he doesn't know how to debate the facts because he's not that smart. >> good morning and welcome to "a.m. joy." i'm tiffany cross. we are just 37 days away from the most consequential election of our lives. and as you just heard, joe biden is expecting the first debate on tuesday to get pretty ugly. as people winter wrote in "the atlantic," the challenge isn't that he'll be facing a bully, but he'll be facing a man who is shameless and without conscience. a shatter of norms and boundaries, a liar of epic proportions. a conspiracy mongerer who inhabits an alternate reality and true to form at his thursday rally trump gave us a taste of what we can expect on tuesday. >> somebody said oh he won't do well at the debate, i said i think he'll do fine. they'll give him a big shot of something and he'll go out there. they have a lot of energy, he'll have energy, he'll be like

superman for about 15 minutes. >> honestly. given that "the washington post" is reporting that trump wants to hammer biden about his son hunter, expect to hear more baseless accusations of the same ilk on tuesday. the same way he employed but her emails as a strategy in 2016. now, there cease some good news. a slew of new polls show biden with a strong lead headed into the debate. a brand-new poll released by nbc news and marist college found that in wisconsin and michigan, biden is ahead by eight and ten points. and in neighboring minnesota, a state trump has been actively campaigning in, biden is up by six points. and in an abc news/"washington post" poll, biden was ahead by a whopping ten points nationally.

but i'm suspicious about polls are they telling the full story? i'm going to ask that of the next guest. joining me now is the democratic pollster and host of the podcast strange days. eric boller, author and editor. brittany packnett cunningham, a member of president obama's 21st century policing task force. thank you for being with me. i know you're gritting your teeth as i talk about the polls because we talk about this all the time. i just think it's such a concern when we put so much emphasis on the polls. i don't know that the debate is going to sway this either way, quite honestly. i talked yesterday i'm doubtful that this debate will change the way that voters cast their ballots this november. what do you think? >> well, good morning, tiffany. i think we need to acknowledge the importance of the role of the polls play because the polls are a check on the process.

we keep seeing poll after poll that shows joe biden well ahead outside the margin over donald trump because the constant polls that show the massive leads make it harder for trump to do so. i hope that joe biden's campaign is doing this, is these are not debates and biden should not be treating these as debates. what these are, tiffany, are trials. and the trial is the people of the united states versus donald trump where the prosecutor is joe biden. the former vice president. if joe biden treats these debates and these opportunities as an opportunity -- as the chance to put donald trump on trial, where the evidence of his guilt is overwhelming and the american people watching are the jury, leading them to render the vote of dictatorship or

democracy, that's the opportunity biden has before him. also remember for millions of americans, this will be the first time they pierce the fox news bubble. they'll have an opportunity to have biden make that case, make this trial a referendum on donald trump and the 200,000 plus americans dead. the automatic rise and the promises not to regard the election as legitimate. to call for a nonpeaceful transition. unprecedented things in american history. using trump's own words against him. if biden makes this a trial and he's the prosecutor he'll animate his base and he'll win. >> i hear you and you're based in florida and we know all eyes will be on florida this election season. it's interesting to me the way they rolled out topics and when they talk about the first debate. it's trump and biden records. the supreme court. covid.

the economy. race and violence in our cities. it's all in the same line. i found that very interesting and the integrity of the election. brittany, when we talk about race, i don't think that it's necessarily automatically necessary to include violence in that. as they brace for this conversation on the stage, how would you like to see them address this issue of race and racial inequality and white supremacy without automatically linking it to violence? >> i mean, you hit the nail on the head, tiffany. we have to make sure that we wholly reject the premise that donald trump continues to offer. we have to reject the premise about the nature of this election and whether or not we can trust these results. we have to reject the premise that he's going to keep america great when there are 204,000 of our neighbors and loved ones who are dead in large part because of his negligence and cruelty. and we have to reject the

premise that this is a law and order election because he is the only one who can keep law and order. i was extremely disappointed to see the commission declare one of the topics to be as you said race and violence in our cities. race and violence is not synonymous and whose cities are we talk about that? that possessive word is interesting to me. look, trump wants us to think that race and violence are synonymous and 90% of the protests are without incident and if there is violence, it's because of the proud boys and the boogaloo boys and it's all about creating racial injustice in the world. donald trump knows much of the violence is from the groups that support him and his nationalism.

but because donald trump is allergic to the truth and will do whatever it takes to win he will continue to use their violence for cover of his repression and continue to make us believe that race and black folks in particular are synonymous in violence. i'm disappointed to see the commission confirmed that bias when we should be rejecting it outright. >> i echo your words, brittany. eric, first of all, i love your newsletter and i love the perspective you bring when we talk about media because look, chris wallace, i will say is probably the most decent thing there is about fox news. he's a tough interviewer, i will give him that. i think he's doing what all journalists should do. he's asking tough questions, asking follow-ups. he is fact checking. how confident are you that chris wallace will be able to control the conversation and not let donald trump turn it into a circus, quite frankly? >> well, the fact that fox news is getting the first debate i

think is ridiculous. they have literally killed thousands of americans during this pandemic with propaganda and misinformation about a public health crisis and how do they say hey, we think fox news should be out front on this debate? so we get the issues like race and violence which i don't think is a legitimate topic. look, we saw a preview of the problem with this the trump town hall with abc a week or so ago. he lied relentlileesrelentlessl. occasionally george stephanopoulos said that's not true. i think they'll be basically potted plants. i don't think they'll stand up and there's a professional problem in this too. think back when candy crowley moderated the romney/obama

debate. she briefly stepped in and fact checked mitt romney about something and the conservatives tried to get her fired from cnn. so the easy thing to do is to be the moderator and the -- in the true sense and let this stuff go. it's not up to me. let joe biden deal with the fire hose of lies it's not my job and unfortunately the beltway institutions including the debates commission, they're clinging to this idea, well, we can still do the traditional thing. we'll slot trump in and maybe he'll behave this time. he's on twitter this morning saying he'll demand a drug test of joe biden before the debate there's not going to be anything normal about this debate. i'm in the nancy pelosi camp for joe biden to say i won't debate this guy, he's nuts. nothing to gain and listening to the mad man lie for two hours

