welcome back. i just want to take a very quick moment and wish my mother a very happy birthday. she's celebrating her birthday today. i'm taking her out right after the show today so thank you, mom, for all you do for me. happy birthday and thank you at home for watching "the cross connection." i'll be back next saturday at 10:00 a.m. eastern and stay tuned because my friend alex witt is next. >> how great is it to have your mom's birthday and you're great for taking her out. philip bailey, and i had the soundtrack going through my head and i said, let's see, september, boogie wonderland, fantasy -- i mean, totally jealous you got to talk to him. >> the album came out 48 years ago today. isn't that amazing? >> i love them. they're such an amazing band. >> oh, please.

>> and the falsetto. >> so, so inspiring. have a good lunch with your mama? thanks, alex. a very good day to you from here in new york. that's the show you're watching. it is high noon here in the east, everyone. 9:00 a.m. out west and we're beginning with breaking news in washington, d.c., where right now thousands are gathering around the national mall and they're calling for action from congress and the white house on immigration reform. my colleague julie ainsley is with us. welcome to you. what are you hearing from these may day protesters? what action do they want to see? >> reporter: yeah. so we have a group here, hundreds behind me as they make their way from the white house to the capitol. they're frustrated, alex. these are a lot of people who had a lot of hope when president biden was elected and so far they haven't seen a lot of action. we have dreamers here who want to see a permanent fix on daca.

we have undocumented immigrants and overall, what we're seeing is a lot of essential workers. people who say that their jobs were essential to getting america through the pandemic and they want protection to be able to stay in the united states. i spoke to one dreamer earlier, fatima, and she had a lot to tell me about her feelings today. >> i am a daca recipient and i came to this country when i was 13. so anything that they decide regarding daca and essential workers will definitely affect me and my family. every day, not knowing what's going to happen if they decide not to act on this big issue it affects me. i don't want to live anywhere else. i've lived here for more than 15 years, so i don't -- i don't see myself anywhere else but here. >> reporter: so, as you can hear from people like fatima, she did say her feelings and anxiety has am proved under this

administration because she doesn't think that president biden has anything against immigrant, but she wants to see more leadership and she wants to see reform on capitol hill. what it really comes down to, alex is whether or not the president is willing to put some of his political capital behind his immigration bill to get reform possible and because of everything happening at the border, it seems that president biden isn't willing to put up the fight that these people are really calling for today and you can hear them. it's a lively crowd. there are a lot of people. we have over 30 organizations represented and they're continuing to make their voices known. >> well, indeed, and the good news is that the fight is not over yet on either side so it will keep coming. thank you so much, julia, for that. let's go out to new reaction from rudy giuliani as federal investigators pore over data from devices seized in raids from his home as well as his office this week. nbc news caught up with giuliani as he left his new york city home and he told our crew he's filming a documentary today, but

saving a big announcement for later. >> we're going to remind the whole world new york was the first capital of the united states and you know what hamilton would agree with me on? the capitol of the world. >> mr. mayor, what do you think about what's going on on? >> if people want to know about this whole thing i'll make a statement this afternoon in new jersey. >> fbi agents warned giuliani he was being targeted by russian intelligence two years ago as he sought political opposition research on the biden family. his lawyer denies this saying, quote, according to giuliani the event never happened and new reaction to the alleged incident to failing to act as a foreign agent while he was donald trump's lawyer. >> it really goes to the question of whether undisclosed foreign agents to be able to control u.s. policy and in this

case, the undisclosed foreign agent was potentially rudy giuliani, the president's lawyer and basically, what's really at the heart of this particular investigation is whether he essentially successfully orchestrated the removal of a very distinguished ambassador marie yovanovitch in return for potentially money, as well as dirt on the bidens from corrupt ukrainian officials. >> my colleague, msnbc's lindsay reiser is joining me from new york city. this big announcement in weehawken later today. do we have any idea what to expect? >> our crew is the only one here to speak with giuliani, and he did mention the announcement in weehawken and we are working out more details about that and i guess that is to be continued. perhaps his interviews on newsmax could be a taste of what he might say.

