hi there, everyone. it's 4:00 in the east. with new records being set every single day for hospitalizations and death from coronavirus the vaccine is our best hope that this is the last holiday season we will endure largely in isolation and fear. today throughout the day a steady stream of images some of this country's top federal officials, people like vice president mike pence getting their vaccines publicly to inspire confidence. house speaker nancy pelosi and senate majority leader mitch mcconnell affirming today their confidence in the vaccine by getting it ethemselves. news president-elect joe biden and the incoming first lady dr. jill biden will receive their

vaccination on monday and that the united states supreme court justices are all being offered doses of the vaccine as well. signs of hope that finally, finally the end to our nation's suffering is within reach. so the news out today that the vaccine supplies are sitting in warehouses and that states are receiving a fraction of the supply of vaccine doses they were promised threatens to shatter both our sense of safety and hope. "the new york times" reporting, quote, in oregon state health officials said they were told they were only scheduled to get about 25,000 doses of the vaccine next week. significantly less than the nearly 41,000 doses the state received this week. iowa's health department issued a similar release saying they were told, quote, they will not receive the volume of vaccine initially anticipated and that their shipment would be as much as 30% less than what they received this week. governor jay inslee spoke out

about the inability to plan for his state's rollout by saying, quote, the cdc has informed us that washington state's vaccine allocation will be cut by 40% next week and that all states are seeing similar cuts. this is disruptive and frustrating. we need accurate, predictable numbers to plan and ensure on the ground success. no explanation was given. and the confusion is even greater when you consider this statement from the vaccine maker, pfizer. they said this, quote, we have millions more doses sitting in our warehouse but as of now we've not received any shipment instructions for additional doses. what? how is that possible? we are the country that is doing among the worst in the developed world in terms of the number of infections and deaths. and now it would appear that of the countries that have approved vaccines we are the first known to have doses just sitting in warehouses. but the chaos has a source. and that source is very likely donald trump and his white

house. donald trump is also sowing chaos around the stimulus package nearing approval on capitol hill. "the washington post" reports, quote, on a phone call thursday afternoon trump told allies that he believed stimulus payments in the next relief package should be at least $1,200 per person and possibly as big as $2,000 per person. officials said congressional leadership is preparing a stimulus package that would provide checks of $600 per person. trump was in the middle of formally drafting his demand for the larger payments when white house officials told him that doing so would imperil delicate negotiations over the economic relief package. government funding which right now is tied to the relief bill is set to expire midnight tonight if a deal can't be reached. donald trump, the chaos president, is disrupter in chief is where we start today. msnbc political analyst robert gibbs is here, former white

house press secretary under president obama. also joining us dr. michael anderson, critical care physician, health care executive and disaster care consultant. and msnbc contributor laurie garret. laurie garret, what do you know? what's going on? how can there be vaccines sitting in warehouses without being preallocated? >> well, this is complicated because we've only been a week of unloading pfizer vaccine to begin with and then a nor'easter hits. and right from the very beginning fedex, ups were warning they were going to have disruptions in their abilities to keep pace with just routine christmas deliveries much less the pfizer vaccine because of airport closures and the nor'easter. now you add to that apparently general pernum who's the ceo of operation warp speed made a decision to set a fair amount of the vaccine off in reserve in

case any of these planes that did try to get through the storm crashed or had disruption in their ability to deliver on time. so much of the dosage was actually set aside and preserved, and that's why states got orders they were going to receive far less than they expected. but the real problem with all this, nicolle, is that each time there's a disruption even if it seems apparently to be relatively legitimate in source and reason and rationale, it undermines the credibility of the entire effort at a time when we have real concerns about public acceptance of vaccination and willingness to go along. and it underscores another key problem. neither moderna, which had its hearings that were concluded 20-0 with one abstention, approval for their new

vaccine -- nor pfizer have agreed to meet their original production quotas with the united states on the original timetables laid out in the summer. both have indicated they're probably going to come in later with fewer doses than originally expected because there are real production issues, real supply issues on basic raw ingredients that go into making these complicated rna vaccines. >> you know, laurie, just to follow up you hit the -- i think the political issue on the head. we have a country that is i think director osterholm calls it not pandemic fatigue but pandemic rage. we have a country that is not known for its patience, a young and impatient country. really pressing against the few things that we can do to protect ourselves. and for all americans there is great hope in the vaccine, and i

think your point about competence and trust is central. is there a -- i mean just from where you sit are there examples of other countries communicating more clearly and more coherently about what's going wrong in distribution? >> well, the u.k. is running up against problems as well. they've just zroved a new mutant strain of the virus is circulating in the south eastern part of the united kingdom. and it appears to be a mutant that gives the virus the capacity to spread more readily. it doesn't seem to make it anymore lethal or dangerous, but it does seem to coincide with more rapid spread that's being experienced in the u.k. and they think it may be a break through mutation that is the result of so much virus circulating so widely in an uncontrolled epidemic in that country that a lot of people acquired immunity because of exposure and now the virus is breaking through around that

immunity. i don't think we can point to a country and say those guys are doing their vaccine rollout perfectly. i think what's much more important to ask is all day today the national academy of science convened a meeting on how do we establish trust in our vaccine programs? how do we get the public to believe that everybody's trying to do the right thing and that the product is safe to use and it will work? and currently we don't have the right kinds of messaging going out, and we're not acting in a way that makes all of this clear. if everything about this lower dosage supply to states boils down to preparation for the nor'easter and disruptions in the northeast corridor due to snowfall, that should have been said, right? you know the general should have issued a statement. the states should have been led to understand. we need clear messaging, clear absolute trance parent messaging because each failure to be clear

about why something's not going smoothly results in more distress in the public. and people leap to their preconceived political notions, you know, red state, blue state whatever it may be and start accusing and reaching conclusions that may be completely wrong. >> you know, i mean dr. anderson, i think laurie's become not only the preeminent science reporter we turn to but quite a political analyst and someone who understands this political climate. and from where you sit, i mean, when people are sick, if their parents are sick or child is sick they don't give a hoot what your political affiliation is. people just want their families to we safe, to be healthy and they want them to be protected. how do you address both snafus if you want to call it that. it sounds like it's a known unknown why these vaccine supplies and shipments are sitting in a warehouse and not going to the states as the

states had expected them to go as well as the -- i won't call it lack of trust -- but questions and skepticism about the safety of the vaccine. >> i come back to something you said and laurie said. you used a word that's really important, and that is hope. hope is on the way. the amazing time from learning about this virus to having an mrna vaccine from two companies is an incredible time line. so hope is here. you also said it, how do we get back to normal? how do we have normal holidays and normal celebrations? so hope is here. but laurie also said it. we are a divided nation, a distrustful nation, and quite frankly it brings warmth to my heart when i see leaders who are getting the vaccine who say i don't care about red, i don't care about blue. we know that this vaccine is safe. we know that the companies have been meticulous in how they've studied. now we've got to figure out how to get the message out. you know, we're in this

together. the other message is a little less hopeful and that is it's still a long winter ahead. the vaccine is coming. i believe we'll get over these logistics, but you can't let your guard down that the intensive care units across this country in the rafters, you know, truckload after truckload of vaccine is shipping, and we'll figure that out, but we can't let our guard down going into this winter. >> robert gibbs, i want to hit you with both of these. let me start with the politic and the trust issues around the vaccine first. i'm going to say two names i don't often utter on this program -- tucker carlson and chris christie. tucker carlson still has a very large audience on fox news, and he's articulating a lot of vaccine skepticism. chris christie understanding that maybe red states and people that supported donald trump are still resistant to wearing a mask. let me show you some of an ad that he released this week. >> this message isn't for everyone. it's for all those people who