but -- but biden was never nothing do that. >> i thought trump was going to say i won't debate -- >> i did too. >> yeah. yeah. i was shocked that it hasn't happened, but look, to the trump era, tuesday is three days away. there's a lot of attention placed on swing voters. you also know very well how i feel about that. and "newsweek" had an interesting article that the biden swing voter problem isn't scotus, but the first debate and they talk about tracking social media and these 40,000 swing voters of every hue. i hear them saying of every hue, however, i have to ask as a pollster, somebody with your fingers on the pulse of multiple communities across geographical landscape what do swing voters really look like and what are they expecting to hear and should they be centered at th e thethese debates when there are so many people in the base who need to be inspired? >> well, there are swing voters

which frankly i think the polling and the data suggests by and large, these are low-information voters. these are people that just aren't attuned to politics and attuned to the dynamics of the presidential election race. that's why it's a small cohort of folks. but frankly if you're the biden campaign it's a mistake to think about this trial because i don't regard it as a debate. thing should be regarded as an opportunity to animate the majority of americans, which poll after poll shows are with joe biden and kamala harris. to animate that base, what they want to see i believe, tiffany, is joe biden coming out there as a fighter. making that case, prosecuting donald trump and treating him as a hostile witness. as the panel has said, he'll get nasty. he's going to get personal. he's not going to debate in any

traditional sense. there are psychological tricks to do that and biden over the years has proven to be a very apt debater. i remember when he debated sarah palin it was a frankenstein and forerunner to what we see in donald trump. we saw him do an excellent job with paul ryan in 2012. i think if he acts as the fact checking prosecutor, he can score wins and it's not about swing voters but about animating and giving those voters that are with him the majority of americans the confidence to go out and vote in this election. >> well, you know, i have a secret fantasy that i kind of wish biden could tag in his running mate, because i'd love to see kamala harris standing on the stage with trump. we'll see how the debate goes. if you could offer the biden campaign one quick piece of advice, ten seconds or less,

what would that be? brittany? >> to play to win and to give your vision of america so that voters can be enthused to pull that lever for you. >> play to win. spoken like a true spades player. >> again, make it a trial and the referendum here is on trump. the verdict that the american people need to vote on do we want to be a functioning democracy or go into full blown american dictatorship. if biden makes that choice clear i think the people will vote for democracy. >> eric, you can give a piece of advice to chris or you can give a piece of advice to the biden campaign. what's your piece of advice? >> well, you know, the media, you know, i don't they'ink we wt see a headline the next day, trump lies his way through the presidential debate because it's normalized but i wish the press would focus on how dangerous he

is. >> well, we'll be tuned in to tuesday. msnbc will have comprehensive coverage. tiffany will be sticking around and be sure to tune in at 8:00 p.m. for the primetime coverage of the first debate. some senate democrats are refusing to meet trump's new supreme court pick. i will speak to one of them. don't go anywhere. ll speak to o. don't go anywhere. it's the ones that got away that haunt me the most. [ squawks ] 'cause you're not like everybody else. that's why liberty mutual customizes your car insurance, so you only pay for what you need. what? oh, i said... uh, this is my floor. nooo! only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪

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should i be confirmed i will be mindful of who came before me. the flag of the united states is still flying at half-staff in memory of justice ruth bader ginsburg to mark the end of a great american life. she not only broke glass ceilings, she smashed them. for that, she has won the admiration of women across the country and indeed all over the world.

>> maybe if amy coney barrett really respected ruth bader ginsburg she might respect her dying wish and let the next president choose her replacement, which by the way, something that the american public overwhelmingly supports by almost a 20 point margin. the confirmation hearing is slated to begin on the 12th and they'll push it through at a record-breaking pace. democrats remain opposed. >> justice ginsburg must be turning over in her grave up in heaven to see that the person they chose seems to be intent on undoing all the things that ginsburg did. i will strongly, strongly oppose this nomination. >> joining me now is senator richard blumenthal, a democratic member of the senate judiciary

committee. senator there's a lot to talk about. i hate to begin the show engaging adolescent behavior but i want to point out that donald trump did tweet about you engaging in his language. i won't insult you by reading what it says but i'm curious if you have a response and i'll give you the opportunity to address it if you'd like. >> there he goes away, peddling the same lies. they won't stop me from speaking out because there's so much at stake. so much real harm to real people's lives that will result from this nomination. ranging from children who have pre-existing conditions to women who simply want to decide how and whether to have families. so i'm going to continue advocating for the people of connecticut who want health care and marriage equality, gun violence protection, civil

rights and liberties. all of the basic protections that are in peril by this right wing nomination. >> so i have to ask you, i have looked into this, i have talked to folks in the senate because i am curious is there any way to stop this? i looked up the senate judiciary rules on a quorum. are you planning on boycotting the process and if you do is that going to stop anything? >> i have no intention of meeting with judge barrett because i simply refuse to treat this process, a sham, illegitimate process as really legitimate and fair. i will participate in the hearings because i think the american people deserve to know about her far-right views and i believe very strongly that the american people are going to

stand up and speak out and hold accountable my colleagues that's really the main tool we have. the others are very limited because procedurally in many ways our hands are tied because the majority republican rule. but the american people need to know that she would deprive close to 130 million americans of protection for pre-existing conditions. as well as other features of the affordable care act that she has said in effect should be struck down. she's been vetted and screened for that position. not to mention her expressed hostility to roe vs. wade and contraceptive health care. these kind of extreme views will come before the american people in these hearings and i will participate in making them as real in people's lives as the

harm that will be done by her appointment. >> so we'll get into the issues she can impact. the aca will be before the supreme court in november. so i hear you. i want to say that people have tweeted me, emailed me and texted me and they're encouraging democratic senators to not participate in the process at all. i understand the position you're in because who's on the senate judiciary committee, senator kamala harris, your colleague. so you will miss opportunities to have these exchanges and debates. at this point are you aware of any of your colleagues who are planning to boycott the process entirely? >> i'm not aware right now of any of my colleagues who will in effect boycott the process. we have an obligation to show for what they are these views that would in effect deprive 130 million americans who suffer from cancer, asthma, heart disease and now covid, 7 million americans suffering from covid

