i mean, it's looney tunes. the president's literally coming to georgia to campaign for the two same senators who his two former lawyers have filed lawsuits to contest the election with the same claims the president made in his very long 46-midvideo yesterday. i'm speechless. >> good morning and welcome to the final edition of "a.m. joy." i'm jason johnson. with all due respect, the

comparison looney tunes is not exactly fair. bugs bunny was a lot more clever than donald trump because it was the president's delusion that was on full display at his rally on saturday night in georgia. which was supposed to be a campaign for the two incumbent republican seats fighting to keep their senate seats and control the republican senate. it was really a venue for trump to air his many petty grievances. it was festivus in georgia. case in point. >> you know we won georgia, just so you understand. we've never lost an election. we're winning this election. >> he also took aim at georgia's top elected officials who are also republicans. >> you got to make sure your secretary of state knows what the hell he's doing and you got to make sure your governor gets a lot tougher than he's been. your governor could stop it very easily, if he knew what the hell he was doing. >> as "the atlanta-journal

constitution" reported, this rally came just hours after trump called kemp to demand that kemp call a special session of the state legislature to overturn the election results, which kemp refused. i guess he was used to calling him on his cell phone when he needed a vote. joining me now is christina greer, curt bardella, senior advise for the lincoln project, latisha brown, co-founder of black voters matter and marcus farrell. curt, i'm going to start with you because you're a country music fan. channel danie charlie daniels here. i told you once, you son of a gun, i'm the best that's ever been. i'm looking at these poll numbers right now. thank you, see, i knew you'd appreciate that. >> that was impressive, jason. wow, i'm blown away. >> thank you. thank you. look, i'm lookingality these recent poll numbers we've got

with the ossoff race with purdue and reverend warnock against loeffler. these look like pretty good numbers for a run-off length in a state that just turned blue about a month ago. do you think that anything trump is going to do right now will have an impact on how this race is playing out? >> i think, jason, at this point the only effect trump could have on this race is a negative one for republicans. by continuing to assail republican officials in georgia like governor and secretary of state. by continuing to promote these baseless conspiracy theories in an effort to perpetrate a coup d'etat on america, he is basically telling voters in georgia the election system is one they can't trust. i think that realistically looking at special elections where turnout is everything, people are not conditioned to show and up vote on january 5th in georgia. this is about getting your side to turn out in the most robust numbers as possible. that can be the difference

between winning and losing, and right now republicans in georgia are getting very mixed messages in an event that's supposed to be only about getting purdue and loeffler elected january 5th. trump spent the entire time, not that this is shocking, talking himself, talking about his delusions and conspiracy theories and grievances and that does nothing to help david purdue and kelly loeffler. they're being put in an untenable position where they have to choose between our democracy and a wanna be dictator. none of those answers are going to be helpful for them to try to get their bases to show up and vote. >> dr. greer, if you had asked me to go through my georgia run-off election bingo card, mypillow guy would not be on it. he's talking about crazy conspiracy theories what republicans' plans actually are. i want to show this video and get your comment on the other side. do we have the video? okay, i guess we don't have the

moo moo mypillow. essentially what you have, dr. greer, is a lot of people saying, hey, look, this is fake, this is nonsense, we can't understand how this election is going to work, don't vote. do you think that's part of the anger and the noise at the time or do you think the local people are seeking this guidance and choosing not to participate in an election that's important? >> well, we said all along, jason, you know, the republican party has turned into a cult-like scenario. so when donald trump tells people not to vote, certain people won't vote, and what i think is inspirational for the democrats and they have to sort of stay the course is that the organizing in georgia for the democrats for progressive politics, for black people, didn't start after november 3rd. it's been going on for several years. new georgia project. black voters matter. there are many organizations that have been working diligently for years, actually, to make sure residents in

georgia understand what's at stake, not just on the federal level and not just with the president and congress, but the local, state and federal level politics and how it interacts in their lives. so when we have the president abusing the governor, republican governor, and the secretary of state, but we also have republicans saying i will not steal this election for you, and what you're saying, your rhetoric is actually quite dangerous and it's putting us in danger. we've seen, you know, when democrats are unhappy, they knit pink hats and go marching. when republicans are unhappy, they grab ar-15s and start storming the bastille and knocking on the doors of the courthouse. sadly, with that last rally there will likely be many residents of georgia who are quite ill because there were very few masks at the president's last superspreader event. >> dr. greer makes a really good point because, look, i for one am sick of giving republican

officials credit for complaining now about the monster they've created over the last four or five years. gabe sterling out there saying, oh, my gosh, the violence is so terrible, while perpetuating the lie that stacey abrams never conceded her race. a full investigation into several organizations than stacey abrams started, the new georgia project, et cetera, et cetera, being investigated by brian kemp. as someone who was part of these organizations and the organizing in georgia, what do you think about republicans saying it was a rigged system while at the same time investigating organizations that are actually dedicated to getting people involved in voting? >> it's not surprising that i say it's hypocrisy. and also, i just wanted to touch back on a former point. you have to be a special hot mess to make republicans depress their turnout in january on a special election, and that is exactly what's happening right now. i was in atlanta, georgia, driving up 85 and i saw a billboard that actually said since donald trump -- since kelly loeffler and purdue does

not support donald trump, we should not support him. >> wow. >> we should not support them. >> yeah. that's a real billboard that's going on. so, i mean, listen, the -- the hard work that was made by these organizations on the ground, black lives matter -- i mean black voters matter, new georgia project, fair fight, aclu just protecting the law, and, you know, black male voter project. all these organizations on the ground that have been working for the past few years. you match that with the amount of ineptitude and hot messiness th that is the republicans' campaign for senate here in georgia, we may see a win. nat is the most amazing thing to it. >> you know what? the political science term of hot messness, i'll make sure we use that in future classes. natasha, i want to get into some hardcore numbers here. usually what we've seen in the

past for run-off elections is that there is a drop, 20, 30, sometimes 40%. what does the drop-off rate have to be for democrats to still be successful? can it only be 15% from the general election in november? can it only be 20? what do you guys have to see in order for this to be successful for ossoff and warnock? >> we are operating as if it can be zero drop-off rate. >> okay. >> we can't lose anything at chance. we can't lose anything on the table. and so for us our goal is to turn out at the same levels -- now, we know that that is an uphill battle, but at the end of the day, we are in a state that when we were are talking about -- while trump is talking about voter fraud, there is no evidence of voter fraud, but aea preponderance of the evidence that there has been voter suppression. while these two seats are really critical for the nation, right?

