good day, everyone, from msnbc world headquarters here in new york, welcome to weekends with alex witt. let's get to the latest for you. and we begin the hour with breaking news from wilmington, delaware, where joe biden just outlined what he said are the high stakes of the election. the existence of obamacare. the former vice president said appointing a supreme court nominee during the election defies every precedent and expectation. >> trump's nomination should be withdrawn, i should nominate chosen by a president who has just been elected and by the people to get a fair hearing

which would not even occur until early february. a confirmation vote. >> and this comes as republicans on capitol hill are setting the stage for that fierce and swift confirmation battle. today new reaction from senate democrats. >> i have no intention of meeting with judge barrett because i simply refuse to treat this process as sham, illegitimate process as really legitimate and fair. i will participate in the hearing because i think the american people deserve to know about her far right views and i believe very strongly that the american people are going to stand up and speak out and hold accountable my colleagues. meantime, several new polls out today with just 37 days to go. ow nur nbc/marist polling shows

biden ahead in michigan and wisconsin. a new poll out of minnesota shows biden leading trump 48% to 42% with 8% still undecided in that state. and a national poll from "the new york times" and siena college shows biden ahead by eight points, 41% to 49%. marianna sotomayor is joining us from delaware. another good sunday to you. what is the main takeaway from biden's remarks in the last hour. >> reporter: well the former vice president was very blunt with why he believes donald trump is trying to quickly move through this confirmation process. and as you mentioned, it health care, health care, health care. the threat of someone like judge amy coney barrett who has been critical especially about the affordable care act and what her placement to the supreme court might mean. as you've mentioned before, as

well, the supreme court will be hearing a case on the legality of the affordable care act and the biden campaign, including the former vice president and also senator kamala harris are stressing to voters that if the affordable care act is found to be unconstitutional and is reversed, it would threaten millions of people who have pre-existing conditions and have gained access to health care in the last several years. biden also said that it shouldn't be a coincidence that people that trump nominated coney barrett yesterday, on saturday, and the president began sunday morning by tweeting the fact that if the supreme court invalidated that health care law, it would be great for the united states of america. take a listen to just how passionately joe biden talked about what is at stake in this election just a couple weeks

away -- >> this is about your health care. this is about whether or not the a.c.a. will exist. this is about whether or not pre-existing conditions will be continued to be covered. this is about whether or not a woman could be charged more for the same procedure as a man. this is about people's health care in the middle of a pandemic. >> reporter: now, another message that the former vice president has stressed ever since last week when he also spoke about the supreme court is trying to make an appeal to senate republicans telling them to examine their conscience and to step away from president donald trump's influence and to honor the fact, as he said, it would be a major betrayal to the american people to the core of democracy if they are to proceed with this confirmation vote and not respect whatever the american people decide on election day. alex. >> marianna, thank you so much from delaware. back to our new poll

numbers. monica alba joins me with more on that. let's break down the numbers. what do you know. >> reporter: what is critical in the poll numbers from michigan and wisconsin, two critical battleground states, is the fact that the former vice president still leads the incumbent by significant margins, 8% and 10% respectively and the former vice president does enjoy more support among black voters than the current president and same story for women, double-digits there and independents and white voters with college degrees and senior citizens, a critical voting block that the president has tried to make end roads even though there has been erosion in that category over the past four years. where is the president doing well. whether we look at michigan in particular, the president continues to have support of men, more so than the former vice president, 51% to 45% and

the white evangelical voters who many in the president's orbit feel will be emboldened by this pick of judge amy coney barrett for the supreme court, that is something that will animate them heading toward the polls. there is a large gap between the senior citizens that support verse biden versus the president, that is why he wanted to send the discount cards for medicare saying we didn't want to have any part of in that. it is unclear how the white house is going to do that. but clearly a political play with a few weeks to go until the election. and you have the president campaigning for the key constituencies. he was in atlanta on friday trying to court black voters, earlier in the day he was in florida trying to reach latino voters and another key group but we haven't seen much movement in any of the key constituency, the president's base as they are

known remain solidly in his corner. the issue is if he wants to have a chance of a second term, he needs to grow that by a significant number and we haven't seen yet reflected in the current polls, alex. >> and he also has to get through the debate. and last hour you said that some of the allies are concerned about what he's doing to get ready for tuesday's debate. what are you hearing on this. >> >> reporter: well the president hasn't been doing any kind of formal debate prep and that is something he didn't do in 2016 either. nothing as formal as standing behind a lectern and doing a 90-minute round to simulate what we'll see on tuesday in cleveland. he has aides pepper him with questions on the various air force one rides in the last couple of weeks and does he have people helping him such as chris christie who did play hillary clinton in a couple of those practice versions last cycle. but what we want to point out is that the incumbent president argues he's been doing debate

