good morning, saturday, september 4th. i'm ali velshi and my thanks to my friends for filling in for me during my time off. we begin this hour with the escalation this week in the war on women. the gop finally been able to do what it's been trying to do for decades, find a way around roe v. wade and fechktly ban abortions across one entire american state. and it might be catching. because the legislative legal template for the legal republicans with the mcconnell stolen trump stacked supreme court signed off on is set to be the meddle in several very red states, including arkansas, florida, idaho, indiana, oklahoma and south dakota. medical professionals in new mexico are bracing for increase in women seeking treatment from texas if they can afraid to travel there. and that's important. because what this blatant attack on women's rights also is is a badly veiled attack on the poor and vulnerable.

if you got the ways and means and money you'll be able to get treatment. but if you don't then you won't. it also affects medical providers and the last night on all-in amy hag strom mill miller, the founder of and ceo of whole women's health, the organization challenging the texas abortion ban in the supreme court, spoke about the situation facing providers. >> we have seen lots of people come in since this law was passed heart breakingly we have had to turn away quite a lot of people. and it's been really really difficult for our staff members who are there because of their commitment to this work, because of their commitment to the human rights and justice issue that was abortion, having to look people in the eyes and deny them care that they could provider just two or three days ago. it's really heart breaking for all of us to be put in this position. >> the fight is being joined, though. meanwhile, several companies and groups are starting to speak out

and fight back. lyft and uber both say they will cover legal fees for any drivers sued under the new texas law. and that's relevant, because the law works by preventing state governments from enforcing it. but instead deputyizes private citizens to enforce the law by a civil lawsuit. which can be brought by anyone even if you have nothing to do with the person getting the abortion and you aren't from texas, against anyone associated with the abortion treatment, including a driver for at least $10,000 per defendant. lyft also is donating $$1 million to planned parenthood. social media influencers are doing what they can too. as you can see by the lenl tiktokers bombarded anti-borings with schreck porn and false information. in the last hour since first reporting i don't know what shrek porn is. i'm going to let one of the organizers describe the situation via a tiktok video

with almost a million views. >> if you go to the pro-life whistle-blower.com which i put in the caption below you can see that texas has anonymously set up a system where you can report people who have gotten abortions won it be so awful if we sent in a bunch of fake tips and crashed the site. like greb abbott's butt stinks. >> that and apparently alternate version he is of shrek. it's run by a private anti-abortion group which is how the state of texas intends for the law to be enforced. but the same anti-abortion group who is site was overwhelmed by ticket irisicers suffered a flow. a texas district court judge granted a temporary restraining order preventing them from enforcing the law against planned parenthood. joining me now an editor from "the washington post," ruth marcus one of her latest pieces gets to the heart of the matter. the supreme court aidsen abets texas in violating women's

constitutional rights. ruth, good to see you. thank you for with being with us this morning. you've made an interesting point. i've been talking about this. but you summed it up in your column. i want to read our viewers a portion from it in which you say congratulations, texas, you did it. you figured out a way to write an anti-abortion law that everyone agrees is unconstitutional under current law and ensure the women whose rights are violated don't have the ability to challenge it in court. a five justice supreme court majority instead of slapping down this end run around the constitution and the judicial process is happily aiding and abetting it. it's a sad day for women but also for the rule of law. that really sums it up. there are two things going on. the attack on abortion and the failure of the supreme court to do -- to uphold its own historical precedent. >> i think that's exactly right. and the failure of the supreme court to, as chief -- the chief

justice john roberts urged with the three remaining liberal justices, to keep the status quo in place. while we follow the federal courts and state courts figure out the constitutional status, spoiler alert, it's unconstitutional -- of this law. so the justices just rushed in instead of letting the case go through the courts and keeping the status quo in place. >> so, ruth, i guess the question is, people out there are saying everything ranging from this is the beginning of the end of roe v. wade to there are things biden will do. there are things congress will do. i spoke to representative judy chu this morning who since 2013 has been trying to put real legislation in place, the way most western democratic countries have to protect abortion which we don't have that the united states. where do you think it goes from here? >> well, in terms of a congressional solution -- and

