boulder supermarket. he is charged with ten counts of first degree murder. >> i am going to read the names of the deceased -- [ reading list ] >> our hearts go out to those killed from all of the senseless violence. >> the officer, father of seven rushing in to try to save lives.

they said he had been trying to move off the front lines because of his family. and one spoke to hoda. >> it has been hard. waking up and processing everything. it's harder than yesterday, just thinking about the friends that i lost. >> here in washington president biden has been briefed on the latest mass shooting. he will be speaking before leaving for a scheduled trip to ohio this afternoon. senate democrats, along with the president have been pushing for gun safety laws for decades. two bills have already passed the democratically controlled house which are now to be brought up in the senate.

>> last night i was putting the finishing touches on my statement and questions and there was another unspeakable mass shooting. these victims and their loved ones are worthy of our thoughts and prayers. but there is more that's required. we face a pandemic of coronavirus, we have another epidemic in america called guns. >> joining me now is erin from boulder, and cliff is a former fbi special agent. erin, what a horror. watching what happened and hearing the brief from police, the grief of witnesses and the sadness of america to this kind of shooting and nothing is ever done in washington. >> reporter: there are still more questions than answers at

this point. we do know the name of the suspect now in police custody, 21-year-old ahmad. we know he has a criminal record and pled guilty to an assault charge in 2018 relating to an assault in 2017. we know there was gunfire exchanged between police and alissa. he was shot and wounded. is expected to make a full recovery and transferred directly to boulder county jail. he is facing ten charges of murder. this is a community that is reeling, that is struggling to make sense of yet another mass shooting. listen to what one democratic congressman had to say earlier today. >> this is my community. we have lived in boulder county for many years. my wife was born in boulder.

we went to school in boulder. this this is our community. we are heartbroken. in this year of separation due to covid, of loss and loneliness, grocery scores like king soopers have been one of our consistent gathering place, one of the few routine activities that we continue to engage in as coloradoans and as americans. it's hard to describe to see at this safe place, a horrible tragedy like this unfold. >> reporter: a sentiment echoed by many members of the community especially as we hear more and more of the sheer terror that unfolded in the store behind me. how the gunman opened fire. how people were hiding for their lives. how some went back for the

elderly. people will be struggling with this for sometime. >> they said at the press conference there is no motive. they believe he was acting alone. are they to be believed or not believed? >> it looks like the local police are taking the lead. it was the district attorney, not the u.s. attorney that had taken on the case suggesting that they see it as a local crime, not part of a larger next us. was this tied to any particular target at all or was this a random selection chosen by the shooter. that comes back to motive. they want to close out all leads that point to a larger next us or larger --

they seemed to reassure us of that during the press conference. why was this target elected. was it personal grievance, and it will come down to weapons and weaponry. as it comes down to the shooter, there will be questions was a weapon produced or acquired legally and were there any warning signs missed in this case. >> the police were talking about the officer they lost, officer talley. there was a line, a parade of motor cars paying tribute as his body was taken away to the police chief. >> that's right, andrea. what we have learned, as an

unfortunate circumstance over the last decade, police officers have to respond quickly to these mass shootings. he did just that and paid the ultimate price. >> clint, i think the police chief is speaking about it. i think we can play that now. >> i feel numb and it's heartbreaking. heartbreaking to talk to victims, their families. you know, it's tragic. this officer had seven children, ages 5 to 18. i can tell you that he's a very kind man and he didn't have to go into policing. he had a profession before this, but he felt a higher calling. he is everything that policing deserves and needs. he cared about this community. he cared about boulder police department. he cared about his family. and he was willing to die to

protect others. >> to that point, clint, jim cavanaugh, as you know from the atf previously was on the air last night saying that in the past first responders would wait for the backup or wait for the swat teams to come, people with the gear, the body armor, but in recent years they are trained to go in to try to mitigate the death in these mass shootings. that really exposed this officer for bravely going in on his own without backup. >> not only do they have to go in immediately because they want to stop the carnage of these mass shootings, they are going in on the defense meaning they are outmatched in terms of weaponry. many of the perpetrators nowadays have body armor.

