tv Deadline White House MSNBC November 11, 2020 1:00pm-3:00pm PST
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i'm ari melber in for nicolle wallace who has the day off after a marathon of election week anchoring. now here's the reality. joe biden is the winner of this election, and donald trump is the loser. that has been true since saturday, but the reality is only sinking in now for many of the president's inner circle. morale clearly impacted by trump failing to speak or join the battle in public at all. he's been holed up on twitter mostly. nbc news reporting on signs of more concrete growing frustration, even among trump's top aides. one top official says his refusal to concede is unsustainable, and the tweets about fraud are, quote, total theatrics.
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joe biden's margin of victory is not close enough to be in doubt. and those allegations of fraud have not been borne out. election officials in every state across both parties say there was simply no evidence that fraud or irregularities hindered the race and outcomes. here's the other problem. with trying to base a legal or even grievance strategy on the suggestion of an inner state set of election crimes. that is a big charge that will get investigated or reported out. so the few republican claims about alleged voter crimes are actually hitting the brick wall of evidence this week. "washington post" now reporting one postal worker who was quoted by republicans about alleged voter irregularities now admits he made it up. according to three officials with knowledge of an internal investigation into that game. because here's the thing. and i'm just going to lay it out plainly. if there is voter fraud, investigators, state and federal officials, they want to find that out. journalists want to report on it. these things get looked at pretty closely by independent
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parties. you can almost think of this as the opposite of the infamous republican version of the clinton email story where the plot turned on missing evidence, which allowed some partisans to believe whatever they wanted about emails they said would never be found. but here even the partisans need some evidence to make a far-fetched theory stick. maybe that's why even donald trump has gone quiet, largely avoiding the cameras. this is the fifth straight day without a single public appearance or even so much as a phone interview with his one-time favorite fox news. the longest stretch of his presidency, essentially out of public view. now, trump's streak of staying completely indoors did break today. what you see here is a ceremony honoring veterans add arlington national cemetery. the president did not speak there nor take questions. so there is a certain symmetrical irony in how it's all ending. donald trump closed his campaign homestretch with a string that we saw of tough talking rallies,
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while claiming his opponent was holed up in a bunker. we all remember that. and yet here we are, and now it is the vanquished president, the loser of the election, who is holed up in the literal bunker of the white house and the figurative bunker mentality of denial, man who knows he lost, surrounded by people who know he lost. in a world that is moving on from him because he lost. a reality apparently so painful he does not even try to blunt it with the once soothing balm of a fox news interview. to take a riff on a familiar phrase, a defeated man once said nothing at all. we turn now to our experts and we have some great ones to kick off this hour of conversation. "washington post" white house reporter ashley parker, former white house press secretary under president obama, robert gibbs, and new york university law professor melissa murray, all contributors, all have been through this wild ride of this
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election. robert gibbs, i turn to you first with that very simple thought. a defeated man once said nothing. >> well, i do think ari, your point is strong in that if donald trump felt like he was on the verge of winning this, if he felt like he was on the verge of this being flipped to his side, i can't imagine that you wouldn't see him in public a lot. i can't imagine that you wouldn't see him commanding big crowds. we heard all this discussion about rallies continuing. it's pretty clear that his heart isn't in it based on the news. so i think it is a pretty big tell as to where we are in this race. i think probably more the tell is that the legal avenues are dwindling. states are certifying their elections, and in just a matter of days, we'll have the final, final answer in this race. >> right. and we have the answer. we just have the denial around
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that final answer, and professor murray, i have a very goofy poll here on deadline, our journalist producers pulled this up. it's a real thing, but i have to note it's goofy that we're polling this as a nation. this is from reuters. and the question is about who won the election. which is a thing we all know. 79% of people will say biden won. 13% are clinging to this idea that it's not yet decided, which has an element of technical -- there's a technical aspect to that in the certification process, if you want to be very charitable, but the problem for donald trump is down in the right-hand corner there. when you get to the theory that they have that he's in denial about, he won't concede on the idea that maybe somehow he think he's won, nobody, i mean this is a rounding error, professor murray, even in a republican, qanon, twitter driven world,
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nobody is actually saying he won, professor, which i admit is a goofy thing to even bring up. >> yeah, i mean, the truth is incontrovertible. this was an election joe biden won by wide margins, even in those battleground states that are still being contested. as robert says, the president has run out of legal avenues, and this is a lot of political theater that is really, i think, about engaging and enraging the base. so that he can perhaps direct that energy toward the georgia runoffs where control of the senate hangs in the balance, or more importantly, use it for his post-presidential career, which some speculate will be about launching his own tv program or network where he'll be able to talk about all of these theories in much greater detail. so this to me is about what comes later, but the difficulties that our entire democracy and its legitimacy hangs in the balance as well. >> all very well put. ashley, i want to ask you about what his aides are saying based
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on your reporting, and i admit this is a bit of a difficult question. we have it up on the screen. it says trump may accept results. but never concede he lost. say trump aides. can you help me with this cheshire cat level riddle. i believe if you accept the results you lost, that is the concession. you either accept that or somehow you don't. legally, it doesn't matter, but can you unpack that for us from your reporting? >> sure, what aides are referring to there is this idea that people are rightfully worried there may not be a peaceful transition of power. and what they're saying is they believe at the end of the day, the president understands that in his heart of hearts that he's lost the election and that come inauguration day, he will vacate the white house and hand it over to president-elect joe biden. what they also believe is that he will never admit that he lost. he will go kicking and screaming and saying, you know, i'm leaving but only because the
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election was stolen from me. you know, if this were fairly counted, i would be the winner. this isn't fair. everyone is out to get me. i'm the victim, but i am still leaving. and i want to pause here to say what you have said before, which is important to stress, which is this -- he lost. he lost fair and square. he lost the popular vote. and he more importantly lost the electoral college vote which is how our country decides who the president of the united states is. but that is specifically what aides are referring to and that riddle wrapped in a puzzle wrapped in an enigma. >> i believe you're quoting kissinger if i'm not mistaken. about china. but it is an enigma inside a riddle. it's good thing we have professor murray. to the extent it's designed to sow confusion, there's a legal answer. what ashley says is telling. they're trying to make it sound, professor, like that's some gift that donald trump would give to the country, that he will leave
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peacefully. that would only be legally a gift he gives himself. because the constitution has one president at a time, and the moment that he ceases to be president, anything else he does as an ex-president would theoretically, i'm not saying it's going to happen, but would theoretically only involve hiown legal situation, whether you call that trespassing or something more. that's how it works, right, professor? that's not a gift when he becomes ex-president under the constitution's timeline, he's the ex'president. >> as you say, he naz no gifts to give. according to the constitution on january 20th, he will no longer be the president and joe biden will be the president, and donald trump will be, again, a private citizen. so this isn't a gift he's giving the country, but what he is doing right now is stoking these doubts, discrediting democracy, discrediting the ballot counts in all of these battleground states and basically undermining a system that has worked well for over 200 years.
