because 2020 was the most anomalous year in american life in recent years. that does it for us this evening. thank you very much for coming on the program. >> thanks, chris. >> that is "all in" on this tuesday night. it rachel maddow show starts right now. right now. good evening, rachel. >> good evening, chris. thanks, my friend. appreciate it. thank you at home for joining us this hour. after the shootings, the mass shooting at the sandy hook elementary school in 2012, president obama asked the then vice president joe biden to lead a task force for the obama administration on potential reforms to gun laws and gun policies, to try to find a way to advance gun safety somehow, to try to find a way around the obstacles that had made any kind of progress on that issue completely politically impossible since the early 2000s.

all the while, the country was experiencing more and more and more increasingly horrific single shooter mass killings, gun massacres every year, while it became increasingly impossible to do absolutely anything. in response to them. president obama put joe biden, then vice president, in charge of leading a task force in the obama administration to try to find a way around what could be done. vice president took charge of that and they moved very, very fast. it was december 14th, 2012, when the sandy hook elementary school shooting happened, 26 little kids and teachers and school staff. that was a friday, december 14th. before the next week was up, the following thursday on december 20th, then vice president joe biden had already started convening the first meetings in washington.

>> the president asked me to convene this meeting with you and we will be talking with other stakeholders as well, because we have to have a comprehensive way in which to respond to the mass murder of our children, and we saw in connecticut. the president gave me this charge, along with some of our cabinet colleagues here. you're the first group i wanted to speak with. so what i'd like to do is the president is absolutely committed to keeping his promise that we will act and we will act in a way that is designed, even if he says we can save one life. we have to take action. there are a number of things you know because i've spoken with you all for so many years and continue that relationship over the past four years that there's some things we can immediately do. >> then vice president joe

biden. that was less than a week after the elementary massacre in sandy hook, in december 2012. that was only six days after that happened. that was the first meeting of that task force that he held but then he worked like a whirlwind on it. the pace of it, looking back, is -- i had forgotten how quickly it moved before i went back and looked at the timeline. here's how "the washington post" described it. just the following month, in january 2013. they said in the 33 days after the massacre at sandy hook elementary school, gun control rocketed through what one administration official called a time warp, transforming from an issue that was politically off limits to one at the top of obama's agenda. at the center of the transformation was the biden-led task force. it held 22 meetings, most of them in the same week, many of them over two hours long, biden furiously scribbling notes in a black leather-bound spiral

notebook. the group collected ideas from 229 organizations. or as bider put it last week, quote. reviewing just about every idea that has been written up only to gather dust on some agency. the post continues, quote, the vice president placed phone calls, too. including one 45-minute talk one night with the parents of a student who died at sandy hook. they said it was like watching a series of senate hearings compressed into a week. he was interrogating witnesses, following up, finding common ground, finding discrepancies. again, that's 33 days after sandy hook happened. in the end, the biden task force meeting incredibly quickly, meeting with everybody from law enforcement in that first meeting to clergy to families of gun violence victories to the nra. biden took an nra groups. he even met with video game

manufacturers. all those different people being brought into the discussion at the end of all of it, a month into it, they recommended 23 different actions. to try to increase gun safety, to try to reduce the number of americans being killed by guns. >> i have no illusions about what we're up against or how hard the task is in front of us, but i also have never seen the nation's conscience so shaken by what happened in sandy hook. the world has changed and it's demanding action. in this context, president asked me to put together along with the cabinet, a set of recommendations about how we should proceed to meet that moral obligation that we have. >> that moral obligation. that was january 2013. that was just a month after the sandy hook killings. vice president biden led this

whirlwind, incredibly tense, incredibly intensive process, and at the end of 33 days, had a set of 23 recommendations, from new federal research funding to things that can only be done by congress, things that can only be done through legislation. president obama, himself, stood next to president biden as he explained the recommendations. the president talked about the one single, simplest, smallest thing that could be done by legislation, something with more than 90% support among the american people, something that had massive support, more than 70% support even among members of the nra. >> it's time for congress to require a universal background check for anyone trying to buy a gun. the law already requires licensed gun dealers to run backed checks and over the last