he's been defending himself on news max as well as his podcast. let's catch you up to speed on what's going on here. cnbc confirmed there was a raid at his apartment. the doorman led the fbi agents up and they showed the search warrant to giuliani and they took a cell phone, a laptop and an ipad and as you mentioned nbc news has confirmed that this is in part related to finding potential evidence related to the 2019 firing of the ambassador to ukraine marie yovanovitch. giuliani's lawyer is saying this whole raid and legal thuggery, giuliani never lobbied for any foreign government and official and giuliani spoke out against yovanovitch publicly because she believed she was undermining then-president trump. let's hear about what giuliani had to say about the documents seized about his client president trump. >> i've never heard of someone blatantly violating the

attorney-client privilege that way, and basically what they did when they took all my documents from the icloud, they admitted that there was attorney-client privileged information there and they decided on their own what they would use and what they wouldn't use. >> reporter: so giuliani has denied any wrongdoing and he hasn't been charged with any crime right now and he also believes that the department of justice investigation is corrupt. we should mention that president joe biden earlier this week sat down with my colleague craig melvin. craig asked him, did you have advanced knowledge of this raid? the president said absolutely not and he found out the same time the public did. lindsay reiser, thank you for that and let's go now to a bombshell new report from "the daily beast." it's about matt gaetz. in a confession letter reportedly written by his associate, joel greenberg, "the

daily beast" said he and congressman gaetz paid for sex with multiple women as well as a girl who was 17 at the time and greenberg reportedly wrote the letter while working with roger stone to try to secure a pardon by then-president donald trump. we want to be very clear, nbc news has not obtained nor seen this letter. we have not been able to verify its content, but let's go to amanda gold on capitol hill with the latest on this. the question you can answer, amanda, how are members of congress responding to this? >> we are getting some renewed scrutiny over congressman matt gaetz amid this ongoing federal probe into sex trafficking and prostitution charges and nbc news has not verified the supposed letter and we have not viewed the contents, but we do have a very strong statement of defense from a spokes purpose for congressman matt gaetz, and quote, congressman gaetz has never paid for sex nor did he

have sex with a 17-year-old girl and while the daily beast story contains a lot of confessions, it certainly doesn't add substance and the wild and false claims against rep gaetz. he had no interest in involving himself in mr. greenberg's affairs. we also now have a statement from roger stone in which he formally denies any seeking of a pardon for gaetz from former president trump. they have based their smear attacks which are out of order, incomplete, edited and out of context and made no effort to seek a pardon from mr. greenberg and i have seen no substantiation or actual proof of any of the wild accusations he has made against congressman gaetz. desperate men often tell lies in an effort to implicate others in their own crimes to lessen

penalties with themselves. there's been swift condemnation to this renewed scrutiny and not very much from republican lawmakers at this time and i want to take a listen to somewhat congressman ted liu had to say and he served on the commission alongside congressman gaetz. >> like all americans congressman gaetz is entitled to a presumption of innocence and sitting on the committee is an honor, and it is the very department that has opened a criminal investigation in which matt gaetz is a subject. that is a clear conflict of interest and leader kevin mccarthy must remove matt gaetz from the committee immediately. >> as far as house minority leader kevin mccarthy he has been previously asked into gaetz noting that the allegations are serious, but gaetz denounced them and innocent until proven guilty and saying if he was found to be complicit in what

he's being alleged of doing that he would therefore be removed of his assignments in the house and we have not had updated reaction from kevin mccarthy in light of the daily beast reporting. one of them includes congresswoman marjorie tailor greene who has been a staunch defender of gaetz before. they are partnering for this america first upcoming tour that they are doing and holding rallies across the country. the first one is going to be next friday in the villages, the retirement community in florida and this comes in light of marjorie taylor-greene getting swift pushback from republican leaders in the party over the potential america first caucus. she walked that back and gaetz and green is moving forward with the rallies with the america first. >> they will target the radical left and republicans in name only. it should be interesting to follow. thank you very much, amanda, for that. now a look at today's other headlines starting at the u.s.-mexico border, the pentagon is stopping all border wall construction that was paid for