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>> robert? >> i don't doubt that the damage is going to be significant and may well be lasting. i do think it is -- i do think the rhetoric, at least on not every side, but on a bunch of sides has been a little bit lower in the sense that there's the creation of space for donald trump to come to understand the legal, political, electoral bind and finality he's in, again, i think we're a matter of days to the certification of these states that basically close down all of the avenues that he has. and while he may never concede, he may never fully in his mind accept it, the constitution doesn't afford for somebody's opinion about whether you accept the election. there's math involved. >> there is math, so robert, what do you think of the flipside of this, the way that joe biden has dealt with it, rather calmly, not dancing, you
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know, in any way, but noting that as he put it yesterday, he seems it as embarrassing. as a communications expert, do you think they're walking the line right, and if this emotional denial continues is there a time at which the president-elect in this unusual situation, as they see this as it was put here, comedy of errors, does he need to step up further to make sure everyone understands exactly how strong he's going to be, that there is no ambiguity? >> i think smartly right now, the biden campaign again is giving that space. i actually think there are a number of republicans that are doing this as well. i don't think -- we know a lot of smart republicans. we see them on tv a lot. i don't think many of them or any of them really believe donald trump has either won or will conceivably win this election. i think it may come a time, as biden answers more questions that he has to continue to remind people that his lead is
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strong, it is stable, and in many places like pennsylvania, even today, it grows. but i think they're smart to keep the temperature as low as they can and we'll get through this blight on our democracy and those brighter days will come. >> ashley, is it weird that the whole political class and a chunk of the nation has to continue to work out all of this as if donald trump is not an adult president but some sort of unpredictable rambunctious child who cannot absorb that which is occurring in life? >> there's a whole cottage industry of republicans and white house officials scrambling around to coddle the dilutions of a president who doesn't want to accept that he lost the presidency, and it is worth noting that there is some danger there. in some ways it makes sense to do what robert is saying that people are doing, which is give him some sort of space to come to terms with this, but while everyone is giving him some
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space, that means you have republicans, members of republican leadership, who should know better and in fact privately do know better not recognizing joe biden as the president-elect. so that sows distrust in the election. it sows distrust and undermining our democratic institutions, and because it effectively freezes the transition, it potentially places a grave national security risk. the reason you have such a robust transition was in the wake of 9/11. because there was a sense that george w. bush did not have ample time to get his team up and running. and we know now whatever risk may face us in the future that we can't predict, there is one very real risk, and that is the devastating coronavirus pandemic that donald trump is presiding over now. joe biden will inherit, and there really should be some high functioning, real transition that works between the two men. and we're not seeing that now. >> yeah, and robert, is there a point at which the biden folks
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put a little more heat on the rest of congress to say, yeah, okay, you have to give him a few days. that's one thing, but the future president has a lot more impact on your life and any bill you ever want to go anywhere than the soon to be ex-president? >> absolutely. and i agree with everything that ashley just said. i think it is imperative as we see coronavirus cases, you kno , spiking to levels we have not seen in this entire pandemic, the national security implications of a president-elect not receiving the presidential daily intelligence briefing, i think there is a moment rather soon where these implications are going to become more than just twitter fodder. they're going to become real and legitimate for the future governing aspects of our country. again, i'm hopeful that the space that's being given is being given only in the extreme short term, and i believe you're already beginning to see some
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republicans say, yep, it is time for him to have the pdb. yes, it is time for the president to go. you have seen that from a couple of the secretaries of state. you have seen senator toomey just in the last few minutes say, no, pennsylvania isn't going to reconsider how it chooses electors. again, i think rhetorically, the options for donald trump, both rhetorically, legally, and politically, they're closing rather quickly. >> yeah. robert gibbs, ashley parker, and melissa murray, my thanks to each of you. >> when we come back, there's the shakeups at the pent gone. concerns about allegedly unqualified loyalists into key positions head nothiing into inauguration. a look at president trump's attempt to impact all of that, and republicans are not acting like they have evidence, so what is the real plan? a former insider on the republican party is here. and governors pleading with people, stay home if you can, keep a distance. the virus is spiking.
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we're going to go out live on an important story for everyone in america and look at one of these testing centers in the midwest. all this and more when deadline white house returns after this. i guess i look pretty... ridiculous. [ chuckles ] no one looks ridiculous, bob. progressive is always here for you with round-the-clock service. just so you know, next time, you can submit a claim with our mobile app. good. thanks again for -- for rushing over. are you kidding? this is what 24/7 protection looks like. okay. -you smell like fish. -sorry. i was talking to jamie.
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sure, so there's basically three reasons why you get rid of senior officials at the defense department. one is gross incompetence. you know, negligence. they have really, really fallen down on the job in some demonstrable way, which i don't know we have seen here. second is just punitive, right? the president was mad at secretary esper. he was mad at these other officials, and even though he's maybe on his way out, he just wants to stick it to them as a demonstration of what happens when you cross him. the third reason is you want
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people who will say yes to things that others would say no to, and that's the most concerning one. that's the one we all need to be thinking about. >> a member of congress echoing what people both inside and outside the pentagon say are some alarming and sudden changes at the upper echelons of the defense department. including firing defense secretary esper, trump has also put top loyalists in there regarding policy and intelligence. a former aide to mike flynn, another former aide to congressman devin nunes, tied to efforts to discredit the russia investigation. plus a retired general who has expressed what many describe as islamophobic views and even called president obama a, quote, terrorist leader. earlier today, the pentagon confirming trump's acting defense chief, christopher miller, will bring on a senior adviser know as a fox news regular with a history of controversial remarks and approaches to muslims, islam, and undocumented immigrants in the united states. we turn now to retired four-star
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u.s. army general barry mccaffrey, an msnbc analyst, a former member of the national security council, and on this veterans day, general mccaffrey, we fittingly begin with thanking you and all enlisted military members and veterans for your service. thank you, sir. >> yeah. exactly, you know, there's 18 million veterans out there. to include 300,000 from world war ii, and we're proud of what we do for the country. >> amen to that. and so it's a fitting day, and we showed a little bit of the president emerging to do the remembrance -- excuse me, the memorial there, and this is the footage of that. general, i would say obviously if it were calmer times we would have a longer discussion of that. but i begin on the news with you of your reaction to the replacement of the pentagon chief and whether you see anything here related to the election that could be concerning or improper?
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>> well, look, ari, i have been shot at a lot and nearly killed a bunch of times. i'm not an alarmist. i stay cool under pressure. mark me down as alarmed. i just listened to senator tim kaine, wonderful, experienced, mature guy, say this is just payback to esper not being a loyalist. i don't believe it. we're watching a setup of some people who are unqualified for office to be in control of the 2.1 million men and women of the armed forces. and i remind our viewers, the only one who can give orders to the armed forces is the president and the secretary of defense. this acting secretary chris miller is a perfectly good, experienced combat soldier. he is unqualified for this office. the other three, one of them, a retired one-star, is a dangerous
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man. that team moving in, no one in his right mind would have accepted an appointment for 90 days. these people are in there to control a coercive institution of u.s. democracy. watch out. >> what specifically are you warning against, general? do you feel based on your knowledge of these individuals and the situation that you have a credible reason or evidence to think that there could be an effort to enlist the military in something unlawful? >> first of all i think there is zero possibility of a uniform leadership of the armed forces. starting with it chairman general mark milley doing anything unconstitutional. it's not going to happen. so they're actually taking over the wrong agency. the federal government tools could be used in an oppressive manner, start with the attorney general of the united states, the department of homeland security, and federal law enforcement agencies, who unless
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they get an order that is patently illegal will carry out their instructions. so the end of the story is, you know, i don't believe in any way this should be minimized or this is just a tantrum of a president trying to accommodate himself to the outcome of the elections. this is some crazy thinking going on inside that white house. the congressional republicans have a huge responsibility now to speak out or privately go to the white house and tell them this isn't going to work. by the way, it isn't going to work. at the end of the day, 20 january, the election will be sustained and mr. biden and vice president harris will be in office. but we are in a risky situation right now. >> i appreciate the nuance you're drawing both in what the limits are but why you, given the great experience you have, do take this as more than just some petty squabble with one more cabinet officer.
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on the foreign policy side, we also wanted to get your insights. there's this report, quote, divisive pentagon hire may rush troop withdrawals before trump's exit. that's lawful policy. but concerns mcgregor says the u.s. needs to pull troops out of syria immediately, claiming america has no interest there, criticizing germany to be too welcoming to muslim invaders, that's a quote. advocating for martial law at the u.s./mexico border according to some interpretations and using deadly force as a detea e deterrence to immigration. are thee things the pentagon can be involved in and implementing syrian policy without the president's sign-on? how much do we understand the policy process here? >> well, you raise a good point. with only 90 days to go, by the way, it's very hard for these guys to carry out any substantial changes in the department of defense. but they may well try.
