among the unvaccinated, the life or death fight against covid-19 just entered a new phase in america. the hardest part might not be the science itself but convincing americans to believe in the science after the damage done by the trump administration and the continuing barrage of disinformation coming from conservative quarters. inspired by the landmark march on selma of 1965, a group of church leaders and democrats will walk the final mile of their voting rights march across texas this morning. we'll take you there live for the latest from texas and from washington, d.c. to which texas democrats have fled in order to stall a republican voter suppression bill and to plead for federal intervention. and there is a high bar for getting the u.s. senate to work on a saturday. but that's what's happening today. the senate will be in session waiting for the final bipartisan infrastructure bill and we'll be there for it. "velshi" starts now.

good morning. it's saturday, july 31st. i'm ali velshi. a number of stunning new revelations about the twice impeached ex-president. apparently his efforts to overturn the election results of 2020 were greater than we knew. just 11 days before a violent mob of supporters would attack our nation's capitol, the ex-president appears to have attempted a coup of his own. in brand-new reporting from the "new york times," notes from top doj officials reveal that the former president pressed the justice department and the attorney general himself to declare the election results corrupt. even though there was no evidence to support that claim. according to notes taken by the former acting deputy attorney general, the ex-president directed him and the former acting attorney general, jeffrey rosen, to "just say that the election was corrupt and leave the rest to me and to

congressional allies." leave the rest to me. for the first time we're starting to uncover specific details about the former president's chaotic last days in office that are beginning to read more and more like a premeditated plot to overturn the 2020 election results and there might be more to come. the justice department has also announced that former trump officials can give unrestricted testimony to the senate and house committees who are investigating the former president'se efforts to undermie biden's victory and the events leading up to the insurrection. on top of that the doj is firing a warning shot at states using trump's big lie about the 2020 election to fuel sham audits like the one that just wrapped up in arizona. the "new york times" writes the department warned that auditors could face criminal and civil penalties if they destroy any records related to the election or intimidate voters in violation of the civil rights act of 1960 and other laws.

and now we may potentially be one step closer to finally looking at the former president's ever-elusive tax returns. the department of justice says the treasury department must turn over six years worth of the ex-president's tax returns to the house ways and means committee. that committee has been seeking those documents for the past two years. so it has been a busy week for the justice department. my next guest is going to help break it down for us. with me now is katie benner, she covers the justice department for the "new york times." she was the first to get her hands on these explosive handwritten notes detailing the pressure that trump was putting on his department of justice as he tried to overturn the election results. good to see you again. thanks for being with us. this puts a lot of flesh on bones that we thought existed. the notes of that phone call are reminiscent of the phone call that -- around the same time of year, president trump made to the secretary of state in

georgia. they're also reminiscent of the phone call he made to the president of ukraine leading to his first impeachment. it's the idea that i need you to do something for me. i need you to put something out in the ether that sheds doubt on the election that will allow me to then do something with that. >> absolutely. the former president understood the power of raising questions, of sowing seeds of doubt in the minds of voters so they would not feel comfortable or confident that democracy worked. they would think the election was a failure. in that type of chaos he could step in and claim to continue he should be the president. that's one reading of the way he phrased -- or the notes show the way his comments were phrased. i don't need you necessarily to overturn the election. i don't need you to get to the bottom of some of these questions. what i really need you to do is simply say the election was

corrupt. we know former president trump is correct in his assessment if that's what happens when you undermine the voracity of something. today we've seen him continue to say the election was stolen. a significant number of americans continue to believe him and we're seeing this chaos that that has sown including that the fbi said one of the biggest domestic terrorism threats facing the united states right now is the threat of violence perpetuated by the idea that the election was not secure and that the election was incorrect. that joe biden is not the president. and that those false notions that are being spread are creating a national security risk. >> we know the pillow guy has been perpetrating this. other media has been perpetrating this idea of a stolen election. it's a big escalation to see there is direct contact between the president and the attorney general because we're all supposed to think the attorney general is not the president's lawyer. but it's a bigger escalation