14 years, that has kept more than 1.5 million of the wrong people from getting their hands on a gun, but it's hard to enforce that law when as many as 40% of all gun purchases are conducted without a background check. that's not safe, that's not smart, it's not fair to responsible gun buyers or sellers. if you want to buy a gun, whether it's from a licensed dealer or a private seller, you should at least have to show you're not a felon or somebody legally prohibited from buying one. this is common sense. an overwhelming majority of americans agree with us on a background check, including 70% of the national rifle association's members, according to one survey. there's no reason we can't do this. >> there's no reason that we can't do this, he says. there's no reason we can't do it. except, apparently, even that,

we cannot do! you might remember how this all unfolded. you're forgiven if it's blurred together during the years because of the way these things resolve. remember how this happened. after sandy hook, vice president biden put in charge of a task force which moves with incredible speed to come up with concrete proposals for things that can be done to try to reduce the number of people killed by guns in this country. president obama proposed what you heard there. universal background checks, background checks should be run on the buyer anytime anybody wants to buy a gun in this country. 90% plus support for that among the american people. it's simple. you have to have a background check if you want to buy a gun. that's a simple idea. overwhelming support, near unanimous support among the american people, but republicans in congress, including republicans in the senate, are not among that 90%-plus, apparently and decided they would go for something even

lower than that smallest, unambitious simple goal. conservative joe manchin and pat toomey said they wouldn't pursue, they wouldn't allow the pursuit of a simple rule that there ought to be a background check to buy a gun. instead, they had their own idea and said they could get it done. they had their own way. they had something that they said they could pass. we wouldn't do more than what 90% of the country wanted to do. but instead do a tiny piece of it, because they said so. so instead of that simple thing, saying you have to have a background check, full shot, manchin and toomey said no, no, we think that's a terrible idea. we're against that. we know that more than 90% of the people are for it, we're against it. but our idea is that the law will change to just say you have to have a background check if you buy a gun at a gun show or on the internet.

we will only extend background checks that far. gun show purchases, internet purchases, that's it. it is hard to imagine a smaller reform. but that is what they said they would do. that is what they said they could do. and so the rest of the country, more than 90% just want friggin' background checks, full stop, the rest of the country stood back and took very credible senators pursue this rinkey-dink tiny reform instead. because they said that was something they could get done and they failed. they couldn't even get that done, not through the united states senate, not even right after the sandy hook massacre. joe manchin and pat toomey were convinced and convinced the whole political class that they had magic gravitas on this issue to show that the legislative process in the united states senate can be trusted to work to do at least the smallest imaginable thing in an issue of overwhelming public concern. they were wrong.

they could not even do that one pitiful thing! not in the u.s. senate. not with filibuster rules in place that say a majority vote doesn't count. so nothing happened in american law. no law change. not made i through congress. in the final year of his presidency, president obama was still not just expressing regret about that, still not just exhibiting a rare for him show of anger about that. in the final year of his presidency, he was still actively emotional about that years later. >> second amendment rights are important. there are other rights that we care about as well. we have to be able to balance them. because our right to worship freely and safely, that right was denied to christians in

charleston, south carolina, and that was denied jews in kansas city and sikhs in oak creek. they had rights, too. our right to peaceful assembly, that right was robbed from moviegoers in aurora and lafayette. those rights were stripped from college kids in blacksburg and indonesia. and from high schoolers in columbine. and from first graders in new town. first graders.

and from every family who never imagined that their loved one would be taken from our lives by a bullet from a gun. every time i think about those kids, it gets me mad. >> that was president obama in 2016, emotionally reflecting on the fact that even after the murder of all those 6-year-olds at sandy hook, even after all those other mass murders of dozens of americans all killed by individual shooters legally armed to the teeth, even with all that, no, the united states senate insists there can be no changes, no reforms.