for the democratic party, they're most important for people here in georgia. >> so -- >> we can't -- >> marcus, i want to -- what was that, latisha? >> we can't take any chances. we're trying to get it all. >> okay. i heard a police car in the background. i couldn't quite tell. marcus, i wanted to ask you this. this is also something that i've seen and it's been a concern when i've talked to people in georgia. you have great organizers on the ground. you have latasha, black voters matter. there is always this influx of out of state consultants who have free time because their campaigns failed who suddenly start telling campaigns what to do. what do the democratic candidates right now, what do ossoff and warnock have to be careful of when it comes to the outside voices suddenly flooding the state for the turnout in january. >> it's interesting you said that, jason. after the general election was over, there was more white consultants that came down from

d.c. than playstation 5s. so at this point, what i'm thinking is that these campaigns need to just listen to the people on the ground. and, i mean, here's one thing that you have to understand, folks come into town wanting to take over narratives instead of trying to win an election, and that's a problem. so you can't take the same iowa tactic that didn't work for you in iowa and try to implement them with black voters. you got to listen to the aunties, the uncles on the treat. because if you mess around and start doing work on your own outside of the parameter of people who have been here and doing work for years, you're going to start running iowa commercials. turning down and suppressing a vote that obviously as latasha said, we need to leave every vote unturned. you can make one bad commercial or phone call or one bad decision politically and all of a sudden a whole neighborhood hates ossoff or warnock because you don't know what the hell you're doing. >> that's right. jason, to that point, you can say y'all the wrong way in a commercial and we know that

you're not from the area. i think what is really important in this election cycle, too, is we're also seeing the closure of early voting sites. that's something we're paying extraordinarily close attention to. are these early voting sites in places where you saw democratic votes? so i think we've got to keep all eyes on georgia, literally. >> and keep those eyes focused on what actually matters. curt, i want to put this to you. put on your republican hat for half a second. they've got this joe biden fight, circular firing squad, they're all beating on each other. what on earth is the message republicans need to come up with in the middle of this infighting? you've got trump attacking kemp over twitter. gabe sterling saying this. loeffler and purdue saying that. can they come up with a coherent message out of this or are they just trying to depend on turnout? >> i think republicans at this point are going to have to depend on turnout. there is no cohesive message.

one of the things that we've learned over the last four years is nothing republicans can say or do can be louder than what we're hearing from donald trump. the one thing we've seen since the election is that donald trump is determined to be as loud as he possibly can from now until january 20th. there is no shutting him up. there is no he's going to go away or he's going to retreat or withdraw into the background. as we saw last night in georgia, he is determined, as always, to make everything about himself because that's the only mode that he knows, is 100% self-promotion. republicans in georgia, their only hope is that everyone shows up to vote because that's what republicans do. republicans often rely on the fact that behaviorally republicans show up to vote, no matter what the condition is, no matter what -- when the election is, no matter who's on the ballot, republicans vote for republicans. they don't have the same turmoil that you often times see on the democratic side. even if they think that the candidate isn't their ideal person, they will still vote for that person, as we saw with the robust numbers, higher numbers

than we expected from republicans in this most recent elections. so republicans aren't going to have a message other than what we've continually seen and there is no getting louder than donald trump. so they're just going to have to make the best of it. >> dr. dr. brier, very quickly. so donald trump is not on the ballot but kelly loeffler is and debating raphael warnock tonight. i'm pretty skeptical whether debates make a difference in an election. do you think tonight if there is some huge blunder on either side from warnock or loeffler that that could end up affecting turnout or do you think it's going to be caught up in the overall morass of this campaign? >> i agree with you, jason, debates tend to not move the needle too much. they are really great, though, with fund-raising. as we go into this final push, if warnock behaves the way he has been, very strong, steady, clear in his messaging, think that will help with fund-raising to focus on turnout.

with kelly loweffler, there wil be good sound bites to extract because of the insider trading allegations she's facing right now. >> i think if warnock makes a little drop motion like he did in his last commercial, he'll probably win the entire debate. christina will be next in our back hour. thank you to our panel. coming up, the challenges of convincing 350 million americans to get vaccinated. alice loves the scent of gain so much, she wished there was a way to make it last longer. say hello to your fairy godmother alice. and long-lasting gain scent beads. part of the irresistible scent collection from gain!

the team's been working around the clock.wire, we've had to rethink our whole approach. we're going to give togetherness. logistically, it's been a nightmare. i'm not sure it's going to work. it'll work. i didn't know you were listening.

it's time for us to stop being guinea pigs. >> right. >> and people need to know where we're coming from. we're not trying to be against everything, but we as a people have suffered. >> that's right. that's right. >> we've gotten to a point where we just don't trust. >> given this nation's legacy of racism in medicine from denying treatment to black men with syphilis to the 1933 tuskegee

study to the recent report of i.c.e. detainees happening now. it comes as no surprise many black and brown americans are skeptical of a covid vaccine, even though the virus is disproportionately affecting their communities. joining me now is dr. patel, senior fellow at the brookings institution and senior msnbc medical contributor. and co-chair for the louisiana governor's covid-19 minority task force. dr. awabare is also a principal investigators for the vaccine trial -- there is a slip from "snl" last night that i really think captures the skepticism many people have about a covid vaccine. i want your comments on the other side. >> the cdc has recommended that the first people in the u.s. to receive covid vaccines should be health care workers and residents of nursing homes. while the first people to actually require it will be guests of colin and scott's holiday yacht party.

i got mixed feelings on this vaccine. on the one hand i'm black, so naturally, i don't trust it, but on the other hand, i'm on a white tv show, so i might actually get the real one. >> dr. abare, i am black and i don't know what kind of tv show i am on, but i understand the skepticism being expressed in last night's segment. how do you battle that? because we're not just talking about people who are not educated and disconnected from medical science. large numbers of educated, connected african-americans are still skeptical about a vaccine. >> well, in my newsroom right now, people are very, very skeptical. and these are very educated people. but one thing we have to do, we can't frame the situation without understanding the blame of the situation. and i say that because we have the -- a real historic distrust because of realities. we always talk about the tuskegee experiment, and that

was a bad thing, but let's not forget that african-american women that are giving birth right now have a higher chance of dying during childbirth than some developing countries. let's not forget the social determinants in america make it so a black child not taken care of by a black doctor has an increased risk of dies when in hospital. these are things not from tuskegee experiment days, these are things happening right now. so when you look at this whole concept of guinea pigs, you must understand that this is not a joke, but that it is very real and there is a reason why people feel this way. grave robbing from medical school so that people could actually experiment on black cadavers. all of these things are ghosts of our past. the reality now that you have to remember is that we are dying more than any other group, african-americans are, it's the leading cause -- covid-19 is the leading cause of death in the america among all groups. >> right. >> but african-americans are dying at disproportionate rates. so that's why as a -- as a

professor, as a doctor, as a principal investigator, i have to do these clinical trials so that i can put african-americans in it so we can know if they work. and that's why we have to step up as scientists, we have to step up as leaders in our communities and say, this must be done. because, look, you don't want to get a vaccine that won't work on you. you don't want to get a vaccine -- >> right. >> that will be harmful to you, right? so you got to be in it to know. >> dr. patel, there's a new survey out that shows sort of receptiveness to the vaccine and it's broken down by race, which groups of people are more comfortable with it. when you see these kinds of numbers we're going to flash on the screen in a second. when you see these kinds of numbers, what do you think will have to happen from a messaging standpoint? will there have to be tailored messages to different ethnic communities in america in order to convince them to participate in addition to the logistic challenges that will be faced? >> jason, absolutely, and thanks for bringing this topic up

