american, so there could be no mistake or misrepresentations habit what i wanted to communicate. i did what i came to do, number one. identify areas of practical work our two countries can do to advance our mutual interest and also benefit the world. twofr, communicate directly, directly at the united states will respond to actions that are parallel of our interests or those of our allies, and clearly lay out our country's priorities and values so he heard it straight from me. >> all right. president biden's message to the world following his summit with vladimir putin. it went pretty well, joe. we're live here in washington. why don't you come in and join us? that's a long sweep. it's so grand. >> welcome to our garage. >> good morning and welcome to "morning joe." it is thursday, june 17th, along with joe, willie, and me we have my god, white house reporter for

the associated press, jonathan lemire. what time did you land last night? >> air force one got back right around 11:00, snagged a couple of hours of sleep, happy to be here this morning, staying away from anything that looked like it could be tea or coffee or anything else the russians may -- >> seriously, how are you feeling? everything good? >> i am fine. a little tired, but fine. >> you're alive. >> that's right. a giger counter. >> so -- you need a giger counter. willie, you saw the picture yesterday, five russians on one red sox fan and, you know, it's kind of like when i saw the picture, do we have that picture? i hope so. >> it's coming. >> when i saw the picture, five russians named igor, coincidentally. all of them named igor. off me, igor. anyway, it was kind of like the opening scene of "batman" with christian bale where they have to separate him from all the

prisoners, because he's beating them all up. >> you know what, you needed to be removed, jonathan. and they removed you. >> you need to listen to the russian security -- >> a surprising pro-gru take from mika this morning. >> reporter: but, yeah, willie, but jonathan lemire, back in one piece. >> that's great. washington anchor for bbc world news america, katty kay is with us. >> when i say willie, that's when we let willie talk. willie, talk. >> let's be honest, our viewers would rather see katty anyway. when jonathan described dipping his shoulder into five russian security officers, he wasn't kidding based on that photograph. he's obviously in helsinki, jonathan asked the question with putin standing there. and i think, it's fair to say, jonathan, that president putin may have recognized you when you stepped into the room. >> it's possible, i get special treatment there.

i did shout questions at him yesterday, too, about alexei navalny, why he was afraid of him, he just stared at me and did not respond and sent his friends there to get me out of the room, which was truthfully a heated scene, some of my colleagues were knocked to the ground, as we were discussed yesterday. not the entire u.s. press pool was a i believe to get inside that room, and that fracas set a tone for that day, to reflect the tension that had been surrounding that summit since it has been announced. >> katty kay is here. also with us, pulitzer prize winning historian, rogers chair and the american presidency at vanderbilt university, a man who was roughed up, but he was roughed up at a kentucky fried chicken joint in nashville yesterday, jon meacham. he occasional and unofficially advises president joe biden. >> great to have you all onboard this morning. president biden is back at the white house this morning, having wrapped up his first overseas

trip as commander in chief. the eight-day tour culminated with a face-to-face talk with president putin. it is clear, however, that divisions remain on issues such as human rights and cyber warfare. russia denied recent attacks on the united states and instead accused the u.s. of being the largest cyber aggressor. the issue of trust also came up, when putin was asked if he trusted joe biden, he said there was some, quote, some specter of trust. here's how biden answered that question. >> this is not about trust. this is about self-interest and verification of self-interest. that's what it's about. so virtually, almost anyone that i would work out an agreement with that affected the american people's interest, i don't say,

i trust you, no problem. let's see what happens. this is about how we move from here. i listen to a significant portion of what president putin's press conference was. as he pointed out, this is about practical, straightforward, no nonsense decisions that we have to make or not make. we'll find out within the next six months to a year whether or not we actually have a strategic dialogue that matters. for example, when i talked about the pipeline that cyber hit for -- that ransomware hit in the united states, how would you feel if ransomware took on the pipelines from your oil fields. he said, it would matter. i made it clear that we will not tolerate attempts to violate our democratic sovereignty or stable ides our democratic elections and we would respond.

the bottom line is, we told president putin that we need to have some basic rules of the road that we can all abide by. let's also say, there are areas where there's a mutual interest for us to cooperate. russian and american people, but also for the benefit of the world and the security of the world. i also told them that no president of the united states could keep faith with the american people if they did not speak out to defend our democratic values, to stand up for the universal and fundamental freedoms that all men and women have in our view. that's just part of the dna of our country. how could i be the president of the united states of america and not speak out against the violation of human rights. >> so jonathan, instead of just looking at yesterday, let's look at what happened over the past week. first of all, the special relationship, they had the meeting early on, then g-7, then nato, and then the putin summit.

how was the white house feeling about what they've accomplished this past week? >> they feel it was a success. aides i've talked to over the last week or so, overseas on various flights and air force one, do feel good about where we were. it was as much about messaging as it was about any sort of deliverable. they wanted to send the signal that the u.s. was once again a dependable ally who could be trusted by its european partners and democracies of the world. that was the thing we heard in the g-7, his meetings with boris johnson, nato, and culminating yesterday with this summit with vladimir putin. they wanted to establish first that, hey, we have these alliances again. we may not agree on everything, but they wanted to be a unified front going into that putin meeting. >> so let's add color. biden, what kind of mood was he in? a good mood at the end of the summit, at the end of the week? >> he did. he did. it's a grind.

all of these overseas trips are hard. reporters, we're feel it by the end of it. there were moments where the president looked a little tired. he's 70 years old. but he did look good. he was good yesterday with putin, he was in command. he admitted he lost his temper briefly at one point, which he apologized for. but they feel like he's god and welcomed back by his european allies who were so relieved he wasn't his predecessor. >> and it was executed really well. >> john, joe biden, the biden administration has come under criticism for even meeting with vladimir putin. and of course, that's just -- that happens. whatever a president is going to do, they're going to be questioned on whether they're making the right move or not. i've just got to say, if i'm looking at everything that happened, starting with a special relationship, contrasting that will donald

trump regularly assaulting theresa may, going on to the g-7, contrasting that with donald trump, constantly being an irritant, asking where vlad is, why isn't this a g-8, why aren't we inviting the russians? and instead the g-7 can focus on how they were going to push back on russian aggression. you go to nato, instead of donald trump pushing people out of the way to get to the front, again, it was more of a collective effort between all of the nato partners, as it has been traditionally, and then, of course, the meeting with russia. i've been going back through my mind, maybe you can come up with a better week in american diplomacy overseas, over the past 20 years, in the 21st century. i've been trying to figure it out over the past 12 hours. i can't think of a more successful diplomatic trip in the 21st century than this one. simply because we finally did the basics. we weren't going around talking

about wars we were starting or wars that we were in, but we were nailing down our special relationship, our g-7 relationships, our nato relationships. and then going as a united free world to vladimir putin. >> i think that's right. i think what president biden showed here, watching it from afar, was the product of decades of being chairman of senate foreign relations committee, being vice president. and of having a really -- it's almost intuitive, right -- sense of what diplomacy is. he defined it as the science of human relationships. and it doesn't mean -- the president wasn't saying, oh, if i can get in a room with somebody, we can always make a deal, which would be a very trumpian thing to say, right? that's the other interesting

thing here, is that biden's diplomacy was about the nation and the alliance, not himself. it's a subtlety, but he talked about that diplomacy is an extension of personal relationships by other meeps, he didn't, i don't think, really mean leader-to-leader, so much as nations, acting as a self-interest. he said nations are people, or the man feation of one will and one fission. thflt to me as there were two tributaries meeting. the other is, this is a very practical mans that believes in these ideals and believes that

diplomacy is hard work. it's meat and potatoes. you just keep plugging. and there was -- i guess my interesting -- my insight, watching the press conference yesterday was, there was a kind of poetry in his prose. does that make sense? not literally his prose, but just the whole thing. it was straightforward, and by being so straightforward it, seems kind of evaluating to me. >> you know, there was a moment, too, guys, during the press conference of president putin where he invoked january 6th, invoked the black lives matter matters movement, when he was asked by an abc news reporter about his crushing of little opponents. here's president putin. >> if i may, sir, the lists of your political opponents who are dead, imprisoned or jailed is long. alexei navalny's organization calls for free and fair elections and an end to corruption, but russia has outlawed that organization, calling it extremist.

and you have now prevented anyone who supports him to run for office. so my question, mr. president, is what are you so afraid of? >> they are not prohibited from working. they can continue to operate. foreign agents don't need to stop operating. if they are extremist in nature, that's another thing. the organization you mention has publicly called for mass disorder. >> you didn't answer my question, sir. if all of your political opponents are dead, imprisoned, poisoned, doesn't that send a message that you not want a fair political fight? >> translator: as for who is killing whom or throwing whom in jail, people came to the u.s. congress with political demands. 400 people. over 400 people had criminal charges placed on them. >> katty kay, it's so interesting to watch president

putin. he just doesn't have to face questions like this, obviously, at home. so by doing that press conference, he was facing western journalists who were going to ask questions and follow-up questions. but the term whataboutism maybe has been overused over the last couple of days, but it's exactly what president putin was doing, comparing january 6th and the black lives matter movements to the murder of political dissidents, to the jailing of alexei navalny. >> and look, it's possible that putin believes what he's saying, but when you watch him in a situation like that, he seems such a master of the art of disinformation and of lying, frankly, that you kind of think he knows he's not telling the truth, he knows that we know he's not telling the truth, but he's putin, so he can get away with it. the truth about whataboutism, you can never win at that game. there was some pressure on biden to respond to that in his press conference and he talked about the fact that there was no comparison, these were criminals that came to capitol hill. and putin will say, but navalny

under our laws is a criminal as well. you can escalate and it doesn't get you very far. the effective thing about what happened yesterday between these two men is biden did have a chance to go in there and say, this is what we will no longer tolerate. particularly on the cyber front. as chris krebs was saying yesterday, it's satisfying to think we don't know the answer if this was a successful summit, but we will know within a month or two whether those attacks have diminished. that meeting in geneva will be important. >> and i want to follow up on what jon meacham said, and what we were saying before is that there was actually some poetry in his prose. he did this -- we'll put it down where lemire and i can really figure it out. he had a lot of singles. >> yeah! >> he didn't swing for the fence. he did what he needed to do.

and, you know, i'm just going to repeat this again. it bears repeating and maybe people are tired of hearing it, but it ain't nothing to get the united states of america and the eu on the same page. because if you, katty, i'll say it again. and some people will say, why does he say this every day? because we overlook it. we brush aside the eu, as rumsfeld would say, what, chocolate makers and clock makers or whatever? but if you can combine the united states' gdp, 21 trillion a year, and the eu and great britain's gdp, about 19 trillion. that's $40 trillion of power. that's $40 trillion of leverage. that's $40 trillion -- being able to be invested against a country in russia that has a gdp of $1.4 trillion and even china, who has a gdp of $14 trillion a

year. so when we're getting that team together. i'm sorry, we can say this too, that's getting the avengers together. >> biden rallied his posse. >> there you go. we've gone from the red sox to marvel to john wayne. >> i can do a little bit of pop culture on occasion. it doesn't happen often, so take it when you can. and he has a playbook here. he did it with china, too. that very first trip that blinken and lloyd austin made together, they did exactly the same thing. they went through asia, they went to south korea, they went to japan and then they met the chinese. and that's what biden did this time around. he went and he showed, there's the united front, and that is a much harder thing for russia to take on and for putin to take on. and i think the other thing he did, he painted this kind of -- he painted a vision of democracy throughout this trip that has something to offer, as opposed

to putin who's saying, there is no happiness in life, only a mirage of happiness. >> there's that. >> exactly. >> it was a lot of really good sequencing -- >> it's not quite jeffersonian, but we'll talk to meacham about that -- life, liberty, and illusion of happiness. >> exactly. >> there was really good sequencing in this trip in terms of, you know, not just the buildup and who he met with before he went to meet face-to-face with vladimir putin, but even the sequencing of the putin event itself. putin arriving first, putting him in a completely differently position than he's ever been in before, where quite frankly, if biden was late, putin would have had to wait. and so it was perfect, because putin got there on time, for the first time, actually, because he realized, the only way this gets going is if he shows up. but you pointed out a line. you get a sense of what happened in that meeting, if in the press conference, joe biden says, our