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there may be contracting irregularities. there may be federalizing national guard troops in sort of a measure of intimidation. mcgregor, i know quite well. he's a defense intellectual. a bright guy with some really extreme thoughts. i mean, the whole notion of martial law at the border, for god's sakes, what is that all about? this is a federal law enforcement responsibility. an immigration problem. it's not a criminal problem, by and large. so again, i go back to the thought that, you know, if i was a cia officer trying to understand what was going on in a third world country, and i saw this pattern of behavior, i would say that strongman is trying to take over the government and defy an election. and i think they're playing with that idea inside the white house. i can't imagine that senator rob
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portman and even mcconnell and people like this are going to disregard the constitution, but i think that's the thinking that's going on in the white house right now. and we ought to be worried about it. and the republicans in congress ought to speak up and push back. >> real clarity and a really important time. general barry mccaffrey, thank you for your insights, and again, sir, thank you for your service today. >> pleased to be with you. >> thank you, general. >> the republican party on the hunt for proof of voter fraud, but none has existed. officials in both parties, in every state, explaining why. we'll have more details when "deadline white house" continues. i've been involved in communications in the media for 45 years. i've been taking prevagen on a regular basis for at least eight years. for me, the greatest benefit over the years has been that prevagen seems to help me recall things
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biden win the election? >> we don't know yet, do we? >> we don't? >> it hasn't been certified. >> senator, have you c congratulated joe biden yet? >> no. >> why not? >> have you spoken to vice president biden yet? >> i have not. >> do you believe he won the election? >> president wasn't defeated by huge numbers. in fact, he may not have been defeated at all. >> fact check. false. you know what it is. president trump is the loser of the election. joe biden is the winner. the margins have been decisive,
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both in the states that matter and definitely in the total national vote. the margins will not be in question, according to any pending case in the nation. let me just repeat that, filling in for nicolle, but i'm also our chief legal correspondent. if there were a case that might change the outcome, i would report that to you. that would be interesting. there is not a single pending case in the nation that would change the outcome of this election, and yet, as you just saw, so many republicans are basically choosing to join donald trump in his denial strategy, even as this push to find evidence of voter fraud has become more and more absurd and baroque as the days go on. pennsylvania postal worker that we mentioned here in our coverage recanting one of the only public claims there was about ballot tampering. now, the number two official in texas, a republican, is claiming to offer, get this, up to a million dollars for proof of voter fraud. which shows the lengths needed apparently to incentivize or find claims of this occurring in that state.
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also given biden's margins in all of these key states at a million dollars per vote, it would literally cost billions for this to work nationally. turn to "washington post" national political reporter robert costa, also an analyst for us, and elizabeth neumann, form former adviser to the republican alliance for integrity and reform. what do you say to all this? >> it's shameful. i'm so disheartened. i'm so disappointed. i apparently naively again thought that we would get to the other side of the election and the republican party would start to step away from trump. and recognize that there is still a number of people that voted for him that are hard core supporters, but there are a whole host of people who voted for him only because they couldn't bring themselves to vote for a democrat, and i would beg them for two reasons, one, realize that all of the loud
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trumpian supporters do not necessarily reflect the entirety of the republican party. so they need to consider that their actions are causing most republicans to be very disappointed in them. but more importantly, we were supposed to be the party that stood for principles, the party that stood for national security, and the things that they're doing now are sowing discord, sowing division. they're doing russia and iran's work for them. we're going to have half of our country believing that biden won illegitimately, that this election was stolen from donald trump. and they could help change that narrative. they can help not all of the hard core supporters but a sizable portion would listen to republican leaders actually saying the truth, which is donald trump has lost, and it is time for a transition to begin. but instead, they're still kowtowing to him.
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i just don't understand it. i am so disappointed in the leaders in the republican party. >> appreciate your forthright reaction there. robert costa, you followed this in and out. you have followed times where donald trump has what many see as unreasonable demands or demands that people lie on his behalf. what is your view, though, of how this works when the declining power of the president is so clear going towards january? do you see this as a moment in time or a foreshadowing of where the republican congress will stay? >> the republican congress in particular the senate, is focused right now on the two runoff races in georgia on january 5th. the majority on the line. and part of the focus on those races is about keeping voters, white voters in atlanta suburbs, trump supporters in the atlanta suburbs, energized and really focused on those races.
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i am seeing, ari, a thaw in the republican position, and in brief, i spoke to senator pat toomey of pennsylvania earlier today. and he said he expects president-elect biden to be the president-elect, and that sounds like a simple acknowledgment, but as you saw from the video you played, articulating anything close to that so far has been something republicans have been reluctant to do, but to hear toomey say it, again, this afternoon was interesting, and it shows that there's an acknowledgment, privately for sure, and increasingly publicly, however restrained, about the reality. >> i hear you. reality is hard to avoid or run from for too long. and in that vein, i want to read new reporting we're getting in, looking at the notes that our own peter alexander reporting out that there was a new meeting with the president, jared kushner, and jason miller. i'm curious from your reporting,
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robert, what happens in these kind of meetings? if you're the campaign manager and you want to make the candidate feel as good as possible even after the election, is stepien someone who would say, look, mr. president, we could be loyal to you in any number of ways, but as your campaign manager, here's why you lost and that's not changing? or do they not go that far in your experience? >> what i'm hearing is that stepien, kushner, jason miller, are acknowledging to republicans behind the scenes that president trump is determined not to concede. he's also determined not to even move close to concession until the vote is formally certified by the electoral college and the united states congress. and because of that, his political advisers, instead of trying to pull him away from the position, are catering to the position. so i have not had a total readout from my sources on this particular meeting you have mentioned by peter alexander's reporting, but i know recent meetings have been about
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thinking through rallies, how do they help president trump get out there, sustain his political base, even if they know the mathmatics and the data is hard against president trump in all of these different states and recounts. they believe keeping his base alive is critical, as he looks ahead to his own brand, sustaining, trying to sustain that in 2021. and to 2024, potentially. >> elizabeth, i mean, this is obviously a newfangled attempt to elevate the arcane state certification process as some sort of inflection point. i don't think you need to be as into politics as some of us are following it every day. i think any citizen alive in the country remembers election night, media projections or sometimes a few days later projections and speeches by candidates. i don't think anyone has any confusion about the notion that suddenly the goalpost move to what looks like a technical off-ramp for what acosta was
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referring to as this thaw. >> i am so concerned about the transition period, so there's part of me that's like, the president wants to continue refusing to concede, i am actually okay with that, as long as the transition access, the access to classified information, the meetings with the agencies, and all of the transition materials get turned over to the biden team. the process of transitioning a government is extremely complex. even though the biden administration likely has people coming in that served during obama, it's been four years. a lot happens in four years. programs change, laws change, threats change. they need time and space to get things up to speed. they need to be able to identify what their top priorities are and therefore what the best people are to address those priorities and get them prepared for nomination. and staff these agencies. it is a long process. it needs to be able to start as
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soon as possible for the safety and security of our country. >> yeah. i appreciate your candor and your thoughts as well as the context you bring from your history where the republican party. elizabeth neumann, robert costa on the beat reporting. and by the way, robert, it was pointed out to me from some of your twitter viewer plans that that beautiful "washington post" plush pillow behind you is always there. i thought you busted it out here for the homestretch, but apparently you always have it there. is that right? >> yeah, and just to clarify, i get emails about this from time to time. i don't know where to buy it. it was given to me by a friend at the post. so i'm a limited guy. i can report, but in terms of home decoration, the questions aren't best for me. >> well, i appreciate you taking such an objective approach to that issue as well as any other. how often now i have to ask, how often do you find yourself actually fluffing it? >> i would just leave it there. it just sits. >> i will tell you also, we had
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an interesting life with everything going to zoom. it's not just you. viewers have pointed out steve schmidt appears to do a karate chop. i'm being told to wrap it up as is often the case around here. just kidding. thanks to both of you. we have to fit in a break. when we come back, we have an update on something very important around the nation. the biden administration getting ready to deal with this, the transition, the covid cases surging. we're going to take a look at the strain it does put on hospitals and health care workers from a very hard hit area in wisconsin when we come back.
