l.a. be sure to tune in next week. now stay tuned because my amazing friend alex witt has the latest. i'm right next door, we're matching, i'm coming to hug you. >> i know, and you're going through my hood, l.a. is my hometown. if you need a restaurant recommendation, i'm good for that, my friend. >> i do, thank you. i'll hit you up on that. >> we'll make a date sometime. have a good week, we'll see you then from l.a. and a very good day to all of you from msnbc world headquarters here in new york. it is high noon in the east, 9:00 a.m. out west. welcome, everyone, to alex witt reports. we begin with the breaking news out of michigan. the parents of the oxford school shooting suspect making their first court appearance today. all right, well, james and jennifer crumbley both pleading not guilty to all four counts of involuntary manslaughter.

the two were arrested after an overnight manhunt. they were found hiding in a commercial building after hours of searching. lawyers for the crumbleys defending that move. >> last night and throughout the day we were in contact with our clients. they were scared. they were terrified. they were not at home. they were figuring out what to do, getting finances in order. >> their son, 15-year-old ethan crumbley is accused of killing four students and injuring several others in a school shooting on tuesday. a tragedy the oakland county prosecutor this morning says his parents could have prevented. >> this is a very serious, horrible terrible murder and shooting, and it has affected the entire community, and these two individuals could have stopped it, and they had every reason to know that he was dangerous, and they gave him a weapon, and they didn't secure it, and they allowed him free

access to it. >> thousands of members in that community gathering last night for a vigil to mourn the loss of those teenage victims. hana st. juliana, tate myre, madisyn baldwin, and justin shilling. >> we are oxford, and no one will shatter that love. >> let's go right to nbc's shaquille brewster joining me from pontiac, michigan, i know you've been covering this really horrific story all week. what can you tell us about the overnight hours into this morning? >> yeah, that arraignment that you saw with the parents of this 15-year-old suspected school shooter, it was the first time we saw them in court since his original arraignment earlier this week, and it was an arraignment that was scheduled yesterday at 4:00 p.m. we know that yesterday around noon, that's when the charges were initially filed. those four counts of involuntary manslaughter, but by 3:00 p.m. yesterday, a message went out to

local law enforcement to be on the lookout for these two suspects. they didn't turn themselves in and didn't appear to that original arraignment. well, after the overnight hours, they were eventually apprehended in the detroit, michigan, area, and it's for that reason that the prosecutor was arguing for a $500,000 bond and the judge cried with the prosecutor. listen to the argument that the prosecutor made in the court earlier today. >> instead they fled, and they sought multiple attempts to hide their location and were eventually tracked down after they parked their car somewhere, a witness saw it, and the entire fugitive apprehension team and multiple other law enforcement agencies went into a vacant building and searched it from top to bottom, and these two individuals were found locked somewhere in a room hiding.

>> reporter: now that manhunt happened after that extensive press conference that we heard from the prosecutor where she said the parent a s were criminally liable for the shooting saying they knew things that no other person knew including that this 15-year-old suspect had access to the weapon. i want to pull up the statement that we got from the attorneys of the two parents pushing back on some of the claims that we heard from the prosecutor. they say the prosecution has very much cherry picked and slanted specific facts to further their narrative to do that. we intend to fight this case in the courtroom and not in the court of public opinion. we know that in the end the entire story and truth will prevail. during that arraignment, one of the facts that they pushed back on was whether or not the gun, the gun that was purchased or that was used in the shooting and purchased by the father of the suspected shooter, whether or not that was locked. the prosecutors say that was put away in a drawer in the parents' bedroom with access -- with the

15-year-old having access to it while the defense is saying that was actually locked. there's a lot of evidence that we're going to go through and a lot of litigation this is going to take, alex. >> i guess then the question would be was the drawer broken into or was there a key somewhere where if it was locked ethan was able to access. again, that's all going to come out in the investigation. >> exactly. >> we're going to continue the conversation as i bring in katherine sh wade, retired fbi executive and the author of "stop the killing, how to end the mass shooting ccrisis" and joyce vance, a frequent guest on the show. these parents have been charged with four counts of involuntary manslaughter. if convicted they could face up to 15 years in prison and time again, we have seen these young lives lost in a school shooting, but it is extraordinarily rare to charge the parents. so is this case different in that regard, or could this be precedent setting?

