good evening, everyone. we begin the second hour of the reedout tonight with a grim kmem raegs. tomorrow marks six months since the insurrection. the day donald trump incited a mob onto our capitol, hunting for the vice president and the speaker of the house, intended to capture and assassinate elected officials. they built a gallows and chanted "hang mike pence." this also means we are six months into a vast republican undertaking to gaslight the american people into memory holding what went down on that horrible day, a day president joe biden has described as the worst attack on our democracy since the civil war. we've heard republicans down play and even flat out deny the violence that left five people

dead. we've heard republicans, including their dear leader himself, turn the rioters into victims and martyrs, even as video showed them beating police. we heard congressional republicans like andrew clyde even describe k it as, quote, a normal tourist video, and then widely reject a bipartisan commission to investigate the attack. what is also emerged in the past six months is a clearer picture of what happened on january 6th thanks to the government's have you had yo evidence released at the request of nbc news and other organizations. some of that new video shows police trying to rotate fresh officers to the frontlines of the siege. >> slowly, guys. we're rotating out. we've got a shield behind you. you go behind me. you, come here. go, go. you, go.

>> ladies and gentlemen, back up! >> joining me now is scott mcfarland, investigative reporter for nbc washington, michelle dean, nbc columnist. scott, i want to start with you. you've been going through and pouring through these cases against these insurrectionists, the people who were part of this siege, what are you learning that brings together what we now know about who these people were and why they say they were there? >> hey, joy, good evening. they're from all walks of life. in the last few days it's becoming increasingly clear if we're on a journey here legally we're still closer to the starting line than the finish line. our latest count is 516 federally charged accused

insurrectionists. there could be hundreds more. by my count about 2% of the cases -- 2% -- have got ton a plea agreement, and just one solitary case has gone to sentencing. so, there's a journey still to be made here. there are three large group of defendants all accused of being parts of far right groups, the oath keepers, the proud boys and the three percenters, all accused of conspiracy, of plotting, planning, coming ready for action january 6th. those cases largely are in their infancy, but the oath keepers, that stands out joy. the feds have had early victories there. they've secured three plea agreement, all three of whom have agreed to help with the investigation, to flip. and the prosecutors said there are good discussions underway with the rest of them. >> and just to be clear, scott, have we discerned any ties yet

to lawmakers, because we do still have ally alexander who is still missing out in the world. we don't know he's been captured that we know of. and he named lawmakers as having been part of it. and we just had lawmakers doing a tour of the border with one of the people who stormed the capitol, one of the people who are friendly with marjorie taylor greene. have any of those connections been made in court? >> the nbc team here has read through the thousands of court filings, every one of them. not iteration, not one mention of a member of congress by name or otherwise. here's what we can tell you. we mentioned the oath keepers. they're flipping. they're helping the feds. bhuf defendants flip, it's because they're going to flip bigger fish. right now in terms of the charges, the oath keepers are the big fish. so, the provocative question is who are they going to turn over or what are they going to turn over to the prosecutors?

>> indeed. and michelle, the thing about these groups, the proud boys, i would say stand out particularly as an organization that "washington post" and other reporters have talked about as law enforcement looking the other way when they were around as having weirdly cozy relationships going into this siege with lawmakers. we've got people in the oath keepers who were doing things like providing security for people like roger stone who were around the former president. other than the three percenters who are essentially a radical organization, do you feel it's inevitable we're going to have to talk about elected officials as we talk about these cases. >> i think one elected official we should be talking about right now is paul gosar who did a number of rallies with ally alexander, seems to have been quite close to him, is also, we know, close to the white nationalist refusing to disavow that association, even though this isn't sort of nudge, nudge,

wink, wink, white nationalism. it is unapologetic. actually far worse than anything steve king said except the center of ogravity in the republican party has moved so far right that where they would have once expelled steve king in order to preserve, you know, what they thought was their image, now they sort of come to accept that people like marjorie taylor greene and paul gosar are part of their image. so, yes, i think that -- i think it's no secret, anybody could have seen the rally that preceded this insurrection. they could have seen the people saying, including the president of the united states, we're going to march on the capitol. i guess the question is whether the coordination went even beyond the already kind of quite shocking level of coordination that we've seen. >> indeed. you know, benito mussolini

