we get to that point. we're not there at this point. >> jon, thank you. >> coming upon top of the the e midnight out west. you're watching msnbc's continuous coverage of the 2020 election. i am katy tur. >> and i'm ayman mohyeldin. there are hundreds of ballots being counted across the country as we await the final results of six states. as it stands, donald trump continues to trail joe biden by 39 electoral votes. you have both candidates are still looking for that count to 270. we're also keeping an eye on those outstanding senate races. there is a lot at stake for the democrats, who are hoping to take over control of the senate by now. let's get a quick check on the big board with ali velshi, who has been monitoring all this for us. it's a slow process at this point of the night where we're getting batches of tallies.

the last one we got within the last half hour in arizona. all eyes are on the southwest. >> yeah. and we're not going to get more from arizona for several hours now. what we have in arizona right now is a lead for biden. let me take you to the other one where i can show you exactly what we're looking at. in arizona, what you have statewide, we've got about 86% of the vote in. it sounds like a lot, but we may have several 100,000 votes to come, and joe biden has a 68-point lead. it's relatively close, but still looking like it favors biden. we're also looking for nevada, where we have a slightly bigger percentage in 86%. we're going get stuff from nevada in a few hours, probably about noon eastern we'll get another drop of information in nevada. we're looking for about 200,000 votes. but again, we're mostly missing votes in the reno area, where joe biden is outperforming

donald trump. not by much, by about 10,000 votes. but we're still looking for about 30,000 votes there. and in clark county, which is las vegas, same thing. but we've got a bigger lead there. joe biden is leading by about 60,000 votes. but we're still looking for more than 150,000 votes. the other places we are looking for across the country are georgia, where we should get votes. they say that they're doing quite well with their vote counting. some time in the next 12 to 16 hours, we should have information on georgia. statewide, donald trump is leading in georgia. we have 95% of the vote in. but just to give you a sense of that, still maybe about 200,000 votes remaining. and if you look at where the votes are outstanding in georgia, it's in the atlanta metroplex. these are nine counties around fulton county, which is atlanta, all of which tend to be overly democratic. we've got columbus, georgia, which is muskogee county. that is again favoring joe biden by a very large margin.

macon, georgia favoring joe biden. augusta, which is richmond county, favoring joe biden, and savannah. so all the outstanding votes, the large areas with outstanding votes in georgia are generally favoring joe biden. let me give you an example. dodge county over here. we're expecting only 3,000 votes there. that's favoring donald trump over here in floyd county in the northwest of georgia, we're expecting another 5,000 votes. that's favoring donald trump. so there are some counties that favor donald trump in georgia, but they aren't populous. the population centers in georgia are favoring joe biden. north carolina, very close right now. 95% of the vote in. there is not much left. well, actually, there might be close to 300,000 votes left. however, we got a small trump lead here, 76,000. but we're not getting any more information. we can sit here and come to me every half an hour. we won't get more information on north carolina for a while,

because they're allowing mail-in ballots to have been mailed and received, and will be counted. same issue in alaska. there is a reason why we're not getting numbers in alaska. we're expecting that to go for donald trump. we've got only 56% of the vote in, because the vast majority of ballots in alaska are mail-in ballots. so donald trump has a lead of 51,000. we're still expecting another 150,000, 190,000 votes in alaska. but as you know, what's the one thing i haven't talked to you about yet? pennsylvania. they will have their results by friday night, because if you mailed your ballot on monday -- on tuesday, on election day, you have until friday for it to be received and to be counted. however, the secretary of state has said everything is working on time. they are going through the night. and they expect to have -- they expect to have this done by friday. so might actually by earlier. might evan be thursday. what we are looking for there, this is a different situation. we are looking for votes to be coming in from all over the

state in pennsylvania. right now, pennsylvania has a lead for donald trump of 164,000 votes. but we have probably 800,000 votes still coming, and again, they are overwhelmingly coming from allegheny county, which is pittsburgh. 80,000 votes expected there. philadelphia county, which is philadelphia the city, 244,000 votes here. this thing normally breaks above 90% for the democrats. so donald trump is at 20%. biden is at 80%. you can expect that spread to increase. again, i only left pennsylvania for last because i think we're going get pennsylvania last. there are paths to victory, by the way, for let me just show you one more thing before i let you go. there are paths to victory for donald trump and joe biden to get to 270 votes, but the difference is biden has nine options. he has nine paths to victory. donald trump has three options. he either takes pennsylvania,