they are putting their life on the line. they are almost sacrificing themselves to try to protect the local citizens. this officer responded as trained by doing that and probably helped save some lives and helped protect this community. >> erin, such bravery, not just this police officer who is extraordinary, but watch this from one of the shoppers who spoke to hoda kotbe. they were just married a month ago. >> i just felt god compel me to go back. there was another guy sitting by the emergency exit and then there was michael. he was really sweet and brave. there were two older women trying to get out. i just wanted to go back and help them. >> i started crying because i was like he's running like --

everyone in the crowd is running away and my husband of a month and a half is running towards it. that was hard. >> erin, just extraordinary. the people must be shattered by all of this, the survivors as well. >> reporter: completely shattered and struggling to make sense of this. when you listen to accounts like that, what strikes you is this could have been so much worse, that there were heroes inside the supermarket helping people get away, get away from the shooter who was shooting seemingly indiscriminately. police say they responded within minutes of that initial phone call. had they not responded --

keep in mind, colorado does have a history of these mass shootings. this is not the first kind of tragedy that this state, these communities have been struggling to cope and deal with. >> indeed. thank you so much, erin. thank you clint watts. such a difficult story to be dealing with in the field. more from president biden and kristen welker. so sad. how many times have we gone through this. sandy hook, aurora, littleton, columbine in colorado alone. sandy hook in connecticut and what happened in tucson to gabby gifford. >> i think what you will hear from president biden when he

addresses what happened in colorado is a president who takes on that all too familiar role of consoler. we have seen this increasingly over the past several years. several administrations, former president trump, former president obama both dealt with mass shootings like this. we will hear from president biden. and in the wake of the shootings in atlanta which he and vice president harris have been addressing in recent days. the question becomes what happens next. we know there is legislation that has passed through the house that would extend background checks. senate majority leader chuck schumer vowing to bring that up for a vote on the floor. they are discussing it today in hearings in the senate. it is not clear president biden will use this moment to introduce some new broad piece of legislation for stiffer gun

laws, but we do know as a candidate he said he wanted to introduce on his first day in office, legislation that would repeal liability for gun manufacturers. that is yet to be done. based on my conversations, what i expect to hear from the president is his extension of condolences to the people who are suffering and grieving right now. and it comes against the back droop -- drop. officials are fighting for new gun legislation. he authored the ban on assault weapons and during his time with president obama, he was put in charge in trying to enact some of those executive actions in the wake of sandy hook. you and i both covered tragic events at sandy hook, that if there wasn't some broad reform

of gun legislation at that point, it's hard to see how that happens particularly when you have such a divided congress right now. 50-50 in the senate. how does something like that happen? that will be discussion in the coming days. today we will hear from president biden, and i think he will focus on condolence. >> we do have a statement from president obama as we both covered those horrible events. i remember charleston when he started singing amazing grace and how devastated he was and joe biden was after sandy hook. this is what he and michelle wrote. >> it will take time to root out

the racism, but we can have a gun lobby that owe potions any limit on the ability of anyone to assemble an arsenal. we can and we must. that is only part from the obamas. there was a lawsuit challenging them. they were thinking of moving to texas where it would be more friendly from state law enforcement officials. recently had the bill from senator manchin and toomey. that did not pass. maybe there is hope this time. schumer says today it will get to the floor.

>> reporter: he is very clear on that point, that he is determined to see this get a vote. the question is what are the politics of this. as we just saw with the first piece of legislation, the biden administration passed a covid relief package, there were so many sharp divisions about that. and then it gets even more complicated. you talk about the fact that a moderate senator manchin carries moderate weight when you talk about this sort of reform. i think that's where a lot of this focus will be in terms of trying to get that legislation over the tleshhold. andrea, it's hard to see that this would get done given the fact that this is still such a deeply divisive issue. the nra has been weakened in some ways in recent years but still carries a significant political weight and they have

been clear that they don't want to see stiffer gun laws. >> we are joined from the congresswoman from denver. first of all, condolences to the people of colorado. another tragedy in colorado. how do you deal with this? you know better than i certainly. columbine, aurora. >> we are all devastated about this. i have been working on this issue for many years, since the '90s. columbine is in my congressional district. boulder is beautiful, very calm, not the place you would think of gun violence. in colorado we feel like we have had a disproportionate amount of

gun violence. as someone who has been active for a long time on gun safety lenl lags, it leads me to think that this could happen again in colorado. and to listen to the speculation and reporting about what we can do as a nation, it's ptsd for all of us for sure. >> i am sure it is. am i correct, colorado is an open carry state, is it not? >> i am not sure boulder is open carry though. no, people don't walk around with their guns in the grocery stores. >> because one of the points that was made last night was for police in open carry states, if you have a guy walking with a long gun into a supermarket, you don't know is he a madman or just a man carrying a gun.

