loot the planet and fun stuff like that. infrastructure pays for itself.f like that. infrastructure pays for itself. republicans say their issue is with how the $579 billion infrastructure bill will be paid for. that is actually the wrong question. politico notes that conservatives are increasingly leaning on the senate gop to rip up the bill and kill its attempt to pour $40 billion into increased irs enforcement. end quote. and that extra money for the irs would help the agency collect billions in unpaid taxes mainly from wealthy individuals and corporations. so in reality, republicans are worried that their rich constituents and corporate donors may have to actually pay their taxes if the democrats get their way. that is not representation, that is a racket. chuck schumer is dialing up the pressure, says a procedural vote on the bipartisan bill will be

held on wednesday ready or not. schumer has already set wednesday as the deadline for senate democrats to finalize their separate larger $3.5 trillion plan which they plan to pass through budget reconciliation. it means that they don't need 10 republican votes. that is a lot of priorities to get in to that bill including extending the child tax credit under the american rescue plan, more funding for clean energy and addition of a new dental, vision and hearing benefit to medicare to name a few things. here is why senate democrats are in a time crunch. their goal is to get both bills passed before congress' scheduled month long august recess. and so this is shaping up to be a very busy week capitol hill. joining me now, anna palmer from punch bowl news, and she is the best selling author of the hill to die on, the battle for congress and future of trans

america which may be the best book name ever. this is really a very, very busy week on capitol hill. some argue too busy because we have more than $4 trillion, $5 trillion worth of bills that as far as i know at the moment have not yet been either written or finalized. >> yeah, we clearly see chuck schumer trying to put the pressure on this wednesday deadline. he doesn't want the negotiations to continue on because as you note, not only is there this august recess that will come up really quickly, but there also are a couple other things, the debt ceiling, funding the government, really two things that they have to do, they are critical this fall. and so he is trying to say is this deal with republicans and democrats actually going to happen and if it is, let's move forward with it. and if not, then it is really that secretary reconciliation package is the only vehicle that they would have for infrastructure. >> so is it either/or would

chuck schumer like both? >> oh, i think certainly he would like both. and if you look at pennsylvania avenue, joe biden definitely wants both. he has said when he went into office that he was uniquely qualified to find deals between republicans and democrats. this would be a massive deal. this is the first time in 20 plus years that infrastructure has gotten as far as it has gotten. we always make the joke and donald trump and it was infrastructure week every week, but that was just recognition of how difficult it is to find compromise right now in weighing even though every district has crumbling roads and bridges. >> but there is a difference -- there is a fundamental language or definitional difference between what joe biden and some democrats are calling infrastructure and what republicans are calling infrastructure. frankly, it has been that way forever. there is always a time when, you know, in the '20s and '30s when

someone suggested something should be part of infrastructure and someone else said infrastructure is just x. is there a way to reconcile that? because americans overwell well himmingly support these bills, but republicans being that democrats are engaging in a spending overreach. >> this is a massive amount of money that we're talking about. but i think that what they tried do is separate them so that on the kind of hard infrastructure bill where they are trying to find this bipartisan group to come together on the agreement on those issues, and then there is piece which is a reshaping of how government interacts in american's lives and democrats believe that there is support for that and that joe biden will be a transformational figure. the question is can they get one or both of those and i really do think in the next week or two we'll start to see how

exactly -- this pathway they end up taking. >> so progressive house democrats want both. their view is you don't get to give republicans physical hard infrastructure without dealing with the human priorities we want. there are a lot of republicans, not necessarily overly conservative republicans, but republicans who say we do not want this hard infrastructure bill tied to your human infrastructure priorities. to use your term, is this a hill to die on for either of them, will anybody torpedo this because of the other bill? >> i think the reality is you have seen joe biden say they wouldn't be tied together, they are trying to work on them in tandem. to your point, appease the progressives that really are -- this is a fundamental issue for them that they believe that human infrastructure piece needs to happen. but you also have to deal with the joe manchins, the kyrsten sinemas of the world which are the moderate democrats and that is the fundamental problem for