that we see there are notes. are there more? is there more stuff? the department of justice told former trump officials they will not be impeded from testifying before committees or passing evidence along. >> that's correct. we can expect to see more documents passed between the justice department and the two committees on the hill looking into the final days of the trump administration and looking into the events leading up to january 6th and those committees are the senate judiciary committee and the house oversight committee. those two investigative bodies right now are requesting information from the justice department and then we'll see what happens should interviews occur. certainly witnesses have already been notified that the committee would like to speak with them. and depending on what they say behind closed-door testimony we could see another barrage of requests from the justice department or other entities. we know the senate judiciary committee asked the national archive for all messages that it would have, it would be saving

white house communications for all messages that it has related to the final days of the white house. i don't think we've seen the end of new revelations coming out of those final weeks. what do we know -- given you follow the justice department, there's information that the treasury department should hand over donald trump's tax returns that the houses committee has been getting at. is that likely to happen? what happens next? ways and means has sued for these documents and the government under trump has said they don't want to hand them over. the justice department under merrick garland said, yes, indeed, congress and the committee made a reasonable request for the documents and the treasury should turn them over. we also heard from the administration that the treasury will turn them over. it's basically all sides going to court and agreeing on next steps. you could see the former president sue in order to stop

both testimony of his former officials to senate -- to the house oversight committee and the senate judiciary committee. the president could attempt to stop testimony and the president could attempt to stop the transfer of the records. i think it will be an uphill battle on the latter point. once the tax returns go to the house ways and means committee, should that happen, it's not certain that the public would right away see those records. that transfer is governed by a lot of privacy restrictions. >> thanks for joining me. thanks because i know you were up late last night because you were on tv with me talking about this last night. kitty benner reporter with the "new york times." elsewhere on capitol hill, lawmakers are racing against the clock to pass president biden's

infrastructure bill. chuck schumer says the chamber will come back into session this morning as they await the text of the legislation which is still being finalized. this comes as the bill clears a major hurdle on the road towards the president's desk. yesterday the majority of the senate from both sides of the aisle signaled that support for the legislation that would put billions towards the country's physical structure like roads, public transit and buildings. schumer said this part of the bipartisan deal and the budget resolution that the democrats are pushing for to work on their separate $3.5 trillion package before the upcoming senate recess. that's a good thing because now progressive democrats in the house say they won't consider the smaller bipartisan infrastructure bill unless the senate passes the budget reconciliation one. with me is hank johnson of georgia. he's a member of the house

transportation and infrastructure and judiciary committees. thanks for being with us. how do you see this unfolding? we have bipartisan support for the part of the bill that you would have assumed we had bipartisan support for. the fixing of roads, bridges, public transport. we've got some problems on the much bigger bill that democrats are interested in. >> well, i tell you, thank you for having me this morning, ali. i think the fact that democrats control the house and the senate, though those -- that control is very slight. we do have the ability to deliver for the american people. we already delivered the american rescue plan which lifted our economy from the doldrums of another great recession. and we injected money into this

economy which got people back to work, got our children back to school safely or at least gives them a chance of returning to school safely now. and put money into peoples pockets. and made an initial investment to rebuild america. but at this time in the nation's history, we can't afford to just go back to the same old same old the way it was. we have to build america back better and so the american jobs plan and the american families plan, both of which have been introduced and will be incorporated in a budget reconciliation bill that the senate and the house will take up will do just that. it will rebuild america. and it's so important that we restructure our economy so that this economy will work for us all, not just for the top 1% as it did during the tax cut era

that we have been involved in for the last 50 years. in that tax cut era has resulted in a decline by 40% of public investment into america. we have to start investing in america? guess who pays for it? those who got that $5.8 trillion tax cut back in 201 and didn't need it. >> congressman, you are from georgia. i want to ask you about things going on in georgia right now. we're watching texas this morning where there is a march protesting restricting voter rights. in georgia it's something entirely different. you were participating in the summer of action. they're looking at taking the elections chief in fulton county, atlanta, and replacing them, which is not something you

