good evening good evening everyone. we begin everyone, we begin the the second hour of the second hour of the readout tonight with rideau with the a grand commemoration. grand commit implication. and prevent the peaceful transfer. they descended on to our capital and hunting for the vice president and the speaker of the house attending to capture and assassinate elected officials. they built a gallows and chanted, hang mike pence. this also means that we are six months into a vast republican undertaking. to gaslight the american people into memory holding what went down on the horrible day the day that president biden has described as the worst attack on our democracy since the civil war. we've heard republicans

downplayed and even flat out deny the violence and left five people dead. we've heard republicans and dear leader himself turn the rioters into victims and martyrs. even -- we heard congressional republicans and withdrew clyde describing it as quote and widely reject the bipartisan -- democrats launched in its place. what is also emerged in the last few months is a clear picture of what happened in january six. thanks to the governments video evidence released the request of other news organizations. some of that new video says police trying to rotate officers to the front line of the siege. >> slowly guys. we've got a shield right behind you. you go behind me. you, here. though.

go. go. [noise] ladies and gentlemen, back up. >> joining me now is scott macfarlane, investigative reporter for nbc for washington, michelle goldberg, calmest for the new york times and dean obeidallah, host of the dean obeidallah show on msnbc. thank you all for being here and scott i want to start with you. you've been going through and pouring through these cases against these insurrectionists, the people who are part of the siege. what are you learning that kind of brings together what we now know about who these people were and why they say they were there. >> hey joint, good evening. there are all kinds of people from all walks of life and country but it's becoming increasingly clear that if we're on a journey here legally we're still closer to the starting line than the finish line. our latest count is 516

federally charged, accused insurrectionists. there could be hundreds more. by my count, about 2% of the cases, 2% have gotten to a plea agreement and just one solitary case has gone to sentencing so there is a journey still to be made of where the case is right now. there are three large groups of defendants all accused of being parts of far-right groups. the oath keepers and the proud boys and the three percenters. they are all accused of conspiracy, of the plotting and planning and becoming ready for action january 6th. those cases, largely are in their infancy but the oath keepers stands out join. they won some early victories and won some progress there. they've secured agreements from oath keepers and they've all agreed to help the feds with their investigation to flip. and the prosecutors, joy, said that they're good play discussions underway with the rest of them. >> just to be clear, scott,

have we discerned any ties yet to lawmakers? because we still do have ali alexander, who is still missing out there in the world. we don't know that he's been captured that we now have, but he named lawmakers is having been part of it. and we just had lawmakers doing a tour of the border with one of the people who stormed the capitol. one of the people who is apparently friendly with marjorie taylor greene, a sitting member of congress. i've any of those connections thus far have been made in court? >> here's what we can tell. the nbc news team here it is gone through thousands of court filings. every one of them. not one iteration or mention of congress by name or otherwise but here is what we can tell you. we mentioned the out keepers flipping and helping the feds. typically in federal prosecutions when you have defendants flip it's because they're going to flip bigger fish. here's the thing, join, right now in terms of the charges, the oath keepers are the big fish and the provocative

question is who are they going to turn over or what are they going to turn over to prosecutors? >> yes, indeed. and michelle, the thing about these groups is the proud boys stand up particularly as an organization that washington post and other reporters have talked about as law enforcement looking the other way when they were around as having a cozy relationship between going into the siege with lawmakers. we have people in the oath keepers that were doing things like providing to clarity, for people like roger stone who around the former president. a lot of three percenters who essentially a radical organization. do you feel that it's inevitable until you have to start talking about elected officials as we talk about these cases? >> well i think one elected official we should be talking about right now is paul gosar, who did a number of rallies with ali alexander in seems to have been quite close to him and is also close to that white nationalist --

and is refusing to disavow that association even though this is sort of norwich nudge wink wink nationalism. it's unapologetic. it's actually far worse than anything that stephen king said that the republican party has moved so far right that where they would've won and expelled steve king in order to preserve what they thought was their image, now they sort of come to accept that marjorie taylor greene and paul costar are part of them. so yes, i think that it's no secret. anybody could've seen the rally that preceded the insurrection. they could have seen the people saying and including the president of the united states that were going to march on the capital. i guess the question is whether it's important that the nation one even peons the already kind of quite shocking coordination that we've seen. >> indeed. and we need to celine it wasn't physically leading the brown