because it's an important one. i think, number one, we actually have to understand who has trust amongst community members. i think it's kind of hypocritical for doctors like me to think, oh, we trust the hospital, for all the reasons that we're talking about this morning. or that we trust research institutions. if you actually live and work in these communities, you learn that the trusted person is the schoolteacher or the principal or the barber shop that has, like, a community presence amongst black men where you can actually get prostate cancer screenings as well. we've got a history that is very rich of how to overcome that statistic, jason, but here's what's troubling. i've looked now at most of the country's vaccination plans, which have been submitted to the cdc, and they don't have the funding to do what they need to do, and they have no funding to actually think about community-based approaches to overcome some of the distrust that you're picking up on those surveys. >> dr. hebert, this is actually something else that's key here and has to do with a sort of

lack of funding and lack of resources. i've seen this in political campaigns, and basically fighting covid is another form of campaign. disinformation. what americans me is let's say the covid-19 vaccine gets out there and a story someone is sick and associated as a complication and they're like, aha, it's killing black people. what is the plan to combat disinformation? because inevitability, there will be some people who get sick, there will be side effects to this vaccine. how do we combat that in advance? >> there are two things. the first is that the louisiana governor's task force that i'm a very strong part of is doing these things to get into the community, to let people know that trusted voices in their community are taking the vaccine and are giving them the information that they need so that they can move to the next level of distrusting the vaccine and actually wanting to take it. but one thing i also have to, you know, we can not forget about, is as the other doctor mentioned, we have to know not only how to have the vaccine in an area, but how are we going to

deliver this vaccine? i mean, the rural areas are more likely to die -- people in rural areas are more likely to die from covid-19 and also less likely to get the vaccine. that's not even including the people that decide they don't want to get it. i'm talking about the people that won't be able to get it. but people like me, people like the other physician that is on the panel, what we have to remember is that we have to have boots on the ground. boots on the ground. and the trusted people in that community have to step up. and that -- i hate that that's the case, but it's got to be entertainers because that's what we like. we got to have football players, basketball players, people that are taking this vaccine on camera saying this is safe. because we mentioned and the cdc actually said -- it's something i didn't agree with. they said this is not going to be a walk in the park. this vaccine is going to be, you know, a day-long exhaustion and all these types of things. first of all, that's wrong to be saying, even though it may be the case. the reality is every vaccine has

that. why come out and say that? the african-american community does have a lot of disinformation. remember when we first started this whole covid-19 thing, we thought black people couldn't get it, remember that? >> this is true. >> oh, we can't get it. people kept doing what they were doing and that's when we became 70% of the death. so the disinformation has come out so fast. that's why the people -- boots on the ground have to take care of their communities. there's no way around it. that's why our task force is doing that with all the messaging on everything. >> and dr. patel, quickly, when it comes to boots on the ground, because as you mentioned before, that's going to cost money. which method do you think will be better? we've got this newcoming administration. do they need to create a brand-new agency, a sort of homeland security for health or do you think they can commandeer u.p.s. or the postal department or something else to conduct this. it seems to me we probably have distribution companies that exist that can be transformed into delivering this vaccine, but maybe some people won't be comfortable with that sort of

federal overtake. so which do you think might be more effective? >> jason, i think you're right. it's the latter. we need to use the existing infrastructure. we've been able to do it before for other public health campaigns and make sure that primary care doctors, clinics, community health centers actually have the ability to access these vaccines. you can keep them in a deep freezer and then in a refrigerator for about five days and then outside of a fridge for six hours. and to your point, jason, we can use existing kind of supply chain companies that are already doing things right now to make sure you can find out, jason, when your amazon prime package comes to your doorstep, so that we can understand how to get vaccines to difficult communities, rural, tribal nations, territories, so many. and i think that's exactly what the incoming administration is planning to do. >> look, if i could get my vaccine when i go to subway, that would be a heck of a lot more efficient than me having to go to a local hospital. thank you, dr. patel and dr. hebert, thank you very much.

>> thank you. coming up, the morality of coronavirus relief being debated by some very unmoral people in washington. bishop william barber joins me next. >> tech: every customer has their own safelite story.

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the fine print of the new covid relief proposal. bishop william barber joins me next for your moral moment. and if you're 55 and up, switch to our essentials 55 plan and save 50% on your bill vs. the other guys. that's right, iphone 12 on us! holiday on with t-mobile. for members like martin. an air force veteran made of doing what's right, not what's easy. so when a hailstorm hit, usaa reached out before he could even inspect the damage. that's how you do it right. usaa insurance is made just the way martin's family needs it with hassle-free claims, he got paid before his neighbor even got started. because doing right by our members, that's what's right.

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if a picture tells 1,000 words, the images outside food banks all over america could write a novel on need. >> now due to the virus, you know, the money is not there. >> reporter: it's an ongoing pandemic, putting a crisis into focus. in miami people waiting on line for hours. >> if it weren't for these sites, would you be able to get food on the table? >> not really. >> as americans cry out for help and the pandemic grinds on, in washington there is new hope for another round of economic relief. one bipartisan proposal that is gaining support in the senate would be worth about $900 billion and include more supplemental employment payments as well as aid for businesses and local governments but no direct stimulus like the $1,200 checks that went out months ago. joining me now is bishop william

barber, co-chair of the poor people's campaign and author of "we are called to be a movement." thank you, bishop barber, for talking to me this morning. i read your op-ed in "the nation." it was compelling. it was moving. it was an open letter to a member of the senate. just tell our audience, what was your -- what was your motivation in writing that open letter and what were you hoping to get senator manchin as well as other senators right now to understand? >> well, jason, i know, for instance, one family that's lost 11 family members since mar, one young 18-year-old lady. >> jesus. >> and the reality is we've been talking about the biden/harris transition team ever since the election. there's a promise -- tomorrow, we're releasing a 14-point moral justice policy priorities, first 100 days for the healing of the nation. but here's the ugliness. corporations have gotten everything they wanted, jason.

billionaires have made billions in the midst of covid, but poor and low-income people and workers have been treated by mcconnell and republicans like they aren't essential but they are expendable. >> right. >> and to suggest that this compromise is a good thing is a bad thing, it's an immoral thing. it may be what they're going to do, but we can't celebrate it like it's great. the fact of the matter is it's far less than what's necessary. it doesn't deal with the issues. people who are dying -- we keep saying people who are dying, but many of the people who are dying, it's not just that people are dying, it's poor and low wealth people are dying in all races, black, white, brown, indigenous, it's low-income, low wealth people that are dying and they've watched corporations get everything. when it comes to poor and low wealth people, the cry of scarcity. now, i want you to imagine -- this is what i was trying to say to the senator. imagine that this disease was sweeping through and killing u.s. senators like it's killing

poor and low wealth people and ask yourself a question, america. if the response would be so pie piecemeal. >> right. >> and underfunded. and you can't. there would be no compromise. there would be no centrist position. that's what makes this so damnabel. they look paid sick medical leave and health insurance before covid. they lacked access to unemployment before covid and they lacked safe working conditions before covid. and after covid, they are being called essential on the one hand but being treated. >> expendable. >> like expendable on the other. it's immoral. >> bishop, i want to show you a stat right now of where covid relief money has gone so far. and you can see in this stat that, you know, a lot more money