i'm all in favor of a congressional solution -- the reality is that that's not available given the current state of congressional rules, given the slim democratic majority and given the need for any legislation on in subject to is your mount a filibuster in the senate. and that's a whole other segment. so where things go from here is something that you suggested in your opening, which is, why would this stay in texas? i'm looking -- i'm imagining a landscape six months from now where you could have eight states, a dozen states, passing some version of the texas law. by the way, there is no reason it would have to only prevent abortions at six weeks. any state could pass a law that says we prohibit abortion entirely. it's just as unconstitutional as the fetal heartbeat law that texas has. and -- but we don't enforce it ourselves so leave us alone. and the justices, i think,

really didn't look down the road at what they have opened the door to. so meanwhile, while red states could scurry to do that, blue states could create their own constitutional mischief. what's to prevent a blue state from saying, there is a second amendment we don't like it, we're outlawing handguns. and if you find one of your neighbors with a handgun there is a $10 bounty -- $10,000 bounty for you. then you're in a state of constitutional chaos. >> ruth marcus, the columnist and deputy editorial page editor at the “washington post”. joining me now miriam camaro, the vice-president of the social programs at refugee and immigrant center for education and legal services. in a statement the organization vows to disobey the texas law saying in part the ban on abortion in texas is an abomination. we want to send a clear message.

our organization will not bae in archaic and serksist law. thank you for being with us this morning. i addressed a number of potential outcomes and changes with ruth and judy chu earlier. but you and the organization are saying we'll break the law. litt and uber said we'll pay for the defense of drivers charged under the vigilanty law in texas. our women needing abortion who don't have the means to go to new mexico or somewhere else to get that abortion, are they going to be willing to accept the risk that you will come to their aid? >> good morning. i do believe our organization's stance is reproductive rights are human rights as well as we see migration as a human right as well. it was a dark and unfortunate day when we saw the law become

enacted. the way that the organization will be performing disobedience is to make sure our clients remain and have access to care. it's a very daunting law. it's a law that will very highly oppress people of color. and vulnerable groups like our clients and the migrant population at large. >> tell me more about that. because we have said that all week. but explain why this disproportionately affects women of color, women in vulnerable situations, including immigrants and refugees, people who live -- people of low wealth. >> absolutely, specifically with the migrant population, this will highly impact them. they are already a very vulnerable population. although the law makes exceptions for emergency situations, it does not make any exceptions for our victims of

rape, child abuse, trafficking, domestic violence. it really puts them in extremely vulnerable population. our migrant community already is very hesitant to access any sort of community resources, including medical care due to the public charge law. so this will really, really impact if they cannot even know that they are within that heartbeat threshold, getting them access within texas. this is why we will pivot our plan of action to go to out of state abortion service providers. but even then traveling and crossing state lines for our clients makes them in a very risky move to be able to do that. and that's only our clients that we have care and support over. i cannot even imagine those that are at large that do not have any access or support whatsoever. and even if they do seek it, those that are trying to support

them can be deputyized and could be fined. that's what what's really really scary as of these last couple of days and for the days to come. >> you made an interesting point when you talk about women who do not know that they are inside that -- the heartbeat threshold, as you describe it. this is a conversation that a whole lot of men who have never been pregnant don't really have. women of modest economic means or without adequate health care, it is entirely possible they would not know they are pregnant at six weeks. a bunch of people there is not any way you know you're not pregnant at six weeks. that's only non-sense come out of mouth of someone not knowing about pregnancy. women can absolutely not know they are pregnant at six weeks. >> absolutely. i think that's also applying the standard that everyone has access to compelled care, everyone doesn't have language barriers, barriers instilling fear anwar, manifestations of