wasn't leading the shirts either. we've got to start confronting fascism. when you marry political violence to supreme loyalty to one leader in a willingness and attempt to overthrow the government, who this core believes ought to be in charge and on top in whatever the social configuration is, i can't avoid that. you've gone even further than that and talked about the fact that we've got to start talking about terrorism. as you've said this has all the hallmarks of an al quaeda-like leadership. bin laden wasn't on the planes either. >> i love you're not intimidated by using the ford fascism. by explaining it, we understand it's not hyperbolic. the gop is not a political party. it's a white nationalist movement. it means undemocratic means plus

violence. that's what we're seeing. to your other point, christopher wray has testified under oath before congress. he didn't use the word insurrection. he said this was an act of domestic terrorism. that's the fbi director. that's the words we should be using. january 6th was an act of domestic terrorism. it's two plus two equals four stuff. ashli babbitt, all these who attacked the capitol are terrorists because the fbi director said it's an act of terrorism. if the islamic cleric said the election was fraud, stop the steal, i want my supporters to go to washington and stop the steal, and those muslims attacked the capitol, are you telling me that cleric would not be charged with incitement? donald trump would be screaming for that islamic cleric to be charged. in what nation can a man incite a terrorist attack on our capitol, radicalize people for

two months and his punishment is he's off facebook for two months. now he's defending the terrorists. intellectually it's very hard to understand what's going on nour country right now that we're not using the term, not just fascist, terrorist. you're either with us or you're with the terrorists. it is that clear. >> to underscore that. we did have white supremacists march in philadelphia the day before the july 4th celebration and free to do so. the enemy of the far right are antifa, meaning anti-fascist. so, they are anti-anti-fascist by their own anglo-saxen caucus. there does seem to be an attempt to make ashli babbitt into the new kyle rittenhouse, make her into a martyr.

we do a lot of stuff on policing here and there are a lot of police who are a problem. this police officer was not a problem. he defended the lives of cowering, terrified members of congress, who if ashli babbitt who was a trained air force specialist to kill -- she was a military member -- if she had gotten through that door, god knows what kind of harm she could have done. what do you make of this attempt to turn her into a martyr? >> i think it's -- you know, there was a moment right after this insurrection when it was so raw and the revulsion against it was so intense that you saw even republicans in congress or republicans writ large wanting to distance themselves from it. and now i think they have a double think about it, right, because it's almost like holocaust deniers. it didn't happen and if it did, they deserved it. you have a significant number of republicans. there was a recent morning consult poll. there's a significant chunk of republicans who believe it was

antifa who stormed the capitol. there's a slight majority of republicans who blame democrats in congress for the insurrection at least for inciting the insurrection, which makes no sense whatsoever. and the number of republicans who blamed donald trump, who believed this movement was representative of trump's movement has declined quite a bit in the last six months. so, again, you sort of have republicans of two minds. on the one hand they want to disavow it and distance themselves and pretend they had nothing to do with it. but at the same time this martyrology around ashli babbitt is immensely telling that really their hearts are with the insurrectionists and they think what they were trying to do -- donald trump certainly thinks what they were trying to do -- was good and just. the only problem was that it didn't succeed. >> dean, you now have a of republicans who filed to run in 2022 echoing the very big lie that brought those very people to the capitol. do you think that democrats -- i

asked this in the previous hour. i'll ask it again. are democrats alarmed enough about this? this ter identifies me. i don't know if they're alarmed enough about it. >> no. they should be watching your show every night, joy, to understand the stakes and understand how to frame this. it's about framing. democrats don't grasp the fierce urgency of now. martin luther king talked about it with voting and civil rights. we're talking about democracy sustaining, prevailing and enduring. those are the stakes right now. the gop, they're not fearful of donald trump. they agree with trump. they're at his rallies cheering. you have people interviewed afterwards saying if trump is not reinstated there will be a civil war. i don't hear republicans denouncing those people. we've got a switch where january 6th was an act of terrorism incited by donald trump. begging democrats to use a term -- we're in the 9/11 twenty