georgia, north carolina, and arizona. he takes pennsylvania, georgia, north carolina, and nevada, or he takes pennsylvania, arizona, nevada, and alaska. three choice, but he's got a lot of winning to do in order to get to 270. >> can you go back for a minute to the pennsylvania map? you were talk about this on your show earlier today, katy, was the postal office. ali just explained to the viewers we're probably not going to get a final definitive result until friday because of the secretary of state and the pennsylvania legislator deciding that they have until friday. if you put your ballot in the mail on tuesday, november 3rd, you have until friday for it to arrive. but what we learned today is the postal service in central pennsylvania was underperforming. >> yes. >> there were concerns about postal delivery in the philadelphia area, a predominantly biden area. i think there are still a lot of questions as to whether or not the way all of this has played out -- >> the whole country. you saw this.

i think you may have even tweeted it. the underperformance of the postal service, it's another easily fixable thing, right? we can decide that everybody can run their own election, but all ballots need to look the same. maybe they need to be a particular color, and maybe they don't get mailed the way normal mail gets in. maybe it costs the government a few extra cents, but it gets treated like express mail, and it gets there on time. this is an easily solvable problem, some of which, some of this was political stuff, and that needs to end. every american needs to understand that their right to vote needs to be protected and the postal service should not be an impediment. >> we've had a lot of discussion, he will invoke jacob sobirov about why we have to vote on tuesday. it has to do with the sabbath and farmers able to get to the

polling place. it's convoluted and hundreds of years old. it's antiquated. >> yes. >> what we have learned in this election is there is a better way to do it. what we have seen because of the pandemic, one silver lining is we can have voting begin much earlier than november 3rd. we can do it in a way where voters are allowed to drop off their ballots and not only polling place that are go and vote at polling places that are open before election day, or go drop off their ballot at elections offices or drop them off in dropboxs or request a mail-in ballot and get it in early so the postal service has time to get it back. >> can i give you two more ors? >> there are so many ways we can do this better. we're learning. >> i want to give you two more ors. in australia, anybody can vote anywhere in the country. there is a way we can figure that out. in north carolina, you can have an app that shows you what the voting lines are different places and go to a different polling place in order to vote.

and domino's pizza has a thing that tells me when they put it in the oven, when it comes out of the oven, when it's getting quality checked, when it's left and it gets to my house. domino's pizza can do this. america, you do thinking i think domi domino's pizza is a little more technologically advanced. >> 100%. you can also ensure your pizza. >> you live in new york city. why do you eat domino's pizza? it's because of the app. >> do you really? >> i know where my food is at all times. i know where my food is once i digest it at all time. i have full control of my ingestion of my food. >> ali, i will personally deliver you better pizza than that. i will go to the -- >> but will you tell me where you are in the process? >> i will. i will give you a full movement by movement count of where your pizza slice is. ali, come on! >> this, katy tur, is who we are. >> all right. ali velshi, we digress on to a

very important subject of pizza in new york. >> i'm horrified. >> seriously. we won't talk about it. ali, thanks for that. let's go to wilmington where we have the latest from the campaign. >> i know allie is horrified as well. i can see it in her eyes. >> i have to say i am. >> sorry for the pizza reference. it's 2:00 a.m. and i'm hungry for pizza now. allie, give us the update from the biden campaign. i know, it's 3:00 a.m. have you heard anything interesting? >> yeah, guys, well, if there is pizza, count me in. in terms of what we're hearing out of wilmington, really, the initial shock of the other night wore off pretty quickly as the sun came up here yesterday. the team really leaning into the idea of being patient, letting all the votes be counted. and it's funny, as i was talking too democrats over election night, everyone i talked to that night said this is going to take a while. we have to be patient. but then the words in advance

