no respect here for process. and it seems like the proportionate response for democrats is to say the rules as democrats have been following them should no longer apply. what do you make of these ideas about making these changes?

and keeping in mind that there are two special elections that are happening that actually would, if the democrats in those seats won in georgia and arizona, they would actually be seated in november. so it would put democrats even closer to being close to a tie in the senate. what do you make of the argument that democrats could then go in and say, okay, there are going to be 15 members on this court if this is what you all do? -- do we have cherylin? okay. i think we have lost her audio. so we're going to hold on just one second. i think we've got her back. do we have you now? >> you got me. i apologize. so first of all, joy -- >> that's quite okay. >> i'm ready. you talked about the memes, the obscenity of the t-shirt and the "fill that seat." i'm glad that you talked about

i it. the fact that justice ginsburg has not even been funeralized yet and that the glee with which the president and his cohorts have decided to try and fill the seat is unbelievable. in addition, i do think this question about what the democrats can possibly do is an important question on the other side of this election, if this election changes things in washington. look, first and foremost, i'm a lawyer, i'm interested in the integrity of our legal system, the integrity of our courts. and therefore that's important to me. but i think we've been talking about this incorrectly. i hear people talking about the democrats having the option of packing the courts. the reality is the courts have been packed. that's been the project that mitch mcconnell has been on since 2016 since judge garland was not justice garland. and since he's been packing the

circuit courts and the district courts. so the question facing frankly anybody who cares about having a legitimate, sound judicial system that is one of integrity is how do we ensure the integrity of the federal bench, what needs to be done? -- how we're doing this. because the suggestion that there is something untoward about what we have on the other side kind of already sets things up. we have to talk about what has already happened, which is the courts have been packed. and the questions -- >> that's a very good point. >> in the federal judicial system. >> and i heard a good point that some of the lower circuit courts have members on them. there's no massaggic to having people on the court. but the republicans are governing from a minority position. it's not as if they have

majoritarian views. they're forcing them on americans through the courts. you've had speaker pelosi in talking about everything's on the table, also impeachment might be on the table. it's not clear what impeachment would be for because donald trump does have a constitutional ability if he chooses to add someone to the court. but that would certainly tie up senate judiciary if an impeachment were to go through the house and wind up in the same senate judiciary committee. what would you make of that kind of a gambit? >> i can't really speak to the political gambit of the democrats because i run a nonpartisan organization. what i can say with absolute certainty is that we are in the middle of a presidential election. people are already voting through early voting, through absentee voting. i hear people talking about filling the seat during an election year. it's not during the election year. it is during an actual election which is happening right now.

this is absolutely an affront to our democratic values. >> yeah, absolutely. it's a very good point. two states are already fully voting right now. people are standing in line right now. thank you very much. always great to talk with you. with me now is "new york times" washington correspondent. he's also the author of "donald trump versus the united states: inside the struggle to stop a president." i'm sure you've been hearing the same names being bantied about as i have been all weekend. amy coney barrett who always comes up in these conversations, barbara lagoa, started hearing those names this weekend. i'm sure you did too. this is all about politics for donald trump. i wonder if in looking at the ways it matters to them whether or not they're able to jam this through during the election, which is now. we're having an election right now. or during a lame duck. >> look, i think the most important thing to understand here is that the president's

umbilical cord to his base is the judges. it's the fact that he with, the help of his aides, remade the federal judiciary with very conservative, very young judges. and we will be living in that donald trump's version of the judiciary for decades to come. and that's important because that political tie, that umbilical cord is what has allowed the president to behave in the ways that he has and for the republicans to stay with him. it one of the main reasons the president was able to behave the way that he did and weather the investigations he did. >> and i know that you talk a lot about that in your book. and i think that's an important point is that he's been able to get away with in a very unchristian way because the evangelicals are with him no matter what. there is a "new york times" headline that donald trump could be investigated for tax fraud. this is for the -- this says the d.a. says for the first time. the manhattan district