shirts to do their attacks either. and i talked in the previous hour about the fact that we've got to start confronting the uncomfortable f-word, fascism, because when you marry political violence to supreme loyalty leader with willingness to attempt to overthrow the government and reinstall that person in the defensive one group of americans, namely white americans, who this court believes ought to be in charge and on top in whatever social configuration there is, i can't avoid that. you've gone even further than that talked about the fact we have to start talking about terrorism because as you said this has all the hallmarks of sort of an out canada like leadership. bin laden wasn't on the planes, either. >> joy, first of all i love that you're not timid about using the word fascism because people have to know what that means. a lot of people just don't know what it means. it's not a common usage of the term. by explaining what it's really about, we understand it's not hyperbole. the gop is not a political

party. it's a white nationalist movement that embraces fascism which means that other democratic means plus violence is wet we're seeing. christopher wray the fbi director has testified under oath for congress he use the word insurrection and said that this was an act of, quote, domestic terrorism. that's the fbi and that is the words we should be using. january six was an act of to make this domestic terrorism. the supporters that he attacked the capital are terrorists it's two plus two equals four stuff. those who attacked the capital are terrorists because they say it's an act of terrorism. joy, if an islamic terrorists after two months said that the election was fraud, stop the steal, i want all my supporters to go to washington and stop the steal and those muslims attacked the capital, are you telling me that cleric would not be charged with incitement? donald trump would be screaming for that islamic clarification chart. and world can a man and site --

radicalize for months and have no punishment while playing golf and spreading the same lies that radicalize people. the first to rallies after january 6th. the last two saturdays in a row and now he's defending the terrorists. intellectually, this is hard for me to understand what's going on in our country right now that we're not using the term fascism, terrorism. you're either with us or you're with the terrorists. is that clear? >> you know and to underscore that, michelle, we did have white supremacists actually march in philadelphia the day before the july 4th celebration and freely do so. the enemy of the far-right and their own words are antifa, meaning anti fascists which is anti-, anti-fascist by their own reckoning which is the thing to be. there's been this attempts to create an anglo-saxon caucus that got spoiled because that got out. it becomes really difficult. i want to ask you about this ashli babbitt thing because there seems to be an attempt to

make her the new martyr. and we do a lot of stuff on policing here. and there are a lot of police who are a problem. this police officer was not a problem. he defended the lives of terrified members of congress who if ashli babbitt, who was an air force specialist trained by air force specialists was trying to kill. if you got through that door, who knows what kind of harm she could've done. one of you make of this attempt to turn her into a martyr? >> i think there was a moment right after this insurrection that was so raw and the revulsion against it was so intense and you saw even republicans, and republicans in congress but also republicans at large wanting to distance themselves from it. and now i think they have sort of a double think about it and it's almost like holocaust. it didn't happen, and if it did, they deserved it. you know, you have a significant number of republican so it's a recent

warning consul poll. there is a decent amount who still believe it was antifa who stormed the capitol. there's a slight majority of republicans who blamed democrats in congress for the insurrection at least for inciting the insurrection which makes no sense whatsoever. and a number of republicans who play donald trump who believes that this movement was representative of trump's movement has declined quite a bit in the last six months and so again you have republicans who have two minds. on the one hand, they want to disavow it and distance themselves and pretend they had nothing to do with it but at the same time this martyr all itchy is immensely telling that their hearts are with the insurrectionists and think that what they were trying to do and what donald trump thinks that they were trying to do is good and just and the only problem with it is that they didn't succeed. >> yes, indeed you now have a third of republicans who filed to run in 2022 echoing the very

