stay on the platforms and what gets kicked off. >> all right. nicholas johnston of "axios", thank you even have he for being here this morning. we really appreciate it. now that we have had that conversation, i just got to say again what took them so long? how people get information, what kind of information they're consuming matters. and it leads to real-life consequences and actions. yes, we can all takes steps to try to mitigate that. that does not mean there aren't other people, companies that bear responsibility here. thanks for getting up "way too early" with us on this thursday morning. don't go anywhere. "morning joe" starts now. >> this is a political process. there is nothing judicial about it. impeachment is a political decision. the house made a partisan political decision to impeach. i would amendment a largely partisan outcome in the senate. i'm not impartial about this at all. >> the trial hasn't started yet.

i will participate in that and i plan to listen to the evidence. >> that was senator mitch mcconnell in 2019 ahead of trump's first impeachment trial. compared to what he said yesterday ahead of trump's second impeachment trial. he might vote to quit but he is pretending to be impartial this time around. you can say that at least. good morning. welcome to "morning joe". it is thursday, january 28th. we have jonathan lemire. founder of the conservative website the bulwark and author of how the right lost its mind, charlie sacks is with us, msnbc contributor. good to have you both. you know, though, willie, about mitch, regarding mitch, he's been trying since january 6th -- actually, he's been

trying since after the president's election and before january 6th to drag his conference along with it. what did he say? do not contest the electors. this will end very badly for us. mitch warned us. he warned america. josh hawley was too good, too smart, little bird-handed -- >> okay. >> -- insurrectionist. >> that was his fist bump. >> he ignored mitch. and then mitch, post january 6th, sent another signal to republicans, which was what the president did was impeachable. did it off the record and then on the record last week.

said the president's actions led to the insurrection, to the riot. and his party, i mean, you know, you would think they would listen to him after they lost both seats in georgia. but they're not doing it. and mitch mcconnell knows. the republican party is cracking in half. and he's telling republicans in the senate what they can do to save their party. but they're too scared about saving their own seat to even think that way. >> they ignored him 45 out of 50 voted for the rand paul motion the other day, including mitch mcconnell. so the problem with his statement yesterday where he said i'm going to listen to the evidence, we'll have a trial, and i will make my decision, he has already voted and been on the record with the rand paul motion saying the trial is unconstitutional. rand paul came out of that vote and said how could you ever say the trial is unconstitutional and then vote to convict. that's when rand paul said this

is over. it's dead on arrival. so, yes, mitch mcconnell probably didn't want to be here. it looks like now that they are here, that republicans are here, that the tide has overwhelmed him. he's going to have to go ahead and vote to acquit the president of the united states. >> charlie sykes, we will see what happens between now and impeachment. you're the majority leader. and you want to stay the majority leader, you're going to vote to acquit and say i know this might tick people off. i understand why mitch did what he did yesterday. you're a majority leader. you keep trying to drag them along, say, hey, insurrection is bad. like being on the side of cop killers is bad. being on the side of trump terrorists are bad. obviously not enough of them were persuaded with that vote yesterday. if you're the majority leader, okay, i'm going to vote with them. then i'm going to try to pull

them my way for the impeachment vote which, again, is a signal he sent yesterday. i understand it's nuanced and when we do not live in the land of nuance in washington, d.c., cable news, podcasts, et cetera, et cetera. but that is what's going on. and i think the fascinating story here is, you've got a guy that has proven himself to be extraordinarily cynical. and he is being extraordinarily cynical in trying to save the republican party from themselves, from their worst instincts, from the trump terrorists. and they won't listen to him. >> yeah. well, it's time to move on. it's been a whole three weeks. and there's only six people who are dead. the extraordinary thing, joe, is both the speed and the thoroughness of republicans crawling back to donald trump in less than, what, 21 days. so you have mccarthy down in florida who is going to kiss the

ring. and the thing about mitch mcconnell, he knows better. he knows what happened. he knows there was an insurrection conspired by the president of the united states who used all the powers of his office to overturn a free and fair election. he knows that. and he's still going to go along with all of this. what's interesting about this, what's their excuse now? you and i, joe, heard from people saying, okay, trump is awful. but at least we will get justices, tax cuts, regulatory cuts. donald trump is gone. you're not going to get any of that anymore. it has expired. yet they are still going alone. there are senators not even running for re-election. they can't even claim they're afraid of the tweets because he doesn't tweet anymore. it gives you an indication just how thoroughly the republican party has been trumpified and

corrupted. they are doubling down on rationaliing the big deep lie about the election. not only do they paer not to be shamed, some appear to be emboldened. i woke up this morning. and i don't want to appear too negative. the post trump party could be worse than the trump republican party. under trump, you could say it's just trump. how bad can it actually get? now we know how bad it is. and they are okay with it. they are going along with it. and they are coming out in a couple of weeks and say, look, total exoneration. >> yep. and yet they get nothing out of it. they're not going to get perks, ambassadorships for their donors and buddies and anything. that's over. and they're still in suck up mode. >> and here is what's so

fascinating. it really is. we know, we know what's going to happen to them. we to the floor to go, you know, we have a midterm in 2022. no! just we just have to look back a couple of weeks and see what happens in georgia. that's all we have to do. we don't have to look at political polls, polls that show joe biden's approval ratings are plus 26 and donald trump's are in the tank. we don't have to look at that. we don't have to look at what's happened the past four years, what happens if you follow donald trump. we don't have to go back and tell you about the huge gains democrats made in the 2017 elections in virginia and across the country. we don't have to tell you what happened in 2018 where democrats won by the largest landslide vote-wise in the history of the republic and the congressional races. with he don't have to tell but that. with he don't have to tell you about the southern democratic

governors that were elected in 2019. all we have to tell you is that donald trump is the first president since herbert hoover, listen to me, republicans, -- for those who have ears to hear, here, this guy donald trump that you are cowtowing to, to lose the white house, the senate, all in one term. he did it all in one term. jonathan lemire, you have kevin mccarthy reaching out to donald trump. the guy who may be up for insurrection against the united states of america, the guy who inspired cop killers, the guy who inspired a mob to kill cops and to batter cops with american flags. kevin mccarthy, in the name of unity, is going down to mar-a-lago to talk to donald

trump. when any sane person would say you have to walk down to liz cheney's office and apologize. he's just too stupid politically to do it. >> another capitol police officer committed suicide yesterday. in terms of the political stakes, republicans seem to be making their decision. their decision is to return to donald trump out of -- even with the tweets being silenced, there is this fear. republicans that i talked to, in the ex president's circle and those on the hill, still believe there is a movement there. if not trump himself at this moment, but trumpism. and supporters are so loyal and

would be willing to go with him if indeed he were to signal primary challenges to the republicans, whether that's in '22 or another time. this may proof foolhardy. he does still have a significant hold to the gop right,000. that is the calculation they are making. one out of fear. out of believing this is where the party is. they are afraid to alienate those. he did briefly rebuke the president. we had private remarks in the last week or so after the insurrection. and of course word got back to the president. now we see the gop leader heading down to florida to make a mends and reconcile their differences. we did see mitch mcconnell speak out strongly january 6th.

let's of course remember, it took weeks to get there, allowing some of this fervor to build that eventually led to that insurrection. and now of course he is saying to colleagues, vote your conscious. i have talked to republicans in the last few days about this. the delay that mcconnell did in the trial, though at the time, though certainly it has allowed more and more evidence to come forward, more and more video to show how bad january 6th was. at the same time, it allowed a cooling off period and allowed them to talk to constituents, advisers, who told them, no, donald trump is still the republican party now. you don't want to alienate them. >> jonathan mentioned the new details we're about to talk about. the deaths and debilitating injuries. police officers sustained during the january 6th attack on the u.s. capitol.

according to the chairman of the capitol police labor committee, some officers suffered brain injuries. cracked ribs, smashed spinal cord discs. one officer will likely lose an eye. and another was stabbed with a metal fence stake. >> again, this is what trump supporters did. this is what trump terrorists did. this is what the trump rioters did. why? keep that up. why are their cops with brain injuries, cracked ribs, smashed spinal cord disks, why is one going to lose an eye, stabbings. why is that? because donald trump held a rally and told them to go up there and whipped them into a frenzy with two months of lies. there is a direct link directly from donald trump's words, from donald trump's actions to this. and, by the way, a false flag,

not even close. we have all the videotape. and the more we pore through the videotape, the pore we see they are saying they are doing it for donald trump. and they're doing it for ted cruz, the insurrectionist. mika, the evidence is overwhelming these cops were killed by cop killers, trump cop killers. >> and maimed. >> or maimed by trump cop killers because of the words of donald trump. nobody else is to blame. nobody else has this or their shoulders. it's donald trump. and you have kevin mccarthy going down today to bow to cop killer insurrectionist donald trump. >> i can't think of any explanation. nearly 140 officers from the capitol police and the d.c. metropolitan police were injured

during the attack. officer brian sicknick died. howard liebengood and d.c. police officer jeffrey smith both died by suicide since the attack. according to the capitol police officers union, nearly 40 employees have since tested positive for the coronavirus. willie, at this point, it's really -- every day we learn more about this riot. and we are horrified at what these patriots were put through, the capitol cops, d.c. police, and anybody who was trying to stop it. >> yeah. republican senators want us to, quote, move on. they're worried about divisiveness in the country if there's an impeachment trial if somebody is held accountable for this. mitt romney is one of the lone republicans who calling out

those. >> people largely on my side the impeachment trials will inflame incites more. i said first have you gone out and saying joe biden is the president of the united states. if you have said that, i would be happy to talk about other things that inflame divisiveness. but if you haven't said that, that is what it begins with. . >> the original lie that donald trump has been pushing that republicans have been pushing now for, what three months since after the election, that donald trump actually won it, there were irregularities. all of these things we hear from josh hawley and ted cruz, that is what led to the laundry list of swreurs and a death of a capitol police officer, and the lost eye and the cracked ribs and everything we just laid out.

all of that is because of the lie. acknowledge the victory to start rolling back the lie. >> this is absolutely right. here's the fundamental question that people ought to ask. it is an obvious question and obvious answer. would officer brian sicknick be alive today if donald trump had not hraoeufd about the results of the election? think about that. his words on january 6th i think are bad enough. but it is this big lie going back for months. it is stoking this sense of the ill legitimacy of the election. and all the other republicans who went along with this as well. people showed up because they were invited by the president. why were they motivated? because they had been convinced by this deep lie. when i say deep lie, i mean something that had spread through social media, through maga world.

