hello there, everyone. 4:00 in the east. legislation to create a bipartisan commission to investigate the capitol insurrection. somehow ended up on the kill list of mcconnell. republicans this amp voting to block the bill in the senate just six republicans voted to advance the bill to the senate floor out of the ten needed to skirt a filibuster. today's vote followed a night of delayed led by some of the same republicans that spearheaded efforts to whitewash the history of january 6. chuck schumer said to sweep the horrors of that day. here's more from senator schumer today reacting to the vote. >> out of fear to donald trump, the republican minority prevented the american people from getting the full truth of january 6.

this vote made it official. donald trump's big lie has fully enveloped the republican party. trump's big lie is now the defining principle of what was once the party of lincoln. we all know what's going on here. senate republicans chose to defend the big lie because they believe anything that might upset donald trump could hurt them politically. shame on the republican party for trying to sweep the horrors of that day under the rug because they're afraid of donald trump. >> senator mcconnell working in what "the washington post" describes as a relentless effort to kill the legislation before bipartisan commission could be established. the senate gop leader functioning the same way as kevin mccarthy. the gop now loud and proud in its objection to fact finding about the deadly insurrection

and the underlying threat it revealed. namely that radicalized white supremacists and trump supporters pose a threat to the united states homeland. that threat the focus of two homeland security bulletins this year and a third one issued today of violent domestic extremists seizing on the anniversary of the tulsa attack. this threat is real. it is grave according to fbi director wray. and it is ongoing according to the department of homeland security. and the gop is awol. here's republican senator murkowski last night on the gop obstruction. >> it's important that there be a focus on the facts, and on the truth, and that may be unsettling. but we need to understand that. we just can't pretend that nothing bad happened, or that people just got too excitable. something bad happened.

and it's important to lay that out. i think there's more to be learned. i want to know more and i'm -- i want to know and i don't want to know. i don't want to know but i need to know. >> something bad happened for sure but mcconnell was diabolical to make sure that the allies in the gop failed. politico reports, quote, collins kept trying to whip up ten votes to break a filibuster on thursday and said in an interview that she wouldn't give up but mcconnell didn't let her go unrebutted and collins resigned to the failure of the efforts at compromise. it is not just legislative failure. mcconnell's calculation is that awesome politics in the gop to align yourself with the insurrectionists. that's what defense lawyers are for, mitch. four former homeland secretaries

warned of the security risk of yielding to the politics of the moment and reacting to today's developments this afternoon to nbc news saying this. the senate's decision to not seek the truth about what happened during the insurrection against the u.s. government, one of the most dangerous and violent attacks on our democracy in modern memory, is deeply alarging. we have gravely concerned about the mess ablg this sends to the american people. the duty of public officials to uphold the democratic institutions that protect all of us. after 9/11 our country grieved together. we were united in the determination to seek the truth and the 9/11 commission was established to do just that. the department of homeland security which all of us served, was created to protect the nation based on what was learned from the 9/11 commission. likewise, we must understand how the violent insurrection at the capitol came together to ensure that the peaceful transfer of power in our country is never

threatened again. our representatives owe this much to the american people. gop obstruction of a bipartisan investigation into the insurrection is the feature and not the bug of the gop is where we start. congresswoman dean of pennsylvania is here. she served as a houseman irin donald trump's second impeachment trial. also joining us former congresswoman comstock is here. she yesterday accompanied officer sicknick's family on the meetings and visits to republican senators' offices. olivia troy is here. now director of the republican accountability project. boy, do we need that. barbara, i want to first hear about how officer sicknick's family doing and what the case was that they made and how did those senators vote no after hearing it? >> well, it was a tough day for them but we did start with senator romney who of course was

supportive and very helpful and ended the day with senator murkowski who really talked to gladys sicknick mother to mother and really apologized to her saying i'm sorry that you have to come to do this, what should be done anyway. and gladys sicknick said she is not the kind of person to want to come forward. she is usually in the background but she just felt she couldn't be quiet anymore. but so she was very strong in those meetings. it was tough. as was brian sicknick's partner sandra gomez and then two of the officers who were there that day on january 6, officer don who knew brian well and then officer michael and made strong cases why it should be done for the officers and for everything they went through on the front lines that continues to be minimized, but also, for the country and

for history as officer dunn said so i agree with my friends tom ridge and michael chernoff and the other bipartisan efforts that say we need the commission and as susan collins said, she is going to keep working on this. there were seven republican votes if senator toomey was able to be there and i would expect that members of congress will start -- i don't know why they didn't start to subpoena things right now. i said on january 7 subpoena donald trump's phone records. all the people that were involved. think about all of the texts and the messages back and forth to the white house on that day to do something. we need a distinct time line and can start today with existing committees with the effort to turn it over to a commission down the road.

>> you seem to have putt your finger on what i think had adds much to do with the rupture of mccarthy and cheney. she included mccarthy subpoenaed to share what he knows and it was at that point he seemed to pull the rug out from her and senator katko who he sent with a mission to negotiate a bill. the democrats yielded to everything and seemed like the dog caught the car. mccarthy panicked and then whipped votes against the legislation he said to negotiate. is kevin mccarthy scared? >> listen. john katko was a great colleague of mine. he was a prosecutor. i knew him in the justice department days. and he did negotiate a very good bipartisan agreement there. that's why he got 35 republicans

under the difficult circumstances. but the issue here is the truth is going to come out eventually. it would be better for everyone to participate in the process. there are going to be records that are there that whether the justice department starts doing it or other investigative bodies, it will come out and for the sake of the country and the safety and the threats that still exist that are out there you have state officials threatened, officers are getting death threats just for speaking out and talking about what happened to them. officer fanone, some members yesterday didn't realize that his assailant that tased him in the back of the neck 12 times had been already arrested and he was a well-known trump activist who had been active since 2016.

his name is daniel rodriguez. there were three others also arrested in connection with the brutal attack on officer fanone that almost killed him. he had a heart attack and still has -- so they were not familiar with that. they didn't know that this was a trump activist from california. he was someone talked about the deep state. he had been really in all of these dark -- on the internet talking about all of these conspiracy theories. had really strongly took hold and why he was here with other friends and has to be looked at and how that connects to this rally on january 6. and all the people communicating back and forth and those facts exist and those records exist and there's going to be nothing to do about getting rid of them and might as well know sooner. they're still out there attacking everyone republicans and i should point out michael

fanone and brian sicknick are republicans. and that is something that brian sicknick's partner said yesterday. she said he loved you guys. he voted for donald trump and yet we leave them on the field and instead of getting the truth as lisa murkowski said. >> congresswoman dean, can you do what barbara comstock is suggesting? can you subpoena records from the white house, the phone call records, at least get the times? at least start to put the pieces of evidence in place while we wait for some sort of commission to be formed by the speaker pelosi if the bipartisan efforts fall apart. i guess there's history of a watergate select committee in the senate. is there more investigative work that can be done in the interim? >> yes. we can.

and we will. of course we have an administration that will not do what the previous administration did which was block every subpoena, every attempt at oversight. let me thank congresswoman comstock for her role and escorting gladys sicknick around yesterday in the senate. how is it her words draped in grief fell on the deaf ears of senators? we needed ten. we got six. too bad senator toomey wasn't there to vote yes. why were three more and the ores? where were they in search for the truth? i'm furious for the senate to require her to come to the senate and then not heeding her words. so yes here in the house we will do everything we can. we'll subpoena those who need to be subpoenaed. but the independent commission was the way to go.

we don't need this to fall into party lines and narratives that become so poisonous. we need not politically tied to look at january 6. i was there as you know. but for those that were not there, they're at fault. i have staff members furious today. they weren't there but they actually say we have to learn the truth. i think a lot of martin luther king's words from the letter from birmingham jail which i used to teach in writing course i thought over ten years and he said we have to repent in this generation, not merely for the hateful words and actions of bad people for the silence of good people. mitch mcconnell, kchb mccarthy, the appalling silence of the truth is shameful.