attorney's office, which has been locked in a yearlong legal battle with trump over obtaining his tax returns suggested for the first time on monday that it had the grounds to investigate him and his businesses for tax fraud. and trump has said he expects the dispute over the subpoena to end up, voilà, in the supreme court. that's the point, right, that donald trump is trying to stack a court for his own personal purposes because he understands that he's on the hook potentially for tax fraud, for insurance fraud, for other crimes. >> i'm not sure how much the court would matter in a case like that. but what i learned working on the book and what i've seen in the past few years is that there will be a relentless effort to go after donald trump and to hold him accountable. and that will extend into next year regardless of what happens in this election, and questions about things like his taxes and his behavior in office are things that we will be dealing with for many years to come, because of questions like this

and because of prosecutors like sy vance in new york who has taken this independence and this willingness to take the president on. >> the book is "trump versus america." everybody, please pick it up. micha michael schmidt, really appreciate you being here tonight. and lindsey graham's epic hypocrisy. brennan said the gremlins told him don't pay attention to any of my public statements because it's all just politics. with polls showing him in a tie, will south carolina voters punish lindsey graham for his complete and utter lack of integrity? plus, the staggering loss of 200,000 americans from coronavirus. and what donald trump thinks about that. onald trump thinks about that >> we've done a phenomenal job, not just a good job. public rashs i give myself a d. on the job itself we take an a

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if there's a republican president in 2016 and a vacancy occurs in the last year of the first term, you can say lindsey graham said let's let the next president, whoever it might be, make that nomination, and you could use my words against me and you'd be absolutely right. >> if an opening comes in the last year of president trump's term and the primary process has started, we'll wait till the next election. and i've got a pretty good chance of being the -- >> you're on the record. >> yeah. hold the tape. >> who among us was actually surprised that lindsey graham would become the hypocrite in chief in the looming political battle over the supreme court vacancy left by justice

ginsburg's passing? and then again in 2018 that he would not consider a supreme court nominee in an election year. this time it's different, he says. he road-tested the explanation on saturday blaming democrats for changing the confirmation process saying harry reid changed senate rules to allow for a simple majority vote and accusing chuck schumer and republicans. graham's toting to donald trump in moving forward on a nominee should surprise approximately no one, given that at this point he's much more of trump's caddy than a leading member of a co-equal branch of government, to be honest. but the south carolina senator's hypocrisy takes on a different significance this time because he is now the chairman of a senate judiciary committee. today he sent a letter to committee democrats again blaming them and trying to hide his shameful behavior under their coat tails, adding i'm certain if the shoe was on the other foot, you would do the

same. notably, graham is also very much up for re-election right now. he's one of the 22 republicans facing re-election, and he's one of democrats' biggest targets. and it's in that atmosphere that the folks over at the lincoln project have partnered with the anti-graham super pac "lindsey must go." noting that if he wants voters to use his words against him, join. i am joined by political consultant and senior adviser to the pac and stewart stephens and author of "it was all a lie: how the republican party became donald trump." the polls are tied at least according to the latest polls. at this point are there undecided voters left in south carolina who might actually be surprised that lindsey graham is being hypocritical on this? >> well, there's not a single person in south carolina who thinks that lindsey graham isn't being hypocritical or is shocked

and bewildered by it. are there undecided voters? yes, there are always some undecided voters. i have tobacco farmers that live one mile from me. they've asked to get meetings with lindsey graham or his staff because trump's chinese tariffs have screwed them over, they're about to go bankrupt. they now hate lindsey graham. if white tobacco farmers in south carolina don't like lindsey graham, man, oh, man, that guy's got a problem. >> and, you know, stewart, i think jimmy makes the point that it's the thing that tips people over. because at this stage it feels like the only undecided voters are do i vote or do i not vote. there don't seem to be too many people who who wonder i wonder which of these guys is for me. and lindsey graham said use my words against me, and now these organizations, the lincoln project and lindsay must go.