it was echoed on fox news and other things that the american democracy was being undermined, there was a great conspiracy against the united states. they believed that. i'm not defending them. but they believed it because the president and supporters told them that. look, there is a real through line with what we have seen, from charlottesville to what happened. and here we are, here we are three weeks after this violent attack. and i guess what's so frustrating is we had been warned and warned and warned that this was heading this way. and we were all accused of trumpy syndrome. well, it was this bad. it was worse than anyone could have possibly imagined. small lies lead to big lies that lead to deep lies that lead to

an insurrection. yet three weeks afterward, donald trump is going to walk away from this claiming exoneration. and i really do think this is a rather extraordinary moment. obviously, it's an extraordinary moment. but it's as if we had said what's the worst possible case scenario and would that be enough. cue doughs to mitt romney for speaking out and calling out josh hawley, ted cruz and ron johnson. >> what's the worst-case scenario, mika? >> yeah. >> that the united states capitol is actually invaded by terrorists, by trump terrorists, who were riled up by his words. they are cop killers. they kill cops. it's interesting. donald trump pardoned a cop killer. a guy who wasn't there when he got killed but it was his conspiracy. they were doing there.

they went in to do a drug deal for him. cop got killed. he got sent to prison. trump released the cop killer. worst case, he said i could shoot a man on 5th and supporters would still be with me. >> here we go. >> he inspired people to kill a cop. and if you apply the same sort of legal standard that you would to other people that were part of the conspiracy, the death of a police officer, he's a cop killer. yet you have all the republican senators, forget the teeming masses, that are still siding with a guy who inspired cop killers. who was part of an insurrection that led to the cop killing and the brutalization of the police officers. now three dead. wow. i must say that actually goes beyond him just shooting

somebody on 5th avenue. he actually loud an insurrection against the united states government and republicans in washington, d.c. still don't give a damn. >> what is the claim he has on you? it's beyond me. we will continue this conversation. let's get to the latest moves from the biden administration. his pen is getting a lot of use in his first days in office, signing a slew of executive orders and actions. and there are more on the way today. two sources familiar with the move and an administration official tell nbc news that biden is expected to sign orders to reopen the healthcare.gov insurance markets for a special sign-up window here to people needing coverage in the pandemic. he is also expected to take steps to strengthen medicaid, the government-run health insurance program for low income americans, reopening the

affordable care act markets will like live yield a higher medicaid enrollment. he detailed his agenda on climate change, saying the administration's plan is addressing the existential threat with a greater sense of urgency. >> in my view, we have already waited too long to deal with this climate crisis. we can't wait any longer. we see it with our own eyes. we feel it. we know it in our bones. and it's time to act. >> biden's executive actions direct the federal government to open climate change to a national security priority. conserve 30% of all federal land and water by 2030 and suspend new leases for natural gas and oil development on federal lands and waters. >> you know, it's interesting, jonathan lemire, we said it for some time, but since legislation

doesn't actually pass through the united states congress and bills don't get signed into law much anymore, and they haven't for the last decade, we are now going through what we went through at the beginning of every administration. the president signs executive actions, and they remain in place until the next president gets sworn into office. and it's this sort of merry go round of legislation, and we're never able to pass something that remains on the books, that remains permanent. >> yeah, joe. it's reflective of internal partisanship and gridlock that plagued washington for a long time but particularly increase indeed recent decades. presidents obama and trump certainly were fond of the executive action. we're seeing president biden come out of the gate doing the same. look, his advisers know this is not ideal.

now, some of these executive orders are even more symbolic in nature. they sort of undercut the heart of the trump agenda. others have more meaning. and certainly this is something democrats have hoped for a while. reopening healthcare.gov, the obamacare exchanges. affordable care act was in president trump's cross-hairs his entire four years and never was able to get rid of it and never put forward his health care plan. in spite of being told it's going to come two weeks later, two weeks later. this is what president biden is able to do right now. they are first steps. such a striking difference in rhetoric on climate change. john kerry has a near cab let level position battling on the environment, talking about how this is not just a national security issues. this is a moment with the economy teetering, but this is

the moment to invest in more environmental friendly jobs to get americans back to work in new positions. but obviously this is limited to what legislation can do. and the biden's team focus, we will have an intense period of lobbying, to try to see what they can do with congress with the $1.9 trillion bill. whether it will be pushed to reconciliation or split in half. trying to get a deal focused on the virus and vaccine and pushed forward through reconciliation, some of the other parts of the package. that is their number one focus even as biden signs executive orders day after day. >> another striking difference is the approach to russia. the new secretary of state tony blinken held his first press conference where he said the biden administration is reviewing the response on russia, like hacking and other issues. and he had this to say about a lacksy navalny. >> we have a deep concern for

mr. navalny's safety and security. and the larger point is that his royce is the voice of many, many, many russians. and it should be heard not puzzled. >> these what we expected to hear the last four years raising concerns about election interference, about targeting troops, american troops in afghanistan, and now the jailed opposition leader alexei navalny. >> well, exactly. whether you're a leader in russia, whether you're vladimir putin or president xi in china, you have to know, you had to know the last four years were merely an aberration. that at some point the united states of america would once again be bringing up the case of political prisoners in russia, would be bringing up the case of hong kong, would be bringing up the case of uighers in

concentration camps that donald trump signed off in in a meeting with president xi. said, yeah, that sounds fine. china and russia had to know this was coming. and i will say the thing i said yesterday. in the long run it's best for u.s./russian relationships. it's best for u.s./china relationships that we have grown-ups at the table that will sit and lay out the concerns that congress having that donald trump didn't have, to sit down and have tough negotiations about it and figure out how we move forward together as rivals but not enemies. >> yeah. as with a lot of things, foreign and domestic, we had almost forgotten about what it is posed to look lik. sometimes it's ugly. sometimes its means confronting china or russia on issues like we heard from secretary blinken yesterday. >> all right.

still ahead on "morning joe", wall street can't stop taking about gamestop. why the video game retailer is having such an impact on the market now. plus, dr. anthony fauci will be our guest this morning on "morning joe". we'll be right back. be right ba. ♪♪ this is what community looks like. ♪♪ caring for each other, ♪♪ protecting each other. ♪♪ and as the covid vaccine rolls out, we'll be ready to administer it. ♪♪ it's time for sleep number's january sale on the sleep number 360 smart bed. you can adjust your comfort on both sides... your sleep number setting. we'll be ready to administer it. can it help me fall asleep faster? yes, by gently warming your feet. but, can it help keep me asleep?

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projecting that as many as 90,000 more americans will die from the coronavirus in the next four weeks. the virus has already taken over 430,000 u.s. lives. the administration's new health briefings are set for three times a week and part of biden's attempt to restore trust in resistance for the vaccine. as for the vaccine, white house

coordinator jeff zentz said they are looking into multiple ways of speeding up production. his comments come a day after president biden will provide states for 300 million americans by the end of summer. he said states are getting better at administering the shots. >> except for florida maybe. >> to pass biden's $1.9 trillion rescue plan, $400 billion for efforts to contain the virus, including increasing the pace of vaccination and ensuring more testing nationwide. joining us now, physician and fellow at the brookings institution dr. patel. she is with us. and dr. dave campbell. good to have you both. i like to always begin with where the virus stands right now. dr. dave, you have focused a lot

of your time on florida. my instinct is florida is doing terribly just looking at how people are behaving at night, out and about in cities. >> yeah. florida, like many states across the country, are not doing well. mika, we can see some little shining light in the numbers that have been coming out in the last week or two in terms of new cases and hospitalizations in florida and across the country. the grave concern that you will be hearing about all day and for the next few weeks are these variants that could be increasing the rate again with yet another surge if the unfortunate expectations come true. >> dr. patel, we're talking 90,000 more deaths before we can figure out how to roll out the vaccine in a way that gets to

everybody. is there any way that can be curtailed. we will hit half a million people. >> good morning, mika. happy to be here. hopefully with a little bit of good news. we're starting to see more data. it's not bleach. a combination of mono colonial antibodies before people get to hospitals that decrease death and the risk of becoming severely ill. this just emphasizes the biden administration, as they spoke about yesterday, has to do everything. they've got to fix the vaccine distribution and supply problem, fix what never got fixed on testing issues. it is ridiculous for me to get 48 hours on a turnaround. and they have to fix the issue of mask fatigue.

that's why governor newsom had to call it quits on stay-at-home orders because frankly nobody is following them in southern california. the hospitals are still deluge ltd but improving. >> we have talked so much about the defense production act the last year. a lot of americans suddenly became familiar with what it was and what it should be doing right now. with the biden administration talking about invoking that, what does that mean as a practical question to solve some of the problems you were just laying out in terms of just getting these shots made and distributed to the right people? >> yeah, willie. you heard andy talk about yesterday that's becoming a common phrase. these low volume dose syringes. and i have used these. you have to use kind of a special syringe to get that little extra vaccine to get six

doses of the pfizer vaccine instead of the five. there's actually not a lot of those syringes available. that is one practical example. the other has to do with any of the components to create and put the vaccines together. they are highly unstable in their original form. they require all sorts of particles to surround them and coatings. those are places you can help. you heard andy also mention they're going to look into having ramping up of manufacturing through other mechanisms. but that's not easy to do. i suspect, willie, along with getting us better ppe, and making better masks we can send to all americans would be one of the single best things we could do. even if people throw it away or give it to a neighbor. giving people a high-quality mask will make a difference with some of these emerging straepbs. >> had dr. dave campbell, where are we as far as the number of infections, the number of

deaths? are we -- do we expect to be plateauing off any time soon, or could things actually continue to get worse as we move toward the spring? >> joe, the concern is the variants that we are watching closely in the uk and south africa and now brazil could really this condition in the spring that shows increasing transmission rates again across the united states as a surge. to lower the risk of that, the cdc continues to recommend appropriately to ramp up the prevention measures, the mitigation measures, the face mask. where, as you have just heard, the social distancing. we are opening schools up in many places. that seems to be safer than some of the local community transmission and spread. as we have heard, open the schools, close the bars still

holds. but that can change. locally, if we see increasing transmission rates again, we will see schools pressured into closing. it is this mixed bag in january which happens to the worst month of the pandemic. so come february, had we're monitoring the surges, the kind of blips that go up and down across the country and we're watching the variants and the rollout, it is this race, joe. it is a race against increasing the number of shots in arms. we're at 25 million now and increasing every day or going into people's arms, against the tendency for mask from teague and these variants that are just this kind of crazy concern that are appropriately being monitored by all the experts to try to minimize these mutated

strains start to go spread and make yet another surge across the country. >> already. thank you both so much for coming on. they found themselves stuck in a snowstorm on the way back from a covid-19 vaccination event, went car to car injected stranded drivers before several of the doses expiredment josephine county health officials said the impromptu vaccine clinic took place after 20 employees were stopped in traffic on a highway after a vaccination clinic. six of the vaccines were getting close to expiring so the workers decided to offer them to other stranded drivers. the shots were meant for other people, but the snow meant those doses wouldn't make it to them before they expired, the health

department said. the staff walked vehicle to vehicle offering people a chance to receive the vaccine. public health workers tkphepb sterd all six doses of the moderna vaccine to six grateful drivers. coming up, state republican parties continue to go after republicans who support the impeachment of donald trump. we'll tell you who is being targeted now. "morning joe" is coming right back. ♪♪ smooth driving pays off you never been in better hands allstate click or call for a quote today