big lie that brought those very people to the capital. do you think that democrats -- i asked this in the previous hour, i'll ask it again. are democrats alarmed enough about this? this terrifies me. i don't know if they're alarmed enough about it. >> no, they should be watching your show every night, joy, to know the stakes and how to frame this. it's about framing. democrats don't grasp the urgency of now. marlin king talked about it with voting and civil rights. we're talking about our democracy and sustaining and prevailing and enduring going forward. those are the stakes right now. the gop are not fearful of donald trump. they agree with trump. they're at his rallies cheering. you have people being interviewed afterward saying if he's not reinstated that base of a war. i don't hear republicans announcing this people. so we have a situation where democrats should be out there saying the january six was an act of terrorism. you're either was or against us and backing democrats to use the term or that 9/11 20th year

anniversary. use that language. it's visceral. terrorism moves people. insurrection is more intellectual. democrats are not the doing a good job of making clear that this can't be politics in our nation. >> yes, i should note for our audience that benny tom who is an our commission was asked if he was prepared to subpoena the former president he said he's prepared to subpoena anyone based on the facts and circumstances. jim clyburn, who was the house majority whip has said that he wouldn't like to see a former presidents testify but if it comes down to he'd be down. and i want to end this on the legal cases with you scott. what should we be looking for? you noted 516 total cases. is there sort of a commonality that kind of gives us a sense of where they're going? and if they're flipping people my question is flipping people to what end right? are we talking now about essentially naming these three groups, the oath keepers, the proud boys, and the three percenters? in essence, as domestic

terrorist groups? because they seem to be the focus. >> flipping to wet and is a great question, joy. we haven't seen people flipped and names in new cases but here's with the fbi director has said to congress. there are hundreds more investigations in addition to those who are already charged, meaning there's a possibility there could be hundreds of more in arrests. we're talking about january 6th. this hour is the six month anniversary of what happened at 7 pm d.c. time, january 5th. somebody left live active pipe bombs at this hour in january 5th. there have been no arrests, joy. in fact, there have been no suspects details in that case. that is another open thing. that and the alley alexander missing an action where the hell is this guy? there are so many unanswered questions we need more than a commission we need a lot more to find out what happened. scott macfarlane, thank you always. michelle goldberg, dean obeidallah, you both are great. thank you so much. up next, the donald trump just admit to the serious charges

facing his company? i think he did. did he just do that? plus, texas republicans decide that in history museum, get this, is no place for a discussion of texas history. absolutely not. and the growing outrage of she carrie richardson. if it's a dumb rule, why not to change right now? reidout continues after this. sister. you remember rick, her neighbor? sure, he's the 76-year-old guy who still runs marathons, right? sadly, not anymore. wow. so sudden. um, we're not about to have the "we need life insurance" conversation again, are we? no, we're having the "we're getting coverage so we don't have to worry about it" conversation. so you're calling about the $9.95 a month plan -from colonial penn? -i am. we put it off long enough. we are getting that $9.95 plan, today. (jonathan) is it time for you to call about the $9.95 plan? i'm jonathan from colonial penn life insurance company.

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but that's not all you'll find here. there are hundreds of good-paying jobs, with most new workers hired from bayview-hunter's point. we don't just work at recology, we own it, creating opportunity and a better planet. the disgraced, twice impeached now, that's making a difference. former president was back out there over the holiday weekend on his revenge tour, just days after his company, the trump organization, and cfo allen weisselberg or indicted for un-and ledge tax game and, a caviar, it were only playing sound of this guy, normally we wouldn't, but we will do it tonight because he actually admitted it. >> they go after good, hardworking people for not wearing packs --

taxes on a company car. company car. you didn't pay taxes on the car, or a company apartment. you used an apartment because, you needed an apartment because you had to travel too far where you're houses. you didn't pay taxes. or, education for your grandchildren. i don't even know. to use anybody have the answer to that stuff? okay? but, they indict people for that. >> trump still talks like maryland monroe, breath ali and weirdly, but he was following don jr. had fences named. by saying what's the big deal to try to spin the trump news to his side. trump is leaving the city in record numbers, it's dirty, disgusting, new york is no longer what it is. they have an entire district attorney office, and attorney general's office that is focused on three and a half years to take down a political opponent? this is a farce. it is a disgrace that they