do you think that's the kind of thing that tips an election in a red state like south carolina? >> i worked for five republican presidential campaigns. to me, lindsey graham just represents everything that's wrong with politics. he's just become this sort of classic washington pol who doesn't stand for anything but re-election. i'm from mississippi, not south carolina, but i think a sense of integrity, a sense of honor, a sense that your word is your bond still means something in the south. it goes beyond party. i tell you how naive i am. i wrote a book that was pretty bleak about the republican party. i turned out to be an optimist. i really felt 48 hours ago that lindsey graham wouldn't do this just because it was too far even for him, but it just shows how

naive i still am about the republican party. >> and what's the closing argument then? there are so many things that have happened. so many people have died of covid. there is so much economic devastation. you just talked about the tariffs and other things. what becomes the closing argument? does this become the closing argument? because it looks like for lindsey graham, the closing argument is going to be i stood by trump, i stood by evangelicals. that's his closing argument. >> so, look, south carolina's mississippians, we just don't like to be b.s.'d. i'm trying to be polite and not use profanity. people believe you when you give them your word, and then when you turn your back on them and don't even give them meetings or you ignore them, or, as we like to say down here, you get too big for your britches.

he's from 1600 pennsylvania avenue. that's not a good address to be from these days. that's why we established this pac "lindsey must go." he's worse than a flip-flopper. he's a liar. lindsey graham's a liar. i went to the citadel we have an honor code there. does not lie, cheat, or steal or tolerate those who do. south carolinans i don't think this time are going to tolerate his lying because we don't know who the hell he is anymore. he's a fraud. >> um, you know, and, stuart, beyond lindsey graham, just if you look at the southern competitive races, not even just southern races, joni ernst is in iowa. you've got thom tillis, john cornyn in texas. there are all of these races. you're from mississippi. there is the espy race.

he did take cindy hyde smith right to the end in that special election before in that runoff. and you think about some of these races, the georgia races where kelly loeffler has this wild ad. are there more than one vulnerable southern republicans in this environment where they're chasing after evangelicals with the supreme court seat but where they're just blatantly lying about what they said what they promised they would do? >> in the previous segment, he was saying that he thinks conservative judges is what holds this coalition together for trump. i have to disagree with that. i think conservative judges have become an excuse for people to say that they're for donald trump. most of those people are white. i think really ultimately it's more about race than it is about conservatism. ask most people, okay, you think conservative judges.

it's better that than to say i'd really like to hold onto some powerful white guy who's going to be like me. i think espy could win. look, donald trump is president of the united states. anything is possible. i think this is very bad politics for trump. i think the best move for trump would be to say, look, 2016, this is what we said. i'm not a key, let the people decide. and then he could have put the supreme court nomination on the ballot and he would have been much better served in running with mike pence. >> very good points. two experts in southern politics, jimmy williams, stuart stevens thank you very much. really appreciate your time. still ahead, as america passes 200,000 deaths, donald trump gives his administration an a-plus in handling the

pandemic. seriously. the reality is next on "the reidout." frustrated that clothes

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[ bell tolls ] those were the bells at the washington national cathedral. the tolled its mourning bell 200 times, once for every 1,000 deaths from covid-19 in the united states. it's just yet another gut-wrenching milestones. fathers, mothers, sisters and brothers were taken too soon. at the same time those bells tolled, donald trump was squarely focused on his golf

game. trump who privately admitted to downplaying the dangers of the virus which led to those 200,000 deaths, thinks that he deserves high famarks for his approach. >> so what grade do you give yourself on the virus for the last six, seven months? >> i give ourselves an a. but the grade is incomplete and i'll tell you why. if we come up with the vaccines and therapeutics, one, i give myself an a-plus. >> unsurprisingly, larry kudlow, an economic adviser who has zero, no medical degree, no experience, is parroting this success story. >> the usa is in a much better position thankfully. we've regained control of the virus. both the cases and the fatalities.