can organize around, right? there's a lot of things happening across the country that people can organize around in terms of fewer ballot boxes or less time to vote. what they're talking about in georgia is the ability to basically overturn elections, to control elections that you don't like the outcome of. >> they're setting up an infrastructure to destroy the vote in america. they're doing it quite publicly. everyone can see it. some are in denial about what they're doing. our onnow is to awaken the american people to the threat that exists to the democracy that all of us live up under. it's not just black people now. it's brown people, it's white people, it's asians. all of us live in this country. all of us have a fundamental right to vote. and if that vote -- if that right to vote goes away for any segment of us, then it means the others don't have a democracy

either. so it's important now for all people to take some action to force the united states senate to come to grips with the fact that we're going to have to enact some measures to protect the vote. and to the extent that the filibuster impedes the senate's ability to deal with this threat to our vote, then that filibuster has to go. so it's a racist origin and it's been used for racial purposes to deny black people our civil rights. it's something that has to go away as far as constitutional issues like voting rights are concerned. they've done it for issues like the budget. they've abandoned the filibuster when it comes to judicial appointments. and those measures don't have to

go through that 60-vote threshold requirement and voting rights is something that doesn't need to be going through it either. >> congressman, good to see you. thank you for joining us. democratic congressman hank johnson of georgia. we're moving over to texas where democratic state legislators have been calling out for federal intervention as republicans push to roll back voting rights. 57 texas democrats have been fighting their republican colleagues from afar in washington, d.c. after absenting themselves from the state legislative session called by governor greg abbott earlier this month, a hail mary, if you will, to stall the voter suppression bill by breaking the quorum in the legislature. the texas democrats walking out of the state capitol last may to temporarily halt the passage of severe voting restrictions. abbott called for a special session in july to try again to push through the new voter suppression measures. democrats walked out again. and now they wait -- as they

wait out the special session in washington, they're looking for federal lawmakers to come to their defense. joining me now is jasmine crocket of texas. she's a civil rights attorney by trade. representative crocket, good to see you again. thank you for being with us. you made incredibly clear when testifying before a congressional committee this week that you can do what you can do in texas, but ultimately you can't finish the job without federal help. >> yeah. so good morning, ali. it's good to see you as well. unfortunately i didn't get to testify, but nicole collier, she did make those points. she is the chair of the black caucus. and, you know, what was really frustrating was that during those hearings we saw a texas congressman say i received this text message. your colleagues have agreed to work on this issue. it's amazing that once on the

national -- in the national headlines, now finally they're like, oh, yeah, we messed up, right? we couldn't have these conversations and these negotiations back home. instead, our republican colleagues made it clear that they were not interested in negotiating whatsoever, even if. >> now, what's the -- what is it that you most want the feds to do? at this point there's a new voting rights bill being worked out by reverend warnock. two have been stalled. what would you like most to happen? you want a federal law that has a basis for what states can't do to take voting rights away? >> absolutely. so what people don't understand is the full context of what's going on in texas. texas does make it harder than any other state to vote. so some of the things that they're discussing in this bill would have same-day voter registration, something we can't get a hearing on in the state of texas.