started meeting the reality, and there was just a lot of jitters. we know the 2016 that hangs over this race. democrats have seen that worn off. they're feeling good based on what they've seen and being able to rebuild parts after that blue wall. but the biden team is really gearing up for potential legal fights ahead. we've seen fighting words from bob bauer, the lawyer leading the effort for the biden campaign. he has effectively said throughout this process that if the trump campaign wanting to make the forays into the court, the biden team will be there to meet them. and he is confident they will win in whatever cases that will spring up, whether it's from wisconsin to georgia, all of these new filings and potential filings that we're seeing from the trump campaign. i would also say that ali pointed out there are mo paths to victory for the biden team than there are for trump. that's something that has remained true consistently. the biden team was really clear at the outset that they thought hey had a lot of different ways to get to 270. and frankly, that remains to be

the case right now. as we start going into this, we are seeing and hearing from the candidate. we saw joe biden yesterday. his running mate standing next to him. falling short of saying i am the winner, but i plan to be the winner once this is all over. let the process play out. it's an important distinction that the campaign has tried to make throughout this process. they saw the way donald trump came out on election night and without facts or votes to back him up, say he won. they wanted to be cautious to project optimism. but also letting the candidate get out there and say he does feel good about where this race is at. in terms of what we can see here today, we know that a lot of those states that they're banking on to get them to 270 are still outstanding. votes are still being counted. however, if we do see them get to 270 today, you can very well expect we're probably going to see joe biden here in wilmington. >> are they a little nervous though? i know they have more paths than the trump campaign does. the trump campaign does have, i think ali said three paths. are they a little nervous? i know it's legally obligated

that they have to make a transition. but are they a little nervous about posting their transition online? any superstitious folks in the biden campaign? >> there is a lot of superstitious folks in the biden campaign. and democrats are notoriously skittish, especially around elections. but that being said, you've sort of got to go with the public posture on this. yes, legally you have to have a transition. this is something that has existed for several weeks now. but at the same time, they are sort of making these slow forays. you have a landing page there basically if you were to go to the transition team website. there is not much more than that. they are sort of slowly wading into that space that they have been quietly setting up behind the scenes. sure, there is superstition here, but at the end of the day, they're doing what they've done throughout this process, which is leaning on the math, leaning on the data, and saying that they see the raw numbers they think leaning in their favor. all of that being said, they can see the raw numbers, but nbc news and our decision desk has yet to make the calls.

we have yet to see the numbers on our team. the biden team is projecting a lot of confidence here. they're not saying this is 100% theirs, but you also see bob bauer saying on a call yesterday that they think they've won already. >> i still feel like that's today. >> we lost track of days. ali vitali, we have a pizza being delivered to you right now. >> oh, great. >> he's lying, ali, oh my god, that's cruel. do we really? >> you never know. thanks, ali. >> i'd like to know. >> we'll let you know shortly. pivoting to the trump campaign, nbc senior white house reporter shannon pettypiece has the latest inside the trump campaign and what they are thinking at this hour. i suspect, shannon, that they're looking at the reality that is sinking in, and it looks that it's getting narrower and narrower for the president to make it to another four years at the white house. >> you know, these numbers that are coming in from arizona, they are breaking at exactly the margin that the trump campaign

needed to be able to eat into -- to be able to eat into biden's lead enough. so those numbers that are coming out of arizona overnight, they are encouraged by those. they need to keep going on that trend, though. and that's a big question. is the next batch of ballots going to be breaking at the same level for trump? pennsylvania and georgia much different stories. earlier in the day, the campaign was saying they were very confident about what they were seeing in pennsylvania from these trump country rural working class parts of the state. but as the numbers have continued to come in, they're not hitting their targets in all of those places. there is an expectation it would be exceeding the white working class vote in 2016 in lancaster county, and erie county and those parts of the state, and they're not really doing that. so that's a concern there. now a lot of the attention is on philly. they have hope among the trump campaign is that the philly numbers aren't as big as 2016, aren't as big as their models are predicting.