joe manchin insisted after sandy hook in 2012 that he was the one that could do it. that i would show that the united states senate was not broken, that it could absolutely do its job on this issue as long as you let someone like him define the job that was to be done. just as long as you let someone like him lead the way. just as long as you let somebody like him work with other senators like him who had so much credibility in the gun lobby. we can't do anything more ambitious that what he wants or what they want. watch what they can do once they finally decide to do on this. people like joe manchin said there's some credibility on this issue, they could get things done! things that we all agree should be done. just watch. the senate can work on this issue when they want to. just wash. just put things in the hands of the senators who disagree with 90 plus% of the american public on this. senators who represent the

fringiest, smallest, most hard-line ancient paleo politics position on this. they're the only ones with credibility on this issue. they're the ones who decide what's possible and they will show that the u.s. senate isn't broken, that things can be done, as long as they decide what those things are. watch. everything else stopped. all of that momentum after what happened in this country. after sandy hook. the outflowing of emotion after sandy hook, all of the momentum that was taken by the administration, all of the public desperation to do something. joe manchin said give that to me. i'm the one. i'm -- my way, this is the way we'll get things done. >> what we watched today really involved only one piece of

what has been a big complex debate about guns and it includes just a few senators. yet, the impact seems so much larger, in part pause of the emotion that helped make it happen. driven by their loss. >> i feel like i carry my daughter's spirit when i got into these meetings. >> i wanted them to hear me as a mother. i asked them if they could please give me something i can tell my son. >> surrounded by newtown families to talk about today's breakthrough on background checks but only a whisper could come forth from senator joe manchin. manchin, a democrat partnered with pat toomey, a republican, both rated by the nra to forge a compromise today. >> i think the substance of the bill makes a lot of sense. to me, this isn't gun control. this is common sense.

>> reporter: and shopping on the internet, just like those already required when buying from licensed dealers. the law would not affect individuals who buy, sell, or give their weapons to families, friends, or even strangers. >> this is a right that is so much good. it will prevent people from having a gun who shouldn't have it. >> he could not get that done. something that's so right, it does so much good, he couldn't get that done. and now he is insisting that he is the one who has to be trusted with this task again, because he will not allow anybody else's ideas to move forward. the alleged shooter in the boulder, colorado, massacre yesterday was released from the hospital after receiving medical treatment and is now at the boulder county jail. he was charged with ten counts of murder. he is 21 years old. he was born the same week at the

columbine massacre -- high school massacre was in 1999. when columbine happened, it felt like the world stopped and it would never start up the same way again. thirteen people killed at columbine high school in 1999. again, it felt like the biggest news we'd know for a decade, right. but the country would continue to have mass shootings at actually an accelerating pace. in 2012, just before the sandy hook massacre, it was aurora, colorado, a massacre in a movie theater that left people 12 shot and killed. actually, the colorado experience shows that the joe manchin don't actually do anything plan is not the only option. and when we hear from senators like joe manchin that we can do nothing else, we have to put it in his hands, despite all the ways he's failed in the past, you can look at a state like colorado and say there are other options we could try. at the time of the aurora

killings, the governor of colorado was a moderate man, john hickenlooper. but after aurora, he came to believe that some common sense popular gun reforms with you not only necessary, they were possible and it was bother worth. he announced his support for gun laws in colorado. he announced it in december 2012 just a few days before the sandy hook shooting happened. that of course focused the whole country's attention, but colorado was already moving. in colorado they did pass new laws. nothing radical but common sense changes that were very, very popular with the public, including limiting high capacity ammunition magazines and, yes, requiring background checks. the republicans and the gun lobby went nuts and they vowed revenge. they did get some of that. two democratic state senators who supported those reforms were recalled from office. two of them. the year after those gun reforms were signed by governor

