wouldn't have otherwise seen that from before. some are true conspiracy nuts that believe it. others like grassley probably don't believe it. steve scalise probably doesn't believe it. but they have to do it to hold on and get through their republican primary or maintain their office. here is what they are counting on in '22 and '24. the macro conditions will favor republicans. for the house, it's redistricting plus macro conditions. they are counting on the question, are you better off or not? they will want to focus in on the economy, which is why this biden white house is working so hard to shore up the economy and make sure going into '22 and '24, the macro conditions support democrats. republicans get through the primary but lose like trump did. >> my sunday family, good to see you. thank you. we are back at the top of

the hour. good day from msnbc world headquarters in new york. developing for you, the treasury secretary is sounding the alarm on the debt ceiling and the ripple affect it could have. the house is gearing up for a vote this week on a short-term extension to raise the debt limit. there's uncertainty surrounding how lawmakers plan to reach a long-term solution before december. janet yellen told nbc news why it's imperative the u.s. raise its debt ceiling. >> there's an enormous amount at stake. a failure to raise the debt ceiling would probably cause a recession and could even result in a financial crisis that would be a catastrophe. >> okay. democrats in both parties of congress -- both chambers, rather, of congress, they are working on reaching an agreement for a significant part of the president's agenda. we have an update on

negotiations over the wreck on -- the reconciliation package. >> 98% of us agree that $3.5 trillion was the number. all the programs that are in there. the president agrees, 70% of the american people agree. we have two senators, democratic senators, who are not on board. a lot of this depends on the two of them getting together, because they each want slightly different things, and coming back with a proposal what they want to cut. the price tag comes out of that number. >> it has been almost a year since the 2020 election. new evidence today, some republicans are still pushing donald trump's big lie. >> do you think the 2020 election was stolen from donald trump? >> first, i've been very clear from the beginning, if you look at a number of states, they

didn't follow the state passed laws that govern the election for president. >> you think the election was stolen? >> what i said is there are states that didn't follow their legislatively set rules. >> last time, i promise, do you think the election was stolen or not? >> it's not just -- it's states that did not follow the laws set, which the constitution says they're supposed to follow. >> that was a hot seat right there. what liz cheney firing back on twitter writing, republicans have a duty to tell the american people that this is not true. we will go beyond the headlines now on the january 6 investigation. with a welcome to you. julie, it is becoming increasingly clear that a subpoena showdown with the select committee might end with contempt citations levelled at former trump officials. what happens then? what are politicians saying about it? >> the committee's first set of depositions are scheduled to take place next week on thursday

and friday. it's still a bit of a mystery between reporters and the committee itself, quite frankly, as to whether either of those four will show up. steve bannon's lawyer telling the committee on thursday that he is relying on the former president's executive privilege when he missed that first deadline, the document request the committee subpoenaed him for, last week. i should note that steve bannon, he was former president trump's campaign advisor. but he only served a few months in 2017 in the white house itself. senator amy klobuchar was asked what she thinks should happen earlier today. take a listen. >> that's going to be garland's decision. i think ultimately the courts will decide. i think subpoenas have to be enforced. for steve bannon to claim he has executive privilege when he wasn't even in the executive office during january 6, that's absolutely absurd. most legal analysts would agree with me on that.

>> she's a senior member of the senate judiciary committee. she's familiar with how these things work. you heard her referencing bannon's short time in the white house and why he should or shouldn't be eligible for executive privilege. bannon, if he does deny the subpoena, the committee made it very clear that they will pursue criminal referral and then it's up to the biden's justice department to take that up. >> there may be monetary damage as well. we talked it one congressman who is pushing that in a bill. thank you. president trump rallied in iowa saturday to a crowd of thousands of supporters. it comes on the heels of a new poll that shows his favorability hitting a new high. he called out the 2020 election, alleging fraud and cheating. gary is joining us now. you spoke to the people in that audience. they are singing a significantly

different tune about january 6th. what did they tell you? >> the people that attend trump rallies for the most part are the diehard trump support ersz. they may not believe trump lost in november. they find conservative media may not be conservative enough for them. these are folks -- these are folks who believe january 6 was some sort of setup by the government to round up trump supporters. listen to what i heard yesterday. >> when we got back to our hotel room on january 6 and turned the tv on, the stories we were seeing were no resemblance at all to what we saw. we wondered if it was fake. >> it was a big setup. it was -- it's all a political scheme. everything is a political scheme anymore. >> they can investigate all they want.