but we've got this whole legal undercurrent over all this, this legal battle that they're trying to fight on 'nam of fronts, and the big issue there underlying these legal cases is trying to limit the number of mail-in ballots that get counted, essentially. for example, in pennsylvania. they don't want to see ballots counted if they came in past 8:00 p.m. on election day. so these mail-in ballots that have been breaking really hard for biden, trying to limit how many of those get counted. so that's really the crux of these legal cases that we're seeing. >> shannon, savor this question. because if donald trump doesn't win, this might be one of the last times i'm going get to ask you this question, or at least in the coming months. anyone in the white house or in the campaign a little freaked out by the president going on twitter and claiming states for electoral purposes when he doesn't have the -- you can

claim that you're going to bed right now, but you're on television with us. it's not reality. >> right. this isn't i claim this land in the name of spain, which is what that tweet sounded like. it is -- when you hear -- when the trump campaign is talking to reporters, talking to sources, it's i'll just say a much different message than the president is saying. when you talk to the campaign, they're talking about the legal nuances, the numbers, what the data is showing, how they think they can pull this off. no one in the white house or the campaign is saying we claim this, the commonwealth of pennsylvania. but at the same time, the president's advisers have been urging him to keep fighting this, to not give in, not throw in the towel, encouraging him to fight this, and pushing him in this direction. and so there is still even within the campaign while he may not be claiming electoral votes, there is confidence and there is defiance, and they are ready for a full-court press to try and

fight to the very bitter end in all of this. >> shannon, let me ask you quickly, one person i've been keeping an eye on, and i haven't heard anything from, and maybe you know. so please tell me if you have it, william barr. where is he in all of this over the past 24 hours, as we begin to see the issue of legal challenges emerge from the trump campaign? because despite the fact that he is the attorney general and is responsible for the judiciary, or at least the prosecution of the cases in this country on a federal level, he does sometimes act to the criticism and observation of many as president trump's personal lawyer. >> right. well, we've seen one of president trump's personal lawyers resurface, rudy giuliani. but we have not heard much from the attorney general. it is possible that he can stay out of it, that this remains an issue in the states and at the court level and not at the federal district level. but of course we will see. and the president may even try and bring him into this at some

point. but no, he has not been a figure in all this so far. >> shannon pettypiece, shannon, thank you so much for staying up with us. we got a panel coming up for us after the break. >> absolutely. stay with us. got a lot more to talk about. it's moving day. and while her friends

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welcome back, everyone. let's bring in nbc contributor and political strategist and founding partner of northern star strategy, michael starr hopkins and msnbc political contributor and former republican congressman from florida, david jolly. great to have all of you with us. let me begin with you, david, in florida. first of all, the republican party right now is at this crossroads. you have a president who is claiming victory, and is falsely

saying that he has essentially won his second term, and yet we're not necessarily hearing from every rank and file republican saying this is not how it's going to be. we have to wait until the votes are counted. where do you see the complicitness of the republican party at this point with what the president is tweeting? >> it's a great question, ayman, because, look, this is a president who is needing to control the narrative, but to do so, he desperately needs allies. and the only public allies we're seeing within the republican party right now are those who typically kind of operate around the fringes and empower some of the fringe narratives. where the president sits tonight, see wrestling with three elements or three opportunities if you will. the first is to be able to actually capture the votes. it's largely out of his control. if there is one pathway still left, the president doesn't want to completely resign that over and then shift to a second element or strategy, which is the legal one.

but we know they're wrestling with the legal one as well. and with that, there is the minutia. can you challenge certain ballots, certain deadlines and so forth? those are the cases we're seeing right now. but the inflection point for the president and for his republican allies is sort of the nuclear option, which is the big legal option. and though it hasn't been talked about a lot, the president made decide to escalate this. and the final legal move is to try to prevent certification of the results in these states. and that requires kind of a full-scale apac on our election system. could he make a case before a court that look, the secretary of state of pennsylvania of georgia, or arizona should be prevented from certifying the results? is it because of the vote by mail changes or the vote by mail apparatus. is it because of the postal issues? a broad scale argument. but that's where he doesn't have the allies right now within the republican party. and to successfully do so would

require a significant public affairs strategy that we're just not seeing right now. >> well, i'm curious about this, because i was talking to bob costa about the republican party and what they thought of the president's behavior declaring he was a winner the other night. and bob costa said, and we've heard this a thousand times privately, republicans were very upset, but publicly they're not going to come out and break where the president. how far is the republican party, your former party, how far are they willing to go to back this president up? >> katy, i love that question. i've wrestled with it. the number of conversations i've had about the demise of the republican party in the past four years matches many others, particularly on this network. what i'm about to say is not to shift the narrative, but it's more a concern. we talked about last night about how our nation behaves in a partisan way, and it's this. there has been no attrition among the republican party on