year anniversary. democrats are not doing a good jofb making it clear this can't be politics as normal in our nation. >> and i should note for our audience that bennie thompson who's the head of this new commission was on with ally this weekend. he was asked when he was prepared to subpoena the former president. he's prepared to subpoena anyone. jim clyburn who is the house majority whip has said that he wouldn't like to see a former president testify but if it comes to that he would be down with it. let's go back -- i want to end on the legal cases with you, scott. what should we be looking for. you noted 516 total cases. is there a commonality that gives us a sense of where they're going. my question is flipping people to what end? are we talking now about essential naming these three groups, the oath keepers, the proud boys and the three percenters in essence as domestic terrorist groups because they seem to be the

focus. >> flipping to one end is, we haven't seen people flipped and named in new cases. the fbi director said there are hundreds more investigations in addition to those who are already charged, leaving open th arrests. but i want to add one point. we talk about january 6th. this hour is the sixth-month anniversary of what happened at 7:00 p.m. d.c. time january 5th. somebody left live active pipe bombs january 5th. there have been no arrests or suspects detailed in that case. >> that is another open thing. that and the ally alexander missing in ax, where the hell is this guy. we need more than just a commission. we need a lot more to find out what happened. scott mcfarland, thank you so much. michelle and dean, you are both great. up next, did donald trump just admit to the serious charges facing his company? that would be dumb, right? but didn't he just do that?

plus texas republicans decide that a history museum -- get this -- is no place for a discussion of texas history, absolutely not. and the growing outrage over the suspension of sha'carri richardson, if it's a dumb rule, why not just change it right now. "the reidout" continues after this. reidout" continues after this how can i handle one more thing? you can stay on track and be cured in only 8 weeks with mavyret. you can keep your momentum with mavyret. before starting mavyret your doctor will test if you've had hepatitis b which may flare up and cause serious liver problems during and after treatment. tell your doctor if you've had hepatitis b, a liver or kidney transplant, other liver problems, hiv-1, or other medical conditions, and all medicines you take. don't take mavyret with atazanavir or rifampin, or if you've had certain liver problems. if you've had or have serious liver problems other than hep c, there's a rare chance they may worsen. signs of serious liver problems may include yellowing of the skin, abdominal pain or swelling, confusion, and unexplained bleeding or bruising.

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disgraced, twice impeached former president was back out there over the holiday weekend on his revenge tour just days after his company and ceo allen weisselberg were indicted for a tax scheme. a caveat -- we're playing sound of this guy. we're going to do it tonight because he admitted it. >> they go after good hardworking people for not paying taxes on a company car. company car. you didn't pay tax on car.

or a company apartment. you used an apartment because you need an apartment because you have to travel too far where your house is. you didn't pay tax. or education for your grandchildren. i don't even know. do you have to -- does anybody know the answer to that stuff? okay. but they indict people for that. >> apparently trump still trumps like marilyn monroe, breathily and weirdly. but he was following the lead of his two adult fail sons, don jr. and what's his name, saying what's the big deal. >> crime is rampant, people are leaving the city in record numbers, it's dirty, it's disgusting. new york is no longer what it is, and they have an entire district attorney office and attorney general's office that's focused on $3.5 million to take down a political opponent. this is a farce. it's a disgrace they spent millions of dollars and years

instead of prosecuting murderous thugs on the streets of new york, they go after their political enemies. >> unfortunately people dodge taxes all the time and this is unfair. it is actually not a solid argument in a court of law, sorry. and according to "the washington post," the trump organization provided a road map for its own indictment, keeping internal spreadsheets detailing the payments that were being hidden. prosecutors detailed the spreadsheets as the county equivalent of a confession. joining me now investigative reporter for the "new york times." joyce, i love the fact they essentially wrote their own indictment with spreadsheets. your thoughts. >> well, this is an absolutely fascinating sort of commentary tour for the top executives at the trump organization to be making right now. of course they haven't been indicted yet. allen weisselberg is the one who's indicted in this particular indictment at least so far. but it's hard to figure that

there aren't criminal defense lawyers for any number of people who have been out there just face palming as they hear this sort of commentary. you know, what you expect from the owner of a company when there is an indictment like this is to deny the conduct occurred or express outrage. this sort of approach saying, gee, it's not much of a crime, is it, is really unusual and probably won't play well if it ever has to play in a courtroom. >> it's sort of like i only rob the five and dime argument. it's not like a rob a rich company like walmart. that doesn't help you if you rob the five and dime. this is one of the things that trump argued. never before -- never before -- has new york city and their prosecutors or any prosecutors criminally charged a company or person for fringe benefits. leon na hams lee's ghost would like to have a word. she was convicted on tax