protections that they need and deserve from pre-existing conditions. not to mention the loss of prescription drug care. the ability to have protection on their parent's policies if they're under 26. all of the affordable care act is at risk here. and that's what the american people need to know. that's why they can hold accountable my republican colleagues who have absolutely refused to stand up and speak out as they should. and the hearings give us that opportunity. they also afford the time that will be taken to have those hearings. right now this process is so totally rushed and unfair. we will be voting likely on this nomination a handful of days before the election and the american people deserve to be the ones who decide who is the

next justice on the court to replace justice ginsburg. they deserve to choose the president and the senate who in turn should be the ones to make this decision. >> so i hear your point and just want to let the viewers know on november 10th that's when the aca will be heard before the court. 7 million will be impacted should they strike it down. given the dire situation we are in, the old playbook before 2016 is thrown out. so based on where we are today, where do you stand on if joe biden is successful in november and bests donald trump what's your position on expanding the court? >> that's a really good question. and all the more reason that we need to focus on these next days and weeks, trying to defeat this nominee. i'm going to be fighting like hell to defeat her using every

possible tool. limited as those tools are. we can't force the republicans to keep their word any more than we with force them to care about their constituents' health care. any eventual option after the election depends on winning the election. without joe biden as president or a democratic senate, none of these options is achievable. >> yeah, i hear you. i think because the base is so frustrated with the process, people are looking to if we win this is what we'll do. so yes, would you support expanding the supreme court? >> what i'm prepared to say is we must win this election for joe biden and for the senate to make them both democratic and then nothing is off the table. >> okay. senator, there you have it. thank you so much for joining me. senator richard blumenthal. coming up, it's not just the supreme court. i'll explain next. eme court. i'll explain next.

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they say it's the most important thing a president can do. i don't know if that's true. i would say the military. you might agree with me. military protection. but they say the selection of a supreme court justice is the most important thing. and the other thing by the end of the term we'll have almost 300 federal judges and court of appeals judges which is a record. so we'll have had a great impact. >> be afraid, be very afraid. donald trump as this nominated

and mitch mcconnell has confirmed more than 200 judges to the federal courts. meaning that nearly a quarter of all federal judges currently on the bench are trump appointees. yes, you heard that right. nearly a quarter. back by popular demand to talk about is elie mystal. i'm so happy to have you back, because my only law school education was watching l.a. law and ali mcbeal. i need you to explain what the conservative packed court will have on the society, really for the next generation to come. what is the most important thing to you that has you up at night? >> i'll put it like this. amy coney barrett already sits in a stolen seat. she's on the 7th circuit court of appeals. she fills a seat that was nominated by barack obama,

barack obama nominated a woman named mira shelby. a black woman in 2016. mitch mcconnell blocked the black woman just like he blocked merrick garland and when trump got in trump nominated barrett to the court. the 7th circuit covers chicago, all right? so that's the scope of what we're looking at here. trump has used the entire federal judiciary, not just the supreme court, but everything up and down the federal judiciary with trump judges, overwhelmingly white judges and male judges. we are long overdue for an expansion of those courts to more better reflect the plurality and diversity of this country. >> so one thing i find interesting is that the right has made this an issue for their

base. this has always been what they took with them into the voting booth. the left has not. and the irony of this is that the impact that the courts have disproportionately impacts those on the left, more people of color. what can we do to change the conversation and the political landscape to make the courts just as important on the left as in conservative circles? >> they have to do a better job of messaging to the base about how important the courts are. i do not think the base republican voter is any smarter than the base democratic voters, but the democrats have made this a one to one connection, if you want this, then you need the courts. if you don't have fulton, then you have the courts. if you don't want guns you must have the courts. if you want climate change, then

you must have the courts. if you want health care, then you must have the courts. the democrats never make that one to one connection and i think part of the problem is frankly arrogance. we are right, we know we're right. more people agree with us. and we think that being right and being, you know -- and being in the majority is enough to push the ball. it ain't. what's enough to push the ball is controlling this institution of minority -- of judges that are elected for life -- sorry, that are appointed for life and represent minority opinions. controlling that branch is how we control these major issues that we care about. >> so let me say, as of right now, as of july 7th, there were 792 active judges serving across the three main tiers of the federal court system. we talked about how more than a quarter were appointed by donald trump and you talked about most of them being white. 85% of them in fact are white. i want to make the point, i think a lot of people think

every decision that happens in our judiciary happens at the federal level. but interesting thing to me is that most of the decisions that impact your daily life, the folks -- when you're sent to jail for selling marijuana on the street, the judge in the breonna taylor case, for example, all happen at the state courts and what people may not know the judges are actually elected. in other cases, they're governor appointed. i think this is something that more people should be talking about but you and i talked briefly before the show and you don't necessarily think it's a good thing to have judges elected either. >> yes. state courts -- that's a hornet's nest that's a whole different array of stings. sandra day o'connor, she argued against the election of state court judges and i don't think she's wrong. one of the problems with

electing judges that's kind of what makes them particularly should i say aggressive when it comes to issues of crime and punishment. if they're looking ahead to the next election they tend to look ahead to like who's the criminal that i can say i'm the hanging judge and i got him. like that makes them less -- that makes them more susceptible to i think egregious acts of criminal injustice when it comes to their state court rulings. i'm fundamentally uncomfortable with the election of state court judges and on the other hand, the other option is to have them appointed by the governor and what we have seen in red states whenever a red state governor is able to appoint judges they appoint judges that are not just against kind of criminal justice reform but against voting rights and remember most -- you know, we don't have one election system, we have 50 state electoral systems that choose our federal officers. they elect judges, and they appoint judges who are against

voting rights and for all of the other kind of antidemocratic things. there's no great solution to the state courts. that people -- people need to understand, you know, this is where the law that puts its boot on your neck is usually a state court law. not a federal law. >> all right. i'm going to put you on the spot a little bit because should joe biden become successful in november and best donald trump at the ballot box he will have -- he will be in the position to appoint judges himself. he's promised a black supreme court justice. i'm going to ask you, if he gets that opportunity who are some names that you'd like to see in the pipeline that could potentially serve on the supreme court or if you have names who cou could serve on the lower couldn'ts who are those people? >> first of all, it cannot be just one person, we cannot accept -- we cannot accept 30, 40 years of republican control of oh of the supreme court.