trump in terms of performance. republicans perform about 50% in presidential elections. that's roughly what we saw last night? why do they need to course correct if they're performing at 50%? i would flip and ask democrats, how can you let this guy get 50%? this guy. how have you not found a way the actually grow your blue coalition and beat donald trump by a wider margin? i think that's a question we'll wrestle. with. >> well, michael, that's a good question for you to answer. >> it is. when i talk to democrats or republicans on the hill, both of them tonight are very frustrated. republicans because the worst scenario for them was a close loss for donald trump. a close loss means they can't really kick him to the curb, repudiate him and move on. now it's guaranteed that he's going to be a big voice in the party. and on the side of democrats, it's just like david is saying, how can we not beat this guy? 250,000 americans dead, the economy is hurting, americans

are upset. it doesn't bode well for democrats moving forward. so we've got to figure out how we're going to talk to republicans and independents and make a better message. >> ashley, let's pick up on that point for a moment. if we were to assume everything holds as, and joe biden, as he says he anticipates becoming the next president of the united states and the senate remains in the hands of the republicans, i know those are a lot of ifs i'm throwing your way. but if in fact that does stay that way, we are looking at a very divided government at a time that the country is extremely divided with a lo lot of things that get done, chiefly among them stimulus relief for the millions of americans that are struggling and can't afford to get by on a daily basis. >> well, let's say all of those hypotheticals are in fact true. you would have joe biden, who would be the perfect leader for that very unique moment. because even in his speeches thus far, he, one, has not claimed victory, has just showed

his pathway to 270, that this could be the eventual situation. he has said he will be an american president. this is a theme he has conveyed multiple times continuously throughout his campaign, because he knew he was going to get the support of people like me who were former republicans who are now independent who voted a blue ticket. and that's exactly the new situation we create heard in the united states. and to michael's point, we have a lot of independents that biden was able to pick up in this election. and i do want to give his infrastructure credit for that, because suburban female voter, and that was who tipped the scales for trump in '16, they came out, 55 to 44% in favor of biden nationally this time around in 2020, according to preliminary exit polling. so i'm sure we're going to see data kind of shift on that. but that's a huge change and turnout. and that really shows you the

direction which kind of this country is going at this point. so i do think, yes, there will be be gridlock, but biden is the perfect president-elect to be able to handle that situation, because he has said time and time again, he will work across the aisle. he is one of those kind of mccain politicians where bipartisanship is part of his record. so i do believe he will be an american president who will meet that moment. >> you say president-elect. he is not even quite there yet. we are still waiting to get these races in. let's be clear with everybody. david, i know joe biden says he wants to work with the other side. do you foresee the other side wanting to work with him? >> look, mitch mcconnell famously said that his goal was to make obama a one-term president. and so reaching across the aisle requires somebody to reach back. i do think the success of a -- let's call it a cross-partisan biden administration is going to rely on the relationship and negotiation between mitch mcconnell and chuck schumer.

joe biden's going to face two forces. he is going to be facing wrestling with republican interests, but he is also going to be wrestling with a bit of the progressive base that residences in the house, right. the democrats did a very good job coalescing around biden, setting aside the family conversation over ideology. but there will be that pull in the house. but i think if nancy pelosi can marshal something to the senate, on whatever the policy proposal is by say a president joe biden, then it comes down to whether mitch mcconnell and chuck schumer can reach agreement on what to move. i think anything that mcconnell and schumer can reach a agreement on you'll have pelosi confirming. >> does nancy pelosi keep her seat -- not her seat, her position. >> i made the case last go-round that perhaps it was time for a change. you can't give her anything but high marks the last two years. i'll leave it to democrats whether it's time for a new direction or not. >> david? your not going answer that question?