hickenlooper, the following year 2013 and again in 2016, republicans took control of the colorado state senate. but in 2014, john hickenlooper was also elected, and in 2013, democrats won back the colorado state senate. one incumbent was ousted from his seat. he lost his seat and by a lot to the father of a young man who was killed in the aurora massacre. gun lobby republicans who had run the recall effort who had supported gun reforms, the gun lobbyists went after representative sullivan as well but their efforts to recall him collapsed and failed. last year, representative sullivan was just re-elected. colorado is now represented in the united states senate by senator michael bennett and senator john hickenlooper, the former governor. in order to get his seat in the u.s. senate, senator hickenlooper ousted republican

pro-nra republican senator corey gardner last year. senator hickenlooper and senator bennett said today in the wake of the boulder massacre that they support national reforms to improve been law and gun pollination wide. a lot of democratic senators are saying that today. when you hear that from colorado, senator hickenlooper in particular has at least lived through what it means to not only say that, but to do it. to show, that, yeah, you might rattle some cages when you do it but if you've got a the vast support of the people on your side, it will be viewed as the right thing to do, despite the fact that you will have opposition. and if you do it, there's no guarantee in life. there's no guarantee in politics that your career will thrive but hicken looper has shown that it can. president biden is calling once again for action from the country. >> i don't need to wait another

minute, let alone an hour, to take common sense steps that will save lives in the future and encourage my colleagues in the house and senate to act. we can ban assault weapons and high capacity magazines in this country once again. i got that done when i was a senator. it passed. it was law for the longest time. and it brought down these mass killings. we should do it again. we can close the loopholes in our background check system, including the charleston loophole. that's one of the best tools we have right now to prevent gun violence. the senate should immediately pass -- let me say it again. the united states senate -- i hope some are listening -- should immediately pass the two house bills that close loopholes in the background check system. these are bills that receive votes of both republicans and democrats in the house. this is not and should not be a partisan issue.

this is an american issue. it will save lives, american lives. we have to act. >> we have to act. but he's talking to the united states senate there. and joe manchin, the senator from west virginia, he will not act. even after the humiliation and what he dragged the country through in 2013. is not. senator manchin reiterated today that he doesn't support background checks for all gun sales, which is something that has already passed the house. it passed the house even with some republican support, which means joe manchin is to the right of republicans. if he alone changed his mind on this and decided that he really does care about this, that actually probably would be enough to get that one reform over the finish line, which if he changed his stance on the bill itself, if he found it in his heart to support background

checks, given that, and his stamps on keeping the filibuster rule in place so that majority votes don't count even for his own legislation, those two issues alone, joe manchin holds the fate of this in his hands. he promised this was an issue that moved him, in tears, as a parent, as a grandparent, he promised that he could get it done. he could get it done, actually, now. if he wanted to. i mean, even now with the nra almost dissolved in disgrace and in bankruptcy, instead of doing what he says he wants to do, he will do what the nra wants instead. not even the nra's members want that, but joe manchin does. and because of that he personally will stop the whole country from getting any substantive relief from this thing that plagues us still.

'because of that, because the united states senate is broken in that particular way, it will likely almost certainly come down again to whatever the president, now president biden can do on his own without congress, which is not much. and that is because the united states senate does not work, even for things more than 90% of the country wants done, even things that tear our hearts this much and that we agree on this much, even when we don't agree on anything else. the you said senate does not work in large part because of democrats like joe manchin. because of that, we can't do anything substantive as a country on this issue. despite senators like joe manchin saying this means a lot to them. there's a lot going on right now, including in washington. former first lady michelle obama has tonight published a powerful call on the senate to pass the federal rights voting bill that

already passed the house and is spending before the senate. we're going to have a report coming up tonight on the real urgency behind that right now, something that happened last night and tonight and is going to continue to happen this week that ought to be on the national radar in terms of the voting rights bill. we've also got reporting ahead on a real problem at the justice department with a bill barr appointee, a sort of leftover in the justice department from the trump era, who has screwed up in a way that may screw up all of the january 6th capitol rioter prosecutions. a lot to come tonight. we'll speak with congress joe neguse tonight who represents boulder, colorado. a lot to come tonight. stay with us. automatically-responding, energy-building, dually-adjustable, dad-powering, wellness-boosting, foot-warming, snore-relieving,