post traumatic stress zoord. it's applying a perfect standard everyone knows you to perfectly know everything. but in reality life is different. and i think it's also a very, very scary situation for a woman to even want to go to a medical provider to even see if they're within that threshold to pursue or make a choice on that. >> which is why when people talk about abortion being a health care issue if we just had health care for everybody we would at least understand those kind of things but there are a bunch of women find out they're pregnant require abortion and now in texas can't get one. mirian associate vice-president of riesus. joining me now is james clyburn of south carolina, a regular guest on the show. we love seeing his picture. we have technical problems this morning, congressman. i'm glad to have you here regardless. i want to continue the conversation with you. because i've taken your name a few times this morning. you had said in this -- this

sort of unsolvable fight about the filibuster in the senate, you had said voting rights should be an exception. you all can keep the filibuster for other things but for voting rights this is too important to have to reach the threshold the filibuster requires. now talk to me about this, this texas law. the ban on abortion now going to be spreading like wildfire through other states. do you think this should be subject to the filibuster in the senate? >> well, first of all, thank you for having me. you know, i've said coupled with that, voting rights like all other constitutional rights ought not be subjected to the whims of any one person. and so the supreme court in roe v. wade made it very clear embedded in the constitution of the united states the women's right to choose is there. privacy rights. that's what they rested it upon. and nothing is more private than this kind of a situation.

and so i think it's very clear that the filibuster ought not apply to anything akin to a constitutional violation. it allows one person to let his or her views take precedent over the constitution of the united states. and so i think that roe v. wade, founded -- privacy rights of the constitution, ought not be subjected to the filibuster. >> i spoke to your colleague judy chu who has since 2013 been trying to codify abortion rights into law. nancy pelosi says you'll have a floor vote on that. her bill has 216 cosponsor meaning likely to pass in the house. 48 firm supporters in the senate plus two republicans supporting it. so 50 in the senate plus the vice-president which means under simple majority if you got rid of the filibuster you could do

what should have been done decades ago and codify abortion rights into law. what do you believe is the likelihood of the legislative solution to the supreme court issue that just occurred? >> i think it's very likely. i think the supreme court when it sort of put the ball so to speak really in a strange way is saying let there be a legislative fix. and so we should have done this years ago. judy chu is to be commended for staying with this issue. i hope that we get the vote on it next month. and i suspect that long before november 1st it will pass the senate. >> your colleague, senator joe manchin of west virginia has said as it relates to the new bill that the large bill, the budget reconciliation bill, that

you and others want to get passed, he says we should take the gas off the pedal, slow down, take a pause for a little while. what do you have to say about that? >> i say joe manchin is late to the game. that's what nancy pelosi did several weeks ago when she did the rule and paused the whole process on the $3.5 trillion to allow the committees the time it needs to come up with legislation. the 3.5 happens to be a ceiling. it may be something less than 3.5 that will satisfy. but i want joe manchin to take a look at what they did with their bipartisan bill. let's take, for example, broad band. broad band according to all the experts -- did in order to build out the country in four to five years we need $100 billion. they came up with 65 billion. that's two-thirds of the way. so the 3.5 contains processes as

well as funds by which we we can build out the rest of the country with broad band. because if you only two two-thirds i think juror senator manchin snows in his native state of west virginia, the chances of the 65% being spread across the whole state are nil. then who gets the two-thirds application be and who will be left out for the one-third? is it will take us back to where we were after the so-called in new deal when throughout the south places, communities recovered, other communities did not recover. simply because they were allowed to discriminate against communities. and that's what will happen with broad band and other parts of the bipartisan bill. so either we allow the 3.5 trillion to be discuss the it may be only 2.5 maybe 3.

that's what nancy pelosi was doing. the strategic pause is under way. >> thank you for joining us this morning. i'm sorry we couldn't see your picture. but that just means we have to book you again so we can see you. senator database representative -- representative james clyburn of south carolina. still ahead, covid-19 doesn't care how old you are. shocking numbers show increase in youth hospitalizations as schools across the nation open doors for a new year. what you need to know, next. w yr what you need to know, next. dice possible at 40,000 feet. instead of burning our past for power, we can harness the energy of the tiny electron. we can create new ways to connect. rethinking how we communicate to be more inclusive than ever. with app, cloud and anywhere workspace solutions, vmware helps companies navigate change. faster. vmware. welcome change.