>> this case is unique because of the facts, alex. here we have parents who were aware of two important things at the same time. they were aware that their child was having violent fantasies that he had put them down on paper and that he had alarmed the school. so they were aware of the risk. they also knew uniquely that he had access to a firearm, apparently school officials weren't aware. the mom had taken him out shooting over the weekend. whether the gun was locked or not in their home seems largely immaterial to me because one way or another ethan managed to access it. so the parents knew he had the interest and the access to a firearm, and that's tantamount to proving that they were reckless with regard to human life, which is what prosecutors have to prove to convict for involuntary manslaughter. >> and katherine, very interestingly, you ran the fbi's active shooter program. you focused on ways to prevent these kinds of shootings from happening. you wrote the book as well.

when you look at the series of events that led to the killing of four high school students, what went wrong? could this have been prevented? i mean, that is the million dollar tragic question that's being asked today. >> yeah, i think that's the hard part, right? there are so many ways to prevent killings like this, particularly these type of school killings where we know 80 to 90% of the time kids that do this, leak that information, 80 to 90% of the time parents and peers and teachers hear about something, and they don't report it, and i think this is a perfect storm of facts and circumstances that if they had been properly gathered together by a threat assessment team at the school and relayed to the police department and the sheriff's office that there would have been a way to prevent this shooting. there's constant trip wires that you see all the way along whether it's the text messages or the facebook posts or the conversations with the teachers and the principals and i

certainly agree with what she just said, you know, it's not going to be whether a drawer was locked or not. i mean, the parents were in the school the day of the shooting with the child, with the backpack, and never said, you know, hey, ethan do you have your gun with you? >> well, and also, katherine, the fact is it's our understanding that the school suggested they take him home, and it's also our understanding that there was a 48-hour suggestion you must get your son some psychological help in the next 48 hours, and they reneged on doing either of those things. they said, no, no, no, he's going to go back to class. how much does that place a burden on the parents? how much does that make this case different than other ones. it seems so blatant these facts that are being unfolded. >> yeah, i think we're struggling right now with wanting to hold somebody accountable, right? society wants to hold somebody krobl and the prosecutors, the defense counsel said that in their own public statement.

they said society is looking for someone to blame and hold krobl. accountable. that's what the prosecutor's office is doing here, maybe this is a way to do it is to say the parents have to be held liable for the conduct because they are criminally negligent. maybe the school has to be held liable. it's really threat assessment is a term process. it's not one time in that one instance in the school. that was just the straw that broke the camel's back and sent that boy off to the men's room so that he could turn around and pull the gun out and load it, right? it was all the things that led up to it, and that's threat management that we need to get better at so that we don't end up in these situations where we're looking at the straw that broke the camel's back, but we're failing to look at all the other pieces and straws on the camel's back. >> yeah, so shaq, i want to ask you. what do we know about the time between the last appearance of the parents and when they were arrested in the middle of the night in a commercial warehouse

in detroit? how did they get away? what are we learning about the details here? >> well, the last time we saw the parents appear virtually in court, that was on wednesday, the day after the shooting as we were watching the arraignment of the is a-year-old suspect. one thing you notice about their appearance there, it was all virtual. they appeared to be in the back of a vehicle or inside of a vehicle as they had that arraignment there. in the hours since, we know that there was some contact between the attorneys and law enforcement. both sides say this there was some contact. they disagree on the level of contact and the level of agreement they came to, but there were text messages exchanged, calls made, and the attorneys are saying that they made arrangements to then turn in their clients later in the afternoon, if those charges were filed. well, once the charges were filed according to the sheriff, they say that the attorneys then told them they didn't have access to their clients and they

