tv Weekends With Alex Witt MSNBC October 11, 2020 11:00am-12:00pm PDT
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says that you no longer are considered a transmission risk. does that suggest that you no longer have covid? >> yes, and no longer than that, i am immune. which i would go way out of the basement. to run the country, you have to get out of the basement and it looks like i'm in-mism mun for, know, maybe a long time. >> and the doctor says that he is no longer at risk for transmitting the virus. dr. conley did not indicate whether trump has tested negative for covid-19. and with 23 days until the election, new polling today shows that biden ahead of trump by six points in michigan and nevada and both candidates tied in iowa, 49-49. and new national polling shows joe biden leading the president by 12 points. and this comes amid new reaction from the biden campaign on the next presidential debate which will now take place on the 22nd
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after this week's was scrapped. >> our demand of the commission is that the trump campaign and everybody that they are bringing to the debate shows proof that they are negative. we'll let the cleveland clinic and the commission work out exactly how that works, but obviously we are not interested in creating another moment where there is the potential for the spread of this virus. >> meantime the push for new coronavirus relief bill is at a standstill. nancy pelosi says that she still has issues with the trump administration's proposal and this past week pelosi said that she would not agree to a standalone aid package for the airlines unless there was a broader relief plan. let's go to julia jester joining us in arlington, virginia. i know that you have been talking with airline workers. how worried are they about this? >> reporter: yeah, i spoke with several flight attendants who were among the 45,000 airline industry workers who have been
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furloughed so far. united and american airline flight attendants furloughed. i even spoke with an express jet flight attend who lost her job when that company folded its business entirely last week. and in these conversations, they are being companying the same sentiment that they feel like political pawns in this process as they are trying to figure out health care, health insurance, getting unemployment. some of the companies have said that they will recall those furloughed employees if they receive this aid. now, with all eyes on d.c., here is what this means for the stalemate -- the stale might me mate means for the thousands of workers affected. take a listen. >> these service cuts mean that there will be communities where people are cut off, where they have to drive 8 and 10 hours to get to air service, or the mail that comes to their communities on those planes doesn't get there anymore and airline
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workers who are certified safety professionals will start to lose our qualifications and take longer to get training back. so when we get the virus under control and the rest of the economy is able to start up again, the airline industry won't be able to meet the demand. >> i'll be joining my co-workers next week on unemployment because i need the money to survive during this crisis. >> reporter: and as these workers and union president just noted, it didn't just affedoesn employee, the industry supports about 10 million jobs outside of what you see on planes and in arnts. a airports. so they are calling for an extension of the payroll support program and arguing for a comprehensive bill as well, but they say if we can't get that passed, then the critical issue here that is urgent is getting this relief for the airline industries, but it doesn't have
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repercussions on the economy as a whole. >> julia jester, thank you so much. challenging times for sure. and let's go now to breaking news, twitter responding to a tweet by the president. let's go to josh lederman with more from washington. >> reporter: and this stems from something that the president tweeted shortly before noon today as he sought to portray himself as having fully recovered from coronavirus. the president tweeting referring to the white house doctors a total complete signoff from white house doctors, it means that i cannot get it, immune, and can't give it. well, that quickly led twitter to replace the tweet and cover it up with a warning saying this tweet violated the twitter rules about spreading misleading and potentially harmful information related to covid-19. twitter saying that they are keeping that tweet accessible in the public interests which is something that we have seen twitter tend to do given these are the words of the president of the united states. but making sure that they are
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adding that warning to it. it appears that what they are objecting or adding their own notice is the president's reference to immunity. as we know, doctors have not determined that once you recover from covid-19 you are necessarily immune and they certainly don't know how long that immunity would last. and so that information coming from the president not something that twitter was going to allow to be out there unchallenged. but this comes as the president as he seeks to return to the campaign trail, trying to portray covid as little more than a hiccup or road bump on his way to the presidential re-election with the president telling this morning another interviewer that he is now medication-free. take a listen. >> as far as medication, i'm not on any medication. i'm not on any medication. and the medications that i took were standard pretty much
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routine,ing other than the one which is a miracle, the antibody stuff which is incredible how it works. and we're going to be delivering that to hospitals, we're waiting for the emergency use authorization and we'll be delivering that to hospitals all over the country and ultimately all over the world. >> reporter: and so he described his own medication regimen as standard in addition to that experimental cocktail from regeneron that he was touting, the president was also on remdesivir, another antiviral therapy that is only approved under emergency use authorization. so not exactly standard or routine. the president also had been taking a pretty powerful steroid that doctors tell us is generally reserved only for more severe covid cases. >> josh, thank you so much. pretty extraordinary that twitter is flagging this tweet as spreading potentially misinformation. thank you, appreciate that.