chuck schumer and nancy pelosi, how do they thread the needle of keeping everybody at least somewhat happy. and so far they have done a very good job. you have not seen democrats torpedo either of these packages in a way that typically falls along the lines of partisanship. they kind of said we'll wait and see what is in the package, everybody from alexandria ocasio-cortez to joe mar chin manchin are waiting for the details. >> and right now in the house they have a low single digit majority. any problems there? >> it will be so tight. you are talking about a three seat majority probably by the time this bill or either of these bills would get to the house. that means that nancy pelosi is going to have one of the toughest jobs when it comes to actually getting this through the chamber. you can't underscore how tight that is. and when you look at some of the democrats who haven't even voted for some of the covid relief funding, there are at least two to three that she automatically

lose. so she is probably uniquely suited. i always say don't count against her because she wins more often than not. and she's been through massive packages. obamacare, covid relief, where a lot of people counted her out. so very difficult. we're not quite there yet to see how she will do that, but she has done a pretty good job so far of making sure that democrats on either the moderate side or the progressive side aren't saying, no, no -- she keeps saying don't make any red lines right now, let's just keep the process going. >> it is an exciting week whether you like the politics or the policy of it. it is all coming together this week. anna palmer, great to see you. thank you for joining us. founder and ceo of punch bowl news. and best selling co-author. meanwhile this week the irs sent out its first batch of checks to families as part of the government's child tax credit. this is part of the $1.9

trillion american rescue plan that was signed by the president earlier this year. and this particular initiative is set to cut child pore povert half. my next guest has been aggressively pushing to make this credit permanent. right now it is just a this year thing. joining me is the democratic senator sherrod brown of ohio, share of the senate banking housing and urban affairs committee. i love infrastructure, i think that it is a terrible name, i think human infrastructure might be an even worse nachlg. name. but you are talking about children in poverty, children who are hungry, children who go to school hungry and can't learn properly. every study that has ever been done says if you feed your children properly, you clothe them properly, you send them equipped to school, they will have a bright future. >> exactly right. 39 million families -- [

inaudible ] will have $250 for this month, $250 next month for six months. or $300 depending on the age of their children. the 92% of children in my fate will get these dollars. and this is the way social security reordered priorities for seniors, this will reorder priorities for children. and i spent a good bit of time two weeks ago in ohio having round tables from fremont, bryant, dayton, and they will say this is the first time that i can send my child for a week to summer camp. a father said now i can buy equipment for my daughter's fast pitch softball game team. and a number of people said now -- i'm always anxious about that last week of the month how ican put together the money for

the rent. and so we decide what the best use of the dollars are so they can make decisions on their own kids. and this is an opportunity to launch, it is really -- the real infrastructure in my mind is to build a foundation to give families the opportunity to launch their children so that they have more opportunity than they have in the past. >> and as we struggle with democrat or republican interpretations of what infrastructure means, the holistic view, whether you support republican or democratic views on this thing is it is stuff that makes your ability to function, live, work, be prosperous and be a tripcontrib to society better. there is just no argument anywhere that this money that goes toward the well-being of children, the lifting of children out of poverty, is beneficial as an investment. in other words, the kind of thing that will be returned to our coffers over time, not an

expenditure that is a decoration. >> we're going to look back five years, ten years from now and say this is the best thing congress did in a quarter century because we will see now -- republicans define infrastructure very narrowly, highways, bridges, sewer. and we define it as building a foundation for families to prosper and provide opportunities for children. evidenced by the fact that on two different votes,s unanimously opposed the child tax credit. they opposed an amendment to take it out back in march on march 6. and then they voted all against the final bill with child tax credit in it. and i know this will be a success. and a year or two from now republicans will take credit for helping to write it. but that is really not of much concern. republicans don't campaign per se against it because they know it works. and this is that kind of

earth-changing for our country future that we'll be so proud of in the years ahead. >> but that is kind of -- you know, your point of whether social security or this child credit, the part about it that republicans should like, maybe i should wrap this enter slew up with you and just pull a republican, that you are giving families the money to do with as they wish. as they think it is right. but when you are giving money to people who are struggling, we know, economists indicate, that more than every dollar goes back into the economy. these are not people who are taking it on a skiing trip to switzerland. >> yeah, this is great for families. it is the most pro family kind of legislation that you can offer. you help families provide opportunities for their children and launch those children into a better -- potentially better life and lifestyle. and productive prosperous life. what is more important than that. and it not just helps those families, where connie and i live in cleveland in 44105, our