has gone to business than has gone to individuals and families or even government agencies. which could include public hospitals, police officers, emergency techs and everything else like that. from a moral standpoint, what do these numbers -- they always say that your bank account shows your values. what does this graphic show us about the moral standing of the united states government right now? >> and about specifically mcconnell, trump and republicans. i never separate the two. it shows us clearly the love of money. it's the root of all evil. it shows us that there's a -- that we would rather put one person on the supreme court than protect thousands of people from being placed in caskets and on breathing machines. and it's even worse than that graph, jason. we know 84% of all the money in the first c.a.r.e.s. act went to corporation. it didn't go to those who need it the most. but mcconnell in this new proposal, if you go to the bottom, is pushing for a liability shield for businesses

to protect them against lawsuits from poor and low wage workers who become infected because the business didn't protect them. that's criminal. when you want to force people to work in covid-infested workplaces and then give the corporation the ability to be protected from suit because they didn't protect the people. >> you know, bishop, when i look at the numbers and you see that jared kushner, tom brady and kanye west can get hundreds of millions of dollars for their businesses, but the local person can't get anything, it's a reminder of the sort of the failings of this country. here's a question i think you're sort of uniquely capable of answering this. there are moral men and women, even on the republican side. i would say mitt romney seems like a moral godfearing man, but they fundamentally believe that charity should only come from individuals and not from the government. how do we break peek out ople o

that belief system? people that believe that there are people in need and you have an individual moral obligation to care for others but should not come from the government. is there any way to break that mind-set or the ideology? >> well, it's certainly not being moral or biblical. the biblical reality says that you care for your neighbor. the biblical morality, in the bible,i bible -- there is no way you can say i care about somebody individually but i don't care about changing the structures that are hurting people corporately. so, for instance, romney. he's now saying, you know, the centrist group. these are not centrist positions. first of all, the $900 billion is where mcconnell was months ago. he's not lost anything. these are not centrist positions. it's not compromise. it's capitulation. now, that may be the best they do, but we must demand they do more. we must demand they do not have this liability shield for businesses. and what we have to understand,

the true moral position would be equitable treatment, care, vaccines, resources for schools, food security, stimulus checks, child income credit, family income credit, disability income credits, direct payments for poor and low-income people and front line essential workers, cancelling rent, moratoriums on evictions and foreclosures and ensuring safe homes for the unhoused. if you do not do that, all of this individualistic morality is contrary to the bible, and guess what, j., it's contrary to the constitution because the constitution says we are to establish justice, and then the last part of it in the first four moral principles say we are to work for the common defense, the common defense and promote not individual welfare, but the general welfare. and that's the only way you can ensure domestic tranquility. >> bishop, domestic tyronn quillity is something this country has been lacking certainly when it comes to poor people all along.

thank you so much for speaking to us this morning. this is bishop william barber. thank you so much. >> god bless you, sir. >> more of the final "a.m. joy" after the break. [ twig snaps ] hey! stop! it's alright. friend. little girl is lost. i am taking her home. my name is captain kidd. captain. -captain. word is she's that captive out of wichita falls. how much you want for her? it's a child. it's not for sale. i wanna get you away from all this pain. [ grunting ] captain. get in the clear of it.

joe biden's very diverse new cabinet as he continues to fill key positions. we'll discuss what happens to the vacancies he may be creating in democratic strongholds. more "a.m. joy" after the break. but we didn't stop there. we made a cloud flexible enough to adapt to any size business. no matter what it does, or how it changes. and we kept going. so you only pay for what you use. because at dell technologies, we stop...at nothing. ♪ ♪ oh, oh, (announcer)®! ♪ once-weekly ozempic® is helping because at dell technologies, we stop...at nothing.

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look, i'm going to be announcing remaining 15 members of the cabinet. the first eight members are the most diverse cabinet anyone in american history has ever announced. i'm going to keep my commitment that the administration both in the white house and outside in the cabinet is going to look like the country. welcome back to "a.m. joy," i'm jason johnson. despite the all female white communications team and cabinet picks that currently only include two white men, an unheard of ratio, pressure is continuing to mount for president-elect joe biden to choose more diverse members to fill the twremaining posts. arrested some are already preparing to jump into the race for kamala harris's replacement.

in louisiana, representative said rick richmond is leaving his seat to be a senior adviser to the biden administration as names like marsha fudge, keisha lance bottoms get tossed into consideration, who will succeed them? joining us now is christina greer, associate professor, hawk, host of the global experience, elencia johnson, former consultant and democratic strategist nina smith. thank you all for joining me. and i'll start with you, niera, biden roll out a lot of his foreign policy team early on. blinken, all the great people who told these amazing stories. and it is a diverse group of people. but my concern when i saw this group is are they just going to sort of go back to the kind of policies that we saw under the

obama administration and clinton administration or are they really diverse ideologically? take us through given your past experience, are any of these people going to pull us out of wars, are they going to change sort of america's aggressive posture abroad or is it more of the same? >> two things on that, jason, particularly with the national security cabinet. they were all deeply rooted in their personal stories in their announcements and continuing that is key across board because what the biden administration is trying to show, how much each of these individuals brings to the table in terms of understanding the experiences of everyday americans. so talking about discrimination and understanding what it is to be a minority, as a holocaust viewer vifr, from tsurvey, and the bayou and she had to personally des sedeg gga segreg

local schools. and you almost called it the biden administration previously because vice president was deeply involved when it came tw afghanistan. and that is where there is daylight. michel michelle fornoy, there was daylight between her and how to handle the afghanistan drawdown. she wanted more troops and got that. and biden wanted at the time to be pulling out. so i think that he will surrounds himself with people who are able to be forward leaning and forward thinking, not just in terms of diversity, but also in terms of being able to think about the reality we have now, which has changed dramatically on the international front in the last four years. >> i hope i can eventually share your optimism. dr. greer, the next group of people that there has been a

tremendous amount of discussion about is bipartisan has an all women coms team, and they will be responsible for delivering his messages to different government agencies as well as the nation as a whole. because i'm familiar with several of these people, i say this a great and qualified group of people. what is the real significance? because there is also a skeptical part of me, oh, you're sticking all the women in communications, like on star trek just answering phones. how is this still a progressive move on the part of joe biden to have this collection talented of women taking over coms. >> and these women are far there answering phones. we talk about there is descriptive representation and then substantive representation. great thing about the democratic party is that there is great diverse ideological diversity going on. so we have these women that represent lgbtq+ americans, they represent children of

immigrants, geographic diversity, you name it, all of this female coms team. but when we look at the substantive representation, the great thing about what joe biden is doing is he is not just picking women for women 00 he sake, he is picking women who have years of experience in various sectors of the white house and presidential level politics where they actually can articulate a message and vision, something that we haven't seen in four years. sarah huckabee sanders, spicer, kayleigh, these were people growly incompetence and to be fair, their job is quite difficult because we have a president who is inarticulate, in-s incompetecompetent and doesn't . so we have women charged with disaccept nagt tseminatioaccept to the american public that we have not heard in four years. and so these women will actually be the conduit for not just information but a tone that joe