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and i'm joined now by jeff mason, white house correspondent. we'll put it back up for the viewers to see once again. so twitter looks at this tweet and says yeah, nope, it may be spreading potentially harmful misleading information related to covid-19. the fact is, jeff, at this point if we knew more, if we knew the details, if they were completely transparent about the public's health, it might be that the president wouldn't have to put out this kind of information even if you wanted to. and twitter wouldn't be flagging things by saying yeah, this may not the be correct. >> that's right. and it is just an unknown. and president trump saying it in a tweet or otherwise in an interview does not make it so. it is an in-known and has been an unknown for months to what extent getting the coronavirus chbd a recov and recovering from it makes you immune and for how long. so him suggesting that now is
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probably more a sign that he wants either to reassure people or to falsely and without evidence suggest that he is in good shape to go back to doing sort of behaviors that he was criticized for before. and that means holds rallies with thousands of people perhaps indoors again or certainly outdoors, not wearing a mask regularly. other practices that again have not been in line with the cdc guidelines and that seem to have led to a large outbreak of coronavirus not only within the first family but elsewhere within the white house. >> and projecting an image of strength is something that is really important to donald trump and yet this not the first time that twitter has flagged one of his tweets. given your experience there as a white house reporter, how do you think president trump may be reacting to this? >> well, he won't react well to the twitter decision i'm sure. and he has also been very
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critical of social media companies including twitter others for some time, both before the pandemic and since, about what he believes is a move to sensor republicans and him. as josh mentioned, that tweet remains up for people to see but with that label. and that is key. he is the president of the united states, he does use twitter as one of his if not the primary way of communicating both with his supporters and with the rest of the country. >> so let's look ahead to this week, he has three campaign rallies scheduled. does the white house believe that getting back out on the campaign trail will help him particularly in states where he needs to make inroads, notably florida, pennsylvania, iowa? >> all important states and i'm sure that we'll see more campaign travel came coming up after those initial three. the answer is yes, they want to
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get him back out on the road. i think that they view the last week and a half as really being a blow by side lining him from doing in-person events which have been the life blood of his campaign. not to mention something that is very energizing to him personally. but also to voters and supporters of his. so they want to get him out there again and they have to from their perspective because of the fact that the polls are showing hill continuing to trail joe biden nationally. >> and the president's son eric trump today said that his father wanted nothing more than to debate on thursday even though the president was the one to refuse to participate virtually and that plomted trompted the cn to cancel the october 15th debate. so is there a sense of regret now? because the question is who has more to lose by not having a debate. >> it is a good question. and i can't say that i know
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whether there is a sense of regret in the campaign. but i think the facts show that having that platform with millions of people tuning this is usually helpful especially if you are now the one who is behind in the polls which as we were saying president trump is. so the biden campaign did not want to hold a debate if there was any question mark about whether president trump or others around him might be contagious or still have the virus. and this is telling and it may be the part of the response, that the doctor who released the statement last night said that he was no longer contagious but t declined to say whether or not he still had the virus. so those are the questions that we'll continue to ask and no doubt one that the biden campaign and commission would have asked if that debate had still been scheduled. and of course it is not as you said and president trump declined to do it virtually. whether or not that helps or
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hurts, it is hard to say. but it is not hard to say that he has lost a platform as a result of that decision. >> jeff mason, thanks, my friend. and now breaking news from the biden camp with new information about judge amy coney barrett's confirmation decision. what do you know? >> reporter: so we know that senator harris sits on the senate judiciary committee and we're hearing from her senate office today that instead of appearing in the committee hearing room during judge barrett's hearings which start tomorrow, senator harris will be in her own senate office which is in the hart building not too far from where i'm standing right now. and she will be taking part in these hearings remotely. and it is a decision that has come after she, senators booker and leahy sent a letter to senator graham asking essentially to postpone these hearings given the risk of
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coronavirus not only to the senator, not only to judge barrett, to the media, to the senate staffers that keep the building running. this is off obviously still a deadly virus. we saw how much it spread during that white house rose garden event and this is what they were trying to avoid and they asked senator graham if there are no testing protocol, we've already seen some senators test positive and that request was essentially ignored. so what senator harris is coming in response is to respond by taking part in that remotely. what you see in the weeks since that roese garden super speeder event happened, a number of senators tested positive with coronavirus and even lindsey graham like i mentioned, chair of the judiciary committee, he just backed out of a debate that he was supposed to have with jaime harrison when the debate changed format at the last
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minute because they asked the senator to take another covid test and he refused. so you are seeing a number of senators where we don't know their testing status and so of course that puts the whole room at risk. so we'll be seeing senator harris take part in these hearings, committed to doing her duties, but that will be taking place remotely for her. >> thank you for the update. award winning filmmaker michael moore on the thwarted plot to kidnap governor whitmer. he spent the day with the ma militia over 25 years ago, what he learned then and how he says president trump emboldened their beliefs.