>> that happens in many states in america. i have seen it myself in some of the protests recently on television. you don't know if that person is going to start shooting that gun or not. but one of the issues we saw with officer talley last night, and what a heartbreaking situation. here is a law enforcement officer with seven children who gets a report who goes just minutes later running into the scene. this is the same thing that happened in the aurora theater shooting where you had people who immediately called 911. you had law enforcement who immediately ran in, but by then, because of the weapon -- and we don't know exactly what kind of a weapon it was, but observers said they heard many gunshots. as someone just said on the previous segment, the officers are outgunned. they are facing people who have

very, very powerful weapons and it's difficult for them to do their law enforcement duties, even if they run in and they try to save people right at that time. what we learned from columbine, if you remember, at that time the protocol was not to go in immediately when there was a call. that's why so many people were killed at columbine. but now the officers run in, but they are just sitting ducks for being shot. it's a horrible situation. >> thank you for joining us today. we hope next time might be different. >> i hope and pray this will be an incentive for us to do something.

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no, no. i'm definitely not watching basketball. right... ( horn blaring ) the u.s. has surpassed 30 million cases of covid. people can suffer more than six weeks and sometimes months with

results. here is tom costello. he is immersing his burning feet in a tub of cold water. >> i have had an average of three or four hours of sleep every night. >> reporter: his legs switching. a fever over 105 degrees. doctor think he was among the first to contact covid back in 2020. he has been sick for an agonizing 14 months. doctors say he is suffering from long-haul covid.

after 70 doctors visits he and his wife have come here to the mayo clinic in rochester, minnesota. we have been close friends since 10 years old growing up in denver. he is a passionate triathlete running in five boston marathons and dedicated to pushing his 22-year-old special needs running partner. now ty gets winded walking to the mailbox. in near constant pain and his heart not loading enough blood during exertion. and there is brain fog like when he went to pick up takeout food. >> hop in the car, get two blocks away and i couldn't remember where i was going. >> you couldn't remember the fast food place you were going to. >> i couldn't remember the name. i had to pull over and look at my phone.

five minutes later. >>. >> reporter: now an entire team of doctors are starting fresh. looking at his symptoms and why tens of thousands of people are also suffering. >> our current thoughts is that this is an overreaction by the immune system. it's fighting infection no longer there. >> reporter: research finds 85% of covid patients have four or five neurologic symptoms. researchers say some patients will suffer chronic damage to their heart, lungs, kidney and brains. >> i think we are going to have to manage those chronic symptoms with hopes over time they will have full recovery, but it's too early to tell. >> after a year of being sick there is also the emotional

toll. >> he talks about mortality, will he be around to walk me down the aisle. >> reporter: is that what you worry about? >> missing life events. >> reporter: fighting covid hoping one day to rejoin the race. >> it's just awful. thanks for bringing this story. how long do people have symptoms this si -- severe? >> reporter: 10 to 20% of covid patients develop long-term symptoms. they have reported that they felt only 65% recovered after five months. that's the vast majority, that even after five months they were not fully recovered, only to 65%

of their formerselves and some people have symptoms nine months or even a year later like in ty's case. >> thank you. i am joined by the doctor, former member of the obama advisory board. tell us what is the prognosis for these cases? >> it's tragic. the short answer is the disease is too new. we don't know. as tom costello said, he is among the first to probably ever get covid in the united states. we won't have more data than that. you have two sets of symptoms around, breathing difficulties, fatigue, loss of energy, loss of

exercise tolerance and then the mental component and the brain component. in addition, anxiety, depressive symptoms, post-traumatic stress disorder. the best hypothesis at the moment is that a lot of the breathing symptoms related to fibrosis of the lung from the immune response. mental condition, we don't know. we don't have a good treatment. the only thing on the horizon is that getting a vaccine seems to improve the condition for some patients. >> it is said that clinical

trial results may have been outdated when astrazeneca released results of the vaccine at 79%. dr. fauci. >> this is likely a good vaccine. it does cast some doubt about the vaccine and the efficacy. if you look at it, the data are good, but when they put it into the press release, it wasn't completely accurate. >> that is a continuing problem and worried about supply. there is some concern that manufacturing aspects on the supply of johnson & johnson. do we need it to reach the president's goal?