president says reporters, how would it feel if ransomware violated your oil fields? this is what he said to vladimir putin. what he's saying to vladimir putin, that's what he told the press they said. can you imagine what he was saying in there? it's quite frankly, you want to talk about cyber? we can -- we can come back. we can respond in a big way. and how would you feel if we did? >> and certainly, a lot has been made, and rightly so, in putin's news conference afterwards, the whataboutism, the accepting no responsibility for the malfeasance by russia-posted groups or the government itself. and questions were put to the president. how can you be sure what you said in there today changed anything? and biden leveled. he's like, i don't know yet. we'll have to see. but the message was delivered inside that room and aides highlighted it, too, and pointed to that line. look, the u.s. will not just sit back. there will be consequences. biden to my question in the news conference said, alexei navalny died, there would be

consequences. if he gave a list of off-limits infrastructure projects in the united states, where if a ransomware attack were to hit these, there would be consequences. and certainly, mika, the hint there about the russian oil fields and the way he conveyed it in the news conference -- >> it wasn't really a hint. >> it was a very clear message. and he said to president putin, look, how would you feel if this were to happen in your country. and biden's recounting, putin said, that would matter. and that in itself is a significant moment. that would party. willie? >> jonathan lemire, in another understatement from president putin today, he said, president biden is very different from president trump. and so much of this trip, from the very beginning, from that first stop two tuesdays ago, where the president landed at a base and spoke to american troops about the need to restore faith and democracy, that we stand on the edge of something that we need to step back from, there's a moment in stroo to save democracy was about making

the case contrasted to the previous four years. so in that regard, how did he do? >> jon meacham? >> well, the theme of this presidency, the way it's emerged is, this is democracy versus autocracy. and autocracy can take form both at home and abroad. so chinese communist party, vladimir putin and his oligarchs, the insurrection of january 6th. there is a connection, thematically, within those forces. and so my own view, again, is that basically, almost anything the president does is going to be doable in this frame. does it strengthen -- does something he wants to do or wants the country to pursue,

does it strengthen democratic institutions that had been under prolonged assault, explicitly, you know, y'all are sitting, aren't you, year the capitol. you cannot walk to that capitol and go over there because of the fencing and the soldiers. that was the legacy of the previous senior administration. what i think president biden is doing, what i think the country voted for last november was not his return to normalcy, not this some sort of restoration, as though there's some deep state establishment that is coming in to kind of calm things down, it's not that. , you know, and i think we saw that with biden. one of my reactions to the president is, i would say 90% of -- and lemire can correct me on this if he disagrees. about 90% of biden is pretty much out there.

i suspect the body language we saw, a lot of the words, i bet 90% of that or so was what he was like behind closed door. biden is like an upside down iceberg. you see most of him. >> maybe not a bad thing for this. >> no. and i think it's an interesting way of thinking about it. if you want to know what joe biden is thinking, just listen, right? and you know, he kind of lost his temper there at the end. that's the kind of thing ordinarily, we all know this, that they would be muttering about in the cabinet on air force one. they never ask -- they ask the wrong questions. why don't they understand? he didn't do that on the about on air force one. he did it in front of the world. and i think part of it is being

78 years old. >> it's the no-filter presidency. i like it. >> just prove that i know something. although it is from the 1930s, appropriately. and biden may well be -- he shows up, he does well, but shows up, as opposed to babe ruth. babe ruth sold a lot of tickets and was highly dramatic, but got it done. and i think there may be something. >> yeah, either one. >> they're both pretty good players. and we will even say as red sox fans, they're both pretty good. i'm good. in his latest stop, the lou gehrig of the financial times writes this. biden writes riot act to putin. >> how do we measure whether

biden is making progress with putin? mostly by things that do not happen. further russian incursions into eastern ukraine. support for international piracy, and the longevity of alexei navalny. the absence of big cyber attacks on the u.s. would be another benchmark. a more ambitious one would be the weakening of russia/china ties. the latest zbigniew brzezinski described it as an alliance of the aggrieved. for the time being, biden must make do with modest contrasts, compared to putin's 2018 press conference with trump, when the russian leader could not contain his smirk, putin's solo press

conference in geneva seemed notably subdued. and i will say i think that vladimir putin seemed a little bit on edge and a little uncomfortable and a little smaller. he didn't seem like he had the upper hand at all. of every answer was january 6th, january 6th. >> i would say, neither would jonathan lemire say such things about president putin. listen, here's the deal. vladimir putin -- >> he looked defensive. >> he doesn't feel defensive. he doesn't feel on edge. that is not him. he is comfortable, all he's doing is, and i'm sure president putin would take this as a compliment. he is a shark in water looking for weakness and victims. that's how he looks at the world. he's constantly as a kgb agent, being very good at what he does, he looks for weaknesses. he knew he had weaknesses in donald trump. that's why he couldn't contain his smirk.

he had, for whatever reason, he had no respect for barack obama. treated him with contempt. even just visually, constantly slumped, showing him absolutely no respect. george w. bush, he didn't think too much of george w. bush either, obviously. bush was extended all across the world. so with biden, he has the first president that he understands. he's got a professional that has been on the world stage for 40 years, and a professional that's not distracted by a hot war in iraq, an on going war in afghanistan. >> what meacham said about the inverted iceberg, i thought that putin is the shark and all you see is the fin. he lies and lies and lies. so we don't know if anything he said to biden yesterday, he will take back to moscow and implement. we don't know that yet, right? we have to -- it sounds

satisfactory, but we have to wait to see the proof of this. but there is something about the fact that biden has an incredibly experienced team. highways very experienced diplomat. he has decided to make a wall against putin, as opposed to trump. and maybe biden benefits from the chaos of trump and the inadequacy of trump, in terms of building diplomatic alliances. >> i think wherever he goes, he goes to great britain, and they're like, thank god we have a guy who's not going to insult like theresa may. he goes to the g-7 -- >> who won't keep the queen waiting for 15 minutes. >> and step in front of her. >> walk in front of the queen! >> and the gp -- >> you mentioned the european union. that part of the trip was slightly overlooked. the european union is critical to america in a lot of fronts. it's the european union that's going to be dealing with china, the european union that's going to be dealing with russia and climate change. a hugely important partner for the united states at the moment. and biden gets that, because he

knows. because he's got a team around him who knows stuff. i remember having a meeting with jared kushner very early on in the trump administration and kushner saying to me, well, we think that we can fix middle east peace, because my father-in-law is a great negotiator because of the character of the guy. the hubris in it, in a sense, the absurdity of it that one person could fix something. biden's team don't operate like that. yeah, they like personal relationships, but he knows how you get things done, and that's by building alliances. >> he also understands, there's history. there's diplomatic history. it's the one thing that the trump team, they had a belief that history began on january the 20th, 2017. they didn't have to worry about the history. they could have contempt. they would say repeatedly when you talked to them, oh, if they were so smart, why is everything in such a mess. we're going to do everything differently. biden's team is connected with

history, biden's team understands history. i mean, god, joe biden was around at the creation of the eu. he's seen the successes, he's seen the failures. he knows. and let's just use the word, he knows how to exploit it for the united states' best interest, just like he knows how to exploit the special relationships, the g-7, for america's benefit. instead of just looking at these things going, oh, well, what's it costing us. >> trump viewed these relationships as zero sum. had to be a winner and a loser. biden was like, we can profit together and weft together. it was good for them, but also good for us. certainly among his allies, they were going from stop to stop with summit to summit, a palpable sense of relief from these european allies and western democracies. is there some concern about what could come next? yes, time will tell, if biden is

the an ration or trump is the operation. certainly, some european allies are concerned that in four years, they might be returned to trump or something like him. that is a concern, that is still a worry, but they recognize this president is someone they can deal with, they feel like they can trust. who does understand history. the benefit of these alliances. the prime minister of italy, he said, look, talking about sequencing. he's like, where was president biden's first trip? it was year, it was the uk to meet with us. where was president trump's first trip? and he left the question unanswered. but we all know where it was. it was saudi arabia. that was president trump's first foreign trip, with a very different message and theme to that administration and this was biden trying to suggest, and he said it time and time again, that america is back, and certainly at the very least, there's a sense that this is now someone who can predictable and the european allies can deal with. >> we don't know what vladimir putin is going to do moving forward. we do know that we have

tightened our relations with our allies. >> so we have a packed show ahead on "morning joe." coming up, we'll be joined by three members of congress. republican adam kinzinger and democrats alexandria ocasio-cortez and seth moulton. plus, former secretary of state, madeleine albright is our guest. also this morning, a gop congressman is facing criticism, including from fellow lawmakers after refusing to shake hands with a police officer who protected the capitol during the january 6th insurrection. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. this is dr. arnold t. petsworth, he's the owner of petsworth vetworld. business was steady, but then an influx of new four-legged friends changed everything. dr. petsworth welcomed these new patients.

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well, there may be hope on

capitol hill for democrats sweeping voting rights legislation. senator joe manchin of west virginia, the only democrat not sponsoring the bill has outlined a list of policies he would like to see in order to support it. in a memo circulated by manchin's office, he is asking for several changes to the "for the people act," including making election day a public holiday, banning partisan gerrymandering by using computer models, instead, and requiring voter i.d. with alternative forms of proof of identity. "the washington post" reports manchin's memo also sketches out several provisions that have historically been opposed by most democrats, including backing an i.d. requirement for voters and the ability of local election officials to purge voter rolls by using other government records. joining us now, nbc news capitol hill correspondent and host of "way too early," kasie hunt, and

national political reporter for "the washington post's" breaking news team, eugene scott joins us. >> thank you all for being with us. and kasie, you know, the reporting also the complaints from democrats that just been that manchin has been going no, no, no, no, no, no, when, in fact, he's been developing this list about hr-1 a long time. he told chuck schumer a long time ago, this is never going to pass. there is some crazy stuff in here. i understand this is a wish list, and that's cool, but if you want us to get a bipartisan deal, we have to work together. he's doing the same thing on infrastructure and every single bill. is this all about joe manchin? no. because for a lot of other democrats who don't want people in their state to know that they're not blindly following leadership. >> right. those democrats have to worry a little bit more about the progressive base of the

democratic party, which joe manchin really doesn't have to -- >> all politics is local. donald trump won west virginia by 69%. >> most pro-trump state in the entire union. you're absolutely right. and look, the voting rights, i'm much more skeptical about it. that list will be a non-starter for the congressional black caucus. it does allow him to say, hey, civil rights groups, i'm listening to you. i'm trying on this. chuck schumer will put him on the spot next week. infrastructure, i think, is a completely different situation. and i also think that there is a point, potentially, where manchin gets so frustrated with this, with republicans, that, you know, he may actually move. and i think that gives him some additional power here in this situation. because what he's saying behind the scenes about the filibuster and about a lot of this legislation is, it's a little bit different than what he says in public. >> well, it is. and there was actually leaked audio that came out where he

said that he would go along with some filibuster changes that would make it easier for democrats to get, whether it was 60 or, i think, in the audio tape, it was -- who floated the 55 idea? >> it's been floated -- it's one of those ideas that's been out in the ether, basically. >> right, so, at the end of the day, it seems like, eugene, that manchin is going, i'm going to give republicans every last chance. and i'm going to check and see if they're going to operate in good faith. he's already checked mitch mcconnell off that list, because of the january 6th commission, for him. he's said, okay, i'm not going to deal with him. i'm going to work straight with republicans. it seems to me that manchin is again bending over backwards for republicans. but at some point, he's going to get what he wants. >> he is. and this is important, because as you all know, manchin has been the target of so much criticism from the left.