>> congresswoman, the reporting suggests more than the silence. they didn't stay silent and say listen vote your conscience. they aggressively whipped support to kill it. this was killed by mccarthy and mcconnell. what do you think they're hiding? >> what exactly? what are afraid of? are they complicit? we'll get to the truth. the facts will be revealed. the truth will be revealed. they're afraid of the truth. they're defending nonsense and we know that. so what i hope is that the american public rejects their alternative facts or their silence. i was thinking back to the very first set of press conferences under the previous administration and do you remember the person who came

forward and said maybe there are ale alternative facts? >> kellyanne conway. >> your colleague asked her those questions. >> chuck todd, yeah. >> todd, yes. it was literally about the crowd size. remember how long ago that was and nonsensical this seemed to argue alternative facts as to that which is discoverable and known? it was bizarre. sadly, guess what. five years later we see those seeds were sown and we sadly are reaping the seeds of falsehoods, alternative facts of people that can't face the truth. if we don't get to the bottom of this we suffer and risk this repeating itself and perhaps even worse fashion.

this was the interruption of what is precious to us. the peaceful transfer of power. imagine those there hunted on that day could have been killed but for the acts of officer sicknick and every other capitol police officer don't want do get to the truth. shame on them. >> olivia, the congresswoman makes an interesting point. this was all previewed for us by sean spicer who argued on the first day in an ill-fitting suit that the crowd was larger than gathered for former president obama and i think conway went on chuck todd's show and talked about alternative facts. the sad truth is that a lot of the republican base believes that those are the real facts. that shows like this are not the

real facts and with the republican party seems to have cosigned is they seem to have made official the break with reality. what they did not just by staying silent. silence would have been egregious approach to attack by them but mike pence's own brother voted against the commission. i wonder what you do to sort of break through again with reality. >> right. the absence of the republicans in the senate today are shameful and dangerous because what they're doing is not going to allow the truth to be told to americans. that's what's needed a the this moment where you see the threat of domestic terrorism rise across the country. you are seeing the groups. you saw the groups at the u.s. capitol. like these people are still out there, talking to each other and

radicalizing not within themselves but the leaders of our country are feeding them the narratives over and over. it is shameful and horrifying to see the actions of mccarthy and mcconnell where they stand by and allow this to happen because what they're doing is saying that they're okay with it. doing the seal of approval. the disinformation that they spread that led to this event on january 6 they're going to continue to push. they will continue to push it for months to come and try to sweep it under the rug and makes an investigation still critical. it needs to happen. we need to get to the facts and push out the truth that led to this. whatever dereliction of duty happened which we saw in the oval office and also with others involved. that's what is critical in whatever form and unfortunate it's not bipartisan to be more

effective to diffuse what we have which is a pandemic of disinformation across the country on lies about an election that are just not true and lies that will continue to go on and embolden the terrorist groups across the country. >> barbara comstock, i want to come back to mccarthy's leadership. he couldn't get rid of liz cheney fast enough. he had to leak a hot mic tape to make sure that's his mission before he got to washington to do it but this guy is a member in good standing. matt gaetz. last night -- i'll read what he said. he said we have a second amendment in this country and i think we have an obligation to use it. to which chris krebs who i believe you have worked with, the homeland security official in charge of making sure that 2020 was the most secure election in our country ice history, achieved that aim and fired by donald trump for doing so. also a lifelong republican.

he said i void commenting on members of congress and the inane remarks but this clear call to violence by a member of congress is beyond the pale. disqualifying and un-american. you're part of the problem. mccarthy is associated with this because we know he knows how to cut someone loose. why is gaetz and greene members in good standing and liz cheney is not? >> i certainly don't think they should be and maybe people within the cause kus who will take action on that. i said in january, february and certainly as the investigations into matt gaetz started by donald trump's justice department as they went on i said why is he on the judiciary committee? why is he even in the caucus? i think marjorie greene will be

kicked out of the caucus. they'll drag it out. when things will happen anyway you should just turn the page, get it done and move on. they are dragging out the painful, ugly face of the party with the gaetz/greene grift tour going on now that's not just a clown car show but a dangerous thing that they are doing. they're continuing to spread disinformation. we're ill served to have them in the caucus and more and more members will want them out. people tell them what an embarrassment they are. greene started to attack mccarthy and stefanik that replaced cheney so nobody is going to be odious enough for those two. so they are a cancer on the party like donald trump has been and we need an independent,

outside investigation that looks at all of these things and gets it out of the political sphere. but as i was mentioning earlier that doesn't mean -- in prior live i was chief counsel on a house committee with investigations so when you get the documents they and the records themselves aren't political. it is going to be the interpretation and how they are tied together so if you get them now i think that will accelerate the acceptance ultimately hopefully sooner rather than late irof an independent commission. >> congresswoman barbara comstock was very good at what she did and that is a pathway that might be the thing that makes republicans say we don't want that. do you think there's a way to call -- part of me thinks that -- >> i wish democrats had done this -- yeah. i wish they had done it back in

january. you will remember in january everybody was saying have this independent commission so it is unfortunate we lost the five months but still move forward. get records. >> congresswoman dean, do you think that maybe democrats sort of win by losing? i only mean that in the spirit that speaker pelosi wanted a bipartisan commission so much that she conceded all of these -- basically everything mccarthy wanted. is it time to just do this with a democrat-led? obviously still bipartisan. i think we should start correcting any republican saying that that's not bipartisan. it would still be a bipartisan committee in the house. is that something that may yield

a faster and better result? >> i'm not certain it will yield a better one. you know how poisoned it will be. but failing an independent commission we have to do it. we have an obligation to do it to protect the precious democracy. if we turn a blind eye on this we actually risk losing our democracy. i won't do that. i'm certain that speaker pelosi will move forward but i hope that everyone notes negotiations took place between benny thompson and representative katko and got to equal number of representatives. and they would be independent not political. not electeds. equal subpoena power which is critically important measure. i want to go back to the point of mrs. sicknick.

gladys talked about her son and said, she boasted of the work ethic, only there to serve our country. republicans who denied this independent commission are the ones that speak very loudly that they're pro police. they worry about liberal democrats trying to defund the police. we want to find out what happened rs to find out exactly how that these police officers, this protectionary force that i know now much better before impeachment they are servants to us and the country. how is it that the republican party does not want to protect those who protect us? does not want to find out the truth. and then the reason is what it might expose about them. >> we are left with no other rational conclusion to draw. congresswoman dean, thank you.

former congresswoman comstock, it is a privilege to talk to you both. olivia is sticking around. president biden is set to cap off a weekend of commemoration in tulsa, oklahoma, to mark 100 years since one of the most heinous attacks on black americans in this country's history. the government warned that the weekend could be a target for white supremacists. vladimir putin upping the stakes for the face to face meeting next month with president biden. with this latest escalation means. later white house chief of staff klain will join us on all of the above. plus, the progress that's been made in fighting the pandemic that allows us to go out and enjoy the holiday weekend. all those stories and more when we continue after a quick break. ok everyone, our mission is to provide complete, balanced nutrition for strength and energy.