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bombing. >> this country is heading to civil are war because this is the final step. >> what do you think about my idea of maybe it would be better if we had more than two political parties? >> how when we frighten the guys and gals in there. >> we put the uniforms on so that they would see us and they would have to hear us. but we're down to two options and two options only. either you listen to us or you destroy us. >> michael moore is joining me. good to have you back on the broadcast. let's take a look at this because this incident here that we just witnessed, this was the '90s of course, but some of the sentiments probably still hold today. first of all, how long have militias been around in michigan and were they always seen as a threat? >> well, white supremacist -- let me say this first of all about michigan because i grew up there and still live there. people in michigan, i mean in flint, flint elected the first black mayor in the country back
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in the mid-60s tod. we passed the first open housing ordinance. the uaw was one of the first to demand integration of the assembly line. so strong, strong history of doing well and treating people well. sadly though, since back in the '30s with father coughlin's radio show, it was the most popular radio show in the country demanding that we do not enter world war ii, that we be sympathetic to the germans and it was an awful white supremacist show that came out of a catholic church. so from that point on, all the time while i was growing up, i mean this kind of racism and things that you hear this, but the militias really took hold once the auto factories started to close in the late zet'70s.
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the city of 234ri7b9 by tof fli 80s today had an unofficial unemployment rate by 29%. and so they formed militias. and the first time -- actually i had the grand dragon of the michigan ku klux klan on my radio show in flint called radio fl free flint when i was 20 some years old. and i've listened to them and i've had them -- terry nichols who blew up the oklahoma city building with timothy mcveigh, he graduated from high school the same year i did and he went to the high school right to the east of mine. so i've known these guys for a long time. so when i saw them back in april at the state capitol, i don't know those guys specifically, but i know those kind of guys. i went to high school with some
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of them. and their bark sometimes is bigger than their bite. and what they want to do 4-- wht the leader of the militia at that time after oklahoma city, what they said was they want to be heard. and that is why i was suggesting why don't you start a political party. you can do that. there are nonviolent ways to be heard and to enter the political fray. but, you know, i have to say that i think what i want people to do is not be afraid to go to the polls, whether in michigan or anywhere else. a lot of these guys, you know, they have a lot of guns, but remember there are some very, very, very small percentage of this country and i know people are really frightened when they see this, that is what they want, they want you to be frightened. don't be frightened. there are many more of us there
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are of them. and i think love and peace and compass will win the day. what i've said to them is, look, your white supremacy thing, you will have to change. the country has changed. white people will be the minority in the 2040s so get used to it. >> yeah, echo your sentiment, don't be afraid and get out there and vote. when we vote, it could not be more important right now. but let me ask you, because a lot of people have certainly their intent of going to the vote and potentially voting out president trump. has the trump era changed the militia movement, has there been influence there and anything specific that you can note? >> they have never had a leader in the white house. militia and the white supremacists literally never had the leader of the country in
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their white house. so this has been very good to them. but trump is not -- he is not going to be able to fulfill their hopes and dreams because he -- he is -- i don't know how to put this. look, let me make this point. we have white supremacy not just amongst the poor white working class. we have white supremacy in this country among the ruling elite, amongst the rim. t rich. look at the forbes 400s, the board of corporations of our major corporations or universities? just go through the whole system. white people are running the system and they figured out how to take over without using guns. they kidnapped, quote, governors and senators and politicians with paying money to them. and then they own them. and then they get what they want. and what they want is different