zip road had more foreclosures back in 2007. it helps the neighborhood and these dollars are going right back into the economy. pay rent, by stuff for their kid, go to a diner maybe once a month. any number of things that parents make the decision on and that is the real key here. let parents decide how they want to -- give them a little help, let them decide how they best want to raise their children. >> you are clearly at peace between the fact that there shouldn't be that much of an intellectual discussion between roads, bridges, buses and things that make people live their lives better. they all contribute to a more prosperous and active economy. how do you get your republican colleagues to buy into that is this because in your state, people on the grounds actually support the development of human infrastructure as well as physical infrastructure. your colleagues in the united states senate, your republican

colleagues, are still struggling with this. >> yeah, take the third biggest city in my state, cincinnati, all kind of -- everybody almost in cincinnati wants to see help rebuilding the bridge across the ohio river, but people want to see kids prosper at a community school that is a national model. we want kids to have more opportunity. our republicans in the end don't much like -- i mean, their tax policy we know from behavior in the past is cut taxes on the rich, it will trickle down to everybody else. well, they tried that four years ago. during infrastructure week you talked about, they decided to skip infrastructure, give a tax cut to rich people, it will trickle down. it never works that way. invest directly in families and children and people in the middle class and people aspiring in the middle class, and then it brings prosperity. people all over my state know that. republican office holders don't, but the public does. and that is why we'll succeed on

both these bills in the next three weeks. >> senator, thank you for your time. thank you for your commitment to helping children come out of poverty. there should be nothing partisan about that. sherrod brown, chairman of the committee on urban affairs and a senator from ohio. right now there are at least 70 wildfires burning across the united states and that is just the start of what is expected to be a hot and dry summer fueled in part by the climate crisis. i'll bring you my conversation with pete buttigieg. plus a new book is giving us more insight into the final year of donald trump's presidency. and some of the details are far more disturbing than you would imagine. i'll talk to the book's author up next. and a proliferation of qanon candidates running for elected office. this is not a conspiracy theory. this is "velshi." "velshi.

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listen up. we've been warning about qanon conspiracy theorists. many of the january 6 insurrectionists if they weren't wearing logos of that are own

were wearing qanon shirts, flags and other paraphernalia. they believe and espouse fantastical and ridiculous conspiracy theories including that democrats and the media are part of a satan-worshipping and baby eating kabol. they seem to find comfort in the big lie. qanon once thrived in the darkest corners of the web and while we still find traces of qanon on our aunts and uncle's facebook pages, the movement has largely dissipated on the internet. but that is not good news because qanon is reappearing on a balance let near you. after its failure january 6, dozens of qanon followers are attempting to lay a more durable claim to our federal seat of government. according to media matters, at least 40 people running for congress in 2022 have publicly

expressed some level of support for the qanon conspiracy theories. the state with the highest numbers is, you guessed it, florida. and politically by the way, 38 of the 40 candidates are republicans. there are two democratic candidates who believe in qanon you wonder? no. the other two are independents. here is what we're working with. a republican running no congress in california, after he was accused of supporting qanon, cruz released this statement on official campaign letter head. from what i researched online, q on nonbelieves if not for the election of donald trump, a worldwide satan worshipping fed piles would have continued ruling the world. where do i sign up? here is another republican running for congress in california, this guy took to twitter last year, ask me anything. g money says do you support the

q movement? this guy says yep. no beating around the bush here. though he later deleted this tweet and told axios that he did not recall sending it nor does he endorse q. that is dangerous stuff. qanon lies and people die. right now fuelled in part by qanon adherence, a massive covid-19 disinformation campaign is convincing americans not to get vaccinated. they are lying again and people are dying again. in 2020, at least two candidates marjorie taylor greene and lauren boebert had publicly sympathized with qanon, won their elections and are now members of the united states congress. the rest of the gop may not bow to the qanon gods, but giving these conspiracy theorists comfort and aid in the republican party makes republicans accomplices. this is not about your politics any more. this is about conspiracy theorists spreading lies that are undermining the republican

party and american democracy and endangering the health and lives of americans. it is time for the republican party to expunge these conspiracy theorists from their ranks for the sake of democracy. . this is about conspiracy this is about conspiracy this is cynthia suarez, cfo of go-go foodco., an online food delivery service. business was steady, until... gogo-foodco. go check it out. whaatt?! overnight, users tripled. which meant hiring 20 new employees and buying 20 new laptops. so she used her american express business card,