online voter registration, which the majority of states have, but we can't even get a hearing on in the state of texas. so this baseline bill would provide for more access. the problem in texas is that they reduce the access and then after they reduce the access, they do other things to make it even more difficult to vote as far as things such as what they talked about earlier this week when they talked about if you don't recall which form of i.d. you use when you registered, whether it was the last four of your social security or your drive's license if you registered 20, 30 years ago and you put down the wrong one, even though it's correct for you on your vote by mail application or vote by mail ballot, they would kick it out. so it's those types of little things they're doing. so they're trying to make sure they have the ability to easily throw votes out and they also make sure that they restrict access to the ballot box. one of the measures that has not been discussed often is the fact

that we had a number of dropboxes for these ballot by mail applications as well as the ballots themselves. and the governor said no. we only want to make sure there's one dropbox in the entire county. you start talking about a county the size of harris county. you tell me if that's restrictive? it absolutely is. so, you know, having this baseline that expands access in the state of texas would do a great deal for us. >> are you concerned that this has been said inhe texas legislature by you and your colleagues, what problems are you solving for because you didn't have the problems that any of these measures would actually solve. all these things that the texas republicans want to do would not result in their being any difference in the election. people believe them. people believe republicans who say this is about voter fraud and election security even if it isn't.

>> they're liars. i mean, i don't really know how else to put it except the fact they're liars. earlier this week i had an opportunity to do a town hall. i talked about the numbers. i don't know what the exact numbers are when we start talking percentages. what i told that group, because this is a group that deals with women's rights as it relates to their bodies. i said let's think of it like maury povich and the baby daddy situation he would have all the time. the reality is texas doesn't have an issue. texas doesn't have a baby daddy named voter fraud when we look at the numbers. from a scientific standpoint, yes, there may be some voter fraud. nothing in this world is perfect. when we look at the number, it's 0.000 something. so essentially if we were talking in the words of maury povich, it would be texas, you don't have a baby daddy named voter fraud. let's move on to things we do have a problem with such as our

infrastructure, keeping the lights on. such as covid-19 because our governor this week decided that no local elected official would be allowed to invoke a mask mandate. why? why are you continuing to kill people in the state of texas? that's what we need to talk about. that's where we have real numbers and a real problem. >> the list of things we didn't think we would say on this show in the morning just grew longer. texas doesn't have a baby daddy called voter fraud. jasmine crocket, thank you. you have woken us all up. jasmine crocket state representative from texas. we won't go far from texas. we have a live report from that voting rights rally from austin, texas later in the hour. the rally will take place at 11:00 eastern, 10:00 a.m. central, but they're literally walking the final mile of a walk across texas. we'll catch up with julian castro who will join that march

in his homestate. and i'll talk to congresswoman madeleine dean about voting rights and how congress might get an infrastructure deal passed. amid another surge in covid-19 cases, new data showing the delta variant is more contagious than the chicken pox. the cdc is out with a new warning. the war has changed. you're watching "velshi." wright brothers? more like, yeah right, brothers! get outta here! it's not crazy. it's a scramble. just crack an egg.

history says: fine jewelry for occasions. we say: forget occasions. (snap) fine jewelry for every day, minus the traditional markups. ♪♪ let me read you this tweet. law enforcement face dangerous threats in society and we exist to stop their violence. the mob doesn't want that. they're coming after the freedoms we hold dear. this is not a peaceful protest. this is a violent mob with an agenda to destroy our nation. now, without context, i wouldn't hold it against you if you assume this tweet has to deal with the january 6th insurrection. a violent mob. an attack on our nation. a dangerous situation for law

enforcement officers. this was tweeted out last summer by the fraternal order of police. the oldest and largest union representing police officers in the united states. it's in reference to the black lives matter movement. it's referring to a specific story about blm protesters allegedly shooting at a black police officer in wisconsin. that was some strong language, but one glance at its twitter page reveals that rhetoric is standard. there are tweets referring to suspects as dirt bags, the twitter page consistently rails against progressive lawmakers calling for americans to "vote their behinds out." they don't use the word behind. they use the word that starts with an "a" and rhymes with sass. needless to say, the fraternal order of police is not shy about defending law enforcement, which is why it's even more baffling that the typically vocal union has been uncharacteristically

quiet when it comes to defending the police officers who fended this off, rioters on january 6th. now, to be fair, the union did decry the attack on the capitol from the start calling on the insurrection president at the time to forcefully urge the demonstrators to stop their unlawful activity. but according to metro d.c. police officer michael fanone, the support pretty much stopped there. he was one of the many officers who defended the capitol on january 6th. he was assaulted with his own taser, later suffered a heart attack and now has lingering brain injuries. he and three other officers painted a daunting picture that day when testifying. even after his testimony, he told the media he was disappointed in the union and hoped it would come out stronger against the insurrectionists who maimed, poisoned, hit, kicked, stabbed and in one case killed police officers. he said it took the union six months to reach out to him following the insurrection.