spend millions of dollars in the years, instead of prosecuting actual murderous thugs on the streets of new york, they go after the political enemies. >> unfortunately, people dodge taxes all the time, and this is unfair. it is actually not a solid argument in a court of law, sorry. actually not a saccording to thn post, the trump organization -- e trump organization - joyce vance and suzanne craig joins me now. joyce, i love the fact that they wrote their own indictment with spreadsheets. your thoughts? >> well, this is an absolutely fascinating sort of commentary toward the top organizations at the trump organization to be making right now. they haven't been indicted yet, ellen weisselberg is the one who's indicted in this

particular indictment, at least so far. it's hard to figure that there are criminal defense lawyers for any number of people who have been out there, just face palm-ing as they hear the sort of commentary. >> when you've heard from an owner of a company, when there's an indictment like this, is either to deny that any of the misconduct occurred, or to express outrage, right? i've shopped there is gambling casablanca. gee, it's not much of a crime is it? that approach it's unusual, and it won't play well if it has to play in a courtroom. >> it's sort of an, i only robbing the five and dime, not a rich company like walmart. this is one of the thing trump argued, never before, as new york city and the prosecutors or perhaps any, anywhere criminal churchill company or personal fringe benefits. leona henry's ghost would like

to have a word. she was convicted on taxation and -- and renovations on her kinetic in a state not reported. joyce, just to be clear, folks to get prosecuted in this and elsewhere in new york right? >> people do get prosecuted for tax aversion and federal assistance, this is a strategy though joy, that we have seen trump use before. it's a notion that it's not an important crime, people don't get prosecuted for this, it's like an instant replay of what happened during the mueller investigation when trump dismissed obstruction of justice as a crime. it's not people should be worrying about it. here he is, appealing to the court of public opinion, again. thinking that will help him with federal prosecutors. that might have worked for someone who was cloaked in the protection of the presidency, but it would be very interesting to see if public outrage, by his base, will have

any impact on what is now the indictment of allen weisselberg. i doubt it. >> it shouldn't in the normal country. susan, let me bring you. win let me read a bit of a quote regarding the spreadsheets of the indictment. you've had a good look into the trump tax sort of, weird world. is this a common way that the trump organization paid people? is that the tax returns that revealed all, this or literally is the spreadsheets? >> what we're seeing, and with the documents in the indictment are internal work product of

the trump organization. we didn't have this ability -- but they have a lot of documents they are now putting together. right, now these are allegations, they're in an indictment, they may make it into court monday. anytime you hear two sets of books, i mean, wow. we think, you know, it's not a good starting point. as a journalist, you always want documents. this is a very document based indictment. witnesses can be great, but they are unreliable. documents are there, and you can't impeach the character of a document. you can argue about its ferocity and debate it, but it's great when you are a prosecutor to go into a case where there are this many documents which they seem to have. >> suzanne, michael cohen, he was on the show last week. he talked about being millions of documents. being there, as trump's lawyer, he testified before the grand jury. i wonder, if going through and

in a journalistic standpoint for you, michael cohen and others who worked for donald trump have said essentially, this was a wave underpaying people. paying them low salaries, essentially compensating them with presents, presence for the kids, a house to live in, those things. did you find that when looking at the internals of the trump organization particular the stuff that trump provided? >> we didn't see so much that. we had the tax return information, this is not what they actually told the tax man. it had the effect of reducing the amount of taxable income that the irs could go after. you are getting all these perks on the one side, and just the way they are being accounted for is not fully reflecting the taxable income. when i heard those remarks on saturday, i heard two things. one, when joy was talking about, they will try to minimize this. it is small.

