good evening. once again welcome to a special expanded debate night edition of "the 11th hour." day 1,372 of the trump administration. a dozen days remain until the election and now the final debate of this cycle is history. tonight's debate was nowhere near as contentious as the first. thanks to our colleague kristen welker a lot of ground was covered tonight from the economy to where they started with the pandemic. >> we can't close up our nation. we have to open our schools. and we can't close up our nation or you're not going to have a nation. >> people are learning to die

with it. you folks at home who have an empty chair at the kitchen table this morning, that man or wife going to bed tonight and trying to touch their -- out of habit where their wife or husband was is gone. learning to live with it. come on. we're dying with it. when's the last time -- is it really dangerous still? will you tell the people it's dangerous now? what should they do about the danger? and you say i take no responsibility. >> i take full responsibility. it's not my fault that it came here. it's china's fault. and you know what, it's not joe's fault it came here either. it's china's fault. they kept it from going into the rest of china for the most part, but they didn't keep it from going out into the world. >> and as expected the president repeatedly tried to bring up issues related to biden but more often hunter biden than his opponent. >> the character of the country

is on the ballot, our character is on the ballot. >> please respond and we're going to have follow-up. >> if this stuff is true about russia, ukraine, china, other countries, iraq -- if this is true, then he's a corrupt politician. >> nobody's calling me -- >> so don't give me the stuff about how you're this innocent baby. joe, they're calling you the corrupt politician. >> i want to stay on the issue of race. >> there are 50 former national intelligence folks who said that what he's accusing me of is a russian plan. they have said that this has all the -- five former heads of the cia, both parties say what he's saying is a bunch of garbage. nobody believes it except him and his good friend, rudy giuliani. >> you mean the laptop is now another russia, russia, russia hoax? you've got to be -- >> that's exactly what -- that's exactly what -- >> this is where he's going. the laptop is russia, russia, russia. >> gentlemen, i want to stay on

the issue of race, okay? >> you have to be kidding. >> indeed, the issue of race in our country was also front and center tonight. and biden wasted no time confronting the president over his previous statements. >> abraham lincoln here is one of the most racist presidents we've had in modern history. he pours fuel on every single racist fire, every single one. started off his campaign coming down the escalator saying he's going to get rid of those mexican rapists. he's moved around and made everything worst across the board. he said about the poor boys. last time we were on stage here he said i'd tell them to stand down and stand ready. come on. this guy is a dog whistle about as big as a foghorn. >> president trump, i'm going to give you ten seconds to respond and then i have another question. >> he made a reference to abraham lincoln. where did that come in? >> you said abraham lincoln -- >> no, i said not since abraham lincoln has anybody done what i've done for the black community.

>> and i'm saying -- >> i didn't say i'm abraham lincoln. i said not since abraham lincoln has anybody done what i've done for the black community. now, you have done nothing other than the crime bill, which put -- >> oh, god. >> -- tens of thousands of black men mostly in jail. >> here for our lead off discussion on this thursday debate night claire mccaskill, former democratic senator from the great state of missouri. our own lawrence o'donnell, from the bay state of massachusetts, host of the 10:00 p.m. eastern hour on this network. eugene robinson, pulitzer prizewinning columnist for "the washington post." and david plouffe, former obama campaign manager, senior adviser to the former president. he's also on the board of directors of the obama foundation. his latest work "a citizen's guide to beating donald trump." i have never looked forward to seeing your faces this much before. we get to celebrate the end of

the last presidential debate. claire, you first. what did we just witness? >> well, i think it's really interesting that people think trump did so well tonight, but that is in context. i mean, he was a train wreck last time. this time he was just a moving -- slow moving manufacturer of lie after lie after lie after lie. and i do think joe biden once again showed why the suburban women are drawn to his candidacy. he talked about how he'll unite the red states and the blue states, and how he wanted to be a president for everyone. and importantly, he talked about their families instead of attacking each others families. and when he did that i thought it was really telling that trump made fun of him about it. and people notice things like that. i don't think this debate moved the needle much one way or the other. except i don't think that biden lost any ground tonight.