with military funds redirected by the trump administration. it is not clear whether president biden will halt all construction. on capitol hill, negotiations on police reform are under way. of course, the anniversary of george floyd's death. this morning leading democratic congressman hakeem jefferies saying democrats shouldn't give in too much to republican demands on this. >> we know in congress that we have to respond, and it shouldn't be a watered down response. it's got to provide accountability and it's got to lead to changes in policing that will allow every community to have an engagement with law enforcement that is anchored in dignity and respect. >> a swing state is ramping up efforts to restrict voting access. the florida governor is expected to sign a bill into law, limiting ballot drop boxes and making it harder to vote by mail. this morning, new reaction from

the florida state legislature. >> we are just going to have to put pressure on our federal legislators, our members of congress and folks like joe manchin and kyrsten sinema and do the right thing and pass the voting rights act. that law hasn't happened and it is effectively moot if we pass the john lewis voting rights act. >> let's go to shannon pettypiece in washington. welcome. he has the first hundred days behind him and how are the next 100 days shaping up for the president? >> this is marked by the infrastructure push. you are talking about the police reform bill. the president, and that's something he supports and wants to see through. a lot of that is largely going to be in the hands of the senate for them to hammer out a deal. the white house focus remains on the $2 trillion infrastructure bill the president wants to get through. he has a number of stops planned this week to promote that to the american public. he'll be in virginia on monday.

on thursday, he's going to louisiana and trying to build that public support, he hopes and the white house hopes will built that support in congress because right now while the president is pushing for some type of republican deal they're not close to that. the republicans and the democrats are trying to figure out if there is some compromise. he has talked to a number of senators involved. the white house says to expect him to bring some members to the white house as early as next week and hold some of those bipartisan meeting to try and reach a middle ground. i will say the white house officials indicate the clock is ticking on this. they want to see a counter proposal from the republicans and a bipartisan compromise by mid-may, and they want to see substantial progress by memorial day or they're going to re-assess whether or not this bipartisan route is working. so the white house sees some speed here, they want to get

through. they still want to reach a compromise, but they are not going to wait very long to get to that compromise. >> okay. >> we have a huge opportunity here to provide fast, safe, reliable, clean transportation in this country, and transit is part of the infrastructure. like the rest of our infrastructure, we're way behind the rest of the world right now. we need to remember we're in competition with the rest of the world. >> reporter: and a lot of the conversation, of course, with republicans is going to be what is infrastructure. everyone can agree, elder care is infrastructure, our electric vehicles are infrastructure and that's partly where you will see the back and forth. >> shannon pettypiece, appreciate it. joining me now is minority whip jim clyburn. there's a lot to talk about.

let's start with matt gaetz and he remains defiant and lawmakers if the most part have been quiet. should your colleagues take action at this point and is gaetz a drag on republicans so far and at what point could house democrats step? ? >> thank you very much for having me, first of all, but i would hope that mckarther would do as ted lieu indicated. we ought not have anyone anywhere that could cause some doubt to be thrown on the investigations. i think representative gaetz has subjected himself to activities that should be scrutinized and we ought not have anybody thinking that he's in some place that he can short circuit the

scrutiny. so i agree with ted lieu. mccarthy should take a look at this. >> it just seems as common sense when someone is being investigated that they be removed from the body that investigates that person, but let's talk about this, sir, as we go to president biden's jobs and families plan. republicans certainly balking at the price tag. what is the best way to get these sweeping packages on to the president's desk? might we see both of these plans broken into pieces? it could very well be and that's not a bad thing, but you know, i wish if people would take a look at where the country is today, what we've been through in the last year and what we need to be doing to repair people's lives and to set us back on course toward the search of a more perfect union. if we were to do that and put a price tag on not doing this, i think we will realize why we

need to do exactly what the president is calling for. what is going to be the price on the lives of children who may miss a second year of school? what's the price on the lives of senior citizens who don't have access to telehealth and telemedicine? what is going to be the future of businesses? we have to remain closed because we cannot get the kind of efforts we are paid for to allow us to get beyond this pandemic. that is what this president is calling for and the price tag is big, but the price tag of not doing this is much, much bigger, and i think we ought to get that as we talk about what the cost is to this country. >> yeah. absolutely. let's talk about police reform, sir. lawmakers in both parties have started negotiations and a bill that could actually get through