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than what these guys -- all these guys want is a job. and they want a decent middle class income. most of them do. the nfl answers apeople started informants after started talking about killing cops. imagine if they had had a decent job making $60,000, $70,000 a year, would we have this problem, would people be able to recruit them into this militia. >> so look, just as people may want to go to the polls and vote and vote out the president, there will be a lot of people who also want to go to the polls and vote for this president. the important thing is that everybody gets out there and votes. but as you -- >> get out there and, yes, be with other people and we'll be okay. >> 100%. >> and also can i just -- i just want to say that there are other acts of violence that we need to
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be talking about leading up to this election. paying people $7.25 an hour is an act of violence. going to the supreme court to get rid of obamacare so that millions will be uninsured and die as a result, that is an act of violence. saying that we want to take away roe v. wade when 70% of the country supports roe v. wade and forcing women back into back alley abortions, that is an act of violence. and who is doing this? these white men -- trump -- are committing the acts of violence and we need to see them as that. and i think that if we kind of wrap our heads around that and realize that we're the majority, that biden and harris are out there and they are telling us that they are going to do things for the people, don't we all believe, first of all, just with the coronavirus that we'll be in better shape come january, that at least there will be a plan
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and there will be action and we're going to do what germany did and these other countries did and get rid of this damn thing? right now we have trump in some crazed state -- more and more people are dying. it is all going up and we have to fix this and i just encourage even to vote, to get out and vote, vote this week if you can, vote by mail this week if you can. don't put this off. we are in a dangerous, dangerous place. our lives are at stake. and i'm much more worried about that than i am some guys running around with guns and trying to figure out how to kids nap the governor. not to say that schisn't import, but one guy said he was mad that he couldn't go to the gym. and so good on them that they
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wanted to go to the gym. >> let me ask you the last question, that being with this 2020 race, 23 days ahead, is there anything that worries you, where do you see this thing headed? >> i'm worried that people will start to take for granted that biden is going to win. >> complacency. >> yes, you need to wake up every morning with the thought in your head trump pulled it off before. he lost by 3 million votes and became the president of the united states. i don't know how to do that. he did it. he can do do it again. do not take him for granted and act as if today is the day that trump is going to win his second term. everybody needs to behave like this in these -- and you must make a list of five to ten people that you know don't vote and hold out your hand and say i know you don't want to
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do it for me just are this once. there is 100 million nonvoters in the country. the largest political party. all we need is just a couple million of them in the right states and we will be done with this madness. >> you may be somewhat encouraged to see by comparison the incredible number of early voting, people have been mailing in and people who are going to the ballots and trying to vote in person early. i know a lot of states are offering that as well. michael moore, thanks so much for your insights. really fascinating history. thank you. so judge amy coney barrett released her opening statement ahead of her confirmation hearing tomorrow and depending on how you read it, you are either alarmed or calmed. two powerful legal minds will react to it next. l react to it next when was the last time your property tax bill went down?