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some members of the massachusetts republican party are seeking to censure their state's republican governor charlie baker, over his support of trump's impeachment. governor baker called on the former president to step down

after the violent attack on the nation's capitol and supported invoking the 25th amendment. once former vice president mike pence made clear he would decline to pursue the amendment, the governor responded in part, impeachment is the only one that's left. members of a pro-trump faction of the massachusetts gop are claiming baker needs to be called out for siding with the democrats with some calling on baker to retract his support of impeachment. adam lange, a cape cod republican who supports trump said in part, quote, we need to unite our republican party. and a major reason we are divided is charlie baker. the message we are sending is we are republicans behind donald trump. this is a cult. . >> i can see, charlie, why they would want to take down charlie baker.

his approval rating in massachusetts. his approval rating plummeted to 72% in the bay state. he's actually the most popular governor, one of the most popular governors in america. and these jacks want to take him out. he's the only reason republicans have any power in that state. so of course they're so stupid they're attacking him. >> no. and you notice this cult-like behavior is spreading from one state to another. a lot of attention in arizona that the republican party there re-elected kelli ward, a conspiracy theorist. and then censured cindy mccain and former senator jeff flake. that was bad enough. but they also censured governor doug doocy. what did doug doocy do?

he was a trump supporter but he certified the election. so actually doing your job puts you on the wrong side of the cult. look, this is one of the reasons why republicans in congress are behaving the way they are. this has spread so deeply. and the republican party has been thoroughly, thoroughly trumpified. it tells you an awful lot about the move to purge liz cheney while giving marjorie greene committee assignments. a qanon supporting nutjob, bigot like marjorie taylor greene or somebody that stood on principle like cheney or adam kinsinger. a former president who is sulking down in mar-a-lago but the crazy is still strong.

>> trump's coup foiled by key republicans but the ranks are shrinking. you write this. the future may well belong not to republicans who believe in the rule of law but to republicans like senators josh hawley of missouri, ron johnson of wisconsin and ted cruz of texas or mo brooks of alabama, matt gaetz of florida or even elise stefanic of new york. don't assume it can't happen. because at the grassroots level, republicans continue to be radicalized. what if instead of raffensperger, someone like representative marjorie taylor greene had been in charge of counting georgia's votes? this time, the system worked. we may not be so lucky the next time around. one in oregon suggesting that

the capitol attack was a false flag to embarrass donald trump. that's an official statement from a republican party. so as you say, this is far from subsiding now that donald trump left office. it seems to be getting worse. . >> it does seem to be getting worse. and, look, we -- democracy actually prevailed in 2020. but it ought to be a warning. what if in fact, you have folks like this who are in charge of the secretary of state's office in georgia, as i suggested. what if you had one of the trump cultists on the pwaorbd of canvassing in michigan. at the grassroots, unfortunately that's the trend. they are saying, look, we are with you. we are conservatives. but this is wrong. you lost the election. qanon is toxic. they're not willing to do that.

as a result, what's been happening is you have this culture that republicans are not willing to stand up. so four years from now, what is the state of play going to be? who are the republicans making the decision? what if republican legislators in states like pennsylvania had done what donald trump wanted them to do and wanted to void the popular vote. right now, you know, we have seen the possibilities out there. so we had the dry run for the coup. that doesn't mean we're never going to see the real thing. . >> so, charlie, this gives us also an opportunity to look back at all the lies that donald trump supporters told people like you and told people like me over the past four years. what did your friends and family members and my friends and my family members tell me about why they're voting for donald trump. oh, it's about the policies.

it's not about the man. it's about the policies. he's in charge. he can get a lot of things done. now what do we find? he's not pushing any policies forward. he's not doing anything to change washington, d.c. or a single law that's on the book. and they slavishly remain dedicated to this guy who wanted to be their tyrant. so actually they were lying to us all along. it was never about the policies. it was always about the man. and in the house, and in the senate, the republicans still are captive to this man. >> they lied to us. they also maybe lied to themselves. they rationalized, okay, i can't pay attention to what he says. i look at all the things he does. and we also, you know, it's a binary choice. if you don't support donald

trump, then the socialists will take over. well, none of that is true anymore. as i mentioned earlier, you're not going to get any more supreme court justices, any more executive orders. there is no policy left. and you have seen in fact, maybe you ought to pay attention to donald trump's words. this big theme among republicans don't pay attention to what he says. maybe in retrospect you should have paid attention because words have consequences. the words are ugly. and they're still there. maybe it turns out republicans weren't supporting trump in spite of the ugly aspects of trumpism. maybe they were all in on that too. maybe that wasn't the glitch. maybe that was the feature. that they kind of liked that. >> yeah. >> by the way, the words -- don't take him literally. yeah, you've got to take him literally. always had to take him literally. his words led to the killing of

cops. his cops led to the maiming of cops. his words led to an insurrection against the united states of america. his words led to the storming of the united states capitol. terrorists took control of the united states capitol because of his words. >> charlie sykes, thank you very much for being on with us this morning. still ahead, three weeks after the deadly capitol riot, the department of homeland security issues a new national terrorism alert. due to concerns over domestic extremism. >> plus, senate democrats are lotting their next moves after only five republicans voted to move forward with the impeachment trial. we'll look at some of the options being discussed. and dr. anthony fauci will be our guest. "morning joe" is back in a moment. ng joe" is back in a moment

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>> a live look at new york city as the sun comes up this morning. we're just about to hit the top of the hour. welcome back to "morning joe". it is thursday, january 28th. along with joe, willie and me, we have chief white house correspondent for the "new york times", peter pwaeurbg. editor-at-large for the nonprofit newsroom and 19th and msnbc contributor, aaron haines is with us. and mike barnicle. and capitol hill correspondent and the host of "way too early", kasie hunt is still with us. good to have you all on board this hour. the department of homeland security has issued a national terrorism advisory of heightened threat environment across the

united states. a heightened threat environment across the united states. the alert that went out yesterday didn't have any information related to a specific credible thought but said motivation could lu anger over the presidential transition and other perceived grievances fueled by false narratives. a clear reference to the false voter fraud allegations pushed by former president trump. an official who drafted the bulletin said the issue to issue the report was driven by the department's conclusion that president biden's peaceful inauguration last week could create a false sense of security because the intent to engage in violence has not gone away among extremists angered by the outcome of the presidential election. willie? .

>> so peter pwaeurbg, this obviously is an effort by homeland security to say this threat has not subsided. let's be clear, it was the lie that persists and the lie still floated by some members of congress that in fact, joe biden is not the legitimate president of the united states that drives a lot of this. extremists groups had driven them before. it's not going or anywhere. it's become the focus of law enforcement in the biden administration. >> well, i think that's exactly right. you know, we have heard this now for months, years, that this domestic hate, the domestic terrorism was a serious, if not the most serious threat to the american government. it wasn't until january 6th that i think people in washington woke up and talked about what happened. chris wray, going back, much to the consternation of the trump administration which thought

that he walked the page. i think this warning shows from the dhs the threat hasn't gone away. this was not a one off. it was not related to a specific, you know, moment in time. all the arrests we have seen, as important as they are, have not broken the back of this movement. and washington remains under threat. if you're here in washington, what you see all the time unfortunately now are uniformed soldiers trolling the streets and barriers up where there never used to be barriers. it still feels like not the camp it was january 20th. but it feels like a city under occupation in some sense. that's because people expect there is a real risk here. >> prosecutors indicted three members of the far right group the oathkeepers. the indictments handed down yesterday describe self-proclaimed members conspired as far back as november to obstruct congress during the riot.

that charge alone could carry a maximum sentence of 20 years, mika. >> all right. now to the upcoming second impeachment trial of former president trump. sources tell nbc news trump does not plan to appear in person at the senate trial but that he may submit a written letter to defend himself against the charge that he incited an insurrection at the u.s. capitol. nbc has also learned that trump added north carolina attorney joshua howard to his defense team. a former federal prosecutors who worked on investigations into the clinton white house. meanwhile, senate democrats are weighing options after only five senate republicans voted tuesday to move forward with the trial. climate legislation and cabinet confirmations, the "washington post" reports that some senate democrats are eyeing a short

one-week trial. after privately pitching their colleagues on a bipartisan resolution to krepb cher the former president, "axios" reports that democratic senator tim kaine and republican senator susan collins are now forging ahead with a proposal that lays some groundwork to possibly bar trump from holding future office >> kasie hunt, give us the latest you're hearing to the hill about this strange back and forth between mitch mcconnell and republicans. mitch several times trying to push them forward, warning them not to do what they did. it cost him the senate and two seats in georgia. as he tries to gently nudge them, he pulls back because the caucus still seems to be more

beholdened to donald trump than anybody else. >> it's pretty remarkable, joe. i think you were absolutely right in the last hour to point this out. mitch mcconnell knows this was their one chance to push donald trump off the stage. and he knew heading into the electoral counting that the best way to start to do that was to just let it go forward. and he made that known on internal conference calls. and josh hawley is the one who ignored him. once hawley was out doing that, ted cruz followed right along to try and continue to push forward with questioning these results. we all saw what happened on january 6th. and since then, mcconnell has been clear. and he is a man of few words. he says nothing by accident. he leaks almost nothing by accident. he knows how to use the system