and what he has to prove to people and his party is that it's not just him. it's actually people right of him who are making it very difficult for things to move forward. so many of the things that republicans have said that they want to see in voting rights legislation, he has gone forward and put forward. and to see them still not come onboard with him, it's going to make him or give him the opportunity to say, it's not me, it's them. willie? >> so, kasie, obviously, this is not going to be a nonstarter, not just for some of those democratic groups you mentioned, but also for republicans, where mitch mcconnell and republicans have said, no way to s-1, and called the john rights voting act unnecessary. if the idea for senator manchin is to get republicans onboard, what exactly is his strategy here to do that? >> well, willie, if you look at that list, it includes some things like voter i.d., for example, and the idea that you could remove voters from the roles by using other databases,

those are republican ideas. so if they're going to come out and say, okay, well, sure, we'll take the two things you like, but oppose it anyway, because of these other things we don't agree with, a public holiday making it easier for people to vote in general, you're really setting them up to kind of demonstrate the obstructionism, right, that democrats are focused on when it comes to republicans and how they're handling this administration and the democratic majority. so i'm curious to know, is he doing that? is he more focused on republicans? is this really actually because he is under pressure from democrats, from his own party, because, again, this is such an emotional and really fundamental issue, especially for these civil rights groups, that the one thing i don't totally understand about this is the gerrymandering question. i mean, that's something the democrats want, but he's saying he wants to use a computer to do

it, and that potentially threatens the seats of a lot of african-american lawmakers, black lawmakers in congress, who have, frankly, a ton of power in the house of representatives and who fought really hard to have districts drawn to make sure that they were represented by somebody who reflected the popular vote in the area. >> they are also the most crazy gerrymandered districts ever. >> many of them are. >> and by the way, i mean, i understand they're really powerful members that own those crazy gerrymandered seats, but you just look in the state of florida, you know what that does? that gives democrats one seat. it gives republican five seats around it. so i understand what the purpose was, because the road to hell, i think, as my grand mom would say, is paved with good intentions. and those gerrymandered seats that guarantee that one black representative will be in that one seat, has ended up most likely hurting democrats in the long run, because you're taking

all of those democrats out of other seats. i want to -- can we put up the list of four again? and eugene, i want to go through these really quickly with you. because this is actually a proposal for a 50/50 congress, right? because make election day a public holiday. democrats love that. ban partisan gerrymandering. democrats love that. require voter i.d. actually, a very popular -- if you look at where that stands with americans, most americans want that, right? that's a very republican proposal. allow for maintenance of voter rolls. you know, people like joe manchin and al of others are like, why don't you purge voter rolls every few years? it seems like that would make a lot of sense. that's something else that the republicans want. that is a 50/50 proposal there. >> it is. and i can't help but to think that some of this is about manchin defining his legacy. people want to know what his future plans are, and he doesn't want to go out with the criticism he's currently facing.

many people are asking, what's he about with the republicans. he's a democrat, which democrat is he representing. and whek make these things very clear, he's trying to tell people, these are the issues that matter most to me and matter to many of the people that i represent and matter to americans on both sides of the aisle many some cases. >> and joe meacham, everybody wants everything resolved in 15 minutes. manchin has been doing this a very long time. it's always taken a long time to get things done, until, you know, the last couple of years, people expect something instantly. but, you know, we would have regular order. you would go through the subcommittees for a month or two. go through the committees for another month or two. then it would go through the house. then it would start in the senate. you would be nine months into it and then you would get, you know, the senate and the house fighting on reconciling the two

bills. and maybe a 11 months into it, you would pass a piece of legislation. that's how it usually works here. the fact that we are five months in and people are freaking out that a revolution hasn't taken place in legislation, it's -- they may not understand how legislation is supposed to work, but joe manchin does. >> i think one question you have to have, that senator manchin has to answer is what's the legacy? what's the point of having this much power, this much attention at what is unquestionably an inflection point for american institutions? and that's not overstated, right? i mean, january 6th, we almost lost the country. we almost lost the constitution, right? the confederates didn't get into the capitol during the civil war, but they did in 2021.

right, as close as they got was ft. stevens out near silver spring during the civil war. but not this time. and, you know, i hate to be totally in character here, but we can't forget what happened. and, so if you're a united states senator, if that's where you're going in your political career, then if you're senator manchin, you have to decide, what do you want that legacy to be? what do you want us to think about when we look at your portrait? it's a great test to use with politicians, because they can't imagine a world where we're not looking at their portfolio. >> jon meacham, thank you very much. and coming up, the inside story of how leadership failures, politics, and selfishness doomed the u.s. coronavirus response. that is next on "morning joe." that is next on "morning joe."

welcome back to "morning joe." with president biden's july 4th vaccination goal looming, health experts are now sounding the alarm about the so-called delta variant of coronavirus. nbc news correspondent blayne alexander has the latest on the race to get more americans vaccinated. >> reporter: experts predict the delta variant first discovered in india could soon become the dominant covid strain in the u.s. >> it is more transmissible, and possibly more dangerous in terms of causing severe disease. >> reporter: all of it only accelerating the rush to get americans vaccinated. but the biden administration is running out of time to hit its july 4th goal. 70% of americans with at least one shot. so far, only about 53% of the country is partially vaccinated. but some states are barely

hitting a third of their population. the lowest rates in southern states, like georgia, alabama, louisiana, and mississippi, where only 28% of the state is fully vaccinated. a new poll gives some insight into why the rates are lagging. 37% of those asked point to vaccine hesitancy, but nearly double that number say they faced barriers in trying to get the shot. and even as scenes like these are becoming more familiar, dodger stadium hosting the largest sports crowd since the start of the pandemic, still, some setbacks, with a royal caribbean cruise ship forced to postpone setting sail after eight crew members tested positive for covid. >> on one hand, we're seeing a number of states loosening restrictions, but on the other hand, we're hearing this dire warning about the delta variant. is this a confusing message? >> blayne, i think what you're hearing is really a message for two different populations. which is that if you are vaccinated, you are still in good shape. but if you are unvaccinated,

there's still reasons to be cautious. to still wear a mask, to still avoid indoor gatherings. >> nbc's blayne alexander reporting there. joining us now, former biden senior adviser for covid-19 response, andy slavitt. he was a key architect in crafting the affordable care act as well under the obama administration. andy is out with a new book entitled "preventable: the inside story of how leadership failures, politics, and selfishness doomed the u.s. coronavirus response." andy, good morning. good to have you with us. we'll talk about the moment in a moment, but you're only a week or so out of a job running the coronavirus team inside the white house. tell us what you know about this delta variant. obviously, we've heard from public health officials who have said the answer to this is to get vaccinated, because the vaccines are effective against it. >> we should think of this as covid on steroids. before, you walked into a room and it took you ten minutes to get exposed to covid, now you

can get exposed in something like five minutes. if you haven't been vaccinated, you should be worried. it's another reason for you to talk to your doctor and ask them about getting vaccinated and get vaccinated. if you have been vaccinated and live in a community with large numbers of people being vaccinated, that's exactly why you're vaccinated and you should feel good and safe about the delta variant. and feel fortunate that unlike the rest of the world, we have abundant vaccine supplies here. >> obviously, you and your team and president biden set that july 4th goal to get 70% of eligible americans vaccinated. how is that goal looking and what's the significance of that number from your point of view? >> here's how i'm looking at it. i think we're probably as a country going to be very close to 70%. if we're short, we'll be at 68% or so. and we won't stop. we'll keep moving beyond that and i think we'll eventually soon cross 70%. here's the point and i think you made this point very well, willie, that doesn't mean the whole country is 70%.

it means parts of the country are at 90% and parts are at 40 to 50%. those parts of the country that are 40 to 50% are at risk, particularly come fall, should we see a new rise in variants and i think you can be sure that we will. >> you were talking about really fears in this in britain. >> they're worried about the delta variant spreading very fast and being both more transmissible and more dangerous. it's already had an impact in the uk. and dr. slavitt, is there a possibility that delta, given that we have some areas of the country with low vaccination rates and we have children not yet vaccinated in this country, could we see stresses on the health care system in some states because of delta? >> you know, i'm not as worried about it. you know, i think if there's one thing we did differently in the uk, which is we required two

doses, and for all americans who have gotten two doses, they have a higher boost in immunity. the uk pursuit of strategy getting more people vaccinated more quickly by giving people one dose. the reason that dr. fauci decided that was not the idea was precisely because of variants. you need the extra boost when you're facing something that's trying to evade the immunity m system, like we see with delta. >> certainly at the g-20, there's a lot of discussion about this and the commitment made for a billion doses worldwide, although some groups say, that won't be nearly enough. that it will need to be 10 to $11 billion. but i want you to talk about your book and take a step back. that very fragile time in terms of presidential transition between the trump and biden administrations and what sort of setbacks and obstacles you experienced that as you came in as part of the team, that then took hold of this nation's

pandemic response. >> i think one of the major differences and one of the ways that we were so fortunate is that we had a president that came in with a big focus on accountability. he wasn't going to avoid accountability, basically, his approach was, we're going to get it done. and i think as we saw from donald trump and, i think this is outlined in the book, donald trump did everything he possibly could to avoid accountable. whether that meant denying that the virus existed, denying the seriousness of the virus. point fingers at china, going through the summer and systemically removing anybody, from the scientific point of view that was different from his narrative. the job is a lot harder to compute when you have a boss that essentially wants to deny the problem. we came in and one of the reasons that president biden was sitting in the oval office is because he said, we're going to

take this side and beat the goals and beat them and set new goals. and that's what we did and that's why we were able to deliver more for the public. >> the book is ""preventable." andy slavitt, thank you very, very much. >> and to show just how serious this is, how leaders in alabama understand how serious this is, you had tommy tubberville doing something that surprised a lot of people. getting on, doing a public service announcement, saying, hey, alabama, get vaccinated. >> we call him senator now, but i think his more important role is, of course -- >> call him coach? >> you did not. i say, we named him senator, but in that video, the most important title he's ever had is coach. good on him for doing it. there are so many people who haven't or won't. even former president trump has basically refused to. and when he does even mention the work, he mentioned it at an

event he held semi-recently and there was silence from the crowd. which shows how this has gotten so incredibly political-sized. you know a lot of these republicans who cnn did a survey of them in the house and a bunch wouldn't say whether or not they were vaccinated. >> whether it's stfgs hosts or republicans. look at doctors, the latest number, 96% of doctors, eugene, have gotten themselves. >> and when you look at the demographics of those who have not yet been vaccinated, many of them are in these voting blocks that support many of these republican lawmakers. white men are behind the national averages in getting vaccinated. having these lawmakers speak out can be beneficial in the long run. >> makes a difference. >> new polling shows that among trump voters, vladimir putin is viewed more favorably than some democratic leaders around the world, including joe biden. we're going to dig into those new numbers, straight ahead.

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pointed out to him, we have significant cyber capability and he knows it. he doesn't know exactly what it is, but it's significant. and if, in fact, they violate these basic norms, we will respond. cyber way. he knows. in the cyber way.