>> i don't think we need it to reach the president's goal. we will reach that goal. another good news is that the novavax is likely to report in a month or so. but the astrazeneca vaccine has been star crossed from the start. they didn't get the dosages right. then the manufacturing was questionable and now their reporting of the data is a little problematic. i do think dr. fauci is right, confidence in whether this company is doing the right thing is getting eroded. that is not a good thing for the world. britain and europe is heavily reliant on this vaccine. >> dr. manual, thanks for being

with us. and people killed in a mass shooting. what chuck schumer calls the epidemic of gun violence. epidemic of gun violence i don't know. i think they look good, man. mm, smooth. uh, they are a little tight. like, too tight? might just need to break 'em in a little bit. you don't want 'em too loose. for those who were born to ride there's progressive. with 24/7 roadside assistance. -okay. think i'm gonna wear these home. -excellent choice. as carla wonders if she can retire sooner, she'll revisit her plan with fidelity. and with a scenario that makes it a possibility, she'll enjoy her dream right now. that's the planning effect, from fidelity. she'll enjoy her dream right now. ♪ and a little bit of chicken fried ♪

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congress to take action on gun reform. nine churchgoers, gabby gifford injured in tucson, just to name a few. today the senate judiciary will be holding a previously scheduled meeting on gun violence. background check has already been passed by the house. it will reach the senate floor. >> today woke up to another nightmare. stunning, shocking, savage, but unsurprising. because this kind of horror is thoroughly capable as long as congress fails to act. >> we need to show we care and prevent the next mass shooting. >> the senate is going to debate

and address the epidemic of gun violence in this country. >> joining me now is former congresswoman donna edwards and tom costello who was raised in colorado and covered a lot of these issues. thanks for being with us. do democrats have politics on their side now? >> in fact, democrats have long had the support of the american people for sensible gun laws, whether it's expanding background checks or limits on high capacity magazines. restrictions on making sure people with history of mental illness that could be violent, would not be able to get guns. the american people, the

majority support these so it is the entrench. of members of congress who are still aligned, even with a weakened national rifle association. i hope this time it's different. it does have to be more than just words or standing on the floor offering thoughts and prayers without any action. without the argument that maybe this law or that law would prevent this mass shooting or that mass shooting. the american people, if joe biden galvanizes the american people with democrats in charge, it may be narrow majority, but i think some of these sensible gun laws can get through. >> in atlanta, he apparently did

talk to background checks, but he didn't mention it as a top priority coming out of those meetings. tom costello, you grew up in colorado, we saw columbine, aurora, boulder, places none of us would have expected these tragic circumstances. what explains it? >> well, i think a lot of us coloradoans, and i have lived away from colorado for a while but it is still home. colorado has like the fourth highest per capita murder race in the country. this one hits home for me. i am from littleton, colorado. i grew up on south columbine way. i didn't go to high school there, but my own high school had a shooting a few years ago. i used to work at king soopers

as a teenager, not that one, but another one. i have so many connections to so many points in colorado where we have had mass shootings. i am not alone. i think so many americans can say i went to that school or i grew up down the street from that mall or office building. we have so many touch points across the country now for mass murders, it is resonating and hurtful. i used to work at kusatv, our affiliate in denver. yesterday i heard somebody say we have gotten used to this as a country. young people expect this. what a sad commentary as a country, and as a generation, that these are expected and routine. it's horrifying that this country has one of the highest murder rates in the world, one

of the highest mass murder rates in the world. mental disease or illness is not unique to america. it happens in every country in the world. what is different is we have a proliferation of guns, more guns than number of citizens. >> it's incredible. donna, we thought after parkland and the march by the young people in washington, that something would happen, something would change. >> andrea, i want to emphasize that we should know who are buying guns and do proper background checks and make sure that people who want to buy guns don't have criminal records and

don't have a history to suggest -- that people should have weapons. there is coalesce sense around these laws. a week ago background legislation passed in the house of representatives even though it was mostly with democrats. these things in small ways can get passed through the house. they need to be considered. i am glad to hear a promise of that. but there has to be action on it it. i think the american people are tired of feeling like we have to go into collective mourning because there is another mass shooting. we can hardly finish mourning one mass shooting and there is another one. it is not acceptable. a society that can get a covid