now, in response, the fraternal order of police referred back to its original statement that was released on january 6th and added in part we continue to offer our support, gratitude and love for our brothers and sisters in law enforcement who successfully fought off the rioters. but that's it. it's unusually quiet for a union when their members come under threat, actual physical threat. why is it that the largest police union in the nation is largely ignoring one of the most egregious attacks on law enforcement that this country ever witnessed? it might have something to do with this. if you go to the website for the fraternal order of police, you see the motto. it's right above this prominently placed photo of you know who. the fraternal order of police, like many police unions and police officers in this country still support the former insurrection president. he's on their webpage. despite what happened on capitol hill on january 6th, many cops

like and continue to like the very guy who tried to set american democracy on fire. now, you know i'm a vocal supporter of unions. i have been for decades. it's critical that workers have a say in their work life and that they have access to solid representation. but it is also critical that we call out unions that are making decisions, bad decisions, and this is one of those unions. this is one of those bad decisions. were the desperate cries of their officers loud enough to set politics aside in the true interests of its members? let's hope so. when it comes to domestic extremism and anti-democratic action in america, police and police unions need to be part of the solution not part of the problem. emulsions for 100% whiter teeth. its highly active peroxide droplets swipe on in seconds. better. faster.

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it's felt like we've been in

the final stages of the coronavirus pandemic for a while now. masks have been coming off. americans have begun gathering again. people have been steadily going back to work like i have. that return to normally could be upended by the latest revelation by the delta variant. in a slide obtained by nbc news but first reported by the "washington post," the agency issued a stark warning about the current state of the fight against covid "acknowledge the war has changed." according to that detailed document, the delta variant causes more severe illness than earlier variants, is highly con tabl contagious and spreads like the chicken pox. it says vaccinated individuals who contract the infection may be as contagious as unvaccinated people. this warning is a red flag, a scientific basis for the cdc recent abrupt change in mask wearing guidance that urges

vaccinated people to begin wearing face coverings again in certain situations. right now delta is surging through the country. the map shows in red all the states experiencing case increases of 100% or more over the last two weeks. only 12 states, 12 of the 50 are not highlighted. the delta variant is responsible for most of these infections. joining me now is the virologist and immunologist dr. rick bright. we have known and know that people uninfected are getting the delta variant. that's the predominant variant in the united states and many other places at this point. the new news is how susceptible that those who are vaccinated are to this variant and possibly needs to mask up. you were in the u.s. government

when these things were going back and forth and there was arguments about what you're supposed to tell the public. now we are stuck with the cdc with a bit of a messaging problem. what is going on now and what should we believe? >> thanks for having me once again. good to see you. it is painful to watch the delay in the messaging coming out to the american public and people around the world. we have known about the threat of this formidable foe, this delta variant for seven months as we watched it rip through india, singapore, israel and the uk and now coming into the united states. this should not be a surprise to us. it's disappointing that news is still being delayed coming out of our public health agencies who i know are working hard to get in front of this virus. we need to be honest. we need to be transparent and we need to be rapid with this communication about this virus. we're learning, as you said, it is more contagious than the previous version of the covid virus.