refuse to wear a mask. you know, lie in isolation in icu for seven days i thought about how wrong i was to remove my plask at the white house. today i think about how wrong it is to let mask wearing divide us especially as we now know your choice is likely to get covid-19 if you don't wear a mask. because if you dent do the right thing we could all end up on the wrong side of history. please wear a mask. >> robert gibbs, i am in harsh and strong disagreement with crist christie on the question of his support for donald trump, but i think joe biden is clearly looking for partners with credibility in the tucker carlson viewing world to help him vaccinate the country. what do you think of that message and the messenger? >> bravo to that message and that messenger. and i think, nicolle, we need far more of it. look, i was heartened to see vice president pence and the

surgeon general get the vaccine publicly and on television. i'm excited to see president-elect and dr. biden get it. on monday i think we need to have athletes get it and nascar drivers get it. and quite frankly anybody with a following, anybody that is an influencer of some sort needs to preach the message that governor christie is preaching about being vigilant. this has been a tale of two cities week. we see these great pick dhrz and the hope of the vaccine coupled with a record number of new cases yesterday. nearly 7,000 people dead in two days and a record of that. and a record number of hospitalizations climbing. everyone has to get onboard with the public health messaging and i can't agree more with the clarity of this. reading some of those articles about the vaccine potentially just sitting in a warehouse i felt like i was listening to a conference call where the government says, well, if this vaccine is sitting there, we

need to know about it and the company is saying the vaccine is sitting here and we need to know what to do about it. that clarity has to get figured out. that clarity needs to be communicated because, look, we not only have significant trust issues around sort of the vaccine as we know it and mask wearing, but think about some of the generational issues we're going to have to overcome in some of the populations in our country. we tested vaccines on black americans for generations. it is understandable when you look at research it's about 50-50 in some earlier polling whether black americans were going to get vaccinated. we need public examples, clear public messaging on this to overcome generations of hurdles to getting this country vaccinated and on the path to safety and normalcy. >> you and i have been on the same kind of conference calls, because when you read these stories you have that feeling -- and it usually falls to

communicators to make these points when you work in the federal government, this reeks of incompetence, it reeks of bureaucracy. and i wonder what your degree of confidence is in the last 30 days the trump coronavirus task force, which has been undermined by the president of united states, which has been left to languish with a focus in that white house around overturning that election trump lost and a transition that is delayed by donald trump's refusal to concede. what is your confidence that the next round of calls will be more productive and more competently executed? >> well, look, i don't have a lot of faith not shockingly in the current occupant of the white house. nicolle, imagine where we would be in this virus if chris christie's video had been done by donald trump in march? where would we be, right? my guess is we'd all be making holiday plans.

we'd all be thinking about getting around the table with our friends and family and celebrating in a far different way than we are celebrating. i do have good faith in the logistics of the military moving this out. i do have great hope in watching a partnership between government and companies create in record time a vaccine. i am hopeful that the politics can get out of the way or at least it can get coordinated in a sense that we are all rolling in the same direction. but, boy, you know, had donald trump -- maybe had he stood on the top of the steps at the white house after coming back from walter reed delivered through the greatest health care in the world and filmed on video about wearing a mask i doubt we'd be on this show talking about a record number of new cases and a record number of hospitalizations. it is an opportunity missed. we can all remind ourselves it did not have to be this way, but

now we can get this right. >> laurie, robert gibbs' words hit me like a ton of bricks. everyone who's been doing what we've been asked to stay home and not travel, feels that pain what could have been. if donald trump had been an advocate of public mask wearing and social distancing and not being a vector for them, i wonder what you make of the biden team's warning about too much optimism and hope around the vaccine time lines. they're saying it might not be until late summer or early fall before the vaccine begins to be widely available to the general public. is biden's additional messaging challenge going to be to call for more patience? >> well, of course it is, nicolle, and he's right. and here's the thing. the national association of governors -- the national

governors association, excuse me, said november 25th we need $8 billion to be able to rollout a vaccine on a massive scale to the entire population of the united states. because you put the full burden of response to this epidemic on the states all this time, and now you're turning around and telling us we're in charge of disseminating vaccine and we don't have any spare human beings. we don't have any extra employees waiting for something to do so they can now be involved in vaccine efforts. and the response from the federal government this week was, hey, good news the cdc is dispersing $227 million to the states. 8 billion, 227 million, that's a bit of a difference. when you go down to the local level and ask how is this all going to get out the door, putting aside whether the vaccine is going to get produced at scale in a timely fashion, which i have a great deal of cepticism, you have to ask can the states actually execute the

dispersal especially in rural areas, especially in already highly underserved communities. if you're out in the navajo nation spread out over three states where it could be a 100 mile drive to get to drugstore do you think they're going to have the vaccine to all the navajo nation by august? go guam, puerto rico, rural iowa and you can begin to get a sense of the scale what we're trying to accomplish. and here's another one, a curve ball to throw your way, nicolle. each time we have an outage whether it's due to weather or some other political machinations in the delivery of vaccine, we may interrupt the timetable for boosters. so individuals who are supposed to get their booster in 21 days might not get it until 40 days. well, does that work? we don't know.

all we know is what's been done in clinical trials which was 21 days. and in the case of moderna, 28 days. so we're playing with fire. and each time we play with fire we have the potential of undermining public trust. >> dr. anderson, i want to give you the last word. these first doses, the ones that came in large undercounts for the states we're expecting were all four front line health care workers who have bore the brunt of this. the populations laurie has articulated have been hit the hardest, but it's the front line workers who have risked their own lives, their families health, their families lives. so it is their doses that came up short. what are your thoughts about how our country's doctors and nurses and hospital workers are doing and how this news lands among them? they had an expectation and they were promised this first round, and it's already coming up short. >> you know, they're not doing

well. there are doctors and physicians and respiratory therapists and nurses and support staff that for a year have had just been at war. and now whether it's the second wave or the third wave, whatever you call it, now the icus are flooded again, and it's horrible hospitals are ordering more body bags. the personal toll first and foremost is on the family that suffers the lost. but death after death and loss after loss is really wearing on the medical community. and we know the mental health crisis is something we're really going to have to tackle. so i was actually heartened when you see not only the pictures -- and i would agree with the notion that having leaders and what mr. gibbs said is spot on, having people with followings is really important. i think it was really great on social media. my friends and my colleagues getting the vaccine, the smiles on their faces were just so --

like hope's here. however when they see people gathering and when they think it's over -- hope is here. we've got a lot to get through, but please remember that very fragile health care structure right now when you think about gathering or think of letting your guard down because you just can't. >> dr. anderson it's great to have you back, robert gibbs, and laurie garret, the human truth seeking missile we're always glad to have you. up next for us the chaotic transfer of power after the pentagon says it's taking a break from working with the biden transition team, yet the incoming administration says there was no break they agreed to. the dangerousales of this comes km as the nation is hit with a massive attack, a security breach that stretches throughout the federal government. former director of the cia, john brennen, will join us. and donald trump leaves washington in just a couple of weeks. new reporting today shows he'll

take with him a huge pile of cash with free rein how to spend it. and a refreshing look at the new first couple, the ones moving into the white house very, very soon. all those stories when "deadline white house" continues after a quick break. don't go anywhere. after a quick break. don't go anywhere. at acute, nonk muscle and joint pain with topical nsaids first. a formulation they recommend can be found in salonpas. a formulation they recommend can be found in salonpas. salonpas. it's good medicine. hisamitsu. ...this one's for you. you inspired us to make your humira experience even better... with humira citrate-free. it has the same effectiveness you know and trust, but we removed the citrate buffers, there's less liquid, and a thinner needle... with less pain immediately following injection. ask your doctor about humira citrate-free. and you can use your co-pay card to pay as little as $5 a month. humira can lower your ability to fight infections. serious and sometimes fatal infections,...