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overnight, the united states set new coronavirus records yet again, proving that the united states is moving in this troubling direction. you see it here. in fact, yesterday, more than 135,000 new documented cases. a record number of americans, this is one way to obviously think about it that hits home, a record number currently hospitalized. topping 61,000. according to the covid tracking project. now, fatalities, which have lagged after cases go up, are also rising more than 1400 americans died yesterday. nearly 8,000 have died in the last week alone. so far, we have lost over 242,000 americans. more than 10.4 million americans have contracted this virus. the situation escalating, especially in the midwest. in one day yesterday, wisconsin set a record number for the number of cases, deaths, and
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hospitalizations. the governor say, quote, it's not safe to go out. issuing a new executive order urging people to stay home if they can. we turn to msnbc's cal perry who is live at a testing center in milwaukee, wisconsin. cal. >> reporter: hey, ari. this is miller park where we normally see the brewers playing. now one of the largest testing sites in the state. i have watched cars come for two days. it's unbelievable, almost crushing emotionally when you think about the positivity rate in wisconsin is 30%. 1 in 3 people who come for tests are now popping positive tests. it has the health care system, as you have alluded to, overwhelmed. 85% capacity at hospitals around the state. there are less than 130 icu beds available in the state of wisconsin. and it's only the fourth worst per capita in the country. the other three states are all in the midwest. they can't evacuate any patients to nearby states because those hospitals are full as well. we have been talking to health officials here throughout the
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week. they say one of the important things people should know is when exactly to get tested. take a listen. >> really exceptionally important for people to understand, ideal timing of testing after a close contact, so if you came into contact with somebody who is known to have covid-19, 3 to 5 days should be your window of timing for testing. one of our biggest concerns is people are showing up the day after or two days after contact with someone, it's too early to test, so you may get a false negative. and the implications of that are even more significant where you have false sense of security if you're asymptomatic or you were negative when you in fact could be positive and you could contribute to community spread. rt with community rates so high, officials are pleading, no, they're actually begging, ari, we heard this from the governor last night, for people to stay home on thanksgiving, to do it virtually with their extended family. they think the spread is simply out of control, ari.
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>> msnbc's cal perry on the ground, keeping us abreast of all of this. thank you, stay safe, sir. >> we're going to stay on this. cal laid out the virus is worsening, we'll discuss exactly how you can stay safe, what to know, what to do amidst the good news down the road, the hope for a vaccine. "deadline white house" right after this. ♪ [ engines revving ] ♪ it's amazing to see them in the wild like th-- shhh. [ engine revs ] for those who were born to ride, there's progressive. [ engine revs ] let's get checked for those around us. let's get checked for a full range of conditions.
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increasing amount of patients. and we know that even if transmission stopped today, our hospitalizations would continue to rise for weeks. our caregivers are strong. they're incredible people. but they're tired. they're fatigued. and they're often frustrated and angry when they go out in their communities and see people not heeding the advice of public health experts, because we know that's going to lead to transmission. that's going to lead to more patients in the hospital and more unnecessary deaths. >> that's the reality. we need to process it. we need to work with it and deal with it. that's what's happening inside hospitals around this nation, the virus spreading at record rates, hospitalizations at record rates, all but four states now seeing a case trend increase of over 10% in these last two weeks. that's why the map you're looking at is bright red. governor andrew cuomo in new york putting out new restrictions, trying to manage the rising cases in hot spots around that whole state, including ordering bars, restaurants, bowling allies and gyms to close indoor areas at 10:00 p.m. and limit all indoor
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private gatherings to ten people or less. as promised, we turn to msnbc news and analyst dr. irwin redletter. the director for the national center for disease preparedness. the fatigue is everywhere. i think the first responders, we all understand, are entitled to more of it and tremendous respect for them on a day we honor veterans, we honor public service. but the public has become fatigued, and that's why some folks are out there, you know, trying to just get back to a full normal life. what do you say to people who are feeling this fatigue, look at the red map and say, well, maybe it's all hopeless anyway. >> yeah, so here's the situation. we're all fatigued. i'm fatigued. my family's fatigued. and this is a battle between pandemic fatigue and pandemic fatalities. actually, this is literally what it comes down to, and i think all of us need to be just disciplined. this is going to be a hell of a terrible end of fall and into the winter in terms of increase
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in cases. we had over 130,000 cases yesterday as you reported. we're going to undoubtedly be at at least 200,000 cases a day, sometime in the next few weeks, and increasing number of hospitalizations too. so, the stress on the system is incredible, and we have to worry about what's going to happen in the aftermath of thanksgiving and the end of year winter holidays and christmas and so on and we have a lot of college students coming home, and this has been a problem on college campuses, so a lot to think about and a lot to plan for, ari, but i think we're up to it. we just have to be disciplined and stay the course. >> as people try to get their mind around where we're headed, you know, one of your colleagues, dr. osterholm says, the next three to four weeks will be the darkest of the pandemic. would you go that far? is it useful if true for people to know it's getting worse? >> well, you can characterize it
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different ways. but you know, the problem is that there's no sign of let-up right now. we do not have a functional vaccine that's distributable to everybody in the country. we don't have a medication to specifically treat it in outpatient, so we have to brace ourselves for a very troubling time coming up with this. that doesn't mean we are defenseless. and i think one of the things we're going to see come january when the biden team takes over is a lot more focus on the things that we can do that are not politically symbolic, they're simply what public health experts are telling us about, wearing masks, keeping our distances, and from time to time, having to shut certain kinds of gatherings and restaurants and so on. but we have to -- we're going to have to just roll with it. i just don't know what else to do. and i'll tell you, i have these discussions with my family almost daily and friends and colleagues. we're all in this together. that's a very literal statement, not just a cliche. and we just are going to have to hang in there, but i think we'll
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get through this eventually. but there will be more pain involved. >> copy. we have about 45 seconds until i toss it to joy reid during the second hour of this program. when we hear the covid vaccine is 90% effective, what does that mean when we see it in the next year? >> well, 90% effective is really good. some of the vaccines that we use are far less effective. that means that if you get the vaccine, and if it's -- if it holds up, that it's 90%-plus effective, that means you have a very good chance of being protected. what we don't know, though, is how long will that protection last and secondly, with the two most prominent candidates for new vaccine, which is the pfizer product and moderna, those are both special technique which we haven't used before called mrna. that's not important ordinary reason secondly, require extreme cold temperatures to keep the vaccine from falling apart and being
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dysfunctional. so there's a lot of logistics challenges and at lot more time we're going to have to wait to make sure it's safe and effective to give to people in a complex distribution system over the next number of months. >> dr. redlener, tough times but we feel more informed having listened to you. thank you, sir. >> thank you, ari. >> appreciate it. we have a break now. i will see you back in this chair in exactly one hour. i hope you join me for "the beat" at 6:00 p.m. eastern but also the next hour of "deadline white house" will be anchored by our friend and colleague joy reid after this break. our friend and colleague joy reid after this break. 3 out of 4 people achieved 90% clearer skin at 4 months after just 2 doses. skyrizi may increase your risk of infections and lower your ability to fight them. before treatment your doctor should check you for infections and tuberculosis. tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms such as fevers, sweats, chills, muscle aches or coughs, or if you plan to or recently received a vaccine. ♪ nothing is everything ask your dermatologist about skyrizi.