he was very strong tonight. >> lawrence o'donnell, same question. >> well, in a debate like this i'm just looking for where did the conversion come, where was the conversion moment for a voter who was not voting for donald trump going into this debate. what would convert them? donald trump is the one who has to do that. he's the one behind. i don't see where that happened. joe biden's message was a recurring version of you know who i am, you know who he is. he actually said that a couple of times. and each time, it carried an awful lot of import. it was a character statement. joe biden also filled the space with policy where it was supposed to be filled, but he was really making that character argument for himself versus the guy he was standing next to. the lies have been cataloged, and they will be -- donald trump's lie that he always gets away with and never gets called on really is the tariff's lie,

and it's one of my stickling points because i used to work on this policy in the united states senate. the american people pay american tariffs. when this president slaps tariffs on china, no one in china pays anything of those tariffs. it's all paid by us, and the compensation of farmers suffering from that is also paid by us through taxation of us, transfers to farmers. he gets away with it. and when donald trump says he's the greatest president since abraham lincoln, i wish just once someone would mention lbj, someone would mention linden johnson signing the civil rights act and voting rights act and what donald trump and his party have tried to do to the voting rights act and have successfully done in trying to take a hatchet to it. and in my limited experience in this world i have to say every time i've ever heard someone say "i am the least racist person in this room," it has always been the most racist person in the

room. >> lawrence, about lbj, i've spent a lot of time over at the lbj library in austin, texas. every time -- you're right. every time he says that i think of members of the johnson family. i think of the museum director, autohistorians who have pieced together the life and tale of that former president. eugene, same question. >> well, i think those of us who watch these debates for a living are the only ones who grade candidates on a curve. and so we're, i think, the only ones who might remember the first debate and say, well, trump was completely unhinged during that debate and he was less unhinged here. therefore he did better. i don't think voters look at it that way. i think those who tried to actually listen to what the candidates were saying -- and by the way they were able to do that this time thanks to kristen welker who won the debate, who clearly won over both trump and biden. and so people got a chance to

hear these two candidates, and i think they heard who these two men are and what they would be like as president. and i think it was essentially a status quo debate. i don't think -- i don't think donald trump moved the needle particularly in his favor, which he would have certainly wanted to do. i think arguably joe biden may have gained a bit in the debate. but in any event, if it was a tie the tie goes to biden because he's ahead. >> david plouffe, while never spoken out loud empathy was as they say on the ballot tonight. late in the debate the environmental question about american families, mostly families of color who are forced to live next to petro chemical and other facilities and grow up

with that environmental risk, the president quickly reminded them how much money they're making and how much they've profited during the trump presidency. >> you're right, brian. family separation where trump showed no remorse about these kids being separated from their families, and then the issue you just talked about around minority families living in the shadow of pollution and the health effects there. biden showed empathy throughout. and at the end of the day i've agreed with everyone who's spoken so far. is there anybody in america, a senior down in florida who plans to vote for joe biden in person in early vote next week, an undecided voter that might be leaning biden who says, you know what, give me 4 more years of trump. give me four more years of that guy. and i thought the most passion he showed in the debate when he was haranguing joe biden and his family. it wasn't about covid and all the deaths. it wasn't about kids separated from their parents, about people

whose health is at risk because of pollution. it was about that. so the notion that somehow just because he wasn't an unleashed rabid dog tonight -- although by the way he could see in the last half of that debate he was leaning more in that direction. joe biden is leading, and at worst for him, i think it's status quo. he doesn't have much more room to grow, but to the extent he does i think he might have accelerated that movement tonight. >> and eugene, as i work my way back down our panel, i mention this in our first summation, a lot of his talking points, i mean, i watch all the trump rallies because i do so for a living and it's part of our job. a lot of what he was citing from rudy giuliani's laptop caper was very specific stuff that you have to already be in that media bubble and following closely to have followed along with what the president was referencing tonight.

>> yeah, it was impossibly arcane. i mean i have tried to keep up with these allegations such as they are, and i got lost at various times, didn't know exactly what he was talking about. i think for people who sit for most if not all of the day glued to fox news who, you know, open up their laptops and read "breitbart" all day, those people probably followed along. those people probably already are voting for donald trump, but they probably understood. i think the vast majority of the television audience just had no clue what he was talking about. and i thought joe biden's answers there because they were so simple and direct, they were just -- that's not true, you know who i am.