didn't know where exactly their clients were. we eventually know that there was a $4,000 that was withdrawn from the bank. we learned in the arraignment that that was done about 20 minutes from where i'm standing now in this area. however, they are ultimately apprehended in the overnight hours in detroit, about 45 minutes from where we are now. that contradicts the claims from the defense that they were out of state and returning home. that's part of why yesterday we went through the conflicting information where we didn't know where exactly these suspects were. we didn't know what their attorney knew, and we didn't know why there wasn't surveillance by law enforcement. a lot of that started to be cleared up today at that arraignment. >> can i also ask you, shaq, at what point did the officials conclude their searching of the home? did that all happen on tuesday? i mean, were the crumbleys home wednesday? were officials there looking for more evidence on wednesday as well? >> we know that the night of the shooting there was a search warrant that was executed at the

crumbleys' home. we knew at that point -- or i should say we assumed at that point that the main focus of that search warrant was on the 15-year-old suspect and figure ing out what led to the shooting. many of those red flags that became apparent throughout the week, including the two meetings that were had. the two different teachers in that school that on monday, the day before the shooting when one teacher saw the 15-year-old looking for ammunition on his phone, and then he was called down to the office. or even on tuesday, hours before the shooting when a teacher saw that graphic depiction of him shooting someone and the words please help me on it. we didn't know many of those details. as far as we know that search warrant was executed on tuesday, and that's where they got the vast majority of the evidence in terms of going into the parents' bedroom and know where the gun was. we also know that the prosecutor today said that there is plenty

of other video. there's lots of other evidence that we still don't know about. she made the reference that she's going to hand that over to the defense as is required in cases like this. there's plenty more that we don't know, and that's being signaled by the prosecutor. >> i'm going to be talking to the sheriff in the next hour and hopefully get a few questions answered on that front as well. last question to you, joyce. so ethan crumbley is facing a multitude of charges including murder and an unusual charge for mass shooting prosecution, that being terrorism. that charge, could that one hold up in court and how? >> well, so these charges are based on what we have often come to talk about this conversation about how at federal law there's no specific domestic terrorism statute. that's actually when we saw and play here, and these charges are above and beyond charges of intentional murder. they are very well grounded in the facts in this case, which involve someone bringing a firearm into a school and

shooting people at point-blank range in this fashion that's deliberately without regard for human life. so alex, i think as we often have to encounter in these situations, whether or not a prosecution can be had is a matter of state law, and every state has its own unique laws. in this case michigan has some statutes, some laws on the books that are well tailored to dealing with these facts, and ultimately, as with we look at these rash of school shootings that continue across the country, as we come out of the pandemic, one of the most important answers will be making sure that state legislatures have laws on the books that allow them to hold people accountable. it would be far better as katherine says, if we were able to take proactive measures. if there had been, for instance, in this case, more firmness in the school that it refused to return the child to the school or if there had been a search of his backpack that revealed the gun. at a bare minimum, we need to

hold these people responsible for their criminal conduct if for no other reason than to create deterrence. >> joyce vance, katherine schweit and shaq brewster. i will be speaking about the pursuit of anyone who may have helped them to try to get away. everyone in california, the battle is intensifying after a wave of brazen smash and grab robberies at retail stores across the golden state. videos of new thefts emerging almost daily on social media. retailers and prosecutors are calling for tougher legislation to help counter the growing threat after some blamed soft sentencing and bail policies for the rising crime rates. let's go to nbc's gad ve nay gas. >> the ka attorney general spoke yesterday to announce a six-year sentence for a man who would go

into the store and steal products and make millions reselling them. under the current laws they can prosecute these criminals who go in and steal these products. the most brazen of crimes breaking out across the golden state. smash and grabs, luxury store shakedowns. the pillaging of department stores. >> reporter: authorities investigating the latest, this jewelry repair shop in a san jose mall. $70,000 worth of goods stolen in just 12 seconds. the governor insisting the system is in place that can fix the problem. >> police need to arrest them, proximate results need to prosecute them. judges need to hold people accountable. >> reporter: this week officials in los angeles announcing the arrest of 14 individuals connected to recent smash and grab robberies. >> they worked to steal from high end clothing stores, often using weapons and physical force. >> reporter: but critics say more action is needed.