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major catastrophe in his first day of office. >> hello, everyone, it is 5:00 in new york. i'm joy reid in for nicole wallace. a signature of donald trump's time in office has been the sledgehammer that he has taken to nearly every single norm and tradition of the presidency. so, why would his departure from office be any different. "the new york times" is reporting today on donald trump's attempt -- his latest weapon in his ongoing don quixote-like quest to overturn the results of the election, namely, the united states governor. the "times" writes that trump, facing the prospect of leaving the white house in defeat in just 70 days, is harnessing the power of the federal government to resist the results of an election that he lost, something that no sitting president has done in american history. here's what we're seeing so far. trump's attorney general has authorized investigations into voter fraud claims. his white house has told agencies to move ahead with a budget for next year as if he will still be in office. and his latest eyebrow-raising
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move, cleaning -- clearinghouse to make a place for loyalists in the defense -- in defense positions. on that, the "times" adds, the president has also embarked on a shake-up of his administration, firing defense secretary mark esper as well as the heads of three other agencies while installing loyalists in key positions at the national security agency and the pentagon. allies expect more to come, including the possible dismissals of the directors of the fbi and the cia. when it comes to actually assisting the incoming administration with its transition, trump has refused to let biden's team access resources, including valuable national security information, an act which former chiefs of staff under both republican and democratic presidents say could have serious costs. andy card, who worked for george w. bush and john podesta, who worked for bill clinton write in "the washington post," when the
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9/11 commission finished its report, it found that the delayed transition hampered the new administration in identifying, recruiting, clearing, and obtaining senate confirmation of key appointees in the national security arena. the commission also concluded that avoiding future disruptions in transitions was deeply in the national interest. with the covid-19 pandemic continuing to wreak havoc, the costs of a delay are much higher today than almost any time in u.s. history. specifically, a delayed transition and the absence of cooperation between the outgoing and incoming administrations could hinder economic recovery, slow the distribution of a vaccine, and, god forbid, put american lives at risk. now, we know from history, including a foiled terrorist attack on the day of president barack obama's inauguration, that our adversaries seek to take advantage of the united states during transitions. we cannot let that happen today. so, today, on veterans day, as
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we reflect on the principles that make america america, they are exactly what's at stake when trump denies the president-elect his proper recognition. congressman adam schiff tweeted earlier, "imagine if this happened in another country, a leader refusing to concede, alleging fraud without evidence, resisting a peaceful transition of power. we would condemn it. it's no different here. trump lost. biden won. america cherishes her democracy. it's time we show it." and that's where we start this hour with our friends, jason johnson, politics and journalism professor at morgan state university, and contributor to the grio, and with us, lily adams, senior spokesperson and advisor to the dnc war room and former communications director for senator kamala harris. and former senator claire mccaskill. thank you all for being here, and claire i'm going to go to you first on this. because you know, it is prumd that when people people run for public office, that they have a
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great respect for and adherence to core american principles and that they want to serve because they want to advance those principles and do good things. what we've seen so far from republicans is a pretense that they don't understand how dangerous it is for joe biden to be delayed in being able to look at the books, to look at what's under the hood, to get in and begin to do the work of doing his transition. he's being very calm and cool about it, but there is a real issue here, and what we're seeing is republican senators, members of the house, denying it. what do you make of it as you're watching that happen with your former colleagues? >> well, i think they all have this mistaken notion that somehow this isn't damaging, that they're humoring the president. it's almost like they're grief counselors. well, if we play along for a few days until it becomes painfully obvious to him that he's lost, then everything will be okay. but joy, in the meantime, he's doing real damage not only to
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people's full faith in our elections but also to government. i mean, think about this for a minute. i just want to put this out there. he installed, in the last two days, a man in charge of policy at the pentagon which has oversight over 2.1 million people that serve our country in uniform, and this man he put in there said the following in a tweet to john brennan in 2018. listen to this, what he said. "pick your poison. firing squad, public hanging, life sentence as a prison b or suck on your pistol." that's what this man tweeted to a former official, respected official, in numerous administrations just two years ago. and they now have him in charge of policy at the pentagon and the republicans on the armed services committee in the senate are quiet.
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it's crickets. >> and you're referring to general -- >> that's what's so scary. general tada. i am. and he was not confirmed because at that point in time, the republicans in the senate knew he was a nutball, and they wouldn't go near him. so now he's put him in there and nobody says a word. it's unbelievable. >> well, and you know, lily, that's, i guess, the challenge here. there's two questions. one, the question is, what is donald trump up to? at this 11th hour of his presidency, to put in people like that, you know, to have government employees waste their time creating a budget for a second trump administration, knowing there won't be one, having them spend time actually putting together a budget, this is -- that's a lot of work. and so having people doing those things when he knows the outcome, there's even, you know, reporting now that says, oh, he's going to eventually say, okay, fine, the election's over, we're not going to fight it anymore, we know there was lots of fraud but we're just going to stop contesting it but that he
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may never, ever, ever admit that he lost the election, but the time-wasting and then putting in these dramatically, extravagantly unqualified people, it's hard to understand what he's up to. but i want you to talk a little bit about what the biden team -- what is their mindset going into that kind of a mess? >> well, look, joy, i think you're right, you know, we don't know what the president's going to do, and frankly, he's being treated like a toddler because he's acting like a toddler, but this is the truth, which is that on january 20th, vice president-elect kamala harris and president-elect joe biden are going to get inaugurated. they are going to take power. we are going to transition and we're going to get to work on behalf of working people in this country and take, you know, obviously, take on the enormous challenges that donald trump has made worse with his four years in office. but i think that what you saw from president-elect biden was a real steel and resolve and calm and leadership and commitment to just keep moving, keep moving.
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>> you know, and jason, among the many real concrete, actual things that are going to be harmed by this is the ongoing pandemic response, which donald trump gave up on the pandemic a long time ago. he's trying to do herd immunity. but you know, if -- he said there was going to be a vaccine but what if there is? you can't distribute it. a covid vaccine, that's one of the pieces of news that's floating, nbc news reporting it would be delayed, even if there was a covid vaccine ready, this mess is going to prohibit it from being distributed. so they're actually, potentially, putting people's lives at risk. >> yeah, joy, and here's the thing. it's more than trump's ego. it's more than his petulance. it's the number of papers and documents that we know he's not reading that may end up in the circular file that joe biden could actually be using to get his job done right now. but it goes even deeper than this, and this is why it's important for this transition to go through quickly. there has been so much incompetence on the part of the trump administration. for years, remember, we went
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almost a year and a half without a secretary of the navy. there are so many government agencies that were not staffed or were understaffed throughout this trump administration that biden needs this information so he can actually make changes. and here's the thing, joy. even once he gets in, let's say we have a covid vaccine that can be tested, he's still got to deal with dejoy at the post office. he's got to deal with that whole committee that's filled with republicans. joe biden needs as much of a head start as possible to reorient this government, which has been turned into a shambles under trump, and the longer we have to wait because of this nonsensuous t nonsenno nonsense, the more people could die and the more difficulty we'll have in facing any impending crisis that could hit at any moment. >> indeed. it's veterans day today. it's a day that we celebrate those who have put their lives on the line for american principles but i want to let you listen to mike pompeo. this is mike pompeo. this is a pretty -- some people heard this sound yesterday but i want to play it again. this is mike pompeo, the guy who is supposed to be in charge of
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telling foreign governments the ways in which the united states supports democracy and maybe challenge foreign governments who are not respecting democratic principles. here's mike pompeo talking about a smooth transition. >> there will be a smooth transition to a second trump administration. we're ready. the world is watching what's taking place here. we're going to count all the votes. >> you were asked today about the concerns about a smooth transition and you said it will be a smooth transition to a second trump administration. were you being serious there? >> we'll have a smooth transition, and we'll see what the people ultimately decide when all the votes have been cast. we have a process, the constitution lays out how electors vote, it's a very detailed process laid out. we need to comply with all of that. >> claire, this is a guy -- i believe he went to west point. he knows how politics work. he theoretically wants to run for president. what is he doing? how do our allies look at us as something other than banana republic with that kind of
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behavior? >> yeah, the world has weighed in, joy, and pompeo knows it. all of our allies have congratulated president-elect biden and vice president-lengel harris. everybody knows what this is. they all know that this is trump being just bizarre and behaving like he is in some place other than one of the most vaulted -- vaunted democracies in the world. and pompeo knows it. he's just trying to hold on to the trump base so he can run for president. that's what all these guys are doing. it's really disgusting. they're all thinking about their political future rather than what this does to our image on the world stage. particularly bad for a secretary of state. >> lily, i do wonder, to come back to what the biden-harris -- i don't know how much you've talked to folks about what they expect to find, but you know, one would presume that there's been tremendous incompetence, at