>> at this point, and this should come as no surprise, he is not quite right. according to reuters, the weekly number of new covid-19 cases in the united states rose last week for the first time after falling for eight straight weeks. and death rates have risen 5% after falling for the previous four weeks. earlier today joe biden slammed the president for his handling of the president trump. >> what worries me now is we've been living with this pandemic for so long, i worry we're risking becoming numb to the toll it has taken on us and our country and communities like this. we can't let that happen. the president knew of these dangers back in february. and he hid it from the american people. trump panicked. the virus was too big for him. all his life, donald trump has been bailed out at any problem he faced. with this crisis, a real crisis,

a crisis that required serious presidential leadership, he just wasn't up to it. >> for more, i'm joined now by dr. tom frieden, former director of the centers for disease control and prevention. and dr. frieden, i think former vice president biden is absolutely right. the thing we can't do is become numb to the idea of 200,000 people dead, which it freaks me out to read those numbers every time they tick up. but based on what you've seen happen and how we got here to 200,000 deaths, what grade would you give to the trump administration? >> i'm a scientist, not in the job of grading people. but what i can say is that the u.s. response has really failed. if you look at countries like germany, they have one-fifth the u.s. death rate. canada, about half the u.s. death rate. sure you can point to other countries that have also failed. but the u.s. shouldn't fail. the u.s. has the potential to

beat this virus. it is not currently under control. it's better than it was, but nowhere near where it should be. and because of that, tens of thousands of americans have died who didn't have to die. because of that, our economy is in worse shape than it could've been. millions of jobs have been lost that didn't have to be lost. >> yeah. you ran the cdc. one of the most disturbing things that has happened just in the recent, you know, few weeks as we've learned more and more, is the extent to which i personally find it very difficult to trust the cdc now. very difficult, i think anybody who's been paying attention to trust the fda, which are sort of government agencies, that's part of the alphabet soup of trusted agencies, always that we've always just by default trusted what they said. the "new york times" said this is the extent to which secretary azar has seized control of the

fda for trump's political purposes, barred the nation's health agencies including the food and drug administration from signing any new rules. sigs and to send a signal to trump that no surprises would come to the agency. so they're sort of wrestling back and forth over whether or not the fda would approve any kind of vaccines. and one more headline. the "wall street journal," the cdc has removed guidelines saying that the coronavirus can spread from tiny air particles. the u.s. center for disease control pulled new guidelines acknowledging the new coronavirus could be transmitted by tiny particles that linger in the air, saying a draft version of proposed changes was posted in error on the agency's website in acknowledging aerosols would

transmit the virus. we don't know if it's scientists who wrote it or if it's political people who wrote it. what is the risk, in your view, of people not trusting these agencies going forward? >> when we look around the country and around the world, the places that have done the best have been guided by and have supported public health. they have fewer deaths, less disease, and less economic devastation. what's happening now is really the politicization of public health agencies and the risk of undermining trust, particularly when we're facing a choice about a vaccine. there may be a vaccine available in the future. we need to be able to trust that the decision on whether or not to approve that vaccine and who to recommend it to has been made by the experts, not by someone trying to make political points. i just wish the folks in washington would spend more energy fighting the virus and less energy fighting the science.

>> yeah, indeed. and less time golfing might be helpful too. dr. tom frieden, thank you so much. mitch mcconnell's republican-controlled suspect has proven it can't get much accomplished, except when it comes to ramming through a supreme court nominee before the election. more on mcconnell's shameless hypocrisy, next on "the reidout." (coughing) hi susan! honey? yeah? i respect that. but that cough looks pretty bad... try this new robitussin honey severe. the real honey you love... plus, the powerful cough relief you need. mind if i root through your trash? new robitussin honey severe. strong relief for your severe symptoms. and now your co-pilot..lief still a father. but now a friend. still an electric car. just more electrifying.