number two. i think the last thing he wants now is a cold war. >> that was president biden when asked yesterday if he told vladimir putin what the penalty would be for interfering with america's infrastructure. it's very different tone to the conversation. >> sort of more of a, like, i don't know, lemire's going too far, sort of a -- i don't want to sa cordileone thing, but -- >> just telling the truth. >> nice oil field you have there. it would be a shame -- >> we have the ability -- well, he knows what we can do. that's the message that was sent, clearly, in between all the niceties. >> behind closed doors and then in that one public form. we didn't get the side-by-side press conference of the two presidents. we didn't -- but joe biden and his team said they didn't need that. that's the message they wanted to send, that vladimir putin has nobody for a long time that the

united states could respond in this way. the administration is saying, hey, we will respond in this way. does that mean that putin will curb his behavior? only time will tell. >> really, guys, you and i both heard from different sources, different diplomatic sources, that a message had already been sent to the russians before this summit. that we had capabilities far beyond what the russians were capable to do. and while we haven't been used our offensive capabilities to the degree that we're capable of using it, that it's a real possibility. >> no question about it, in terms of responding to the cyber attack. and we heard that from chris krebs yesterday, of course, we have the ability to respond and do big things like they do here. but also in terms of attacking the finances of not only

vladimir putin's friends, his billionaires, the oligarchs of russia, but perhaps to president putin himself. i would be interested to know from jonathan or others who have reported out if that came up? if president biden did, in fact, talk to president putin or suggest, perhaps, that he can impact the bottom line, his personal bottom line? but so much of what we're talking about, joe, here, is base line diplomacy. and it's that contrast of the last four years, which is just kind of resetting, getting back to level, kind of firming up the alliances across the eu and in great britain, as well. and coming and doing what presidents do and taking a hard line with someone in vladimir putin who has threatened in so many ways the united states. it sounds obvious, but these are things that have to be said out loud in contrast to the last four years. >> and the president making clear he got what he wanted done done. welcome back to "morning joe." the ap's jonathan lemire, kasie

hunt, and eugene scott with us. and joining the conversation, republican congressman, adam kinzinger of illinois. and editor of "the new yorker" magazine, david remnick joins us. good to have you both onboard this hour. >> what do you think, congressman? how did -- let's just not look at the putin event. let's look at the entire week. how do you think the entire week unfolded? >> probably no real headlines in terms of anything accomplished with the summit, with putin. >> it's a good thing, better than standing in front saying, i trust the russians more than our own intelligence. one of the good things is being able to walk away and say we have expectations. from a trick perspective, i think it's fine. >> that's one area of conversation we have yet to

have. >> and that will continue. we lifted the sanctions temporarily. that debate will continue. i'm wondering about the difference between -- we've been talking about the special relationship, instead of having the president attacking theresa may, it looks like biden got along very well with someone who had been critical of before, with boris johnson, same thing with the g-7, same thing with nato. i mean, it's going -- >> it's like old-cool politics. >> it's going the small things. making sure you've got your team hogt. how did he do on that front? >> i think good. even if i don't agree wall of his policies, it's refreshing to see someone stand up, say nice things about nato, about our allies, about the importance of nato. not bluster with russia, but also not be super nice to russia and say, vladimir putin and are friends, but nato and i aren't, which is what you got with the last administration. i think all in all, it was a

decent trip. >> president biden is back at the white house this morning, having wrapped up his first overseas trip as commander in chief. the eight-dur tour across europe culminated with that face-to-face meeting with president putin. vladimir putin called the talks constructive. russia denied recent attacks on the u.s. and instead accused the u.s. of being the largest cyber aggressor. here's president biden explaining what comes next. >> this is about -- this is about how we move from here. i listen to, again, a significant portion of what president putin's press conference was. and as he pointed out, this is about practical, straightforward, no-nonsense decisions that we have to make or not make.

we'll find out within the next six months to a year whether or not we actually have a strategic dialogue that matters. for example, when i talked about the pipeline that ransomware hit in the united states, i looked at him and said, how would you feel if ransomware took on the pipelines from your oil fields? he said, it would matter. >> i made it clear, we will not make attempts to destabilize our democratic elections and we would respond. i told president putin that we need to have some basic rules of the road that we can abide be. and areas where there's a mutual interest for us to cooperate. more our people, russian and american people, but also for the benefit of the world and the security of the world. there wasn't any strident action taken, where we disagreed, i

disagreed, stated where it was. where he disagreed, he stated. but it was not done in a hyperbolic atmosphere. and now, we've established a clear basis on how we intend to deal with russia and the u.s. russian relationship. i'm not suggesting that any of this is done. we've gotten a lot of business done on this trip. >> david remnick, i remember watching you to see if our in our new york interview, it must have been eight, nine years ago, and i was struck by how much resentment fueled every utterance that came from lavrov. a little bit of that edge was off yesterday, though. i am so curious with your vast experience with russian history, what your takeaway was from yesterday's meeting. >> i think joe biden set out to do certain things and did them in a very immediate way, which

was to reestablish a relationship with allies in europe that had been demeaned and debased by four years of trump. and then he went in front of the russian leader and acted as an american president should, delivering clear messages of national interests and so on and he behaved as he should. in any real world, that would probably not be a headline, as the congressman said, but unfortunately, in the world in which we've lived in the last five years under trump, when we've had just debased relationships with our european allies and the most curious relationship with vladimir putin, things needed to be reset, to use that now fallen term. that's number one. number two, our biggest interest in the short-term with russia, of course, is nuclear peace. they have an outsized nuclear arsenal, they present a threat that is enormous. and that needs to be kept under

control and it's better to talk with the russians than not. always, i think, not talking with them, like some republican congressmen suggest is nuts, it's just wrong. but we also have a long-term interest with russia and with everybody else. it's to set some kind of democratic example in our own nation. and we have debased that, unfortunately, in recent years. and we need to reestablish that and i think that joe biden, the more he can do to represent the reestablishment in democratic liberal values in this country through policy, through rhetoric, through action, that is important to the future of russia, not in the immediate sense, because, excuse me, vladimir putin is not going anywhere, and he's crushed all opposition, but in the long-term, that's very important. we've seen that historically. >> yeah, the czar is not going anywhere. kasie hunt is here. >> to pick up on what david was

saying about the issues that we have here at home. i was watching the putin press conference yesterday and he didn't say ashley babbitt's name, but invoked the woman who was killed in the january 6th riot and essentially parroted some of the talking points that we're seeing on our far, far right conservative media, even from some of your colleagues, like congressman paul go satyr. what is going on with that? >> insanity. it's not even paul. it's our own -- it's not the far, far right, it's just the right now. where it's saying that she was assassinated. now the new push is that the fbi actually somehow planned and assisted in jan 6th. >> you have members that are actually promoting that. >> oh, yeah. >> and it's insane. >> it's the circle of life. i mean, the russians -- not just the russians, but there are chinese propaganda websites that are spitting this out, spitting out conspiracy theories every day. i'm having to talk to family

members. we don't trust the press. oh, but you trust a chinese cult? that's where you're getting your news from? and the answer is, yeah. that's where they're getting their news from. >> it's been so much information peppered on these people that now you can say, fbi planned january 6th. that's the now thing. you can't prove otherwise. by the time you do prove otherwise, they don't even listen to facts anyway. and this is the legacy of trump and trumpism. this is the legacy of blatant outright lies to people that are being abused for the raw noble patriotism. >> and the thing that i've found is, you knock down one conspiracy theory, they go, yeah, but what about the fbi? and you knock down another conspiracy theory, there's always a thousand conspiracy theories that the russians, the chinese, all of these conspiracy websites are pushing. and they would rather believe that than read the constitution than google and see what the associated press or other news outlets are saying about it. >> we saw this become a big

issue during the 2016 election and saw a president ignore it. we saw the president and an entire party not really address it in the way that we need to. and we'll see it continue in 2022. what we'll need to happen is for media on both sides, the non-partisan media and lawmakers to be for it, say, this is wrong, this is not true, this is not factual. but you're going up against so many people who already don't trust these picture and i don't know what you can do to fix that. >> i think there's a big problem with the media, which bends right or left, that has got to cover the same facts. and they're not. that's not what's happening right now. >> well, leaders have to tell the people that follow them the truth. if you don't see anybody you trust tell you the troous, why would you believe the truth? that's why leaders have failed. >> that brings us to this. leading up to the biden/putin summit, vladimir putin polled higher among than joe biden

among trump voters. a new poll shows that 19% of trump voters had a favorable view of putin. only 9% of trump voters had a favorable view of president biden. compared to other world leaders, the poll shows putin's favorability is onpar with canada's prime minister, justin trudeau among trump voters. >> willie geist, you look at these numbers and vladimir putin -- trump numbers have higher favorability ratings for vladimir putin, a guy who has invaded two european countries over the past 13, 14 years, shot down an airliner of civilians, continues to kill journalists and politicians that he doesn't like. and so these trump voters have a higher favorability rating for him than the democratically elected leaders of canada, of

france, and of the united states of america. now, where i came from in the deep south, we would just call that un-american. and would say, america, love it or leave it, growing up. i don't -- there are no words, but this is a trend that's been going for some time. can you imagine saying you have a more favorable rating -- a more favorable feelings for slp vladimir putin than the democratically elected presidents of three western democracies? >> no, i can't. but an awful lot of people in this country can, apparently. actually, i'm surprised that 19% is as low as it is, given the way that the president has talked about vladimir putin in glowing terms. congressman kinzinger gets at your point, that will shock people who watch this show. it will shock many americans. but in you live in the information bubble where joe biden is the villain, joe biden is an incompetent.

joe biden is a bad president and a bad person and his family is corrupt and all the things they've been hearing for the last couple of years, that number makes perfect sense inside that bubble. >> yeah, well, look, i'll say, from my party's perspective, like, i think 1%, it's obviously extremely high, at least we can say 81% don't. but when you compare it to joe biden, you look at and say, look, he is an person president, you can fully disagree with what he's saying and disagree with his policies. but sit here and say, he's anti-american. i can tell you who is anti-american, and that's vladimir putin, you know? and i can tell you who's also not anne-american, angela merkel. this is a failure of leaders who were sitting with me in d.c., scared to tell the truth to their voters, because they're afraid they might lose the primary. if everybody stands up and tells the truth, people are somehow going to learn some version of the truth. instead, it's like me and louisiana louisiana, and easy to

separate us and demonize us. >> and here's a perfect example of this in the basest of terms. republican congressman andrew clyde of georgia, who voted against awarding police officers the congressional gold medal for their bravery, refusing yesterday to shake hands with one of those officers, d.c. officer michael fanone, who was badly beaten in the capitol attack, who later spoke about the encounter. >> i asked him if he was going to shake my hand and he told me that he didn't know who i was. so i introduced myself. i said, that i was officer michael fanone, i was a d.c. metropolitan police officer, who fought on january 6th to defend the capitol and as a result, i suffered a traumatic brain injury as well as a heart attack after having been tased numerous times at the base of my skull as well as being severely beaten.

at that point, the congressman turned away from me, pulled out his cell phone, looked like he was attempting to pull up like an audio recording app on his phone, and again, like, never acknowledged me at any point. as soon as the elevator doors opened, he ran as quickly as he could, like a coward. >> congressman, i just -- i can't even begin to understand it. but you actually witnessed other incidents like this yesterday. >> of course. but i'll tell you, on this incident. so i'm good friends with michael fanone. i've gotten to know him. he doesn't hide this. the guy used to be a republican. used to think that donald trump was out there for backing the blue. it's amazing to me, when you are a coward, taking cowardice votes, voting against gold medals for the cops. they didn't want to have to face their base and admit it was an insurrection. but then you stand in the company of a hero, i understand

why you would shut down. you are standing with people that know the truth, because you're out there spewing lies and representative clyde is the one who said, this was nothing but a tour group that day. and fanone is there saying, aye got a story, i'll show you the body camera and it's much easier to shut down and run away than it is -- >> this guy saw the video of cops being beaten by the american flag. this guy saw the video of cops having their heads crushed in doors. this guy has seen the videos of cops -- >> he was there! he was there! he was there! he was hiding! >> and yet he was there, freaking out. so now he's lying, saying that this never happened. that it was just a tour group. so what do you do with that? >> and this hero stands in his company and he freezes. that's why it's so important for this information to come out. because our base out there, the republican base that believes anything from an fbi, to black lives matter, to, it's, you

know, antifa, anything but what it was. when you see your heroes, quote/unquote, that are standing up there making up these stories, freeze in the presence of a heroic police officer, who's a republican, by the way, and as dishevelled and disenfranchised by the party at this moment because he feels left behind by it, that's -- >> i'm not a republican anymore. i'm still a krve pip mean, you shake hands with cops >> you shake hands. >> you shake hands with anybody. >> with any hero. but especially, they're going around, defend the blue, support the blue! how about just shaking hands with cops? >> how about "thank you"?! you were there, i was in that chamber. you are out there trying to keep these people from coming in. how about you just say "thank you." >> 140 law enforcement officers were injured. >> that's the point. >> i talked to one officer and if you talk to him in person, he

could have walked up and said, let me show you my scars, right, on his hand, on his foot, he had surgery, and he was someone who was not ever political previously, but who watched brian sicknick's mother go and beg these members of congress to actually vote for this january 6th commission. and he said, i can't sit here on my couch anymore. he's been off work until just a week or so ago. he was like, i can't sit here anymore and be apolitical, when these members of congress that i defended are refusing to say -- >> and jonathan lemire, it's something that david remnick were talking about, we have to worry about our own country. the divisions they're exploiting. >> and this is all tied together. it's about the mistruth, the lies from the white house, from former president trump created this atmosphere, created what happened on january 6th. created those poll numbers from vladimir putin where more republicans support him than president biden, because of this warped sense of reality that the former president created. so david, i mean, two questions for you. one is, where do we go with