there is nothing that i saw that was wrong happening there. >> i know we have a number of colleagues here at nbc that would disagree with a lot of those statements. but it speaks to the misinformation and disinformation spreading across the country as it relates to january 6. >> thank you so much. . joining me now, peter bakker. peter, as i'm glad to see you on a sunday, how do you interpret the trump iowa rally and how it fits in with the 2024 chatter? why in some ways -- it feels kind of unreal, especially the viewpoints of those that gary was playing there in the crowd and their take on 1/6. >> that's right. you have always had in america people who believe in conspiracy theories who refuse to believe the established media and so forth. what you now see is that that has become, at least according to polls, the majority of one of

our political parties. the number of people that agree with president trump that the election was stolen, even throw there's no evidence of that is 75% of republicans in polls these days. that's an extraordinary thing. that's an extraordinary challenge for a country when you have that many people basically believing something that's not true. there's no evidence for whatsoever. it undermines the whole fabric of a democracy, how people -- people living in a different reality. the former president wants to keep talking about that. that's his personal obsession. that's the interest he has. that's an issue he has. what you don't hear are established republicans who have to worry about the midterm elections talking about that. that's not the issue they want to talk about. they do -- first of all, they probably don't believe what president trump is saying. as steve scalise made clear, he will try to avoid saying it

flatly as chris walace tried to get him to do without seeming to repudiate the president. >> okay. they don't want to spend their time talking on that. you bring up steve scalise. it was almost comical watching him repeat the same statement that just repeatedly avoided answering the question. why is he so afraid of saying it wasn't stolen? isn't there anything to be gained by speaking the truth? >> you know, would you have thought so on january 7. you would have thought that would have been the end of the trump hold over his party. republicans -- many republicans if not most in washington were furious with him, thought he had not only jeopardized the safety of their own members but undermined democracy in a very significant way and a way no other sitting president has ever done. yet in the five, six, seven, eight months since then, his hold on the party has grown. that's why steve scalise and

chuck grassley and others are afraid of crossing him. not only are they afraid of primaries, they are afraid of losing support, money, donations. they are afraid of what's happening to liz cheney in wyoming where she's fighting for her seat against a trump endorsed republican simply because she said that it wasn't stolen and what happened on january 6 was a great offense to democracy. >> i have to say, listening to chuck grassley accept the endorsement of donald trump, that had a comical element to it as well. it's like he almost did so halfheartedly. it was gentle. i would be foolish not to accept the endorsement of somebody who has 91% favorability in the state. okay. anyway, in that trump speech, trump did not delve into the biden white house denying his request of executive privilege for 1/6. is that telling for you in some way? >> look, you know, i'm not a lawyer obviously.

i think he has some legal issues here. he no longer controls the justice department. congress can now seek justice department enforcement of the subpoenas. that means you can't drag it out for as long as they did when trump was in office. some people might face the prospect of being penalized in some way, even locked up for contempt, which has happened in the past. he is on a weak side here. he will make the argument that executive privilege applies. i'm not a lawyer, but in some of the cases it's hard to see. steve bannon didn't work for him. there's no precedent for executive privilege for people who wasn't working for the president. that's like saying anyone the president talks to is covered by executive privilege. that's hard to see in our legal system. they will fight it. they may be able to drag it out for a while. there's a confrontation coming. that's why i think you see two of the four, apparently talking with the committee, looking for an accommodation, rather than to

have a showdown. we will see how that works out next week when some of the dates arrive and whether people actually show up in person or have to be pursued legally. >> is there something, peter, the trump folks are talking about right now, including the 1/6 committee subpoenas, that worries them? he seemed like the same character last night in iowa. >> i think they're feeling pretty strong right now. they feel like they have the momentum on their side. the party is with them. they haven't suffered as a result of what happened in there. obviously, there are individuals who tried to get jobs who haven't been able to get them. the consensus we thought developed after january 6 is something really bad happened and there would be consequences, that's gone. it's one more confrontation. either you believe in trump and he was ripped off, or you don't.