prep every day because the virtue of how many questions he does take from the press on a regular basis. take a listen how he described how he's preparing ahead of tuesday. >> the debut is coming up. everyone is going to be watching. how are you preparing specifically? >> i think i prepare every day. i think, you know, when you're president you sort of see everything that they're going to be asking and they may disagree with you, but we've done a great job. >> reporter: now, the trump campaign has tried to actually raise expectations for how the former vice president is going to do pointing to his nearly 50 years of public service and the many debates he's done. they studied that film quite closely, trying to see what he did in different debates that were in settings that had many candidates versus one-on-one to try to take lessons but the president continues to make the baseless claims that joe biden has been injected with something before the performances and that is what attributes for what he's done. he continued to make that in a tweet earlier today again.

no evidence to support that. that is something the president did in 2016. then candidate trump tried to claim that hillary clinton should subject herself to a drug test ahead of the debates and arguing that again today. absolutely no basis in fact for that and there is no indication a drug test will, of course, take place for either of the two candidates ahead of the first general election debate on tuesday. >> i just want to apologize for addressing that in that report. thank you so much, though. joining me now, robert gibbs, a nbc news political analyst. you saw the polls. joe biden holding a national lead in the battleground states but what are you hearing inside of the biden campaign? what is the mood? >> well, look, i think they have to be hospit to be optimistic. if you look at the polls, the race is stable and has been that way for several months.

you see trump mierp mired in the low 42 and 43 and he's staying that way and if you're the biden campaign you're hardened in those two states of that poll showing you above 50%. so i think they're in a good place heading into the debate, five weeks to go. but certainly this is a big week. >> so when you look at national polls, robert, how much do national polls suggest what is happening in states? you know, national polls could be misleading. you have got to go state by state because all politics is local. >> and it is how we pick our presidents. we don't pick them nationally. we pick them in 51 state contests with the district of columbia. i think you could see trends in national polling, if there are any. but it is remarkably stable how this race has been. the nbc poll from last week had the race at eight and at the beginning of the year the race was at eight. so it is been stable, i think

when you look at state polling you see that what donald trump has to do or his campaign should want him to do with five weeks left is they have to change the troth ectory of this race. he's losing in this race, losing in his battleground states in the national polls and he's got to do something to shake up and change the trajectory of the race. if you're joe biden, you like where this race is. i don't think you have to go win the debate. i think what you have to do is reassure the american people that when he speaks, they're listening to a president. somebody who will take the job seriously, has a plan for jump starting the economy, protecting us against coronavirus, healing racial wounds and someone who will take that seriously and maturely. i think if you look at the tweets today, i think they're a blessing for joe biden. the sitting president of the united states with 205,000 deaths in this country tweeting

out about whether the former vice president should take a drug test before debate. people in the suburbs know we have serious problems. people in the cities know we have serious problems. they don't want their president tweeting about drug tests. >> yeah. how much do you think of the vote is still up for grabs? i mean, look at how many people are doing mail-in ballots and they've already begun that and in-person voting in several states. how much do you think minds are made up, what is left to even still say i'm on the fence? >> there are very few. it is a great question. there are probably maybe 5%, maybe 7% in some places. but as you mentioned and as i talk about changing the trajectory of the race, time has wasted for donald trump's campaign. because as you mention people are voting. they are lining up to hand the ballots to city clerks. they're requesting their absentee votes. early voting has started in a

lot of places. so if you're going to make up some gaps in the vote, you have start quite frankly yesterday. but if your trump, you have to start very quickly. so i think there is a very small number of people that haven't made up their minds. and i think in historically when we look at debates, they are not trajectory changers. they lock in what we already have. they don't tend to move the electorate in big numbers and that is what i anticipate coming out of tuesday night's debate. >> i'm looking at the debate facts and indeed you're precisely right on, not surprisingly. so with the first presidential debate in a couple of days, how does a campaign prepare for debating donald trump? it is not like donald trump could put forth something that is false and joe biden has some earpiece and someone could say, look, in realtime, here is how to counter that. how do you potentially prepare for someone who might litter the entire 90 minutes with