>> they only made 14 arrests in 11 incidents where at least one of these incidents involved 20 people. >> reporter: l.a. mayor eric garcetti calling for an end to the county's no bail policy for some offenders that some say is fueling the surge in crime. this year criminal activity up more than 8% in san francisco and in los angeles, violent crime rising almost 6%. in beverly hills, philanthropist shot dead in her home, a suspect caught hours later robbing a house nearby. all of this putting california residents on edge. >> literally every block there was police cars, police on motorcycles, bikes. >> oh, my god, this is a disaster. this is so scary. >> reporter: the governor in california has said that the california highway patrol will be helping local police, especially paroling the areas with the shopping centers. also, investigators will now

have an opportunity to follow up on a lot of these crimes because the thieves that steal the products often will go resell them, and that's the moment when they're exposed giving the authorities an opportunity to catch them. alex. >> let's hope they can catch them even before they make those heists. nonetheless, thank you so much for that story. the omicron variant and the one thing it has in common with the common cold, the latest on that. plus, why a researcher says we should assume omicron will be just as bad as all the other strains. strains. as a professional bull-rider i'm used to taking chances. but when it comes to my insurance i don't. i use liberty mutual, they customize your car insurance, so you only pay for what you need. wooo, yeaa, woooooo

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a growing number of states is reporting more cases of the omicron coronavirus variant. health officials say there are still a lot of unknowns about this strange -- strain rather. we're learning new information about its transmissibility and how it may have originally spread in the u.s. let's bring in dr. peter ho at the scene, codirector for the center of vaccine development,

and the dean of the national school of tropical medicine at baylor college of medicine. i'm glad you showed up again this weekend. you were on last week, and this is what you predicted. take a listen. >> if you had two doses and then six months later got a booster of the mrna vaccine, you've seen a 30 to 40 fold rise in virus neutralizing antibody, and that means even if it goes down, you still have enough residual virus neutralizing antibody to potentially neutralize the omicron variant. and don't know that for certain, but i think that's a real possible scenario. that's why i say a week from now and definitely two weeks from now, we can make many more informed decisions. >> okay. so here we are a week later, what more do you know about the vaccine's ability to hold up against omicron? >> unfortunately we don't have the data yet. we haven't -- we don't have access to the -- either to the virus or the pseudo virus, although companies are now looking at this, so we're hoping to look at it very soon as is

pfizer and moderna and the other companies, and the way it works is we look at the antibodies to our vaccine as do the pfizer and moderna, and when you compare it to the original lineage versus the omicron, you'll likely see a decrease, but we still don't know how far it goes. but for now, the message is likely that you're going to get some protection from that third immunization because of that big rise in virus neutralizing antibody. but we are learning a few things about the virus, and unfortunately much of it is still anecdotal based on what we're hearing out of south africa. we still have too few cases in the united states, fortunately to make any firm conclusions. one of the concerns is that we will start seeing reinfections with the omicron variant, so if you've been infected and recovered from a different lineage, a different covid-19 virus but you've not gotten vaccinated on top of it, it looks like you're going to be

susceptible to reinfection. so this is a wake-up call to people across the united states who are saying -- who have the feeling who have the so-called natural immunity that is e equivalent to vaccine induced immunity. the bottom line is if you've gotten two immunizations and will have waning immunity after six months, get your third immunization if you're eligible. if you're infected and recovered, get vaccinated on top of that. it will build this greater durability, greater resilience against any variants. finally don't forget to vaccinate your kids if they're eligible and over the age of 5. >> all excellent advice for good reason. let me ask you about the similarities we're hearing about between omicron and the common cold. what do you know about that, and if it does have some similarities to the common cold, does that mean its effect is like the common cold? is it less severe symptoms than say the delta variant has been?