he is feeling the -- he wants us to think he is going to run right up until the minute he decides whether he will or not. we will see whether that leads to anything. it may be a while before we know the answer. >> what do you think the overall appetite is, political appetite, to see these trump characters and others answer publically for their actions, whether guilty or innocent on 1/6? is there overall fatigue for everyone, but folks on capitol hill? >> well, there's some fatigue about it. we tend to move on rather than dwell on the past. i think there are a lot of unanswered questions. the biggest is, what was the president of the united states doing in the hours before, during and after this assault on the capitol. we don't really have a clear picture of that. all these videos we see, the investigations and reports we have seen have not really

answered the question. what we think is happening is he didn't take any action as far as we can tell other than a couple brand treats only after having been begged to by his staff and daughter. he didn't seem to have any issue with what was happening on capitol hill that day. a couple of the witnesses could tell us about january 6, what the president was doing and what he didn't do. >> okay. i have no issue with having you on. i will take issue if you are not here next sunday. just saying. thank you. >> i always answer your subpoena. >> good call. let's go to southern california where beaches from los angeles to san diego are feeling the impact of a massive offshore oil spill. teams and beachgoers are removing tar balls as investigators are trying to figure out when and how that pipeline was damaged. today, there's some hope that the end may be in sight. let's go to scott cohen joining us from huntington beach,

california. that's a good thing to take off on here. there's hope as to whether or not we can figure out what happened. looks like a beautiful day. how is the beach behind you? >> it's interesting. when you first get out here and first blush, it looks like a typical southern california day. the thing everybody comes here for. then you look closer. the beach is open but no one is in the water. that's because they are not allowing people in the water. there's a cleanup crew. you can see over my shoulder, there's container ships that are the focus of some of the investigation. i can count just seven right here offshore in huntington beach. there are probably a couple dozen more that are waiting to get into the port of los angeles and long beach. they're starting to get a handle on this, but then you look how far this spreads. 75 miles down the coast from me in san diego, they are cleaning up tar balls. they are working on this cleanup there as well as the oil spill

spread. even though the absolute amount of oil now seems to be less than originally feared, make no mistake, this is still a mess. >> the fish and sandpipers are still feeding out here. you can't smell it, but it's nauseating. i can't imagine having to feed from the land and the sea. >> authorities are telling beachgoers not to touch the tar balls. they are not safe. this is toxic chemicals that you are handling. they are saying to report those. now there's a small army that's working on this cleanup. 1,300 people working on the response up and down the southern california coastline. offshore, they have recovered 5,500 gallons of oil.

onshore, some 232,000 pounds of oily debris that's been removed. they are still recovering dead birds and sick birds and trying to deal with that. the original thinking was 144,000 gallons of oil spilled. now it seems to be less than that. as i said, it's still a mess. >> yeah, for sure. thank you so much for that. james carville join me next. you know him. we all know him. you will want to hear what he has to say about the virginia governor's race, about joe manchin and senator sinema and what could doom donald trump's 2024 aspirations. trump's 2024 aspirations ♪ there are beautiful ideas that remain in the dark. but with our new multi-cloud experience,

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i think what's happening right now is so heartbreaking about our country, i don't know if we are going to have a country. i don't know. it's not going to be a

recognizable america where freedom is everything. i think we're going to see -- it's going to be an unrecognizable america compared to the freedoms that i grew up learning about. >> former president donald trump riling up his followers in iowa who seem oblivious to the serious legal hurdles trump faces on a number of fronts, even as he hints to a 2024 run. democratic strategist and campaign manager for bill clinton's 1992 election james carville is joining me now. welcome back to the show, james. it's good to have you here. i know you mentioned on the 11th hour earlier this week that donald trump is in deep legal trouble. he is not acting like it. but do you believe it's likely to derail any real 2024 aspirations? >> in all likelihood, he will indicted on multiple easy to understand charges by the manhattan d.a. that's in front of you. he is committing crimes.

he is telling people not to cooperate with the congressional committee. that's obstruction of justice. i don't know where the attorney general is here. i think he is scared to do anything about his lawlessness. there's multiple investigations to him trying to rig the 2020 election. it's against the law to try to pressure people to change voting results. i guess 35% of the country will be with him no matter what. the guy said we will not recognize our country if we don't enforce the laws which is the bedrock of the united states, he might be right. >> can i ask if the gop in general has morphed into a fringe element party? what do you think of that statement? >> they're a coat. look at senator grassley. he is up there. look at steve scalise. they're not part of -- senator

grassley and scalise, they are part of a trump personality cult. >> james, let me ask you this. hang on. you have chuck grassley and steve scalise, since you mentioned both of them, look at the lukewarm way chuck grassley accepted the endorsement. look at the way steve scalise almost turned himself into a pretzel trying to avoidancing -- avoid answering the question on fox news. do these two people and a number of republicans in leadership -- do they buy into the trump thing really? if they don't, why do they continue playing along? >> because they're doing exactly what the republicans in the state of iowa want or the republicans in the first congressional district of louisiana want. they're nothing but a manifestation of democracy. the problem is about 35% of the people in this country translates into a large majority