congress. how delicate a balance is this and what have you heard about this and are you confident that the george floyd policing act will be on the president's desk by the may 25th deadline that he set? >> well, i'm very confident that what he's undertaken will take place in the next several days and even weeks, and i'm optimistic that something will get passed. now what that something is will depend upon how serious the negotiations are. look, we don't expect for the law to be exactly as proposed in the house, nor do we expect it to be exactly as proposed in the senate. i don't understand why people think that because your version was rejected that nothing else can be considered. let's sit down around the table and let's have some serious

discussions as to why democrats think it ought to be done one way. you think it ought to be done another way and seeking to find common ground. that is the way you do things. this whole notion that it will either be my way or the highway, that's the problem we've got here. so karen bass, the former member from louisiana, cedric richmond, we worked on this for over a year. i stayed out of it, but i've been in consultation with them a whole lot. they are earnest to end their discussions. i would hope that what's taken place over in the senate when kamala harris was there. she worked on it. she's not there anymore, but cory booker is still there, and i know how earnest she is about this. i hope the same thing will

continue to take place with my colleague tim scott. >> well, let me ask you about that because tim scott who -- he's working on police reform negotiations and he got mixed reaction after saying, quote, america is not a racist country in the gop response in the president's response on wednesday. what went through your mind when you heard that and what do you think about the reaction to scott's remarks? again, he's gotten a lot of pushback and it's been somewhat controversial. >> as you can imagine, i sat down with great anticipation to listen to his rebuttal to the president, and i was shocked when he threw that into the mix. >> yeah. no one has ever called america a racist country. that's not the problem here. there are systemic racism in various jurisdictions in this country. that is the problem.

a racist country would not elect barack obama president or kamala harris vice president, but that's not the issue. the issue is do we have racist things taking place in certain institutions, in certain jurisdictions and will they do what is necessary to weed out those things? i often talk about santiago who wrote about this country in the 1830s when he came here from france, who said this is a great country because we were more enlightened and slavery is not enlightenment and it is not great, but rather because we have always been able to repair our fault. the emancipation proclamation was to repair the fault of slavery. it was to repair the fault of segregation. when we find faults in the system, the question is are we going to go about repairing those faults.

so i would say to my colleague, let's get onboard. let's look at the fact if we've got some faults in our law enforcement. we've gotten to figure out a way to get these bad actors out of it and hold them responsible and have qualified immunity applied only to be there for them and directed by throwing the battle over to the police departments and that's not it. each and every one of us as individuals, congressional, administrative or at the local level, we have individual responsibilities that we must fulfill. a police officer will not be held responsible that the burden must be under the department, that's not good enough. each and every one of us must measure up to our responsibilities to the public and as a police officer, you have an individual responsibility that you should

be held accountable for. >> yes, sir. one more question, and this is regarding what senate minority leader mitch mcconnell is doing and he's leading republicans and they're calling on the education department to stop a proposal that would promote teaching about systemic racism and the consequences of slavery. the letter said in part, quote, families did not ask for this divisive nonsense. voters did not vote for it, americans never decided our children should be taught that our country is inherently evil. is it evil to teach and normalize lessons in history. is mcconnell trying to fire up his base with those words? >> that's exactly when he's trying to do. >> i used to teach history. i studied history every day and i would tell my kids that were in my class, i would tell them all the time, look, don't bring this to me. it was introduced to this

country and we know that, and am i not supposed to know that? 1492 wasn't a year that this country was discovered. that's when columbus found his way here. native americans were here all the time. we should put history in the proper perspective. you don't do that by ignoring the fact. he should be ashamed of himself. if the schools down in kentucky were to follow his lead they would turn out a lot of ignorant people, and i would hope that we would do what is necessary so everybody will put history in its proper context. george santillana admonished if you fail to learn the lessons of history, you are bound to repeat them. we need to learn history, learn the lessons of history and work on doing what is necessary not to repeat certain things about our history so that we can avoid all these pitfalls going