now, if you want to talk about with who, a name that i have heard a lot recently that i real like is christina schwartz, the head of a chapter of the innocence project and the reason i like that, i think that's an important credential is that one of the overall problems we have with the federal judiciary is that so many of them come from a prosecutorial background. even the good ones. sotomayor is the most liberal justice alive now and she's a former federal prosecutor. christina is working for the innocence project and working for the innocence and is real deserve beyond racial and gender inequality. i like that idea a lot. i know she's not technically a black woman, but she's a woman of color. i think anita gupta is amazing. i mean, i have a list. and i think all four or five of them should be appointed to the supreme court. but the democratic bench is so

deep in part because mitch mcconnell has blocked so many obama judges and in part because we tend to play with people from all across the country as opposed to just white. so we have a deep bench and lots of opportunities. >> i hope you tweet out that list because i'd love to see the names that you recommend. we're running out of time. final question for you. should democrats participate in the confirmation hearing of amy coney barrett? >> absolutely not. richard blumenthal said that the hearing gives the democrats an opportunity to expose amy coney barrett's record. we're exposing the record. the record will be exposed. the hearings give amy coney barrett a chance to defend her record often uninterrupted when the republicans tee her up for it. as i said yesterday on your show, we just went through the kavanaugh hearings. if the kavanaugh hearings did not shame republicans into not voting for kavanaugh, what are the barrett hearings going to do? we have to stop acting like republicans who step over 200,000 dead bodies to go to work are capable of shame.

shame is not going to work. fighting well, you have your press conference, you delay as much as you and if you take control of the house and the senate you expand the court by ten to 20 people. that's the play. >> all right. elie mystal t people demanded that you return today. thank you. i know you have little kids so appreciate you getting up and joining us on a sunday morning. coming up, how the new supreme court nominee could impact some of the nation's biggest issues including you for decades to come. stay tuned. ome. stay tuned introducing stocks by the slice from fidelity. now you can trade stocks and etfs for any amount you choose instead of buying by the share. all with no commissions. stocks by the slice from fidelity.

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thank you to all involved in our clinical trials. (fisherman vo)ce) how do i register to vote?ential election... ask your doctor about opdivo plus yervoy. hmm!.. hmm!.. hmm!.. (woman on porch vo) can we vote by mail here? (grandma vo) you'll be safe, right? (daughter vo) yes! (four girls vo) the polls! voted! (grandma vo) go out and vote! it's so important! (man at poll vo) woo! (grandma vo) it's the most important thing you can do! coming up, obamacare, abortion access, voting rights. these are just some of the things that will soon be in the hands of the most conservative supreme court in decades. stick around. more "a.m. joy" after the break. s stick around more "a.m. joy" after the break. powerful relief so you can restore and recover.

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i have clerked for justice scalia more than 20 years ago. the lessons i learn still resonates. a judge must apply the law as written. judges are not policymakers and they must be resolute and setting aside any policy views they may hold. >> welcome back to "a.m. joy," i am tiffany cross. judges are not policymakers, in

the three years amy coney barrett has authored about 100 opinions and several dissents. such as gun rights, reproductive rights and immigration. judge barrett criticized justice roberts for failing to strike down on obamacare saying in 2017 he pushed the affordable care act beyond its means. her thoughts on the aca are more than just academics, considering the court is scheduled to hear a third challenge to obamacare a week after the election. if confirmed, barrett could would be the youngest justice at

just 48 years old, her thoughts can change laws. joining me now, brittany cunningham is back with me, our contributor and a member of obama's 21st century of the task force. brittany cooper, author of the book "eloquent range" and sister campbell. i am so happy you guys are with me. there are so much to unpack here and talk about what's happening. sister simone campbell, i think i want to start with you on this sunday morning. reproductive rights, conservatives quite frequently

use religion as the tool to make this argument happens. this is the thing that makes it okay for a president to talk about grabbing a woman by their anatomy. as someone in the religious speck to of our society, where do you stand on this pick and the agenda that she brings to the court? >> thank you so much for this opportunity because it is critically important to acknowledge that while this pick appears to be an attempt to placate catholics or attract catholic to the trump candidacy, catholics are issue voters. the affordable care act is a pro-life issue. the affordable care act is critically important for protecting the life of our people. quickly i will tell you about margaret. i have a picture here that i think you can see. >> i see. >> margaret died in 2012 of the

full implication of the aca, because she lost her healthcare and lost her job in the last recession. that's wrong. no more margarets should die. what we have to be clear is that pro-life is way more than the question of roe v. wade. roe v. wade is whether a woman that is the moral authority to make a choice. the fact is we have a choice as a nation to care for all of our people and ensure they have access to healthcare. >> that's a pro-life issue. we catholics know it. we helped in the past to protect it and improve it. that's what we are about. >> i am sorry to hear about the passing of margaret. i will tell you in a personal testimony that i have obamacare and it has been a lifesaver for

me and i have tweeted about it and shareholdd stories on insta. this is a pro-life issue. one thing i find interesting and carry, i will go to you brittany cooper, the fact that healthcare is such a big issue. on november 10th, the aca will be before the courts. now judge barrett could be in a position to help the six conservative justices strike down the aca. i don't know where chief roberts land on it this time, how concerned should people be? we are talking about 11 million people, 12 million people who have lower income. the president has yet to release any types of healthcare plan and people lives are hanging in the balance while the self-imposed pro-life party is championing and striking it down. >> tiffany, it is deeply appalling.