michael? >> i'm a disrupter at heart, and nancy pelosi that's steady hand. so i prefer to see change always. but, look, we've had a tumultuous two years, including an impeachment where i think speaker pelosi should have been more aggressive. i think you'll have some in the party, in the democratic party that said yes, she should have. you'll have others who say she handled it masterfully. she has a caucus that will ultimately vote. i think she has the seats to keep the speakership. >> it's 3:32 in the morning, and david, your name is directly in the prompter, and i keep saying it. that is the hour of the morning. and that is me not having enough coffee. michael, please answer that question. >> nancy pelosi has absolutely earned the right to stay speaker. but i do think democrats are struggling with the idea our leadership doesn't look like the people it's supposed to represent. so i think we've got to get younger. we have to get more diverse, and i think we've got to be able to

talk to more people. so i think that's where democrats have to get better. it's messaging. it's always messaging with democrats. >> everyone, thank you so much. i appreciate it. and coming up next, where are we going to go? >> we're going to go to the big board. we're going bring back ali velshi. stay with us. about treatment options is key. today, we are redefining how we do things. we find new ways of speaking, so you're never out of touch. it's seeing someone's face that comforts us, no matter where. when those around us know us, they can show us just how much they care. the first steps of checking in, the smallest moments can end up being everything. there's resources that can inform us, and that spark can make a difference. when we use it to improve things, then that change can last within us.

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welcome back, everyone. it is 3:37. you're locking at -- we had the map there of the road to 270. >> looking at ali velshi. >> are you ordering pizza there? >> i am not ordering a pizza. i was actually doing calculations about maricopa county. i wanted to tell you something, because, you know, about half an hour ago, with ewent from 83% to 86% of the vote in maricopa county, and we are running with

a 68% advantage for joe biden. 50.5% to 4% in the state. now let's just quickly look at maricopa county. there is a difference of 74,000, 51% for joe biden. 47.2% for donald trump. now what's important here is the last time we got a big dump, 75,000 votes from maricopa county, which is the biggest area that we're missing votes from in arizona, still about 300,000 votes missing, donald trump was running at about 59% of the vote, with i was eating into joe biden's lead. he's coming in here at 58%. so the bottom line is he is still coming in stronger in the outstanding votes than joe biden is. this is where the problem comes in, because these are places, maricopa county, this county here where flagstaff is, and this county here, pima county,

where tucson is. these are outstanding areas of votes. 46,000 votes outstanding here. 13,000, not that many up here where flagstaff is. but a lot, 294,000 in the maricopa, phoenix area. if donald trump continues to come in at these rates, he is going to eat into the 68,000-point lead that biden has. that is why in arizona, you're seeing protests by trump people to say continue counting the vote. as you know in other parts of the country, those very same people, different people but same party affiliation are arguing to stop the vote counting. so where they do not have a vote advantage, they don't want to continue the counting where. they think they might have an advantage in places like arizona, they are continuing the counting. the bottom line is with 86% of the vote in statewide, and about half a million votes still not counted, we don't know which way arizona is going to go. now, i just want to quickly give

you the road to 270 and how we get there. we think nevada is leaning toward joe biden. if that happens, it gets him to 259. he needs 11 more electoral college votes. guess what? that's 11 in arizona, if he wins it. let's say he doesn't win arizona. let's give arizona to trump to see what happens. he gets to 225. then we're looking at georgia. that would get biden to 275. but if you give georgia to donald trump, it gets donald trump to 241. let's give north carolina to joe biden. that gets him above 270. if you give it to donald trump, he still doesn't get -- so i've just gwynn donald trump everything there. i'm going give him alaska too. still doesn't get him to 270. donald trump has got to get pennsylvania at this point in order to win this thing. that gets him to 279. so that is why all eyes remain

on pennsylvania. however, if joe biden does win nevada, and we will get numbers by about noon our time, noon eastern we'll get numbers on that, maybe not all of them, but we'll get more, and he wins arizona. if he keeps his lead in arizona, joe biden comes out with exactly 270 electoral college votes. >> ali velshi, can we zoom in on georgia? there was a note from glen alexander earlier tonight talking about the vote count there. i believe it was -- i want say it was dekalb county. i may have been fulton where there were still a few outstanding votes. they were saying they could count 2,000 votes an hour. we still getting an update? >> they actually say they're on track in dekalb county, which is just east of atlanta. atlanta is in fulton county. we've got 95% of the vote in. very, very little left. joe biden leading in dekalb county by 247,000 votes.