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i will never forget the violence of the white mob when we left our home. i still see black men being shot, black bodies lying in the street. i still smell smoke and see fire. i still see black businesses being burned. i still hear airplanes flying overhead. i hear the screams. i have lived through the massacre every day. our country may forget this history but i cannot. i will not. and other survivors do not and our descendants do not. >> wow.

that was 107-year-old viola fletcher remembering and sharing the memories of one of the worst acts of racial violence in american history. a century ago an angry white mob attacked the greenwood district known as black wall street. they burned businesses to the ground and murdered as many as 300 black people. marking a significant milestone in the cub's lock overdue racial reckoning president biden will travel to tulsa on tuesday and emphasizing the push to recognize some of the most difficult moments in the history and help advance social justice. yet concerns remain today. today department of homeland security warned that the commemoration could be targets for attack why is while the warning is not based on a specific or credible threat they say that the events quote

probably are attractive targets for some racially motivated violent extreme itself-white supremacists to commit violence. joining us now is reverend al sharpton and olivia troy is back with us. you and i think were on together when the last president used a trip to tulsa in a very different way. this trip seems to be punk waited now by this homeland security warning of a heightened risk of domestic violent extremism. >> yes. we were on together. in fact, it was last year when donald trump was going to tulsa to have a rally at the beginning of what is juneteenth where they celebrate when people in texas finally freed of slavery. i wept in to speak the night before trump's rally. that was the rally many believe

later caused covid-19 to take herman kaine from us because they famously did not socially distance. now this president going to salute and commemorate those that sur vooied in tulsa and those that died in the worst race riot in history. that wiped out the richest community of blacks in the history of the country at that time so the difference between a year ago and now and the difference between how one deals with racism and the policies around racism, president biden is going a week after meeting with george floyd's family and i spoke with him at length on the phone about some of the kind of legislation we need. you couldn't have a more clear contrast between presidents and presidency than if you gauge last june and this june in terms

of where a president deals with tulsa, oklahoma. >> it was mentioned on the occasion that president biden met with the floyd family there's a cultural backlash around not reeducating people but looking clearly at the most heinous racial violence which is obviously where tulsa stands in the history books. president biden seems undeterred and maybe unaware of what is going on. what do you make of sort of his leadership on the issues and where would you like to see him spend more attention and time? >> i think that his leadership has shown so far a sensitivity and a hands on kind of approach. i think that what we would like to see is to move forward in a way where we understand he wants to reach out.

we understand the desire for bipartisanship but some point i think we have to move the george floyd bill and other bills forward by dealing with this filibuster because we cannot allow this to stand in the way of progress and i hope to see the president get to the point where he can say the filibuster can no longer be durable because we have to deal with policing, we have to deal with the voting rights, whether it is senate bill 1 or the john lewis bill coming through the house. i think that there has to be a time that we're saying that reaching out is gone long enough. it seems interesting to me some republicans that took shots at the president meeting with the floyd family are the same kinds of republicans that rejected hearing from the families of capitol police that were killed during the insurrection.

when you deal with people that want to see the families of police victims treated humanely and ignore the police killings by a mob you have to wonder where the moral come pass is. >> the political compass is dialed in with what they now see as a part of the coalition they can't defend and i was chilled to see this homeland security warning today. that these -- one of the events canceled. the commemoration of the massacre in tulsa is a possible target but when you see a party failing to do anything about the conduct on 1/6 i guess they feel emboldened. do you expect more warnings like the one we got today? >> i do. i'm grateful that we have leadership in place in the

department of homeland security and national security apparatus and the white house to allow the truthful warnings to come out like this that call it for what it is and say white sy prem sy because i know that this was something that we struggled with in the last four years where this was not allowed. they need to. because it's important. people need to be vigilant. for them to put out a threat bulletin means we need to pay attention and working with state and local law enforcement because it is a partnership with citizens and with them. it is appalling that we have people in the republican party leadership and elected office and talked about this earlier but the matt gaetz of the world and marjorie taylor greene have the power and dangerous because they speak with rhetoric that promotes violence and attacks like this and i am concerned about what will happen in the next few days and hope there's

by law enforcement and security. which under president biden i will say this. thank goodness that he is in office because the right security parameters will be in place. >> it's just almost more unbelievable as a commentary on the ex-president. thank you for spending time with us. the reverend is sticking around. texas trying to make it harder to vote particularly you guessed it people of color there. the governor's signature is the nengs step. the latest assault on democracy is our next story. we'll explain it all next. ♪ since you hung around ♪ ♪ but those dreams have remained ♪ ♪ and they've turned around ♪ ♪ who'd have thought they'd lead you ♪

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this is all taking place under the guise of quote/unquote standardizing our elections. who can be against that? we might have asked the same question of ourselves 100 years ago on the poll tax. doesn't that apply to everyone? or a literacy test. or how many gumballs are in the jar. what we know is these are all efforts to suppress the votes not of all texans in this state but certain texans. >> we are on the verge of an extremely consequential development and what he was describing there. the republican effort to restrict voting rights particularly among nonwhite

americans across this country. the bill passed in the texas state house to among other things put limits on absentee ballots. ban drive through voting and empower partisan poll watchers. both chambers of the state's legislature had different versions of the bill and assembling a final verse to send to the governor's desk. and then it would spark developments that would quickly make those restrictions the law of the land. joining us is nick campasori and the reverend al sharpton is back with us. i want to read you something from the texas tribune coverage of this today. a comparison of the election day polling locations used for the 2020 general election and what would happen under the senate

proposal shows a starkly different distribution. in harris the formula would mean fewer polling places in the county and all currently represented by democrats. every district held by a republican would see a gain in polling places or see no change. in most cases the districts that would lose polling places the represented by people of color with a far higher share of potential voters of color than the districts to gain voting sides. i know mark elias is bringing lawsuits against the bills but this seems flagrantly racial in the tactics and didn't try to hide the punch line here why what can be done in the short term? >> i think that it is clearly racial. when you look at harris county and there's an office and board

members there in harris, a predominantly black county and other counties impacted and it is racial and i think what must be done is that the justice department needs to come in under civil rights legislation -- civil rights lawsuits to try and stop this process. i remember when texas tried to start instituting the voter i.d. laws in texas that attorney general holder came in and sued and i would hope that attorney general garland and his new head of the civil rights division come in and try to intervene. this is another reason why we need the john lewis voting bill passed as well as senate bill 1 because they would have had to preclear this had the voting rights act still be in force the

way it was but taken out section 4 and 5 texas doesn't have to preclear the changes so we have to be proactive and need that legislation back in to deal with preclearance and the state legislature couldn't try to pull the antics to disenfranchise black voters. >> nick, it's my understanding that the federal legislation would actually invalidate all bills and there are a lot of them now. from the brennan center of justice. as of may 14 legislators introduced 389 bills with restrictive provisions in 48 states. 22 bills with restrictive provisions already enacted. 61 bills with restrictive provisions in 18 states moving through legislatures. 31 passed at least 1 chamber and another 30 had some sort of committee action. the laws based on the lie of

voter fraud and republicans in georgia, lutd governor duncan and i believe raffensberger acknowledged that the bills are predicated on a law about fraud, are hard at work and enacting voter suppression laws across the country. pulling out the all-star game from georgia didn't do anything to slow this push in statewide legislatures. what is sort of an option for maintaining access to the right to vote? >> look. for republicans these actions are existential. different party might conclude if they lose in purple states and losing ground in texas over time to compete for the votes of people not voting for them and we see efforts to make it harder to vote. i was struck by the new formula debated in texas that just happens to disadvantage democrats and voters in black areas so i think we'll see more

of an effort from the justice department. the question is how aggressively is the biden administration going to move behind the legislation in congress? the democracy reform bills from the left. the john lewis act. all these are different kind of touch and contact point os ten democratic system. we haven't seen a real effort from the biden administration which is working on a lot of new things right now to get behind one and push it forward super aggressively. >> that causes some consternation. nick, reverend, thank you both president biden has said he did not seek any escalation with russia but kremlin backed hackers struck again indicating an escalation is what's happening. we'll explain. [ suspenseful music ] ♪♪