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hearing. she says in part the policy decisions and value judgments of government must be made by the political branches elected by and accountable to the people. the public should not expect courts to do so and courts should not try. and joining me now is made police is melissa murray and harry litman. so good to see you both. i want to ask both of you what your interpretation is of her statement starting with you, melissa. >> i think that she goes a long way in the statement to answer questions that people have about her particular views. there is a statement of about her father selling her that anything boys can do girls can do better, maybe to sooth those who think that her views may be regressive for women. and there is also a statement about how closely she would follow the legal precedent set by her own mentor, justice
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scalia, saying that she would be a judge in the mold of justice scalia and that she would be faithful to the original meaning of the constitution as framged in frame and interpret it correspond to the words. >> harry, same question to you. >> i thought that it was really bland. she did mention scalia, but didn't elaborate much. and there is quite a lot about her family, her personal background, both her parents and children even relative to other previous nominees. it is a very sort of down the middle huing to safe harbors kind of i thought. >> anything that you can take away at what her judicial rudder i guess would be if she were to
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serve on the supreme court? >> the short answer is no other than really kinds of safe statements. what melissa says is true, but we knew that she would say i'm in the model of justice scalia, courts should not make policy choices. those are pretty uncontroversial at this point. she did add at the very end that she believes in the power of prayer, which i think would attraction some attention. she didn't have to say that, though we know it is true. but i think for the most part it is a very sort of safe down the middle in the wake statement. >> so melissa, democrats are certainly expressing concerns about what barrett's nomination could mine for legal precedent. let's take a listen to what two senators had to say. >> on that court we want to hear the affordable care act case one week after the election so that she can strike it down. that is sher few on tis her vie affordable care act. and i'll be focused on her state
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of women's right to choose, abortion. >> she is being sent on assignment to the supreme court by president trump and we know what that assignment is, eliminate the affordable care act which protects 23 million americans and be there if the president needs her on election contests. >> and so from everything that we know about judge barrett, do you think that she will vote to overturn the affordable care act or roe v. wade if given the chance? >> i think that it is actually really interesting that neither senator mentioned roe vs. wade, but it seems that judge barrett's statement is aimed exclusively at sort of assuaging fears that she would do so. there is a lot about her family, about her commitment to her children. she says that she will fill justice ginsberg's teeth seat b seat but not her shoes because those shoes are huge. and i think that the reason why she will likely be confirmed is
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because she will be a reliable conservative kroet on tvote on . i don't know if that means that she will be a vote to strike done the affordable care act. the case is quite complicated. i'm not sure if she will vote to give the election to president trump if that does happen. but we know that she is there to bolster the conservative wing of the court which already enjoys a five member majority and this would make it a six person supermajority. >> and so is there any necessity or justification behind packing the court? >> the short answer is no. and when it has happened in the past, it has really been to the court's discredit, not to mention the american people. so i think that there is very good reason to think that if it is properly presented, for example, she would vote tooff turn roe vs. wade. michael moore just explained 70% of the american people are against that. that doesn't mean -- it
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shouldn't be a litmus test that anything that the american people are against that the court shouldn't do. but i think that there will be a series of cases one after the other over the next possibly 20, 30 years where she will vote to do things that not just the american people but the legal profession would say are wrong and we will have as melissa says a supermajority for that. when that has happened before like in the roosevelt era, it has been tough times for the court not to mention the people. >> melissa, republicans have accused the democrats of attacking her religious beliefs back in 2017. and then you have dianne feinstein during that time saying, quote, the dog mama liv loudly within you. dunk that the committee should request barrett about her religious beliefs? >> i think that you can question her about her judicial
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philosophies without ever touching on the question of her faith. and i think that it is also important to note here that there are other members of the court who would consider themselves to be persons of faith and we still question them about their understanding of particular clauses, about their views about religious are liberty. the fact that she too is a person of faith should not necessarily exempt her from serious and rigorous questioning about her constitutional philosophy about those provisions. >> and i agree and it has now become the third rail after feinstein, but i don't think that you want to question her about her beliefs but about her practices. she does belong to a group that believes in supposedly divine prophecy, speaking in tongues, that the husband is master spiritual and worldly of the wife. those are unusual ideas and practices. i think those are fair game. but it is not about her faith per se but her life.
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>> can i ask you both the same last question and get a quick answer if you have one. were either of you to be on this committee, what is the question that you would want to ask barrett? melissa you first. >> well, she said in the past that she believes article 3 judges have an obligation to overrule precedences that they think are erroneous. i'd like to know more about what would constitute demonstrably erroneous. >> and i think it is fair, she said she believes life begins at conception, that means that state sanctions of termination of pregnancies atantamount to murder. so how can you set that aside and disregard it. >> okay. harry, melissa, thank you so much. and in a moment, fact checking the president's claims about his case of coronavirus. [ thunder rumbles ]