that? you think big thoughts. let's hear some of them. also, just want to get your sense a little more about yesterday, too. and president biden's performance in geneva. and in particular, talking about the truth and opposition. we know that this is what putin does. it's disinformation all the time. and he is trying to shape the story about alexei navalny there. and curious what your -- of his response, he wouldn't use navalny's name, but also the consequences that president biden said would happen to russian when i asked him what would happen if navalny were to die? >> first of all, props to you for getting that question in and the response or non-response that you got. i was thinking yesterday, it was the centenarian of andre sadoff. and it took him two decades, and he found himself standing in front after reforming, a reforming general secretary, mikhail gorbachev and spoke the

truth about afghanistan, about the need for the communist party not to be the only center of power in the soviet union and many other things. and he was able to point to and the dissidents were able to point to a distinctly imperfect united states, but a nation that had some sense of democratic liberal values, that could be pointed to, as a reality, despite vietnam, despite so many other flaws in the american -- in american history. racism and all the rest. but if we have a united states that presents no center, that has a -- one of its two main political parties coddling conspiracy theories, calling this summit a great victory for vladimir putin, because we gave him a quote/unquote stage instead of it being a diplomatic event, in which we refuse to shake hands with heroes. in which we suppress supreme court nominations in the most -- in the grossest way, as mitch

mcconnell is mow promising to do yet again, we have a major political party that is anti-democratic, that seems to admire authoritarianism more than it admires what we call liberal democratic values. then, therefore, we set no example for a russian future. i'm not saying that suddenly slp slpt is going to disappear from the stage, but there will come a time when he's not there and american behavior matters. not only to americans and in our own country, but elsewhere in the world. and if we lose that, then we've lost our souls. >> so, congressman, i am constantly battling -- constantly -- i am so used to being hopeful about america and optimistic about this country. i have grown up believing the moral arc of the universe is long, but it bends towards gist. and what do i see?

every time i start to get hopeful, i'll see things like yesterday. and it came one after another and let's just not watch tv right now, because there were three stories. one was this poll, talking about vladimir putin, being more respected than democratic leaders. the second was about the hand shaking of the heroes. republicans won't even shake heroes' hands anymore, a few of them. and third, this fbi conspiracy theory that the fbi now, it was antifa, it's the russian fire hose of falsehoods. now they're moving on, trying to blame the fbi. and what i want you to do this morning is to tell me, to restore my faith, restore my hope, and say, joe, these are just small incidences. there is hope on the horizon. can you do that? can you give me that hope this morning? >> i think there is hope on the

horizon. it's what i'm fighting for. >> you do? where? >> it's what i'm fighting for. >> shis my question. she will take you down. but i think -- i think it's basically the crazier it gets, the harder this is going to fall. this is not sustainable, but the question is, you know. it's the fbi -- it's the question, in the next month? probably not? in the next year? probably not. it will fall. and if you talk about the arc of history, you have to look into the long arc of history. at some point, the american people will wake up and say, quit lying to me, so obviously pandering to me like you are. that's where i'm optimistic. >> how much is this. we used to always blame donald trump for this. donald trump has been sitting in plea bargain plarg or bedminster the past couple of months. he's not on twitter. he's not on facebook or twitter. the train moves on without donald trump. >> i started the whole country

first to be like this kind of david versus goliath on misinformation. to fight to say, the country is what matters most. that's going to be a fight, but one where people have to choose, are you going to engage in that fight or sit back and say it's lost? i refuse to say it's lost. and i think the republican party will continue to be a major party for the future. so we have a choice. that's either going to be driven by misinformation or fight to restore the soul of it and tell people the truth. that is a choice they have to make. i know what i'm side i'm on. >> so is it fair to say there's three parties? there's a democratic party, a republican party and an insurrectionist party? >> that sounds right. if you sit here and say -- >> i would love it to be called the insurrectionist party. they can have their own party. let them have their party. and a real republican party, with real conservative values, with real debate, on real issues, based on facts.

>> yeah, because you've always been so supportive of the republican party. >> i believe it's important to have two strong parties. but to have one that literally wants autocrats in charge, to have trump in charge? a total dictator. >> in your district, explain your district. when you hold town hall meetings and talk to people in your district, talk about the base. do you see any movement moving away from donald trump? more towards main street republican values? a tiny bit. when people talk about the district, the district includes everybody, not just the base. the district is supportive of what i'm doing. the base is not. it's a republican district. >> what do they say? >> they think i'm supporting democrats by calling out the truth. >> what do you say?

i say, you have been lied to for so long. and i have evolved to realize, it's not their fault. nobody they trust has told them otherwise. >> that's right. >> and when the voices they trust and sit there and say, either imply that the election was stolen or imply that the insurrection was by the fbi or say it outright, to think that they'll organically come to this on their own with voices that they don't trust and have been told is on the other side of the aisle, that's why leaders have to lead. what does the base say? i think they're coming around a little bit. it's not fast, and i'm not going to sit here and pretend like we're on the edge of this massive awakening, but it will happen. >> don't you think it's playing out what led up to the insurrection and january 6th would help your constituents? >> i think telling the truth, the january 6th hearings. if you believe it's the fbi, have the january 6th hearings. that's going to blow the top off of it. >> yeah. all right, congressman adam

kinzinger of the new yorker, david remnick and eugene scott, thank you all so much for being on today. we really appreciate it. still ahead on "morning joe," a signal that progress is possibly being made when it comes to a bipartisan infrastructure deal. we'll be joined by congresswoman alexandria ocasio-cortez and congressman seth moulton to discuss that. >> two democrats on different sides of the issue. >> and what they want to see on the infrastructure issue. and former secretary of state madeleine albright on the 50 over 50 list, joins us with her thoughts about vladimir putin. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. n. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. my nunormal? fewer asthma attacks with nucala. a once-monthly add-on injection for severe eosinophilic asthma. nucala reduces eosinophils, a key cause of severe asthma. nucala is not for sudden breathing problems. allergic reactions can occur. get help right away for swelling of face, mouth, tongue or trouble breathing.

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support for an infrastructure deal is expanding. 21 senators onboard with yet to

be released plan, including 11 republicans. in a statement yesterday, the group wrote in part, quote, we support this bipartisan framework that provides an historic investment in our nation's core infrastructure needs without raising taxes. the support comes one day after senate majority leader chuck schumer announced that democrats are planning a budget measure that could bypass the filibuster. a bipartisan deal will ultimately need 60 votes to pass. there is still no guarantee that all 50 democrats will vote for it. meanwhile, new monmouth university polling shows the majority of americans support president biden's infrastructure proposal, regardless of party. 68% of americans say they're onboard with the plan, compared to 29% who oppose it. joining us on set in washington, congresswoman alexandria ocasio-cortez of new york, and

congressman seth moulton of massachusetts. they're both calling for high-speed-rail funding to be included in the infrastructure package. >> i'll take it! >> we so agree with that! >> so before we get to this, after the election, you tweeted some things that i thought were hopeful about how democrats campaign. because as a former republican who now is paying more attention on how democrats campaign, i'll just tell you, it drives you crazy. and i was like -- >> it drives me crazy too, sometimes. >> that's what i want to talk about. you were talking about, when nobody else was talking about, like after the election, everybody was blaming everybody for everything. and you were like, hey, wait a second. you've got to knock on doors. i know there was covid, but i kept saying, put on the mask, knock on doors, talk to people. and they say, you can't do it, but that's exactly what you did. can you talk about what a difference it makes when you're really aggressively reaching out

to people and why that didn't happen in 2020. >> well, i think conversations, real conversations is what's most influential. and that's why it's so important for us to not just do this during campaign season, but during government season, making sure that we're out here, having town halls with our communities, constantly delivering our message and because the things that we -- we have good things to say, actually. we need to say them well. and in person, especially in the age of disinformation and misinformation. one of the most effective ways to cut and combat misinformation online is the actual in-person interaction. and so, for example, with the high-speed railwork that seth and i are doing, we want to go out and we should be telling every person in america, millennials and gen-z should be the most unionized workforce in modern american history. and the way we'll do that is by

having massive infrastructure proposals that draw down our climate emissions that ensure we are creating millions of union jobs in this country and connecting rural and underserved opportunities to affordable housing. >> and congressman, she talked about town hall meetings, and no, no. >> it's amazing, right? >> hundreds of town hall meetings. and i look at these numbers that i put up every day. americans support your proposals overwhelmingly. and yet, we keep hearing about how these little slogans are going to make a difference next year. doesn't make a difference if you're talking to your constituents in town hall meetings. >> and when you're talking with constituents, you're also listening and hearing what the american people want. and the american people want us to invest in the future. they don't want us to just be filling the last generation's potholes. they want high speed broadband. they want high-speed rail. we should be able to get to new

york in an hour and a half. you should be able to get to new york city to albany, 152 miles in 36 minutes. >> can you get me from jfk to midtown in less than an hour and a half? >> you know what, it's not just about -- it's not just about the east coast. the most popular high-speed rail line -- >> okay, you're on the wrong show! >> -- bangkok to shanghai. that's the same distance from chicago to atlanta. that's good for louisville, chattanooga, indianapolis, all of these communities in between would be connected by high speed rail. >> but aren't you guys right now pushing something that republicans totally would agree with. >> you overestimate. >> are there sticking points with this? >> i think so. i think so. because, here's the deal. fossil fuel industry opposes electrified high-speed rail. there's a lot of special interests that do not want to see mass transit. and this is one of the big reasons why, you know, we had

the technology for evs about a hundred years ago. we had technologies for electrified rail about the last hundred years. and one of the big reasons that didn't happen is because congress was swayed in lobby the first time by fossil fuel industries, by car industries, et cetera. and so, that's why the fight on this and the fight on voting reform and getting big money out of politics is also so crucial for the future of our policies. >> and jonathan, we've -- we've all been on amtrak time and again. you look at our competitors across the globe, whether you're looking at china or japan, looking at europe. everybody's ahead of us. everybody's way ahead of us on this. it doesn't really make sense. i keep wondering why america has been dragging their feet over the past 30, 40 years. and part of it is, of course, the reason why, you look at l.a., why is l.a. such a mess? because the auto industry and big oil lobbied against mass

transit in los angeles for a very long time. >> i've been on amtrak for about two hours. the sort of go town, if there's going to be infrastructure in a bipartisan way. i asked the president yesterday on the tarmac in geneva whether or not he has seen the new proposal. he says he has not. he's been overseas. but what are your concerns about if a bipartisan deal is made and it's a smaller number than the democrats first proposed, what are you concerned about losing? what are red lines for you? >> usually, representing the bronx in queens when these bipartisan deals come together, they tend to underserve the communities that are already underserved. places like the south bronx, baltimore, you know, areas of chicago, you know, across the country. and so not only do those communities get left behind and cut out in these bipartisan deals, but corporate interest gets centered in these deals, as

well. so that is number one. so we need to make sure that our infrastructure policy -- you know, i think our number one priority, and what democrats should prioritize is not process and how, but are we passing the deal that helps working people the most? are we passing the deal that makes the most jobs. are we passing a deal that brings down the most climate emissions, that raises wages and improves infrastructure for the next generation. and if a bipartisan deal succession up trillions of dollars in bridges to know where, because it makes people feel good, that's going to be a huge concern. we need to make sure that we're creating economic opportunities for people who are ignored in this country. and that's what's -- it's not just good politics, but policy, too, and that is politics at its best, when people who are helping people the most win, but we have to communicate that well, too. >> let me ask both of you.

and congressman moulton, we heard -- and you mentioned voting rights, congresswoman. joe manchin put out a memo yesterday, and it is probably the most significant, existential, emotional issue. he is, of course, also at the center of the voting rights talk. but do you think he's acting in good faith in proposing that compromise or not? >> i don't think this is a place where you compromise. and i think that joe manchin should know better than that. he's in a very powerful place right now in history and excited about that, but i think he's really out of touch with the times and really out of touch with the american people and our fundamental values. there's no compromise when it comes to basic constitutional principles in democracy. >> congresswoman? >> i think there was an audio leaked yesterday on the intercept about the senator's conversations with big donors and saying, hey, you know, cut me a break on the commission.