forward. mitch mcconnell needs to come onboard. >> i can tell you were an outstanding history teacher and you wear pink well, sir. wear it out today. thank you very much. it is a sign that republicans are increasingly taxed by president biden and that's next. taxed by president d that's next. applebee's irresist-a-bowls all just $8.99. ♪ limu emu & doug ♪ liberty mutual customizes your car insurance so you only pay for what you need. thank you! hey, hey, no, no limu, no limu! only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ it's moving day. and while her friends are doing the heavy lifting, jess is busy moving her xfinity internet and tv services. it only takes about a minute.

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a new bill that would implement a slew of voting restrictions and the swing state is on its way to becoming law this time in florida where the republican-led legislature passed a bill thursday that would limit drop boxes and add more stipulations for getting an absentee ballot. joining me now is zerlina maxwell and host of the show "zerlina" on peacock.

kurt bardella and elise jordan, from the george w. bush white house and msnbc political analyst. some of you weren't here last week, and i noticed. glad you're here today. let's talk about governor desantis, zerlina, does florida or any of the states, pushing for voter, restrictions, rather, do they have a legitimate, non-political reason for passing legislation, is there evidence of voter fraud or is it just political in. >> it is all just political and all based on the big lie, alex. essentially republicans fed into the lie that donald trump really won the election which we all know sitting here did not happen, and so based on this lie and the lie about voter fraud which there is barely any voter fraud, they are passing restrictions on what we used to like and mail-in voting was a thing that republicans actually

loved until black people did it during this pandemic year, and i think what we're seeing here is republicans in the country and state legislatures all across the country looked at what happened in georgia and we're, like, we're going to do this, too, because they don't have a policy platform. they're only arguing over culture war issues and now we see they're passing voter suppression all across the country including in these important battleground states and that's part of a political strategy to eke out elections in a country with changing demographics and they're trying to suppress the votes of people less likely to vote for them and that's what they're doing. >> and even donald trump voted by mail, just saying. if you really want to see today's post-trump republican party in action, take a look at what's happening in gop-controlled state legislatures because they're pushing through legislation allowing people to carry handguns without a permit, ban

transgender athletes from playing sports and protesters and there's the audit, and months after the election was won by joe biden. you know, take all of that in, kurt, what does the republican party of today stand for? >> you know, alex, the republican party is an anti-democratic force in american politics. it is a party that is built now on white supremacy, white nationalism, author tearianism and i just -- i don't know how someone like senator tim scott can use a platform responding with a joint address to congress and having that opportunity to address the country and say something like racism doesn't exist in america when we're seeing in republican-controlled legislators and states throughout this country, republicans systemically going

through and definitively trying to implement policies that are trying to erase the votes of communities of color. they are trying to make it harder for them to participate in the democratic process. they are racist and targeting people of color. it is really that simple and ultimately a party that used to be about less government interference, that used to be about small government. that used to be about fiscal responsibility. those policies have all been abandoned and now the only thing that this party really stands for is white power. >> so that begs this question, elise. are republicans struggling to find effective attacks against biden. they've been focused on these culture wars and not many substantive ideas while biden's agenda items appeal to be polling very well across the country. >> alex, it's actually hilarious that there isn't an anti-biden

cottage industry selling anti-biden memorabilia, and the republicans have not been able to sink their claws into that effective of an attack and it plays to joe biden's benefit that during the debate he was on stage and he was staking out a more moderate platform than other democratic candidates and so now as he is enacting a very liberal agenda and a progressive agenda, he still has some insulation of his previous record and because of where he was among the democratic field. and so it really, it's been something to behold to watch the republicans flailing about to try to label joe biden, but failed. >> and you have senator mitch mcconnell joining the culture wars. you have "the new york times" reporting on this. mcconnell led on friday in