205,000 people have died in this country since the pandemic, since march. 45,000 of those folks are black. we disproportionately need what obama provides. we have a president who have known how devastating this pandemic would be and he allowed it to devastate the country and now taking away healthcare and making people more desperate and figure out how to extend benefits and make healthcare universally acceptable. i want to make one other point, amy coney barrett is white woman rewards for their loyalty of the republican party. to get them to sign up for their own commitments to family

values. there is a way republicans vote about gay rights, while they leave care for the poor on the table which is what they would be doing if they gut the aca. she's religious but you can't say you care about any version of jesus in the country if you don't care about the poor. i think that we need to be calling on white women progressives to have a reckoning around what it means that she's holding on the banner of cons consolidated white women rules. >> we saw it. we saw in 2018 a lot of the landscapes, oh, trump is losing from white women, 49% still sounds painfully uncomfortable

for me. i definitely take your point and i hope conversations are happening. david, you are the youngest on the panel. this justice could determine what the rest of your life looks like. you have been an out spoken gun control. what are you most concerned about seeing her on this bench? >>. >> yeah, i think one of my biggest concerns, yesterday we were in front of mitch mcconnell's house demanding justice. a lot of that is because amy coney barrett would be one of the youngest supreme court justices ever appointed and if she were to live as long as rbg, that would mean that she would likely be on the court until i am 50 or 60 years old. i would hope that she as a mother of seven children would understand why kids and march for our lives and many organizations out fighting for

our daily lives. we live in the only country that has a great gun violence in the united states. my biggest concerns is if we want to protect a woman's rights to choose lbgtq and our fundamental rights to not be shot in the united states, we need to have a system where they care about the future of gun people. and frankly -- the only way we can address that is having the highest voter turn out in history. you know i think the last thing her disregard for presidents is concerning because in the united states right now if she were to go down that track and they were to declare her, for example, something as simple as background checks and even the background checks that we have

right now for many gun sales unconstitutional, that would hurt many people and for example, white supremacists being charged with felony to get guns. we don't want people to have guns. it is interesting she keeps on talking about her family is important and everything but a lot are dying from gun violence and believes that guns have more rights than people. it is not very profamily and pro-american people. >> yeah, you know you brought background checks if they are talking about taking off this hearing on october 12th, they're going to rush through a lot of the background checks for judge barrett. jonathan, i want to go to you on this. immigration rights is something that could land in the courtyard of daca recipients but also

lbgtq rights. he actually asked her about this. she took money from an organization alliance defending freedom which is a far right group, the criminalization of homosexuality. these are the people that fund her. really we can be living something like gilead. what's your take on this? >> it is terrifying. there are three immediate court cases that deals with immigrant traits. so the ability, trump's campa n campaign, the second one is public charge actually. this is a really important case because she already ruled on it and she decides with trump and

enforcing basically -- in this country for years to come the immigrant population will be increasingly white and wealthy and increasingly able body. the last thing i want to bring up is temporary protective status. trump made a point to highlight her kids from haiti and i don't have any evidence that'll mean anything for the hundreds of thousands of pps hollers that are looking for the supreme court to protect and shields from trump's racist and immigrant attack. this is more than all of us. this the supreme court, the highst court of the land only serves equal justice under the law for the rich and powerful and that's wrong. >> brittany, i want to turn to you. brittany cunningham, i want to

ask you because the most important reason why donald trump wants to rush this justice through because the supreme court could be asked to weigh in on the election. he's filling this court and d questioning the legitimacy of our election. back in 2000s, the story that i did was with gore and we saw the roles that the courts play. if these justices are asked to weigh in and combining that with the uprising and increase groups of solidly trump's base. we could have chaos in your government. >> i think at this point is so important. you heard from the entire panel, a critical reminder that this has been a long-term strategy.

the reason why donald trump want to sprint to the end on this long marathon project is to make sure he can resecure a victory. we have to be clear that victory is not about another term. if he's able to resecure keeping that position then he'll want to extend out as far out as possible not just for him but for the party. i think everyone should be worried especially on this fact given barrett's history around voting rights. it should worry and offends all of us. she's written that voting is not an individual right but reference historical idea that quote "only belongs to

citizens." we should worry about some people looking at poor folks and black folks and young people and women the way she does and someone who views our democracy as optional for people who don't adpr agree with her. she resembles such a thoughtful panel of so many various of important perspectives that there are a lot of people who may be watching this never had their rights voted on or ruled on and so their privilege may make them think this is just political chatter or this is a game or this is merely identity mo politics. for the rest of us is not a game. those of us calling less liberal or progressive, all we stand for is progress. these are the things that everyone should be offended by. should we not be in favor of

treating everyone equally. i am my koni barrett and the par hi that's trying to rush her through this process stands against these very things and this judge want to gs want to g our way of healthcare and our democrats. that should be a no for everyone. >> brittany, you are an activist and you have taken to the streets many times. republicans are going to go through and there is nothing democrats can do on the front end. what can the people do? david, i am going to ask you this question next. people ask me all the time what can we do and i don't have an answer for them? >> what they can do is stop waiting on everyone else and be the hero of our own story. the best way to stop a coup is to stop it before it happens.

make sure you are krcorrecting e truth, don just do it over social media, make sure that information reaches the people and make sure your folks are registered for vote. yes, be ready to take to the streets and we raise our voice. we are reminding the power structure that the power belongs to we, the people. they derive their authority from us and we have full authority and rights to take back that power and to alter our institution that no longer serves us. we'll do what's necessarily to take back which belongs to us. >> david, and sister simone, i want to go back to you quickly. what's your advise of people out there feeling hopeless. >> if you are in arizona,

colorado, maine,montana, georgia, kansas or iowa, call your senators. call your senators and tell them don't do this. this is not a done deal at this point. duri if you are in those states, speak up. let them know you will not accept their voting for judge barrett in this way. you have power, you can make a difference. if they do it, vote them out on november 3rd. >> all right, david, i want to go to you. i let a study group, i was talking to students and the one thing i heard is how hopeless they feel. what do you say to student who is feel so dishearten? what's your advice for people to get out there and really do

something tangible to impact where this country is headed as it relates to the courts. >> i think it is super important. i just want to get out to brittany especially for everything she has said. i am in total agreement. progress is incredibly hard when especially people die everyday and across the country that families are affected. i would encourage people to look at 2014, the gun voter turn out is doubled. as we result to that, we saw people like aoc and all these other amazing congressmen and women that actually be elected and actually cared for young people and they're not just old white men and realizing that people like amy coney barrett