to send a message to the public, to his own members of his conference, to the president of the united states, former president of the united states. and he is saying that what donald trump did is an impeachable offense. and you started out the show with exactly those quotes. it is night and day the way we talked about impeachment. we were talking about ukraine and how he is talking about it now. he is saying he is open to convicting the president. but the thing is, his power is generated from inside his conference and winning elections. he's done that by going out and winning elections. people have believed that. i think the problem now is it's not clear to me he has that same support inside the conference. there are too many who aren't willing to stech their own necking out here. the question is whether they can convince more that it is worth the personal sacrifice in this

moment to do something good for the party and the country in the long run. >> so republican senator mitt romney is calling out his fellow republicans who refused to acknowledge president joe biden's victory in the presidential election. >> and the people largely on my side who said, look, it will inflame passions more. i say, first of all, have you gone out publicly and said there was not widespread voter fraud and that joe biden is legitimate president of the united states? if you said that, then i'm happy to listen to you to talk about other things that might inflame anger and divisiveness. if you haven't said that, that is what is at the source of the anger right now. >> wow. i'm not sure, mike barnicle, what it would take, why, why, why we're still here. >> you know, mika, what mitt

romney said is the source of the anger right now. it's the lie that donald trump began talking about, perpetrated, made come alive each and every day multiple times a day, that the election was rigged. that joe biden was not elected president. the thing was fixed state after state. legislativers have to do the right thing. it was his constant big lie that has triggered the main story of the "new york times" today. the terrorists who invaded the capitol, and they are terrorists, they are insurrectionists and they committed a criminal act of treason when they did that, they are triggered still by this big lie. good for mitt that he spoke to it. the larger problem is we have thousands of people in this country and thousands of organized groups aimed at overthrowing the american government because of one man, donald j. trump and one lie,

that joe biden is not the legal president of the united states. and that is still out there thick in the air among these crazy people >> kasie, i hear you on mcconnell's strategy in terms of impeachment. let me put to you the rabid paul question. how can you vote in support of my motion to say that a trial is unconstitutional and then during that trial vote to convict? how would mcconnell go about stating that? >> rand paul has been a thorn in mitch mcconnell's side even though they are from the same state. what i would say, honestly, the logical connection is obviously there. rand paul has a logical point from. a political perspective, and in the way that we were talking how mitch mcconnell does everything deliberately. rand paul threw this as a surprise move before mcconnell was ready to make a statement one way or the other about how he was going to actually vote on

impeachment. and his comments about still being open to it came after that vote. he didn't want us to send us all spiraling and that he was going to go about impeaching donald trump on a timeline that wasn't his. as we have seen, mcconnell is willing to disexpense with whatever seems like to all of us a logical straightline argument if he knows he's going to do something differently politically. and he comes up with an argument to back that up. so i think that's what you're seeing here. i think it's possible he hasn't made up his mind yet. you could see him vote to acquit the president based on factors that we don't know as these weeks unfold ahead of the trial. but i wouldn't take his vote on the rand paul motion as gospel at this point. >> and mika, as kasie knows better than any reporter up there, you often vote

procedurely with your party. >> right. >> in fact, i would always have the party whips come up to me knowing that i was going to vote on a final vote. they would say, scarborough, you have to be together on the procedural vote. stay with us on the procedural vote. on the substantive vote, if you want to go your own way, we can't stop you from doing that. but with us on the procedural vote. the party needs to stay together. that's how they organize the votes. in this case he wasn't doing a favor for rand paul. he knew it was going to come down. this happens on capitol hill. you vote with the party on a procedural issue and then you're free to go your own way on the underlying issue later.

>> there's this. a new bill aims to make it harder for absentee voters in georgia to cast their ballots during an election. the legislation introduced yesterday in the state's senate would create a photo identification requirement for voting outside of polling places. voters would need to submit their i.d. twice, once when applying for absentee ballots and once when returning them. state and federal officials are said there was no evidence of widespread voter fraud. earlier this week, we reported on the efforts led by republican state legislators in other states to restrict voting in their states, perhaps learning the wrong lesson after trump's

loss? we have seen moves in texas, north carolina, arizona, and now georgia, erin haines. it's like opposite day for the republicans approximate in school. >> no, mika, it is more like consistent day. georgia was a leader in the voter i.d. fight back when i was first covering the georgia legislature a decade ago. now we still have a solution in search of a problem. to your point, there is no evidence of widespread voter fraud in this country. and, in fact, you had federal officials saying this was the most secure election in the history of the country in 2020. and yet we still have republican officials in georgia basically responding to the record turnout of voters of color, people kwho

had not previously voted being part of the expanded electorate in that state. mainly because of a campaign to get them to vote absentee because of the pandemic, try ig to squash that as a path to their increased participation in future elections. so i think the backlash to an kwrepbt see balloting, because that was such a successful strategy for democrats this time around, the natural response i think we will see in statehouses around the country will be to curb absentee balloting through state legislation. >> so peter baker, what is the talk inside the biden administration on the chaos still swirling around the republican party and the upcoming trial of donald trump? obviously biden is moving

forward. a lot of executive orders we talked about earlier. anthony blinken is in at state. janet yellen is in treasury. they are moving forward quickly. i don't know. maybe you can give me some insight. if i were a politician and making a thousand decisions and they weren't being covered every day up close by the media because of this massive -- you know, an invasion of the united states capitol. i'd be pretty happy about that. i'm sure bill clinton is thinking, well, i could have used this the first couple of weeks of my presidency when everybody was talking about zoe baird and all of these other -- jimmy carter and in his first couple weeks when he granted amnesty to vietnam draft dodgers. the first couple of weeks can be really, really lugly. but donald trump and the republicans continue to provide

a shield against the hot, bright sun for the new president. >> yeah. two-edged sword here. on the one hand, as new president, you want to be able to set the tone, you want to move on from your predecessor and be the person really in charge. and you have seen a president here in his first week in office, great action. he signed more than 40 executive orders, memoranda and proclamations so far on so many topics, climate, immigration, covid obviously, private prisons and so forth. and he is trying to, in this initial burst of action, a couple of things. one, wipe out the trump legacy in the space of as few takes as he can, two to give energy, and three to say we're moving on, turning the page. the problem is if you end up spending a long amount of time in the senate starting on february 9th on the trial of your predecessor, you're not

moving on. you're not able to begin really handling the bigger stuff that you need in terms of legislation because the senate is occupied by this exercise which we now know to be unlikely, if not impossible to lead to actual conviction. you know, there are a lot of different possibilities here. could mcconnell switch directions. could tim kane, susan collins get resolution on their censure resolution. we don't know. but the biden administration should be able to move on and focus on their initiatives. you're right, the longer trump remains sort of on stage, it union guys his own party. there are a lot of progress if's who are prime to be disappointed with president biden, he hasn't done this, having gone as far as they might prefer. buff having him as a common

enemy with other things don't. reminds me you might not be appreciative of everything biden is doing, but, hey, he is not donald trump. . >> it seems with every stroke of the pen, every executive order president biden has issued, he's signaling that he is winding back and unwinding things president trump did with his own actionsing executive orders. you know with people around the president they would not like to engage much on impeachment. the president finally said, yes, i think the senate is right to have a trial. i'll let them do their job. when you ask press secretary, for example, not terribly interested in talking about that. they say we want to work on our own agenda. we'll let the senate do its business. you get the sense they want to plow ahead with their business rather than focus on the impeachment. . >> the pending impeachment trial is nothing less than a huge

attraction. we have had enormous action out of the biden administration in a very short period of time since the in inauguration. the government hasn't been used for positive purposes in a long, long time. that's his goal. so far he's achieving his goal on a daily basis, often through executive actions that he signs. but i think if he sat down and was fully open about his feelings about impeachment, i think he would reiterate exactly what you just said. it's not in the best and of the ongoing biden administration to have the united states senate distracted. and especially distracted when on the other side, the opposition to impeaching donald trump is nothing but a full-blown case of the crazies among the republican party. i mean, look at what has happened to that party. look at the prominent

republicans mentioned in the media the past two weeks. and they're not nationally prominent people but greene. the bobart from colorado. so far the crazy right, you could focus on them. that would be helpful to move forward in terms of popularity for the biden administration. but, no, impeachment, it's a distraction. >> so, kasie, let me ask you. what have you heard yesterday, we got more information about a new republican member of congress who called for the assassination of nancy pelosi, liked it on her facebook page. when the lynching of barack obama was brought up, she said be patient. those plans are taking shape. we need to make sure we do it correctly.

in a way that liberal judges don't get in the way of us lynching barack obama. well, and of course, you know, her campaign ad that showed her holding an ar-15 and targeting three members of congress. what were the words again? i'm coming after them or something like that? three democratic members of congress. something going on offense or something like that. but it very much looked like she was targeting three women of color in the united states congress. man, i don't -- i don't care what my ideology was. if i'm a member of the house of representatives and i have been a member of the house of representatives, i would tell my majority leader, my minority leader to get their you know what together and to get this taken care of and rectified and get anybody who called for the

assassination directly or indirectly of another member of that institution, to get them on the floor, make them apologize, or expel them. that's black and white. that would have been black and white in my day. that would have been black and white in any day. like are there -- are republicans concerned about this? we have people talking about assassinaing other members of congress? >> yeah. you're right not to use her name. this is what they thrive on, attention. and i think the attention is rightfully placed on what leaders are doing about this. and kevin mccarthy sat this person on the education committee in the house, even though she has called shootings of schoolchildren in florida and connecticut, newtown and parkland, false flag events online. and while mccarthy was on a conference call yesterday and he told his members to cut the crap

was the quote, to stop criticizing other members in public because it was creating unsafe situations for other republicans, there are a lot of republicans this morning about what he is actually doing about it. matt gaetz said at 1:00 p.m. today, he is going to cheyenne, wisconsin, the state capitol, calling on patriots to assemble to oppose liz cheney on her vote on impeachment. what is kevin mccarthy doing? it seems like a call to action, the same call to action that led to the events january 6th. i think you're right to raise these questions. how would you feel, anyone watching the show this morning, if there was somebody in your office that posted something like this on facebook, a photo of themselves with a gun and vague threatening language towards them or directly

threatening language toward them? would you feel safe going into your office? because that's what it is like for the other members of the house of representatives. it's their office. >> yeah. willie, it's one thing for somebody to come into my district and hold a rally against me. and i would say bring it on if they did that. it's another thing if you have a sitting member of congress who has called for the assassination of other members of congress who have suggested that other members of congress that she was going to target them with an ar-15, if she had talked about the lynching of barack obama, a former united states president and said, hey, sit tight. we're going to do it. we're going to take care of it. thanks are getting in place for the lynching of a former president of the united states. like that -- that's, again,

that's an immediate discussion with a member, immediate censuring. i'm sure it violates the rules of the house. how for the safety of all members. i don't understand. really does kevin mccarthy, after january 6th, think that he can, like, allow this to happen in his midst? do other house republican members think this is acceptable or okay? their safety is also on the line. we saw the guy that shot up scalise. he said he was a bernie sanders supporter. we know there are crack pots on both sides.