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best, in the most, you know, sort of charitable reading of it or something worse when they get there. how much of a mess does the biden administration -- would you expect they're going to find when they finally get a chance to look at the books? >> well, look, i think they're going to face enormous crises and enormous problems within government, but this is why i was so heartened to see president-elect biden put out a list of covid advisors who are going to be his task force, who are already getting to work, and you know who they were, joy? they were scientists. they were doctors. they were infectious disease experts. and that was, frankly, so heartening to those of us who have been appalled, as this president has seen 250,000 lives lost to this virus, 10 million cases. so i think they're not even waiting. they're making sure that they've got folks lined up and ready to go in and do the work on behalf of the american people. >> yeah, and you know, jason, i think, you know, beyond just the unpatriotic nature of the behavior, it's also a pretty big affront to a very multiracial
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electorate that made a very firm and decisive decision about who the majority, 75 million people and counting, want to be the president of the united states. >> well, yeah. remember, trump is a white nationalist and his entire administration, if they're not white nationalists in their hearts, they are in acting and behavior to ignore the large number of black, brown, white people that said they wanted joe biden as president. and here's the other part of it, joy. they're ignoring the obvious signs, right? like, slowly but surely, everybody's moving on. at some point, joe biden's going to change his twitter status to, you know, vice president-elect and the white house facebook page is going to say, it's complicated. you know, like it's gone. it's done. everyone started to move on, everybody knows it's not your job anymore, and i think that republicans -- like what we're seeing down in georgia with the secretary of state saying we're going to do a recount and these lawsuits that keep failing, all these republicans are doing is actually damaging their future reputation. i don't think anybody should be thinking about 2024 right now,
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because if they continue to act like fools, they will look like the kind of losers that they don't want to appear to be, and that will damage any future chances. be a good loser, accept what's happened, go out, get work done, and run again. but this kind of behavior is the kind of thing that people are going to remember, and when joe biden gets into office, if he's success. everyone who was a part of this slow-moving, pouting, dragging your feet because you don't want to go to the dentist kind of behavior, it's not going to be a good look for them this summer when we're actually able to go back into malls and things like that. >> wait until they find out, surprise, donald trump is going to try to run again in 2024 and all this lwill have been for nothing because he's not even going to let y'all run. thank you so much. jason johnson is sticking around. when we return, the shake-up at the pentagon and the threat to national security as donald trump refuses to concede an election he clearly lost. we'll talk to a member of the house armed services committee next. plus the red-hot battle for senate control comes down to those two runoffs you just heard
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jason mention in georgia. we'll get the latest on the ground where democrats are clamoring for barack obama's help. and the coronavirus pandemic spinning out of control as cases, hospitalizations, and deaths reach frightening new levels. we'll check in on what may be the newest epicenter in the pandemic. "deadline white house" continues after a short break. so don't go anywhere. tinues after a short break. so don't go anywhere it's made for him a veteran who honorably served and it's made for her she's serving now we also made usaa for military spouses and their kids become a member. get an insurance quote today.
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election, and i think they're playing with that idea inside the white house. >> general barry mccaffrey last hour talking about what's happening right now at the pentagon after a series of resignations following the dismissal of defense secretary mark esper. trump loyalists are assuming top positions at the defense department in the 11th hour of this presidency. just this afternoon, we learned of another one, retired army colonel douglas mcgregor, a fox news regular and an advocate for troop withdrawal is headed to the pentagon as a senior advisor to the acting secretary. mcgregor was up for a policy job at the pentagon earlier this year but didn't get the nomination because of his history of controversial remarks. axios reports he criticized germany for being too welcoming to, quote, muslim invaders, and advocated for the use of deadly force to deter undocumented immigration. when mcgregor didn't get the nomination, it went to retired army general anthony tata but his name too was withdrawn for past controversial remarks. he called president obama a,
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quote, terrorist leader. look at that. as of this week, tata is now -- now has a leadership position at the pentagon along with former aides to michael flynn and devin nunes. it all begs the question, at least among national security officials, what exactly is donald trump up to? he's obviously yet to concede the presidential race, one that he lost last week, and that refusal to acknowledge reality represents another national security risk. joe biden, our next president, is currently unable to receive the presidential daily brief or access to classified information. joining us now is democratic congressman anthony brown of maryland, the vice-chair of the house armed services committee. he's also a veteran and retired colonel in the u.s. army reserve corps and a recipient of the bronze star for his service in iraq. so, congressman, i want to start by thanking you for your service and thank you for being here. >> thank you, joy. let me say happy veterans day to all of the millions of men and women who currently serve and have served our country in
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uniform. happy veterans day to them and their families. >> absolutely. i will echo that as well. and i'll start there, because you know, this is a day when we honor those like yourself who have served this country honorably and who serve in many cases in very dangerous parts of the world where the governments around them are not democratic and are not converted in a democratic way. what does it say to those troops, some of whose votes were being dumped in by republican local officials in some states as if they were illegal votes when they're not, they just were voting from overseas, that this president is refusing to do a traditional transfer, peaceful transfer of power? >> listen, men and women join our armed forces because they gladly, willingly and with great pride want to defend everything that this country stands for, democracy, our democratic institutions, and the freedoms and liberties that we enjoy, including the right to vote. they fought for the right to vote. many have died at home and
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abroad for the right to vote so when they see the commander in chief doing everything he can to create a situation where their vote might not count, it can be demoralizing on troops. look, men and women in uniform are going to get up and do their job every single day, but we're human beings. so when you see that kind of conduct by your commander in chief, it can be demoralizing and any time you impact morale, you impact readiness, so i'm always concerned when i see the president trampling on rights, particularly those of military members who need to be able to cast their ballot, even when they're in iraq, afghanistan, or anywhere else around the world. >> yeah, and you know, you tweeted earlier, chaos is harmful to our national security, global uncertainty, terrorism and authoritarianism remain threats as we transition government. it's telling that one of the last things secretary esper worked on was ensuring our military stopped honoring traitors and those who betray our values. the kind of people going out, james anderson, joseph kernen,
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undersecretary for intelligence and jan stewart, mike esper's chief of staff, they're going out. the people coming in are people like anthony tata, who's got some interesting thoughts on school resegregation, who called president barack obama a terrorist leader, who has a long history of islamaphobia, douglas mcgregor, who has extreme rhetoric about muslims and undocumented immigrants, which led even esper to have concerns about him. you've got ezra cohen-watnick who was forced out in 2017 because he worked with michael flynn, who of course was chatting with the russians and saying, don't worry, we don't have sanctions against you and kash patel, who's a devin nunes acolyte, who played a key role on the hill in helping republicans discredit the russia probe. bringing that kind of leadership into the, you know, the department of defense, what does that do to our readiness and our national security? >> sure, first of all, you know, you raised, you know, real,
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relevant, salient points that go to their character and their competence to serve in these positions but even putting that aside, high-level turnover at this point in transition undermines national security. it will prevent or certainly impede the ability to transition seamlessly, quickly, to the biden administration, which requires many things to happen. 1,200 appointees have to be filled. they have to be vetted. there are security clearances. we're going to need to have communicatio communications with other countries facilitated by the state department. that won't happen. access to intelligence and other sensitive information, that doesn't happen. so, while the biden transition team right now is doing its very best to transition to govern, it's impeded by the people that president trump has put into place as well as the other impediments that he's put up, namely, the gsa not determining that an official transition can
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take place now. so all of these undermine our national security and put us at greater ri greater risk. >> what do you think would be the implications for an incoming biden administration if, as a lot of people fear, he does a mass pullout of u.s. troops from all around the world where they're serving? >> well, let's, you know, one reality is it's hard to do a mass pullout between now and january 20th. you're talking about large number of troops, a lot of heavy equipment, but nevertheless, even a movement to do that could put u.s. forces at risk because everyone in this business understands that sort of retrograde and withdrawal operations are often the most dangerous when it comes to force protection. so, even talk about that and movement towards that could put our troops at risk so i would say, listen, president trump, you're outgoing, we're in a transition, pass the baton to president biden. he'll work the issue. >> would that he would listen. congressman anthony brown, thank you so much. we really appreciate you being
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here on this veterans day. >> thank you, joy. cheers. when we come back, georgia, georgia, georgia. with when it comes to control of the united states senate, it's the entire ball game. democrats want president barack obama to help win it but what do republicans want from donald trump? we'll head there next when headline white house continues. n headline white house continues pain gel, my husband would have been on the sidelines. but not anymore! an alternative to pills voltaren is the first full prescription strength non-steroidal anti-inflammatory gel to target pain directly at the source for powerful arthritis pain relief. voltaren. the joy of movement.