biden is setting, not just for american citizens, but you for the globe. and that is really important as we try to move forward and mend relationships with our allies and sort of figure out what we'll do with our adversaries. >> and i'm glad that you cleared that up because there are people who were skeptical about that and i wanted to hear that answer from a look, this a holistic and professional group of women who just map to be women. nina, speaking of relationships, you did coms for mayor pete and one of the stereotypes about any transition team is that, okay, all the people who got beat during the primary, they get some plush spot in the brand new administration. there your perspective and a lot of people suggested that mayor pete might be involved in something that has to do with foreign policy, what is it like to see a new administration get built. >> is there an expectation that former rivals from the primary will be a part of the new administration or are they sort of envisioning their own political futures regardless of what happens in washington, d.c.? >> i think a lot of times they

are envisioning their futures in and outside of washington. i think a lot of times this conversation, it is natural to think about people who were a part of the primary who held the national stage and are familiar to the american public. that is important and of course always a part of the conversation when you are building a new administration. this happened with hillary clinton and the obama administration and so on, so forth. so it is natural for that conversation to come up when you are building a new administration. i'll say that when it comes to at least at this moment, there are some complicating factors when thinking about some of the former presidential candidates. some hold current office, others don't like my former boss mayor pete, and so, you know, there is so much to consider when thinking about personnel both

from the diversity standpoint in terms of who, identity and who fills the role, and then their ideology and their approach to leadership once they get into the position. >> mayor pete and julian castro are available, i hope joe biden is listening. i want to talk about the succession process. one of the positions that we're hearing about now and james clyburn has been pushing for this, for marsha fudge to step up and be the new secretary of agriculture. if she leave, there will be a serious the fight for her congressional seat and we're hearing everything from local names like dennis kucinich and bashir jones on city council in cleveland and even nina turner may fight for her seat. as somebody who was a part of the warren campaign, the progressive left, is there a real belief that some of these seats as they open up are opportunities for the democratic left to take a former spot, or

is it the best bet to move into the new biden administration? >> well, i have to agree with congressman clyburn. i think my former national sorority sister marsha fudge would make a phenomenal secretary of agriculture. and you made a good point that there are a lot of people in her district as well as new orleans and so many others where is a majority black people that want log recei progressive policies and polys that will create the systemic change. and as we've seen, some folks rise up and challenge incumbents to get that change that they are working for. and so i think this is a great opportunity to see some young fresh black leadership because i think that it is critical that in both new orleans and cleveland where they are majority black cities that we have black representation, that you have someone young, fresh,

new idea, someone we may not have even heard of who is really ready to be bold on the issues that we need, bold in congress to be there to make this work for black americans, folks who carried biden over the line in 2020. >> so with that in mind, some be who carried biden over the line obviously was senator kamala harris who will isn't become vice president of the united states. and there is a huge, huge, huge question right now here in california as to what gavin newsom will do, who will he pick to replace senator harris. will it be karen bass, will it be barbara lee, will it be somebody else entirely. dr. greer, what are the kinds of things that gavin newsom will have to weigh when he decides to replace senator harris demographically and politically? >> i mean, we've talked about this quite a bit. again, going back to descriptive and substantive representation. there are many people who feel that gavin newsom as the

governor should replace kamala harris' seat with the black woman. that opens up karen bass, representative lee, many women who are sort of possibly lower level leaders, elected leaders throughout the state of california. some people argue that it should or could just be a woman of color, which opens up the conversation to the a.g. and what it means as far as the musical chairs that we've seen happen in other states as you elevate one person, seats become open and then everyone starts jockeying for various positions. and he also has to think about the future of the state. this is the largest state in the union. they have quite a few environmental issue, economical issues, to say nothing about the covid crisis and how you it is affecting them with small businesses and the overwhelm health and wealth of their state. so i don't envy him. you have someone who is super tar lent talented like mike tubs oig who

no longer be the mayor of stockton. does gavin knew system look at him for maybe a particular position? so he has quite a bit to think about. but i do think that the representation of a woman, a woman of color and possibly a black woman is of great importance in factoring who should replace senator/vice president-elect kamala harris. >> and niera, you were a deputy coms person. i want to ask you this on a much more personal level. what are the kinds of things that people are to take into consideration when they want to join a new administration? there is an assumption that, okay, biden got into office, trump is gone, everybody wants to go work with him. is that always the case, what kinds of things do you have to measure between do i want to keep doing my work here in texas or michigan, or do i want to go join the biden administration, what things are people wrestling with when these decisions come or when they get that call? >> well, there is certainly the

excitement of being able to make deep change. folks who work in policy and politics know this is a moment not just to go back to quote/unquote normal, but to course correct for things that have been wrong in america for many years. so disruptive moment is certainly very attractive to people who want to make change. and they are the people working on policy and politics to begin with. but there is a big difference between working on a campaign and working this government. and i will quote from hamilton, winning is easy, governing is harder. and that is the challenge as you see every single person in these top positions has decades of experience working in government and working around policy. and with communities and the intersection of all of these these cease. so especially with biden going back 40 years of his own experience and people feeling very closely connected with him, it will be difficult for the lo of new talent to break in in this moment. i think that there will be for new talent that is just getting

started out, a lot of opportunities to make a big change in the state and that is classic advice. you can be a big fish in a small pond or small fish in a big pond. and when any job opportunity presents itself, you have to evaluate what is going to be best for your personal career as well. >> nina, you had people like you, mya rupert, cokarine jean-pierre, and some still had racial problems. what does joe biden need to do to make sure that as he pits his administration together -- here is the thing. you can have all the black and brown faces that you want, all the members of the lgbtq+ community, but if the voices he listens to are still the same white guys, we didn't see change. so is there a critical number that biden needs to get to, a critical voice, what will real change look like in this administration in your

perspecti perspective? >> it will look like actual policy change in addition too who he surrounds himself with. you know, there has been some note that lot of his closest advisers are white males. so you know, that is a gap that in terms of perception that he will have to address. and the deeper issue is along the lines of who will meet the moment. we have a global pandemic that is ravaging primarily communities of color, black folks, brown folks. you have an administration that their policies have wrecked any progress that was made under the previous administration. so, you know, there are deep systemic issues here that are at play and it will be essential for biden to show that he independe understands that through the people surrounds himself with, not just communication shop but

in the cabinet positions critically hhs in particular during this global pandemic. and i believe the attorney general who heads up the justice department given what we saw this last summer with george floyd is also going to be a critical signal particularly to a lot of the black led and black movement organizations that he is listening to the demands coming from the streets and continue to do so to this day. so those pieces will indicate whether he is really listening and understands the moment that we're currently in. >> and before we go, i have to ask, this is really the most burning question of the day, please tell us who is the brilliant artist behind the artwork next to you as you are on the show today? i've heard there is this new artist out there named edris. >> yes, born actually on trump's election night and so it is a brand new day for him here in america and we're celebrating

with his arm wo artwork and you can dm me if you are interested. >> i love that so much. thank you so much. christina will be right back. thank you all. next up, the crown act, we're not talking about netflix, i'll tell you about it after the short break. er the short break. - [announcer] your typical vacuum has bristles that can leave cleaning gaps and wrap hair. so shark replaced them with flexible power fins to directly engage floors and dig deep into carpets. pick up more on every pass with no hair wrap. shark vertex with duoclean power fins. alice loves the scent of gain so much, she wished there was a way to make it last longer. say hello to your fairy godmother alice. and long-lasting gain scent beads. part of the irresistible scent collection from gain! so now that medicare annual enrollment is here, it's time for a plan