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russian hackers at it again. microsoft sounding the alarm that the russian-backed group behind the solarwinds hack has launched a new campaign targeting more than 150 government agencies, think tanks, and nongovernmental organizations in 24 countries. groups that have been critical of, you guessed it, vladimir putin. last month, president biden announced several new sanctions on russia for the solarwinds attack. however, the response from russia seems to be an escalation. our next guest says his latest

move indicates putin is looking for a showdown with president biden ahead of their scheduled meeting in three weeks. let's bring into our conversation, our friend, frank figliuzzi, former assistant director for counterintelligence at the fbi and lucky for us an msnbc national security analyst. frank figliuzzi, two-part question to start with. you have no doubt that this is russia and you have no doubt that this is putin's wind-up to the face-to-face with the new president, president biden. >> yeah. all indicators are that the signature of this is exactly the russian external intelligence service, the svr, and that's one and the same as the solarwinds attack, yes. >> and what is putin's objective here? is it to -- is it to convince president biden that he is still the biggest geopolitical threat to the united states of america? is it to -- is it sort of like a dog trying to show his dominance at the dog park? i mean, what is putin doing?

>> yeah, couple things, real quick. first, it's not remarkable that russia is doing this and is still doing it. what's remarkable is they didn't stop doing it on the eve of a summit, a meeting between biden and putin. that -- that's noteworthy, that it's business as usual, and here's -- i'm going to take a slightly different perspective than some commentators on this. i'm talking to a couple of russian intelligence experts who aren't entirely sure that putin is in total control of his intelligence services at all times. number one. number two, he's increasingly in trouble and desperate at home. number three, we've got to stop acting like russia is our strength and power equal, because they are not. and so, this may be all that they have. now, it's significant. a cyber capability like this is significant. but if my expert friends are true and putin's not entirely in a stable place, then this may be

all he's got and maybe people are actually acting out, looking like it's him, within his intelligence services, to try and destabilize him even further. the first question i would ask, if i were joe biden sitting across this from him is, hey, vlad, are you sure you're in total control of your intelligence services? because we're not. so, if you are, show us that you can stop this because we're not sure that you can. >> well, if you're putin, don't you look back at the american president and say, are you sure you've done all you can to secure the federal government's infrastructure? isn't it troubling that now under two presidents, russia has successfully hacked executive branch government agencies? >> yeah, we're not -- look, we just had four years of -- and beyond, right -- of money being poured into the pentagon for traditional munitions, armaments, planes, tanks, you name it. we are not spending enough and

investing enough resources in the new battlefield. it's time to move on. the rest of the world's got it. it's cyber, cyber, cyber. we've got to be pouring investment and resources into that, shoring up our firewalls, all of our defenses, all of the supply chain across the government. we can't be stove piped across this. we need a czar in charge of cyber protection, just like we have a secretary of defense. >> a czar, oh, that's a good one. frank figliuzzi is sticking around, and that question about a czar is one -- just one of the security threats looming over president biden's administration. we'll get to all of them with white house chief of staff ron klain, who is our guest, when the next hour of "deadline white house" starts after a quick break. don't go anywhere. we're just getting started. ere. we're just sbegetting started. ooo... you gonna eat that at lesliepalooza? what? who's coming to that? everyone's coming, everybody. you, her, me, all of us.

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you know, in fredericksburg, fans are heading back to the minor league ballparks. pools and parks are opening up across the state. families are heading down to spend memorial day weekend at virginia beach, and all over the country, we've gone from pain and stagnation of a long dark winter to an economy on the move growing faster than it has in nearly 40 years. >> hi again, everyone, it's 5:00 in the east. just ahead of memorial day, a memorial day weekend that will look normal to close to normal in much of the country. president biden in virginia today taking a bit of a victory lap in the country's fight against covid. an historic crisis that now shows clear signs of receding thanks to the president's speedy vaccine rollout with more than

290 million doses administered nationwide. all this while grappling with a country still in turmoil and threats at home and abroad. on the covid front, a new poll shows that the country's on track to vaccinate 70% of all adults with big increases in vaccination rates among latinos and people without college degrees. that's 70% benchmark is not just a symbolic goal of the biden administration's as dr. fauci says, it's the level at which the u.s. could avoid future covid surges. already ten states have hit that 70% mark. with 70% of their residents vaccinated, 10 other states approaching that goal. of course the covid crisis, just one of the many fires team biden is tasked with putting out every day. just today, a stark reminder of the domestic extremist threat that lurks all across this country. the department of homeland security issued a bulletin this morning warning that white supremacists might target the centennial commemoration of the

tulsa race massacre and from abroad, a new reminder that vladimir putin remains an active adversary of ours with the discovery of another breach. all this as the president's sweeping and potentially transformative domestic agenda, which commands significant support in all recent polls from republican voters comes up against a wall of opposition from a political party that still all too often refuses to recognize president biden's legitimacy. according to a new poll, 66% of republican voters do not believe that president biden was legitimately elected. and republicans in the senate have buried their heads in the sand by blocking an independent 9/11 style commission into the capitol insurrection. an attack on the heart of our democracy, a blatant attempt to derail the transfer of power to the new president. despite all that, president biden's efforts at negotiating with the gop show a president

determined to walk the walk and not just talk the talk when it comes to bipartisanship. negotiations are still under way on key issues like infrastructure and police reform. with so much happening, we can only wonder what a day in the life of the biden white house chief of staff is like and lucky for us, white house chief of staff ron klain is here. hi there, my friend. >> hi, nicole, thanks for having me. >> thanks for being here. let me start with what the president's talking about today. a country nearing this 70% vaccination level, which isn't just the goal you've set out for yourselves and the speech to the nation but has an important sort of scientific effect. explain what that will mean if we reach that. >> well, look, i think that we know that the more americans are vaccinated, the fewer that will get covid, the fewer that will get sick from covid and of course, most importantly, the fewer that will die from covid so we've seen this tremendous progress in four months in getting the country vaccinated. when joe biden became president, less than 4% of the country had

been vaccinated. now we're up to over 60% of adults and in many states, over 70%. one state, we're over 80%, particularly among those who are most at risk from covid, older americans. we're at over 85% with one shot. and in fact, overall in the country, more than 70% of every person 40 and up has had their first shot. so, we're making tremendous progress. and what does it mean? look, we're seeing what it means. the president was in virginia today where they were able to lift their mask mandate. same thing today in maryland, same thing today in new jersey, so as americans head into memorial day weekend, they're heading back to a more normal way of life thanks to the really unprecedented success we've had with the speed of this vaccination program and the reach of the vaccination program to help so many americans kind of go back to the things they want to do on memorial day weekend. >> president biden seemed to make a bet in the earliest