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kmol dumouliner.

alone, over 53,000 children, age 17 and under were admitted to the hospital with covid-19. that's according to cdc data. the rate at which kids are getting hospitalized with covid far surpasses anything we saw during the winter covid peak. put it this way.

during the last week of august, a child accounted for one in every five covid cases, according to the american academy of pediatrics. with kids going back to school cross across the kr he. . icu beds are overwhelmed or at capacity in hard hit states. what does that mean? here is how this emergency medicine physician explained it. it means if your child comes to the hospital ill with covid-19 or even a non-covid problem that requires icu level care, any will likely have to wait an indeterminate amount of time for a bed. it means worsened health outcomes and mortality rates. joining me now is dr. black stock, founder of health equity and msnbc contributor. i spoke to somebody in louisiana at a pediatric hospital there, pediatric emergency. and they'd actually sent a warning. they said if your child comes here and needs an icu bed they're literally going to have

to wait until another child dies in order to get that. that was a stark example. but if you're a parent who doesn't think your kid is getting covid, you always want to know there is some ability to treat your child, right? at that moment when your child needs a hospital bed, that's not the moment you worry about the capacity of the hospital. >> exactly. we are in such dire times right now. and the fact is there are relatively few pediatric icus throughout the country. starting out there are not enough icus to meet the demand of the surge we are seeing right now. essentially we are not protecting our children. we have a highly infectious variant out there. and what we're seeing is more children are being infected because we have essentially reopened. children are going back to school. and there is such a variability in terms of public health strategies that are being utilized by schools. that's contributing to the high

rates that we are seeing of kids getting sick. i think that there was this narrative beginning of the pandemic that essentially children are less likely to get infected and less likely to get sick. but we have such widespread transmission that children's hospitalizations are overwhelming children's hospitals. and this can't happen indefinitely. there are only a finite number of staff, a finite number of resources available at these hospitals. and things can only get worse. >> let's just examine that a little bit. dr. irwin red letter spoke about the concept that kids don't get sick from covid even if they get it. let's listen to what he said touts. >> you are a pediatrician what do you say to the people even liberal kids are low risk and schools aren't superspreaders. what's your response? >> well, that's old news. kids used to be relatively low risk. i'm actually just writing about

this today. but we need to move on from that and understand the reality of what we're dealing with. this delta variant has caused tremendous amount of trouble with rapid spread in communities, especially communities that are -- that are unvaccinated or undervaccinated. >> so the problem here is that these kids in many cases don't have the choice to make. if you are unvaccinated and getting covid there are some in the country with less sympathy for that, whether right or wrong not for us to discuss. but for kids, many of them don't have that choice. there are kids getting sick who are not given the choice of being vaccinated. >> right, you know, exactly. and so that's why even more so we have to protect them, have to cocoon them. because we prioritize the economy over public health we've essentially reopened businesses. it's essentially business as usual. and we are forgerying ahead, you know, full steam, with reopening

schools, and not ensuring that these environments, you know, are safe. and that means at a minimum in the community that there should be mask mandates. that means at a minimum within schools there should not only be mask mandates but vaccination mandates for anyone eligible. at a minimum schools need to receive more guidance than they are currently searching around ventilation. meaning families should receive free masking and free rapid testing. we talked about rapid testing before. but rapid testing is great for determining who is not only infected but also infectious, able to pass on the virus to someone else. and so schools are not inherently safe. they're safe if we apply all of these leader mitigation strategies. and that's currently not happening. and so my fear is that we go into the winter months as more schools reopen my children's schools are reopening in new york city public schools next week, i have serious concerns about us seeing outbreaks within

schools across the country this fall. and we're going to see the hospitalization rates increase even further. >> doctor good to see you again. an msnbc medical contributoren. the catastrophic effects ever climate crisis were in full force, with ida bringing destruction. russell honora, the commander of joint task force commander joins me after the break with what we need to do to prepare for the future. this is "velshi." need to do to future this is "velshi.