the other thing in is, it's some of the contours of the legal defense he will start to see them present which is, he needed unemployment to stay in new york. so, we gave him. that these were actually some of them, more legitimate. i don't think you have an argument where the grandchildren's to asian is. on some of the bigger items, they may argue that these were legitimate expenses and there will be a debate about that, should this end up in court. >> and if you are a lawyer, joyce vance, representing don and eric trump, not that they would pay you, so you may not want to be their lawyer but let's say you you are. would you advise them to keep trumping? -- talking? it does seem like the trump family is a business. donald trump and his family were living in this apartment for free or cheap. it's something they kind of. and if you are don and eric, would you talk on tv or advise them to if you are third lawyer? >> you know, if i was in the

position of being their lawyer joy, i would get within the same a device i would give to anybody else under investigation in a criminal case. don't go out in public and run your mouth. if you will talk with prosecutors and investigators, do it with your lawyer present. better yet, through your lawyer without being in the room. this is just a really, insanity. you have to wonder, does this signify that they believe they are so untouchable, that they can get away with anything, and that they really believe that by catering to the court of public opinion they can outrun the courts of the state of new york? it is really baffling to see this kind of conduct. >> if i had to guess, i would guess the answer to that is yes, joy. they do believe in that. donald trump got away with it his whole life. we will see how it plays. that joyce vance and suzanna craig. thank you both very much. remember the alamo? texas republicans want you to

remember it as they remember it in their bedtime stories. not the way it actually went down. a shocking suppression of facts and free speech in the lone star state, next. on the readout. on the readout

i can't, you know republicans love to rage against censorship and cancel culture? well we don't actually walk at like the top it. take a look at what's happening in texas. state republicans led by republican luminaries like governor greg abbott who can't even manage the states electrical grid forced the abrupt cancellation of a book event at a state history museum because they didn't like with the book says. forget the alamo examines the role slavery played leading up to the battle of the alamo. naturally, the mere mention of slavery triggered the fragility of republican leaders who just happens to be on the board of

the museum. now, abbott didn't have the courage to publicly condemn free speech but his deputy, lieutenant governor dan patrick carried the bag. in a tweet, patrick said, i told staff to cancel this event as soon as i found out about it and called it a -- rewriting of texas history. lieutenant governor of texas proudly announced that the texas state history museum was no place for history? yeehaw. joining me now is chris tomlinson, columnist for the houston chronicle and author of forget the alamo. i have to read your response to texas -- dan patrick and i said the emmy and come on my show. that is one of the reasons you're here. i was like i need to book you immediately. you wrote that lieutenant governor dan patrick affected free speech. bullet museum proves that it's a propaganda outlet. as for his factory comment, while a dozen people

professional historians disagree. and you have to of course forget the alamo texas legislature. please tell me the story of how you're book event with their co-offers bryan borough and jason stanford caught scheduled and then canceled. >> well, they reached out to us as soon as they found out that we were doing this book. we had spoken to the program manager months in advance once we had a publication in june 8th. we talked about it again and said yes we want you here. we had a lot of demand for speaking including one from the rioters fleet of texas so we thought let's do a joint events. let's get these two groups together. we're gonna do it virtually anyway and the bullet said okay. will supply the website and register the attendees and we will make this happen. then, a right-wing extremist group called the texas public policy foundation starts tweeting about it. they are particularly incensed by the content of our book so

we checked in with the bullet and they said no problem we've done controversial stuff before and besides the wall street journal said they had a professor talk about how great your book is. history professor said that all this stuff about slavery is old news. the most interesting part is the modern part of our book. and then that senate governor dropped the hammer. he either calls up the bullock and says, no, you have to pull out. we got a call from our publisher. this is off. rioters in texas say we can scramble and get you on a zoom call. and were like no, there's not enough time. and that's when i went to twitter. >> and a wise thing to do. and this modern age, the thing to do is go public. go to twitter. what's the status? now are you gonna be able to discuss your book? i know texas is not put in this thing called the 1836 projects,

creating a nine member committee to promote patriotic education. patriotic history. they basically want to limit the way that the historical events are taught. essentially, they have to be taught in a way that i guess makes a hedged history. are you gonna be allowed to discuss this book in the state of texas? >> well, i mean clearly i'm standing in texas and i'm talking to you and private bookstores. but i have questions about how far this ban goes. and my ban from state universities? the texas book festival is held on state property every year. i'm on the board of advisers. it might not gonna be able to discuss that my book there? i've got a lot of questions for governor patrick and we're talking to some attorneys who have questions too about the attitude towards the first amendment. >> right. the first amendment has to