most of the crack pots are right wing crack pots. but it's not like there aren't people unhinged or could get unhinged on both sides if this escalated. what's kevin mccarthy doing? what is steve scalise doing? what are other leaders doing other than trying to get rid of liz cheney who just simply said you can't throw out millions and millions of black votes. >> yeah. you've got a congressman from northwest florida flying to cheyenne wisconsin today to protest liz cheney's seat at the table in the republican party. bizarre to say the least. your point about kevin mccarthy is the right one. are you afraid of two, three, four people who sit as far back on the bench as you can sit, just being elected to the congress. are you afraid of crossing them on death threats? is he scared of the voters that put those people in?

is he scared of trump voters and what they may say? i think the answer is yes. the leader of the republican party kevin mccarthy is afraid of the back bench of his party. kasie was in that building that day. they have metal detectors outside the chamber now. some have protested that on infringement of their rights to carry a question on the floor of the chamber. that comes in the context of the crack pot congresswoman who study with an automatic rival with a picture of three democrats saying we have to go on offense. how is this a tough call if you're kevin mccarthy, how is it a tough call to speak out about this? these are death threats against members of congress. say something. >> all right. peter pwaeurbg, thank you very much for being on this morning. still ahead on "morning joe", new pressure to reopen schools after cdc pointed to new

research pointing to that students can be safe if precaution is taken. dr. fauci will join us for a live interview. plus, what our next guest calls an audacious power play by black america in the history of the country. charles blow explains. you're watching "morning joe". we'll be right back. s. you're watching "morning joe". we'll be right back. every zip ? add an employee. or ten... then easily and automatically pay your team and file payroll taxes. that means... world domination! or just the west side. run payroll in less than five minutes with intuit quickbooks. we made usaa insurance for members like martin. an air force veteran made of doing what's right, not what's easy. so when a hailstorm hit, usaa reached out before he could even inspect the damage. that's how you do it right. usaa insurance is made just the way martin's family needs it with hassle-free claims,

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♪♪ it's 32 past the hour. people are starting to wake up in new york city. pretty empty there. joining us now, author, journalist and op-ed columnist for the "new york times", charles blow joins us. his new book is entitled "the devil you know," a black power

manifesto in which he argues of a second great migration in the south in order to concentrate black political influence and fight the threat of white supremacy on american democracy. wow. charles, welcome back to the show. good to see you. >> good to be here. >> your main point is we are still dealing with widespread racism. >> right. tell them to go back to where they came from. louisiana, mississippi, south carolina. another three states were within four percentage points of being majority black. black people -- the majority of black people lived in the south

the entire 400 years black people have been on this soil. there was a pull of northern industry as young white men went away to fight in world war i and again in world war ii. they needed more bodies to do the work. but there was also the push of white supremacist terror that pushed black people out of the south in addition to the collapse of the cotton industry with the infection that collapsed the cotton economy across the cotton states. >> you know, charles, as you know very well, a few of those states are at a tipping point right now. we saw in georgia the power of black voters going out with disaffected white voters in the northern suburbs of atlanta. in north carolina, we saw really small margin of republicans and democrats. that state is becoming more

democratic by the day. we saw democrats winning governorships in louisiana and kentucky. you are not talking about a massive migration before you have black americans being able to help run and control the legislative direction, societal direction of several southern states. >> yes, absolutely. but what happened in georgia, make no mistake about it, was in part the result of the reverse migration that is already under way. the last time that georgia went democrat was in 1992. black people were not the driving force of that. they were only 25% of the population of georgia in 1992. this year they were 3333% of the population of georgia. the black population of georgia doubled from 1.7 million people to 3.4 million people.

there was the amazing organizing of a bunch of groups, including the amazing stacey abrams. when you saw the two georgia senators be elected to the senate, the first time in history that the majority force in electing senators to the u.s. senate. it is a seismic shift that demonstrates what reverse migration, combined with political activism, can reshape the south and the politics of the south. as reverend barber put it to me, if you change the south, you change america. >> erin haines, jump in. >> hey there, charles. congratulations. >> hi there. >> hey there.

you being a native louisianan and me being a native georgian, this is where the majority of black people live, the majority of the country. black women organizers mobilizing and galvanizing the electorate is such a huge key to the strategy that you talk about. stacey abrams basically laid out the playbook. what she did can be replicated in other states. you say reverse migration is under way, even as folks may be loading up the u-haul and heading back home, in states like louisiana, in states like north carolina, in states like florida where black women organizers, in virginia you have two black women running for governor this year. places where this -- what we saw in georgia could be happening in

other states across the south. you know, looking at where the reverse migration is already taking place, i guess, what are your thoughts on targets that might be next for both the black women organizers and the states where you have critical cal mass already of black voters that could be the tipping point that you talk about? >> well, you need the organizing. but right now you may not have the critical mass yet, right? you need the infusion. you need other straits to do what georgia did, which was to double your black population in 30 years. and we haven't seen that widespread enough around the south. partly because not enough national leaders are are making the argument that i am now making. part of it is also you need success stories like georgia to tell people that it's possible. not only is it possible at a political level that you can move to the south and you're not going to give up your way of

life. in fact, the black middleclass is thriving in many of these southern cities. when you look at household income -- increase in household income, it is strongest in the south and west. the most black-owned businesses, that is in the southeast. you have to be able to tell people both things they were able to tell them during the great migration, which was there is an economic opportunity here but there's also access to political power here. and when i look across the south, i see, you know, mayor jackson was the first mayor of a major southern city. it happened in 1973. it happened because in 1970 was the first year it became majority black. after that, now you look across the south and almost every major american city has a black mayor. young, revolutionary, energetic

people. there are 1,200 majority in america. 90% of them in the south. right now, as we speak, 10% of all -- i'm sorry. a quarter of all black people in america live under black municipal control. the idea of being in a space where your government is responsive to you, looks like you, is doing its best to not have you live on a structure that was described in the late 1800s to be white supremacists on its face explicitly is attractive to people like me. >> well, the new book is "the devil you know." a black power manifesto. charles blow, thank you so much for being on this morning. we look forward to having you back as soon as possible. and coming up, president biden says we can't wait any

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>> national climate adviser gina mccarthy and my former boss, former secretary of state john kerry. and a big day for boston in the briefing room. go ahead. >> thank you. it's a big day for boston every day. >> yes. and boston's big day continues right here on "morning joe". gina mccarthy joins us now. she is the new white house white house climate adviser. congratulations. we will keep that boston connection going. mike barnicle will take the first question.

mike? >> gina, i'm here and i can interpret anything that i say or you say. >> thank you. . >> let me ask this. yesterday you were on the white house -- in the white house press room with former secretary of state john kerry. you are the national climate investigationer to the president of the united states. and i realize we're only eight days into the administration. john kerry is the global climate envoy for the president of the united states. what roles are both of you playing? is was there any potential for conflict in the two jobs global versus international climate? >> i will tell you, mike, i would never argue with john kerry. there's no way for climate conflict. i would lose every time. as we move to reengage in the paris accord and work with our international partners, we have

to strengthen that accord. we have to make it consistent what science is telling us about the global actions that need to happen. and to do that, we need to be good players. we need to be strong. so john kerry is actually working in that international arena. my job is to deliver the strongest commitment we can make in the united states to reduce our global emissions. and the way that this plan shakes up is just very exciting, which is why it's getting praeutsz from the labor community and the environmental community and progressives. because it is shaped to actually look for the actions to move forward, that grow jobs, that look to the future. that's part of the build better that will make us healthier, thank god, because we need to get out of the economic danger and the health danger that we're in today. so it's really joe biden making

a statement. president biden is saying yesterday he is embracing science again. he is setting up infrastructure to make us rejoin the paris agreement and address climate change. and he's going to make sure that every step we take domestically is strengthening our economy, growing millions of jobs, relying on a clean energy future. and not leaving communities or workers behind. because we have a lot of work to do and a lot of crises we're facing. we can do it if we think about each one of them and ask every agency to spend their money and procure products that send a signal about where we want to be in the future. that's what this plan is all about. >> hey, gina, it's willie geist in this boston celebration, i should disclose i'm a yankee fan from new jersey. i want to get that out of the way at the outset here. as you talked about the groups that lined up behind your plan, you have heard from many republicans and people who work in oil and gas concerned about some of these directives.

it's going to cost their jobs, their industries, going to cost many towns their livelihoods. what do you say to people who worry about even if they want to see us move to green energy, move towards those jobs? >> i think we did a pretty good job making sure we're sending the signal. what we're looking at is not to transition people and workers to nothing but to look at how we build jobs that are going to be suitable for every worker in every community. so we put in here a couple of really creative ideas. we will put together a task force to look at the communities highly dependent on localized utilities, localized coal. and bring them together on how we revitalize those communities. we will open up opportunities for those workers to look at all the mines and all the literally thousands and thousands of oil and gas wells that were never

properly closed that are spewing methane. those are jobs they can immediately do better out of the gate better than any of us can. we are looking at being creative and sending a signal this is about a transition. people have the time and we invest in the communities left behind. a lot of this is not just about the coal industry or rural communities. a lot of this is about, look, making sure that the communities that really have not been invested in, those that have been impacted by systemic racism can a lot of the benefits from this. because we know they're hurting in covid-19 and they're in the crosshairs of climate so we have to move forward. >> kasie hunt. kasie? >> i was going to say, i may not be a red sox physician, but i like them better.

gina, you can do a lot with what you have outlined here with executive actions, with what the administration can do. but you can go a lot further with actual legislation. it does seem as though mitch mcconnell came out over the last four years and said, yes, climate change is real, it's caused by humans. there seems to be a willingness or interest among congress, those who were previously reluctant because they can get money for green jobs to their districts, their states. what do you think you can actually accomplish with this congress on climate change? >> we think we can accomplish a lot with the executive authorities that we have and with the money that the federal government spends. this is about reducing subsidies to the fossil fuel companies and starting to really invest our public resources. the billions that are given to the agencies to establish an

opportunity to really invest money wisely. so that we're procuring the kind of products we're asking the private sector to procure. that triggers the market and a lot of opportunities for private sector ventures. that's what we're hoping to do. in terms of congress, you know the president has to move forward with a bill that is looking at building back better. that's looking for infrastructure improvements. these things are not dependent on climate needs, they're human needs, they're ways in which our country has to start investing in itself again so we're not falling behind. with buy america, which is all about revitalizing our manufacturing to build the products of today and the future, and with build back better there are opportunities for us to grow a lot of jobs. you're right invest in a lot of communities. this should not be a republican versus democrat issue.

this is about america. we're facing four crises today. we better figure it out and work together. so i have great hopes because i don't think anybody is better at bringing the country together than president biden. >> white house climate adviser gina mccarthy, thank you very much for the boston reunion this morning. we'll see you soon i'm sure. still ahead this morning, amateur investors do battle with wall street's 1% driving up the prices of stocks that professional investors have bet against. is this indicative of a larger issue on wall street? possibly a gigantic bubble. we'll go live to cnbc for the latest reporting on this story that the investing world can't seem stop talking about.