falsehoods? >> well, i think it is a great question. because you don't want to turn joe biden into fact checker and chief. i think you've seen this from a lot of mepeople and they've smartly said in the beginning saying joe biden, you're going to hear a lot ever things from my opponent, the president of the united states, that are simply not true. you know they're not true. you know that coronavirus isn't going to disappear overnight. you know that -- and go through a whole litany of things. i do think there will be a lot of responsibility on the moderator to fact check this debate. i think having chris wallace was a smart pick by the presidential debates commission and if you are joe biden you have to focus not just on donald trump, but what do you want to drive out of the debate. don't lose your cool. make sure your answers are framed in a larger critique around the trump presidency and reassure the american people that they're looking at a president. and i think if he does those things, then the undecided voters will hear what they need

to hear because i think in many ways the electorate that will tune in on tuesday has decided they're ready to fire the incumbent. they need to see from joe biden that he's calm and steady and has a plan and i think if he were to jump over that hurdle, i think he'll be a long way toward being the next president. >> so i want to get specific as we drill down into the six topics for the debate. here are the topics. the trump and biden records, the supreme court, covid-19, the economy, race and violence in our cities, the integrity of the election. two things here. one, robert, do these topics favor any one candidate and the second question, the coin flip left the president to get the first question so if you're in the biden camp, is that better for you. so first the topics? >> i think on the topics, i think there are a bunch of topics left out that you could spend a lot of time on, things like climate change. but i think these topics are

neutral for both candidates. i think joe biden will think he has a good message on the supreme court and covid 19. he has a good message on race and violence in the cities an the integrity of the election. if i'm looking at those topics and if i'm joe biden, i want to hone in on the economy, bringing in health care and talking about creating jobs, the one natural advantage that trump still seems to maintain nationally and in the state polls. in terms of the first question, i don't think it matters a whole lot. i think trump will clearly try to do something outrageous and put joe biden on the defensive. he might try to call out his family early on and get joe biden off his game and that is why i think biden has to keep his cool and really focus on the four or five things that he wants to do really well in this debate. >> okay. robert gibbs, focusing on all of this. come see me again soon. >> happy to do it. thank you. and catch our coverage this tuesday night, brian williams,

rachel madoy and joy reid and nicolle wallace will lead our coverage here on msnbc. as president trump's supreme court nominee is ready to go before the senate next month, a democratic senator joins me to weigh in on what he wants to hear from amy coney barrett. y ce me lots of money. this game's boring. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪

my wife and daughter had been killed in an automobile crash, and lying in the bed were my two little boys. i couldn't have imagined what it would've been like if i didn't have insurance to cover them immediately and fully. forty years later, one of those little boys, my son beau, was diagnosed with terminal cancer, given months to live. i can't fathom what would have happened if the insurance companies had the power to say, "the last few months, you're on your own." the fact of the matter is health care is personal to me. obamacare is personal to me. when i see the president of the united states try to eliminate this health care in the middle of a public health crisis, that's personal to me too. we've got to build on what we did because every american deserves affordable health care. i'm joe biden and i approve this message.

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not surprisingly we are back with the supreme court battle brewing on capitol hill as both parties prepare for the confirmation process, that is set to begin in just over two weeks. some democratic members of the senate judicial committee are giving new insight into what they want to know from judge amy coney barrett. >> i want to ask her if she will recuse her sfrl in terms of any election issues that come before us because if she does not recuse herself, i fear the court will be delegitimized. >> it would effort the fact that she wants to be fair in

addressing this. >> joining me now is ben carden, from the finance and foreign relations committees. it is nice to see you again. let's get into this. do you agree with your colleagues if she is confirmed should judge amy coney barrett recuse herself if any election issues go to the supreme court? >> well, alex, it is good to be with you. and look, president trump expects every person he appoints to office, the loyalty is to him not the constitution of the united states. you see that with the attorney general and in way that he's acted as president trump's lawyer rather than the people's lawyer. but i think there is a great deal of concern that is this appointment is for trump to have his selection on the supreme court of the united states. but let me point out, the first question for people of in country are we going to defer this nomination until after the people have had a chance to express their views on november