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. it was bad. really bad. i don't even know how to describe it. scared the hell out of me. i couldn't get a hold of my wife, she couldn't get a hold of me. she was trying. she was all freaked out. when we finally got together, she was like what the hell, i couldn't call you! it was bad. >> that right there is the human toll of climate change, that man from doyle, california narrowly escaped before his home was engulfed by the beckwourth complex fire, one of several wildfires burning in the western part of the united states. no doubt this will be a summer of climate catastrophe.

we cannot accept this as the new normal. congress is working on a pair he have bills that would fulfill several of president biden's climate promises, but the climate initiatives lack republican support. and some staunch climate activists say the bills don't go far enough anyway. one reliable solution to part of the climate crisis is sustainable infrastructure. for example, electric vehicles. transportation secretary pete buttigieg was in eugene, oregon touring a new fleet of electric buses. and i spoke with him about building smarter infrastructure and common high school misconceptions. >> the -- there are a lot of cry climate actionity virgin islandss who were hoping y virgin islandss who were hoping hoping that the infrastructure bill would be bigger and more. >> the last time you and i saw each other, we talked for an hour. this a near and dear to your heart. what is your message about your

administration's commitment to climate? because the crisis is upon us right now. and it is upon your administration to lead us the right way. >> that's right. you know, climate effects that we thought would happen in the middle of the century are happening right this minute. we don't have time to debate whether it is real or caused by humans or whether we got to do something about it. we just have to act. my message to people who care about climate like we do is first of all, this is the biggest investment in these kinds of things that we've had in the history of the republic. and what we're doing in the bipartisan infrastructure framework is only part of the story. the other part, the one that we may have to do without republican votes although i'll like to keep trying to convince republicans to support it, that too contemplates measures that will make a huge difference in the fight against climate change. >> how do you get around the criticism of the "green new deal" for instance where they said that it will take you out of your cars, we're not going to

fly airplanes anymore. there are ways in which people can stay in their cars and ways in which that they can fly on airplanes that do not have to be as damaging as they are now. what are the initiatives that either you have seen or you want to support? >> look, there is this cartoon version of our climate agenda that is out there that if you listen to certain radio stations or commentators, you would think that we would abolish airplanes and ban cheeseburgers. and the reality is that that is not what we want to do and it is also not what it takes to meet our climate future. what we need to do is make sure that there are more and better options for americans. so take pickup trucks. it is often people who are in rural areas who use their vehicles for both work and for family purposes, who will benefit the most from the savings that come from having an electric versus a gas pickup truck. often in rural communities, frankly often in conservative communities that there will be the most to gain. we have to get that message out

and make it clear. we also have to make it clear that there is no option for doing nothing. that is not acceptable. and that we're seeing all around us the consequences of being too slow to act. the other thing we have to do is break this false narrative of climate versus jobs. it is very clear that if we take the infrastructure action, the climate action that the president is calling for, we'll have more jobs than if we stick with business as usual. this is about preventing economic and environmental destruction and creating a better opportunity for everybody. >> you know as a former mayor that lot of these things move ahead on a local level and on a state level. so what is the role in the federal government? >> we can no longer have local leaders or state leaders waiting on washington to catch up. washington needs to be there. when i was a mayor, i believed that most of the important action happened at the local level. now that i'm a federal official, i know that that is the case. and so i view our job not to provide the answers for local communities, but to provide the resources for local communities

that are trying to do the right thing. and to create the standards that lift the country up as a whole. i think that that is the right federal role. and this infrastructure framework contains the dollars do just that. >> and how do we encourage good clean behavior knowing what an influence we have over it? >> i think good policy means not so much less growth, but more growth but having it be cleaner. no reason why driving has to be bad for the environment. but we need to make sure that there are alternatives to driving and that there are ways to drive that are clean which is why electric vehicles are so important. we should be able tond will be able to grow our economy even more. and meet our climate challenge. i think the two can't be vatted separated. remember, this is a jobs plan at the end of the day.vatted separated. remember, this is a jobs plan at the end of the day. often jobs that don't require college degree, union jobs. >> why is a cleaner environment and infrastructure program that supports that going to create

more american jobs than otherwise would have been repai needed to repair? >> i guess no country has ever led the world by clinging to technologies or pieces of infrastructure that were 100 years old. if we're clinging to technologies that worked wonders for our economy in 1950 and think that that will carry us into the future, we will continue to fall behind as a country. and at the end of the day, i think america is not america unless we are striving for number one. >> the next hurdle for climate and infrastructure is going to come this week when there are -- on wednesday when senate majority leader chuck schumer plans to bring bipartisan infrastructure framework to a procedural vote. ever wonder what it was like inside the white house during some of the most tumultuous years of the trump presidency? a new book pulls the curtain back on that. the author michael bender joins me after this. me after this. get outta here.