this week hurricane ida offered tragic proof of off our worsening climate crisis. at least 50 are dead. three dozen died from flash flooding across the northeast. a whole three days after ida made landfall in the gulf coast. the hurricane unleashed rare tornadoes in new jersey, maryland and pennsylvania, took

out new orleans entire power grid. with sustained winds up to 150 miles an hour. across louisiana more than 700,000 people remain without electricity. and after touring the state yesterday, president biden said more help is on the way. >> we're going to deploy even more federal resources including hundreds of generators. and there is more to come to restore power as fast as we possibly can. faster than anything that happened during katrina. >> joining me now is the former commander of joint task force katrina. lieutenant general russell honora. there was a similarity here with katrina in that when the storm passed it didn't seem the worst had happened, particularly in new orleans it didn't flood because of the work they've done. but just like katrina, the worst was in the aftermath of it. there are people without power across louisiana. and this can't sustain -- you

can't be a week, two weeks, three weeks without power. >> i think -- i can't really hear general honora. i think he might. >> i'm back. i have the left-hand rb right hand, had a senior moment there. i'm sorry. the difference is this time the wind damage, ali that started at the coast and went through the length of the state of louisiana and went on into mississippi and points north. the wind damage broke the grid. and i say broke the grid, it literally broke it from homer all through st. samany, jefferson parish, no electricity. many places the water systems were destroyed and/or disrupted. and the cell service which we

have become so dependent on to a point where many of the 911 system depending on cell were not accessible. if you can't communicate you can't coordinate. so same problem, ability to communicate, ability to do search and rescue. all of that disrupted by power poles laying over roads, trees knocking down power. we have to fix the grid, just like we fixed the levee system, the grid to use the current term has to be built back better to recognize the that fact that you are in a hurricane zone. and commerce and government have not come to grips with this. within a few months this problem will become solid and the legislature each time will refuse to take actions to make the grid better. there is a lot of good things that did happen after katrina. but we got a lot more work to be more resilient, ali. >> and of course the system of levees and pumps and drains in new orleans.

i'm really glad that did work. one thing -- you and i talked about for years, even before the term environmental justice was prom then, is that, we always say why do people live in the places in louisiana. grand isle flooded, all again. la feet flooded a lot of parishs suffered. the environmental justice issue is that people of limited means can't just up and move. people of limited means can't drive away to another state and stay in a hotel room and buy food for three weeks. how do we address this? that people of limited means are the ones that suffer every time this happens in the gulf? >> well, one of the things i'm recommending we'll push strong to the congress. we need to give fema the authority to preregister people while they have electricity and while they have networks up. the way we do it now is we wait until after the storm hit then tell people to apply. we need to preregister all our

citizens, particularly in the zones like fire zones, mushing zones, flood zones. they should be preregistered so when the storm hit the computers can basically figure out what area you are in and automatically start sending information to people on what they are entitled to. one of the big moves by the president yesterday was to approve people with the ability to go stay in hotels. at the end of the month people on fixed income don't have a credit card that they can do go to nashville or dallas and get a hotel. we have to fix that so encourage people to evacuate before the storm comes ali. >> what a great idea. what's wasted if do you florida? you set up get preapproved or registered and if the storm doesn't affect you and power is not gone house is not destroyed who loses in that idea? what a great idea general honora. people have been coming to you for advice.

i hope that takes root. good to see you as always. lieutenant general. >> please help our volunteers. >> absolutely. >> right now if you want to help, send money to the big ones they got great work going on food, the governor directed pods in every down. but we need the figure booed providers like second harvest, chef andreas is here. the red cross, help them feed people by giving them money so they can get more resources. and that would be a big help. if you can't do something, send money. >> good plan, sir. good to see you as always. left-hand general russell honora. it appears several gop lawmakers are scared now the house committee investigating the insurrection wants a look into phone records from the anti-democratic day. i'll explain after the break on "velshi." i'll explain after the break on "velshi. ♪ ♪ and one we explore one that's been paved and one that's forever wild but freedom means you don't have to choose just one adventure