they were very basic, simple answers that i think people could understand especially given how arcane the stuff trump was talking about must have struck most people as. it was just -- it was kind of weird. and i thought he would have a better sort of -- a better choreographed attack on the hunter biden stuff if he was intending to bring it up, and he did not. and lawrence, speaking of choreography and given your past in politics before media, there was a moment where donald trump, talking about the biden family, siblings and sons of joe biden, painted them as money hungry. i think he said they were sucking up money like a vacuum cleaner. clearly that was the door opening if joe biden was going to go there on trump family members, most of whom were

seated in front of them at the venue tonight. and i have to assume just as clearly joe biden didn't want to go there. >> yeah, and i think the whole country watched him make that decision to take that high road. because it is many, many more people know that the president's daughter while working in the federal government did business with china and got permits to do business in china through the chinese government. and so people at home are sitting there knowing -- they actually know what the ammunition is for joe biden to throw in this moment. and because of that -- because there's so much fluency on it, he doesn't have to do it. and people knew what they were watching. they saw exactly what they were watching. the other part of that is joe biden doesn't want to prolong that section of the discussion. he'd rather get back to the minimum wage with donald trump challenging him on the minimum wage. and i just wish -- i just wish

joe biden had asked trump what the minimum wage is. you know he has no idea what the federal minimum wage is, and he kept saying -- donald trump kept saying it should be up to the states. and again, donald trump has no idea that the minimum wage is up to the states. and that's why california's is $12 and the federal minimum basic wage is $7.25. that's why new york it's $11.80 on its way over time to $15. so joe biden would prefer to be talking to minimum wage workers about their minimum wage future than going on about the president's kids. and i think everybody is going to recognize that joe biden avoided that, took that pass and just decided, nope, i'm not going to go after the president's kids. >> that's also why you ask an incumbent senator from iowa the break even price on a bushel of soybeans. hey, claire, speaking of the

middle of the country, i am curious about your perspective on this election season thus far, with these two caveats. a dozen days yet to go. that's the equivalent of 12 years on the old time scale, and we have something close to 50 million votes in, which is obviously all new territory for our country. what's your comfort level as you look at this coming presidential election? >> well, i will never be comfortable until a winner is declared. and so i think this is one of these situations because of what happened four years ago that all of us are very cautious about being confident. having said that, one of the reasons i think that joe biden would never lose ground in a debate with donald trump is because this country knows that donald trump is not an honest guy. they know that. now, some are overlooking it and

saying, oh, he just exaggerates, they love him. it's about 35% of the country. but and then there's another 5% or 6% that love the tax cuts because they're very rich or they love the lack of regulation. but for most americans they know this is not an honest president. and that's why all of his attacks and smears on joe biden are not working. and they didn't work tonight, they won't work tonight. i feel pretty good. i mean, i see the numbers, and i look at them, and his approval rating is still in the low 40s. he's got a 9 to 10 point margin right now nationally. and i think if he just keeps talking about health care and keeps talking about the aca and keeps talking about covid and the mismanagement, joe biden will be president. >> on that note, and i'd like to know a closing note when i hear one, our thanks to senator claire mccaskill, eugene robinson, david plouffe. greatly appreciate your instant

reaction following this last debate tonight. more debate reaction from the mayor of atlanta when we come back. this special edition of "the 11th hour" is just getting under way on this thursday night. >> i think you'd have to clean it up and talk to the american people. maybe you can do it right now. >> vice president biden, you may respond. and i do want to follow up on the election security. >> i have not taken a penny from any foreign source ever in my life. we learned that this president paid 50 times the tax in china, has a secret bank account with china, does business in china, and in fact is talking about me taking money? i have not taken a single penny from any country whatsoever. for skin that never holds you back don't settle for silver #1 for diabetic dry skin* #1 for psoriasis symptom relief* and #1 for eczema symptom relief* gold bond

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it will go away and as i say we're rounding the turn, we're rounding the corner. it's going away. >> let's talk more about what we just witnessed tonight, and to do that i'm joined by the democratic mayor of the city of atlanta, georgia, keisha lance-bottom. she was among the biden family's guests at the debate tonight. mayor, first of all, your reaction to what you witnessed. >> well, thank you for having me. i thought that joe biden did a fantastic job in showing the american people why he should be president of the united states,

why he is the person who we need to be president of the united states. it struck me, brian, even on the first question when asked about the coronavirus president trump couldn't even speak of people. he spoke of models. and what i saw from joe biden tonight was someone who showed empathy, someone who understands where we are in america, understands that many of us may not agree on all things but certainly it's up to our president to unite us and not divide us. and i was honored and proud to be with him this evening. >> let's go deeper on the virus, and i know your personal story. visited the bottoms household. you and your husband both had it. your husband's symptoms were more severe and lingering as you and i discussed on this broadcast. you're now responsible for the health and safety of the people