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when it comes to the coronavirus pandemic, the thing that has killed more than 200,000 americans and is still raging through our population putting people out of work, out of their homes and into food lines, you would think that donald trump, president of the

united states, and senate majority leader mcconnell were completely helpless. trump, mcconnell, and their political party just can't help you, america, when it comes to passing a second coronavirus relief bill. they can't find the time to pass the heroes act that the house already passed, which would put some $3 trillion into the hands of unemployed americans, cities, and small businesses, hospitals, and first responders. nor can they come up with a bill of their own. they simply don't have the time, between hitting the greens with the boss, enjoying their fun vacations, and getting their comfy couch time in. so much to do, so little time to do anything about the pandemic. and when supreme court justice ruth bader ginsburg passed away, however, trump, mcconnell and friends, well, they didn't even let the sun go down on rosh

hashannah. and this hypocrisy reveals that this republican party is all about power and maintaining power through the courts through white, christian men-centric americans. but if you think this is just about roe v. wade, this is just half of the movie. when you peel back the film, what you'll also find is greed, particularly corporate greed. the greed of insurance and drug companies who republicans want to give back the right to charge you more if you have a pre-existing condition or to even deny you coverage at all for any reason they want. that's why trump and republicans are in the federal courts right now trying to cancel 20 million americans' health coverage under obamacare, in the midst of a pandemic. it's the super rich who trump, mcconnell, lindsey graham, and old paul ryan and friends, handed a trillion dollars in tax cuts that republicans want to let them leave to their heirs, tax-free, like old-style lords

and russian oligarchs. mnuchin forked over trillions while leaving your mom and pop stores die. they can't get them through their elections so they need the courts. that's why they care so much. for decades, republicans have also needed something else, minority rule. it's why they won't restore the voting rights act. so black, brown, asian, american, and indigenous voters can't vote in large majorities because if they do, well, how would big business, big pharma, and big oil win? minority rule has become so endemic, they go way out of their way to try and hide it. tom cotton of arkansas trying out this excuse on fox news for stealing. >> in 2014 the american people elected a republican majority of the senate to put the brakes on president obama's judicial

nominations. in 2018 we had a referendum on this question just a month before the 2018 midterms, we had the vote on justice kavanaugh. there could not have been a clearer mandate because the american people didn't just re-elect republicans, they expanded our majority. they defeated four democratic senators who voted against justice kavanaugh. they re-elected the one democratic senator who did vote for justice kavanaugh. >> nice try, cotton, except that as "the washington post" points out, the cotton math leads out too little election called 2012 where democrats elected president barack obama and a democratic senate. and harry reid was senate majority leader. and as for the mandate in 2018, democrats won 22 of the 33 senate seats that were up, winning by more than 17 million more votes. bump points out that the republican party has repeatedly failed to win a majority of the

vote in presidential contest as well, relying instead on the electoral college to win the white house. it keeps winning a majority of the senate by taking seats from states that make up less than a majority of the population. in other words, minority rule. and if trump fills the ginsburg seat, five of the nine justices would've been nominated by presidents who lost the popular vote when initially elected. and it will get worse. according to one analysis, by 20 years from now, about 70% of americans are expected to live in the largest 15 states. they will have only 30 senators representing them while the remaining 30% of americans will have 70 senators representing them. and that of course would suit people like mitch mcconnell, donald trump, and their rich super friends, their super rich friends just fine. we'll be right back. l be right . like you, my hands are everything to me. but i was diagnosed with dupuytren's contracture.