benefits including renovation on her connecticut estate. joyce, just to be clear, thugs do get process kutd for this in new york and elsewhere. >> people do get prosecud for tax evasion in both state and federa before, right, this notion of not an important crime. people don't get prosecuted for this is like an instant preplay of what happened during the mueller investigation when trump dismissed obstruction of justice as a process crime. oh, it's not something that people should worry about. so, here he is again appealing to the court of public opinion thinking that somehow that will help him with federal prosecutors. and while that might have worked for someone who was cloaked in the protection of the presidency, it will be very interesting to see if public outrage by his base will have any impact on what is now the indictment of allen weisselberg.

i shouldn't doubt it. >> you're right. you shouldn't in a normal country. the indictment. let me lead a little bit of a quote regarding these spreadsheets. for certain years the trump organization maintained internal spreadsheets that tracked the amounts it paid for weisselberg's rent, utility and garage expenses. weisselberg received the benefit of these payments and trump organization internally tracked and treated many of them as part of his annual compensation, ensuring he was not paid more than his fixed amount of gross compensation. you've had a good look into the the trump tax weird world. is this a common way that the trump organization paid people? is it the tax returns that revealed all this? or literally is it the spreadsheets? >> i think what we're seeing and what the documents in the indictment that we see are very much internal work product of the trump organization. so, we didn't have visibility

into them when we looked at his taxes. but they've got a lot of documents they're putting together. right now these are allegations that are indictment. they may make it into court one day. but any time you hear two sets of books, wow, i think it's not a good starting point. but as journalist you want documents like this was a document-based indictment. and witnesses can be great, but they're unreliable. you know, documents are there and you can't impeach the character of a document. you can argue about it's voracity and debate it, but it's great when you're a prosecutor to go into a case with this many documents, which they seem to have. >> and suzanne, michael cohen, who was on the show last week talked about there being millions of documents -- millions -- that he said just having worked there and being donald trump's lawyer he could say that. and he testified before the grand jury. and i wonder if going through from your view, were michael

cohen and the others, they were essentially compensated with presents. did you find this kind of thing when looking at the internals of the trump organization, particularly the stuff mary trump provided. >> we didn't see so much of that because we had the tax return information. this is now what they actually didn't tell the tax man. but this is -- what it had the effect of doing is just reducing the amount of taxable income the irs could go after. so, you're getting all these perks on the one side. and just the way they're being accounted for is not fully reflecting the taxable income. and i have to say when i heard those remarks on saturday, i heard two things. i heard one thing joy was talking ability which is they're going to try to minimize this and oh yeah but it's small ball. but the other thing i heard which is very interesting and i think it's some of the contours

of the legal defense that you're going to start to see them present which is, you know, he needed an apartment to stay in new york, so we gave him that. these were actually -- some of them were legitimate. i don't think we're going to have an argument where the grandchildren's tuition is. but on some of the bigger issues there are going to be arguments about those should this end in court. >> if you were representing don and eric trump -- not that they would pay you, so you may not want to be their lawyer. would you advise them to keep talking? it does seem the trump organization a family business. one might assume if you read mary trump's book, donald trump and his father were in a habit of living in this apartment for free or cheap. if you were don or eric, would you talk on tv or advise them to talk if you were their lawyer? >> you know, if i was in the position of being their lawyer, joy, i would give them the same

advice that i would give them to anybody else who's under investigation in a criminal case. don't go out in public and run your mouth. if you're going to talk with prosecutors or investigators, do it with your lawyer present or better yet through your lawyer with you not being in the room. this is just really insanity. but you have to wonder does this signify that they believe that they are so untouchable that they can get away with anything, that they really believe by catering to the court of public opinion they can outrun the courts of the state of new york? it is really baffling to see this kind of conduct. >> if i had to guess, i would guess the answer to that is yes. they do believe that. the dad got away with it. donald trump has gotten away with it his entire life. they probably do believe that. we'll see how it plays out. thank you both very much. remember the alamo? well, texas republicans want you to remember it as they remember it in their bedtime stories, not the way it went down.