>> so this -- so alex, this comes out of a very interesting study by a big data management group and ai group out of cambridge, massachusetts. i haven't heard a lot about them before this, but they put up a very interesting preprint where because of their database, they compared the omicron sequence to 5 million other coronavirus sequence, which includes all of the current covid variants that we know about, plus not many people realize this, but there are several coronaviruses even before this pandemic that were known to cause upper respiratory infections. they're a less common cause of the common cold, and when that was done, there was a unique signature sequence that was found from one of those upper respiratory coronavirus viruses, and so their hypothesis, which i think has some merit, is that perhaps an individual who got a

covid-19 variant at the same time was infected with one of these common cold coronaviruses, and both viruses have the potential to enter into a single respiratory cell or gastrointestinal cell, and there was some type of recombination even or sharing event, and the result is some type of hybrid. and so the question is does that mean that this is a less serious coronavirus and more resemble a common cold than it will a serious covid-19 infection? i don't think we know that yet. we are getting anecdotal reports from physicians in south africa that they're not seeing a lot of icu patients with this omicron variant, and some cases it's only an incidental finding. i think we have to be over cautious about interpreting anecdotes and we're going to have to wait to see how this pans out. >> generally speaking, when viruses mutate, do they become

stronger or more easily transmitted and ultimately how challenging is that for vaccine efficacy? >> well, it's hard to generalize. and certainly what we've seen throughout this pandemic is the ability of new variants to become more transmissible. so if you remember with the original lineage that came out of central china at the beginning of 2020, that ultimately got replaced across north america with the alpha variant that came out of an unvaccinated population in southern england, and that was much more transmissible than anything we'd seen before, and that worried us. and then in early -- in mid-2021, there was a delta variant that came out of an unvaccinated population in india, and that was even more transmissible, and it out competed and quickly took over the united states. you saw all we've been seeing for the last few months is delta, and that's caused a devastating wave across the southern part of the united states in the summer. now there's some concern that

omicron can outcompete or out place delta. it's a pretty high bar. i mean, delta's been the most transmissible variant we've had. i've been postulating at least for a while, we're likely going to have both. we're going to have a twin epidemic of delta and omicron, and with omicron having the ability to cause reinfection among individuals who have been infected previously but have not gotten vaccinated or those with declining immunity because they haven't gotten their third dose, that's maybe how it will play out in the coming weeks. >> my takeaway from everything you've just said is everybody get vaccinated and get your boosters. dr. peter hotez, thank you so much, sir, it's good to see you as always. coming up next, the charges against the parents of that michigan school shooting suspect are rare, but the politics that may ensue as a result probably not so. what are the chances gun rights and gun control advocates will actually agree on the

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all right, back with the breaking news we're following for you out of michigan as we have the parents of the oxford school shooting suspect in police custody after making their first court appearance today. james and jennifer crumbley pleading not guilty to all four counts of involuntary manslaughter. it comes after an overnight manhunt for the pair who were found after hours of searching. they were hiding in a commercial building in detroit. their son, 15-year-old ethan crumbley is accused of killing four students and injuring several others in that school shooting on tuesday. at 1:00 p.m. i'll be talking to the sheriff about that. meantime, there is a bizarre new twist in the mystery of missing money involving one of the biggest churches in this

country. lakewood church in texas, home to pastor joel osteen told police years ago that $600,000 had vanished. now a houston plumber is coming forward saying he found cash hidden inside church walls. nbc's morgan chesky has more and morgan, what a strange case this is. >> reporter: yeah, alex, it is one incredible mystery, and the investigation into that initial theft seven years ago is still ongoing, and houston police say this recovered cash is connected. meanwhile, joel osteen known for his motivational speeches and sermons has yet to comment on this incredible discovery. >> we love you. we're praying for you. >> reporter: the inspirational messages pack his houston church with thousands, but pastor joel osteen in the spotlight with a money mystery. >> but i mean, it was just like unbelievable the things he was telling us that they found in the wall. >> reporter: during his morning radio show host george lindsey took a call from a man who

identified himself as a plumber who worked inside osteen's lakewood church, the station, 100.3 asked callers to chime in. >> there was a loose toilet in the wall, and we removed the tile or they removed the tile, and about 500 envelopes fell out of the wall. >> envelopes full of cash, checks, and money orders. >> i went ahead and contacted the maintenance supervisor that was there and i went ahead and turned it all in. >> reporter: the church confirmed the find in a statement writing, an undloesed amount of cash and checks were found, adding they notified police but lakewood has no further comment at this time. houston police wouldn't share how much was recovered, but did state friday evidence from the recovered checks suggest this november case is connected to a march 9th, 2014, theft report of undisclosed amounts of money at the church. that money disappeared from a