are a product of conservative movement that did not start yesterday. it started decades ago in orange county california. it started in california. democrats think that we are still playing chest. the only way we'll get them to act is by threatening what they care. the only thing they care about is stay in office. more of just leaders who care about us and whether or not we have a pufuture. >> i am way over. i want to get in jonathan, your thoughts on what you would say to people who again feel they have to course forward here. >> i want to assure the people

that it is okay to be scared at this moment. it is a terrible year for so many people and the things we care. while it is okay to be afraid and terrify but it is not okay to not do anything. the only thing that believe to bring us to justice is a movement that's organized and a movement of people that decided they're not going to take it anymore. i need people to be involved in and i need people to stay to the streets and organize and to change the world. that's not going to take one day or two weeks. it is going to take a generation. we can and we will get there. last words go to you brittany cooper. any word of hope for the people who's watching who feel they need guidance to make the impact on the state we are in right now. >> absolutely, talk to your neighbors and have the hard conversation. this power grabs from the right

is about people who decided they don't care about the system because it does not grant them the absolute power. our job is not to become like them. our job is to recognize that justices o justice is ours to fight for. our job is to go to the voting booth. stop telling people that trump and biden are the same. they are not centuryithe same. our job is to live to fight another day. i come from people who have hope against hope and who recognize hope is risky and who never stops fighting. we have to honor our ancestors and our grandmothers and our people and say that we are worth fighting for. we don't have to see this democracy. it belongs to us. go into the voting booth and keep organizing and of the revolution we want to see. i am not telling you only to vote but i am saying the way you stop this is you don't give him

another term in office to complete his campaign of devastation against our people. >> amen. >> amen to you. >> all right, take us to church today, thank you. government should not be shaping the people. if you can't get inspired of the last 20 minutes conversation, i don't know what else to say. follow all these guys on their social media channels so you can get this information all the time. thank you so much for joining me. jonathan, brittany, sister simone campbell and david hogg. i feel inspired already. coming up an alarming look of vaccines at universities. i really want to talk about this. stay tuned. ally want to talk ab this stay tuned

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within the groups of people running the trial, that there are people who look like me and look like you. it's important that we be represented and that there are thought leaders who can show an example that there are people making those decisions that are evaluating the vaccines as well. >> the leaders of two historically black colleges sparked debate when they announced their participation in a covid-19 vaccine trial and urged their campuses t the relationship between the medical trials and the black community is a complicated one because of a history of racist medical practices, including you know the infamous syphilis study. covid has affected african-americans disproportionately and everyone responds differently to drugs, making black participation in the research critical to a vaccine's success. joining me is the president and dean of the morehouse school of

medicine, dr. valley montgomery-rice and dr. walter k kimbro, who participated in the trial. i'm really happy to have you here, because there's so much conversation about this. when your participation was first announced, group chats went g crazy, texts were going crazy. people were angry about it. why did you decide to participate, and why are you encouraging students to do the same? >> just like everyone, i'm consuming a lot of news. you read stories about how african-americans are overrepresented not only in coviden cases but in covid deat. at one pointid in time this summer, 70% of the deaths were black folks. we are only a third of the state. they said, if we are going to have a vaccine that works, you have to have black folks part of the trial. i'm telling my wife, i want to do a vaccine trial. you go back and do your own thing. you forget about it.

then i was contacted. i'm in this trial. would you consider being a part of it? we will letof everybody on the campus, alum and people in the community say,nd we are a part the study. think about doing it. something to consider.f i'm a part of the study. i have had two injections. i'm doing fine. this is double blind. there's a 50% chance i don't have anything. we have to have more of us engaged in the process. we just wanted to make people think about it. people tookth it as you are tryg to mandate people. my wife ain't doing it. but we still need to talk about why this is important and how people are willing to volunteer. >> i want to go to you on this. how exactly does the vaccine trial work? i think a lot of people don't understand what it takes. i asked people. would you participate in the trial? the responses are memes of no, not doing it. explain how exactly it works.

>> a vaccine -- good morning and thank you for having us. a vaccine trial works like many other clinical trials.in here is the first thing you have to know. you keep hearing warp speed and people believe that that means you are bypassing steps. you really are. we are doing several steps simultaneously. there are several phases in clinical trial. think about zero up to four. phase zero is the first time it goes inme humans. it's usually 15 to 20 people. you try to test to determine whether it works. in thiswh case, we want to knowf we inject something, will it give us and immune response? phase one and two takes that intervention and tries to come upnd with the right dose and al looking at the side effect profile. by the time we get to where we are now with phase three, we are enrolling a large number of peoplero in the trial. but we are also looking at the dosage. you hear some trials are one

dose and then take another dose and another trial may come out where it's effective with one dose. then you also are still looking at theo side effect profile. what you are seeing, each of these vaccines have gone through their phase zero, one, two and now they are in three. we did several of them conc concurre concurrently. they are developing large doses of the vaccine now such that if it shows to be effective, we can get it into people a lot sooner. >> okay. i have to tell you all, i feel trepidation. i can understand why so many people do. we are asking our community to trust two different systems that has consistently harmed us. we arete asking them to trust t medical community. just recently, in the 1619 project, research where we see present day how people view -- how people in the medical community view black people as -- from being able to

tolerate more pain to the mortality rate among pregnant black women. we are asking them to trust the government. i don't even need to get into history there. i get the trepidation that people feel like thisat is not something for me. on the other hand, i understand that we h need to have some sor of research to highlight why this research -- or why this vaccine trial may be important. what do you say to people -- they hearsa this. they hear everything you are saying. nope, i'm still not going to be able to participate because the process has been so politicized, because this is something that if you are not following medical journals, you are looking at it like this is something -- the current government, administration has talked about, they areti talking about bypassg the fda in this process. how can you convince people to trust these two institutions that have not been the most