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there's a lot that we don't know. there's a lot still unfolding from yesterday's events. but let me simply say this. this cannot be our new normal. we should be able to feel safe in our grocery stores. we should be able to feel safe in our schools, in our movie theaters, and in our communities. we need to see a change, because we have lost far too many lives. as i said, i've lived in boulder county for many years and one thing i am sure of is this -- our community is strong, it is

kind, it is compassionate, and it is resilient. and we will get through this together. >> colorado congressman joe neguse speaking about yesterday's mass shooting in boulder, colorado. at that press conference, police released the names of the ten people who were killed in the massacre. they range in age from 20 to 65. also disclosed the name of the 21-year-old suspect who's in jail after being treated at the hospital yesterday for a gunshot wound. he faces ten counts of murder in the first degree. john neguse is with us. he grew up in boulder, has been serving his community there for years. congressman, thank you for joining us tonight. i'm so sorry for what boulder is going through right now. >> thank you, rachel. i appreciate that. >> one of the things that has been difficult even just nationally looking in on this

disaster is how long it has taken to get basical information about what happened. there was a long delay, obviously, a chaotic scene and an emotional one for police, who lost one of their own along the way. and a report that it was worse than initially reported. i have to just ask how you think your constituents are doing, how boulder is doing today. >> they're hurting, rachel. they are hurting. it's been a devastating 36 hours for our community here in boulder, for our state and for our country. the loss of life is truly unimaginable, when you consider the ten people who lost their lives yesterday, people who were friends or family members, brothers, sisters, neighbors, treasured community members, each of whom lost their lives, and the families who woke up

this morning without their loved ones, that pain, that anguish is just too hard to fathom. so our community is grieving. and it's going to take a while. there will be very difficult days, weeks, and months ahead as we grieve with those families and of course with officer talley's family, an officer who bravely gave his life and his heroism saved lives. it's just a heartbreaking tragedy. >> i think that it is heartbreaking for anybody looking in on this, particularly those who can empathize with it, because there have been mass shootings chose to them or their communities. so many americans in that circumstance. i think we are also becoming a little bit hard-hearted about these things when we think about whether or not we'll ever adapt as a community and as a country to try to stop things like this from happening in the future. we lament these things. we tear ourselves up about them. i feel like we're dissolving into a bipartisan hard hearted

cynicism that it's even worth trying to reform gun laws, trying to reform the kind of policies and processes around gun ownership and gun transfers and ammunition purchases and things like that. that might make a difference. how are you feeling on that scale today? >> i'm frustrated. you know, i have to say, rachel, i -- you're -- the frustration i can hear in your opening remarks on the program resonated with me and i think resonated with a whole lot of americans, certainly many of my constituents whom i've spoken to in the last day and a half. people are upset, they're grieving, they are angry at the inaction of the federal government. there is clearly a crisis that has been metastasizing year after year, decade after decade. you mentioned columbine high school. i was 14 years old when that massacre at columbine high occurred. to think of the ensuing 21 years

and the reality, the federal government has done virtually nothing to address the pervasive gun violence across our country that hit our home community just last night, it's difficult to fathom. and we can't at the end of the day accept failure and inaction as an option. i think we have to press forward and i'm certainly going to press forward with my colleagues to make sure we pass common sense gun violence reform. the time has come. i think we have to say as american people that enough is enough and we will not accept inaction. >> you by this tragedy, will now become one of the informal caucus in congress, and there are many members of that caucus where your district has been marred by an act of national significance, a mass murder, a mass -- act of mass gun violence in your district. when these things happen in the future, you will be called on to speak as the representative of a community that struggled through one of these things. it does feel like the moral authority, which you gain here,