prevent government from pressuring americans on the basis of their speech or intervening in the use of free speech so that seems like a pretty straightforward case. let's talk about the book itself. what is the premise of the book that is so terrifying to the old 1836 project folks? >> will we make the argument that the myths that we are taught to people my age and younger frankly in texas schools are hurtful to the growing probity of hispanics in texas. it paints a picture of freedom loving anglo's fighting against dark skinned people for liberty. it completely ignores the role that slavery played in motivating this because we point out the inconvenient facts that mexico is a multi cultural society that had just overthrown spanish colonial

rule and was trying to outlaw slavery. the president santa ana said before he crossed the border into texas, he said i'm gonna go free the wretched souls held in bondage in texas. and to say those things in texas is apparently going to get you slap down. >> yeah it's the same way they don't like to talk about the war of 1812 and the british were offering freedom atlanta any enslaved africans who would join the crowds fight against the americans at the time and the british governor of virginia was offering to completely free all the slaves to his own emancipation proclamation. we don't get the history either. and do you believe that at this point, the goal of the government of texas is to suppress history? because part of this 1836 law says that they have to give deference to both sides. what would be the difference that one could give the other side in an argument where slave holders were fighting a war to

hold on to their slaves? what difference could you get to that as a journalist? that one? >> you know, i don't know. and that's the problem. this grew out of a column i wrote on texas needing to re-brand itself. we cannot have the image of the long tall white cowboy fighting and enslaving people of color as our brand anymore. but unfortunately conservatives and particularly governor abbott and patrick their identity is caught up in this mythology. governor patrick has a collection of john wayne memorabilia and his office to give you an idea of where his politics are. >> don't read him the interview and which john wayne called himself a white nationalist. he might not like that, because you might not find that giving deference to both sides. thank you chris tomlinson, i've already ordered your book. i can't wait to get it and read it. thank you so much for accepting

my twitter invitation. i appreciate you. and good luck with the book. thank you very much. okay, up next. more victims are found in surfside florida after the remainder of that building collapsed condominium was demolished over the weekend. live reports next. ve reports next. hey, i just got a text from my sister. you remember rick, her neighbor? sure, he's the 76-year-old guy who still runs marathons, right? sadly, not anymore. wow. so sudden. um, we're not about to have the "we need life insurance" conversation again, are we? no, we're having the "we're getting coverage so we don't have to worry about it" conversation. so you're calling about the $9.95 a month plan

-from colonial penn? -i am. we put it off long enough. we are getting that $9.95 plan, today. (jonathan) is it time for you to call about the $9.95 plan? i'm jonathan from colonial penn life insurance company. sometimes we just need a reminder not to take today for granted. if you're age 50 to 85, you can get guaranteed acceptance whole life insurance starting at just $9.95 a month. there are no health questions so you can't be turned down for any health reason. the $9.95 plan is colonial penn's number one most popular whole life plan. options start at just $9.95 a month. that's less than 35 cents a day. your rate can never go up. it's locked in for life. call today for free information. and you'll also get this free beneficiary planner, so call now. (soft music) ♪ search and rescue efforts

hello, colonial penn?

resume today in surfside florida after pausing this weekend. so that cruz could demolish the remaining parts of the champagne tower south. authorities said it would allow them to get into previously and accessible areas. in the past hour, the death toll rose again to 28 as more victims were found in the rubble. 117 remain unaccounted for. joining me now is nbc news correspondent megan chesky -- morgan chesky, so sorry. what is the latest? >> joy, good evening. right now you can see crew standing busy. this is a 24/7 operation here

and as you mention they're able to go deeper into that rubble because of that demolish -- demolition that took place yesterday that officials say was highly successful. the remaining portion of shin plane tower south fell right on top of its current footprint and just to ensure that it didn't compromise the current search efforts, they put a large, thick rubber mat over the area that they had been searching should any debris fall in that direction, they would be able to knock it off and pull that math back and go back to the layer that they were currently working in. as a result of this demolition, they've been able to move heavier equipment inside the interior areas and go into the areas that they've not been able to access before. we're now on day 12. i spoke to a famous search and rescue worker today. i said what do you tell the folks who realize how far we are now regarding a chance of survival? and she says, we tell them we believe and that is that we're holding out hope for a miracle. of course, people here pointing out other instances where