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many americans have made it clear over the last 72 hours that they aren't going to sit down and let mitch mcconnell get away with stealing a second seat. joining me now is bishop william barr, co-share of the poor people's campaign and author of "we are called to be a movement." in the last block i went through some of the things that i think people pay so much attention to roe v. wade when it comes to the court that they're losing some of the other stuff that republicans want the courts for, whether it's environmental regulations. they love to deregulate and destroy things like the clean air act, the clean power act and give away a lot of our land to be drilled up and do things to help rich corporations, drug corporations, insurance companies and rich folks. do you think that message has gotten through to people on the ground, that it's more than just

roe, they want to do a lot more than that? >> when i think of the thousands of people that organize with us a day, we have been doing these monday marches. thousands of people joined us online. they shut down his phone lines. i think people are getting it, that the republicans actually want only a fight on roe v. wade. the fight they don't want is us to show that the same way that they claim to be for life but actually not with roe, they are undermining so much else. you think about it 200,000 people dead today from coronavirus. didn't have to be, a lot of them. mcconnell won't go with a stimulus because he can't get protection for liability for corporations. he can't get $2 billion in tax cuts. he can't get his fighter jet. he won't vote on that and neither will he vote on fixing the voter rights act. but he wants the court to fill a seat.

we know when we check all of these justices that have come through him, 95% of the time they vote for corporations. they want to treat corporations like people and people like things. they vote for the health insurance companies and not for health care for the people. they vote for the polluters. they vote against labor unions. so we have to be very clear about what we see. mcconnell is infected. he's infected with lies. he's infected with greed. he's infected with a lust for power. he's infected with a commitment to the corporate bosses. he's infected with racism. and the only vaccine is the people's voice and the people's vote. and i believe people are starting to get it. >> you know, i think lindsey graham is feeling a lot of the heat on that. you think about it. the stuff that's on the table right now, roe v. wade, yes, is on the ballot in november, answer loutly. but obamacare might be doomed if you have a 4-4, you know, ruling that does not overturn this wild

case that's coming up that most legal scholars say is ridiculous. you're talking 20 to 30 million people who would lose their health care, including 400,000 people in mitch mcconnell's home state of kentucky who actually got the obamacare expanded medicate. and, so, i guess is that the fight that democrats should be having, is over things like obamacare, over things like the voting rights act as well as just roe? >> yes. you are talk about the 400,000 people that receive health from affordable care in kentucky. but nearly a million people that are uninsured. they're rolling back protections for pre-existing condition. or if you have covid, that's a pre-existing condition. we're talking about the possibility of rolling back health care at a time when we had 87 million people uninsured or underinsured even with the

affordable care act before covid and now another 27 million people are uninsured because they lost their jobs and we have an insurance policy in this country where more often than not people are voting. people's health care is connected to their job. this is serious business. that's why i say he's infected with greed and lies and infected with racism. and the only vaccine is the people's vote and the people's voice. now, you did something earlier on that segment, and i want to mention it. in the segment you talked about these states and you said how they are the smallest population states but we're getting -- you know, they are getting so much representation. the other part of that is, though, those small states, if poor people, if they vote just 1%, 2%, 19% higher, 1% in michigan, 19% in north carolina, those states don't have to produce republican senators. they can actually produce

senators that will be more concerned about the people than their own greed. so this is a real fight. and this is not a fight that we can't win. it's a fight that, in fact, we have to win and there are $34 million poor people that are eligible people to vote. i say to the democrats, talk to them. speak to them. make sure that you're clear that this is a battle for life and death in this democracy. and if they're going to do this, if they're going to do this, they must pay a political price. we must have a voter turn-out like never before. we must expand that voter turn-out and we must make clear that you don't get to even threaten to do this, let alone do it. >> bishop, a very important voice in these very, very troubling times. thank you so much. really appreciate you as always. and before we go, i actually have an exciting announcement i would like to make.

it is the launch of my new podcast kamala next in line. it is produced by msnbc and it goes inside the cross cultural journey that lead senator harris from her humble roots to represent california in the senate and now the first african-american woman to be the vice presidential nominee. available on october 5th right before the presidential debate. but you can subscribe for free right now wherever you get your podcast. that's it for tonight's "reid out." tonight on "all in," donald trump and the devil's bargain. how many lies are worth control in the supreme court? what democrats are doing in response. then speaker nancy pelosi on the rush to replace rbg is an attack on pre-existing conditions and abortion rights.

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