forthcoming for centuries? >> right. that's why we have to have our medical professionals like dr. montgomery rice, all of the medical schools, they did an op ed to say this is why we need folks in thesey trials. it's something that we -- we don't have these conversations. i don't know anyone who has been in a vaccine trial before. i'm the first person that i know that's done it. it is new.pe vaccines for us are not a new thing. when i was ae t kid growing up atlanta, my music teacher had polio. i didn't because there's a vaccine. when i was growing 'sup, i had chicken pox. my kids won't have chicken pox. the idea of vaccines are not new. you know you have to have vaccines to go to school.ou i think you are right, particularly in this politicized environment, people just -- it's like, let me think about tuskegee and add that with trump and you t have a bad combinatio. that's part of it. the black medical community is stepping up. i'm going to trust an

immunologist. i think what has happened over the last month h is good for uso have conversations like this. in our community, we haven't talkedom about vaccine and we haven't talked about being in trials. we don't have enough people in oncology trials. there are not enough black folks in the cancer trials.ce this is great for us to have these conversations. i think that's a great service that's being done here. >> i'm happy -- yes. we are out of time. quickly, go ahead. >> i have to say, you have to think about, it's not just that we ares just participating in trial. we arepa actually working on th science also. i'm a reproductive endocrinologist that ran a women's center. there are multiple ones of us involved with research for years. we sit on nih panels, on the fda advisory boards. we would not be recommending this as an opportunity for our

communities if we did not believe it is safe. we are putting safety first. we know we don't want to be left behind. we don't want to look back two yearsck from now and a vaccine widely available and i we have t been involved in the trials and so nuances are like people who have sickle cell, we have more chronic kidney disease and we don't know the side effects of these vaccines. we must participate in order for us to know that, because we are -- we have the highest morbidity andig currently we ha the highest mortality. i would say, we as a trusted entity, historically black medical trials, we are all trial sites.ri join us in participating. we ourselves are going to participate in being a subject for the trial also. >> regardless of how you feel on the issue, i think you two have certainly illuminated things and helped the conversation as people consider whether or not to participate in these trials.

i thank you both. i think this is going to be an ongoing conversation. i hope that we can all come together again to re-visit this conversation very soon. i thank you very much. thank you both. coming up, the proud boy's big plan in portland fizzles out. that's next. fizzles out. that's next. no tomatoes.. [hard a] tonight... i'll be eating four cheese tortellini with extra tomatoes. [full emphasis on the soft a] so its come to this? [doorbell chimes] thank you. [doorbell chimes] bravo. careful, hamill. daddy's not here to save you. oh i am my daddy. wait, what? what are you talking about? (vwith your next new vehicle? what kind of value are you looking for with subaru, you get kelley blue book's 2020 best resale value brand, 2020 lowest 5-year cost to own brand,

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joe biden is expected to speak about the supreme court from wilmington, delaware, today at 12:15 eastern. stay tuned to msnbc for the latest. don't go anywhere. coming up, checking in on what's happening in portland, oregon. that's next. here to deliver your packages. and the peace of mind of knowing that important things like your prescriptions, and ballots, are on their way. every day, all across america, we'll keep delivering for you.

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we know people are alienated and afraid and feel like they are in danger. and the best thing for that is to come together with other people to just say it together loud and strong that we are every day anti-fascists. we feel unsafe in our communities. the only way we are going to get any semblance of safety is to come together. >> on saturday in portland, oregon, demonstrators came out to counterprotest against the proud boys, a far right hate group that came to the city dressed in their pretend soldier

con to costumes. but sadly for them, it seems it was a bust. instead of the 10,000 people organizers expected, just a few hundred people showed up and largely disappeared a few hours later. sounds like inauguration. joining me now is the seattle bureau chief for "the new york times" who was on the ground in portland. mike, my friend, you are running on fumes. i know you just went to bed a few hours ago. you got right back up to join us this morning. i have to start with you. so we can send you back to bed as soon as we are off the segment. thank you for joining me. tell me, what happened yesterday? why was it a bust? >> i think the proud boys had some high expectations for a large crowd. they put out this national call for a lot of their supporters to come. it was billed as this event to

end antifa and domestic terrorism. they didn't get the numbers they promised or hoped for. a smaller crowd than they expected. they declared victory. all the groups on the ground declared victory, thinking they had done the job they wanted. >> let me ask you -- there are all these pockets of these white supremacist groups. i'm losing track at this point. they have chapters or -- i don't know what you call them. factions all across the globe. how did they land in portland? do they have any uprising pockets anywhere else across the country? i know they were in the charlottesville rally. >> they are pretty much everywhere. the proud boys and their leadership comes from the east coast. they were at the event yesterday. they had local pockets from around the northwest where they have different groups.

they have groups all over the country. we saw them showing up in different cities all over the place the last few weeks. >> navid, i want to turn to you. i don't dissect these white supremacy groups all the time. they fall under this one blanket of ridiculousness. i have seen, since 2009, an uprising in these white nationalist groups. we have acknowledged now finally that white supremacy and domestic tear irism is a huge threat to the country. these pockets, how did it start? >> i think it's as you said, it has always been here. it's important to remember that in california, we had a group

that shot and killed a court officer. there's a level of violence that exists here. the other part is under trump, they have been really lifted up. now in places like portland and seattle, which we have open carry laws, you can open carry a firearm, it adds a level of danger. when you see these videos of them storming state capitals with weapons, it's very, very frightening. i think that's part of the -- the combination of the two things, open carry and trump really lifting these groups up has really set a pace that we haven't seen in prior administrations. >> i want to stick with you for a second. i want to point out there was in 2009 a domestic terrorism report that said -- it underplayed the threat of the afterthought that economic dislocation and the election of a black president would spark and fuel right wing extremism. the political fallout helped

bury the report. when we didn't acknowledge that it existed, it expanded. what can we do right now to get ahead of this threat as we go into a very concerning election season as we are seeing these pockets of violence happen all across the country? >> that's a very important question. there's two ways to answer. first is, you have to vote. there's clearly a connection between the rise of the groups and the quote unquote mainstreaming of this under trump. the second thing is that we have to demand federal agencies really start classifying a lot of the groups as they tried to do with antifa, calling it domestic terrorism. they need to take them seriously. we have to push law enforcement to take these seriously. >> there's videos of law enforcement treating them nicely and coordinating with them. we have to establish the clear lines of who is who, unfortunately. mike, i want to turn back to you. because this was such a bust and