of republicans, are just flat out of their minds. there's no -- it's no other way to put it. they might be hard working god fearing people that have a lot of skill. if you believe this election was stolen, you are out of your mind. if you take not taking vaccines, you are out of your mind. i will be nice to you, but i don't have -- i know what you are, nuts. >> how do democrats deal with that mentality? >> you don't. you deal with lawlessness. remember, he is only the highest he got was 47%. remember that. there's a third of the republicans -- some number of them, maybe a quarter, that are uncomfortable with him. you build a broad coalition, invite these people into your coalition. you are not going to convince

these people of anything, because they don't want to be convinced. they are perfectly happy. i know a lot of them. i'm friendly with them. i will ask them about football or anything else. if you believe these things, you believe in flat earth creationism, which a lot of them do. there's nothing more you can do. you just gotta move forward with the rule of law. you got plenty of advantages. the democrats have to press these. we could have a good 2022. >> let me ask you about the virginia governor's race here. it appears to be tightening. republican glenn yunkin who is gaining steam. you know that -- probably you are playing a role in the online fund-raising for mcauliffe. it says you are tearing your hair off over the race.

there you go. do you interpret what is happening there? how do you interpret it? >> look, it's a very tight election. the last 44 years, one white house loses, the virginia governor loses. i don't think it's tightening. it's been tight the whole way. this is a critical election for democrats. it's going to say what's going on. it's going to affect retirements and recruitment. the best thing that washington can do to help terry win this election and the democrats want to retain the majority, is get this thing passed now. get off of twitter. quit going to the press. president biden, call these people, get them in a room, hammer this deal out and make it. they're not that far apart. what the democrats around the country need to do is put pressure on their other democrats to say, get at the

table and get this done. instead, everybody is trying to say -- we're trying to negotiation. 10% of the people in the united states know what's in this. 10%. somebody is doing a bad job of communication. once you pass it, people will know what's in it. somebody has to perk up here. >> the president was out there this week trying to get the message out there. they are trying to do that. only 10% know what's in it. it's about getting a message out there. let me ask you about why many critics, james, are blasting senators joe manchin and krysten sinema. listen to janet yellen who had this to say this morning about the in-party fighting. here it is. >> different members of congress have different views on that.

there are active discussions taking place now among members of congress, among democrats, with the white house. we are trying to figure out what is the best way to construct a package that would have huge payoffs for america. there are going to be hard choices to negotiate in the coming weeks. >> i want to remind you about what i got earlier today. sinema and manchin are not on the same page. they are not a dynamic duo on this. they seem to want different things which further splinters trying to put them together and come with the rest of the democratic body. what do you make of those two? >> first of all, senator manchin i know. he is an italian roman catholic

democrat. he has different political interests. he comes from an entirely different place than somebody from seattle. senator sinema, i don't know her. the one person that's got to solve this is president biden. he needs to get everybody in the room and say, what is it -- how do we make this work? this is the way politics works. since time in memorial. as long as everybody has got their own personal story, their own personal self-interest and no one wants to subjugate what they want for the good of the country, we will look like a party that can't do it. it's time everybody wake up with -- go to bed with a political philosophy and wake up and say, i'm an american, i want to get this done. to get this done, good things are going to happen. the stuff in this is very, very popular. >> yeah, it is. james carville, thanks for the chat. good to see you. appreciate that. >> take care.

>> thank you. there's deflating news about soaring gas prices. up next, what's driving them upward.

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i probably don't have to tell you gas prices are rising and rising fast. energy costs are now at a seven-year high. look at this chart of gas prices getting higher. a pain that all of you drivers out there know all too well. let's go to meagan fitzgerald who is joining us with more on this. what are you finding with regard to this? >> reporter: you know what? the short answer is the prices continue to go up. to give you perspective, right now the national average for a tank of gas is $3.26. a year ago, it was $2.19. we are talking about an increase of more than a dollar. we have been talking to consumers. they are worried about this.