church safe, and whale police launched an investigation, no arrests were ever made. with regular services planned for sunday, police documented the evidence and left it with lakewood staff. but call the case an active investigation. >> reporter: there was a push to get that plumber some reward money after that amazing find. crime stoppers says the time limit for tips had already expired and should a tip come in, it must lead to an arrest. and as of right now, no suspects' names and no arrests. >> we'll see. okay, morgan chesky, bizarre story. coming up next, we're going to head to capitol hill where two key depositions of trump allies have been postponed. we now know at least a reason for one of them, and then we're going to talk to our panel about four topics they get to choose what they want to talk about. ooe at they want to talk about

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today's deposition for a key figure in donald trump's attempt to overturn the election has been postponed. overnight, former senior doj official jeffrey clark delaying his testimony before the january 6th select committee citing a medical condition. let's go to nbc's julie tsirkin who's on capitol hill for us. welcome to you on this saturday. there's been a lot of back and forth between clark and the committee. where do things stand today? >> reporter: well, alex, we would have been hearing from jeffrey clark this morning if it weren't for that medical condition you mentioned there at the top, but now his new

deposition date is set for december 16th. let's walk a little backwards here and see where we got to this point. jeffrey clark originally was invited to appear voluntarily. the committee then issued him a subpoena when he made it clear he would not cooperate on a voluntary basis. now on wednesday, this past wednesday just a couple of days ago, the committee met to vote on a report issuing contempt of congress for jeffrey clark. that report was committed -- excuse me, that report was reported out of the committee on a unanimous basis, but look, now the full house vote is on a pause while they wait for jeffrey clark to appear. let's take a listen to adam schiff. he's a member of the select committee, what he had to say when he found out late last night that jeffrey clark wouldn't be appearing this morning. watch. >> the committee is satisfied that it is genuine, that is the sample documentation. this is not yet another ruse, and frankly, given his pattern of, you know, spending weeks when we were trying to get his

voluntary cooperation stringing us along, then being subpoenaed, then coming in and refusing to testify, and then on the eve of holding him in contempt, a new claim, this time that he's going to invoke his fifth amendment right, that was among the -- you know, all the many disparate claims that he made when he showed up for the deposition, he never suggested at that time that he believed what he said would incriminate him. that's a new defense. >> reporter: alex, the committee stands to benefit from hearing from clark in any capacity, even if he invokes his fifth amendment right, which he says he intends to do, so of course he's allowed to do that legally, but he's doing that to avoid self-incriminating himself against any questions he might be asked from the committee. they don't want to go down the road of contempt of congress unless they absolutely have to. as we've seen with steve bannon who was indict ed a couple of weeks, it doesn't mean the committee will end up getting that testimony or those documents.

the committee is also granted short-term postponements to other trump allies like kayleigh mcenany, the former press secretary for president trump. if they see that witnesses are cooperating with the committee, they're going to do whatever it takes to get them in a room and get that information they want before going down that road that i just outlined. >> julie circle, thank you so much for that from capitol hill. beyond that, it has been another busy week in police. i'm going to let my panel pick the topic and then give us their takes on the latest headlines, and here they are. new reporting that donald trump initially tested positive for covid three days before his first debate against joe biden. the ongoing twitter feud between two house republicans is over abortion and religion. the supreme court seemingly poised to uphold that restrictive mississippi abortion law that could have major political implications with a decision expected in june before the november midterms, and then speaking of midtermsmidterms, c surgeon dr. oz announcing this week he is running for

pennsylvania's open senate seat as a republican. joining me now is that panel, adrienne elrod, democratic strategist and former senior aide to the biden harris campaign, and shermichael singleton, political consultant and contributor to "the boston globe." which topic of those four do you want to talk about first? >> boy, alex, you gave us so many wonderful topics to talk about. >> super juicy. >> such a hard choice. i'd like to talk about the supreme court this week, the mississippi law and what the political repercussions of that could be. look, i don't understand why republicans pick these battles they're going to ultimately lose. 80% of americans, whether you're a indicate or republican, an independent or political considered themselves to believe that roe v. wade should be the law of the land. they don't want to see anything meddled with that. they see that as the president setting law for protecting a