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♪ on the third day of croodsmas my neighbor gave to me ♪ usaa. what you're made of, we're made for. ♪ three.♪. dun, dun, duns. ♪ 2 shrieking girls ♪ and a... whoa, peanut toe. ♪ in a pack of croodaceous families ♪ go to watchcroods.com. we are monitoring some startling national security developments today out of washington. president-elect joe biden's team is striking down the acting pentagon chief's claim that an apparent halt in their transition process that the defense department was some sort

of mutually agreed upon holiday break. biden's transition director telling reporters today that the appropriate level of concern that this is not normal said this, quote, there was no mutually agreed upon holiday break. in fact, we think it's important that briefingings and other engagements continue during this period as there's no time to spare. and that is particularly true in the aftermath of the aser entertainment delay. there have been pockets of recalcitrants and the dod is one of them. the potentially damaging dispute comes at an incredibly precarious time. we continue to learn the extent this week of a months long cyber attack most likely carried out by russia, and it could be the worst one ervin the united states. as trump continues to resist criticizing russia, remaining silent on the topic and putting a lot on the plate of the new president who will be sworn in 33 days from now. joining us now, nbc news senior security analyst, former cia director john brennen.

first director brennen, on this pentagon news the miscalculation that somehow the biden team was going to carry on their lie about a holiday break, i've been involved in two transitions. there's no holiday break when it's a transition to the new president. what do you think they're covering up? >> oh, my goodness. i have no idea, but you're absolutely right there should be no holiday break particularly given recent events and news about the hacking of government computer networks. i was in the intelligence transition effort for the president obama group that was coming in 2008, 2009. and the cia that i work with and the intelligence community we worked day in and day out to make sure there was going to be that smooth transition. i think it's mind-boggling the department of defense would stop these engagements at such a critical time. >> especially considering the cast of characters over there. i want to turn to that cyber

attack because i believe it was four years ago this week that you were part of the obama national security team that worked to put sanctions on russia in place for their attack on the 2016 election. obviously donald trump reacting very differently to the cyber attack. it reaches across the executive branch of government, but i want to show you how president-elect biden responded last night in an interview. >> they'll be held accountable. individuals as well as entities will be find there's financial reparations for what they did. and we have to invest a lot more money in cyber. we have to invest a lot more money with dealing with the ability to respond as well as the ability to protect both private and public entities. and we haven't made that commitment. we will in my administration. >> so director brennen, there was no breaking news alert that

went out after he said that, but it shouldn't go unnoticed that no one has said these words about russia in four years. quote, they'll be held accountable. no one's held russia accountable in four years. what do you think the policy process right now is around russia and around this attack for the incoming team? >> i think it's clear the professionals within the intelligence community and the national security environment are hesitant to bring news about russian nefarious activities to donald trump given donald trump's decision to protect vladimir putin and the russians. you're actually right, it was four years ago when the obama administration decided to impose sanctions and also to throw out of the country three dozen russian diplomats. these are the types of actions that can be taken against the russians. yes, this was an espionage activity. yes, it was something, you know, in a lot of countries and intelligence service engage in. but when you get caught you have to pay a price. when we got caught in the past

we had to pay a price, and the magnitude of this demands that a president of the united states and the national security team focus like a laser on this to find out what happened, try to stem the bleeding and then take appropriate action against the perpetrators. >> you know, there's some analysis out there that trump is doing this on purpose to leave a bigger mess for joe biden. but i think that gets two things wrong, one trump is strategic, and two, there's anything extra you have to do to make a mess with u.s.-russian relations. but i wonder from the russian perspective what should we prepare for? obviously they caught us unprepared. there's reporting this cyber attack has been underway for many, many months undetected. what are your concerns about how far russia may have come over the last four years with the president totally subserveiant to their policy aims? >> well, the russians and particularly the sbr which is the rough cia equivalent for russia, they have very, very

sophisticated cyber capabilities. and the fact they've been in on these networks both in the government as well as the private sector for what could be 7 or 8 months, professionals right now in the cyber security environment and u.s. government have a world of work to do. find out what networks were accessed by the russians, what information might have been extracted, how they actually got this information and this malware into the system. it seems as though it was part of a commercial software update that was then propagated through the government as well as private sector. do the russians have a private source in that company able to integrate that malway into the updates? so there's a lot of forensic work that needs to be done in order to understand exactly what the russians did. did the russians drop some malware that could be activated at some point that could in fact have a disabling function or destructive function? were they able to get into some of those critical support systems including for critical

infrastructure? we don't know yet and that's why congress is demanding to have some answers. but donald trump has not addressed it much less said anything serious about it. >> there's a bombshell today in the form of an admission that should lead to an apology for folks like yourself. attorney general william barr was interviewed from "the wall street journal" today. and i'll just read from the piece. quote, the biggest news from mr. durham's probe. he's the special investigator who was looking at the russia investigation. the biggest news from his probe is what he has ruled out. mr. barr was initially suspicious agents had been spying on the trump campaign before the official july 2016 startup cross fire hurricane and that the central intelligence agency or foreign intelligence had played a role. that even prior to naming the counsel mr. durham had come to the conclusion he didn't see any sign of improper cia activity or foreign government activity

before july 2016. he said, quote, the cia stayed in its lane. you have been harassed. you've been abused, you've investigated, you've retained a lawyer, you've been interviewed by mr. durham. your thoughts about that admission? >> the fact i have been denounced and condemned by mr. trump i do wear as a badge of honor. we knew what we had to do in 2016 in terms of cia responsibilities to try to understand what the russians were doing and try to take any steps to uncover that. and so we knew that everything we did was appropriate, and that's why i was ready to talk to mr. durham which i did for 8 hours. i told the congressional committees i'm happy to appear in private or open hearings because there's been so much misrepresentation about the dedicated women and men of cia and fbi did in order to understand how the russians were trying to influence that election. that's why i think this recent evidence of a hack into the government networks just

reinforces i think the concerns that a lot of intelligence and law enforcement professionals have that we really need to up our game because the russians are not going to stop being very aggressive to try to get into our networks, understand what we're doing and then take actions to undermine our national security. >> that was my last question. i was going to ask you to tie the two things together. donald trump and his allies, people like bill barr waged a four-year war against the investigation into russia's attack. today we're covering an attack by russia the extent of which is still unknown. do you think we took our eye off the ball of watching russia and being on a war footing with russia, cyber war footing? >> i don't know. these are very, very complex issues. and trying to ensure that you make your computer systems networks as impenetrable as possible against some very sophisticated cyber actors, you know, is a real, real challenge. and i know there was a lot of focus on trying to prevent interference in the electoral systems, and good on the people that did that, chris krebs and

others. i think they did a great job. however, there's so much out there that we need to protect. and that's why still deal with this issue. i've long been calling for an independent bipartisan commission just like we did after 9/11, stand it up so we can take a strategic and comprehensive look about how we're going to do everything possible to make that digital environment as impenetrable, as reliable so we have confidence that we're not going to suffer these types of potentially catastrophic attacks against what really is the venue of the environment that our security, safety and prosperity rests in. >> director brennen, it is always good to ask you these questions. thank you for spending some time with us today. up next for us, the grift is on. trump's post-presidency war chest rivaling nothing we have ever seen from an outgoing president. what he could do with all that money coming up. atat he could do with all th