it's more contagious than many viruses we've ever dealt with in the past, in history. but i don't want to get lost in that message the value of the vaccine. so even as we learn and information is revealed about this delta variant, we're also learning that the vaccines are working really, really well at preventing people from dying and from being hospitalized, even though they can still get infected with this virus. >> rick, last year there was the politicalzation of a number of these health agencies including the cdc. there was tension within the cdc about seeing their boss standing there with donald trump who was delivering disinformation. in theory, that's all gone. in theory that ended on january 20th. you got a cdc working with an administration that believes in the science. why would we still be getting complexities in the delivery of the messaging now? there's not inherent political tension. >> yeah. i'm really impressed by the

progress that was made over the last several months. i had the honor of being on the covid-19 advisory board for the biden administration. i have a lot of confidence in the people and scientists in office now. i know they're doing a good job at trying to collect the data and follow the science. the information and recommendations that we're getting from the cdc now are about the science and following the science. the issue i have, though, is still the lag and the delay and the lack of transparency for this information getting out to americans. we're almost still in denial that this virus is as bad as we know it is. and we are almost overly hesitant of telling americans how bad this virus is and giving them the information they need to save their lives. we need to be telling people that the vaccine works and we should get vaccinated as soon as possible. we need to tell people that the virus is still contagious, you can't get infected, even if

you're vaccinated. so the key message is masks work. the other message we're not doing well, ali, about masking is the type of mask. it's not just any facial covering that works. we need to focus on n95 respirators and remind people how to wear those masks. i'm seeing a lot of people with a mask under their chin thinking they are wearing a mask. they need to be over your mouth and nose and they need to be tight. >> i'm seeing a bunch of guys in particular who have their nose above their mask. it's like put the whole thing up. the president has been very, very consistent since he got into office and elected about wanting to get these vaccines out. there was never ambivalence about it. he set a goal of 70% of people being inoculated by july 4th. i'm just curious, if we had done that or if we had not hit up against this vaccine hesitancy, would we be in this problem with this variant, the delta variant

spreading as much as it is right now? could getting everybody vaccinated or more people vaccinated just solve this thing? >> it would definitely put us in a better place. the more people we have vaccinated the better place we're going to be. the more resistance we'll have against the virus. it's key to remember this is a global issue. it's not just about vaccinating every american. we have to vaccinate everyone around the world to stop this virus because delta emerged in some other part of the world where they were not vaccinated, they were not following strict guidelines in how to restrict the spread of this virus. the other -- the next variant is emerging today. if we do not vaccinate the world quickly and block out all the spaces where this virus can change, it will continue getting stronger and stronger and stronger and continue whipping back on us and other countries that are well vaccinated with a new variant and keep putting these challenges in front of us. when we win the battle of this virus, the war is not over.

we have to keep fighting. >> good advice, rick. we appreciate you getting up and early talking with us. dr. rick bright from the rockefeller foundation. he was part of the covid-19 advisory board. what i wanted is what they wanted. that's what the insurrectionist former president said about the people who attacked the united states capitol in the effort to destroy democracy and hang his vice president. it's part of phil rucker's new bombshell book. he joins the show in a moment. stay tuned. citi launched the impact fund to invest in both women and entrepreneurs of color like me, so i can realize my vision and give everything i've got to my company, and my community. i got you. for the love of people. for the love of community. for the love of progress.

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i would like you to do us a favor. that was the operative phase in donald trump's july call trying to coerce vladimir zelensky to make remarks against joe biden who was his top opponent. a couple months later trump was impeached by the house but not convicted. i know that first impeachment feels like a lifetime ago, but who knows how the 2020 election turned out had someone not been willing to blow the whistle about that call. the guy who did is this guy. retired lieutenant colonel alexander vindman. he testified to the fact that during trump's first impeachment

trial in 2019, and he will join me on monday for his first cable news interview when i fill in for rachel madow. we'll discuss his time at the white house, his critical time in congress and his upcoming memoir. that's monday at 9:00 p.m. on msnbc. you won't want to miss that, until then we go to austin, texas after a live report from the voting rights march as church leaders and democrats walk the final mile to land at the texas capitol. you're watching "velshi" on msnbc. winner, seven years in a row. in fact, subaru has won most trusted brand for more consecutive years than any other brand. no wonder kelley blue book also picked subaru as their best overall brand. once again. it's easy to love a brand you can trust. it's easy to love a subaru.