in atlanta. sitting and knowing that with your personal experience when you hear the incumbent president say and here are the quotes, it will go away, we're rounding the corner, it is going away, we're learning to live with it -- how do you react? >> this is someone who still doesn't understand what this virus means to families across america mooch he talked about his son having the virus and he was okay. well, they were lucky. because in our family my son had the virus, gave it moo my husband and i, and my husband is now a long hauler with lingering symptoms. and there's so many other families across this country that have lost children, that children have brought it into their household and the parents haven't survived. there's a young man in georgia who's lost both his parents to covid-19. and so if in the midst of where we are as a country, if as the president of the united states you still don't have a basic

comprehension of how this virus is transmitted, what it's doing to families across this country, if you don't realize that now, you never will. and it's not going to get better. it is only going to get worse under donald trump. >> final question, and i have to say this. all of us who are friends and colleagues with kristen welker are mightily proud at the job she did tonight. she was really -- her presence was game changing in my view. and thanks in large part to her stewardship over the conversations and the questions we had some rare topics come up tonight at least in the context of presidential debates. things like environmental justice and a deeper dive on things like criminal justice than we usually get to hear. >> and i thought that she did a fantastic job tonight. it was great watching her

moderate this debate. but even to go deeper in questions on racial justice, and when i heard joe biden describe in detail the experience that so many african-american families have, when he talked about there not being a difference when you're in a hoodie or when you make $300,000 a year, i thought about my husband who's been profiled in a store for shoplifting. i thought about my son, my 18-year-old son -- my sons, my 18-year-old son who drives out of my driveway every day, and i pray over him every time he leaves my house. that's the experience that african-americans are having in this country. that's the experience that joe biden was able to speak about in detail because he listens and he cares. donald trump still does not get it. and with the racial reckoning we are having in this country, the fact he can't even engage in a

coherent conversation about what it means to be black in america, again, is another reminder that he should not be the president of the united states. >> ladies and gentlemen, watching her mask is unambiguous, and it tells the message. and that is vote 12 days from now if you haven't already in the upcoming presidential election. we wish you and your family the very best, mayor keisha lance bottoms of atlanta, georgia. thank you for staying and hanging out with us tonight. we appreciate it. >> thank you for having me. a fact check on tonight's debate. no shortage of work for our friend and in-house counsel ari melber, host of the 6:00 p.m. eastern hour on this network, also happens to be our chief legal correspondent. so, it's kind of in his title. but, ari, i was thinking of you

during the event not knowing quite where i'd start if i were you, but go ahead. >> thank you brian, good to be with you. there was more to start with because this was a more audible debate. there was more back and forth between the candidates. a big thing we want to start with on policy and law which some of our anchors have touched on already is that exchange about child separation and immigration. basically the president was trying to imply that the previous administration where of course joe biden was vice president had the same or similar policy, and that's not true. we'll put some of the data up there regarding child separation. you have 3,000 children separated from parents. as mentioned 545 children have parents who are still essentially at large as far as the u.s. government's concerned. as far as what the obama administration did, they had harsh policies some of which were controversial, but a key distinction here which makes trump's claim false, they did not as policy target families for have separation. then there was of course the discussion of covid, brian, and you and rachel and others have

touched on this. and we've now put together and are airing this for the first time, the ultimate fact check of donald trump because it's his own administration cdc director who contradicts what trump tried to claim tonight on vaccines. we'll let people see it for themselves. >> we have a vaccine that's coming. it's ready. it's going to be announced within weeks, and it's going to be delivered -- >> if you're asking me when is it going to be generally available to the american public, i think we're probably looking at late second quarter, third quarter 2021. >> that is about as crisp a fact check as you can get. dr. robert redfield who's a virologist who runs the cdc, but again serves in trump's own administration pushing that projected way out past what the president claimed. an important fact check is the one of the risk of covid. how you apportion blame may be a political debate. how this disease, this virus affects people, well, the president trying to claim 99% of young adults don't have any

problems. that's just not the case. about 1 out of 5, 20% need intensive care. 1 out of 10 need ventilators. we know how serious that is. and tragically over 2.5% die even in that younger age group. yes, it is not as dangerous as the main at risk group of seniors, but it is by no means a walk in the park, brian. >> strangest moment of the night remains when trump accused biden of selling pillows and sheets. ari melber, thank you for taking a whack with a sigh that some of the behemoth facts that needed checking. coming up, james carville, mark murphy on today's highlights and low lights when our special edition of "the 11th hour" continues. >> we're about to go into a dark winter, a dark winter. and he has no clear plan. >> we're opening up our country. we've learned and studied and understand the disease which we didn't at the beginning.