we should be negotiating with each other, as colleagues, not with billionaires and donors, period. our policies should be with other public servants and our colleagues. and that's not even negotiating with republicans, elected officials. and so i think that especially again, we talk about bipartisan deals, we should not be cutting out the big money provisions in hr-1, because the big money provisions are what's driving down wages and big corporate lobbyists that have a disproportionate megaphone on washington, more than working dpeem. they are the ones that are coming after the big money provisions in hr-1 laws. and by the way, those dark money groups are the ones that are purchasing these voter suppression campaigns and organizing in places like georgia, texas, arizona, election challenges. so we have to address all of it. we have to address all of it in

this bill. >> and you ask why we don't have high-proceed rail, it's the oil lobby, the car lobby, the airline lobby, any state in the country that wants to invest in a new highway, gets an 80% match. 80% match from the federal government. high speed rail, nothing. that's policy from congress. and where do you think that came from? it's big money? >> let's talk about the democratic party. and over the past three, four months, we've talked a lot about joe manchin and getting to 50 votes, a lot about whether it's possible to get to 50 votes. we have noticed that you and bernie and some of the more high-profile progressive leaders, that you all have held your tongue, far more than when

i was in congress and i was on the other side, we would complain every three minutes about, it doesn't cut enough. we are not coming close enough to balancing the budget. and i've been curious, how -- first of all, have you done it? because we could never do it. is there more of a plan to let the moderates work through this? let them try to get to where they go and we work behind the scenes and meet them behind the scenes? >> i think there has been a large amount of behind the scenes work. for example, the american rescue plan, there were parts of moderates on the stimulus side that they wanted to cut the child tax credit. so we were using a lot of our leverage, because, yeah, manchin's got some of these votes in the senate and

progressives holding that margin in the house. so, you know, not all of these fights are all public, but i also think that we've got a lot of work ahead of us, too. and so we've got appropriations season coming up, we've got the defense budget coming up. we've got, you know, dhs coming up, a lot of these different big bills, from agencies where there have been lots of concerns. i think we're pacing ourselves right now, because progressives do want to bring down the military budget. we want a $15 minimum wage. and at bare minimum lower the age. i would like medicare for all. >> let's put that in perspective, though. we disagree on medicare for all, but we both want every american to have health care. the other party is trying to take it away. and we also want to pay for it. we believe that the wealthiest americans should actually pay their fair share. they seem to think if jeff bezos

is paying $0 in taxes, that's too much, because they're always trying to cut taxes on the wealthy. we can have a debate within our party about how to deliver health care for every american. and that's exactly the debate that we should be having. >> isn't it interesting, you listed several things, that five years ago would have made people's hair catch on fire, run out and say, oh, she's a left-winger. but you talk about $15 minimum wage. that's something that five, six, seven years ago would have been seen as radical. oh, he can do that in seattle. in fact, i said, oh, they can do that in seattle, but you can't do that -- >> he said that. >> and now, because it didn't seem possible, we're now starting to see costco, $16 an hour, walmart -- suddenly, what was politically impossible now. >> is fairly possible. and i still say, you're going against a party that's stuck in 2009. >> i agree. >> on these issues. >> i agree.

>> stuck in 1959. >> so how do you again, let's just go back to, how do you win next year? how do you get enough of a majority, where these things can pass, which, again, let me just say again. 60%, 65% of americans support. >> well, i think the thing is to actually deliver. progressive policies are popular. there is a reason why $15 minimum wages is at where it's at right now, because people want this to happen. so if we make these things happen, we'll be able to energize folks enough to go to the polls. canceling student loan debt. these are huge things. because we win a majority with two things. persuading people who are in the middle and driving out people who are convinced that democrats are will do something for them. >> why do you think it was that so many working class latinos across the country voted for

republican candidates in 2020? >> i don't think the democratic party have organized. we haven't invested in it. we don't message in it. we're just seeing -- >> why is that? why is there such a blind spot among the democratic and has been for some time. but towards hispanics, latinos, acting as if one latino voter is the same as every other latino voter. >> well, i think, first of all, there is that monolith issue that has always been there. but also, i think it's kind of connected to the politics of it all, too, and frankly immigration remains one of the most fraught issues in u.s. politics. it's the one thing that can fracture the democratic party. it's the one thing that the republican party just -- it's red meat for their base. so having these conversations to nonmonolith communities, the way

you message on this issue to cubans in florida is different from puerto ricans in florida is different to our brothers and sisters in the south border. so i think a lot of it is about getting our ducks in a row from a policy perspective, too. and when we figure out what our vision is there and our relationship to latin america, a lot of this is about deeper trust with these communities. >> and that is why you have to get out and have those conversations with people. you have to listen. >> congresswoman alexandria ocasio-cortez and congressman seth moulton, thank you very much for being on. still ahead, congress approves the first new national holiday in decades. we'll explain why the president's signature on this bill is so time sensitive. "morning joe" is back in a moment. " is back in a moment psoriatic arthritis, made my joints stiff, swollen, painful.

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on this vote, the yeas are 415 and the nays are 14. the bill is passed. >> all right. june 19th or juneteenth, the bill that commemorates the end of slavery in the united states is now a national holiday. the voet house voted to pass the juneteenth holiday. 14 voted against it. president biden is scheduled to sign this bill into law this afternoon making this saturday the first juneteenth national holiday. also on capitol hill, senate minority leader mitch mcconnell said he would block a supreme court nominee picked by president biden in 2024 is the gop wins back the senate. here is how biden responded when asked about the comment

yesterday in geneva. >> mitch mcconnell said if republicans were to take back the senate in 2022, he did not see a way that you could get a supreme court justice confirmed. >> mitch has been nothing but no for a long time. and i'm sure he means exactly what he says. >> jonathan lamere, after you get pushed around by igor, igor, igor and igor, you actually asked the president that question. i think everybody that knows mitch mcconnell knows mitch mcconnell is interested in one thing, republicans winning the majority next year and this is sending a message to his voters, which is 2022 is going to make a big difference. >> he knows how the conservatives are always fired up at the idea of a judiciary, particularly the supreme court, that is a motivating, animating issue for republicans. that's the message he wanted to send. his rationale for whether it was

mayoric garland, amy coney barrett, the message keeps changing. >> always using this as a campaign issue and it is what motivates the conservative base more than anything else. >> and i will ska to that point the only thing he cares about more than the majority is the conservative nature of the court and obviously he has to have the majority if he's going to continue to have influence over that. but he thinks his decision to block mashg garland is perhaps the most consequential of his career in decades. >> you know what is so interesting about that, too, mitch mcconnell had long be derided among the coneverybodyive base as, you know, he's just a member of the establishment. somebody that we couldn't trust, he was an establishment guy. and after that, it's remarkable how that changed. now he's seen as a conservative champion. >> i wouldn't say that he

necessarily feels like a natural fit for that movement, but i think he has convinced people that he has their interests at heart, that their interests that evangelicals, for example, their interests line up with mitch mcconnell's interests, so they're willing to overlook it. finally this hour, some concerning news, former homeland security head tom bridge suffered a stroke at his home in washington, d.c. according to a long time aide, ridge was taken by ambulance from his home to a hospital for treatment. the aide said ridge was conscious upon arrival at the hospital and underwent a procedure to remove a blood clot. ridge is reported to be in critical, but stable condition and we are praying for tom ridge and for his family. >> he's been a good friend of the show. he's a great guy, a great public servant. he puts his you country over his party. our thoughts and our prayers are

certainly with him. and ahead, americans remain split on a handful of contentious issues, but new polling shows the top issue facing most voters personally is division in the country. we'll dig into those numbers. plus, former secretary of state madeleine al bright joins the conversation. we'll talk about that. ght joins the conversation we'll talk about that. bright jo the conversation. we'll talk about that. ost cobris the conversation we'll talk about that. th nucala? fewer asthma attacks. nucala is a once-monthly add-on injection for severe eosinophilic asthma. not for sudden breathing problems. allergic reactions can occur. get help right away for swelling of face, mouth, tongue, or trouble breathing. infections that can cause shingles have occurred. don't stop steroids unless told by your doctor. tell your doctor if you have a parasitic infection. may cause headache, injection-site reactions, back pain, and fatigue. ask your doctor about nucala. find your nunormal with nucala. when traders tell us how to make thinkorswim even better, we listen.

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impair our vital interests or those of our allies. and three, to clearly lay out our country's priorities and our values so he heard it straight from me. >> all right. president biden's message to the world following his summit with vladimir putin. it went pretty well, joe. we're live here in washington. why don't you come in and join us. that's a sweep. it's so grand. good morning, and welcome to "morning joe." it is thursday, june 17th. along with joe, willie and me, we have, my god, white house reporter for the associated press jonathan lamere. what time did you land last night? >> air force one got back around 11:00. so i had a couple hours of sleep. happy to be here this morning. staying away from anything that looked like it could be tea or coffee or anything else the russians may have had -- >> how are you feeling? everything good? >> i am fine. a little tired, but fine so far.

>> we'll take your temperature every three hours. >> so, willie, you saw the picture yesterday. five russians and one red sox fan. and, you know, it's kind of like when i saw the picture -- do we have that picture? i hope so. when i saw the picture, five russians named igor, coincidentally. >> they were literally saying -- >> off me, igor. so it was kind of like the opening scene of batman with christian bail where they had to separate him from all the prisoners because he's beating them all up. but, no, they were -- >> you know what? you needed to be removed, jonathan. and they removed you. >> you needed to listen to the russian security. >> a surprising pro take from mika this morning. >> her father would not be happy right now. jonathan lamere, back in once piece. >> that's great.

katty kay is with us, as well. >> when i say willie, that's when we let willie talk. let's be honest, our viewers would probably see katty, anyway. when jonathan described dipping his shoulder into five russian security, he wasn't exaggerating. putin is standing there. and i think it's fair to say that president putin may have recognized you when you stepped into the room. >> possibly. i get special treatment there. i did shout questions at him about alexi navalny. he just stared at me, did not respond and sent his friends there to get me out of the room which was truthfully a heated scene. some of my colleagues were knocked to the ground.

that set a tone for that day you. reflected the tension that have had have been surrounding that summit since it was announced. >> katty kay is with us and also a man who was roughed up, but he was roughed up at a kentucky fried chicken in nashville yesterday, jon meacham. he occasionally and unofficially advises president joe biden. >> president biden is back this morning after his eight-day tour across europe. the president said the talks were positive while putin called the meeting constructive. it is clear, however, that divisions remain on issues such as human rights and cyber warfare. russian denied recent attacks on the united states and instead

accused the u.s. of being the large he cyber aggressor. the issue of trust came up when putin was asked if he trusted joe biden. he said there was some, quote, some specter of trust. here is how biden answered that question. >> this is not about trust. this is about self-interest and verification of self-interest. that's what it's about. so i am virtually almost -- almost anyone that i would work out an agreement with that affected the american people's interest, i don't say i trust you, no problem. let's see what happens. this is about -- this is about how we move from here. this is i listen to, again, a significant portion of what president putin's press conference was. and as he pointed out, this is about practical, straightforward, no nonsense decisions.