of course, will come at a cost in handling this tragedy, but you will have a voice from here on out in terms of talking about how the country should handle these things. when you hear frustration from people like me, when you hear frustration from your constituents about the senate being the place where asking for help where these things go to die, is that levened at all for you by hope that it actually will change in the senate, that hearts might change, that the senate might get their gumption together. are you hopeful that things could move? >> i am, rachel. i am. i have to be. you know, i firmly believe public opinion has trended in the direction of support for these broadly popular provisions that we have been discussing like universal background checks as an example. i intend to reach out to every single united states senator to make the case about why we

need to enact common sense gun violence reform legislation. i truly believe that we can make this happen, that we can get it done. for those who doubt that, i would simply say in the last year, in february of last year, i had an opportunity to attend the president's state of the union. i brought as my guest, tom mouser. he tragically lost his son daniel during the columbine high school shooting. daniel was my age when he lost his life. tom refused to give up. he spent the better part of the next year and a half for campaigning for a law closes the gun show loophole. you articulated the steps colorado has taken. there's more work to do. but we have to be hopeful that this is a crisis and problem we can solve. there's simply no excuses to not doing so. my constituents are tired of excuses. >> congressman joe neguse who represents boulder, sir, thank you so much for your time tonight and a chance to talk

with you. i know it's a really difficult time. thanks for being here. >> thank you, rachel. >> hearing him say that, you know, you want -- you want public servants, particularly young, incredibly talented public servants, like congressman neguse, i'm talking and saying that now, i'm talking behind his back, you want people with talent and ambition and values and the kind of communication skills that somebody like that has. you want public servants with hope. right? you want people who believe even against the kind of circumstances that i've been describing here tonight, the sort of, you know, brick wall that we've run into so many times in this country, despite the public will to do something. you want people in positions of power and people who are ascendent in politics who believe stuff can get done. any way. we'll be right back. stay with us. right back. stay with us

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week, debate in congress is shifting to whether or not democrats will change the filibuster rules in the senate so we can have some gun safety reforms in the country. where almost all republicans stand on this issue, if senate democrats don't at least try, it is basically guaranteed there will be no gun reform at all. there will also be no move to protect voting rights at all. last night during a private call between president biden and senate democrats, georgia senator willie warp ok reportedly urged with the president the urgent need for voting rights legislation to counter efforts between republicans in his state and others to radically restrict voting righties. this led to a discussion an reform of the filibuster. if democrats are going to do anything to stop republicans nationwide from rolling back voting rights, they're going to have to do it soon if it's going to have an effect in georgia. earlier this month both the georgia house of representatives and the senate passed a bunch of bills to try to make voting

harder. in the past 24 hours, two of those proposals made their way out of committee and now on their way to becoming law. these bills will do everything from adding absentee voting requirements, to making it illegal to hand out water to people who are waiting in long lines to vote. republicans in georgia plan to confine all these voter suppression the governor's desk for him to sign right away within the next few days. what's going on in georgia or nationally over the next eight days that might derail this speeding train. joining us once again is latasha brown, cofounder of a group. to get georgia-based companies and businesses to come out against this wave of legislation to restrict voting rights. ms. brown, thank you so much for being with us. it's nice to have you back. >> thank you for having me, rachel.

>> so i asked the last time that you were here if you would come back and keep us apprised, because it did feel like this was going to move fast when it started moving. i'm making good on that. i want to ask you to get us up to speed about where you are. >> it's moving pretty fast. what we are very deeply disappointed in is it seems like the metro atlanta chamber of commerce cut a deal with republicans reporting to the minority leader didn't bother to meet the democrats in congress and on senate bill 202, which is devastating. that is the bill that actually cuts out sunday voting on -- new omnibus bill on -- during runoffs and some of the things you raised, including the egregious part of it, it gives who have the -- it gives the republicans whoever's in power authority over the quite frankly, if they don't