energy experts say that's justified. gas prices are soaring with little end in sight. >> americans are spending $430 million more every day on gasoline than just one year ago today. >> in some california towns, prices are topping $5 a gallon. in illinois, it will set you back almost 20 bucks more than last year. >> every time i fill up, it's close to $89. >> how do you feel about that? >> it's making me broke. >> it's no good. what can we do? >> experts say heating your home this winter could be costly. >> prices for oil and gas are high during the heating season. it will be more expensive for the economy, for society and homeowners. >> heating bills could cost 30% more than last year. like everything, the pandemic is partially to blame. demand for gas mrup plummeted i0

and supply hasn't picked up. hurricane ida knocked production offline. it could reduce oil production by 30 million gallons this year. the white house is working to address the problem. >> we need to address short-term supply issues. we need to keep our eye on the impact to the climate. >> drive slower on the highway. slowing down 5 to 10 miles an hour can save fuel. take out unnecessary items that weigh your car down. as for heating your home -- >> bundle up and turn the thermostat down. >> energy experts say it could be months before we see prices start to fall. it depends on demand. if more people are commuting and we have a bad winter, they say we could see elevated prices into next year. >> oh, boy. bundle up. thank you so much, meagan fitzgerald. bernie sanders refused to

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new mounting pressure on senator sinema from her fellow democrats. sinema is considering how to tackle rising prescription drug prices and whether it should be part of the reconciliation package that democrats want to pass by october 31st. in several leaked emails,

senator sanders wanted to call out sinema for not moving on the issue. democratic leaders put out a statement condemning the protesters who followed sinema into a bathroom. sanders refused to sign on because it didn't include a rebuke of her political reviews. joining me is the journalist who got the scoop. welcome. let's get into this. what do you gather from this in-fighting overall? what do you think is more likely to happen? is sinema going to get on board with the democrats on drug prices or the democratic caucus catering to what she wants once they determine what she wants? that remains unclear. >> that's exactly right. it's one of the biggest frustrations in my conversations with democratic senators but also a lot of democrats in the house. they are frustrated that they don't know where senator sinema is on a lot of these issues. what her team will say is that

the white house and the president knows where she is. the key negotiators in this package know where she is. that's where they are leaning their focus and attention. it's not a satisfying answer for a party who see this bigger reconciliation package as their one attempt to really get at a lot of their main priorities and priorities that are the president's. as for email exchange, it's a small snippet of the fuller exchange. it shows how potent the frustration is between the two different factions of the party, moderates and progresses. they are so far apart on so many issues, prescription drug prices one of the key sticking points. it shows the animosity right now between these key senators. >> lowering drug costs, that's a

popular element in the reconciliation package. why would she be hesitant to back proposals to lower prices, which she says she generally supports? is the political pressure from her democratic colleagues working at all? is there any evidence of that? >> i think we're going to have to see what happens with the negotiation. i think from what i'm hearing, she -- you are right, she's generally a fan and wants to lower prescription drug prices. it's interesting -- we don't know where she is on that. she's been having these negotiations. i think it will ultimately -- she's going to continue holding on to that as maybe a key point of leverage is what we are being told. it's a key thing -- bernie sanders, he did a pen and pad as they call it on the hill on friday with reporters. he was really pushing this issue. he was asking -- he said, look at where some of the senators are getting their fund-raising.

look at their donor list. i haven't personally gone through senator sinema's donor list and seen this. but he was trying to suggest these things. he has been dropping hints to the media for some time now, as his frustration continues. >> you bring this up. we have a full screen. he is saying, centrists rejecting the measures are bankrolled and beholden to the pharmaceutical industry. do you think that is an effective approach for him or might he be further alienating himself? >> when it comes to negotiations, he is probably further alienating himself with this. it's something bernie sanders supporters and his allies stand with him or stand by him with that. when it comes to negotiating with senator sinema and manchin, much more moderate democrats, they don't take well to that kind of argument.

that's why i think it's been so tough to bring them together on these issues. part of the reason why senator sinema's team says she tries to not have these discussions with the media and not negotiate with the media and on a broader level but focus her negotiations more narrowly with the white house and people involved. >> interestingly, i was speaking earlier today with a congresswoman. sinema and manchin aren't together. do we know who is closer to agreeing? >> it's a great question. that's a great point from the congresswoman. it's true. we try to point that out. they do get lumped together because they are the two really holdouts in the senate on the democratic side. they have very different views. one is climate change, senator sinema is for some of the bolder climate provisions.