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as donald trump prepares to leave the white house next month he will do so with a large sum of cash. trump's campaign and the republican national committee have raised more than $250 million since election day largely on the lies that the election had been fraudulently stolen from donald trump. more than $60 million of that money has gone to a new

political action committee which trump will control when he's out of office. people familiar with the matter tell "the new york times." that amount of money is unheard of for an outgoing president and comes with few legal limits on how trump can spend it. he could potentially use it to enrich himself by funding his travel and rallies, hiring staff and paying his mounting legal bills. joining us now the reverend al sharpton, host of politics nation here on msnbc and the president of the national action network. and our friend tim o'brien, senior columnist at bloomberg opinion. so, tim, a trump ally told me that the whole thing was a big grift, that he was knowingly mooching off his supporters. a lot of the donations were small dollar donations from his regular campaign donors and it was all meant to help fund his legal defenses. what do you make of just the lack of -- i don't want to say ethics because we know trump doesn't have any of those -- but the lack of shame?

>> the craven willingness to take advantage of other people for his own financial gain is not a surprise at all. this is part and parcel of who donald trump has been for decades, nicolle. i think, you know, it's i guess both tragic comic what's going on now because i don't think he really realized when they first setup a legal defense fund that they could turn claiming the u.s. election was a fraud into a money making grift. i think they discovered that that message had a lot of traction with donors. eric trump was pushing it, don junior was pushing it, and the president was pushing it. and lo and behold between election day and now they've raised more than $2 million. and i don't think they have any desire to use any of that for or a meaningful about of it for legal purposes. i think trump is going to use that as you noted to fund his after life when he leaves the white house, to remain a king maker in the republican party,

to run what i think will be a regular road show of trump events. and i think it should just remind anybody who supports this guy that when they open up their wallet and open up their purse donald trump does not have their interest at heart. he is constantly on the grift, his children on the grift and we were reminded of that today i think by another story that emerged about the possibility of jared kushner setting up a shell company to divert over $600 million into questionable uses. the bright spot in this is that these are some of the very issues that the manhattan district attorney is looking at. so i don't know the trumps are going to be able to get away with this without consequence. >> tim, tell us more about that story about what jared's doing. why would he need to do something like that? >> probably because he can, nicolle. i think at least what we can know on the reporting on this they setup a shell company that

employed laura trump, mike pence's nephew, and there doesn't appear to be any clear accountability for how over $600 million was spent. at a minimum that's going to draw the attention of the fec. but the only power that the fec has is to issue a fine, and i don't think the trumps care about fines. the civil case that's in motion against him in the state of new york probably only has financial penalties. but cy vance, the manhattan district attorney, is looking at a series of crimes, possible crimes, tax fraud, accounting fraud and campaign fraud that could have criminal consequences that would endanger trump's ability to run again in 2024. and i think it's also the latest lesson that anyone in trump's orbit operates just like trump does which is to bend the law, break the law and take advantage of other peoples trust in them.

>> you know, "the new york times" reported earlier this month that trump plans to dole out pardons to his family and friends. but to tim's point, does it sound like he might need one himself? i mean this conduct if it catches the eyes of state prosecutors, state investigators not just what he's done in the past but what he does once he leaves, he doesn't have any immunity from them. >> i really think we have to go to the fact first and foremost that his narcissism and megalomania requires that you pay attention to him. so he's going to use this war chest to try to remain relevant. donald trump would absolutely do anything to remain part of the news cycle and the story. secondly, he's going to use a lot of it to try and undermine in any way he can the biden presidency.

he will not get over the fact that joe biden beat him. and he to the point where he won't even concede or say he's coming to the inauguration. so those are the two priorities. that, yes, i believe he will defend himself with those monies, there may be some criminal or civil liabilities he has to do and deal with, but i think even then he'll try and build movements saying he's being treated unfairly. he'll try to change or turn any narrative into that he's some kind of martyr for standing up for the common man. and some of them will go for it as evidenced by the fact he could raise this over $200 million from these people. so the people that bought into his us against them kind of political ideology that elected him in the first place are not going anywhere. and donald trump is not going anywhere. the loser is the republican

party who will not be able to rebuild themselves without having to take him on, head on. they need to grow a backbone because whether it's now or a year from now the only way they're going to be able to re-establish the party is they're going to have to get in the ring and beat donald trump down and take him out of the political -- out of the discussion of legitimate policies. otherwise he's going to continue to side line them as a party and continue to embellish himself because he just can't help it. he needs the attention. >> rev, what are you bracing for in terms of his pardons which are expected to be plentiful? obviously anyone who needs a pardon is already in trouble with the law, but they're not expected to be the run of the mill kind of folks that were mistreated by the criminal justice system. what are you expecting? >> i'm expecting he's going to

pardon those that have been loyal to him, that have paid homage to him, watch the attorney general in texas who has just went out with this ludicrous attempt to go to the supreme court who is under charges now. i'm watching for those that have paid homage to him or those that could compromise him, those that he needs to say i'm giving you a pardon so don't cooperate with anything against me. which you can rest assured with all of his bragging and running around saying that he was letting people out of jail and listening to kim kardashian, he will not be pardoning a lot of people that deserve pardoning and some of the activist types like kardashian in that regard brought to him. they have gotten all the pardons they will get, in my opinion, because they were only used for cap pain literature. the campaign is over. those pardons are business. >> the rev aland tim are both

sticking around for more. and when we come back dr. jill biden and her husband, president-elect joe biden, the very relatable first family we're about to see a whole lot more of in a few weeks. we'll show you what we're talking about next. you what we talking about next [ thunder rumbles ] [ engine rumbling ] ♪ [ beeping ] [ engine revs ] ♪ uh, you know there's a 30-minute limit, right?

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if you have symptoms of ketoacidosis, which is serious and may lead to death. answer the alert. ask your doctor if farxiga could do more for you. if you can't afford your medication, astrazeneca may be able to help. wow! a new buick? for me? to james, from james. that's just what i wanted. is this a new buick? i secret santa-ed myself. oh i shouldn't have. but i have been very good this year. wow! wow! wow! don't forget you this holiday season, get an s-you-v, from buick. celebrate the holidays with buick, now everyone can get gm employee pricing on most buick suv models. use it to get over 76 hundred total value on this envision essence. it was really the tone of it that i think that -- you know, he called me kiddo. and one of the things i'm most proud of is my doctorate. i worked so hard for it.