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step down, echoing donald trump's baseless claims of voter fraud without any evidence. the paper ran this editorial above its masthead on today's front page, writing, in part, "senators kelly, loeffler and david perd have assaulted the election, that is dangerous behavior both for the state and the nature," adding, georgians are wise enough to recognize these antics and perdue, loeffler and others should know better. it could come down to a proxy war between trump and former president barack obama. georgia democrats are clamoring for obama to return to help turn out the base while republicans are desperate for assistance from trump and his rallies. so far, neither have confirmed that they will visit the peach state ahead of the runoff and then there's this. georgia's secretary of state announced today that the state will do a hand recount of the nearly 5 million ballots cast in the presidential race. despite the decisive five-figure
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lead joe biden holds in the race. let's bring in nbc's priscilla thompson live in atlanta. hi, priscilla. >> reporter: hi, joy. pretty clear picture of what's going on there. go ahead. >> no, go for it. tell me what you're saying, tell me what's going on in the state and how is the state getting ready for this epic runoff? >> reporter: right, well, ever since that announcement, right now, the state officials, at least at the secretary of state's office, are focused on how this hand recount is going to go, and it looks like counties will be able to get that under way starting tomorrow. there's going to be a statewide meeting with all the counties to go over training and procedures, and then all of those election officials who just wrapped up the counting of absentee ballots are going to be back at it, working to count the nearly 5 million ballots that will need to be done in order to do this by hand recount, but all of this is happening on the backdrop of runoff elections and runoff campaigning that is already under way.
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senator kelly loeffler was in the state today campaigning. jon ossoff is on day two of a four-day tour across the state, speaking to folks here about coronavirus and healthcare and those issues that are very much on voters' minds and we're also seeing the money begin to flood into the state here as it relates to those runoff campaigns with mitch mcconnell reaching out to his supporters, imploring them to donate and stacey abrams as well, raising more than $9.8 million off of one video that she tweeted on friday. so it's definitely shaping up to be a very competitive race, and i should point out that voters at this time can already start requesting absentee ballots for those elections. counties were supposed to begin sending them out next week so it's going to be very interesting to see how the counties prepare for this race while also trying to get that recount done of nearly 5 million votes that the secretary of state says they'll have counted
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by hand by november 20th. joy? >> nbc's priscilla thompson in atlanta, thank you very much, stay safe. joining us now is msnbc contributor mara, wall street editorial board member and politics editor for the "daily beast." i'm changing people's jobs as we speak. and jason johnson is also back with us. mara, i misstated your job so g you get to go first. it seems to me quite obvious that the elections sort of somewhat mixed-ish result, right, was a clear rebuke of donald trump himself. that was made clear by, what, 12 to 14,000 votes. it's a decisive win. but with the senate races, these are essentially right now polling at a tie. people are sort of back and forth on this. i find it interesting that the strategy of the two republicans is to triple down on trumpism. attack the republican infrastructure of their own state and try to go extra
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trump-y when that vibe lost for donald trump. what do you make of it? >> well, i actually think that this idea that there is a split ticket effect is a little bit overblown. i think we really need to consider the structural advantages that republicans have when it comes to the senate in general. you know, this is really -- the senate is a place where voters who live in cities have been, i think, increasingly disenfranchised, and we're looking at minority rule being potentially cemented, not just in the supreme court but in the long run in the senate, and absolutely, you know, voting matters there, but your vote just doesn't count as much in certain states as it does in others, and so there really is a structural disadvantage for democrats there. add to that the redistricting that we've seen over the past
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20, 30 years and that compounds the effect. so, i actually think that there's a very -- this is a very clear win for democrats across a number of swing states, and obviously, we should also remember that joe biden flipped several states, which is extremely difficult to do against an incumbent president. so, you know, we're looking at the same margin of votes, just about, give or take, for joe biden that winning margin is about the same as it was for donald trump, you know, four years ago. so, i actually think it's really decisive. i think that republicans right now are doing everything they can to cast doubt upon the legitimacy of this duly elected president-elect, and that should be stopped. i also want to say that in casting aspersion on the election without any evidence, so far, whatsoever, republicans are really doing a disservice not just to institutions but, in
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fact, also are delegitimizing those american voters, many of whom are racial minorities, black, latino voters, asian voters who did cast ballots for joe biden, essentially otherizing them and saying their vote should not matter and they stole the election. it's extremely dangerous when you consider the kind of domestic terrorism this country is facing right now. >> yeah, it was pretty extraordinary, sam, to see the republican secretary of state of a state with a republican governor who many people feel stole the governorship by disenfranchising black voters, stand in atlanta and say, we're going to hand recount five million ballots because i'm secretary of state but i'm not sure this was a fair election. i mean, it's casting doubt on that. again, it does seem to undermine, in every way, it's like they're making the case to not elect these two republicans and then you've got this dynamic of barack obama, potentially coming back to the state, coming
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out to the state to energize the very voters who are being dissed and told that your votes are less valuable and that they may not be legit because, you know, the blacks decided we wanted biden so we can't really go with that. we need to check it. and then you're going to have biden, who's going to come in and energize them. do the republicans in georgia want trump to come? do they want donald trump's help at this point? do they think they need it? would help? >> so, well, there's two conversations happening. there's the republican side, where you're right, i mean, there's some -- it's hard to find consistency here. either you believe the votes are accurate for the congress -- you can't believe the votes are accurate for the congressional races and inaccurate for the presidential ones. it doesn't make sense. but we have a dynamic where everyone's sort of passing the hot potato. no one wants to say firmly, enough, we need to legitimize these results so you have the republican secretary of state being like, okay, fine, we'll recount, you'll have the courts being like, this doesn't work,
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and then you'll have trump saying to william barr, you have to find instances of voter fraud. no one wants to say, enough, this is lunacy, it's all play acting, let's get on with business. that's happening on the republican side. to your question, do they want trump to come in, i think they actually kind of need trump to come in. the worst thing that would happen for the republicans in georgia at this point would be for a huge swath of trump-affiliated conservative voters, not republicans, trump-affiliated conservatives sort of disengaging from the political process entirely and saying you know what? we don't want to. it doesn't matter. which is why this movement they're doing has such risk. if they convince their voters that the election is corrupted, they risk people disingaging entirely. on the democratic side, joy, i think you're absolutely right. they have to find out a way to sort of reenergize the voters. there's a history of voter
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dropoff in runoff elections, specifically in georgia too so they have to figure out how to reengage their voters, whether it means barack obama going in, joe biden coming in, whether it means not having any national figures coming in because you're worried about that looking bad in the state, they have to figure out how to do it because i do think, right now, they have the uphill task. there is a history, again, of runoff election dipoff in the democratic side. they have to figure out how to turn tens of thousands of votes, a deficit into a surplus by january 5th. >> it feels like one way to do that is for donald trump to start doing rallies there, spreading covid all around, and reminding, i don't know, the sixth district in georgia, why they don't like him in the first place and getting black voters to say, absolutely hell no and come back out again. i don't know. maybe you say it differently. >> so, here's the thing, joy. you know, i know some republicans down there and i've spoken to them that would want trump to come. but remember, he's sitting in his dressing room right now saying, nobody out there likes
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me, i don't want to go, i'm a loser. he's got make-up on his face, crying with the mascara, he does not want to gone on stage. the idea you're going to get donald trump to go down and campaign when he knows that he's already lost and he's a loser is going to be difficult. you go to obama expeditiously, welcome to atlanta. abrah barack obama, michelle obama, any other obamas they can get, joe biden, they need to be in atlanta. that's what needs to happen. and here's the other thing. this is really important when you look at what the secretary of state is doing right now. part of why i believe joe biden was able to win in georgia is because you had so many mail-in paper ballots. we know the shenanigans that have happened with voting machines in georgia. a lot of their paper ballots in georgia are bar codes where people don't even necessarily know what their votes are so the paper ballots that people were using, the mail-in ballots that people were using are actually much, much better, so i think democrats have a good chance. obama needs to get there. >> yeah, well, they better keep an eye on mr. dejoy, that's all i'm going to say if that's how
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y'all are going to do it. thank you guys very much. when we return, skyrocketing cases of coronavirus, hospitalizations hitting an all-time high and still, still, no sign of a national pandemic strategy from the trump white house as we head into a long, dark winter. "deadline white house" continues after this. ter. "deadline white house" contiesnu after this she's so beautiful. janie, come here. check this out. let me see. she looks... kind of like me. yeah. that's because it's your grandma when she was your age. oh wow. that's...that's amazing. oh and she was on the debate team. yeah, that's probably why you're the debate queen. - mmhmm. - i'll take that. look at that smile. i have the same dimples as her. yeah. the same placements and everything. unbelievable.