vaccine in record time, that it can't do something sensible about weapons who can do harm. i know my friends and communities are tired of it. legislators have to get to work. >> donna, thanks to you and tom for your perspective. it was back in 1984 that i covered the signing of the assault weapon ban that was let expire ten years later. breaking news from minneapolis. the final jur or has been chosen for the derek chauvin trial. and the white house is

floating taxing rich and big business in order to pay for an infrastructure plan. that's next coming up after the short break. that's next coming up after the short break. hmmm... where to go today? la? vegas? no, the desert. let's listen to this. louder. take these guys? i mean, there's room. maybe next time, fellas. now we're talking. alright. let's. go.

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please help us get every bottle back. the biden administration is already working on its next economic proposal, a $3 trillion plan to be funded by tax increases. jekt janet yellen and jerome powell were in agreement about being optimistic about the economy returning after the pandemic. >> i am confident that people will each the other side of the

pandemic. i think we may see a return to full employment next year. >> the recovery is far from complete. the path of the economy continues to depend on the course of the virus. >> joining me now is the former top economic adviser to president obama and now a professor at the harvard kennedy school. do you agree that the economy is stronger, but not completely recovered, but we are on the way to recovery? and your thoughts on spending another $3 trillion for that legislation. >> i agree with them. it's great to see the two of them testifying together. it makes me feel reassured about where we are and the country, the hands we are in. i think we have taken the steps we need to to get there over the

next year. the issue will be sustaining economic momentum and building stronger growth. that's where the next package comes in. i hope they are just as ambitious about the next package as they were about the last one. in many ways it will be more important because it is our destiny over the next decade and decades to come. >> and yellen is using the taxes word and saying it could mean more jobs and that's the kind of investment that will lead to jobs, but we need revenue. they are talking about that which was not the discussion in the covid bill. >> i think it will be partially paid for. i don't think it has to be entirely paid for. barrow the money now and we will be a richer country to pay it back later.

but we also have room for higher taxes. we are talking about the tax rate under president clinton, under president obama, still a competitive global tax rate. all of that paying for investments that will help us. the cbo is saying the federal debt will double in the next 30 years. long term if we don't raise those passes and we know how hard it is to get a tax bill through, what is your concern, if at all? i know interest rates are low but what about the level of debt people are carrying, the country is carrying? >> if you look over the next ten years, the congressional office has the debt plateauing, it can doesn't have it expiring. the next ten years starts to rise again. i would focus now on what we need to strengthen our economy to invest in workers, reduce

poverty and the like. i think we'll probably be fine but there's a good chance we'll need to come back and do something. on top of my list would be social security reform. we could bring more revenue into the social security system to make it permanently solvent, and that's something we're going to have to do at some point in the next decade. >> wow, nobody's talking about that. it hasn't been done since 1983. when it was done back then. >> yeah, and i don't think we have to do it this year but we need to come back to it in the next couple of years. >> jason, it's great to hear optimism. we can use a little bright spot in our forecast today. just because it is such a grim day in other news. thank you for being here. it's always good to have you and this morning at the white house, the new director of the cia was officially sworn in. vice president kamala harris administered the oath to william

burns, who spent three decades as a highly respected diplomat, including a u.s. ambassador from russia. burns, who retired in 2014, was joined by his wife and two daughters. the senate confirmed burns by unanimous consent on thursday, which is also very rare in this environment. new video and images released this morning from custom border protection, inside the temporary processing facilities at the migrant facility in texas. the el paso facility shows children sleeping on mats in close proximity. the children line up as they go through health checks, get meals, crowded together in what appear to be plastic holding tents. the video was released by the government. news crews were not permitted in. they're also images of some of the youngest toddler i playing inside foldable plastic play

pens with a few toys and checkered carpet. new footage released just a day after texas democratic congressman henry cuellar released photos from the facilities. journalists are still not allowed in the facility. joining us, dasha burns in hildago, texas. you've been on the border, know what the situation is. how do these images compare from what you're hearing from officials and people inside those facilities? >> hey, andrea, they generally line up with what we've been hearing. no kids in cages in these facilities but they are overcrowded. you can see a little bit of that, especially in the four-minute video from the donna facility, the epicenter of overcrowding as we know right now. although these images do generally line up, there was