stages of his candidacy that taking the pandemic seriously and letting that be revealed through the way he ran for the office, the way he ran his convention, the way he did everything he did, that that would be part of conveying the seriousness with which he took securing the country's, all of our ails, economic and otherwise wound its way through curing the pandemic. his opponent took a very different approach. he was just going to ignore it, among other things. the fact that you're seeing sort of clearing all these hurdles and, i guess the most recent one was lifting the mask mandate indoors, this notion that that would be confusing. i saw evidence today that that incentivized vaccine participation among hesitant folks. you guys like what you see in the economy, i understand, but how do you sort of sustain this payoff from the bet he made many, many, many months ago? >> look, i think that he was elected to deliver results, and you know, the day -- the week

before he took office, 4,000 people a day were dying from covid. a million people that week filed new claims for unemployment the week before he took office. that's now down 60%. and deaths are down 85%. and so, i think that the results kind of speak for themselves. but we're not, obviously, going to rest on our laurels. first of all, we still have to vaccinate about 20 million more people between now and july 4th to hit that nationwide goal of 70% by july 4th that's a lot of work left to do. and we have to continue to create jobs, grow the economy, and take the next steps. the budget we released today is part of the next steps on the economy, moving forward on infrastructure is part of that. the families plan is part of that. so, we're -- we couldn't be prouder of the progress we've made and the successes we've had in these first four months, but we are nowhere near finished on the job that has to be done here. >> does that job include conversations in the west wing about the attack on democracy

that is now not an undercover one from republicans but pretty loud and proud on the part of kevin mccarthy and mitch mcconnell and killing the commission to investigate the insurrection? >> yeah, look, there's no question that the president talks regularly about the need to protect, preserve our democracy, and what happened on january 6th was a direct assault on our democracy. it was a direct attack on the effort to ratify the election. january 6th wasn't a random date where an attack came on the capitol. it was a date chosen when the congress was going through the procedures to certify the outcome of the election. and so, this attack was a fundamental attack on the seat of our government and on the exercise of government, and that's something we take very, very seriously. but i think that, you know, even as we go to strengthen the democracy and deal with that, nicole, one other test of our democracy is our ability to

deliver for the men and women this country, for the people of this country, who want us to make sure that we're making progress in washington, that we're showing that democracy can deliver, can deliver here and can deliver around the world. that's why it's important for us not only to fight covid here but to lead the democracies in fighting covid in other countries. it's why it's important for us to be the engine of economic growth here and around the world. so, democracy is being tested now, it's being tested on many fronts. the frontal assault that happened on january 6th and then a question of, can we prove that democracy can deliver for the voters of this country? >> matthew dowd, one of my old buddies from politics but also a frequent guest on this show, has a different view. i want to show you something he said this week. we'll talk about it on the other side. >> i think joe biden ought to appoint a cabinet level person on democracy. it's the most important -- he ought to say, this is the most

important issue facing america and the world today. it's not the pandemic. it's not infrastructure. it's not redoing taxes. it's not anything else. this is the most important issue. and democrats related to that. the third point is, they need to start making the argument. democrats need to start making the argument that we can't do any of these things unless we fix democracy. >> what do you think? >> well, i think we do have a democracy czar, it's joe biden. he's the president of the united states. he was elected to heal this country. he ran on a campaign when many people thought it was mistaken to fix the soul of this country, to try to bring this country together, to try to repair the horrible division that his predecessor has sown in this country. so this is a duty that he takes. it's not -- i don't think it's a duty he can delegate to some other person or assign some czar to do it. i think it's something that is central to his presidency, central to his leadership, and i

think he's making progress on that. i think he obviously, you know, has an agenda here on democracy, an agenda on leadership, and that's what he's doing, and so i think, you know, i think that you can't separate these things, though, because i also think it's important for voters to see that leadership can deliver. look, i think one thing about the trump presidency was that it assaulted democratic norms, but it also fed cynicism through its incompetence, through its inability to address the pandemic, its ability to address the economic issues. and so, i think that the president biden's success on showing people that, yes, we actually can beat this pandemic, and yes, we can create jobs and we can create growth in a more fair and equitable way, i think those things are vital to the case he's making about what democracy means to the american people. >> when you see these voter

suppression bills racing through mostly republican-controlled legislatures, do you toss around getting involved, getting more involved? >> well, i think, you know, we're going to have more to say about that in the weeks ahead. i think that the president certainly is concerned about that. he's spoken to it many times. i think you'll hear him speak to it again next week in tulsa. and i think we know the dnc is launching a big effort. we know there are progressive legal groups that are fighting these laws, so this is definitely -- you know, it's a very important issue for us and defending the democracy, defending the right to vote is a fundamental thing that we are fighting for at the white house. >> do you plan to announce a policy, or do you plan to announce sort of pushing for support of the federal legislation that would actually go a long way toward undoing all of these bills? can you tell us what bucket it is in? >> yeah, well, no, the president's spoken quite

strongly, strong support for the for the people act. leader schumer that's going to come to the senate floor in late june. that's something that we are very focused on trying to round up the votes and the strategy to help get passed when it comes to the floor in the senate. obviously, it's already passed the house, and so, you know, this is a major piece of legislation that we are looking forward to fighting for in this coming month, and again, looking forward to it coming to the senate floor at the end of the month. >> what is -- bipartisanship was successfully redefined in the push for the covid relief bill, and i -- we played the president with the list of all the republicans touting pieces of the covid relief package that none of them voted for. no republicans supported it. and there was a notion that maybe defining bipartisanship as the policies that are supported by bipartisan americans might become a new operating principle. is that -- is that the theory of the case there, or are you

trying to do an infrastructure deal that might be smaller and less ambitious, but is it the priority to have republicans on it? >> look, our priority is to get the infrastructure bill passed, and obviously, it's easier to get it passed if we can get more votes for it. and not have to rely on the narrow margin we just have among democrats. but we have some key things that have to be in it. i'm pleased that senator capito in her group moved in our direction this week, raised the overall level of funding in the bill, raised the funding for particular things. i think it's all steps in the right direction. we look forward to continuing to work with her and her group on that and others in both parties who want to move forward on that. but the president also said yesterday, very clearly, that that process is going to have to come to an end, either reach on agreement or it won't. the only real red line -- the only two red lines he's drawn on infrastructure is he's noit going to raise taxes on people who make less than $400,000 a year and he's not going to accept inaction, so we are going to continue to look for the

votes, look for the support to put together a strong infrastructure package that can create jobs in this country, that can get this country on the path to a clean energy future. we're going to try to get the most number of votes we can for that. that's the best way to pass legislation. and -- but we're going to proceed. >> i want to turn to a meeting on your calendar between the president and vladimir putin, and i wonder what you hope to achieve and if there's a model of an example between an american president and vladimir putin that achieved something that is the model for this president. >> well, look, i think the model, in some ways, is president biden as vice president, his prior exchanges with president putin. they've always been frank. they've always been candid. they've always been direct. we know these are the two great -- >> you don't have a soul, right? >> well, look, president biden, as he likes to say, shoots straight from the shoulder and he's going to tell it like it is

but these are the two leaders of great nuclear powers in the world and it's important they meet face-to-face to find areas of agreement if they exist and certainly to be candid about the sharp areas of disagreement. it's what bush did, president obama. it's important for biden to do the same thing. we're meeting with vladimir putin not because we agree with him or some reward for good behavior, far from it. we're meeting with him because it is the president of the other great nuclear power on this planet. it's important for these two leaders to sit down and try to find ways in which they can work together in some areas and ways in which they can exchange views honestly and directly, eye to eye, face-to-face, about the disagreements, the sharp disagreements and concerns we have about president putin's leadership. >> what is the sort of read internally of this latest hack? i mean, you inherited one of the most egregious hacks of the executive branch. i believe it took place in your shortened transition. but there's another one today of