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i'm running as a proud democrat but i'm going to be an american president. i don't see red states and blue states. what i see is america, united states. >> two of our professionals are back with us tonight to talk about what it was we witnessed this evening. james carville, veteran democratic strategist who rose to national fame with the

clinton presidential campaign, who is these days co-host of the 2020 politics war room podcast. and mike murphy, republican strategist, codirector of the center for political future at the university of southern california. mike, to you first. i saw on social media tonight you said something akin to at the end of the night, nothing changes. is that indeed your position? >> yeah, i think, correct me if i'm wrong, biden might have inched ahead. biden had a good debate, i think his best debate so far. he was tight, on message. and he got the kind of contrast he's looking for trump that he's a uniter, he has empathy, he has a plan. while donald trump kind of down shifted from maniacal trump in the last debate to dare i say it low energy trump tonight. it was still kind of -- trump never really connected on anything. he got a few jabs on biden but nothing that will give him the traction he needs. trump needs to understand most americans think hunter is a

ceiling fan, and this kind of inside rambling about stuff nobody understands, biden was talking about the issues people care about. so if you're trump, you're behind and you're in trouble you need a huge winning debate. and while he got a slight tone shift, i don't think he got what he needed at all tonight to change the race. >> mike, did you agree with me on some of the trump references? you would have to be on a steady drip of fox news, oan, mark levin to know some of those references were to these alleged e-mails from the alleged laptop from formerly known as america's mayor rudy giuliani? >> yeah, it's like showing up two hours into a model railroad convention. and unless you know what "n" and "o" gauge are, again, trump was in that bubble he's in making references that sounded to

average voters i think like almost incoherence. so, you know, for a guy who desperately needs traction and needs to make the race about the economy, instead it was making the 44% he's got, at least a half of it that's tuned into fox a lot, very, very happy by making these oblique references. and i think a lot of people were scratching their heads and listening to biden talk about actual concerns. >> well, there go my chances of ever attending a model railroad convention. james carville, same question, which what did you make of him tonight? >> first of all, in the clip you showed and that was the high point when biden talked about -- so i'm glad you can't see that clip. on the hunter biden stuff. part of my job i've got to watch fox and they're all over this all the time. and trump brought it up, and within 40 seconds biden had

shifted the conversation to trump's tax returns. it was some really good footwork in there. and mike's right. it's an arcane thing most people don't know about, and if they actually knew about it, they'd probably die laughing. biden was actually very skillful in getting out of that subject into the subject of trump's tax returns. so if i'm the fox people i've got to be a little bit disappointed because they were really, really investing a lot into this story, i guess you'd call it. i don't know if story is the right word for it. that was a good moment. i kind of agree. i don't think this was a tie. i think a tie would be a win. i think biden had a good debate, and i think that biden had a good debate season. a lot of people were saying we discussed this on the show, maybe trump shouldn't debate -- biden shouldn't.

and i always thought he should. and i think biden was helped by these debates. it solidified an already-good lead as a result of them. >> now, james, i've been thinking about you because the last time you were on our fair broadcast you made a lot of democrats nervous when you predicted maybe even 10:30 eastern time on election night we would have an early call and early night. do you still contend that could happen, and what do you make of what you've seen out there? >> i do think that. i think we're going to have a good idea of it fairly early on election night. look, you know, the problem is president obama said yesterday, biden doesn't just have to win. he's got to win by more than just a little bit. and right now i honestly think we're on track to do that. i thought that the whole time. but, you know, when the facts change, i'll change my mind. but i defer on this because that

hasn't changed much in the last six, eight weeks or so. >> the president pulled a -- go ahead. >> just, you know, florida in particular. biden has a small but steady lead there, and florida counts their absentees as they come in. now there's a four-day delay and if you don't win florida and you're a republican, you're done. we're going to know florida pretty quick it is likely. and if it goes the way i think it would tomorrow, if the election were tomorrow, the four-day count in wisconsin won't be that important. it'll be real trouble for donald trump. but, you know, we got 12 days left, so the campaigns have to execute in turn out. >> mike, let me ask you this, does the idea, the notion we have 50 million votes in -- in, already cast, does that change what guys like you have come up learning and teaching about electoral politics? >> you know election day is now