>> as a husband who loves this person, did you ever want to get out a length of pool chain and go full corn pop on these people. >> the answer is -- >> the answer is no. >> no, no. but there are some of these -- anyway. >> it was just the tone of it. >> i've been suppressing my irishness for a long time. >> a very relatable scene there. dr. jill biden taking in stride the insults lobbed at her for being called doctor. and the clip there making clear that it was her husband who might have been more bent out of shape before tabout the whole tn she was. they sat down with stephen colbert calming and charming throughout and more important a relatable partnership. any couple, happy couple could see themselves in that. what do you think, tim o'brien, in terms of showcasing a family life that is different from what we witnessed the last four

years? >> well unlike president-elect biden, i don't have to suppress my irishness. and i think it is amazing this past week the hypocrisy from people like marco rubio who was foended at colorful language to the silly editorial in the "wall street journal" targeting jill biden because she proudly wears credentials that she's earned. i think regardless ever people ideology to have a family coming into the white house that is thoughtful, hard-working and jen you arous public servants is a head start right out of the gate because we've been living with a series of people who all come across and look like bond criminals every day of the week. and have no interest really in public service as a core value, they make fun of it. they tried to make it a campaign issue for biden.

and i think it is a nice re-set, regardless of what political side of the aisle you sit on, to have decent conscientious people coming into the white house. >> rev, it was a departure that the family became so partisan. after 9/11 it was laura bush who first addressed the country about how to talk to kids during 9/11 and michelle obama during some of the most divisive legislative battles was always respected by a vast smath of the american people regardless of their political affiliation and that is some of what we haven't had in donald trump's kids being so political and so partisan, not just the ones in the white house, but the folks who became political surrogates for him. this is a re-set, as tim said? >> this is a needed re-set. and it is where you start seeing the kind of stability that we

need. we are in the middle of a pandemic. we have over 3,000 people dying a day. we do not need drama to add to the trauma. we need some stable hands and something that could bring us back to where we understand that all is not lost. and i think the bidens are personifying that. it has always been the strategy of trump and them to try and in many ways delegitimatize whoever they are fighting. barack obama was not born here, he's not an american. and now dr. jill biden is not a ph.d and throwing out there whether vice president elect kamala harris is an american. they must try to make you not legitimate to try to make their illegitimate politic as pes app be legitimate. i watched fantasy island.

we're going back to shore to real life to dealing with real problems and build a real country back out of a pandemic. fantasy island is over. the bobbles and the gold and all of that stuff was a fantasy. let's get back to real life. >> i will be waving good-bye to fantasy island with you. two of our most favorite friends, thank you for spending time with us. "deadline: white house" is just getting started. tting started.

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what i find most astonishing

is that a cyber hack of this nature is really the modern equivalent of almost of russian bombers reportedly flying undetected over the every tire country. not to have the wouse aggressively speaking out and protesting and taking punitive action is really quite extraordinary. >> hi again, everyone. it is 5:00 in the east. in the wake of a massive cyber attack believed to be carried out by russia, mitt romney has described as akined to russian bombers flying undetected over the entire country and with just over a month to go before a new administration takes the reins, the biden transition team is reporting that the pentagon has abruptly stopped cooperating with them. chris miller is calling the halt a quote, mutually agreed upon holiday pause. but biden's camp disputes that. the executive director of the transition adding that there is,

quote, isolated resistance from some trump political appointees and insisting briefing continue as there is no time to spare. the potential for chaos at the pentagon comes as the cyber attack is still coming into focus. more than five days after it was first revealed. the warning that hackers believed to be working for the kremlin used techniques an the hack posed a grave risk to the federal government as well as to state governments. microsoft said at least 40 companies think tanks and government agencies have been infiltrated and investigators say it could take months before the true extent of the damage is known. so with the country in the middle of what is increasingly looking like a full blown national security crisis, this is what one white house adviser had to say. >> i don't know the whole story and i don't know totally who is responsible. people are saying russia.

i don't know that. it could be other countries. i just don't know. >> are we going to hear from the president on the government hack? >> i don't know. >> he's not just some guy on the street. senior adviser to the president. president trump found time today to tweet an endless stream of disinformation about the election. a russia probe conspiracy theory and demands that senators challenge the electoral college vote but not a single tweet or statement or utterance about the significant and potentially ongoing attack on the united states government. "the new york times" reported, quote, officials say that with only one month left in the tenure, the trump administration is planning to simply hand off what appears to be the biggest cybersecurity breach of federal networks in more than two decades. and once again the contrast with president-elect biden couldn't be clearer in what appears to be recognition that the cyber attack will be a day one challenge for his

administration. biden said in a tamtstatement, adversaries should know that as president i will not stand idly by on assaulted on our nation. president trump awol is where we begin with some of our favorite reporters and friends. elizabeth neumann is back from threat prevention and security at the department ofless and an adviser to the group defending democracy together is back. also joining us jeremy bash, former chief of staff to the cia and the department of defense. and clint rons is here. jeremy and clint are both msnbc national security analysts. jeremy, i start with you. first on this attack. is it possible that as the full picture comes into focus, it is much worse and much deeper into our government than we currently understand it to be? >> it is definitely possible, nicolle. some government public affairs spokesperson were saying we're good, our networks are clean.

we don't know that yet. we're only 72 -- 96 hours into reporting about this epic breach of america's national security. one of the largest if not the largest already believed to be the largest cyber attack on our government and what we do know is that the signatures of this attack trace back to a.p.t. 29 and that is advanced participate troop 29 closely linked to the russia's svr which is the successor of the kgb. so this is appearing to be a kremlin directed cyber attack against the u.s. government and it is going to take weeks, if not months, nicolle, to do the full damage assessment to figure out exactly what russia knows, when they did start knowing it and how are we ever going to get them off the network if they're watching the emails of the i.t. professional whose job it is to

defend america. >> so jeremy, you've been the chief of staff at the pentagon and the cia. obviously in recent decades we've turned a lot of our defenses to protecting the space. obviously not adequately. what does it say to you that the pentagon, this new team, donald trump ousted the old folks, put in a new team and it is unclear for weeks now why. why do you think they paused their transition conversations with the biden team? >> well i'm not sure there is a connection between solar winds and the breach in the pause and let me offer, number one, with respect to the transition pause, don't be fooled. this is a decision by the white house. what happened here, i'm told from sources close to the pentagon, that the white house was infuriated because there was a washington post article that said that trump was squandering billion dollars on his wall on the southern border and if some of the money could be redirected, the pentagon could save money for troop readiness

or cybersecurity or preparing for the rise of china or some other important adversaries. and so when pentagon saw this and when the political leaders of the pentagon saw this and the white house saw this, the white house said cancel all meetings and the biden transition team had meetings that were scheduled and had requests for information, rfi's and the trump pentagon shut the whole thing down. secretary miller is a decent person, a mild mannered person and he's saying i'm ready to talk but he's being misled by his own staff. he's being told this was mutual. it was not mutual. this is done by the white house and the secretary of defense should stand up and say my department is going to cooperate with the biden transition national security depends on it. >> elizabeth neumann, you've told stories with eerily similar echo, that donald trump's thin skin, donald trump's pique and

grievances interfere to protect our national and homeland security. what do you make of this cover story, this lie about a pause being due to the holidays. i've been part of transitions that do not take a break for the holidays. why do you think there is a pause in the transition between the trump team and the incoming biden team and what concerns you about it? >> you know, the people -- agree with what jeremy just assessed. i have worked with chris miller. he's a good guy. he's mild mannered. i think the suggestion that perhaps some of the people on his staff may have done this and not fully informed him is very plausible. and i would hope that upon discovery he does the right thing and reinstitutes all of the briefings because there is no time to waste. they are delayed by three weeks in a normal transition period. and we're under attack. we have a massive cyber attack that the military is involved in

various aspects of responding to and discovering and understanding the scope an the size of the attack, that there is no time to waste because this is going to be one of the primary things that the biden administration is going to have to address on day one. and having -- cutting off conversations is just petty. but to your main point of your question, nicolle, that is what donald trump and the people that are sycophantic around him, they care nothing about doing the job of governing and they could care less if you have expertise on the subject matter, they look at making trump look good and making tri making trump happy and they enjoy playing politically with our national security yet again. >> do you think anyone has told him that he doesn't not look good. he looks weak. he looks like russia snuck in, got inside of his own government, the one that he

runs, do you think that anybody told him that putin is making a fool of him right now, today. >> from what we're hearing no one wants to tell the president any bad news any more so i could see two years ago attempts at perhaps trying to educate the president of why it is important for him to take a strong stance on russia. we've heard from the white house staff that have since left about attempts to try to educate him and he rebuffed. i don't have any evidence, i don't know anybody with any evide evidence but it doesn't smell right. it feels like putin has something on him. it feels like he's compromised here. and there is no other explanation that makes sense about this particular relationship with russia compared to all of the other relationships, of cozies up to dictators all of the time but there is something particularly concerning about the relationship with russia.