3rd. and that the next president should be making the appointment. >> and senator, when you pose that prospect to your republican colleagues across the aisle, what is their justification for trying to push this thing through. because the reality is that were donald trump to win the election, sometime as soon as november 4, potentially, the nomination could go through and proceed with a much calmer tenure to it and people wouldn't be able to push back and say, oh, delegitimizing and any sort of concerns. why not wait? >> alex, you ask a very valid question. when i talk to my colleagues, they do not have an answer. coy quote their words four years ago and what they said and how they would treat a republican president, that we would have the same rules for the democrats and the republicans. they have no explanation as to why they are proceeding. so we're hopeful we could get

four republican senators stand with us and say we're not going to take this up. >> what about the two senators from whom we heard from the sound bites there, booker and durbin, saying they would meet with the nominee but there are some of your democratic colleagues, senator blumenthal and hirono will not. senator blumenthal saying that he refused to treat this process as being legitimate. what is your thoughts on that? >> this will act the lives offer person in our country. the immediate concern is the loss of health care rights with the affordable care act. and you're right to be protected against pre-existing conditions or coverage for millions of americans. i think we have a responsibility if the process going forward to get answers on the record with report to the women's right of choice and so many different issues that are definitely at risk with this appointment but the questions need to be asked.

but the bottom line to our republican colleagues, why are we taking that up, that is still a legitimate question to be answered and we hope we could find four senators on the republican side to join us. >> so if you look ahead to the confirmation hearings, they're set to begin on october 12th. the president weighing in today on what he expects to see comparing it to the hearings for justice brett kavanaugh, let's take a listen to him. >> the way judge kavanaugh was treated was, i've never seen anything like it. i've seen this bad treatment, i've never seen anything like that. i think that makes it a lot easier for amy. >> do you think they could resist it. >> i don't know if they could hold back and they don't look good if they go crazy again. >> barring the line about crazy again, what is your response to that and how will your democratic colleague as poach this hearing? >> alex, this is a lifetime appointment to the supreme court of the united states. we only have nine just -- online

justices. this affects so many constitutional rights. and this hearing that i hope will be deplayed until the next president, we'll need to be able to question in regards to basic rights, the rights of lgbtq community, the rights of our environmental, and the migrant immigrant community. we know there is a november hearing on the affordable care act. so, yes, i expect our questioning will be direct. but make no mistake about it, this is a lifetime appointment, the nominee is young, likely to be on the court if confirmed for decades. we need to take advantage of every opportunity we have to let the american people know -- >> what specifically, if anything, do you want to hear from judge barrett during her confirmation process? >> well, i would like to hear, first of all, is that she would

respect the voters of this country and ask the senate to delay until after the election to see who wins the election. that is probably asking too much. but she's written a lot of articles about her view that it is okay to be active on the court, not follow precedent. even though it is protecting constitutional rights for the people of our country. i would like to see how she compared that with the role of respecting the previous discussions of the court such as roe v. wade. but we understand we have to see what she said about that and how her previouses are on the affordable care act, which again compromise millions of americans in protection against pre-existing conditions. >> sir, what do you make of the timing of that, the election november 3rd and the presentation of the affordable care act to the supreme court is scheduled one short week later on november 10th. i mean, it seems like a kind of

whirlwind with such incredible circumstances around that and so many things that are at risk. >> we would like to think that the judicial branch of government tries to avoid the political arena. so if you want to look at the scheduling and they said sthey wanted to do it after the election but we're very concerned about the politics going on in the courts and how president trump is trying to influence. he believes he has two justices that are loyal to him. and by his appointment. nothing to be further from tradition of our constitution and independence of the courts and reaching decisions. i think it is critically important for the credibility of the supreme court for the credibility of the united states senate that we listen to the voters, let's have the election, let the next president make this appointment. we know we have critical hearing for the supreme court.

they could operate with eight justices. we've done that in the past. with merit garland appointment not taken up or justice scalia's death. they could do that. and if they want to avoid politics that this nominee but for the next president. >> we hear you loud and clear and very good to see you. >> thank you. >> thank you. is the president in trouble in key states. those details ahead. states. those details ahead.