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if you have a lot of books written about you, you are either a really good person or a really bad one. donald trump has been the subject of dozens of books and tell alls in his lifetime. what could that mean? i'll let you judge, but the trump presidency was memorable to say the least. we dealt have angry outbursts on twitter, staff turnovers, a devastating pandemic that wiped out more than 612,000 american lives, top it off with an insurrection at the u.s. capitol that led to his second impeachment and the movement fueled by trump's big lie. and in one of the nonfiction based on trump, senior white house reporter michael bender recalls the events that transpired throughout trump's pd presidency reminding us of things that we already knew

providing details about things behind closed doors. and let's just say things were much worse than we thought. the book is called "frankly we did win this election, the inside story of how trump lost." the author michael bender is joining me now. thanks for joining us. congratulations on the book. one of the things that you do in the book is you got a number of anecdotes, stories of trump supporters, which kind of when taken together help my viewer understand why he was able to succeed. these people were -- a lot of political people support their candidate in a very strong way. these people were more into trump than a lot of my viewers might imagine. >> yeah, that's right. i do think that this is -- you mentioned the trump books that is been out there for years. what none of them do is come at trump the way this one does.

anecdotes from inside the white house, behind the curtains of the campaign and i effectively embedded for two years with some of the hardcore supporters who go to 40, 50 rallies to try to figure out what about them draws them over and over again and what it is about trump that draws them in. and i do think that this is a relevant question not just then but now. because trump is still drawing thousands of people despite what happened on january 6. not only what happened on january 6, but the fact that 500 people who were there on january 6 have since been arrested. >> i want to read an excerpt, about a woman named sandra, reading that the crowd on the march around her felt like a stampede. the anger turned palpable, they needed to find pence at the capitol, someone yelled, if mike pence would have come out of that building, i guarantee he would have died. and if it wasn't by gunfire, he would have been pummeled.

they were going to kill him in the street. >> this is a person who went to a number of trump rallies, i think she saw either in a photograph or on tv, sort of the back of her head and gave her a taste of the fact that she is one of those front row joes as you describe it. that is more serious than a lot of people will actually say it was. >> yeah, that's right. she is one of the people who i profile in the book, she had never been involved in politics before, but went to a trump rally and drawn in by the energy and spoke to me that described a richer and full are life because of trump. she had made friends who she traveled to rallies with. they stayed at each other's houses. shared hotel rooms on the road. you know, she and another trump fan flew to hong kong and marched in some of the

extradition protests over there last year. you know, but what happened is -- and that is what this book shows, that they were misled especially throughout 2020. you know, i talked to another super fan who is so sick, he is convinced that he has covid -- >> let me read that because i also found that one fascinating. this is a guy named randall. from the book, for randall, not even a deadly pandemic would stand between him and his idol. a heavy smoker who was significantly overweight, he had fallen severely ill earlier in the year with high fevers and debilitating congestion. he was convinced that he had coronavirus but refused to go to the hospital. he didn't want to take a covid test and potentially increase the caseload on trump's watch. >> yeah, i mean it was october of -- sorry, summer of 2019 where i realized that i had been to 50 rallies in my reporting

for the "wall street journal" and the rallies had become sort of stale for me. and i was getting irritated trying to find news in them. but then i saw 15,000 to 20,000 people show up for these rallies every time. wanting to participate in the chants and i wanted to understand why it was still so fresh for them. and that is what i explain in the book. and i think again the question is still even more relevant now as we see trump trying to remain the headlines and wield the political influence he has. >> and i want to talk about donald trump. you have something in here about mark meadows, when donald trump was diagnosed with covid, meadows had told reporters that morning that trump had mild symptoms. inside the white house he was worried enough to suggest that other staffers say a prayer for the president. at the hospital, trump grabbed his small overnight bag and carried it inside. but he had been so weakened, the president dropped the bag after a few feet. even that part was theater.