>> clint, take me inside what your sense is of how long until we understand the scope of the attack, the -- will he ever know everything that russia learned from this cyber attack, if we didn't know they were in there for many months, how will we know what they stole in terms of data and what they saw. >> nicolle, it is a hard tracing operation. because think if it is six, seven, eight months they're in the system, it is probably going to take that long to even trace it all the way back out. you're hunting for something that you detected. it sounds as if they entered into the networks and then created possibly other pathways into the networks separate from the initial entry point and used other systems and malware to move across networks. an it is not just government, it is the private sector as well. so when you all of that together and i think microsoft said 40

different companies even, that is an enormous amount of effort and man power that has to be redirected to defend against a past incident and all while moving from election 2020 into what are we going to do in 2021 about russia and china which is always trying to hit us in terms of our attacks and it just goes to the broader question of how will we defend all of our systems in cyberspace after spending billion dollars and it still didn't work. it could be argued that the russias upped their game and better than we were before we started implementing our defenses. >> clint, i want to read you something if fr the president of microsoft, he said we've forgotten the lessons of 9/11. it is not a great week for information sharing and it turns companies like microsoft into a sheep dog trying to get these federal agencies to come together into a single place and

share what they know. are we at a place where microsoft is more on top of this than the federal government? >> absolutely. this is been since probably about -- i worked a lot of cybersecurity in the private sector, from 2013 on, the private sector was moving ahead and many were being hired out of the federal government in terms of cybersecurity. it is also our defenses are highly reliant, and fire eye, we're still the ones as a cybersecurity that notified of the breaches. i think across the board we've had incredible turn over and turmoil from cybersecurity defenses, aside from general nakasone, dhs, chris krebs -- tom bossert, when you look at the positions that are a national security, the president who i don't think has even operated a computer in the last

20 years, they just don't have a serious plan for it. so i think when we move into 2021, what i'm hopeful for is a new administration. they know this is the serious problem. but they'll dedicate people for a long term that could build and implement a strategy. right now we only have that on the cyber command side and it needs to go way deeper and microsoft to its credit is one of the pillars in the private sector helping the country. >> and tragically to such pillar in the federal government. jeremy, i want to read you something t"the associated pres" is reporting. the hacks may fall to biden. a cybersecurity expert and former defense department special council said there must be consequences for those responsible for the attacks an the trump administration has fallen short -- far short of holding the kremlin accountable. i want to put up all he's let slide by the kremlin. he shared secrets, he disclosed

intelligence in an oval office meeting with the russian ambassador. he's denigrated nato. john bolton was thinking he thinks he would get out of the nato if he was re-elected. he fought sanctions and withdrew troops from syria and repeatedly invited putin into the g-7 and never spoke up about the bounties on the head of american soldiers. never such stark evidence in front of us of a possible reaction. we talked about it as an action, donald trump's inaction and praise of putin. do you think this is a reaction, do you think putin was clearly emboldened? >> definitely. and i would add two other items to the list, first the president tried to shake down the president of the ukraine, zelensky and slow rolled aid to ukraine they would use to fight the russians.

that emboldened the kremlin and that got the president impeached. but then the original issue was that beginning if 2016 donald trump said russia if you're listening, and he invited, he welcomed, he benefited from and he rewarded russian interference in his own election. and he completely undermined the intelligence community's 2017 assessment that put the finger on the kremlin for its cyber hacking. and so if you're in the kremlin and you see we engaged in cyber hacking against the united states and trump benefited from it and rewarded us, why wouldn't they do it again. it is more than a green light. it is an invitation from trump with open arms and air kisses. this is exactly why one of the major jobs of the biden administration is to reassert, re grip deterrence and that is going to be very difficult after we've lost so much ground. so i think it will take the biden team quite a while to fashion the exact response to

russia vis-a-vis nato and vis-a-vis afghanistan and a whole range of issues. but on cyber, this is got to be one of the biggest issues out of the box because we could not defend our country if the russians are crawling all over our computer networks. >> let me ask you one more question about what russia may have been thinking. do you think this attack was launched in case there was a change in presidents so that russia was already so embedded knowing that trump doesn't even allow note taker news his calls with putin, knowing that no one would by on top of or running a list of policies or issues to raise with an adversary like vladimir putin. you could take me inside how biden prepares not just to change the tone and tenure, but to assess the damage done by trump's posture with putin? >> first, that is a great question. you must have worked in the white house because that is a typical question a president or a national security adviser would ask their morning intelligence briefer. what is putin's end game here.

and of course we don't know. we're not privy to the intelligence but i'm worried that trump is basically said don't talk to me about russia in my morning intelligence briefing if i look at it or hear it again. i do think that russia is trying to capitalize on chaos, on an election year. they believe democracy is a big weakness and trying to capitalize on covid. so they have a lot of nefarious ends here and we have to interrogate this situation very carefully. >> jeremy bash, clint watts, elizabeth neumann, thank you for starting us off this hour. when we return, with a second vaccine very close to fda approval, hospitals across the country are dealing with a surge of covid parentients and health officials have an urgent message heading into the holidays. please stay home. and tens of thoufds of new voters have been registered in georgia since the presidential election and democrats there are cautiously and increasingly

optimistic that donald trump's war against the state's republican leaders is backfiring. and later, as trump's followers suggest more insane ways for him to try to cling to pow, trump may have something very different on his mind. we'll tell you about it. "deadline: white house" continues after a quick break. don't go anywhere. anywhere. who have turned into their parents. i'm having a big lunch and then just a snack for dinner. so we're using a speakerphone in the store. is that a good idea? one of the ways i do that is to get them out of the home. you're looking for a grout brush, this is -- garth, did he ask for your help? -no, no. -no. we all see it. we all see it. he has blue hair. -okay. -blue. progressive can't protect you from becoming your parents, but we can protect your home and auto when you bundle with us. -keep it coming. -you don't know him. ♪

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simply getting together with others, whether it is one christmas, or new year's gathering or party could be disastrous. one hospital administrator conveyed to me if we see a similar spike after christmas and these were his words, we will go under.