people have survived upwards of two weeks and even longer in some instances in these collapses, but this is absolutely a search and rescue mission right now. they are not calling this a recovery mission just yet. the families of the missing meanwhile staying in a nearby hotel, we did reach out to get their thoughts on the demolition. they were briefed prior to it taking place. and many of them understand that this was just a necessary step in the process to try to go deeper into the pile. we know that as it stands right now, about 40% of the debris that's above ground has since been removed and in fact we know that's about 4.8 million pounds of concrete. an incredible job this already been done this delays ahead of them and of course all this with a very careful eye on tropical storm elsa as it turns its way towards florida. while it's expected to go to the western side of the state, there is a concern that a lightning and or wind could pose an issue here. anytime a lightning strike

happens within two and a half miles of this area, crews have to pause for 30 minutes before getting back on top of that pile. and they know more than anyone just how precious every second is. joy. >> wow. morgan chesky thank you very much, i really appreciate that. coming up, the latest controversy surrounding american olympic athletes of color, exposes the sneaky little racism these athletes are encountering at every turn. espn's bonnie jones joins me next.

ugh, these balls are moist. or is that the damp weight of self-awareness you now hold in your hands? yeah (laugh) keep your downstairs dry with gold bond body powder. in an olympic year, one black

women athletes are supposed to become the faces of team usa, gymnast simone biles and john chiles and sprinter allison felix, to name just a few. the biggest topic right now is the star athlete who potentially will not appear at the games. sprinter sha'carri richardson, the 21 year old american track star following her one month suspension from the sport after

testing positive for thc, the chemical in marijuana. richardson has expected the suspension. she won't appear in her solo event. the 100 meter dash. she told the today show she takes full responsibility for her actions. but a lot of people are questioning why we'd, of all things, which to my knowledge has never made anybody faster is keeping her out of the games. richard since punishment comes with a host of arbitrary rules then criticism seemingly only directed at black women athletes, including a ban by swimming's governing body of the sole cap. a swim cap designed for natural black hair. and hammer thrower gwen berry, the daughter of an iraq war veteran, mind you, who's facing calls to be removed from team usa, from the maga crowd for protesting the national crowd at the olympic trials. as for sha'carri richardson, fans want to see her run in tokyo. a move on position, let her run. calling the marijuana rules arbitrary and out dated has already gotten half 1 million

signatures. joining me now is bomani jones, sports journalist and host of the espn podcast. always good to talk to you bomani. so we have the clip of sha'carri richardson onstage? let's play that really quickly. >> as much as i'm disappointed, i know that i represent myself and i represent a community that shows me great support and great love. and to your, i apologize for the fact that i didn't know how to control my emotions or deal with my emotions. sitting here, i just say don't judge me because i am human. i just happen to run a little faster. >> i mean, bomani, her mom had just died and she found that out from a reporter. what is going on here? >> well, i mean as far as the suspension itself it's kind of textbook and hard to get around. like, if you feel that test in that time when she did these are what the consequences are. it's really hard on this one. this is not one that i think

that the drug testing people have the luxury of being able to say, that just didn't happen. that's not gonna be it. to me, it seems to be an unfortunate confluence of circumstances for her which something dramatic happens to her in the time of competition and she went to a familiar coping mechanism which happen to have consequences. i don't really feels so much that the suspension she's dealing with is being picked on for no other reason than she's worth a whole lot of money to a whole lot of people. she was about to be the star of the hundred meter dash of this, right? the look. everything else. she's someone the nbc was gonna be able to put out there and get americans to watch in the olympics. i feel like everybody involved with some measure of power -- at don't think there's anyone that likes this is the outcome. >> but here is the thing. the it seems like an arbitrary entity. they can do whatever they want. this is a 21 year old. my youngest child is 21. i can't even imagine any of my kids being under this kind of pressure. her mother had just passed away. she finds out in an interview with a reporter. she's depressed, she's dealing with -- it doesn't seem like any of