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the president said today that he is feeling great and no longer has the coronavirus, calling the antibody treatment he received a cure. >> the antibody kind of thing that i took was -- i felt really good almost after taking it. i know people call it a therapeutic. but to me, it is a cure. okay? to me it is a cure. i think that it is much more
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than a that you were pew tierapo get it immediately into the hospitals. >> and dr. roy is joining me. what do you make of that comment? would you consider the antibody treatment that he received a cure and beyond that do you anticipate it becoming widely available? >> good to be with you, alex. it is great that the president feels better and that he feels that -- he thinks it is a dur. however even the company that makes it, regeneron, we're talking about the mono clone al therapy to be clear. and they don't claim to be a cure. and right now for covid-19, we have no cure and the treatments are of variable efficacy. some can be effective, but really nothing that is even close to being a cure. >> amgd and it wouldn't be wide
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available. >> no, absolutely not. as far as we know, the president is the only pin erson on the plt to receive the antibody treatment and remdesivir. and remember, this is experimental and extremely expensive. very few have received this medication. >> and what about he also said that he is immune to the coronavirus. is there any way to actually determine that is true? i mean what do we know about antibodies and immunity? >> first a disclaimer. as a physician, none the physicians that you have been talking to have actually seen -- witness all the medical reports, the medical data, imaging, the labs. and b, none of us have actually exammed eme examined the presi. so all we can do is evaluate the forgiven from the white house. which is like a puzzle. but what we know is that based
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on cdc recommendations or guideline, immunity at best we have maybe three months out a person can have some sort of short term immunity. that said, we really don't have any evidence that of the millions of people infected that they have any type of long term immunity. and if anything, we've already seen people who have been reinfected with the virus. so for the president to say that he is immune, there is no data to really support that. >> so how about the memo, dr. roy, from the president's doctor, sean conley, saying that he is no longer a transmission risk. what are the indications that he wouldn't be able to spread the virus any longer, how can you be sure? >> is that the october 10th lettelet lett letter? >> yeah. >> and i just reread that letter again. and me and my fellow physicians were saying that -- you have to write a whole bear graph and bottom line there, he is still most likely testing positive. but here is the nuance of it. the pcr test which is the more
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sensitive test is probably still detecting low levels of virus, they probably also did an additional quantitative test looking at the exact amount of virus, which we suspect is probably low and which is why dr. conley is coming to the conclusion that he has very low invectivity. so that is probably why he is saying that. that said, the president should still be be in isolation given that he was having symptoms. he really should not be outdoors in public enter askinteracting throngs of people. >> and to say that he is most likely testing positive, only reason you say most likely is because we don't know. the white house is not revealing the information about the president's health. so thank you, dr. roy, for giving us what we do know. the group of americans bearing the brunt of covid's financial fallout, you might be surprised. indeed you do. the moment you sponsor a job on indeed
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. >> new job numbers, paint a stark picture of how women are bearing the brunt of the crisis caused by the pandemic, the national women's law center showed women left the work force four times the number of men. the staggering figure includes 3 two of,000 latinas and 54,000 black women. president and ceo of the institute of women's policy research, and author of the book born bright. why is it black and latina women are being disproportionally affected by the job loss? what is contributing to it? >> what is contributing to enormous job loss by black and latinas is that they are employed by the service sector, hardest hit by the pandemic.
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20 million jobs lost, and women, a majority of those job losses. >> yes, majority of the job losses, women in general there, are parts of the economy that have started to come back. women are still the ones leading -- leaves the work force in higher numbers, are you worried it bd be a long term? set back the progress made? >> there is no historic parallel to what we have seen. not the great depression or the great recession in 2008. women have been impacted in this way. when we think about recovery, we know that many of the job says that we have lost are not coming back. or they won't be coming back soon. the additional burdens of care taking responsibilities that are often on the shoulders of women, we know they will have a harder time reentering the economy, and
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sustaining employment. >> part of it has to do with because of schooling. you have so many kids, taught virtually at this point. that will go on until it doesn't any longer. and often times it is the women. the moms staying home with their kids. they are forced to. >> before, before the pandemic, 37% more household work than their male counterparts, schools and daycares closed. while this administration was focusing on getting small businesses back up and running, which i believe is critically important, there was not a lot of attention paid to the impact of school closures, and daycare closures on working women. as we said at the top, 800,000 women have either left the work force, plan to leave the work force or no longer looking for work. all because of not having a
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strategic plan at the state or federal level. >> we look at the wage gap. black women, 62 cents, latina women, . >> how does this wage gap play into the she session? and how does it affect long term? >> pay equity was a problem before the pandemic. women didn't have savings or earnings to ride out the economic down turn. when we think about those gains competition, and so, women who left the unless we do something
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>> good afternoon, we have a busy two hours ahead. the president declared himself cured of covid, ready to hit the campaign trail, despite the white house offering no medical proof that he is virus-free. and an angry eric trump, on how the trump family is benefitting from the presidency and doling out favors in return. take us through a lot has happened with regard to the president. how the last 24 hours or so. what are we learning from the whit
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