>> yeah, that's right. listen, we all know the story of how chaotic this administration was over four years. and you don't need another book to do that. what this one does and what i was shocked in the reporting of this is how dangerous the people around trump thought he had become for the country in his desperation to hold on to power. and that applies with covid as well. he was reckless with his own health and the people around him. and this is the litmus test he put on staffers. after meadows picked up the bag and carried it into his hospital room, trump said that is when i knew you were my guy. >> a fascinating book. thank you for joining us. michael bender, reporter for the "wall street journal" and frankly, we did win this election. the inside story of how trump lost. tomorrow my msnbc colleagues are hosting a discussion with texas democrats about their decision to travel to the nation's capital to push for voting rights. jonathan is joining me now,

another angle with some of the members of the texas delegation contracting covid-19 despite being vaccinated. jonathan. >> yeah, the covid outbreak complicates the mission of the texas democrats but they say that they are undeterred and therefore i'm looking forward to talking to them tomorrow night about their decision and what they want from congress. but also this morning on "the sunday show," i'll talk to some of the key players in the fight for federal action on voting rights. james clyburn, amy klobuchar and joyce beatty of ohio, who was arrested while protesting for voting rights. so as usual, it is a busy morning on "the sunday show." >> joyce beatty continuing in a long history of civil disowe disobedience. and jim clyburn saying just

carve out voting rights from the filibuster. these are important discussions and i'm looking forward to watching. jonathan, thank you, my friend. "the sunday show" right after "velshi." protecting voting rights, police reform, these might all be pipe dreams as long as that filibuster remains in place. we'll talk more about the threat that that antiquated senate rule poses to democracy, coming up next. next ♪ ♪ when technology is easier to use... ♪ barriers don't stand a chance. ♪ that's why we'll stop at nothing to deliver our technology as-a-service. ♪

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authorize did he call on the senate to abolish the filibuster, a barrier preventing from passing voting legislation. a recent op-ed lays out the argument, one can not say that this is the test of our time and not be willing to toss out a senate rule that prevents a straight up or down vote on protecting our democracy. he cannot theoretically commit his presidency and his agenda to protecting democracy without acting to ensure it succeeds. his supporters, the country at large and our democracy cannot settle for anything less. joe biden may talk about protecting voting rights as long as he doesn't vocally support getting rid of the filibuster, his words can't really do that much. the author of that piece jennifer rubin is joining me next. jennifer rubin is joining e next i've got moderate to severe plaque psoriasis. now, there's skyrizi. ♪ things are getting clearer. ♪ ♪ i feel free to bare my skin yeah, that's all me. ♪ ♪ nothing and me go hand in hand nothing on my skin, ♪

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impressive. impressive is saving four hundred bucks a year. four bucks? that's tough to beat. relax people, my wireless is crushing it. okay, that's because you all have xfinity mobile. it's wireless so good, it keeps one upping itself. biden offered a strong defense of voting rights this week. but as some say, words only go so far when this thing called the filibuster exists. joining me now, aaron haines editor at large, also jennifer ruben, the washington post, resistance. how women saved democracy from donald trump. both are msnbc contributors and friends. jen, you make a point others

have made. you made it particularly strongly in the washington post. it's not that there's space between joe biden and those who want to push back on restrictive voting rights being passed in places like texas and other places. it's that joe biden's got to figure out a road forward. the texas democrats who left texas went to washington to argue that they need federal help with a road forward. joyce beatty got arrested the other day, but the argument is we need a road forward. joe biden is key to that road forward because of the filibuster. >> absolutely. listen, joe biden should not fall into the joe manchin trap of believing that there are ten magical friends of republicans who are going to step forward to provide 60 votes in order to pass some form of voting rights. we know that's not going to happen, so the alternative is what mechanism, what carve out or exception to the filibuster or reform, if he prefers that term, is he going to be able to

convey to his friend joe manchin to pass, because without it we're not going to get voting rights. and i think what we've seen in the latest supreme court ruling, from arizona and what we've seen in the audits and what we've seen from the -- i use audits loosely. and seen in the texas legislation making its way down the pike is that we need federal legislation. we're not going to litigate our way out of this. unfortunately we're not going to be able to persuade republicans to defend democracy. so what and how are we going to maneuver past the filibuster in order to get voting rights? and that i think is going to be the test of his presidency. it's going to be the test of our times likely. >> erin, joe manchin got himself in a liars and truth tellers situation. he didn't want to do this with voting rights because it doesn't have bipartisan support, but it doesn't have -- it's not going to have bipartisan support. it does seem jonathan capehart is going to be talking to james