this is basically just adding more flames and fanning the flames of division in a country that is already divided. it is something that i would think and hope that we would all come to our senses and say, hey, can't we wait until after the election. >> democratic senator joe manchin over whom should fill the supreme court seat. a majority of democrats and independents in two battleground

states feel the 2020 winner should get to choose. while the republican neighbors overwhelmingly think it is this president's choice. joining me now former senator barbara boxer who served my home state of california and at my alma mater and melissa murray, clerked who justice sonia sotomayor. i want to start with you, melissa, is there a legal answer to this question or is this all politics? >> well, it seems like as a legal matter there is very little that the senate could do as long as there are enough votes in the republican caucus to confirm this nominee. but obviously the court is somewhat of a political institution. it is supposed to be outside of the fray of politics but who gets nominated to the court happens through the political branch as congress and the president. so there is a political dimension. and so the question going forward is in the face of the republican effort to push through this nominee and cement

a 6-3 conservative majority on this court for at least a generation, what should the democrats do and i think the question here is they're going to have to play this hand very carefully. >> indeed. senator, you have democrats who are coming under pressure and they're being told to use all available options to oppose this nominee. there were protesters outside of chuck schumer's house yesterday. but in reality, to democratic senators have any power here? >> i think ow pour, really lies with the people. and you have opinions and what i think is most intriguing is that not all republicans support this going forward. and a vast majority of independent voters think it should not go forward. so i think taking our time with this is the way to go. and i do want to say this, this is in all of my years of service and i had ten years in and 24 years in the senate, i have never seen such a hypocritical

power grab as this. and this is dangerous. this isn't some theoretical about where the court is going for the next century. it is about health care for 130 million americans. it is about a nominee who said all abortions are immoral. that means if a woman is raped or she's a victim of incest, a child, a girl perhaps, are they going to be forced to have that child? so these issues, equal pay for equal work, clean air and clean water, it is all on the line. i think the republicans have tied themselves into a pretzel trying to figure out how to do this given that they said they would never, ever determine in a election year. >> i want to ask you something suggested to me. i know that you know mitch mcconnell, and i'm not asking you to get inside his head, but from what you know about him, there are those that suggest that he's concerned about whether or not this president is really going to win this

election and thereby trying to cement his legacy, if you will. we know he's always someone who cared dreeply about the supreme court and judicial appointments and securing a conservative base that way. is it possible that that is part of the incentive to get this thing slammed through until waiting until november 4th should this president win again and then propose this candidate for the supreme court? >> the mitch i knew is the not the mitch that i see today. he was much of an institutionalist when i worked with him. meaning if he said something, he meant it. he looked at the camera when merit garland was put up by barack obama and it was eight or nine months to the election and said it is too close to the election, we can't do this. and now he's the leading hypocrite in the country if not the world. and to me, the story isn't so

much trump and mcconnell, it is all of the rest of it. we only two more republicans who are facing their electorate and who are in trouble to say let us wait to see who wins this election and therefore i'm not giving up at all on trying to change minds. and i think that is where the public should be going. not to chuck schumer, chuck is going to do everything in his power to slow it down. but the pressure should be on the -- who look out at the camera like i'm doing now and said i will never vote to confirm a supreme court justice in an election year. so it is about the republican party doing this power grab that is just unprecedented. it is two-faced. it is double dealing. and if i were still in the senate, i could use those words. >> you're speaking directly about lindsey graham, who was both in 2016 and 2018 on videotape and said you could hold me accountable for what i

say here. apparently not. two months ago amy coney barrett was questioned before her appointment. let let's listen to questions how she answered about roe v. wade. >> i'm asking what your belief is about the effect of over turning roe v. wade? would you agree with me that it would have a massive disruptive effect on the lives of countless americans? >> well, senator, i don't think i ought to express personal opinions. >> do you think that roe v. wade was correctly decided? >> well, senator, i'm sorry, i feel like i can't, as a nominee, offer an opinion. >> so you have no personal views on whether there is a right to privacy in the constitution? >> well, i think the question is whether i have personal views that would be appropriate to share in this context. >> okay, melissa, you're a lawyer. how do you interpret that answer and what do you take from that? >> she does what every judicial

nominee does when pressed about his or her views about abortion and precedent. john roberts did this in 2005, said he was respect precedent but then in 2016 on the court he voted to uphold an abortion restriction. he recently voted to strike down an abortion restriction because wasn't because of his views had changed but because the court recently in 2016 struck down an abortion law. this is a standard pantomime but she's clear where her views are. scalia was against abortion and same-sex marriage and she would be a jurist in the mold of scalia. >> melissa, senator blumenthal of connecticut said he will not meet with her but still participate in confirmation hearings for barrett. what do you think he should