like the results, they can do a recall and cancel elections. the results, so that is part of the problem that's authenticated on this big lie that trump made. right now, what we are seeing is organizations like ours, the new georgia project, action pac, naacp, they wrote a letter to the governor kemp's office saying that this is egregious and that we want to see him veto this bill that this bill should not do that. black voters and voters in the state should not be punished because of civil rights in this last election. >> you mentioned one change that i think is worth pausing on and going back to for a second. this idea that the republicans and the state legislature in the new legislation that they want to pass, they would have the authority to remove local elections boards and supervisors if this bill passes. if you think about what they would have done with that power after the 2020 election, the way that president trump and

president trump's supporters and republicans pressure to try to stop the certification of votes in individual counties, to try to reverse the vote count, to try to undermine those things at the local level, this legislation they're passing would have given republicans and the legislature the ability potentially to stop individual counties from certifying the vote. they could just say no. >> absolutely. it would have been devastating. the outcome, i believe, would have been totally different. as we're going forward, it's so anti-democratic. you know, it's interesting. today -- on today, this is 155 years when andrew johnson actually as president of this country vetoes the civil rights bill that was -- ultimately was overwritten a couple of days later, but we're still 155 years later fighting for the basic right to vote. this is not a partisan issue. this should be a basic civil right issue. >> latasha brown, the co-founder

of black voters matter, thank you for your time. thank you for keeping us honest on this issue about what georgia businesses are doing here. their public platitudes to the contrary, their actions are being closely monitored by you and others, keeping the national media honest on this in a way i think we couldn't do without your close watching. thank you for helping us understand. >> absolutely. thank you for having me. >> we'll be right back. stay with us.

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on national ff tv and speculate what further charges they will bring against the rioters. he went on "60 minutes" be said federal prosecutors probably bring sedition charges against people in big conspiracy charges for their actions at the capitol. and he said, i believe the facts do support those charges. he talked about what the evidence is ultimately pointing out in terms of potential future charges. you are not supposed to do that. there are clear justice department rules about not making statements about charged individuals in pending cases including future charged cases or the quality or nature of the evidence. the merits of potential charges, you don't talk about those things in the press because people don't get tried in the press. you only make comments like that in official proceedings in court, not on tv. michael sherwin didn't know that, apparently? justice department veterans immediate raised red flags about

that interview. we learned he did the interview without permission from the justice department will officials reported the, quote, infuriated by his interview. now today seeing the repercussions playing out in court. one proud boys rioter said, opposing the government's attempt to put him in jail, pending trial. the judge in another conspiracy case called an emergency hering today on six hours' notice to make all the lawyers in the case discuss sherwin's comments. the judge told the lawyers, quote. the judge said, quote.

the d.c. u.s. attorney's office said the head of the criminal division to the judge today. he told the judge, quote. so michael sherwin, the big barr this bill barr appointee who was acting d.c. u.s. attorney when the capitol happened. so he took control from the first days of the capitol attack. he is no longer acting u.s. attorney in d.c. but he is still a justice department employee. he is still subject to internal investigation and potential discipline by the justice department. he is now investigated about giving this interview to the cuba about pending cases. whatever happens to him personally as a repercussion

about this bone-headed move! what he has done cannot be undone. the justice department has to deal with the repercussions. it should be noted the judge took the justice department to task, and anonymous law enforcement officials, and they say they have opened an investigation into that article too. the justice department's problems with employees, talks to the media about pending riot cases goes behind michael sherwin. but the michael sherwin problem is a really bad one. is the justice department going to get this problem under control so it can try these cases without more surprises? i hate to say it, but watch this space. don't settle for silver 7 moisturizers 3 vitamins 24 hours hydration gold bond champion your skin

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245 happy to have you with us. i'll see you tomorrow night. "way too early" is up next. >> i commend the exceptional bravely of officer eric talltal. every time an officer walks out of his or her home and pins that badge on, the family member that they just said good-bye to wonders whether they will subconsciously, will they get that call, the call that his wife got. he thought he would be coming home to his family and his seven children. when the moment the act came, officer talley did not hesitate in his