usaid. is it viewed as an escalation or an ongoing threat, or how do you -- and what is being done to sort of secure u.s. government computer systems from russian hacks? >> well, first of all, nicole, i need to be careful here because the u.s. intelligence community has not attributed this latest hack to any particular foreign government. we're waiting for that report from the intelligence community. one thing we like to try to do is to have the facts before we proceed here. but as you noted, there was the solarwinds hack before joe biden took office. we issued a series of sanctions against russia, against many of the relevant players in that hack, against a lot of the capabilities in that hack. we said there would be consequences. the president announced those consequences in april. we said some would be seen, some would be unseen so we'll go through the process here of first of all making an appropriate assessment of

responsibility and accountability and taking appropriate action. we've also done steps in the four months we've been here to try to increase our cybersecurity. the president's named the first ever white house cybersecurity director, senate confirmed position. the president's issued a cybersecurity executive order. we're beginning to implement that. so, we're very well aware of the threats from cyberattacks. again, i want to be careful here, not referring to this latest one because we don't have attribution on that but to be clear, we know there was a threat to the country and we're taking actions to protect the country from that threat. >> another area where i know the intelligence picture is still coming into focus for all of you and is far from being declassified for public consumption but is around the origins of the coronavirus itself. what precipitated -- was it the new reporting in the "wall street journal" or new intelligence that you all recently reviewed? is it that it was so politicized? i mean, what was behind the

announcement this week that another look would be taken at the origins of covid? >> well, the president had the national security advisor launch a review back in march, shortly after he took office, and he got a report -- the first report back on that review earlier this month and asked some follow-up questions and it was finally this week where the intelligence community came back and was prepared to declassify its conclusion that it really had no firm conclusion. two agencies in the intelligence community believe it was a natural occurring event. one agency believes it might have been a lab leak, but the bulk of the intelligence community still was uncertain about the origins, and so with that report ready to become public, the president thought it was the right time to make a public statement and to direct the agencies to look into whatever other information they have on this to try to gather more information on it and to use scientific tools to really study the virus, to see if there's something more we could learn about the origin. you know, as the president said in his statement, nicole, the real shame here is that when

this happened, in early 2020, the u.s. government didn't press hard enough to get people on the ground in china when really we could have been hot on the trail of the origins of this virus to really press to get the information we needed to really understand what had happened here. so, we're playing catch-up on trying to figure this all out. but we are going to make the best efforts to figure this out. the american people deserve answers. the world deserves answers, and we're going to use every tool at our disposal to find those answers. >> the world's problems end up on the desk of any american president, but about ten times that many problems end up on the desk of a white house chief of staff, so i thank you very much for spending some time with us today. white house chief of staff ron klain. thank you for starting us off this hour. >> thanks for having me, nicole. it's always great to be back on your show. >> thanks, ron. when we return, federal prosecutors are investigating another instance of election meddling, this time whether pro-russian officials in ukraine

interfered in the 2020 election by funneling disinformation through rudy giuliani to help donald trump. we'll talk to one of the reporters who broke that bombshell new story in "the new york times" next. plus, now that republicans have blocked a commission to investigate the capitol insurrection, questions are growing about why so many of the rioters have ties to the u.s. military. and more legal trouble for the trump organization. we'll look at the criminal charge the manhattan d.a. could be considering as his investigation moves forward. "deadline white house" continues after a quick break. don't go anywhere. continues after a quick break. dot n'go anywhere. tonight, i'll be eating a pork banh mi with extra jalapeños. [doorbell rings] thanks, baby. yeah, we 'bout to get spicy for this virtual date. spicy like them pajama pants. hey, the camera is staying up here. this is not the second date. [ suspenseful music ] hey, the camera is staying up here. hey, you wanna get out of here? ah ha. we've got you. during expedia travel week, save 20% or more on thousands of hotels. expedia. it matters who you travel with.

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investigate joe biden? >> no. actually, i didn't. i asked the ukraine to investigate the allegations that there was interference in the election of 2016 by the ukrainians for the benefit of hillary clinton for which there already is a -- >> you never asked anything about hunter biden, anything about joe biden? >> the only thing i asked about joe biden is to get to the bottom of how it was that lutsenko, who was appointed, dismissed the case -- >> so you did ask ukraine to look into joe biden. >> of course i did. >> you just said you didn't. >> of course i did. comments like that from rudy giuliani where he's a no and then a yes and then a no and then a yes again, a 180 on whether or not he worked with the ukrainians, he gave that answer in less than a minute. under intense scrutiny as we learn of another federal investigation into foreign interference in u.s. elections. an investigation that was previously not known, a criminal one. "the new york times" is now reporting, quotes, federal prosecutors in brooklyn have been investigating whether

several ukrainian officials helped orchestrate a wide-ranging plan to meddle in the presidential campaign, including using rudy giuliani. "the new york times" adds this. the investigation is unfolding separately from a long-running federal inquiry in manhattan that is aimed at mr. giuliani. while the two investigations have a similar cast of characters and overlap in some ways, mr. giuliani is not a subject of the brooklyn investigation, the people said. and while he may not be a target or subject, what we have here is yet another federal investigation involving the campaign by the ex-president's personal attorney to undermine his opponent, an effort that culminated in the former guy's first impeachment. joining our conversation is ken vogel, reporter for the "new york times" whose byline is on this new piece of "times" reporting. also joining us, andrew weissmann, senior member of the mueller probe, now an nyu law professor and msnbc legal analyst and frank figliuzzi is

back, former assistant director for counterintelligence at the fbi and host of "the bureau" podcast. ken vogel, take us through what this criminal investigation looks like from the eastern district. >> well, in some ways, nicole, this is the opposite side of the investigation of rudy giuliani being conducted by the southern district of new york. in that case, they're looking into whether he may have violated the foreign agent registration act, essentially the foreign lobbying laws, by advocating for things that some of these ukrainians with whom he was working wanted from the u.s. government. well, this investigation out of brooklyn, out of the eastern district of new york, is looking at what these ukrainians were sort of using him for, not what he was using them for as much, although clearly their interests did converge in this case, it's looking at whether these ukrainian officials with whom rudy giuliani met in december of 2019 in kiev and also in

budapest and in an earlier leg of that trip were essentially funneling disinformation through him and potentially others, other americans, in an effort to hurt joe biden's presidential campaign and to help donald trump's presidential campaign. >> and ken vogel, don't we already know that's what was happening from the united states intelligence community, who told us that that was happening and they named the individual doing it, andre durkoc. >> we did know that. what's interesting is that this is counterintelligence investigation but it's also a criminal investigation, looking at whether there could be criminal implications to some of what he and his associates were doing and there are possible implications where they may be conspiring to not disclose information but there's also -- we've seen in the past, including in the mueller investigation, where some of the charges that were looked out with regard to the foreigners who actually interfered in the