promoting education programs that address systemic racism and the legacy of american slavery calling the guidance divisive nonsense. what do you make of that, kurt? >> it's what i asked congressman clyburn, is the studying of history of this country divisive or does it stoke outrage among the gop base? >> alex it is not -- i'm sorry. that's to kurt, but you're welcome to weigh in in a second. >> oh, sorry! no, no, no, no. sorry. >> it is an effort to both, quote, own the libs. a tried and true troll that reps like to fall back on when they have no ideas of their own or to talk about. it's an effort to incite their base and incite the people who stormed the capitol on january 6th and tried to overthrow our democracy, to keep them engaged and keep them agitated and activated and it's an effort to justify the racist policies by re-writing history and whitewashing history and it's no

you are is prize that mitch mcconnell, the leader and this is what they have to fall back on. they have no answer for joe biden. joe biden is an honorable, sincere, authentic, honest person and people of those ideologies agree on the components and it's harder to demonize him and it's harder to make him the radical poster child of the left and that's all they have to fall back on and that's why they'll keep doing it. >> you want to add something to that, elise. i'm sorry, i didn't hear when you called out kurt. i wasn't trying to step out of place. it's not surprising that you have a man of a certain generation in the south, it's 2020, but it may as well be 1950 and 1960 the way he's talking and wanting to avoid talking about the difficult issue of racism in america rather than to address it head-on, and so this is an attitude that has, you know, been prevalent in the deep south for a long time, and you

see the conversation in so many americans wanting to have this conversation, and i'm encouraged by that. >> yeah. i want to go back with you, zerlina, to what happened after biden's address to congress this week when senator tim scott gave the republican rebuttal. let's take a listen to what he said about systemic racism about the president's response and this is an interview with craig melvin and happened the next day. >> hear me clearly, america is not a racist country. it is backwards to fight discrimination with different types of discrimination and it's wrong to try to use our painful past to dishonestly shut down debates in the present. >> i don't think the american people are racist, but i think after 400 years african-americans have been left in a position where they are so far behind the 8 ball in terms of education, health, in terms of opportunity -- i don't think

america's racist, but i think the overhang from all of the jim crow and before that slavery have had a cost and we've had to deal with it. >> and you know, zerlina, that is what congressman clyburn was saying he didn't like that he had to say that. systemic racism, that's a different thing entirely. what do you make of these comments? >> a lot of times, alex, we get stuck in the interpersonal racism and things that you can't really prove. what's more productive is having this conversation about systemic racism and the ways in which our systems are not built for black people and frankly, the idea that mitch mcconnell is putting forward that addressing the enslavement of my ancestors -- no, the enslavement was the divisive part and not talking about the history accurately. not ignoring the ways in which we went from reconstruction and that ended into redemption, into

black coats, into jim crow, into segregation, and now we are in a moment where the aftereffects of the systemically racist policies come out in our everyday lives today. there is a connection between the fact that law enforcement originated as slave patrols and are still in 2021 killing black men and women on the street who are not armed. if mitch mcconnell cannot see those connections, i need to have theirees examined for all of you, catch the zero lippa show on "the pea cook. building a case against rudy giuliani. what prosecutors may ultimately get on him. that's next. ultimately get on him that's next.

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>> now to north carolina where demonstrators gathered for a tenth straight day of protests in the police shooting of andrew brown jr., let's go to sam brock standing by. what's the latest on this investigation? >> hi, alex. good afternoon. out here in pasquotank county, the mayor has said little and in the eyes of so many people that are down here, this say stagnant situation if and until the police body camera video was released and there are no signs of that happening any time soon, the judge here in this case which has to approve the release of body camera said it will be at least 30 days until that happens because he's worried about unduly influencing proceedings in this case. the family was promised to see full camera footage and they say they saw previously, but potentially up to four deputies worth of body camera footage, but that hasn't happened yet. they have a viewing tomorrow, a funeral on monday so the

sequence here all kind of up in the air right now. i would also add the biggest and most significant thing happening and the deputies there during the shooting are now back on the job, alex. three are not according to sheriff wooten and those are the three that are currently on leave discharged their weapons and he cites the body camera footage for that. overnight some of the big changes and the curfew was pushed until 8:00 p.m. until midnight and they are requiring permits with 15 days' notification and that would not be possible given the current circumstances and they've been issued a grace period and i spoke with dmitria williams down the street from andrew brown who says she's known him her entire adult life and she describes what she saw on the day that he was shot. >> i heard a shot and i ran down here. by the time i got here they was literally standing in the back of his car riddling it with bullets, assassinating this young man. he was trying to get away.