that we have to make or not make. we'll find out within the next six months to a year whether or not we actually have a strategic dialogue that matters. for example, when i talked about the pipeline that cyber hit for -- that ransom ware hit in the united states, i looked at him and i said, well, how would you feel if ransom ware took on the pipelines from your oil fields? he said it would matter. i made it clear that we will not toll rat attempts to violate our democratic sovereignty or destabilize our democratic elections and we would respond. the bottom line is, i told president putin that we need to have some basic rules of the road that we can all abide by. i also said there are areas where there's a mutual interest for us to cooperate. for our people, russian and american people, but also for the benefit of the world and the security of the world. i also told him that no president of the united states could keep faith with the

american people if they did not speak out to defend our democratic values, to stand up for the universal and fundamental freedoms that all men and women have in our view. that's just part of the dna of our country. how could i be the president of the united states of america and not speak out against the violation of the human rights? >> so jonathan, instead of just looking at yesterday, let's look at what's happened over the past week. first of all, the special relationship, they had the meeting early on. then g7, then nato, and then the putin summit. how is the white house feeling about what they've accomplished this past week? was it a success? >> they feel it was success. the aides i've talked to over the last week or so, overseas and on various flights on air force one do feel good that it was a -- the trip had a theme to it. it was as much about messaging as it was about any sort of

deliverable. they wanted to send a signal that the u.s. was a dependable ally who could be trusted by its european partners, the democracy of the world. that was the theme we heard at the g7, the meetings with boris johnson, nato, and culminating with this summit with vladimir putin. they wanted to establish first, hey, we had this alliance. we saw differences certainly on how to handle china. they wanted to be a unified front. be the howard cosell here, add color. biden, what kind of a mood was he in at the end of the summit? >> he did. the overseas trips for eight days are hard. there were moments, of course, that even with paths and schedule, the president was tired. he's 78 years old. >> and john, joe biden, the biden administration has come under criticism for even meeting with vladimir putin. and, of course, that's just -- that happens. whatever the president is going to do, they're going to be

questioned on whether they're making the right move or not. i just have to say -- and i'm looking at everything that happened. starting with the special relationship, contrasting that with donald trump regularly insulting theresa may, going on to the g7, contrasting that with donald trump constantly being an irritant, asking where vlad is, why isn't this a g8, why aren't we inviting the russians? and it's so the g7 could focus on how they were going to push back on russian aggression. you go to nato, instead of donald trump pushing his way through to get to the front, it was more of a collective effort between the nato partners as it has been traditionally and then the meeting with russia. i've been going back through my mind, maybe you can come up with a better week in american diplomacy overseas, over the past 20 years. the 21st century.

i've been trying to figure it out over the past 12 hours. i can't think of a more successful diplomatic trip in the 21st century than this one simply because we finally did the basics. we weren't going around talking about wars we were starting or wars that we were in. but we were nailing down our special relationship, our g7 relationships, our nato relationships. and then going as a united free world to vladimir putin. >> i think that's right. i think what president biden, watching it so far was the product of decades of being on the chairman senate rilgzs foreign committee, of being vice president, and of having -- it's almost intuitive, right, sense of what diplomacy is. he defined it, you know, fdr

called it the science of human rips. relationships. the president wasn't saying, oh, if i can get in a room with somebody, we can always make a deal which would be a tremendous trumpan thing to say, right? that's the other interesting thing here is biden's diplomacy was about the nation and the alliance, not himself. it's a subtlety. but when he talked about that diplomacy is an extension of personal relationships by other means, i don't think he meant leader to leader so much as nations, in fact, act according to self-interests. and nations are a collections of people or in an autocracy, the manifestation of one will and one vision. so this felt to me as though there was kind of two tributaries meeting. president talking about how important our values are.

that's one tributary. the other was this is a very practical man who believes in these ideals, who believes that diplomacy is hard at work. as you say, it's meat and potatoes. you just keep plugging. and there was -- yeah, i guess my -- the interesting -- my insight watching the press conference yesterday was there was a kind of prose. does that make sense? not literally a prose, but it was straightforward and by being so straightforward, it seems kind of elevating to me. still ahead, vladimir putin points to the january 6th attack on the capitol when pressed about his harsh treatment of political opponents. we'll show you that moment. plus, former secretary of state madeleine albright will be our guest. "morning joe" is coming right back. est. "morning joe" is coming right back stay restless, with the icon that does the same.

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there was a moment during the press conference with president putin where he invoked the black lives matter movement when he was asked about his crushing of political opponents. here is president putin. >> if i may, sir, the lists of your political opponents who are dead, prisoned or jailed is long. alexi navalny, the organization called for free and fair elections, an end to corruption, but russia has outlawed that organization calling it extremist and you have prevented anyone who supports him to run for office. so my question is, mr. president, what are you afraid of? >> they're not prohibited from working. they can continue to operate. foreign agents don't need to stop operating. if they are extremist in nature, that's another issue and the organization that you mentioned has been -- has publicly called for a mass disorder. >> you didn't answer my

question, sir. if all of your political opponents are dead, in prison, poisoned, doesn't that send a message that you do not want a fair political fight? >> translator: as for who is killing whom and throwing whom in jail, people came to the u.s. congress with political demands. 400 people. over 400 people had criminal charges placed on them. >> katty kay, it's so interesting to watch president putin. he doesn't have to face questions like this obviously at home. by doing that press conference, he was facing western journalists who were asking questions and asking follow-up questions. but the term what aboutism has been overused over the last couple of days, but it's exactly what president putin was doing, comparing january 6th and the black lives matter movements to the murder of political

disdistants, to the jailing of alexi navalny. >> and it's possible putin believes what he's saying, but when you watch him in a situation like that, he seems like the master of the art of disinformation and lying, frankly. he knows he's not telling the truth. he knows we know he's not telling the truth, but he's putin and he can get away with it. the problem is you can never win at that game. there was some pressure on biden to respond to that in his press conference and he talked about the fact that there was no comparison, that these were criminals who came to capitol hill. putin will turn around and say, yeah, but navalny under our laws is a criminal, as well. i think the effective thing about what happened yet between these two men was that biden did have a chance to go in there and say this is what we will no longer tolerate, particularly on the cyber front. as chris krebs was saying yet, it's not very satisfying to say

we don't know the answer yet that this was a successful meeting, but we will know in a matter of months. >> and that meeting will be important and, again, i want to follow up, like jon meacham said and what we were saying before is there was actually some poetry in his prose. he did this straightforward -- we'll put it down where lamere and i can really figure it out. he had a lot of singles. >> yeah. >> he didn't swing for the fence. he did what he needed to do. and, you know, i'm just going to repeat this again. it bears repeating and maybe people are tired of hearing it. but it ain't nothing to get the united states of america and the eu on the same page. coming up, more on vladimir putin and the approach he took with president biden compared to other u.s. presidents.

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biden politely reads riot act to putin. >> and lewis writes in part, how do we measure whether biden is making progress with putin? mostly by things that do not happen, such as further russian incursions into eastern ukraine, support for international piracy, and the longevity of alexei navalny. the absence of big, cyber attacks on the u.s. would be another bench mark. a more ambitious one would be the weakening of russia/china ties. the is bia bra consequenceky described it as the alliance of the aggrieved. less adversarial u.s. relations with russia could loosen the moscow-beijing embrace. that would be a very long shot. for the time being, biden must

make do with modest contrasts xurd to putin's 2018 press conference with trump when the russian leader could not contain his smirk, putin's solo press event in geneva seemed notably subdied. and i will say that he seemed a little on edge and a little uncomfortable and a little smaller. he didn't seem like he had the upper hand at all. sort of defensive. every answer was january 6th. january 6th. >> i was going to say, neither would jonathan lamere say such things about president putin. no, i -- listen, here is the deal. vladimir putin -- >> he looked defensive. >> he doesn't feel defensive. he doesn't feel on edge. that is not him. he is comfortable. all he's doing is -- and i'm sure president putin would take this as a compliment. he is a shark in waters looking for a weakness and victims.

that's how he looks at the world. he's constantly, as a kgb agent, being very good at what he does. he looks for weaknesses. he knew he had weaknesses in donald trump. that's why he couldn't contain the smirk. for whatever reason, he had no respect for barack obama, treated him for contempt. even just visually constantly showing him absolutely no respect. george w. bush, he didn't think too much of george w. bush, either, obviously. bush was extend all across the world. so with biden, he has the first president and he understands he is a professional. he's been on the world stage for 40 years and a professional who is not distracted by a hot war in iraq, an ongoing war in afghanistan, chaos across the globe. >> yeah. what preach yum said about the inverted iceberg and that's what biden is, putin is the shark and

all you see is the fin and that's what he is. and look, he lies and lies and lies. we don't know if anything he said to biden yesterday he would say back to moscow and implement. we don't know that, right? we have to -- it sounds spectacle, but we have to wait to see the proof of this. but there is something about the fact that biden has an incredibly experienced team. he is a very experienced diplomate. he has decided to make a war against putin as opposed to trump. and maybe biden benefits from the chaos of trump and the inadequacy of trump in terms of building diplomatic alliances. >> wherever he goes, he goes to great britain and they're like, thank god we have a guy who is not going to insult theresa may. he goes & to the g7 -- >> who is not going to keep the queen waiting for 15 minutes. >> or walk in front of the queen. and then the g7. >> and you mentioned the european union. and i think that bit of the trip was slightly overlooked. the european union is critical

to america on a lot of fronts. it's the european union that is dealing with china. it's the european union that is dealing with russia. it's the european union dealing with climate change. a hugely important partner for the united states at the moment. and biden gets that because he knows. because he has a team around him who knows stuff. i remember having a meeting with jared kushner early on in the trump administration and kushner saying to me, well, we think we can fix middle east peace because my father-in-law is a great negotiator because of the character of the guy. the hubris in it, in a sense, the absurdity in it. biden's team don't operate like that. yes, he likes personal relationships, but he knows how to get things done. coming up, our next guest says president biden made it clear to vladimir putin that the u.s. has a very different president than the one he met three years ago. former secretary of state madeline albright joins the conversation next on "morning joe." joins the conversation next on "morning joe.

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questions today about human rights, he said the reason why he's cracking down on opposition leaders is because he doesn't want something like january 6th to happen in russia and he also said he doesn't want to see groups formed like black lives matters. what's your response to that, please? >> that's a ridiculous comparison. it's one thing for literally criminals to break through cordoned, go into the capitol, kill a police officer and be held accountable than it is for people objectively marching on the capital saying you are not allowing me to speak freely. >> president biden reekt v reacting to a false equivalence from vladimir putin. joining us now, former secretary of state madeleine albright. by the way, she was on the

inaugural forbes 50 over 50 list which celebrates women achieving tremendous accomplishments and making their biggest impact over the age of 50. secretary albright was appointsed to be the nation's first female of state and she continues her work today of spreading democracy through the world through her books, organizations and public service. congratulations for being on the list. >> she also puts up with brzezinski. >> so she's a very tough woman. a good one to ask how president biden biden did. >> madam secretary, i'm curious what your thoughts were about yesterday's summit. >> well, i thought it was a fascinating and really kind of a master class in diplomacy. because i think there is nobody that has been better prepared for dealing with some -- in this kind of a situation than

president biden. he is somebody who has had an incredible amount of experience and he knows very much the importance of bilateral diplomacy, that it is a way to make some judgments about the person sitting across the table from you and also understanding the importance of being prepared for a meeting and then also something that people need to know is you have to put yourself into the shoes of the person sitting across the table. so you know who you are and you know what they were. and so i think it was a very, very important summit. and then, frankly, based on what i think was a brilliant run up to it in terms of the multi lateral part of it, the partners and you guys have been talking about this, of being in london and then in brussels and meeting with the g7 and with nato and the eu, and so we and president biden was not alone in that meeting. putin was alone.

and i really do think it was a very important summit. and now we've got to figure out what the result of it is. because it just put things on the table very clearly and made some very serious assignments about working groups and that it is not based on trust. so some very, very important points were made. >> secretary albright, some have argued the existence of the summit was a win for vladimir putin to be elevated on the stage and to get that photograph with the president of the united states. we talked to secretary clinton on this show yesterday morning and we were discussing her memo from 2013 to the white house at the time of president obama that said don't give vladimir putin what he wants which is this elevation and this stage and this international attention and recognition. so how do you as a lifelong diplomate, how do you balance those things of we need to engage with people like vladimir

putin without elevating him too much. >> well, i think that putin has to wonder what he got out of the summit. he was basically dealing with his own audience, frankly, and that's what his press conference was about. i think that the way that the relationship with the russians and the soviets has been described over the years is one where we are rivals, where we are on the same stage, whether we want to be or not. and so i think it's impossible to have that kind of bilateral diplomacy without actually being in the room. so i think that it was a given. i don't think it's a win for putin. i do think that it is an important summit that is just the beginning of a lot of contacts. and so those who think we shouldn't have met, i would have been willing to say that trump is the one that shouldn't have met. but i think this was a very useful summit for us. >> secretary albright, there

were a few areas of agreement yesterday, ambassadors will return to each nation's capital, working on the next arms control treaty, but a lot was done behind closed doors, president biden delivering messages about things like cyber hacking, election interference, and about alexi navalny, the opposition leader there. what do you think how that went down in terms of the warnings that president biden gave president putin, what actions could the u.s. take if putin does not change his disruptive behavior and continues along those avenues? >> well, i do think that part of the way this is being looked at is what are the counter actions. and i think that was very interesting because according to what i heard, there was a red line drawn in terms of the cyber activity, that we would respond. and this list of 16 very

important areas that he cannot go into. but i do think that we have to be clear of laying down the line and then sorting out where we're going with it. i think the really it's important to keep in mind that president biden clearly has put a time limit on some of this and is looking for action, looking for areas where we must cooperate. and that was definitely on the nuclear issues and a strategic stability of some kind. but then also pointing out the ridiculousness of the new what abouts and being very clear about where we are and i do think that -- and i would like to spend a little bit of time thinking about this, that the real important issue here is that we need to determine with our allies the whole issue of cyber hybrid warfare that has been going on. it is a new area. it needs to be explored.