focus on? what are the key issues right now front and center? >> well, oshs, health care is an enormous issue. the court will take up yet another challenge to the affordable care act just a week after the election and a seated justice barrett would be in a position to rule on that and she's made very clear her views on the affordable care act in a 2017 article in which she quoted justice scalia who called obama as scotus care and criticized the case to uphold the individual mandate as a tax. so that is one issue i would press and on her views of stare deseissis. he's been very clear that she does not believe that jurists have an obligation to follow past precedent whether that is wrong and these more like clarence thomas who said in a court concurrence that justices should not follow opinions that are demonstrably erroneous and

that is what my colleagues think. >> your colleague dianne feinstein was criticized about the role that her faith played three years ago. do you think that was fair? >> i think all questions are fair. the nominee has to decide how to answer the question. i mean, if it were me, i would say, look, there is a separation of church and state and any personal views. but i have to say this. when you ask her if she thinks roe was wrongly decided, i think we all know, i agree there are legal professor over there but we already know she's -- [ inaudible ] that all abortions are immoral and i'll tell you the reason why. we do have this criminal statute that said federal funds could not benever be used for an

abortion in medicaid except for the life of the mother is at stake and if she's the victim of rape or incest. so this, i think, we could ask. and i would -- i wouldn't let her get away with it. if she's that far out of the mainstream, people need to know. and i have -- and you're so right to talk about her comments about the affordable care act. she took on justice roberts very strongly. she said the constitution was really a powerful -- a powerful set of words. so she's way out of the mainstream and she said clearly when merit garland was up, well, yeah, you could go ahead and have this vote, but she said, she said justice scalia, he's an icon. he's an icon. and therefore you have to wait and see what is president and so on and so forth. so now we have lost another icon

on a different side of the coin. and i believe equality and justice and she ought to be saying i will wait because it will change the court. if you're going to change the court. >> to respect the wishes of that icon. before i let you go, melissa, were your ears burning at this time yesterday because we were talking about potential nominees under consideration by joe biden and if you look there at the bottom of the screen, there to the left, there is you. so, this is from a report from axios. and your name would be bantered about. care to just give me your thoughts on that? >> well, obviously it is flattering to be included in the group of women, many of whom i know. i went to law school with two of them and they're all excellent. i'm not concerned about being a nominee. what i'm concerned about is that we're facing with a lifetime appointment to the supreme court

and we spend more time vetting people to law school faculty than we're spending on this particular appointment. and judge barrett knows that. i just spent six weeks to write a letter to consider whether someone should be appointed to a life for a faculty and we should be spending that much time if someone should be placed in a lifetime authority with the authority to rule on things that affect the lives of every day americans. >> thank you so much. senator barbara boxer, good to see you both. appreciate it. what voters really want and whether it is really being reflected in the polls. reflected in the polls now you can trade stocks and etfs for any amount you choose instead of buying by the share. all with no commissions. stocks by the slice from fidelity. get your slice today.

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talk to your doctor about adding protection with vascepa. new poll numbers show the president trailing in two major battleground states in a new nbc news/marist poll. joe biden leads by 8% in wisconsin. joining me now is charlotte alton. welcome back. it is a sunday habit now with you as someone who has spent the last several weeks speaking to voters in the swing states and the subsequent discussions that we have. what is your reaction to this and should this give the biden campaign a confidence boost out of the debate? >> absolutely. these are great numbers for the biden campaign. and they should definitely feel very confident about these numbers. and i think going into the debate, they're in a strong

position. one thing i did hear from a lot of voters on the ground when i was in those states was that they're still waiting to see how biden does in the debate. i did hear from people who were sort of wanting to see how he would match up against trump, seeing if he could hold his own. so i do think that these are strong efforts going into the debate, but the debates could change a lot. >> you spent some time in pennsylvania. it is the last leg, i believe, on your swing state tour. what did you hear from the voters there specifically in terms of comparing that to what you heard from the voters in wisconsin and michigan that we discussed? >> so, i was in pennsylvania shortly after ruth bader ginsburg's death. so most of my conversations in that state were kind of about scotus and abortion and rights and what people wanted to happen there. and one thing that stuck out to me is that i did hear from a lot of voters, particularly from urban women voters who said they

were pro-choice but supported abortion rights and reproductive freedoms but they still plan to vote for trump for other reasons, related to the economy and immigration. and many of the women voters did not believe that roe v. wade would be substantially overturned or other wise affected with the conservatives of the supreme court. >> do you get a sense there are a lot of votes still up for grabs based on your conversations in these swing states? >> i don't get that sense to be honest with you. i met and i talked to more than 150 voters across the states and i did not meet very many people who seem to me to be truly undecided. i did meet a lot of soft biden supporters, people who said they were frustrated with the president and they were considering joe biden but they needed a little bit more convincing. >> so i could ask you what they would need to hear from joe