that's a sticking point for senator manchin. as for who is closer, progressives in particular seem to think that joe manchin will be a problem. they think he is easier to deal with. he and -- senator manchin and president biden have a good relationship. they have more questions around senator sinema because she hasn't been forthcoming on what she wants. manchin hasn't either. but they feel like he will do the right thing at the end of the day, come around to the table. they're not so sure with senator sinema. it's hard to tell. we will have to see. we aren't having a lot of insight into those closed door negotiations. we will have to see that as it comes into light as they reach the deadline toward the end of the month. >> keep digging. come back and let us know what you find out. thank you. republicans have redrawn the map in texas. it could be bad news for democrats. why it's the first redistricting

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headlines across the country as mostly gop controlled legislatures begin the first legislatures begin the first redistricting since 1960s that does not require approval from the justice department. in houston, texas, black and brown communities are carved up in one case putting powerful house democrats al green and sheila jackson lee now in the same district. >> it's a blight on lyndon baines johns and barbara jordan who were able to have a seat that all viewed as crucial when barbara went as the first african-american to go to the deep south, go from the deep south, to the united states congress. my mentor endorsed me when i ran and to see this district that had been together for 50 years

demolished -- >> joining me is the naac p president and ceo. good to see you. does the history of voting and representation for african-americans across the south, for example, in this case, does that make this more outrageous? >> well, it is outrageous because this would be the first redistricting cycle since 1960 without the protection of the voting rights act. in addition to that, in the case of texas, there are more african-americans who live in the state of texas than any other state in the country. what we're looking at here is a complete power grab by a state legislative body that knows texas is the most diverse state in the country. for kavg carving out the district they're going to put african-americans against one another, put african-americans and latinos against one another,

lat tino district against one another, as opposed to right sizing the demographics of the state so it can be more reflective. this is outrageous for multiple reasons. >> there are certainly some groups filing lawsuits, derrick, but isn't gerrymandering mostly legal? is there any hope this can be fought? >> understanding that the concept of gerrymandering is normally utilized in redistricting but when race is a motivating factor or once political affiliation is a proxy for race, that's when you have protected class and the fact that we have a packed circuit court, this case could go to the supreme court, and it could redefine what we look -- what we determine in terms of racial impact in political jerry mannederings. we have to approach this cautiously while at the same

time, they must reauthorize the voting rights act, they must ensure the democracy we have is representative of all the communities, particularly african-americans who fought so hard for so long to ensure equity and opportunity for all citizens and to take those two districts, those very effective members of congress and pit them against one another is a power play we cannot stand by and watch. >> putting those two as you describe them against one another and realistically removing one from congress, it just seems wrong, doesn't it? >> it is a pour grab, right. sheila jackson lee is one of the most visible members of congress across any community, but particularly for her district and for african-americans. al green, a former state judge, is an intellect in congress. we have to protect those who actually can think because what we're looking at from far too many republicans are nonsensical arguments based on conspiracy

theories and illusion naries that come from qanon. two competent members of congress who have served well all across the country for all communitys how to make democracy work for everyone. the same legislative body taking choice away from women, suppressing black people's vote, suppress taking babies at the border is playing with our future. >> i want to ask you about facebook and your issues with the platform, certainly rough week for facebook but you have your issues you want to raise have they responded to your request for a meeting? i think you want to meet with mark zuckerberg? what specifically are you most concerned about? >> well, this time last year, we were part of the coalition stop hate for profit because facebook was using an algorithm to put profits above people.

we sent this to mark last year, we said it through a campaign called stop hate for profit, something we recognize then as we recognize now. the platform is a super spreader for hate. it is causing harm to our democracy, causing harm to communities, and it actually the platform where people are promoting racial hate themes, radicalizing individuals, whether january 6th, we said it last year and in 2016, we are not [ inaudible ] with this sovereign nation within the sovereign nation is too big and we have to take rash action to put guardrails to protect people and protect our democracy. >> but, derrick, you met with him. what did you get? did you get lip service or anything that changed? >> you know, facebook, they have

mastered the narrative of saying nothing. we've got lip service. so it was -- mark, we had this conversation last year. you said it wasn't doing these things only to find out it's doing the very thing you said it's doing. if you listen to that narrative it's the perfect crisis media narrative. attack, criticize, try to get in front of the issue saying we're doing these things to make it safer and then they try to pivot to make the issue about something else. you see all three of those things at work right now for facebook. congress must act and we need to put regulations on this social media platform because it has become too big as a single source provider of information that's driving the narrative in a very negative way for far too many people in this country. >> let us know if you get that meeting with mark zuckerberg and talk to us about it afterwards. thank you so much. u.s. fighter jets on display

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