he is ahead. but not that much to come in. in cobb county, on the west of atlanta, again, we've got 95% in. we're expecting very little. again, a strong lead by biden. in fulton county, we're at 95%. and we're only expecting 20,000 votes there. douglas county expecting 5,000. gwinnett county we're expecting 14,000. rockdale 5,000. so this one is only 500 in henry county. >> are we still getting these numbers, though, at this late? >> they're coming in slowly. we've still got numbers coming in slowly. it's not just atlanta. we've got two counties in columbus. we're expecting 10,000 votes there that's 500. so we're not expecting much there. in macon, we're expecting 12,000 votes to come in roughly. almost 17,000 in savannah. that's chatham county. and about 14,000 in richmond county, which is augusta. and then a few blue counties down here where we're still expecting stuff. this is the remaining vote. these are the big areas we're

still remaining, we're expecting votes from. atlanta, columbus, macon, augusta, savannah. still a lot of votes to come in. the statewide lead that is under way here. donald trump has a 23,000 vote lead. democrats are fairly convinced that because of where the outstanding vote is in georgia, they have an opportunity to take the lead. but at the moment, donald trump is leading in georgia. we've got over 200,000 votes to expect. >> around the time you and i were on the air earlier, that number was in the 80,000s, so the fact it's down to 20,000 gives you a sense of how quickly that lead is shrinking. >> and the big circles. >> still a long way to go. >> democratic areas where a lot of the democratic votes could still be coming in. when ali velshi says maricopa county, do you here mari-cup a coffee? >> that's the hour right now. >> ali velshi, thank you so much, my friend.

we'll talk to you again in a little bit. >> and we've got a lot more to cover. there are still numbers coming in. votes are being counted. we're going get a little historical perspective as well on this wild year and this truly wild election. ♪ for skin as alive as you are... don't settle for silver ♪ gold bond champion your skin for the better. whatever question i have i feel like there's an avenue to seek the answer. hit that app and you start a story, you're on an adventure. download a new book within seconds and it's ready to go. there's something for everybody on audible. i like short stories. short stories are easy. they're quick. i like long and like intricate stories, that's really what i love. audible originals. i like biographies. self-help. fantasy. true crime podcasts. i love it so much.

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right from your computer all the amazing services of the post office only cheaper get our special tv offer a 4-week trial plus postage and a digital scale go to stamps.com/now and never go to the post office again! let us take a step back from the close examination of vote totals and look at the bigger picture. for that we're joined by jonathan alter, daily beast columnist and msnbc political contributor. also, as you can see behind him, author of "his very best" a new official autobiography on jimmy carter. it is a very good read. i encourage everyone to pick it up. john, this moment is insane. this year has been insane. there is still one path to 269,

269, which will make my head explode. >> we don't want to discuss that at this hour. >> as somebody who has been doing this, go ahead. >> samuel tillden in the house of representatives. in the 19th century. we won't go there. >> you know what? i didn't even know about that event in history, and i'm going to wipe it from my brain right now so i don't have to learn about it until after this is over and we don't get to that point. as somebody who has done this before, who has been around the block, who has seen these elections, sum up where we are experiencing right now. >> well, you know, in some way, this really isn't that abnormal. in the late 20th century, we had 1948 election, the 1960 election. in the 1948, 1960, those were

very long nights. and then 2000, long night. obviously went into overtime. 2004, we didn't know until the next day that john kelly had lost. john kerry had lost. what's different is the reason the count is taking longer is because of the absentee ballots. now why is it longer in some states than others? some states, the republicans went to court a few weeks ago to make sure that the absentee ballots could not be counted in a timely fashion. they were gunning for exactly what we have right now. so this isn't the fault of big city bosses in philadelphia, whatever. this is republicans making it hard for pennsylvania to count its ballots on a timely basis. >> it's not just that. it's also the president going out and claiming states for