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when our daughter and her kids moved in with us... our bargain detergent couldn't keep up. turns out it's mostly water. so, we switched back to tide. one wash, stains are gone. [daughter] slurping don't pay for water. pay for clean. it's got to be tide. turning back to texas where i mentioned earlier in the show, state democratic leaders are currently not located, they remain in washington, d.c. they have been there for nearly three weeks in an effort to prevent texas republicans to enact far-reaching voting restrictions. in texas, thousands are set to

take part in a voting rights valley. it follows a four-day, 27-mile selma to monmontgomery-style ma. gary is there in austin. gary, good morning to you. still early yet. but it is the final mile of that walk coming up. what's going to happen and what's the goal? >> good morning. you know, it's a term often used by activists and organizers, it's called bring the heat. there will be thousands of people out here in the heat of austin, texas. they will be rallying for voting rights. they'll be joined by willie nelson, he will be lending his voice to the cause here as well. while the momentum here is palatable, there's excitement here in austin, what's happening in washington is a different story. the president and the vice

president met with congressional leadership yesterday to talk about the future of voting rights legislation. according to our hill team's reporting it will be a slimmed down situation. we're talking about voting access issues. things like early voting, same-day voter registration. while that is happening, it's almost certainly an issue on timing, of when that could happen. i want to introduce you to a few people marching from georgetown, texas to austin this week. here's what they had to say. >> a little bit of heat won't hurt anybody. it's such a huge opportunity to get them started down the right path and see the world for what it is. >> do you think it's important for you to be here doing this today? >> yes. >> why? >> because it gives me a chance to change things. >> so as i mentioned this is all an issue related to timing. the special session of the texas legislature ends a week from today. congress is on august recess starting next week.

so speaker pelosi said she will bring back members if there is legislation to vote on. advocates say the longer this is drawn out the harder it is to keep pressure on legislators. >> thank you for your reporting. you will be reporting all day today as that rally gets under way. two of the organizers of the march, beto o'rourke and william barber will join us live at 10:00 a.m. eastern. up next, the house select committee investigating january 6th is under way. if you want a good read on the events that led up to the riot, look no further than several books written by white house journalists that take the events from the insurrectionists' mouths. phil rucker joins me after the break. ker joins me after the break. booster downy unstopables this is the sound of change from pnc bank. it's the sound of low cash mode,

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are you okay? -yeah. this week kicked off the house select committee investigation into the january 6th insurrection. it's pretty obvious that one of the contributing factors was trump's big lie about election fraud. president trump is describings angry mob, as a quote, loving crowd. he also said this. >> personally what i wanted is what they want. they showed up just to show support, because i happen to believe the election was rigged at a level like nothing has ever been rigged before >> what i want is -- what i wanted is what they wanted. he is talking about a mob of

insurrectionist. a quick refresher, some of the rioters say said they wanted to hang mike pence. they beat capitol police officers. attempted to take over the capitol building. that sound byte is what the former president said to "the washington post" phil rick are rucker and carol leonnig for their book, i alone can fix it. phil rucker is a correspondent for the posivio and msnbc political analyst. good to see you, my friend. one of the things your book talks about is what happened when donald trump found out that, you know, mike pence was safe. trump said nothing more. he didn't express any hope that pence was okay. he didn't try to call the vice-president to check on him. he just stayed in the dining room watching television. donald trump was not fundamentally terribly upset with abouto about the events of january 6th. he was upset about losing the election and wanted that undone >> that's exactly right, ali. our reporting inside the white