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. people are getting fired from job, girls sent home from school because they have braids. that is not okay. >> my hair has nothing to do with my education. >> so much of our bows are poli bodies are policed on an everyday basis. it is time to push back and say we're more than our hair. >> it is not just about hair and people shouldn't trivialize it. this is a national movement. we define professionalism both in school and work. >> earlier this week, broward county, florida became the

latest community to ban racially based hair discrimination in support of the c.r.o.w.n act that brings florida one step closer to joining the seven other states that have passed similar bans. it is a sign of hope that black americans will stop being punished for how our hair grows naturally. joining me now, dr. christina year, also ashley shelby rosette, and matthew a. cherry who won an oscar for "hair love." thank you all so much. i think this is an important discussion. even as a man who shaves his own hair, we have seen these kinds of battles over african-american hair not just with black women, but also black men. we saw all sorts of viral stories last year of high school stories being forced to cut off their locks and braids. ashley, i'll start but. a statistic is just infuriating to me.

that 80% of african-american women talk about how they had to change their natural hair in order to succeed or fell like they had to do to succeed in a job. you just did a study about this at duke university. what were some of the things that you found in your study? >> sure, so those statistics are definitely alarming. in our research, what we found was that when black women with straight hair -- when black hair were compared to -- black women with who -- i'm a little tongue tied here for some reason. >> that is okay. >> we found that we are comparing black women with natural hair to black women with straight hair or white women with curly or straight hair, that black women with natural hair were evaluated the most negatively, they were least likely to be selected for a job interview. in addition, because of that, or the reason why that actually occurred, is because they were per he seefed to be be less

professional and therefore less compete competent. when you combine what we found with many of the stories that you read about in the news, it really does suggest that black women when they are attempting to go and search for a job that they should be concerned about how they present themselves with regards to their hair style. it is not even remotely fair, but unfortunately, it is a reality. black women may feel that they need it straighten their hair so they can have a fair shot to get that job. and if they strongly identify with their hair, then that can equate to something that we call being asked to check our identity at the door to conform to mainstream expectations in order to make other people feel a little bit more comfortable. so on top of all the other anxieties that happen to occur when you are attempting to get a job, this is one additional layer that black women

unfortunately must be burdened with. now, we don't suggest and people who support "the crown" act don't suggest that this is an all encompassing solution, but it may help to lighten the burden a little bit. >> and ashley, i'll add, it is not just the emotional psychological burden, it is a financial burden to have to go and spend money and change how god put your hair on your head if you believe in that sort of thing. with that in mind, i want to go to you, dr. greer. listen to this clip from joy, the woman who started this show, talking about her experiences with her hair and i want to get your comments on the other side. >> i can remember going out on assignments, you know, going to temp agencies back when they had those things and being told because i had my hair in these beautiful braids that they wouldn't even send me out on jobs because they felt that it was not an appropriate hair style. and that i needed to straighten out my hair in order to be sent out for work. and this was blatant discrimination, it was perfectly legal back in the day.

because we didn't have anything like the c.r.o.w.n act to protect us. >> dr. greer, when you hear that sort of thing, have you had those kinds of experiences or do you think it differences because you are in academia and perhaps having natural hair in creative spaces is somewhat more accepted in the minds of white gatekeepers? >> absolutely not. the back drop of all this is white supremaciy and the overarching idea with is institutions. the academy is an institution. law firms, institutions. the medical community, institutions. the media, institutions. so when black women go into these spaces, i was told explicitly when i shaved my head in grad school, don't do that on the job market. i had an afro, don't do that on the are job market. then lock, then braids. i mean, the beautiful thing about black women, we have so much diversity, we can change colors and styles. but the white supremacist

institutions that we're trying to succeed in consistently remind us that something that happens naturally, something that brings us joy, something that makes you feel and look beautiful is not accepted or welcomed many of the times. so i don't think that there are many occupations that are immune you to this type of discrimination. we're seeing some progress in new york here, our human rights commissioner helped pass legislation to make sure women in the city of this morning weren't discriminated against, but we have a long way to go. win j when joy said back in the day, i think sadly back in the day in small tounsz and bwn and big ci just last week. and the work of matthew, yes, has helped move the ball forward, but there are still far too many people who see black women with natural hair styles and assume all of the negative that the deeb just laid out for us. >> so dr. greer, essentially the career advice is could you be a little less black. >> yeah, change everything and

you will be great. >> just be anything other than what you are. matthew, i as a fan of animation and your work, a huge fan of your work, of course ahair love went viral and blue ivy will be readings book. it is an amazing story that you put together. we'll play just a little clip and i want your comments on the other side about how significant hair is as a spiritual and cultural experience for black people. >> all right, here we go. first you want to moisturize the beautiful thick curls with leave in conditioner which will help detangle the kinks. and now put it in sections. you are doing an amazing job. yeah, you did it. that was so much fun.

i knew you could do it. >> i am under contractual obligation to never get misty eyed on air, so i'm holding back. but i love that clip so much. what inspired you to tell that story and what kind of reactions have you gotten from black women and men across america? >> you know, to echo the points that everybody on the panel is making, you know, our hair is you're personality, it is who we are as people, as individuals. and back in 2017 when we did the kick starter campaign for their love, it felt that there was a bit of avoid especially in animation. you know, you didn't see a lot of black representation in that space especially natural hair representation. it is a huge issue in hollywood especially with black actresses. a lot of times, you know, the sets aren't really set up for them to really thrive wearing

their natural hair. and sometimes they have to spend their own money off hours to get their hair done because the makeup artists and hairstylists aren't really prepared or are qualified to really do their hair in a real way. and so for us, this short film really was just about trying to get a lot more representation and showcase that little girls and dads are in their kids' lives and so we really just wanted to put something out there that showcased hair love, you know, quite literally. and the reactions have been incredible. i feel like every day i get tagged and images of, you know, little girls holding up the book and like oh, my god, she has my same hair style, same thing with the short film. and dads really get involved now. and doing their daughter's hair. it is not a new thing, but just really making it normal. and showcasing that, you know,

everybody is -- hair is such a communal situation. and we all need to be involved and i think the more that you see people like tracee ellis ross, so many mainstream talent that are embracing their natural hair and being on these tv shows and movies, it only makes it that much more mainstream. >> maybe just even eight to ten years ago, came writtreenkarine hair might have seemed radical. and if someone feels like they are being discriminated against because of their hair, what kind of things would the c.r.o.w.n act be able to do. >> sure, education such that they know, and recourse, namely that currently companies in more than 40 different states can at will let someone go because of their hair style. so the c.r.o.w.n act serves to

educate. educate yourself about what your company policy is, and know what the content of the c.r.o.w.n act and the reasons behind the oig c.r.o.w.n act. >> thank you all very much. and coming up, how gaming may save your life. fe ♪ you're still the one ♪ that i love to touch ♪ still the one ♪ and i can't get enough ♪ we're still having fun, ♪ and you're still the one applebee's 2 for $20. now that's eating good in the neighborhood. [phone rings] "sore throat pain? try new vicks vapocool drops in honey lemon chill for a fast-acting rush of relief like you've never tasted in... ♪ honey lemon ahh woo vicks vapocool drops now in honey lemon chill ...this one's for you. you inspired us to make your humira experience even better... with humira citrate-free.