very little in these videos that actually showed those living areas, places where the kids are sleeping. a lot of that four minutes was video of empty rooms and phone booths and folks outside. we did not get a huge picture of what it actually looks like, where those kids are sleeping. i think the next step in the process of transparency is to get access, which you know we've been asking for from nbc news into one of those facilities, particularly donna. but, andrea, the bottom line here is these are not places meant for kids, especially not meant to hold kids for an extended amount of time. customs and border protection has not been granting interviews or ride alongs but we were able to speak to the vice president of the national border patrol council, the union representing border patrol agent. rick cabrera was also an agent himself and was inside the facility just a few days ago. i want you to hear from him.

he tells us he doesn't feel like he and his agents were properly equipped to deal with a humanitarian crisis of this nature, especially one involving kids. take a listen. >> i mean, we're border patrol agents, we're not day care. that's not what we are assigned for. we adapt to it the best we can. a lot of agents bring in toys or coloring books, it gives them something to do but the agency as a whole is not designed for this. >> he said he's concerned about the ongoing issue, more parents spending their children across the border alone, andrea. >> dasha burns, thank you so much for all of your reporting down there. we're expecting any moment now to hear from the president. he's going to be speaking about the tragedy in colorado before he leaves, as you see the state dining room, a previously scheduled trip to ohio. mike memoli is with us outside

the white house. this is, of course, the kind of tragedy that none of us in the country want to see and certainly not the president. i see the president is here. we will talk on the other side. >> the shooting in colorado and other aspects of this mass shooting. i have been briefed this morning by the fbi. i have spoken to the governor. and i will be speaking with the mayor on the aircraft. we're working very closely with the state and local law enforcement officials and they're going to keep me updated as they learn more. they're going to ask me to speculate understandably ask me to speculate what happened, why it happened and i'm not going to do that now because i don't have all of the information. not until i have all of the facts. but i do know this, as president, i'm going to use all of the resources in my disposal to keep the american people

safe. as i said at this moment, a great deal remains unknown but three things are certain. first, ten lives have been lost and more families are shattered by gun violence in the state of colorado. jill and i are devastated. the feeling -- i just can't imagine how the families are feeling and victims of the people whose futures were stolen from them and have to struggle to go on and make sense of what happened. and less than a week ago the murders of eight people in the atlanta community in georgia, while the flag was still flying half-staff from the tragedy and other american cities scarred by gun violence and resulting trauma. and in a state i would hate to say it, because we say it so often, my heart goes out, my

heart goes out for the survivors who had to -- had to flee for their lives and hid terrified, unsure if they would ever see their families again, their friends again. the consequence involved in this are deeper than we suspect we know. by that i mean the mental consequences and feeling of -- anyway, just too many of these. second point i want to make is my deepest thanks to the heroic police and other first responders who acted so quickly in an escalating situation to keep the rest of their community safe. and state the obvious, i commend the exceptional bravery of officer eric talley. i sent my deepest condolences to his family. his close, close family, seven children. when he pinned on that badge yesterday morning, he didn't

know what the day would bring. i want everybody to think about this, every time an officer walks out of his or her home with that badge on, a family member they just said good-bye to wonders subconsciously, will they get that call, the call that his wife got? he thought he would be coming home to his family and seven children. when the moment to act came, officer tulley did not hesitate in his duty to save lives. that's the definition of a hero. thirdly, i want to be clear and this is enough i do know what to say in terms of what's happening there. while we're still waiting for more information regarding the shooter, his motive, weapons he used, guns, magazines, weapons, modifications parentally that had taken place to those weapons involved here, i don't need to

wait another minute, let alone an hour, to take common sense steps or save the lives in the future and urge my colleagues in the house and senate to act. we can ban assault weapons and high-capacity magazines in this country once again. i got that done when i was a senator. it passed. it was the law for the longest time. and it brought down these mass killings. we should do it again. we can close loopholes in our background check system, including the charleston loophole. that's one of the best tools we have right now to prevent gun violence. the senate should immediately pass -- let me say it again -- the united states senate -- i hope some are listening -- should immediately pass the two house-passed bills and close loopholes in the background check system. these are bills that receive votes from both