we will go under. >> a stark warning from the mayor of los angeles on what could happen to hospitals in southern california as bed capacity and the stammino of those working on the front lines rapidly deteriorate. emergency rooms are so crowded that some ambulances have been forced to wait in lines up to six hours long with sick patients inside. a reflection of what is happening across the country, a record more than 114,000 americans are currently hospitalized with covid-19. what's more, several governors have reported that only half of the pfizer vaccine doses they've been expected in the next few weeks will be delivered when the federal health department denies as the country awaits the likely approval by the fda of moderna vaccine candidate in what would be become the second vaccine approved in one week. joins us now is dr. kavita patel and from the bookings institute

and former obama white house health policy director and one of our favorite friends. dr. patel, i keep thinking that this plea to not gather or travel is so detached from the reality of doctors and nurses who are now maybe not getting the vaccines that they thought they would get, who were worried about getting sick or sickening their families. it seems like in some ways this happens in the military, they pay a higher price for protecting our national security. it would seem now that doctors and nurses are paying a much higher price than those of us ringing our hands about what is admittedly sad but not dangerous, missing our family and friends. >> that is right, nicolle. and for months now i think health care workers have seen themselves, in fact, we talked as a joke but it is not a joke, it is very serious that we're like the military but without the equivalent of kevlar or the equivalent of having that protection because as you recall, we didn't have the ppe

to begin with and we still do not have adequate ppe after all of the months and now to have another gut punch about not getting enough vaccine, that will had a v a litt-- will haver lining with moderna, hopefully any minute or hour now we're get that authorization. and it is a more flexible vaccine. similar to pfizer but it could be stored in a refrigerator for 30 days which gives more flexibility and i have min scheduled for next week hoping that moderna gets the trucks out and i really look forward to having a lot more of my colleagues vaccinated soon. >> what is the best case scenario for this country in the biden team said that it will probably be late summer, early fall, before people like me, general public, could go ahead and get a vaccine. what is the best way to keep people adhering to the safety

measures but not losing hope and sort of hanging on through what could end up feeling like the longest stretch? >> yeah, i'm going to give you kind of part like put on my former policy hat on the in the white house. have a national plan. it sounds like that it is a no brainer but it needs to be said we'll have a national strategy to deal with covid including a vaccine rollout with more manufacturers coming online. the second is critical, to make sure the american public understands, we are not going to have a vaccine authorized for children so we need to get the rapid testing that is affordable, nicolle, into everyone's hands, especially schools, especially schools that are in vulnerable communities. the third thing that we have to do is provide that economic support and i don't just mean pass a darn stimulus, mitch mcconnell, but i mean beyond that. we need to think about how to tactically precision handing out and supporting through grants,

public/private partnerships to have businesses open again. but it all has to happen together. i do believe that we could have a national strategy where you could test people and you could put children in schools safely, but we could get adults vaccinated through information and getting the vaccines into doctors offices and pharmacies and that is the only way we're going to get forward. i know the biden team, they're good friends of mine. they're smart people. they've got what they need to get it together. but we just need to make sure that we could hold on, stay home, do the things that we have to do and until we could see the policy pieces get put in place. >> how important are the images of president-elect biden will be vaccinated on monday, mike pence was vaccinated today. how far do those examples go? >> they go far. but i think we need to go a little further. i mean, i think that it is no

surprise to you, nicolle, we have had a divided country and divided election and i think it is helpful that pence was one of them but we need more trusted community figures, local mayors and some of the mayors that have been home town heroes, we need the county and public health officials. there is a black doctor movement for covid-19 where they're getting publicly vaccinated in philadelphia and other places. that is at the end of the day, when you think about who you go to, when you needed advice, you go to local people. people who you trust, who like you, understand you, understand what you're going through. and so it is a start. and i think it is an important one. we have a lot more to do and but i know we could do it. i know we can. >> we'll keep turning to you as we work our way through this. dr. kavita patel, thank you for spending time with us today and let us know you how feel after your vaccine. when we come back, we'll go to georgia where a new voter

registration numbers and donald trump's war against republicans is giving the democrats there a reason to be optimistic ahead of next month's senate runoff. "deadline: white house" continues after a quick break. - [narrator] this is steve.

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obtained by the atlanta journal constitution shows that 76,000 new voters were registered since before the presidential election and are eligible to vote in the january 5th runoffs. that number is enough in and itself to make a difference in the election if they turn out. democrats are optimistic about chances and that president trump's ongoing war against state officials may be backfired. he continues to spread false claims about last month's election and escalated his attack against one time ally brian kemp, the republican governor. democrats hope the baseless attacks will keep trump supporters from casting ballots in the runoffs. joining ours conversation, greg bluestein and david plouffe and msnbc political analysis. greg, you have a great interview with governor kemp and we should say, for our viewers, he was as trumpy of a trump ally that you

could get. but now he is talking about dea death threats and saying it has gotten ridiculous from death threats, claims of bribes from china, the social media posts that my children are getting, he said, we have the no crying in politics rule in the kemp house but this is stuff that if i said it, i would be taken to the wood shed and would never see the light of day. talk about trump's war on these very conservative republicans in georgia and how that is is playing out and maybe damaging the republican candidates there. >> that is about as emotional as i've seen the governor get. he's fiery because he's upset that the pro-trump conspiracy theorists are threating him and his family. low level election staffers, just people trying to do their

jobs. he still hasn't directly criticized president trump. but he certainly criticizing this entire atmosphere that president trump has promoted. these false narrative of a stolen election and has given the republican candidates fits because on one hand they're told to vote and president trump is saying it is a rigged election. so this mixed messaging continues to haunt senate candidates in georgia. >> what is the state of the race there, greg? what are you sense on the ground? >> well more than 1.1 million people have already cast ballots and i think this is through thursday. and i think those numbers have surprised both parties with the intensity. especially early voting. we're almost at presidential levels right now when you compare it to this time in the november campaign. which is astounding. now it might taper off next week, it will probably with the christmas holiday, but still, the fact that there is this much

intensity out there democrats are feeling optimistic and so are republicans because the early voting numbers shattered their expectations but it is hard to reach too much into the numbers so far except for this, georgians certainly reflect and recognize what an intense and high stakes these elections are right now. >> david plouffe, what is the operative in you, in the strategist and the tactition what do you see impacting it and pushing it one way or another. >> it is helpful when you have a recent election to study. an we just had one. >> right. >> i think joe biden got about 100,000 votes more than jon ossoff did. some of that is just a dropoff from the president to down ballot and that is what is all on the ballot but biden maxed out his vote in the suburbs around the metro area so that is

the challenge to get as close to biden's number as you can. because if you can't, unless you have a turnout, you won't be able to win. i do think that trump's attack and sidney powell's attacks and lynn wood's impact will have an impact. i'm not going to suggest it will have a 20% impact. but if the race is close, it wouldn't take much. and it will go down in history, the mal practice of donald trump maligning mail-in voting. the republican secretary of state in georgia points out how tens of thousands of people who voted in the primary, republicans didn't vote. so i think this is doubling down on that and it will turn out difficulty for them. but right now if you're the democrats you have to max out and get to biden like levels around the metro area and hang in the turnout. i do think the numbers are encouraging that we've seen so far and you need to continue.

greg is right, you should see a little bit of a dissipation next week as we are closer to the holiday. but these are close races so the new registration figures you pointed out, you know, those could be material. you've got 17-year-olds who just turned 18, post november 3rd, you have people who didn't bother to vote in the general election, we could ask why but they didn't. i think it is close. but the atmosphere down there is more helpful to the two democratic candidates than the two republican candidates. >> david plouffe, what is your read of the national political implications of a loyal sort of soldier in the trumpian republican party, brian kemp, talking about this assault on him, on his family, on his kids, directed by, green lit by donald trump? >> well, nicolle, we're going to learn a lot about that. it is worth underscoring what you and greg talked about.