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our bargain detergent couldn't keep up. with us... turns out it's mostly water. so, we switched back to tide. one wash, stains are gone. daughter: slurping don't pay for water. pay for clean. it's got to be tide. new record numbers around the country are proving the coronavirus pandemic is only getting worse. yesterday, the united states reported a record number of new cases, more than 135,000. more than 1,400 americans died just yesterday and nearly 8,000 have died in the past week. so far, our nation's death toll is more than 242,000 and more than 10.4 million americans have been sickened. what's more, according to the covid tracking project, a record number of americans are currently hospitalized with the virus. nearly 62,000.
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texas just became the first state to surpass 1 million covid-19 cases statewide, and el paso is looking more and more like the epicenter of the virus in this country. let's bring in nbc's morgan chesky who's live in el paso, texas. morgan? >> reporter: yeah, joy, good afternoon, and it is a dire scene here in el paso where the crisis from covid-19 is becoming more serious by the day. we were here a week ago on election day, and it was certainly an issue, but to come back just one week later, we are seeing people take this significantly more seriously, and you can see that manifested in these tents that have been set up behind me manned by both army and air force personnel to deal with this influx of covid-19 patients. i want to talk about some of the numbers at play here that make this such a serious situation. we know that in el paso county alone, as of right now, there are 65,000 cases as of this moment that have happened since this pandemic began. 717 people have died in this
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county so far, and i want you to take into account how serious it is in texas as well. a million cases, the first state to surpass a million cases. 19,000 deaths. now, here in el paso, joy, one of the big concerns is the fact that a shutdown that has closed all nonessential businesses expires at midnight tonight. we still don't know if that shutdown will be extended, but i want you to hear what the county judge who's in charge of it had to say when i spoke to him about the importance of trying to drive these numbers down. take a listen. >> people might criticize that we're doing this. but we're doing this because we -- we're the ones that make the decisions. we're the ones that understand the trajectory of our numbers. we're the ones that know where it can land. when people are looking, they're looking at yesterday's numbers and wondering if it makes sense. i'm looking at our numbers today and the trajectory of what would happen if we don't intervene.
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>> reporter: you know, i was talking to a gentleman who has lived in this community for more than 30 years, following this crisis as it plays out in realtime. he says that he's seen what looks like a wild fire in the form of a virus and he says, joy, this can play out one of two different ways. you can contain it and watch it extinguish, or it can burn through all the available fuel. he fears that the latter is what's happening here in el paso. joy? >> wow. nbc's morgan chesky, thank you. thank you very much. wow all right, well joining us now is nbc news medical contributor dr. vin gupta, an affiliate professor at the institute for health metrics and evaluation, also a commissioned officer in the air force reserve medical corps and i want to start by thanking you for our service, dr. gupta. it's great to talk to you. >> thank you so much, joy. >> the report we heard morgan do, i'm sort of taken aback by it. i've been reading recently and
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sort of in this deep dive on south texas and the way that the vote, particularly among latino voters, went, and one of the factors that actually wound up hurting joe biden were the shutdowns. was this idea that the shutdowns are hurting people of working class jobs and the oil fields or who work in fields where they're seeing their, you know, restaurants, et cetera, shut down, that they prefer to open up the economy, that they're prioritizing the economy even over their own health and lives. and when i hear that you have a shutdown that's coming at midnight that's going to hit texas and that you see that gentleman, the judge, pleading with people, please understand why we're doing this, and then we report these numbers of dead, the disconnect to me, it scares me, honestly, about how we get out of this crisis. does it frighten you? >> you bet it does, joy, but it's just a choice that they shouldn't have to make, and this is what i mean by that. there's 115 million n95 masks in our strategic national
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stockpile. we thought we needed about 300 million for healthcare workers alone. we shouldn't only have enough n95 masks for healthcare workers. we should be broadening our definition of what's an essential frontline worker to restaurant workers so people can earn a durable living. because because here is the point, joy, there is data that came out in the last week that suggested any -- that a person that shows up positive to a hospital with covid-19 that's symptomatic, it's more likely than the prior two weeks. they were in grocery stores and front line staff, it doesn't just mean they were a doctor or nurse. why does that matter? we need to expand our definition of a front line worker and give them the proper ppe to not choose between their health and making a durable wage. it's not fair. >> i do worry that by the time
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that president elect biden takes over, he will inherit a death toll that is a wartime death toll. to me it already looks like a wartime death toll and he's then going to have to convince people who are dead set against shutdowns and the basics of protecting themselves and determined to go to work and send their kids to school and do their normal lives. regardless of what we tell them about how many people are dead, is universal mask distribution something that you would recommend he try? >> oh, absolutely, and a specific type of it. you're right, we have to meet people where they're at. i can say don't hop on a flight for thanksgiving, stay at home and shelter in place but people are going to choose what they decide to do partly influenced by fatigue and the misinformation and mixed messaging the last nine months. we can empower people and give them what they deserve to have. one is not just universal masks but the universal masking with the right type of access and broad access to rapid testing.
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those are things the biden administration needs to prioritize. >> n 95 and is it kn 95 or n 95? are they the same? >> they are different. k 95 mask has not gone through the vetting than the one i showed has gone through. it would be nice to have more n 95 masks for more people, not just health care workers. >> that is something i feel like we can do and is doable that america could do. thank you for that. thank you so much for joining us on this veterans day. appreciate you. when we return, remembering lives well lived. ou. when we return, remembering lives well lived [ engine rumbling ] ♪ [ beeping ] [ engine revs ] ♪ uh, you know there's a 30-minute limit, right? tell that to the rain. [ beeping ] for those who were born to ride, there's progressive.
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i don't even know how to take a breath, let alone, get through the next days and weeks and months and years without him. hold the people you love, hold them tight, tell them you love them. spend as much time you can with your loved ones because you never know when it's going to be the last. >> such grief. such pain. the natural instinct for us might to be to just look away but the victims of the pandemic and their families, don't we owe them something? to share that burden to stare that sorrow right in the face, paton was 13 years old. eighth grade. a few weeks ago, he started feeling sick. his symptoms got worse and soon thereafter he was gone. paton is so far missouri's
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youngest covid victim. his mom told ksdk in missouri that paton was funny, sweet, kind, and known as her little buddy. he had no underlying medical conditions and yet, the coronavirus was just too much. let's follow his mom's advice, spend time with the people you love and hug them while you can because you never know when it will be your last. we'll be right back. will be your last. we'll be right back. we made usaa insurance for members like martin. an air force veteran made of doing what's right, not what's easy. so when a hailstorm hit, usaa reached out before he could even inspect the damage. that's how you do it right. usaa insurance is made just the way martin's family needs it with hassle-free claims, he got paid before his neighbor even got started. because doing right by our members, that's what's right. usaa. what you're made of, we're made for. ♪ usaa
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