10 days long or longer. so a lot of that vote that's coming in, some of it's pushed back by fear of coronavirus on election day or a week before early vote. and others are enthusiastic voters of both parties. so i suspect more democrats can hardly wait to race their ballot in. but it means for trump to get ig going every day 5% of the electorate or so is out voting and he loses the opportunity of those people. so, you know, the -- he's really dealing with a time clock. and tonight was the last real opportunity to grab the race. and if anybody grabbed it tonight it was biden who i think might have pushed himself forward a little more. that early vote thing is a huge factor. >> james, i'm going to play for you a bit of tonight's debate. some of the questions were kind of unintended measurements of empathy and especially this portion. here is donald trump on immigration.

>> now they cannot find over 500 sets of those parents, and those kids are alone, nowhere to go, nowhere to go. it's criminal. it's criminal. >> let me ask you about -- >> i will say this, they went down, we brought reporters, everything. they are so well-taken care of. >> so, james, obviously the president there at the end. how will -- will remarks like that just land in their respective buckets? >> well, first of all, you hit the daily double because that was the low point in this. they're not conclusive and it was not a huge sample, but that was the moment where trump's line dipped the lowest. and i saw that john and nicolle and rachel were talking about that early. and you don't have to be a genius to say this.

women have -- i do, too, and i'm not a woman -- a visceral reaction to children being separated from their parents. that's almost a universal reaction that you feel. and he looked very cavalier and callus about it, and biden looked very humane. i think the moderator did a good job by exposing that in the two candidates and drawing that distinction. that's what they should do, and i think he did do a wonderful job tonight. >> and i thought nicolle put it beautifully when she said to her fellow parents, any of us who have been separated from our children for 2 minutes in a grocery store -- and who among us has not had that fright -- her point obviously the larger matter was just something that minor, what that does to your nervous system imagine 500 plus sets of parents being unlinked with their children. >> hey, mike, i've got a question for you. "the wall street journal" is out

tonight. so the president had this special guest tonight, a guy by the name of bobalinski. and i'll not muck this up any further. i'll read "the wall street journal" story. an exbusiness partner of hunter biden in a news conference organized by the trump campaign alleged former vice president joe biden was around discussions around his son's efforts to form an investment venture with a chinese oil company. biden campaign denied joe biden had any involvement in the venture nor stood to gain by it. in a statement to reporters thursday anthony said in 2017 hunter consulted his father about a planned venture with a chinese oil company. they go on to say it never got off the ground, and that sentence you see on your screen. corporate records reviewed by "the wall street journal" show no role for joe biden.

is that going to put an end to that part of this plot line, mike? >> yeah, i think so. it's the kind of late crazy stuff a campaign in trouble does. there's no corroboration of any of this. they might want to send a few reporters to find the shady chinese bankers who set up trump's secret account. maybe they can put him in the right direction. this thing seems to be very thin to me, and again this stuff -- people right now are wondering when they're going to get their small businesses open, when they're going to be able to visit their grandparents because of covid-19 and what the same plan is. and, you know, some crazy sci-fi tale about hunter biden and martians and chinese and stuff, seems to be no real credible source other than bobalinsky all we know is he's in the pocket of the trump campaign. i think that's a spit ball off a

battleship. trump's got to start moving the needle on issues people care about. and as we saw tonight he just doesn't have a lot of ammo on that. on the defense on covid, immigration policy, scandal, one bungle after the other. so he just doesn't have a grip, so we're down to the side show stuff now in the closing days. >> and james, you have spoke passionately on our broadcast about voter suppression. i note that your ancestral neighbors in the state of georgia have done nothing to shake their hard-earned reputation in the area of voter suppression. it's been a rough cycle in georgia for a lot of folks just trying to cast a vote. >> it is. but i've got friends there -- when you tell people they can't vote and try to stop them, they want to vote more. it really -- it fires them up. and the turnout numbers now, they're not being terribly

successful from the turnout numbers i was getting kind of midday today in these counties around atlanta. it looks very strong. and they're putting real effort behind this. there's so much you can do, but the people are reacting very, very strongly to this. and we're going to see the turnout numbers are going to be exceedingly high. the numbers given today were nothing short of breathtaking, and we're going to continue to see that. and to be fair, the turn out is going to be more in the rural areas and more republican areas, but the suburban and urban turnout in particular the rural and metro is going to be off the charts. >> pleasure to talk to you gentleman in regular intervals. jamd car vil, mike murphy have been our guests tonight. thank you both very much. and coming up, reaction from the biden surrogate campaign. simone sanders will be joining us when this special edition of "the 11th hour" continues.