u.s. election, in that case the 2016 election, were related to defrauding the united states and that has to do with essentially trying to trick people, trick voters or trick people who they are funneling disinformation through to disseminate this false information and you're right that we know a lot about some of this stuff because the treasury department has sanctioned a number of the folks with whom rudy giuliani met during this trip to europe and subsequently, in some cases before as well, and also from the intelligence community coming out and saying that this guy, andre, the treasury community -- the treasury department and its sanctions against and announcing the sanctions against him called him an active russian agent for more than a decade. now, rudy giuliani says that he was not briefed on that. he was not warned about that. in our story, we reveal that one of the folks who was working with rudy giuliani, who also was subsequently sanctioned, another ukrainian named andre says he did warn rudy giuliani and said,

hey, this guy is bad new he's pro-russian. giuliani, nonetheless, met with him and subsequently even after the sanctions defended the meeting, defended working with him, saying he had no reason to believe that he was a russian agent and then added in a very rudy giuliani way, how the hell would i know? so indeed, how the hell would he know? >> here we are again, andrew weissmann. i mean, rudy giuliani is sort of the axis around which another now criminal investigation turns and i pulled out that old dni report that said this. we assess president putin and other senior russian officials were aware of and probably directed russia's influence operations against the 2020 u.s. presidential election. for example, we assess that putin had purview over the activities of andre derkach, a ukrainian legislator. derkach has ties to russian

officials as well as russia's intelligence services. you spent many months of your life investigating paul manafort and others and their trump campaign's ties to russia and here we go again. >> absolutely. i think it's important for your viewers to -- when they -- i think it's important for the viewers, when they think about ukraine, they really need to be thinking about russia because ukraine, for decades, is torn between the east and the west and the influence of the east and russia is because they have essentially ukraine by the energy stranglehold, so they have enormous kmuns there. so, rudy giuliani really can't credibly say that he didn't have any idea who he was dealing with, and it makes sense that there would certainly be russian faction in ukraine who would be

trying to influence the election in the same way that there were russians who were directly trying to do that and have been shown by bipartisan reports in the senate as well as by the special counsel report. >> and andrew, what are we to make of the fact that the end users of this information include the ex-president? i mean, and again, in this investigation, rudy giuliani is not a subject of the probe, but they are examining what he did with the information. well, donald trump consumed it, disseminated it as well. i believe ron johnson did too. >> well, absolutely, and we saw that was going on in the 2016 campaign as well as the 2020 campaign, which is they were perfectly happy to have information, and let's just remind ourselves what the first impeachment was about. it was essentially about buying an investigation of his

political opponent by using $400 million of taxpayer money as a way to dangle a carrot to get ukraine to open that investigation. and all of that by defrauding the american public because it's all about disseminating false information, disseminating what they hoped would be a false investigation into biden's son, and this is really so anti-democratic, it's nice to see, though, that the justice department is taking this seriously. i suspect this is more of a national security investigation than a criminal one. given the unlikelihood of somebody standing trial here in the united states, but it doesn't matter. it's still very good to get to the bottom of it. >> yeah, i mean, frank figliuzzi, that was my question. does this come out of the national security division and is this just meant to sort of put these individuals on alert that they -- if they come here,

they'll be indicted or what is the purpose of an investigation like this one? >> yeah, it certainly started as a counterintelligence investigation and it's likely continuing as such parallel to what is now the criminal prosecution and this violation, the foreign agents registration act, is within the fbi worked by the counterintelligence division. now, there may be partnered prosecutors and agents from public corruption, and we should pay close attention to that, because one of the angles i'm sure investigates are focused on like a laser is whether any of these characters will offer that rudy told them that he had the ear of the president, that he was convinced that the sitting u.s. ambassador to ukraine could be removed. why? because maybe trump told him so. that would be bombshell information that would be very much a part of any national security inquiry, and answering that seminal question, was the

president compromised? was he in on all of this? but andrew's got this exactly right. when you hear ukraine and these guys' names? just cross out ukraine and write russia. what does that mean? it means that rudy was essentially acting, as they say in russian intelligence service parlance, as the useful idiot. he was willing to be the conduit of russian disinformation to help his friend, donald, and essentially, rudy became the 2020 poorly produced sequel to the 2016 paul manafort, who was the russian connection back then. that's what we're talking about. russian influence, disinformation. the question, how high did this go? how much did the former president know? >> well, frank, we have some reporting that the white house was briefed, even if rudy giuliani wasn't briefed, and i understand that's sort of our understanding at this point. the white house was made aware that rudy giuliani was being used by, i believe, derkach or other ukrainians as part of sort

of the instrument for funneling russian disinformation. will this be -- is a criminal investigation or prosecution the way we'll find out what they knew and when they knew it? >> yeah, you're on the money there. derkach was mentioned by name in the white house briefing as someone they needed to be aware of that rudy was engaged with, so now the question becomes did anybody at the white house warn rudy of that in any official capacity? hey, watch it. they're on to you. maybe you need to lay low here with this guy. if that happened, that would come out during this investigation, and it would add to the intent and knowledge and motivation of rudy who then could no longer say, well, i had no way of knowing this guy was a conduit of russian information. prosecutors would be looking at that. >> it's an unbelievable new piece of our understanding of all of this. ken vogel, thank you for your reporting on all of it and for joining us.

frank figliuzzi and andrew weissmann, thank you both for spending time with us on this friday. when we return, the staggering number of capitol rioters with ties to the united states military. "deadline white house" back after a quick break. "deadline white hoe"us back after a quick break. l music ] hey, you wanna get out of here? ah ha. we've got you. during expedia travel week, save 20% or more on thousands of hotels. expedia. it matters who you travel with. ok everyone, our mission is to provide complete, balanced nutrition for strength and energy. great tasting ensure with 9 grams of protein, 27 vitamins and minerals, and nutrients to support immune health. i'm so glad you're ok, sgt. houston. this is sam with usaa. do you see the tow truck? yes, thank you, that was fast. sgt. houston never expected this to happen. or that her grandpa's dog tags would be left behind. but that one call got her a tow and rental... ...paid her claim...

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this academic year has been, um, challenging. but i think there's so much success to celebrate. woman: it's been a year like no other. man: yet, for educators across california, the care, compassion, and teaching has never stopped. woman: addressing their unique needs... man: ...and providing a safe learning environment students could count on. woman: join us in honoring the work of educators. together, we will build a better california for all of us. now that senate republicans have blocked the formation of a commission to investigate the january 6th capitol riot, many questions about that fateful day will go unanswered, at least for now. one of the more pressing

problems and one that we've covered on this show many times is how to root out extremism in the military and law enforcement. one of the more alarming things we've learned since january 6th is the large number of former military members who participated in the 1/6 insurrection. according to "the washington post," as of last month, at least 40 of the over 400 people charged in the january 6th riot came from a military background. one in ten. with no commission to investigate further, the question about why extremism has flourished among those with military ties may have just gotten a little more difficult to answer. joining us now, jeremy butler, veteran of the united states navy and ceo of the iraq and afghanistan veterans of america. thank you so much for spending time with us today. first, your thoughts about the senate republicans voting down a commission where this surely would have been one of the issues probed. >> yeah, it's disappointing. i mean, any time you've got an incident like january 6th, you want to have a congressionally

mandated commission that looks into what happened, why, who was involved, and how to make sure it doesn't happen again, so it's one of those things where, you know, there's a lot of negative, obviously, around it. you know, in the beginning, right after we knew there was a lot of veterans involved, you mentioned about 10% of those that are being charged were veterans, right after it happened, some of us were sort of like, oh boy, let's not talk too much about that. but the reality is, we have to talk about that because that's the only way we're going to fix things. we need to talk about it not only within the military and veteran community but the problem of nationalism and extremism within the greater american community because that's where we're pulling our military and our veterans from, and so it's certainly part of the problem and it is disappointing that the senate is not going to look deeper into this issue. >> i want to press you on that. let's not talk about it. first reaction. but i want to do it in the context of some new reporting in the associated press today. in new interviews with the a.p., current and former enlisatys and officers in nearly every branch