>> you saw him get gunned down. >> yes. yes. >> did it seem to you like he was threatening the police? >> no. no. how do you threaten the police when your hands is on the wheel when you're trying to drive? >> reporter: alex, in about an hour you will hear from the activists that said they did nothing wrong but violating the curfew, behind that is pasqua tank's sheriff's office and there is a confederate monument for heroes. >> lots and lots of tension. >> new today, former trump lawyer, rudy giuliani telling msnbc news he will make a statement this afternoon on the fbi raid on his home and office. he defended him, saying he was a great patriot. he does these things, he just

loves his country and here's his former lawyer. >> he is giving himself a legal out. remember what i had done when i stated that donald trump directed me to make the hush money payments. i guess he's probably learned something from that. >> and joining me now, chuck rosenberg, msnbc contributor and former u.s. attorney and senior fbi official, chuck, good to see you, my friend. do you agree that donald trump is trying to give himself a legal out and if so, why would he need to do that? >> that's a great question, alex. i wouldn't be shocked if mr. trump was looking for a legal out. i think he spent much of his adult life looking for legal outs both civilly and criminally and tigers don't tend to change their stripes. i may have mangled that metaphor, but i think you know what i mean, and so i wouldn't put too much stock about into

what mr. trump said. i certainly would not put too much stock into what mr. giuliani will say. what does matter is what evidence does the fbi sees. they had a warrant signed bu a federal judge and that's actually what matters. the stuff that is evidence and want what people say about evidence. >> your metaphor worked perfectly, my friend. he's been out saying investigators are out violating trump's attorney-client privilege. does it hinge on whether he acted on behalf of trump at the time? >> well, also a great question. so the way prosecutors and agents think about that, alex, is to establish what we call a clean team and a filter team. when you're looking at material that may be privileged. so if you were my lawyer and we were talking about a legal matter the stuff we talked about was privileged and if we're planning a crime or we're covering up a crime or we're

talking about things other than your legal representation of me, that's not privilege and investigators can look at it. and so the u.s. attorney's office will set up a mechanism for the fbi for a filter team to make sure that the stuff is being passed to the investigative team is not privileged. it's not a hard thing to do, and if there is a dispute, a federal judge can arbitrate that. they will be careful that the stuff they look at with the stuff for prosecution purposes is not privileged. >> are federal prosecutors treading on thin ice at all? how do they try to navigate legal, constitutional questions like these while carrying out investigations that reassure the public that no one is above the law? >> look, we do this all the time. we have difficult, sensitive, long, arduous investigations. we know what the rules are. we have federal judges to whom we can apply for warrants or to

vitiate a privilege. we do this all of the time. it's not necessarily a quick task and it's not always a simple task, but it is something we're comfortable with and it's what we are trained to do, alex. so here's the thing about the justice department that i think you and i have talked about this before. it has to be two things all the time and simultaneously. it has to be fair, objectively fair, and it has to be perceived as fair. it's not enough just to be fair and it is not enough just to be perceived as fair and the great damage that was done to that institution they love so much by former president biden is that he cast into doubt the fact that it was actually fair. the perception of the justice department and its work was undermined by donald trump. what i know of the justice department is that they are both and that they have tried to be both as long as that institution has been around, that they know the rules, they will abide the

rules and even in a difficult, arduous investigation to do it properly and to keep privileged information out of the mix and to use non-privileged information to from seed with a prosecution if viable. >> it is a daunting tank in the wake of the trump administration and the way they handled the doj. point well taken, chuck rosenberg, thank you, my friend. today is the beginning of the end for afghanistan troops in afghanistan or is it? al qaeda has a big plan to reunite with the taliban. we'll talk about it next. talibn we'll talk about it next age before beauty? why not both? visibly diminish wrinkled skin in... crepe corrector lotion... only from gold bond. seeing blood when you brush or floss can be a sign of early gum damage. new parodontax active gum repair kills plaque bacteria at the gum line to help keep the gum seal tight. new parodontax active gum repair toothpaste.