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okay. you know how republicans love to rage against censorship and cancel culture? they don't actually walk it like they talk it. tack a look at what's happening in texas. state republicans like greg abbott forced the abrupt cancellation at a history museum because they didn't like what the book says. "forget the alamo" examines the role slavery played leading up to the battle of the alamo. this triggered the fragility of the republican leaders who happened to be on the board of the museum. abbott didn't have courage to

publicly condemn free speech but his deputy carried the bag. patrick said, i told staff to cancel this oons i heard it was happen. the texas state history museum was no place for history. yee haw. join me now, coauthor of "forget the alamo." i have to read your response to dan patrick because i retweeted a comment on it and literally dm me and come on my show. that is one of the reasons you are here. i need to book you immediately. you wrote that lieutenant governor dan patrick takes credit for oppressing free speech and policing thought in texas. a dozen people historians

disagree. and #forgetthealamo. please tell us how the story with the book event got scheduled and then cancelled. >> well, the board reached out to us as soon as they found out we were doing this book. we had spoken to their program manager months in advance. once we had the publication date of june 8th, we talked to them again. they said, yes, we want you here. we had a lot of demand for speaking, including from the writers league of texas. we thought let's do an event. we're going to do it virtually anyway. the bullet said okay, we'll supply the website. we'll register the attendees and we'll make this happen. then a right wing extremist group called the texas public policy foundation starts tweeting about it. they are particularly incensed by the content of our book. so, we checked in with the

bullet, and they were like, no problem, we've done controversial stuff before. beside it is "wall street journal" had an smu homeland security history talk about how great your book is. he said all this stuff about slavery is old news. the most interesting part is the modern part of our book. and then the lieutenant governor drops the hammer. he either calls up the and as no you've got to pull up, we get a call from our publisher. this is off. riders league of texas says we can scramble. we can get you on a zoom call. there's not enough time. and that's why i went to twitter. >> that was a wise thing to do. in this modern age, the thing to do is go public. are you going to be able to discuss your book. i know texas has put in this thing called the 1836 project, creating a nine-member committee

to promote patriotic education, patriotic history. they want to hurt the way historical events are taught. essentially they have to be taught in a way as geography of texas history, not a real history. are you going to be allowed to discuss this book in the state of texas? >> well, i mean, clearly, i'm standing in texas. i'm talking to you. we're hoping to do some book events at private bookstores, but i've got real questions about how far this ban goes. am i banned from state universities? the texas book festival is held on state property every year. i'm on the board of advisers, am i not able to discuss my book there. i've got a lot of questions for governor patrick and we're talking to attorneys who have questions too about his attitude toward the first amendment. >> the first amendment is supposed to prevent government from pressuring americans on the basis of their speech or

intervening in the use of free speech. so, that seems like a pretty straightforward case. let's talk about your book itself. what is the premise of the book that is so terrifying to the old 1836 project folks? >> well, we make the argument that the myths that were taught to people my age and younger, frankly, in texas schools are hurtful to the growing flew ralty of hispanics in texas. it paints a picture of freedom loving angelos fighting against dark skin people. it eliminates slavery play in motivating the this because we point out the inconvenient fact that mexico is a multicultural society that had just overthrone spanish colonial rule trying to

outlaw slavery. the president santa ana said before he crossed the border into texas, i am going to go free the wretched souls held in bondage in texas. and to say those things in texas is apparently -- it's going to get you slapped down. >> yeah, i mean, it's the same way they don't like to talk about the fact that in the war of 1812 the british were offering freedom and land to any enslaved africans who would join the crown's fight against the americans at the time that the british governor of virginia was offering to completely free the slaves through the emancipation proclamation. and do you believe that at this point the goal of the government of texas is to suppress history because part of this 1836 law says they have to give deference to both sides. what would be the deference one could give one side in an argument where slaveholders were fighting a war to hold on to their slaves?

what deference could you give that as a journalist? >> you know, i don't know. that's the problem. this all grew out of a column i wrote about texas needing to rebrand itself. and we cannot have the image of the long, tall, white cowboy fighting and enslaving people of color as our brand anymore. but unfortunately, conservatives, particularly, you know, governor abbott, governor patrick, their identity is caught up in this mythology. governor patrick has a collection of john wayne memorabilia in his office to give you an idea of where his politics are. >> don't read the interview in which john wayne called himself a white nationalist. he might not like that. he might find that not to give deference to both sides. thank you, chris tomlinson. i've already ordered your book. i can't wait to get it and read it. i appreciate you and good luck with the book.