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like they might be scared. on monday, the house select committee asked over 30 social media and telecom companies to preserve records that could be relevant to the investigation into the attack. house minority leader kevin mccarthy responded by threatening the company saying, if any comply with the lawful requests, he and other house republicans, quote, will not forget it once they are back in the marj. just yesterday 11 republicans doubled down on mccarthy's warning threatening to pursue all legal remedies against any company complying with the committee's request. the bluster coming from mccarthy and republicans is what we call a tell. and the minority leader in particular may have good reason to be afraid. multiple outlines report that mccarthy's own phone records are subject to the preservation requests. that means that his data could well be the target of a potential subpoena. so it appears that the january 6th committee could be on to something and that could help explain why some republicans want floe house members on the

committee, liz cheney and adam kinzinger booted from the gop conference. why all the threats? if you have nothing to hide? we'll have more on that in a bit. but for many americans the labor day weekend doesn't feel like a holiday at all. by monday millions set to lose a crucial covid era unemployment benefit, the extra $300 a woke. i want to bring in in my colleague tiffany cross of the cross-connection. i missed you. good to see you again. you're talking to julian castro, the hummer hud secretary and presidential candidate about this. >> well back from vacation. good to see you. and happy to have you back in the chair and share the screen with you again. but you're right. labor day is going to be really dismal for millions of americans wondering how exactly they're keeping a roof over their heads and food on the table as federal programs end on monday that responded unemployment benefits during the pandemic. which is still going on by the way. so you're right. i'll be talking to our friend julian castro and congressman

from california. who signed on to the letter to president biden to focus on hunger. so we'll talk about what needs to happen and why a lot of democratic lawmakers are now largely silent on this matter. you expect that from the republican party since they're focused on phone records. but this isn't really a strong point for the democratic party as well. plus i'll be talking to the shameful texas abortion ban. the attempt to control women's bodies, aly feels like we went to sleep and woke up in gilead. talk about that. you know i love talking about supports. we're talking about the spart of the football season what the nhl is up against entering another season with covid. because you know some of the stadiums don't have mask mandates. you look at the college football games. it's frightening. we're just minutes away from a very packed cross-connection. and i hope you'll be watching. >> i will. >> back from vacation i want to you stick around. >> i love being back with you. tiffany cross be sure to watch the cross connection right after velshi at 10:00 a.m. eastern.

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love. it's what makes subaru, subaru. as the debate rages over the approach and ultimate timing surrounding the u.s. exodus from afghanistan, the question now is what's next? . the taliban reporting on finalize attention plans for a new government in afghanistan. the biden administration in a critical position having to navigate a relationship with the taliban while being very careful not to legislate myself the group. yesterday u.s. secretary of state antony blinken who will travel to doha qatar and ramstein airbus in germany tomorrow to meet with evacuees offered up these thoughts. >> ultimately, the expectation is to see a government that makes good on commitments that the taliban had made, particularly when it comes to freedom of travel, when it comes to not allowing afghanistan to

be used as a launching ground for terrorism, directed at us or any of our alliesen a partners, when it comes to upholding the basic rights of people, women and minorities, not engaging in reprisals. >> joining me in matt rosenberg a pulitzer prize winning "new york times" reporter covering national security. in 2014 he was expel from afghanistan when the government want the taliban. the first western journalist publicly expelled since 2001. the first time he and i have spoken since that day in which kabul fell. matt, this is a very interesting and difficult line for the u.s. and other governments to walk. and insofar as the taliban is now the de facto and dujure government of afghanistan. afghanistan has shown no ability to spriv without international intervention for the last 20 years and before that. what do you do? because they are of an a unreasonable and unacceptable form of government but now the

government of the afghan people. >> unreasonable, unacceptable, they're the government. if there is any reason why the u.s. and other countries feel they need to engage with afghanistan they need to deal with the taliban. bottom line. they won. look, the afghanistan is wholly dependent on foreign aid. its entire system of government does not work without foreign aid. at least the government is he set ut see what the trablen do they do it on the cheap? i don't think so. right now they are zprat for cash shaking down anyone leaving. they are looking for money. the main source of revenue which had a lot to do with smuggling opium and heroin can only bring in so much. the task base there is abysmally low. probably lower since a tremendous amount of middle class fled and businesses around what's happening. they need aid. what are we doing? i don't know. but if we want to deal with isis, the isis chapter there, if