kemp is trumpy. he's at the top of the trumpy list. this is an ally. this is like ron desantis basically in trump, and we talked earlier in the week for a podcast coming out next week about this. kemp is going to have a significant primary and trump himself called for doug collins to run against him. the brightest star in the republican party is marjorie tayler green, the qanon candidate. so i think we'll see the post trump era from a presidential stand point play out all around the country but georgia you'll have a front-row seat and a senate race where there is this battle between those two say i never wore a mask and i -- and joe biden didn't win the election, donald trump did. donald trump is the greatest president in american history.

so two years from now, how much of a hold does he still have. but it is remarkable. these republicans who have stood by trump through everything he's done, all they've done is say we actually need to let voters decide who our next president is. and that was too much for trump. and we've never seen anything like this i don't think in american political history. >> well i agree with you. i think georgia is this ground zero for where the country heads. our first sort of lab test of trump's impact and this assault on the truth and the election he lost. greg and david, thank you so much. it is great to talk to both of you today. when we return, as his followers propose more and more unhinged ideas about how to hang on to power, donald trump may have other ideas about his future. we'll tell you about them. "deadline: white house" is back after this. k after this

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saving is easy when you're in good hands. call a local agent, or 1-800-allstate for a quote today. but with walmart's low prices, you still know how to do it up. and keep costs down. let's end the year enjoying more. ♪ you are all i need baby baby to get by ♪ it seems that the closer wet get to joe biden's inauguration day, the por december prat and more unhinged the maga community becomes. there is alabama senator tommy tuberville who suggested on wednesday that he would defy mitch mcconnell and support a challenge to the results of the electoral college and earned him a tweet from trump calling him a man of courage as if an attempt to over turn the results were not deranged enough, last night the former national security adviser michael flynn suggested

that trump order military capabilities to swing states in order to force them to rerun, like readminister elections. and amid the calms for martial law what is in trump's head. in the past two weeks people familiar with the matter note trump has casually slipped into conversation lines such as how would you like to see at present is come back and remember the apprentice. joining our conversation, jason johnson, from morgan state university and msnbc contributor and a contributor to the agreo, and donnie deutsche. donnie, is he trying to bring back the apprentice and where would it air? >> i hope so. because little known fact that the deutsche agency, they did three episodes three years. they came to our agency and we gave out tasks so maybe another shot for us. or not. they couldn't be able to air on my major network.

but do not rule out that he would do something like that. there is nothing that is off, he's shameless, there is nothing off the table. would he do a pay-per-view and looking for the next vice president, i don't even say that tongue and cheek. whatever we do, we'd have to monetize in a big way for him. but that's one of many media circus episodes, we'll see. so i don't think it is so crazy. >> well, i mean, i think jason johnson, what donnie said first is the most important. at the moment, donald trump is noncommercial. all of this tweets have a warning, akin to what is on a pack of krigcigarettes and righw he stands for extra judicial conflict and standing with michael flynn and we haven't seen the pardons as of yet. what do you think his future

holds. >> first it holds a lot of lawsuits. so he needs to make sure that he's bringing in income to fight the lawsuits. here is the precedent that i actually see for donald trump. yes, he man anlages to become president for one election. it reminds me of sarah palin, who was extremely popular and everybody wants her glasses or her fashion and her on every single show but by the pmidterm, her shows didn't work very well. she wasn't able to flip elections and i'm wondering if donald trump might be heading in that same direction. as a cultural force, he will always be important to some people. but his ability to really manipulate things comes from the fact that he could do something with some of the crazy that he talked about. and when he can't control an election, when he can't make policy and he can't keep people from coming into this country, i don't know if he has much of a future. and quite frankly, at this point, i don't flow if he would resell the apprentice unless it was on russian tv because nobody

in america wants to work for this guy. >> now, it is so interesting, because the way he lost, because of being such a graceless sore lose who are cares not at all about country and the things we're talking about are so irrelevant and you're talking about that is a fate worse than death and i see elements of an o.j. simpson and going in and stealing his own white house souvenirs. what do you think -- how will he grapple with what will be a fall from grace, not because he lost, but because of how he lost? >> yeah, the harrow will be a side show. i want to calm everybody down about the current state of the republican party because it is a moment in time. and it is an extension of trump now, not trump in the future. you know, when we talk about all of the crazies and the republican party and all of this thing and people not believing

the election, you know, there are 70 million people that voted for trump. that's not all 70 million. that is a slice. that is a slice, a small slice. maybe a third. i spoke to ten of my friends that voted for trump and ten out of ten their attitude now is we lost the election, let's move on and i want to see how any w-2 is next year. so i don't think -- i'm not as nervous about the state of the world and the state of the republican party. donald trump is a moment in time. this is a moment in time. it will always be 20 million american fringes on both sides paying a lot of attention to the right fringe right now. but that is not where the world is going to be. i want everybody to take a deep breath and relax. we are going to go back to some form of normalcy. i truly believe that. >> okay, so before my zen sets in, jason johnson, i want to read this from david ignatius today who takes a different view. he writes unfortunately the road ahead still seems blocked and not just by president trump. republican house members tell me

there is a rage in their districts among grassroots gop voters who believe without evidence that the system is rigged and the election was stolen by biden. trump has helped create and stoke this rage. but it is now broader and deeper than him and it won't disappear di disappear on january 20th. the on prescription i heard is time heals all wounds. that's former congressman mike rogers reminding me. in other words, we have to wait this craziness out. what do you think? >> yeah, nicole, i completely disagree with donnie. this is just the beginning. he abandoned texas and he leaves everything but not trump-ism. he abandoned three different colleges. he's not abandonediing trump-is. you have proud boys madrching through washington d.c. and tearing down signs. once he's out of power, these groups will become unhinged. if they don't believe the things

at the core are willing to placate these organizations. i think we're heading into an even darker period because if you don't have somebody at the head of the sort of collection of ants running in and out, if there is nobody to control them and if donald trump doesn't have anybody around them, they will only get worse. he'll sit and stew and watch television every day and think about the fact he's not on ""saturday night live" anymore and nobody cares about him and will enrage him. i think the republican party is in for real soul searching but right now a lot of them are still committed to donald trump and the violence we're going to see in the coming months will make this past summer look like a picnic. i'm not happy about that. i'm not enthusiastic about that but that's what i see happening and the violence in the streets now is a preview. >> guys, can i -- >> quick last word. >> real quick word, one of 50 senators, the proud boys are

the -- this is still not where the core of the country is. we cover it and it makes news but this is not who we are. this is the fringe, the very, very, very edge of the fringe. >> that's exactly who we are. we're talking portland and the midwest and these people are empowered every minute of every day they hear senators deny the legitimacy of joe biden getting into office. they're not being crushed down. their being empowered. look at the people for the january 5th run off. this is not the end. it the beginning. >> let's see. we will watch. >> we will watch together. jason johnson, donnie, thank you both so much for spending time with us. when we return as we do every day. we will remember lives well lived. erevy day. we will remember lives well lived. tonight...

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thank you so much for letting us into your homes during these truly extraordinary times. we're very grateful. "the beat" starts right now. >> hi, nicole, have a great weekend. welcome to "the beat." i'm in for ari melber. we'll start with silence and inaction from donald trump falling quiet on the spiraling covid crisis and the suspected russian cyber attack that his own administration calls a grave threat. as of tonight, not a single word