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acclaim for her performance at last week's presidential inauguration, 22-year-old amanda gorman, the nation's youngest inaugural poet laureate will recite an original poem during the super bowl pregame ceremony a week from this sunday. her poem will recognize three honorary captains chosen by the nfl for their service throughout the pandemic, an educator, a nurse and a marine veteran. i love that and look forward to it. still ahead on "morning joe," president biden's new covid task force says vaccine distribution is ramping up as coronavirus deaths across the country inch closer and closer to half a million. dr. anthony fauci will join us to discuss the latest on the fight against the virus. that's ahead on "morning joe." we're back in 90 seconds.

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plan on listening to the evidence. that was senator mitch mcconnell in 2019 ahead of trump's first impeachment trial compared to what he said yesterday ahead of trump's second impeachment trial. mcconnell might still vote to acquit but he's at least pretending to be impartial this time around. good morning. welcome to "morning joe." it is thursday january 28th. along with joe, willie and me, we have white house reporter for the associated press, jonathan lemire. founder of the conservative website, the bull work and author of "how the right lost its mind" charlie sykes with us. good to have you both. >> you know. willie, about mitch, regarding mitch, he's been trying since january 6th -- actually he's been trying since the

president's election and before january 6th to drag his conference along with him. what did he say? do not contest the electors. this will end very badly for us. mitch warned us. he warned america. he said don't do this. josh hawley did it any way. josh hawley was too good, too smart, little bird-handed -- >> okay. >> -- insurrectionist. >> that was his fist bump. >> he ignored mitch. and then mitch, post-january 6th, sent another signal to republicans, which was what the president did was impeachable. did it off the record and then on the record last week. said the president's actions led to the insurrection, to the

riot. and his party, i mean, you know, you would think they would listen to him after they lost both seats in georgia. but they're not doing it. and mitch mcconnell knows. the republican party is cracking in half. and he's telling republicans in the senate what they can do to save their party. but they're too scared about saving their own seat to even think that way. >> they ignored him almost unanimously, 45 out of 50 of them voted for the rand paul motion the other day, including mitch mcconnell. so the problem with his statement yesterday where he said i'm going to listen to the evidence, we'll have a trial, and i will make my decision, he has already voted and been on the record with the rand paul motion saying the trial is unconstitutional. rand paul came out of that vote and said how could you ever say the trial is unconstitutional and then vote to convict. that's when rand paul said this is over. it's dead on arrival. so, yes, mitch mcconnell

probably didn't want to be here. it looks like now that they are here, that republicans are here, that the tide has overwhelmed him. he's going to have to go ahead and vote to acquit the president of the united states. >> charlie sykes, we will see what happens between now and impeachment. if his caucus overwhelmingly votes to acquit, if you're the majority leader. and you want to stay the majority leader, you're going to vote to acquit. and i know why this might tick people off, but i understand why mitch did what he did yesterday. you're a majority leader. you keep trying to drag them along, say, hey, insurrection is bad. like being on the side of cop killers is bad. being on the side of trump terrorists are bad. obviously not enough of them were persuaded with that vote yesterday. if you're the majority leader, okay, i'm going to vote with them. then i'm going to try to pull them my way for the impeachment vote which, again, is a signal

he sent yesterday. i understand it's nuanced and when we do not live in the land of nuance in washington, d.c., cable news, podcasts, et cetera, et cetera. but that is what's going on. and i think the fascinating story here, and i'm not putting a halo over mitch, but i think the fascinating story here is you've got a guy that has proven himself to be extraordinarily cynical. and he is being extraordinarily cynical in trying to save the republican party from themselves, from their worst instincts, from the trump terrorists. and they won't listen to him. >> yeah. well, it's time to move on. it's been a whole three weeks. and there's only six people who are dead. the extraordinary thing, joe, is both the speed and the thoroughness of republicans crawling back to donald trump in less than, what, 21 days. so you have mccarthy down in florida who is going to kiss the ring.

and the thing about mitch mcconnell, he knows better. he knows what happened. he knows there was an insurrection conspired by the president of the united states who used all the powers of his office to overturn a free and fair election. he knows that. and he's still going to go along with all of this. what's interesting about this, what's their excuse now? you and i, joe, heard from people saying, okay, trump is awful. but at least we will get justices, tax cuts, regulatory cuts. guess what? donald trump is gone. you're not going to get any of that anymore. it has expired. yet they are still going along. there are senators not even running for re-election. they can't even claim they're afraid of the tweets because he doesn't tweet anymore. yet they're going along with it. it gives you an indication just how thoroughly the republican party has been trumpified and corrupted. they are doubling down on

rationalizing the insurrection, rationalizing the big deep lie about the election. not only do they appear not to be shamed, some of them appear to be emboldened. i have to say, joe, i woke up this morning -- and i don't want to be too negative -- but i think the post-trump republican party could be worse than the trump republican party. under trump, you could say it's just trump. how bad can it actually get? now we know how bad it is. and they are okay with it. they are going along with it. and they are coming out in a couple of weeks and say, look, total exoneration. >> yep. and yet they get nothing out of it. they're not going to ride on air force one anymore. they're not going to get perks, ambassadorships for their donors and buddies and anything. that's over. and they're still in suck up mode. >> and here is what's so fascinating.

it really is. we know, we know what's going to happen to them. we don't have to say there's a midterm in 2022. no. just we just have to look back a couple of weeks and see what happens in georgia. that's all we have to do. we don't have to look at political polls, polls that show joe biden's approval ratings are plus 26 and donald trump's are in the tank. we don't have to look at that. we don't have to look at what's happened the past four years, what happens if you follow donald trump. we don't have to go back and tell you about the huge gains democrats made in the 2017 elections in virginia and across the country. we don't have to tell you what happened in 2018 where democrats won by the largest landslide vote-wise in the history of the republic and the congressional races. we don't have to tell you that. we don't have to tell you

about the southern democratic governors that were elected in 2019. all we have to tell you is that donald trump is the first president since herbert hoover, listen to me, republicans, -- for those who have ears to hear, hear -- donald trump, this guy you are kowtowing to still, it's the first president since hoover to lose the house, to lose the senate, and to lose the white house all in one term. >> still ahead, dr. anthony fauci joins the conversation. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. it's time for sleep numbers january sale on the new sleep number 360 smart bed. what if i sleep hot? ...or cold? no problem. with temperature balancing you can sleep better together. can it help keep me asleep? absolutely, it intelligently senses your movements and automatically adjusts to keep you both effortlessly comfortable. will it help me keep up with mom? you got this. so you can really promise better sleep?

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♪♪ jonathan lemire, you have kevin mccarthy reaching out to donald trump. by the way, the guy who may be

up for insurrection against the united states of america, the guy who inspired cop killers. the guy who inspired a mob to kill cops and to batter cops with american flags. kevin mccarthy, in the name of unity, is going down to mar-a-lago to talk to donald trump. when any sane person would say you should probably walk over to lynne cheney's office and apologize. but he's just too stupid -- and it hurts me to say that about him -- but he's just too stupid politically to do it. >> joe, we're still grappling with the aftershocks of that insurrection. another capitol police officer yesterday was reported to have committed suicide, one who was on duty that day. adding another death to the terrible events of january 6th. certainly in terms of the political stakes, republicans seem to be making their

decision, and their decision is to return to donald trump out of -- even with the tweets being silenced, there is this fear with republicans that i talked to, in the ex-president's circle and those on the hill, still believe there is a movement there. if not trump himself at this moment, but trumpism. and supporters are so loyal and would be willing to go with him if indeed he were to signal primary challenges to these republicans, whether that's in '22 or another time. this may proof foolhardy. we talked about some polls yesterday that showed trump's popularity within the party dipping just a little bit, but he does still have a significant hold to the gop right,000. that is the calculation they are making. it's one out of fear. out of believing this is where the party is. they are afraid to alienate those. you mentioned mccarthy. he did briefly rebuke the president. we had private remarks in the last week or so after the

insurrection. and of course word got back to the president and it was widely how unhappy he was with mccarthy, so now we see the gop leader heading down to florida to try to make amends and reconcile their differences. we did see mitch mcconnell speak out strongly about what happened on january 6th. he did say how important it was so certify joe biden's victory. let's of course remember it took weeks to get there, allowing some of this fervor to build that eventually led to that insurrection. and now of course he is saying to colleagues, vote your conscious. i have talked to republicans in the last few days about this. the delay that mcconnell did in the trial, though at the time, though certainly it has allowed more and more evidence to come forward, more and more video to show how bad january 6th was. at the same time, it allowed a cooling off period and allowed these republicans to talk to their constituents, to talk to their advisers who told them,

no, donald trump is still the republican party now. you don't want to alienate them. there would have been more votes to convict back on january 7th, 8th or 9th than there are today. >> jonathan mentioned the new details we're about to talk about, the deaths and debilitating injuries police officers sustained during the january 6th attack on the u.s. capitol. according to the chairman of the capitol police labor committee, some officers suffered brain injuries, cracked ribs, smashed spinal cord discs. one officer will likely lose an eye. and another was stabbed with a metal fence stake. >> again, this is what trump supporters did. this is what trump terrorists did. this is what the trump rioters did. why? let's keep that up. why did they do that? why are their cops with brain injuries, cracked ribs, smashed

spinal cord discs, why is one going to lose an eye, stabbings. why is that? because donald trump held a rally and told them to go up there and whipped them into a frenzy with two months of lies. there is a direct link directly from donald trump's words, from donald trump's actions to this. and, by the way, a false flag, not even close. we have all the videotape. and the more we pore through the videotape, the pore we see they are saying they are doing it for donald trump and ted cruz, the insurrectionists. mika, the evidence is overwhelming these cops were killed by cop killers, trump cop killers. >> or maimed. >> and maimed by trump cop killers because of the words of donald trump. >> yeah. >> nobody else is to blame. nobody else has this or their shoulders. it's donald trump.

and you have kevin mccarthy going down today to bow to cop killer insurrectionist donald trump. >> i can't think of any explanation. nearly 140 officers from the capitol police and the d.c. metropolitan police departments were injured during the attack. officer brian sicknick died after trying to ward off capitol insurrectionists. howard liebengood and d.c. police officer jeffrey smith both died by suicide since the attack. according to the capitol police officers union, nearly 40 employees have since tested positive for the coronavirus. coming up, michael mann writes about the fact to take back the planet and he joins us straight ahead. "morning joe" is back in a moment.