house that day shows president trump was transfixed by what he was watching on television. he actually liked what he saw, because he saw thousands of his supporters storming the steps of the capitol and carrying trump flags and wearing the red make america great again hats. and he thought this was the show of force necessary to overturn election results. but he wasn't moved to check on the safety of the vice-president. he was upset with pence. he thought pence's to go ahead and oversee the certification of the electoral college count was an act betrayal. but what pence was doing what he was required to do by the bounds of the constitution >> i'm curious given the new reporting about the notes taken after donald trump called the acting attorney general at the end of december to say i want you to say the election was fraudulent. does donald trump believe this stuff? or does he just know that it's

effective, the more he says the election was rigged and fraud, the ballots mail-in ballots were fraudulent, that people believe him and continues to give him momentum. where do you think he falls on the line having spoken to him extensively? >> you know, the honest answer is we can't know for certain because we can't get inside his head. we've tried for years. there is no getting in there. what i can tell from you the conversation karolyn and i had with him at mar-a-lago and our reporting around him in recent months and see he does believe the election lie. he didn't believe it at first in the immediate aftermath of the election. but this is one of those things where he repeated it so many times and has been told it so many times by the people around him like rudy giuliani and mike lindland, the my pillow guy, that it's become true to him now. when he was sitting with us at mar-a-lago he spoke about the lie about election fraud with such conviction and certainty, and no sense he was in on the joke. he really seemed to be believing

it. and i have to think it's one of the lies he repeated so many times it's become true in his own mind >> yeah, and part of the problem is that -- i don't know where that line is between believing it or not believing it. but general mark millie according or to your book had been on edge. milley saw trump as a classic authoritarian leader with nothing to lose. parallels between trump's rerhetoric about election fraud and adolph hit letter's insistence that he was a victim and their savior. this is -- the idea is that if donald trump believed he could do it and use the apparatus of state to achieve what he wanted which we saw with his attempt to cajole the president of ukraine. . the call to brad raffensperger in september and the call to attorney general jeff rossen, milley had the fear it could have no bounds. >> absolutely. and the fear was real and

intensified as we got closer to january 6th. it wasn't just milley who had the concerns. the other leaders at the pentagon did as well. and milley and the joint chiefs, the heads of the army and air force and navy, the other branches of the military put together a plan of what they would do if president trump were to have issued some sort of order to the military as commander in chief that they considered unconstitutional or dangerous for the country. they were prepared to resign one by one in sort of a slow, steady succession of events all designed to delay the implementation of whatever illegal order came from the white house. >> remarkable book, phil. a lot of work by you and your colleague. thanks for joining us. phil rucker a senior correspondent with "the washington post," msnbc political analyst and the author of the book "i alone can fix it." more on velshi. i'll be jund by julian castro,

the hud secretary under obama. who is on the march for democracy in texas and congresswoman mad lean dean. another hour of velshi starts right now. good morning. saturday july 31st. i'm ali velshi. we have a ton happening. let's get to it as the highly infectious delta variant of the coronavirus rips through the nation, alarming new data reveals how easily it can be spread even among fully vaccinated people. president biden is warning that covid-related restrictions could make a comeback. we'll dive deeper into how lower than expected vaccination rates drive the surge in a bit. but meanwhile newly released documents from the house oversight committee reveal just how far the failed former president went in the attempt to overturn the 2020 election results last year.

according to handwritten notes taken by officials on the call, he pressed top justice department leaders to go along with his big lie and declare the election he lost to be, quote, corrupt. with zero evidence. the ex-president told the doj phone bills leave the rest to him say it was corrupt and leave the rest to me and his republican allies in congress. this phone call happened december 27th, 11 days before a violent mob of supporters attacked the capitol in an attempt to disrupt the country's typical peaceful transfer of power. as congress continues to investigate the events leading up to january 6th we could lerp more from the officials under the administration. the justice department says those officials will legally allowed to give unrestricted testimony to the various committees investigating the ex-president's attempts to subvert the results of the the election. the doj is also now clearing the way for congress and potentially the public to get a