there are other foreign militants we want to deal with, it's up to the taliban to help us. that means the u.s. and others have to deal with them if they want to tackle the threats. >> how do do that, matt, without normalizing the fact that they are in fact objectively terrible people when it comes to human rights? >> i mean, i don't want to defend how our country behaves around the world. but we deal with a number of regimes that are terrible on human rights including a number of i allies in that part of the world. i think that the taliban, you know, there is obviously a deep history here. we spent 20 years fighting them. but if we want to have any role in what's happening in afghanistan, we're clearly going to have to engage with them. and you've already seen it. you know, during the evacuation, the u.s. military and others were engaging with people who until recently were on terror watch lists. pretty sure they were on terror watch list. leaders of the haqqani network

and taliban factions considered by americans worst of the worst, we're similarly engaging in negotiations with u.s. commanders. >> they are chumming up with the chinese and it's possible the russians will get in if there is a vacuum of american alliance with the taliban. is that a danger that if we ignore them and decide we're not going to recognize them which antony blinken says is there a danger the chinese and russians say, well we will? >> absolutely. we have to weigh the danger. what is the value of afghanistan? there is obviously human rights question, which i think is concerning to everyone. beyond that, will russia and china kind of want the taliban to allow the same kind of international militant groups that once flourished there to flourish again? i doubt it. what are our strategy irk aims in kabul? what do you want from afghanistan? we have to consider all that. i'm not sure the answer to any of the questions. even the u.s. government doesn't seem to fully -- have fully settled on any answers to the

questions at this point. i think it's up in the air. but clearly the taliban are in charge. they have won. if the u.s. wants to deal with afghanistan it has to deal with the taliban. >> it's a continuing tough question, matt. good to see you as always. matt rosenberg a pulitzer prize been nine months since the january 6th attack on the united states capitol. now another rally is planned for later this month, the who, what, when, where, why, and how right after the break. more of "velshi" to come. to coe ] it's grilled cheese o'clock.

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. the house committee investigating the january 6th insurrection has a new vice chair, on thursday the committee chairman benny thompson announced that republican congresswoman liz cheney would serve as the panel's number two. house republicans have not been happy with cheney or republican congressman adam kinzinger for joining the investigation. so republicans from the hard right freedom caucus have asked house gop leadership to change party rules in order to remove cheney and kinzinger from the republican conference referring to them as, quote, spies for democrats. arizona congressman andy bigs writing in a letter, quote, many of the coming discussions in house republican conference meetings will likely revolve around our defense against the democrats perpetuation of the false narrative that january 6th was an insurrection. the false narrative that january

6th was an insurrection. what better way to continue downplaying that insurrection, which is what it was, than by getting rid of the most prominent republicans who actually admit that the insurrection happened. and now federal officials are worried that january 6th could potentially happen again. another rally at the capitol planned for september 18th. it's designed to demand justice for the hundreds of people who have been charged in connection with the january 6th insurrection. sources tell nbc affiliate in washington, d.c., that far right extremist groups are expected to attend. joining me now, barbara mcquade a former united states attorney for the eastern district of michigan and co-host of #sisters-in-law podcast. she's an nbc legal analyst. i want to talk about this september 18th thing. we're not sure what it is. it is an organized event. we certainly know the last organized event not everybody who had information about it took it seriously. what should we be thinking about now that we know that there's some sort of rally in d.c. on

september 18th, which still allows for the first amendment because they've got permits to rally, but does not allow for an insurrection? >> sure, ali, there's a rally in support of the big lie, what could possibly go wrong? i hope we have learned some rr significant lessons from what happened on january 6th. as you point out, people in this country have a constitutional right to rally peacefully in protest of our government. so that is certainly permissible. what we saw last time, of course, resulted in violence, the loss of life and the stopping of congressional proceedings to certify the election results. so i am hopeful that this time government officials will take seriously the warnings that we've had. you know, i think that most of us would have expected there to be some violence on january 6th in light of all that we were seeing on social media and hearing in the mainstream media. and yet, somehow the fbi seemed to not take it as seriously as the general public. and so one hopes that this time around they will do that. i also think one big difference