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. you guys can call me aoc. mike pence can't call me aoc, but you can. i'm going to get imposter. >> is there a way to -- >> oh, yes. >> that is not -- >> i didn't even he know i recorded myself. ma'am, ma'am! i can't kill poky, she's so nice. >> are you safe, ma'am? >> i think i have to do it. >> aoc's bold outreach to gamers

comes as gaming sky rockets. millions have watched her live stream of a popular game of man manipulation called among us. and she used to raise $200,000 for covid relief. doing more mitch mcconnell. a strong sign that gaming is not just for 27-year-old guys locked in their mom's basements anymore. joining me now, noah smith, and erin ashley simon. thank you both. i'll start with you, noah. we have video here of ilhan omar and aoc playing games together. i want to get your comments on the other side about how this is affecting how politics and gaming come together. >> i think it is -- >> continuing alex. >> no, the doors were locked.

>> i'm voting ihan, but i don't know. >> the way she was like where with are you. >> we're about to find out. >> oh, my god! >> i remember back in the days of like g 4 tv where that was the only time you got to see this sort of action. what do you think is the motivation behind these politicians sharing their games experiences? obviously they are gamer, but now they are using it a way to communicate with people. is it effective or just natural outgrowth of being trapped in a pandemic? >> thanks for having me on the program. i think the numbers speak for themselves. you are talking about 5 million people viewed aoc's first video before the election and having that kind of reach. and also it is unfiltered reach.

they can talk right to her fans, no middle man. and the ruts sort of speak for themselves. there was a tufts study that showed as much of a 14% increase in voters 18 to 29. so i think that looking at that and the shear power of this medium. and as everyone knows, aoc is authentic. she is a gamer. so i think'sing t seeing the grd the cost is free, just essentially had to buy a web cam. so just having that ability to speak to folks is somewhat unparalleled right now especially younger people. >> erin, one thing that i've noticed is when we didn't know if covid was going to end all sports, you saw an explosion in esports. i saw nba players playing basketball, you have the guy who moved from ins nascar to having his own nascar. they have like the esports championship. do you think people are now

saying, you know what, i can watch esports as much as i watch live human sports or do you think that they are parallel or i sports is growing faster than our desire to watch real people compete? >> i think esports has been growing in terms of main treatment's attention towards it, but i think during this time it expedited because a lot of the mainstream media companies, they didn't have official sports to fill the slots. so esports, it was really toward the time where you saw league of legends and everything going on there. and so these mainstream media companies had to fill the time slot. and i think it helps to show that broadcasts for esports as whole isn't just people sitting at a desk and playing games. there is a lot more to it. so i think that there is increased new found respect as well as we're starting to see the convergence of pop culture, the convergence of nonendemic people and brands entering into the esports space.

so it is growing very fast. and i think during this time, a lot of people had more opportunities to just sit down and watch it and a lot of people were amazed to see just how much work goes on behind the scenes when it comes to competitive gaming. >> and i think that is what is key also, as people are home together -- look, i remember a couple years ago i would watch my students play five nights at freddies, now i watch other things on youtube. there is a visual community experience that we're seeing with game. are you seeing when it comes to esports that people who traditionally didn't care about video games at all are becoming interested because of esports or do you think that it is just sort of everybody is moving to it because again we're sheltering in place? >> i think that people are interested for various different reasons. one, there is the glitz and glamg glam of esports. or they see that these pro players that are receiving -- some are receive g 1 1 oo$,000,

some millions, i think we're in the process of seeing the generational fan docdom the samy you see it in professional sports. we're seeing the generational fandom within esports. so you have kids and people around my age who are watching this and talking to people about it and it is grabbing people's attention because with the quarantine, everyone being at home, they had more time to check it out. but i think that the difficulty that we're seeing within esports is that we're having a lot of eyes, a lot of attention, but how do we retain those people who don't feel like gamers or hardcore fans of esports. and so we're seeing not only increased attention and focus, but also the communities figuring out how can we creative some off lfal the casual conteno bring more people into the scene. >> i say this has somebody who has had a ps 4 that i got for my

birthday in march and i haven't even opened it up. i have a retro gaming system. which goes to my question to you, noah, there are concerns just like with other issues at home, people getting a lack of exercise, people not getting out, people dealing with depression. of course it is more and more people playing games at home, there are sti copsychologists a organizations that say this could be turning into an addiction and can lead them not to aoc and ilhan omar, but to crazy white nationalist groups. how do we make sure that this rise in esports and e-gaming keeps people healthy and engaged and not down a rabbit hot of danger and isolation? >> it is a glats question but no easy answer. there are countless examples that i've had where they met somebody on line and that has become a close personal friend. within example is unfortunately

a young person had passed away, someone met online, came to his funeral. there was also people who never met coming to each other's weddings being the best man at their wedding. so certainly it is possible to make meaningful connections online. it is competitive, you are on the same team, shared sense of pump. so on the one hand it is definitely responsible and very often is the case that people form healthy relationships, they are communicating, it is just over a video game or skype or zoom. and there is just balance. if someone is playing a video game 20 hours a day, it is probably good for them to get outside. others say that you can play but also be in good shape. and so stereotypes are no longer relevant. there are gamers who do have balance and are in good shape. and so i think it is a great question just like anything

else, it comes down to balance. and there is one other thing i do want to say is good toxicity in video games. and that is something that the industry has a long way to go towards. still if you go online, if you are a minority, women, and even if you are just not so good at the game, you can get a lot of flack and that creates negative experiences and something that they need to be held accountable for because it is totally unacceptable. >> that is true. moderating the racism and sex inch and homophobic nonsense that is thrown around as just talking in games makes some people nervous about joining in. thank you both so much for this amazing conversation. go out there and buy a video game system, it is safer than being outdoors. more "a.m. joy" after the break. "a.m. joy" after the break. in flings, their laundry smells more amazing than ever. uh, honey? isn't that the dog's towel?