it needs to be really pushed back on and it is something that we must do with our allies in terms of rules of the game. because one of the things that president biden was so clear about was the importance of international norms, of activities that abide by some kind of rules and frankly the cyber area is still open territory in terms of analyzing where this goes. and so there are things that we have to keep watching and not operate on the basis of trust, but on actions and from what i can tell, president biden laid down some very direct points and then also pointed out that there had to be work to be done. >> madam secretary, you have focused quite a bit on china as a serious problem, frankly, for the united states going forward. we heard president biden talk about the importance to everyone but particularly to him of

personal relationships with other leaders with whom he has to work. at what point do you think president biden should hold a similar meeting, praps perhaps, with president xi of china? >> well, he has had a lot of meetings with president xi. and i think that they really do know each other. but i think at some point, there's no question that the relationship with china is the key one. and since we have been awol abroad for the last four years, they have filled a vacuum. and they have policies that are detrimental to what we want. and i do think that part of the other issues in the build up meetings that president biden had with our partners, there was more and more discussion about the importance of operating together, about how china should be regarded and how we deal with it. i actually do believe in personal meetings, especially if you have somebody that is as

capable and really assesses the situation as president biden. but it has to be based on what is going on. we have an awful lot to do with china in terms of the issues that he's been talking about, the human rights, was been happening with the uighurs in taiwan and hong kong. and then also issues to do with what is happening in the south china seas. but i think it's very useful and i think -- i hope the lesson has come out of this is that it's better to go in there, have any meeting with the partners that also need to be a part of the policy. and i think from what i can tell that happened in those run up meetings with our partners. there was a lot of discussion about how to deal with china together. >> jonathan lamere, you asked the question about opposition leader alexei navalny who remains in prison and let's take a look at that now. >> what do us would happen if open is it sigz leader alexi

navalny dies? >> i made it clear to him that i believe the consequences of that would be devastating for russia. i'll go back to the same point. what do you think happens when he's saying it's not about hurting navalny, all the stuff he says to rationalize the treatment of navalny, and then he dies in prison? i pointed out to him that it matters a great deal. >> i wonder, madam secretary, what you think the consequences to that potential should be, what they would look like. >> well, i think that we need to keep raising the issue of navalny and opposition groups. that is something that we have done in the past and needs to be on the agenda. i think that we need to keep an eye and the public attention on it. the thing that is clearer and clearer, to me, and i hope to

others, is that putin is operating in a delusional world that he has created for himself. he is a former kgb agent. this press conference and all his activity in these meetings was for his own audience. he needs to keep building himself up and navalny is seen as a threat. and we just need to make clear that it has to be in the public image that we need to keep raising it and then we have made difference already in the past with the magninski act and looking to see what the effect of how he treats navalny and the opposition, what relationship that has to our -- to the way we operate and to be talking about the norms of human rights and what we believe in. >> former secretary of state madeleine albright, thank you very much for being on the show this morning. >> it's great to have you on. thank you so much, madam

secretary. >> great to owner her on the -- >> and i also know how to spell brzezinski. >> unlike many others. >> you are in the minority of that one. >> thank you very much. and also stay tuned as forbes and know your value is just getting started with these lists. in going through the more than 10,000 nominations received for the inaugural 50 over 50 list, we found so many powerful stories of women who are using these years to pay it forward. and that we're launching now the next list, which is the impact list. it will be announced on july 7th, highlighting women over 50, making a difference in nonprofits, social entrepreneurship, law, policy and education. go to forbes and know your value.com to learn more. so, jonathan, you look at most of the reviews of biden and it's pretty positive.

"the wall street journal" rightly says that the putin crosses a line, he's going to have to respond. the united states is not always responded in the past when putin has crossed that line. we didn't respond when syria crossed the line. biden has laid this out. we think it was a successful summit. certainly around this table. others believe it was a successful summit. but the real test as far as the russian part of this comes when the line is crossed by putin and how does biden respond. >> that's right. i think in terms of the allies all week, with some disagreements behind the scenes about how to handle china going forward, germany and others are much more interested in being trading partners with china than perhaps the united states is. but we won't know if in yesterday was a success until months from now. and biden made clear, he put on the table, there will be

consequences. that's the word he kept using. the stakes are high and there are consequences if putin keeps up with this destructive behavior. will there be follow through if the russian president does? >> he'll talk about how he can't control other people's behavior, but you can control your own. biden has done very well lining up our allies in a way they haven't been lined up in quite some time. but he can't control what vladimir putin does. >> nope. >> that said, the burden is on him and the united states to respond appropriately if he crosses that line. >> it is. i think one of the unique challenges from the a political super speculative is this cyber warfare is so behind the scenes and it will be hard to communicate what's been done. so in the event putin says i'm going to test this, test what we did here, joe biden could respond the way he threatened in the meeting and none of us may ever know about it. i think that's the challenge. >> we shall see. up next, voters rank the top issues facing america and it

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fewer asthma attacks. nucala is a once-monthly add-on injection for severe eosinophilic asthma. not for sudden breathing problems. allergic reactions can occur. get help right away for swelling of face, mouth, tongue, or trouble breathing. infections that can cause shingles have occurred. don't stop steroids unless told by your doctor. tell your doctor if you have a parasitic infection. may cause headache, injection-site reactions, back pain, and fatigue. ask your doctor about nucala. find your nunormal with nucala. let's turn to some new poll numbers from georgetown university politics. it's a battleground poll showing voters rating political division as one of the top issues facing the country. 32% of respondents rank

political polarization as one of their top two issues and 25% name government spending their first or second biggest concern. this as 69% of voters say they prefer a politician who's willing to work together to get things done, even if that means compromising on their values. joining us now, executive director of georgetown's institute of politics and public service, mo alaythe and also kurt bardella. gentlemen, good morning to both of you. mo, what jumps out to you as you look through these numbers? >> a couple of things. first, as you said, it is the number one issue, political division is the number one issue. one of the few things that seems to unify us right now is that point. it is the number one or number two concern whether you're a democrat or republican, whether you are male or female, black or

white. it transcends almost every divide. that division is the single biggest issue driving the country. secondly, when given the choice between a politics who will compromise on my values a bit in order to get results versus a politician who refuses to compromise at the risk of no results, it's not a contest. results are the key. people wanting and expect compromise if it's going to get results. beyond that, there's not a lot that unifies us. we got some strong headwinds ahead of us. people are very pessimistic about the level of division in our country. they don't necessarily agree on who to blame. they don't necessarily agree on the solutions out of it. but when given the choice, if washington listens to that message about trying to find

compromise in order to get results, i think people will start to turn a corner on this issue. >> so this was a bipartisan poll, kurt. in fact, ed goaz who polled for me with the terrance group, he said voerlts are troubled by the division in this country and given a choice, they prefer solutions. that's a guy that's been a republican pollster for decades. and that is showing up in democratic polling and republican polling. >> it's do you let the perfect be the enemy of the good. do you let devout partisanship and ideological entrenchment stop you from getting something good. this infrastructure is the perfect example of this coming to life. for democrats, the question they have to answer is if there is a compromise, bipartisan support that may not be everything they want, are they going to let the left tank it? ultimately, the american people just want to see that the policies are being enacted,

things are being done, that there's actual result. there's tangible benefit in their real day-to-day lives. as long as that's the case, democrats need to run on successes in 2022 if they want to hold the majority and keep the midterms the way they want to go. otherwise if you tank it, if infrastructure doesn't happen, you have nothing to show for it and that poll will prove to be right. people will free frustrated and the voters won't trust you. >> and what kurt just said, joe manchin repeats 20 times a day, which is don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good. >> he says that over and over and over again. you know, i think that there is a sense as well that the biden administration or at least the joe biden and, john, i know you were out on the trail too, the joe biden that campaigned was campaigning on this idea of results. of saying, okay, yes, they talk about bipartisanship, yes, that means ideally republicans support it. but he's looking at all these

numbers and saying what i need to do is deliver. i need to get something done here. i think that also explains why republicans are at the table in this case. why did they start to move once progressives started to get antsy? all of a sudden we have a framework that works for republicans because they also know they'll be punished if they're viewed as obstructionists and standing in the way at every turn. >> from day one they have been pointing to two sets of polls. one is how popular by partisanship is and how popular a lot of joe biden's proposals were if republican voters. the covid relief bill not not a single supportive vote on the hill. that's the framework they have been working for. they want to get something done. biden, he campaigned as being bipartisan but also by being a deal maker. not in the trumpian sense but actual how to craft legislation and getting it through and getting support from both sides which is why they keep coming to the table. now that you have some republican buy-in perhaps on this infrastructure bill, the

president has been patient with, too much so for some democrats' tastes, but he feels they might have to get this done because they might have to go party line the rest of the way. >> mo, you understand how this works as well or better than us. it seems there's a disconnect. the polls show the american people support joe biden's agenda, 65%, 63%, on three of the main issues we brought up earlier today. the question is can democrats do the blocking and tackling? can they do the knocking on the doors? can they do the phone calling? can they do the hundreds and thousands of town hall meetings to get that point across or are they going to get beat by slogans again in 2022? >> well, i think the polling shows some opportunity and challenges for both parties but democrats are actually in a pretty good spot right now. even despite the historical headwinds that they might face. republicans maintain a small

edge on economic issues. small being the key point. they usually have a much bigger edge. but democrats hold a much larger edge on issues like health care and on issues like race and bringing the country together. republicans right now have a 29% approval rating in the congress. democrats are about 45%. and what is also really interesting, while democrats are unified behind democrats in congress, republican voters are much more divided. they have a much higher disapproval rating amongst republicans. the division is real within the republican party. you're not seeing that division within the democratic party. if democrats can continue to drive home the we can get things done message, we can get results message, and if they can keep that margin on economic issues tight, they're in a really good spot headed into the midterms. >> all right, mo, as always,

thank you for being on. some absolutely fascinating findings. we greatly appreciate it. before we close up, two things. first of all, prayers for republican governor tom ridge. a great governor, a great guy. we're thinking and praying about him. also congratulations to president joe biden and his wife. their 44th anniversary today. final thoughts. >> i thought that it was a great trip for the president. he showed once again that american leadership is back center stage and this is a global community that can now look to the united states for leadership, for moral leadership and that will do what they say and stand by it. >> kasie, final thoughts? >> i might have to be a red sox fan with you guys this season after last night's performance. >> be true to your school. be true to your school. >> i know. i'm anti-yankee. sorry, willie. >> that's all that matters. >> jonathan lemire. >> obviously, welcome aboard. go sox.

but i would say this to your point. i think this was a successful overseas trip but you've got to hit the ground running. there's a lot of pressure on infrastructure and he faces a very uncertain future. he has to immediately pivot back to issues at home. >> he does have to pivot. i think this summer will be the setup. people need to get ready for a very, very busy fall on capitol hill. i think they're going to be racing towards the finish line. >> they're going to have to because they might not have power in six months. >> that does it for us this morning. stephanie ruhle picks up the coverage right now. hi there, i'm stephanie ruhle live from msnbc headquarters here in new york city. it is thursday, june 17th. let's get smarter. this morning, that massive, historic summit is on the books. president biden back at the white house and the ball is squarely in vladimir putin's court. bo t