is that we now have the biden administration in charge. and so instead of waiting hours for the president to do something to bring in the national guard, one hopes that even in advance of anything happening there will be better preparation this time to avoid the kind of loss of life and violence we saw on january 6th. >> even though we know it's a big lie that perpetuates this, how do you balance first amendment stuff with this? they're allowed to rally. they're not allowed to have an insurrection. they're not allowed to storm the capitol. how do we make sure we don't overcompensate and create this world in which we're at war with folks who want to demonstrate? >> you raise such an important issue, ali, it's the old skokie case in the kkk marching in the streets. people are allowed to express their opinions no matter how abhorrent they may be. and so if people are peaceful and they want to express a view in favor of naziism or whatever it is, they have a right to do that. it's when violence occurs that

the line is crossed, and i think in light of what happened on january 6th, we need to make sure that we do all we can to avoid that from happening. how do you do that? i think that you have to engage in the kind of optics that they refrained from doing that day, which is having a strong presence of law enforcement or military. sometimes we have seen first amendment zones set up so that they can be kept in a separate place so that people who are counterprotesting are being peaceful, don't clash. we saw that in charlottesville when we had one group of protesters on the other side clashing with each other. i think law enforcement needs to be doing a lot of special event planning. whenever there's a special event like a super bowl or in my part of the country, an auto show, law enforcement gets together and does a lot of advanced planning about how to maintain peace among large crowds. and so this time you hope that they will designate this a special security event so that they can take all of those precautions and have all of those resources needed to do what they need to do that day.

on january 6th they didn't even have the manpower to arrest people who were engaging in violence. you need to make sure you have sufficient bodies there so you can pull out people from the crowd who are engaging in violence. >> let's talk a little bit about this call by january 6th committee to preserve records about people who could be witnesses to the events on january 6th. with kevin mccarthy that's real. we know he was in touch with the president. republicans are panlting that as a witch hunt and basically saying to the tech companies we'll come after you, the telecon companies and the social media companies, we'll come after you when we're in power to do that. how do you manage that situation? as a former prosecutor, district attorney, united states attorney, i'm sorry, how do you think about that? how do you make sure that you don't politicize the idea that they need information that the telecon companies may have to tell them what happened on january 6th. >> number one, what kevin mccarthy is doing is engaging in disinformation. he knows better having been a member of congress. there is case law that says, number one, if there is a power

to legislate, then congress has the power to investigate because it needs to educate itself and obtain information so that it can learn about what it needs to know to be able to pass laws. and that includes the oversight of things that occur in our system to decide whether new laws are necessary to fill gaps or changes in the law need to occur. and the courts have held as a result of that, they have the legal authority to gather information. and so subpoena power for telecommunication records, absolutely permissible lawfully. what kevin mccarthy is doing is undermining the public confidence in our institutions of government to advance his own not only political agenda, but in this instance, personal agenda because he is somebody who might be in the cross hairs. >> barbara, good to see you as always. thank you for joining us, barbara mcquade is a former united states attorney with the eastern district of michigan and an nbc news legal analyst. that does it for me. thank you for watching. i will be back here same time, same place tomorrow. make sure to tune in next saturday for a day of special

coverage to mark 20 years since the 9/11 terrorist attacks. coverage begins at 5:00 a.m. eastern next saturday. don't go anywhere, "the cross connection" with tiffany cross begins right now. ♪♪ good morning, and boy has it been a week. we have a jam-packed show today on "the cross connection" including the millions still left in the dark following hurricane ida and the millions struggling to survive as enhanced unemployment ends this week. we have to begin with the latest on texas's new abortion law. last night a texas judge handed a narrow legal victory to abortion rights advocate when she temporarily blocked an antiabortion group from restricting the new law against planned parenthood. not only does it ban the