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the time has come after nearly five years, the last segment of "a.m. joy" has arrived. the person who has hosted this show other than more than joy herself the great jonathan capehart joins me next. nathan capehart joins me next ♪ ♪

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hiya! introducing mywalgreens. join for 30-minute pickup at walgreens.com so why wait to screen for colon cancer? because when caught in early stages, it's more treatable. i'm cologuard. i'm noninvasive and detect altered dna in your stool to find 92% of colon cancers even in early stages. tell me more. it's for people 45 plus at average risk for colon cancer, not high risk. false positive and negative results may occur. ask your prescriber or an online prescriber if cologuard is right for you. i'll do it. good plan. i appreciate what you shared, but you didn't really address some of the things that the president himself has done. look, a lot of people of color, and a lot of american citizens are tuning into this program right now. this is your chance to make a sound argument on why they who listen to you and support a

president who has failed on a lot of levels. >> in terms of what joe biden is considering, is there any advice you would like to give him in terms of how you made the choice to pick the best person to be your running mate? >> talk a little bit about the unemployment numbers we're seeing for the very first time, we're seeing people standing in food lines across socioeconomics and the paycheck makes no difference. what are you doing right now to ensure that the american people try to get back on track? >> i'm trying to understand how someone of your stature and career, what happened to you, mayor giuliani? >> back in july, joy reid made history when she became the first black woman to become full-time an tore of a primetime news show. since her departure, she's had an amazing lineup of guest hosts. and i'm lucky to be among them. and you will have two familiar faces every weekend starting

next week as tiffany cross and jonathan capehart officially debut their new shows. joining me now to discuss his new show is jonathan capepart. you are the guest dressed guy on tv. i want everyone to understand how significant this is. you have a very long and storied relationship with the nbc network. and i'll throw up a clip right now to just are sort of embarrass you and get your comments on the other side. >> oh, my gosh. >> yes. >> yes, look at that, class of 69 ka'69 kat69 '69, i think? wow. >> yes, we had to make sure that we threw in some throwback jonathan capehart here. my first experience with you was

you criticizing something that i wrote during ferguson. and i remember being -- i was like okay, who is this guy capehart, what is he saying? i a alwalways appreciated the f that you were sincere and consistent. and i think that distinguishes you. so with the new show debuting next week, what do you want with people to get out of the new jonathan capehart experience? >> well, since we're going to be on sunday between 10:00 and noon, we are going to be joining the sunday show circuit. that is the way i'm looking at it. and i'm looking to bring to the msnbc audience and to the largest audience that wants to come in, a different kind of sunday show. you know, the team, the "a.m. joy" team which is fantastic, have been doing a sunday show for years now. and now we get a chance to

really lean into it between 10:00 and noon. the way i've always looked at particularly on sunday when i was guest hosting "a.m. joy," i looked at the audience as being people who know what the news is. these are folks who are news junkies, political junkies, so they know what the news is. but they come to msnbc between 10:00 and noon because know they want to know the context. what does this news mean, how does it fit into the larger story, the larger national conversation. why should i care. and then at a minimum, give me arguments and ways to talk about these issues where i can talk to my friends about it or argue with my relatives who are on the other side of the political divide. so that what i'm looking forward to doing on a more permanent basis on sunday. >> and with that in mind, what you probably envision for this opportunity, announcement just came out this week, but i'm sure

in there is something you envisioned for a long time. do you think your show will have a different toeb because now we'll have a president biden instead of president trump? is it going to change at all now that you have a new administration that is not vehemently hostile and white supremacist? >> sure. look, the whole point of a news show and particularly this show that will be done on sundays is to talk about what is going on and toccountable, whether it is the outgoing trump administration or the incoming biden/harris administration. and i would argue that the biden/harris administration would welcome that. they are coming into office to do right by the american people. they know they won't get it right all the time, they know that there will be mishaps and missteps, but their hearts and minds and policies will be going to be in the right place. my job and our job between 10:00

and noon is to talk about what they are doing, hold them accountable when they get things wrong, but also laud them when they are doing things that are right for the american people but are being held up by republicans either in the house or in particular the senate side. so i don't view my job as an anchor changing depending on who the president is. but certainly depending who the president is will determine the emphasis we give to certain stories. >> so i'm going to lay this out now. this is part of my gift to you for the new show. you've interviewed president obama recently, you've had access to hundreds of people throughout your career. and in the first month of your brand new show on sunday, who would be a dream guest? we're throwing it out there, we want them to be watching, who is a dream guest for jonathan capehart to get say in the first month of the show. >> well, i mean, yeah, i've already had president obama who is always on everybody's wish list.

and i thank him for that. obviously i would love to talk to former first lady michelle obama because she was a former first ladies, but she too is a lawyer. she too has a point of view and thoughts about what is going on in this country. it would be great to sit down and talk with her. of course it would be great to talk to president joe biden and vice president kamala harris. but i also would like to talk to the first second gentleman, to doug emhoff, what it will be like for him in a history making role. first man to be second gentleman of the united states. but also the first jewish american to rise to those heights. what must it be like for him and them to be in such historic posts. those are the names that come to mind at the outset in terms of politi politics. but i also want to point out in terms of wish lists, and i know this will be tough for the

audience are to to hear, but being in the sunday show space, i do want to talk to republicans. i do want to talk to people on the other side who want to do the right thing by the american people. but also keep in mind as i did with rudy giuliani on a mchl joy oig a few months ago, i won't put up with any foolish areness. you won't come on my air in those hours and try to convince me that two plus two equals five. but if you come on the show and you want to have a real conversation about how do we move -- how do we govern this country and how do we move forward, not try to convince each other that the other is right, but to convince each other that here is the way forward and here is how we can get there together. because americans are dying because of an unup checked coronavirus pandemic. americans are hungry and starving because they can't go to work because of an you be uncontrolled pandemic. and they need help and they need

assistance. that is just one of a myriad of things that the biden hair writ harris administration will have to get done and it will have to get it done with republican help. >> this is hugh you know that i don't know than capehart is a real news name. i asked him for fantasy guests and he said michelle obama, kamala harris, joe biden, i probably would have he had santa claus or kevin kwanzaa. thank you, jonathan capepart. that is our final show for "a.m. joy." although we go until the end of the road, i can't let for now stay tuned for alex witt, her guests will include dan rather. r guests will includ dan rather we made usaa insurance for members like martin. an air force veteran made of doing what's right, not what's easy. so when a hailstorm hit, usaa reached out before he could even inspect the damage.

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a very good day, everyone. high noon here in the east. 9:00 a.m. out west. welcome to weekends with alex wi witt. with 45 days left in the presidency of president trump, we begin there with rage and denial, that is how the "new york times" is describing president trump's final weeks in office. that headline on full display last night at a rally for george's senate runoff election which turned into more of a public airing of grievances for the president. this morning the republican secretary of state in georgia setting the record straight.

>> at the end of the day, what they are really trying to say, that if they did that, it will nullify the will of the people. if you look being at how the election turned out here, president trump got 10% less votes in cherokee county which is a rich red county, this election cycle. white field county, less than 4.5%. so at the end of the day, the voice of the people was spoken. i'm disappointed as a conservative republican also. >> and mixed messaging today from the president's allies on capitol hill, a growing number of republicans accepting the reality joe biden's victory as many remain publicly in denial. >> joe biden's victory has been certified in states totaling 279 electoral votes. do you now accept that he is president-elect? >> well, we've got a process that i think we've been going through since the election. and it will play itself out. >> the president in effect has concedn