i felt good about it, and i thought the moderator did a great job of making it run smoothly. and so it was much more rational debate than the first one. got a chance to speak to the american public. >> joe biden about to board his motorcade and leave the venue in nashville. we are pleased to welcome back to our broadcast simone sanders, senior advisor to the joe biden campaign. simone, to start with we're i think correctly proud of our friend and colleague kristen welker around here tonight as we always are.

and for starters i assume you were happy that there were questions and topics that don't usually get a thorough national airing. detailed questions on criminal justice. detailed questions on black lives matter. detailed questions on economic -- i mean environmental justice that we usually never hear. >> kristen welker did a great job. kudos to her. and i may say representation matters, and i think for a lot of black and brown girls all across this country tonight they were pleased to see kristen welker sitting in that seat. let me say, though, kristen welker did something else tonight. she gave the president multiple opportunities to articulate his plan and vision for the future, multiple opportunities to talk about his plan to combat covid-19. and tonight we got nothing from the president. on the contrary joe biden spoke directly to the american people. he summed up really how he

viewed this conversation and this race. and saying it's not about my family or his family, referring to the president's family. it's about your family, the american people. and i think that's why tonight joe biden resoundingly won that debate. in our eyes it wasn't close, it wasn't not even by a little bit. this was a dramatic and resounding win by vice president biden tonight. >> i mentioned this point earlier in our coverage. i have to presume at that moment where donald trump accused the biden family writ large, the former vice president's siblings and children of vacuuming up money, of using his vice-presidency as a business opportunity -- at that moment i have to believe your candidate had a choice to counter personal about the children of the president seated in front of him or not, and he chose the latter. am i partly near correct? >> absolutely.

i mean, that -- attacking other people's children, other folks' families is not who joe biden is. it runs counter to everything he believes. as he stated in the debate tonight, this isn't about their families. this is about the american peoples families. joe biden sees this race as scranton vs. park avenue. he sees what's happening in america through the eyes of folks and kitchen tables like the folks he grew up with in scranton, like folks in omaha, nebraska, places like wisconsin, all across this country. and that's the advantage he brings to this race. look, brian, there were lots of tangents by the president tonight, but i didn't hear any clear plans. and a lot was made on twitter in and even some post-broadcast conversation about the president's temperament. the reality is, yes, his voice was calmer tonight, donald trump interrupted a little less but he lied just the same. he lied about joe biden and his family, lied to the american people many times on that stage.

and he brought much of the same that we've heard from him over the last four years. >> what is something, a blanket statement you can make about the travel of joe biden in the 12 remaining days? at least one event per day, or are multiple events per day on the calender? >> well, i can tell you, you are going to see a lot of joe biden. he will be out and about tomorrow. and you're going to see him over the next 12 days. vice president biden's travel will be a mixture of in-person and virtual events. and we are not going to leave anything on the field. i know folks see the polls out there, and i'm going to echo something our campaign manager jim o'malley dylan wrote to our supporters just this last weekend. we cannot let up. this race is a lot closer than it looks out there in the world, and people looking on television and reading the newspapers, and that is why we have to fight to the very end.

you know, election day -- we like to call it election deadline. people are voting right now in this country so we're encouraging people to go to iowavote.com, go to joebiden.com and make your vote and vote early, because this is in the power of the people as joe biden likes to say. and this is the united states of america. there's nothing we can't do if we don't come together, and we believe the people should, and will be heard and we're out there to earn everybody's vote and it's not over until the people say it's over, brian. >> election deadline is probably a phrase we should borrow in our line of work. simone sanders, thank you for always making time for us. we appreciate it. good to see you. another break for us. and coming up, more of our special coverage of this final presidential debate as part of our extended edition of "the 11th hour" after this.

♪ well, good evening once again as we continue this special extended edition of "the 11th hour" and cross the top of the hour here on the east coast making this now day 1,373 of the trump administration. it also means we are down to just 11 days to go until election day. keep in mind almost 50 million votes are already in, and that's a record. tonight was, of course, the second and final debate between donald trump and joe biden, likely the last time both men will see each other and be able to make their case before such a