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the withdrawal of thousands of u.s. troops still in afghanistan is under way, the final phase to america's war in the country after 20 years. president biden's goal to have all troops out of the country by september 11th, an extension to the former administration's may 1st deadline. joining me now is nbc news chief diplomacy analyst is the former supreme allied commander in nato, and this is exciting, co-author of the new book "2034, a novel of the next world war, not that being the supreme allied commander of nato is exciting. is this the right time, sir, to begin removing our troops? is september 11th a feasible deadline? do you have any concerns about

it? >> september 11th is a feasible deadline. we can certainly and we will have all u.s. troops out because that's the decision the president made, but do i have concerns about it, absolutely. and if i were advising the president i would have said, hey, sir, we are down to 2500 u.s. troops here. alex, as you know when i commanded that mission it's a nato mission i had 150,000 troops there. we are down to 2500 u.s. troops. we've already pulled out 98% of the troops. so i would have said to the president keep a small force there. they're kind of an insurance policy, and as a point of comparison, regard the u.s. capitol with 2500, a country the size of texas, a pretty small investment and it's a sensible one because it would keep the pressure the taliban and it

would enable the afghans to fight this war. i'll close by saying, alex, we haven't had a combat death in afghanistan in 14 months. the cost is not that high. i think it would have been sense to stay. the president's made that decision. i support it. >> i appreciate your perspective there, sir, and let me ask you about the pentagon and preparing for the pentagon attacks and i know a car bomb there killed at least 21 people and is there a chance in your mind, isis, al qaeda can re-surge in the absence of u.s. pressure. you're talking about keeping the 2500 there. is that an effective way to keep up pressure? it's a big country and when you made the comparison of 2300 troops guarding the u.s. capitol versus 2500, it seems like a drop in the bucket and can it be effective? >> it can, alex, because they are, if you will, the rebar in the concrete and the stiffener that trains the afghans and

provides intelligence and flies aircraft. i think they provided a small, but very important catalytic presence for the afghans and we'll have to see how the afghans do as the u.s. forces are pulled out, but here's what we should focus on. it's the future and there's a good side and a dark side. the good side is if we continue to provide funding to the afghans, if we keep intelligence flowing, if we continue to have an embassy there. if we work diplomatically and with non-governmental agencies to protect the rights of women and children there, i think there will be a possibility of keeping this project moving in a reasonable way. on the dark side, could it all fall apart, could the wheels come off? yes, is it possible that the taliban or the islamic state or al qaeda can ultimately end up working together? yes. i'm coming to you from my home state of florida. i always say the taliban are

like the gators down here. you don't want to turn your back on one. they're lethal. they're quick and unpredictable, so yes, i'm worried at the dark side. >> at the risk of short change discussion of your book, please come back and i am eager to talk about it with you. thank you. as the u.s. begins to help india, the pandemic is only growing worse. we'll talk about it next. g wors. we'll talk about it next the bowls are back. applebee's irresist-a-bowls all just $8.99.

now the latest on the coronavirus pandemic. the u.s. supplies are arriving in the country as it sets yet another record for adding new cases daily. more than 400,000 today. "the new york times" reporting that india accounts for more than 40% of new cases worldwide and we'll have a report of new delhi coming pup in the uk, more than 3,000 maskless party goers

packed a party and it's part of a trial to determine how venues can safely re-open. all attendees were required to tend negative 24 hours before the event. the tsa is extending the mask mandate for airports, busses and trains through september 13th and starting today, delta will be selling all seats on its flights after more than a year of blocking middle seats. it was the last airline to keep middle seats empty. the vaccination hold outs finds 20% of americans will never get vaccinated. coming up, how much of a problem is that? when a certain medie did not help enough. xeljanz is the first and only fda-approved pill for moderate to severe uc. it can reduce symptoms in as early as two weeks, improve the appearance of the intestinal lining, and provide lasting steroid-free remission. xeljanz can lower your ability to fight infections.

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