of the armed services describe add deep-rooted culture of racism and discrimination that stubbornly festers. there's no explicit category for hate crimes. the defense department also has no way to track the number of troops ousted for extremist views, despite its repeated plengs to root them out. more than 20 people linked to the january 6th siege were found to have military ties. why, even given the extraordinary step that this new defense secretary took of a standdown, are there still not ways to either identify it or deal with it? >> absolutely. we're far from a solution here. i've been in the navy for over 21 years. i served six years on active duty and still serve in the reserve community now. so, you know, the findings that you just cited there are by no means a surprise to me. the standdown was great. it's a first step but i think as anyone will tell you in the

military, solutions to problems like this don't come from the top down. they don't come from general military training, which are the types of things that we have to go through annually. they happen and they occur when the deck plate soldiers, the deck plate sailors are the ones that are embracing this. so that's why i say that if we're going to solve this, a big part of it does start with the military taking an honest assessment of what's going on, but it really has to extend to america taking an honest assessment of what's going on because anyone that is coming into the military with these extremist views probably got them from the civilian world before they came in. they certainly can be exacerbated within the military but we can't look at only one microcosm of the u.s. society if we're going to try and solve this. so, the things that are going on within the department of defense are a good first step but just like with sexual assault, sexual harassment, this is a much bigger problem that extends outside the department of defense. >> i take your point that it's a whole of society problem. i guess my only hope is that the

military is better. is that misplaced? >> no, it's not. you know, i mean, i think we -- that's why going back to the beginning, when i think, you know, myself and some others kind of had that reaction as we were watching the events of january 6th, we were like, oh boy, let's not talk about the fact that there's obviously a lot of veterans involved in here. you know, for the last 20-plus years, the veteran community, the military community has really been celebrated within this country and rightfully so, and it's incidents like this that begin to peel back the layer of reality. you know? the vast majority of the military, the vast majority of veterans served honorably and continue to serve honorably when they hang up the uniform and that's why we have groups like iava team, rubicon, the mission continues. but the reality is, every problem that we have within society exists within the military. we hold up stats like 40% of the military come from minority

communities and things like that. but when you look in the details, that breaks down when you get a lot closer. i'm an officer in the military, and there's certainly not 40% of my peers that are minorities. when you look at even different ratings within the enlisted branches, that 40% certainly doesn't hold up. so, there is a lot of work that has to happen within the department of defense, so please don't take my comments as anything other than, you know, very much acknowledging the fact that the department of defense, we, you know, myself being a part of that, have a lot of work still to do. >> no, no, no. i'm just admitting that i had, you know -- i think people, to your first point, people hold the military up as better than the rest of society. i think that's why it's such a story, and i really appreciate your candor, and i hope this is a conversation we can continue week after week after week. there's nothing more important. jeremy butler, thank you so much. and thank you for your service and for spending some time here talking about it. when we return, what we know so far about the criminal

charges manhattan d.a. cy vance just might be considering against the trump organization. back with that story after a quick break. back with that story aerft a quick break. as your business changes, the united states postal service is changing with it. with e-commerce that runs at the speed of now. next day and two-day shipping nationwide, and returns right from the doorstep. it's a whole new world out there. let's not keep it waiting. never run dry of... it'killer attitude.rld or hydration. neutrogena® hydro boost. the #1 hyaluronic acid moisturizer delivers 2x the hydration for supple, bouncy skin. neutrogena®.

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rico that resembles the federal racketeering statute. the law carries the penalty for severe penalties that, quote, can be applied to money-making businesses alleged to have repeatedly engaged in criminal activity as a way to boost their bottom line. it can carry a prison term of up to 25 years. at this point, no charges have been filed against trump, the trump organization, or any current trump org officials, and a spokesman for vance's office declined to comment to politico on whether prosecutors are considering charges under the corruption law. let's bring into our conversation, harry litman, former u.s. attorney. this morning, when we talked about the story, i said i need harry litman to take me to school, explain what a rico prosecution looks like and what does little rico mean? >> little rico just means it's new york's version of big rico, which is the feds. what's it look like? it looks like the focus is really the enterprise that the trump organization has sort of

rocked to its core. if you hear the sort of accounts of jennifer weisselberg, michael cohen, mary trump, they all say it's not just trump, not just weisselberg. it was a way of doing business, an m.o. that was corrupt. that's how they did things there andbusiness. an m.o. that was corrupt. that makes for a corrupt enterprise and that's why we're considering it, which by the way, would be no surprise to anyone who knows the new york law. >> well, and it would be no surprise to anyone who sort of casually aligned with trump who described how he rolled in his family office. what do you think when you hear this theory of a potential prosecution under a little rico. >> i think, yep, this is what we have heard. this is the way he does things. it is not isolated crimes. little rico is taking over of a regular business and making it dirty. it could be the mafia, but they have done it for construction companies or unions. and that's the account we have

heard from insiders of the trump organization. they took this regular business and made a way of doing business of just being dirty, valuation, fraud, all kinds of things like that. that's why the focus would be on the business. also a lot of evidentiary means you get more stuff in. you make the vantage point. be the enterprise, which really fits what we have heard, at least from the main critics of the trump organization who saw it from the inside. >> and would it include or could it ensnare donald trump himself, harry? >> it could, but it needn't. weisselberg is high enough. theoretically, you could have this prosecution with only weisselberg, but, yes, it naturally follows. it is the same kind of pressure on trump. it is just with a bigger frame and the possibility of more -- higher penalties and more

evidence. so it wouldn't have to go to trump. it would be enough. but it easily could. and of course that's what everyone has told us, the michael cohen's, the jennifer weisselberg's, the mary trump. it all does go to trump. he's the continuity of purpose. that's the legal term that they look for. >> and we certainly heard him described as involved in all of minutia. it's an unbelievable turn of events if that's where this is heading. thank you for spending time with us. when we return, as we do every day, we will remember lives well-lived. -lived people everywhere living with type 2 diabetes are waking up to what's possible with rybelsus®. ♪ you are my sunshine ♪ ♪ my only sunshine... ♪

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to the yun of 70,000 cookies a year. that's a lot of cookies. a lot of cookies makes a lot of friends. >> seven, eight thousand cookies every season. shirley was so well known around the texas rangers ballpark that there was a small name plate marking her seat in section 135. it said the cookie lady. it was a nickname quite well earned according to nbc dallas fort worth. back in the late '90s she sent one of the players a batch of cookies as a thank you gift. the cookies were a hit. then she made more. and eventually there were cookies for anyone who wanted them, fans included. he was a legend in those fans for decades.

so kind. so enthusiastic. but recently she got sick. the cookie lady passed away two weeks ago from complications of covid-19 at the age of 82. the texas rangers and that i know fans honored her memory at a game with a moment of silence. we will echo by extending our deepest sympathies to the family. thank you for letting us into your homes during these truly extraordinary times. "the beat" with ari melber starts after a quick break. don't go anywhere.

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welcome to "the beat." we begin with these new clues in the ongoing trump organization criminal probe in new york. we have clues that expand the scope of what has been publically known in a fast moving and recently accelerating probe. it implicates donald trump's holdings. tonight for the first time