these athletic leagues whether it's the olympics or the u.s. tennis association has any interest in trying to deal with black women except in a punitive way. am i reading too much into that? >> i don't feel like this is the example of that. i think there's certainly room of empathy for her. and again i don't think -- when i hear her apology, the worst thing about it to me is the fact that she feels like she has to apologize to us which she does not. i haven't seen a measure of judgment. there seems to be a lot of understanding how all those things come together at one time and lead her to where she is. but on this one in particular, things are arbitrary but not really with the drug testing policy when it comes in and it dead letter positive. once that happens, i don't know how much flexibility you have. now, you do have examples of other cases where we're talking about someone that's just too big to fail. lance armstrong, for example with a corrupt cycling body just threw out positive results for him after the fact. but i don't think the argument is if you throw out lance armstrong's drug test, you have to do it for everyone. >> hold on, why isn't that the

argument? why isn't it the argument? you've seen the swimmers name who also tested positive. there was a swimmer -- what's his name, brian phelps. it is arbitrary. >> michael phelps -- >> michael phelps. >> michael phelps got caught hitting a bomb at a frat party and did not actually test positive but was suspended for longer than sha'carri richardson is gonna be suspended right now. i feel like with a lot of these things, we're trying to make some comparisons and it's going into a snowball that i don't necessarily think is accurate. so for example, i think what's happening with the swim cap is absolutely antagonistic for black people and it's ridiculous that nobody has ever done this. they're trying to keep us out of the water 400 years. they don't even want to stick it in the water at the holiday inn. no they can't win like that in that case. but that and gwen berry, you're gonna have people who oppose her politics and want her to be removed but they already said they're gonna be okay with that measure of protesting. so that becomes just a political issue of those people aligning against. this seems to me to be a

completely separate situation from each of those, which i think are separate from one another. the common theme is black women, and the common theme in life generally with black people and black women specifically is being picked on an antagonized by people. i just don't know if you tested positive right at that time, if this is the one that speaks to the antagonism against black women, especially in a sport like track and field. it just so happens that this time that they're going down to a white woman but generally speaking, it's gonna be a black woman that wins the hundred meter deaths in all likelihood and pay the price. this is an event -- the machine has decided we can have 100 meters. they gave up on that for a while. >> i will note that sha'carri richardson may still be able to compete. she may still be able to get a medal if she's allowed to do that. i have to feel that maybe because as a black woman and somebody who has to deal with black hairstyles and all of this sort of issues that we have -- but the swim team, when you combine the fact that they're literally telling black women that you cannot cover your hair

in the water the way you need to to protect it, you're not gonna be able to compete. you go into the attacks on -- a daughter of a war veteran saying that you can't have a thought or a belief about black lives matter. it does feel like an accumulation of arbitrary rules that are being used only against black women. it is ruining my olympics vibe, bomani. it's making me not want to watch and i know a lot of people feel that way. >> yeah, and i guess to a degree i understand that. i can understand how it feels that way for anybody when all these things come together, but i really do think in the three case by case talking about. with glenn very, i think her story is more interesting because there is reason to question whether or not they purposely antagonized her by playing the national anthem while she was on the metal stand at an event where they were not playing the national anthem when people were on the metal stand because it's the american olympic trials. they're playing the same song all the time. they said they play it every day at 5:20, but she was on the metal stand at 5:25. that seemed absolutely like an aggressive play against her,

and somebody trying to show her up. we'll never know definitively whether that was the case but that seems 100% to be the case there. so we've got this in some cases, it's just hard for me to buy in to that -- if you can find me a counter example of someone else failing a marijuana test and letting them compete, i can ride with you. i don't have a counterfactual that says that. >> i didn't even get to the nigerian team that they're trying to throw out. it's just a hot mess. bomani jones. that's it for the readout. all in with chris hayes starts now. >> tonight on all in. six months after the attack on democracy, new video and new arrests in new details on the investigation into the capital insurrection. then, how america missed the biden goal of 70% vaccinations by july 4th. >> the red states probably have a lot of people that are very very conservative in their thinking. and they think, well, i don't have to do that. but you're not thinking right. >> ps,