biden then during, say, this first presidential debate on tuesday? >> what i think they're looking for, my takeaway was a show of strength. they want to see a strong and kind of compelling presidential candidate and i think that some of these attacks on joe biden as being perhaps too old for the presidency, have landed with some voters. and some voter do have some doubts about that. but, you know, biden does have a record particularly if you look back on his democratic convention speech, of coming out strong when he really needs to. so i think a strong performance could convince a lot of these people. >> have it changed the way you viewed campaigns. what has been your biggest takeaway. >> my biggest takeaway has been that i think sometimes i'm in new york right now, i know a lot

of political coverage happens in d.c. sometimes we're so focused on the data and the fold and who is up and down today and what outrageous comment is in the news and what everybody is talking about on twitter, that we forget that american happens in the mind of the american voter. and what's going through people's heads and what's landing with them and what's resonating with them is much more important, ultimately, than what is said that day in washington. so that's, i think, one of my big takeaways, the way voters think has to be a really important part of any analysis of this election. >> charlotte alter, also good to talk to you. next, i have your dad on with me. >> that's so exciting. >> we love the alters. thank you so much. >> the state that's shaping up to be the center of election disputes. we'll ask a member of congress if she's worried about what's going on in her state in our next hour.

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now to the third stop on the velshy across america 2020 tour. ali velshi was in pueblo, colorado, that's a town that narrowly went for hillary clinton in 2016. ali held a conference with voters. ali asked them about their feelings and opinions on the countless protests we have seen sweep the nation since the death of george floyd. let's all take a look. >> i thing a lot of people are frightened by what they see on television. that's what i'm hearing from people. they're afraid to drive to denver. they're afraid the road might be blocked and they might find themselves in a frightening and potentially dangerous situation. i think that people are united behind the idea that there needs to be equal protection under the law for everybody. what happened to breonna taylor

was horrific and a tragedy and things like that should never happen. but part of that comes from how much power we give government. and the more we restrain government and the smaller we make our government, the less likely it is for things like that to happen. so i think republicans and democrats can find some common ground and make some criminal justice reform. but i think that you lose a lot of ground when you smash store windows and you graffiti public buildings and make people frightened by surrounding their car and banging on it and bad things happen and people become more polarized. >> i will echo, and black lives matter. we have a long history and past of discrimination and racism, and it's got to end at some point. you look at colin kaepernick and him being blackballed from football, and now everybody is jumping on the bandwagon,

saying, oh, we should have listened to him. there have been protests for decades. you look at john lewis, the honorable john lewis, and we look at things that happened before that. we protest. that's what this country is founded on, is protesting. peaceful and not peaceful. the boston tea party was not peaceful. there was property destruction. so here we are today. feeling as if white society and, of course, i'm a white woman, but i'm standing with the protesters. i'm standing with my black brothers and sisters. black lives matter. protesting, coming to the table, talking. we have to start now. >> this whole idea of black lives matter and these protests, it is lawful to have a protest. and i would invite the people that are scared about what these protests are and what they mean to come out to a protest. i don't know -- remember the

exact number, but over 90% of those protests have been peaceful. you can't basis your entire opinion on what they are on a 30-second news clip or one bad thing that happened. obviously, that's what the news outlets are going to focus on, but by and large, that's not what they're about. if people come out and listen to other people's experiences and why they're there, it could change a lot of minds and we could come to a place where we could agree more. but people have to be open to listening and listening to paem's experiences outside of their own. >> and that was ali velshi speaking with voters in pueblo, colorado. next week, we go to the critically important battleground staid of ohio. >> president trump may be setting the stage to dispute the election, whether he loses by a little or a lot, how long might the post election last? into next year? an expert on the subject straight ahead. straight ahead it's official:

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good day from msnbc world headquarters here in new york. welcome, everyone, to weekends with alex witt. we have lots to tell you about. let's get started. we have breaking news, with now 37 days to the election, and today, joe biden laid out his case against joe biden and supreme court nominee amy coney barrett. biden said the president is trying to throw out obamacare. >> this is about your health care. this is about whether or not the aca will exist. this is about whether or not