clyburn fairly shortly on his show and it does seem that clyburn is giving biden an out here saying, don't necessarily get rid of the filibuster entirely, but carve outvoting as jennifer said, you don't need ten friends for. >> right, ali. the filibuster isn't necessarily sacred to our democracy, but the right to vote and access to the ballot is, or at least as americans we say that it is. i don't know many americans who say the filibuster is very sacred to them, and yet, you know, jen is absolutely right. six months into this administration, this is the priority for the people that elected them, and they want action on this. and to hear the rhetoric of the president last week here in philadelphia saying that this is a test of our time, you know, they want action to back up that rhetoric. many of them are demonstrating

that they are willing to do whatever it takes, whether you're talking about the texas democrats who are resisting arrest or black women activists and lawmakers who have actually been arrested. you know, you've got more women coming to washington this week echoing -- being in a newsroom, and the suffragists willing to be arrested a century ago for the right to vote. know, this really is something that, you know, if this is not the priority, none of the other priorities that this administration has in terms of its agenda will be moving forward because, you know, these voters, if they are suppressed, if they are not protected in this moment, know, this is not just dangerous for democrats, but what they are saying is it is dangerous for our democracy. >> jen, i had sherrod brown on the show a little while ago. we were talking about the child tax credit which is a huge deal. it's a really big deal. part of it because it reminds

americans how many children in this country who live in poverty and who shouldn't in 2021. one of the things sherrod brown points out, i was missing a republican to have on the show to discuss with them, this child credit goes to families who can then make the decision how to spend it. the one thing about giving impoverished families money is they don't take it to switzerland for skiing vacations. they spend it in their communities, more than every dollar you give people who live paycheck to paycheck gets spent in their communities. >> absolutely. listen, this is a very conservative idea -- >> right. >> -- that you give people programmatic help, that you empower them to spend their own dollars, as you put it. and it is a remarkably transformative idea if it can be extended. as you know, it has to be extended otherwise it will expire. listen, we haven't made a move i think that was this significant -- think of the big legislation of our lifetime, the

civil rights act, the g.i. bill. this is on that magnitude. listen, social security effectively ended poverty for seniors. this can do the same or at least make a huge dent in child poverty. and we would not have it if we had relied on the 60-vote requirement, as you know. this got through a reconciliation. >> yeah. >> and it just shows you how critical it is to unlock the non-democratic, small d, barrier to very popular, very useful legislation. and i think we've gotten ourselves twisted up procedurally so we can't move the country forward in ways that are very bipartisan, very popular. >> erinn, to your point, it not only helps children, the multiplier effect, it helps women. this is a very big deal for women. >> it is a very big deal for families, ali. i'm so glad you're bringing this up of because implementation is going to be key. the overwhelming majority of

people, of courts, will be getting these checks if they are eligible. but there are some folks that the administration knows that they need to reach that they're working with thousands of groups across the country to try to reach the most vulnerable people to make sure they are aware of this tax credit, and that they are signed up and will begin getting those payments as well. but, yes, people are not using this money for, you know, extravagant things. they're using it for the basic necessities and really to give themselves, their families, their children dignity. so, you know, if you are somebody who knows one of these families, i certainly will encourage people to make sure they are aware that this is available to them, and that this is something that needs to be made permanent. these are families that are trying to get to a new normal on the other side of this pandemic. >> as you write in the 19th, the money can mean big things like a new house in a neighborhood free of crime. small things like wipes and cream, detergent for laundry, things that preserve basic

dignity. thank you both friends for helping me end the show this morning. erinn haines, jennifer rubin, author of upcoming book, resistance, how women saved democracy from donald trump. available for purchase in september. we shall talk many times between now and then. that does it for me. thanks for watching velshi. i had a good deal of fun with you this morning. catch me here next saturday and sunday 8:00 a.m. to 10:00 a.m. eastern. it has been a long week for me. can't go to sleep yet, capehart is coming up. the sunday show with jonathan capehart begins right now. one year after the death of civil rights icon john lewis, the battle to protect voting rights is front and center. house majority whip james clyburn is here to discuss what should be done to move things forward. senator amy klobuchar joins us from georgia where she'll lead a hearing tomorrow on the state's punitive voting laws. one of the texaste