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mitt romney is one of the lone senators calling out the trial. >> have you gone up and said there is widespread voter fraud and president biden is the legitimate president of the united states. if you have said that, i'm happy to listen. if you haven't said that, that's at the source of the anger right now. >> so charlie sykes, it begins right there with the lie. that's the original lie that donald trump has been pushing that republicans have been pushing for three months since after the election, that donald trump won it, that there are irregularities. all these things we still hear from people like ted cruz and josh hawley in the senate. that is what led to the injuries and the death of a capitol

police officer and the lost eye and the cracked ribs and everything we laid out. all of that is because of the lie. that's what mitt romney is saying there. acknowledge the victory to start rolling back the lie. >> this is absolutely right. here's the fundamental question that people ought to ask. it is an obvious question and obvious answer. would officer brian sicknick be alive today if donald trump had not lied about the results of the election? think about that. his words on january 6th i think are bad enough. but it is this big lie going back for months. it is stoking this sense of the illegitimacy of the election. and all the other republicans who went along with this as well who convinced millions of people that this election was being stolen. look, why did people show up? they were invited by the president. why were they motivated? because they had been convinced by this deep lie. when i say deep lie, i mean something that had spread

through social media, through maga world. it was echoed on fox news and other things that the american democracy was being undermined, there was a great conspiracy against the united states. they believed that. i'm not defending them. but they believed it because the president and supporters told them that. he whipped this up as he's been whipping up division for the last four years. look, there is a real through line with the violence we've seen under this president from charlottesville to what happened. here we are -- here we are three weeks after this violent attack. you know, i guess what's so frustrating is that we had been warned and warned and warned that this was heading this way. and we were all accused of trumpy derangement syndrome -- well, it couldn't get this bad. well, it was this bad. it was worse than anyone could have possibly imagined.

small lies lead to big lies that lead to deep lies that lead to an insurrection. yet three weeks afterwards donald trump is going to walk away from this claiming exoneration. and i really do think this is a rather extraordinary moment. obviously, it's an extraordinary moment. but it's as if we had said what's the worst possible case scenario and would that be enough for some of these republicans. kudos to mitt romney for calling out and speaking out his fellow senators like josh hawley, ted cruz and ron johnson. up next, dr. anthony fauci is standing by. he will join us live when "morning joe" comes right back.

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fauci revealing he was

blocked from appearing on the rachel maddow show. >> i've been wanting to come on your show for months and months. you've been asking me to come on for months and months, it's just been gotten blocked. >> now dr. anthony fauci goes on all the programs he wasn't able to go on in the prior administration. >> it's great to have you here. it's a real honor. >> what are you most looking forward to in a post-covid world. >> brad pitt, of course. >> you can expect to see cooler weather in the upper northeast corridor. >> don't tell me you get what it's like because you don't get it. >> if you're being a bitch, i'll tell you. >> fundamentals are not rocket science. >> why are you here? >> look at the pastrami sandwich. ♪ shots, shots, 100 million shot ♪ >>what do we do first?

>> are you awake, doctor? >> to be honest with you. >> i'm not sure what the brits are saying. >> oh, my god. >> this is so funny. >> joining us now director of the national institute of allergy and infectious diseases, dr. anthony fauci. he is chief medical adviser to the president of the united states, joe biden. >> i was going to say, dr. fauci, we were trying to get you for months and months. we didn't take it personally until the ham radio operators of northern alabama were able to get you. >> that hurt. >> it is great to finally have you here. thank you very much for being with us. give us a state of the situation right now. are we plateauing? do you expect the situation to get worse? >> well, joe, i think it potentially could get worse. we certainly are seeing, thankfully, a plateauing in cases which is always lagging in

the sense of you'll have a plateauing of cases then a couple of weeks later hospitalizations will reflect that and go down. hopefully serious illness and deaths will then go down. that's the good news. superimposed upon the good news is the sobering news is that we still have a lot of cases and still a serious issue here. the thing that's troublesome now and that we need to keep our eye on are these variants. the uk had some significant issue with their variant, 117 is the lineage as we refer to it. it's here in the united states. it's in at least 28 states. well over 300 individuals have already been reported. fortunately the vaccine that we are distributing now both in the test tube when you look at the antibodies that it induces looks very much like it could contain this particular mutant. the one that is of greater concern and that really could be

problematic is the mutant that's now dominant in south africa. because if you look at the response of things like monoclonal antibodies or the vaccine itself the impact of those antibodies or the vaccine is markedly diminished in the test tube. is that going to be reflection of a diminished efficacy? that very well could be, which is triggering what we're doing right now. "a," we want as many people to get vaccinated as we possibly can as quickly as we can because the more you get vaccinated you give the virus less of a chance to evolve into a mutant form that you then would have more trouble with. the other thing we're doing that i think is equally as important is we're already planning and implementing making a modified version of the vaccine that would ultimately be able to be

directed specifically against the south african isolate, which is the most problematic of them all. on the one hand things are looking better about plateauing. on the other hand, we could have some difficult times that we have to be prepared for. >> so we've seen over the past few weeks with the acceleration of the virus spreading, we've seen actually, mika and i, people in our own communities that have been locked down, we went really from knowing very few people that had covid to just dozens. and all over the place. including some people on our show that, again, have taken all the precautions all along. so now that we're on the other side of that, we're starting to ask if our children, other friends and neighbors that we know how long are they immune? we had heard originally it might be three months. we heard it might be a year.

you know, there was something else, sars lasted 17 years because of the smart cells. i know this is a moving number. i know we'll know more two, three years from now, what is the best guess now for somebody who got covid and survived it? >> you know, the best guess that it's going to be several months up to a year. but, joe, we don't know that as a fact. i don't want to be evasive, but we have to be perfectly honest when we don't know something. we will know as the months and years go by. it's very likely that it's going to be six, eight months, a year. or it could be possibly much longer. the only way you know that is if you follow people over a period of time and you see their protection is durable and is maintained. but we can't say that right now with confidence. it is likely that the vaccine, because you're giving it in the arm, it gives a systemic

reaction, you know that because sometimes after the second dose you feel a little achy, a little chilly, which means the immune system is really getting revved up. what we're hoping is that the durability of protection following a vaccine is at least as much if not much better than the durability that follows natural infection. but again, unfortunately we don't know that for absolutely certain. >> what about this distribution? it seems to be -- obviously it's going to take a long time. but for people like my mother, so many people are elderly who still can't get it. for them will it still be as long as you say it will be for the rest of the population? or are people most in need going to get this vaccine sooner? >> i think we're mixing up two things, possibly, namely how soon you get it versus how long

it lasts after you get it. this is a top priority of president biden is to get as many people vaccinated as quickly as you possibly can. to pull out all the stops to essentially address and overcome anything in the way of that efficient distribution of vaccine getting into peoples arms. for example, he was talking the other day about employing or revoking the defense production act to make those dead space needles that allow you to get an additional dose per vial out of the vial that is used when you vaccinate people. also to do things like get a better capability of logistically getting the vaccine out there. for example, community vaccine centers, getting the pharmacies more involved. getting mobile units. so whatever we can to get the vaccines out there. the other thing that's good news is that we now made a contractual arrangement with the two companies that have the vaccine, moderna and pfizer, to

get an additional 100 million doses each from both moderna and pfizer superimposed upon the 200 million each that we already contracted for. you will see an acceleration as we get into february, march and april of a greater availability of doses at the same time that we logistically make it easier to get them into the arms of people. >> dr. fauci, it's willie geist. great to have you with us at long last. thanks for being here. i want to ask about schools. there's a growing frustration in this country among parents, educators that it's been almost a year and some children have not yet been back to school during that entire time. the cdc researchers put out research this week that suggested it is safe to have schools open as long as we continue masking and social distancing. what is your messaging on schools knowing well it changes from community to community, i understand that. but broadly speaking, should schools be open?

>> i would back the cdc recommendations because that is really based on data. we didn't fully appreciate that early on. but the fact is that when you look at a community and look at the penetrates of the community and spread at the community level compared to the school in that community, it's less likely for a child to get infected in the school setting than if they were just in the community. for that reason, understanding this is not an easy issue, you have to understand the concerns of teachers because they obviously have a concern and an understandable concern. putting all that together we need to try to get the children back to school. that's the goal of president biden that in the next 100 days to get the k to 8s back in school. >> certainly here in new york city the schools have proven to be among the safest places in this entire city. that's good news and perhaps an

example for others. dr. fauci some of the members of the biden administration said last week that effectively you were starting from a standing start to get this started, starting from scratch is the way they put it. i imagine you took some offense to that being that you worked on this for a year. what was the transition from the trump administration to the biden trump administration? >> i think there was some confusion about the words starting from scratch meant and it was the issue of the implementation. remember at the beginning of the implementation of getting doses of vaccine into peoples arms was done right at the beginning or the holiday between christmas and new years. there was some stumbling there. but you have to be fair, operation warp speed has done some very good things. the actual idea of now already having two vaccines that are highly efficacious and have a

good safety profile, i think that's a good accomplishment. obviously the issue of getting those doses into peoples arms in an efficient way i think that's what was being referred to when you were talking about starting from scratch. but other elements of operation warp speed, particularly two successful vaccines is something that is a good accomplishment. >> dr. fauci, we want to be forward looking given what we still have in front of us. as you look back over the last year, are you able to quantify or assess in some way how much better things could have been if some of your recommendations were put in place? >> i would prefer so much more now to just look forward because when we go back and say, you know, how many lives could have been saved, how many things could have been better, that does nothing but to create difficult situations. i would just prefer to put that behind me and let's see what we can do looking forward.