up next more victims are found in surfside, florida, after the remainder of that collapsed condominium was demolished over the weekend. live report is next. s demolished over the weekend. live report is next. welcome to allstate. ♪ ♪ you already pay for car insurance, why not take your home along for the ride? allstate. here, better protection costs a whole lot less. you're in good hands. click or call to bundle today. [peaceful music plays]

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search and rescue efforts resumed today in surfside, florida, after pausing this weekend so crews could demolish the remaining part of the champlain tower south. within the past hour the death toll rose again to 28, as more victims were found in the rubble. 117 remain unaccounted for. joining me now is nbc news correspondent, morgan chess ski. what is the latest? >> yeah, joy, good evening. right now you can see crews staying busy. this is a 24/7 operation here. as you mentioned they are able to go deeper into that rubble

because of the demolition that took place yesterday that officials say was highly successful. the remaining force fell right on top of its current footprint. and just to ensure it didn't compromise the current search efforts, they put a large thick rubber mat over the area they had been searching so any debris fall that direction, they would be able to knock it off and go back to the layer they were working in. as a result of this demolition they've been able to move heavy kmimt inside the interior areas and go into the areas they have not been able to access before. we're now on day 12. i spoke to a fema search and rescue worker today. i said, what do you tell the folks who realize how far we are now regarding a chance of survival. she said, we tell them what we believe, we are holding out hope for a miracle. people are pointing to other instances where people have

survived instances longer in these collapses, but this is absolutely a search and rescue mission right now. they are not calling this a recovery mission just yet. the families of the missing staying at a nearby hotel. they did reach out to get their thoughts on the demolition. they were briefed prior to it taking place. and many of them understand this was just a necessary step in the process to try to go deeper into the pile. we know that as it stands right now about 40% of the debris that's above ground as since been removed and we know that's about 4.8 million pounds of concrete, an incredible job that's already been done but still lays ahead of them and all this with a careful eye on tropical storm elsa, as it churns its way towards florida. while it is expected to go to the western side of the state, there is a concern that a lot lightning and/or wind could pose an issue here. any time a lightning strike happens within two and a half

miles of this area, crews have to pause for 30 minutes before getting back on top of that pile. and they know more than anyone just how precious every second is, joy. >> wow, morgan chess key, really appreciate that. coming up the latest controversy surrounding american athletes of color, the sneaky little racism these athletes are encountering at every turn. next you need an ecolab scientific clean here. and here. which is why the scientific expertise that helps operating rooms stay clean now helps the places you go too. look for the ecolab science certified seal. (realtor) the previous owners left in a hurry, so the house comes with everything you see. . follow me. ♪ (realtor) so, any questions? (wife) we'll take it!

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in an olympic year when black women athletes are posed to become the faces of team usa, gymnast simone biles and jordan chiles and sprinter allyson felix to name just a few, the biggest topic is the star athlete who potentially will not appear at the games. sprinter sha'carri richardson following her one-month suspension after testing

positive for thc, the chemical in marijuana. she told the "today" show she takes full responsibility for her actions. a lot of people are questioning why weed, of all things, which to my knowledge has never made anybody faster, is keeping her out of the games. richardson's punishment comes amid a host of arbitrary rules and criticisms seemingly only directed at black women athletes, including a ban by swimming's governing body of the soul cap. a swim cap designed for natural black hair. and hammer thrower gwen barry, the daughter of an iraq war veteran who's facing calls to be removed from team usa from the maga crowd for protesting the national anthem at the olympic trials. as for sha'carri richardson, fans want to see her run in tokyo. a move on petition has already gotten nearly half a million signatures. joining me is bomani jones.

always good to talk to you. do we have the clip of sha'carri richardson on the "today" show? >> as much as i'm disappointed, i know that when i'm on the track, i represent myself, i represent a community that has shown me great support, great love and so i apologize for the sense that i need to know how to control my emotions, stating here i just say don't judge me because i am human. i'm you. i just happen to run a little faster. >> bomani, her mom had just died. she found out from a reporter. what is going on here? >> well, i mean as far as the suspension itself, it's kind of textbook and hard to get around. if you fail that test in that time when she did, these are what the consequences are. this is not one that i think the drug testing people had the luxury of being able to be like,