electoral purposes. i mean, it's donald trump. the expectations are that he was going do something like this. it shouldn't come as a surprise to anybody i guess at this point. what i'm so curious about, what happens if joe biden wins? how does donald trump treat his lame duck period? and is he really going to participate? i just can't envision him participating. i'm not saying he won't. i just personally from my experience with him cannot envision him participating in the -- you know, the ceremony display of the transfer of power, of him being a part of a joe biden inauguration. >> look, this is a president and this is completely unprecedented in all of american history who has tried to assault our election, which is the bedrock of our democracy. and then on top of that, he has refused to guarantee a peaceful

transfer of power. and i'm actually quite worried about what some of these mobs are doing because you have a president who is inciting, essentially, inciting the mob at this point. we know that he's not going to have a nice ride down pennsylvania avenue with joe biden on january 20th. my guess is he'll slink out of the white house escorted by the secret service, which will be instructed to take him out and you won't see him showing any of the courtesies which we have come to rely on as part of our peaceful transfer of power. it's very disappointing, and i can't understand why anybody would be defending him. but he got close to what is it, five million votes. so there is still a lot of americans who don't understand how unprecedented it is and what a threat this man has been to

democracy. so it's going to be a bumpy ride. like reentry of a spacecraft into the earth's atmosphere in the next two and a half months. >> all right, jonathan alter, thanks for being with us. appreciate your time this morning. up next, the latest on the protests out west. we've got a lot more coming up after the break with our all-star panel. don't go anywhere. we're helping change the future of heart failure. understanding how to talk to your doctor about treatment options is key. today, we are redefining how we do things. we find new ways of speaking, so you're never out of touch. it's seeing someone's face that comforts us, no matter where. when those around us know us, they can show us just how much they care. the first steps of checking in, the smallest moments can end up being everything. there's resources that can inform us,

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all right. while much of america is riveted by the election, there is continuing unrest in portland, where a riot was declared wednesday night and the national guard was called in. joining us now is sergio olmos. he is a reporter for oregon public broadcasting. sergio, what's happening right now? >> so tonight there was a couple of protests in portland, and it

was a unified command of portland police, multnomah county sheriffs and the oregon state police, and protesters, a certain group split off from a bigger protest, started breaking windows along the way. and at that point, the state police decided to declare an unlawful assembly and then a riot. and as they were dispersing protesters, they made a decision to call in the national guard. and they assisted with dispersing protesters tonight. >> so what was the protest initially about? >> there were a couple of protest, and you should know that protest here is have been going on for about 150 days since the death of george floyd. most of them have been black lives matter protests and some have been quite large, and small. tonight there was a few black lives matter motorprotests. and the group that split off was a group that was smaller that detached from the bigger black lives matter protest. they started breaking windows and stuff along the way. the bigger black lives matter protest was adamant about not

breaking windows, not damaging property, not confronting police. and that smaller group kind of detached to do that. >> the violence in portland has been popping on and off. it seems like in the past few weeks at least, at least from a national perspective, it hasn't broken through. has it gotten calmer? and if it has, what is the reason for it -- well you tell me. what is the reason for it's getting worse if it was calmer and is now popping up again? >> yeah, so tonight, you know, protests in terms of portland protests was actually quite small. we've had 5,000 people marching in the streets before. tonight was a couple of hundred, and this group that, you know, created the situation where police declared a riot, they were breaking windows and stuff. to be very clear, there wasn't any kind of human-to-human harm going on. oregon state police did tweet out that they found somebody attempting to light a molotov. none of us have been able to confirm that.

but in these protests, usually the kind of -- you'll see property damage, starbucks will get broken into, they'll graffiti. but people along the way aren't getting assaulted. that's not really what these groups do. what these groups do. >> it's just an indicator of how tense the country is, because when you look at that protest in portland, you also have the protest outside of the white house, you have small protests taking place now in michigan as well as in arizona, so it just gives you a sense of how on edge the country is. sergio olmos, thank you so much for staying up late. appreciate your time this evening. >> thank you. it is 4:00 a.m. in the east, 1:00 a.m. out west. you're watching msnbc's continuing coverage of the 2020 election. i'm ayman mohyeldin. >> and i'm katy tur. we have seen results slowly trickle in from across the country tonight. let us take a look at the map as it stands now. there are six states that have yet to be called, and here's where those races stand.