because there wasn't a lot of participation, do you anticipate that the proud boys will try to reinvent this and try to have another rally in the coming months, particularly again as we are going into precarious political times in the country? >> i mean, i think one thing you will see here is portland is going to continue to be a gathering place for these types of groups for right wing groups who want to come in and confront the left wing activists who are still very active in portland in the aftermath of the killing of george floyd. earlier this summer and in the summer, we had weekends where there was open conflicts on the streets between opposing factions. this was a bit of an extension of that. it's something i would expect to see more of and see groups like the proud boys, even if it might not be a national call, a nationally organized event, i expect they will come into portland to wave flags and show

a presence and do something to get in the face of the left wing activists who are here. >> the last time we deprived you of sleep, it was more unrest. there was a lot of political signage around this. did you see any political signage associated with the couple hundred people yesterday? >> yeah. there's pro trump flags. that crowd and the proud boys was a very -- in favor of trump. you see confederate flags as well. the back the blue crowd. there's a whole range of folks there who are in that conservative world. on the other side, a lot of the folks are out there with their anti-fashi h anti-fascism flags. they don't belong here. that's part of the operating procedure for these activist groups in portland. they come any time the proud

boys or similar groups come out. these activist communities are going to stand up as well and hold their own events and basically say, you are not welcome here. >> wow. the racists support trump. you don't say? thank you so much for having this conversation. i have a feeling we will come back together to re-visit this unfortunately. please stay safe, mike baker, you are always on the front lines recording this for us. naveed, i love how you break this down. break this down. mornings were made for better things than rheumatoid arthritis. when considering another treatment, ask about xeljanz... a pill for adults with moderate to severe rheumatoid arthritis when methotrexate has not helped enough.

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say, author and former first daughter, chelsea clinton. i am so excited to have you on the show. i know you get this all the time. but we grew up together. i grew up watching you come into this full blossom beautiful woman, making an impact and change and you're still doing it so i'm thrilled to have you joining me today. >> oh, gosh, thank you for taking the time and i'm just so excited to be here with you. >> i'm excited to talk about this book. it's a really interesting time to say she persisted in sports, particularly as you see athletes taking an increased more visible role in our politics and making statements and we know really becoming activists, essentially, on the court. in your book, she persist nd sports, you're highlighting olympians. who are some of the olympians you focus on? >> well, i think women athletes have really been in the fore of helping move our country forward. now over many generations.

i think about wilma rudolph who i learned about from my grandmother. she remembered watching her in the 1960 olympics. she was this housewife, stay at home mom in chicago, yet so connected with this amazing american athlete who was l literally like breaking barriers and breaking records like on the track and then she came, she came back to the united states and like refused to participate in kind of segregated celebrations of her achievements. erer refeezed to be in segregated spaces and went on to be a mentor to florence griffin joiner and to so many of kind of the next generation of invedable american athletes and olympian, so i just wanted to share these stories that i grew up with or now have kind of celebrated as a grown up, that really inspire me for what these women do kind of

in their sport and equally often outside their sport. >> i want to play a quick sound bite and see if this had anything to do with the inspiration for the book's title. >> senator warren was giving a lengthy speech, she had appeared to violate the rule. she was warned. she was given an explanation. never the less, she persisted. >> might that have anything to do with how you titled the book? >> yes. i remember watching that at the time i was kind of breast-fe breast-feeding my then 6-month-old son and just was agast though not surprised. nothing senate majority leader mcconnell does surprises me, that he silenced senator elizabeth warren from read iing the words of the great greta scott king concerning the then

nomination of jeff sessions in 1986 in which mrs. king outlined jeff sessions horrific history of racisracism. i know you know, the republicans in the senate at the time and the reagan white house decided that she was right and withdrew his nomination. >> that's right. >> and so senator warren thought if you're too racist to be a judge in 1986, you should be too racist to be our attorney general in 2017. clearly, the senate majority didn't agree with that. but what i also found so powerful about that moment and think senator warren rightly deserved all this support and senator mcconnell rightly deserved all the condemnation that came his way, was really kind of the celebration of king, who i think too often is kind of framed and taught in history as just being dr. king's wife and widow and she actually was a student civil rights leader in her own right and was a civil rights leader and very much after his assassination. >> we're running of time, but i

want to ask you a quick question. got to have a quick political conversation. your mom ran against donald trump. you had a first row seat to witness what she went through. any piece of advice you can offer to joe biden or kamala harris as they square off with him this election season. >> you know, well r, i think that vice president biden and smart harris are clearly making compelling case for why we desperately need their leadership. we have now more than 200,000 americans who have died of covid-19 and i fundamentally believe that had someone else been in the white house, you had kind of confidence and compassion and the willingness to listen and partner with experts, many americans would be alive. many wouldn't be grieving and many would be at work. so i think they're doing a great job and i'm going to do everything i can to ensure they are elected come november. >> thank you so much. i could talk to you a lot longer, but thank you so much. we're out of time.

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good day, everyone. we're just about at high noon in the east. 9:00 a.m. in the west. welcome. what will he say? joe biden gearing up to give remarks on the nomination of amy coney barrett for the supreme court.

we're bring iing that to you li. meantime, trump's selection heating up the sunday talk shows. >> adding more flames you know, fanning the flames of division in a country that's already divided. >> this is what he promise d to do. hooets fulfilling that promgs. >> it's not fair to want to delegitimize the court. >> we can slow it down a matter of hours, days, but we can't stop the outcome. >> poll positions. new numbers are out on where the nation stands on the supreme court, the economy and health care. prus, lining up. ready to go. early voting underway in nearly two dozen states. stunning new numbers about how big the turnout is already. but at this hour, we begin with the breaking news as we await public remarks from joe biden. these about the president's nomination of amy coney barrett to the supreme court. we're joined from wilmington, delaware. what do we know so far about that?