>> dr. fauci, mike barnicle is here with a question. mike? >> dr. fauci, you've given us a pretty good assessment of your sense of when there would be a more stable delivery of the vaccine around this country, distributed around the country. and your hope that more doses would be injected into peoples arms. my question to you is when the vaccine delivery is becoming more stable, when people do think they can get a shot in the arm, where are we going to get -- given the fiscal conditions of so many states -- where will we get all the vaccinators that would be needed? >> that's a great question. and as a matter of fact, if you look at the 101-page strategic plan that the president announced several days ago, that's one of the things that's addressed is to get a lot more vaccinators out there. and even people who are retired

physicians, retired nurses, other people who have done community work, you make a very good point and that is actually a very specific component of the president's plan. >> so, dr. fauci, before we leave, just what is your projection on when americans can expect to get out and go watch baseball games? let their kids go to camp? are we talking mid summer, late summer? again, i know this is a best guess right now. but right now, what's your projection? >> you know, joe, as you said, they are really all estimates. if all other things being equal, and we don't get any major setbacks about variants or other lineages or mutations that get in the way, if we roll out the vaccines as we see it, they likely would, the logistics of

getting what i would say hopefully would be between 70% and 85% of the population vaccinated, just logistically alone, even if you start on that, let's say in april, where anybody and everybody can get vaccinated, it's going to take at least a few months for that to happen. i would say by the end of the summer, so that hopefully as we enter into the fall that we will begin to approach normality. i don't think, joe, it will be a turning a light switch on and all of a sudden everything will be back to normal. i think as we enter into the fall, if we get all these things done efficiently we could approach normality substantially even though we don't get there exactly the way we were before all this happened. >> all right. dr. anthony fauci, it is great to have you on "morning joe." thank you so much. please come back. and up next, gamestop

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now to the story shaking the investing world. gamestop and amc rallied over 400% each this week after becoming targets of the popular reddit chat room wallstreetbets. the two companies which have been -- [ laughter ] -- okay. >> maybe willie and i need to get in the stock market if social media is driving the -- >> yeah. >> i don't know, willie. this is pretty exciting. i thought the dog track and off-track betting was a sure thing. my god, reddit now.

twitter. that's where the real investment professionals are going. >> just dip into a reddit chat room. let's explain this. it's a little confusing. the two companies which have been having financial trouble because of the pandemic were being short-sold by hedge funds in that reddit chat room focused their attention on these stocks, pushing the share prices through the roof, so much so that gamestop's games for the month of january now have reached 1,700%, and yesterday more than 1 billion shares of amc were bought, the highest volume ever. several hedge funds have taken hits due to gamestop's activities, including melvyn capital management, due to its shorting of the stock but since has been bailed out by other hedge funds. this morning the gamestock stock soared again, topping $490 in premarket trading. joining us is cnbc's lesley

picker, she covers hedge funds. lesley, good morning, we're so glad you're here to walk us through this. how did this happen, why is it happening and what's the outcome at the end of all this? >> that's a lot of very good questions, and thank you for having me. so i would say it's the mascot of the wall streets bets movement is gamestop, the enemy has really been the hedge funds. this all surfaced back in the springtime where people on these reddit chat rooms were talking about different put positions, these are bearish bets hedge funds make that are sometimes disclosed in quarterly filings. they looked at those filings and said melvyn capital is bearish against gamestop. it took fire, went viral, this idea that if people could bid up the price of gamestop to force melvyn to cover their short, buy at higher and higher prices, thus driving the stock price even higher from there. this whole idea of a short squeeze isn't new.

what's really new about this whole phenomenon is that it's taking place in individual investors' homes. people in hedge funds have been trying to squeeze each other for decades at this point but the idea that really kind of took hold on these social media platforms were people who maybe individually don't have enough money to effectuate a short squeeze but when they come together collectively and find this common enemy in hedge funds they can really make a big difference and that's what you're seeing with gamestop, with amc and some other names. i would suggest, i would assume it's not going to end anytime soon. >> well, but leslie, i'm going to ask you, what is the long-term impact for gamestop and amc? i mean, what goes up must come down, especially if it's driven by reddit and twitter. do professionals on wall street expect these stocks eventually to crash again?

>> oh, absolutely. when you look at what has been done on the fundamental research side on these wall street -- at wall street firms people are looking at a company like gamestop with 5,000 stores, declining sales. the pandemic doesn't help their case. amc, similar thing. this company was near bankruptcy just weeks ago before it received a bailout of its own. now that stock is up tremendously, to the point where they were able to actually raise additional capital in the equity markets and take advantage of their higher stock price. so if you look at what kind of the fundamental analysis of these companies are it would suggest that ultimately these stock prices will go down. now the question becomes now that they are this big, what actually is the catalyst that causes a lot of people who bought into these names to ultimately disappear? and people who kind of look at historical regressions of these types of movements would say that, you know, if something moves up, this violently,

chances are it could move down as violently as well. that's been shown time and time again especially with companies -- well, in 2021 we could call them a meme stock is the name people are using. >> okay, cnbc's leslie picker, thank you so much, we appreciate it. now to president biden's detailed agenda to tackle climate change. yesterday signing an executive action that direct the federal government to elevate climate change to a national security priority, conserve about 30% of all federal land and water by 2030. and suspend new leases for natural gas and oil development on federal lands and waters. joining us now, distinguished professor of atmospheric science at penn state, michael mann, the author of the new book entitled "the new climate war: the fight to take back our planet." and a lot of people, i think michael mann, see this as

something off in the future. can you explain why this is a war that we should be well under way with right now? >> yeah, thanks, mika, it's great to be with you. wasn't it refreshing listening to anthony fauci earlier? science is back. science-based policy is now back. and we saw, as you just alluded to, president biden announced the boldest climate plan in history yesterday. so we are so close to finally seeing the actions that are necessary. but we still encounter obstacles. now, the old climate war was the effort by fossil fuel interests and those promoting their agenda to try to discredit the science, to discredit the scientists, to deny that climate change is real. well, that's not possible anymore because we can see the impacts playing out in realtime. it truly is a crisis. it is an emergency. and so what the forces of inaction, the inactivists as i call them in the book, they haven't given up. they're still trying to prevent

our transition off fossil fuels towards renewable energy but they're using other tactics, trying to divide us, getting us fighting with each other, finger pointing over our individual lifestyle choices, carbon shaming people to divert attention from the needed systemic solutions, or promoting doom and gloom as a way of disabling us. if we really believe there's nothing we can do about the problem, then why bother? so we need to recognize these tactics and combat them so that we can finally get the action that we need and that's really what this book is about. >> professor mann, it's willie geist, good to have you back with us, part of the argument against joe biden's new plan and sweeping climate change plans over the years has been jobs, that you're going to cost millions of jobs in oil and gas and you're going to cripple entire states but one of the points you've made in the book and one we've heard from some congressmen and even senators in midwestern states is why can't we be the place that turns into

clean energy jobs, that makes cell fuel batteries and solar panels and all the things that look to the future of energy? how do you make that transition to those kind of jobs and how do you make that argument to people who are rightly scared that their livelihood is at stake? >> yeah, thanks, willie, it's a great question and, you know, we saw that again in joe biden's plan yesterday. one of the things that i like so much about the way he framed this is this is about jobs. it's about climate change but it's about the opportunity that comes with climate crisis. the green energy jobs that will be available, fossil fuel jobs these days are fairly few because that industry has largely been automated. there's a lot more opportunity for jobs and clean energy and that's a big part of this plan, to make those jobs available to provide resources for that. but what i also like is the idea of hiring a sort of civilian climate corps, which is in the

plan, to provide jobs to those people who would otherwise be displaced by this transition. frontline communities, people in fossil fuel states, and those communities where they've lost those fossil fuel jobs, we need to make sure those people aren't left behind and this plan will provide resources to give them jobs. why not have them help in the cleanup and the restoration that's necessary as we transition into clean energy? so this plan is bold, it's comprehensive, and it gives me optimism that we're finally about to achieve the action that we need on climate. >> wow. >> so let me ask you about one project, you were talking about jobs and fossil fuel industry. the union representatives, of course, very concerned about the keystone pipeline being cancelled again, that's been an on again, off again, on again project that's once again been turned off. we years ago had canadian

ambassador to the united states asking, you know, what we thought we were accomplishing by cutting off that pipeline because they'll just get it out somewhere else without american jobs. how does that help the environment? how does that help jobs by killing the keystone pipeline? >> yeah, so a colleague of mine said the keystone pipeline would be game over for the climate. it literally would mean that we would mine, extract and burn enough fossil fuels to put us past the dangerous limit. we do need to block that new infrastructure. we can't be funding now fossil fuel infrastructure. that's part of president biden's plan. but as you alluded to there are some jobs that are lost, maybe in the hundreds. the number of jobs that will be lost is in the hundreds. a lot of profit for the fossil fuel industry will be lost but a relatively small number of jobs, far more jobs in renewable energy, clean energy and helping clean up this problem. >> all right, distinguished professor of atmospheric science at penn state, michael mann,

thank you, we look forward to seeing you again, his new book, "the new climate war: the fight to take back our planet," that does it for us this morning, stephanie ruhle picks up the coverage right now. hi there, i'm stephanie ruhle. it is thursday, january 28th. we have got a very busy morning ahead, so let's get smarter. this morning the biden administration is defending the vaccine rollout as shortages are now being reported in all 50 states and the death toll is projected to skyrocket over the next few weeks. it comes as the risk of americans getting infected is still ridiculously high. former cdc director tom frieden will join me to explain it. also today democrats will be talking to the white house as they try to hammer out a covid relief bill. the question is, will republicans get on board? doesn't even matter. senator jeanne shaheen i