okay, let's act like we didn't happen. that was not going to be it. to me it seemed to be an unfortunate confluence of circumstances for her, something incredibly traumatic happened to her and she went to a familiar coping mechanism that happened to have consequences. i don't really feel so much that the suspension she's dealing with is her being picked on. she was about to be the star of the 100-meter dash of this. the look, everything else. she was somebody that nbc was going to put out there and get americans to watch in the olympics. i feel like everybody involved with some measure of power, i don't think there's anybody that likes this as the outcome. >> but here's the thing. the olympic committee seems like they're quite an arbitrary entity and can pretty much do whatever they want. this is a 21-year-old. my youngest child is 21. i can't imagine any of my kids being under this pressure. her mother just passed away. she finds out in an interview with a reporter. she's depressed. it doesn't seem like any of these athletic leagues has any

interest in trying to deal with black women except in a punitive way. am i reading too much into that? >> i don't feel like this is the example of that. i think that there's certainly room for empathy for her. again, i don't think anybody -- when i hear her apology, the worst thing to me is she feels like she has to apologize to us which she does not. there seems to be a lot of understanding about how those things could come together and lead her to where she is. on this one in particular, things are arbitrary but not really with the drug testing policy when it comes in as a dead letter positive. once that happens, i don't know how much flexibility you have. now, you do have examples of other cases where we're talking about somebody that's just too big to fail. lance armstrong, for example, with the corrupt cycling body just threw out positive results for him. but i don't think that the argument is if you throw out lance armstrong's drug test that we've got to do it for everybody. >> hold on. why isn't that the argument? why isn't that the argument?

what was the swimmer's name who also tested positive. brian phelps. it is arbitrary. >> michael phelps -- >> michael phelps. >> michael phelps got hit hitting a bong at a frat party and did not actually test positive and was suspended for longer than sha'carri richardson. i feel like we're trying to make comparisons and it's going into a snowball that i don't think is accurate. i think what's happening to the swim cap is just ridiculous, the idea that nobody has ever done this. y'all have been trying to keep us out of the water for hundreds of years. you don't even wanting us go into the water in the holiday inn. no, you have not seen a swim cap like that. but that and gwen barry, the usoc said they were okay with that measure of protesting. so those are people aligning against people they would align against otherwise. this is a completely separate

situation from each of those which is separate from one another. the common thing in life specifically is being picked on and antagonized by people. i just don't know if you tested positive right at that time if this is the one that speaks to the antagonism against black women, especially in a sport like track and field. that's out there, right? it just so happens that they're going down to a white woman. but generally speaking, it's going to be a black woman that wins the 100-meter dash. the machine has decided we can have the hundred meters. >> sha'carri richardson may be able to compete in the relay and may get a medal if she's allowed to do that. i have to feel and maybe because as a black woman and somebody who has to deal with black hair styles and all of the issues that we have, but the swim team, when you combine the fact that they're literally telling black women you cannot cover your hair in the water the way you need to

to protect it, you're not able to compete. you go into attacks of the daughter of a war veteran saying you can't have a thought or belief about black lives matter. it does feel like an accumulation of arbitrary rules that are being used only against black women. it is ruining my olympics vibe, bomani, and making me not want to watch. i know a lot of people who feel that way. >> i guess to a degree i understand that. like, i can understand how it feels that way for anybody when all of these things come together but i really do think in the three cases we talk about, with gwen barry, i think they are story is more interesting because there's reason to question whether or not they purposely antagonized her by playing the national anthem while she was at a medals stand at an event where they were not playing the national anthem because it's the american olympic trials. they said they played it every day at 5:20 but she was on the medal stand at 5:25. that seemed absolutely like an aggressive play against her and somebody trying to show her up. we'll never know definitively

whether that was the case but that seems 100% to be the case there. so we've got this in some days. it's just hard for me to buy into that. if you can find be a counterexample of somebody else failing a marijuana test and getting to compete. >> the nigerian team they're trying to throw on. bomani jones, thank you for being on. "all in with chris hayes" starts right now. >> tonight on "all in," six months after the attack on democracy, new video, new arrests and new details on the investigation into the capitol insurrection. then, how america missed the biden goal of 70% vaccinations by july 4th. >> the red states probably have a lot of people that, you know, are very, very conservative in their thinking and they think, well, i don't have to do that. but they're not thinking right. plus, the cruelty is the point. adam serwer