woman's right to choose. so why republicans want to go down this road and take on an issue and make it front and center going into the 2022 midterms, and 2024, this is an issue that's going to be ongoing. whether or not this law is upheld, we know that more states are coming forward and presenting challenges to roe v. wade. this is an issue that's not going away. it's an issue that really fires up swing suburban voters. i cannot figure out why republicans want to take this on. it's going to fire up democrats and swing voters fire up our base going into 2022. >> i would love to let shermichael go back and forth on all of these, i want to get to all the topics if possible so you guys can have that conversation amongst yourselves. shermichael, those other three options, can you pick one you want to speak about? >> yeah, alex, i'm going to pick the two republican congresswomen going against each other. i think what this showcases, though it is on twitter, it showcases this continued rift and divide that we have

discussed many, many times on your show between two different branches within the republican party. you have your more traditionist, mainstream centrist right leaning individuals versus your populist nationalist trumpist form of republicans, which marjorie taylor greene represents. i think this battle does sort of exhibit the overall battle within the republican party, and that is a battle for the soul of the party. who will ultimately win that fight? i think the trump wing of the party currently has an advantage. i think depending on who some of those republican members are who will win in 2022 and ultimately run in 2024, could be donald trump himself. i think that will actually cement the future direction of the republican party for the next several elections to come. and so while i know a lot of people may dismiss it, i think the catalyst is something far greater. >> okay. between donald trump testing positive for covid sooner than

announced or dr. oz running for senate, which one do you want to take? >> i mean, i think i'm just going to take on dr. oz. you know, again -- >> why not. >> two great topics, alex, come on. i think what's happening here is, you know, you have donald trump who, you know, was essentially a celebrity, celebrity apprentice was a show that was very popular on television. he won in 2016, so therefore you've got all these copycats like dr. oz who think they can walk into a senate seat in a swing state. i think he's got a big surprise coming for him. we got to keep in mind that while pennsylvania is a purplish state, a swing state, we carried that state, the biden campaign in 2022 -- i'm sorry, in 2020, and i think it's going to be a very challenging time for somebody like dr. oz who has certainly made a number of controversial statements on had -- on his show, especially when it comes to vaccines.

i'm not sure this is going to play well with pennsylvania voters. >> last one to you, shermichael, with regard to donald trump testing positive for covid days before that biden debate. >> i mean, look, alex, i'm not even sure where to begin. you know, the mark meadows book that he's now stepping away from saying it was a false positive test result. we had several tests and we weren't sure what the status was at that time. if it is indeed true, as alleged as written in his book that the president tested positive and still went, i think it was careless. it's interesting i was doing research on this topic and it was only a couple of months ago this year during a fox news interview that donald trump was saying, hey, you know, i think i would recommend some of my followers to take the vaccine. it seems to me that the president is trying to have it two ways. i think some republicans are trying to have to two ways. some are saying we understand personal freedoms, yet we're still going to encourage

individuals to take the vaccine because they recognize that after saying don't take the vaccines for so long, alex, that there are many republican voters, particularly those of the trump wing, of the trump orbit who don't believe in vaccines. now it's almost impossible to roll that back to try to encourage those people and say, hey, we want to make sure that you're safe. we want to make sure that you're taking care of yourself, your family, and other individuals you may find yourself around. well, alex, you have to lead by example, and it's difficult to not showcase proper leadership in the beginning and then try to walk it back later on. >> yeah, i think you're 100% right on that, shermichael singleton, always good to have you both on. thank you, guys. so as you know, former trump lawyer michael cohen was released from home confinement, and he now has a lot to say about that experience and his assessment of whether officials have enough evidence to charge donald trump already. well, today maybe that could happen now, and he tells us why he thinks allen weisselberg is not the key figure in the prosecutor's probe. he's going to join me at

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a new development into the investigation of that fatal shooting on alec baldwin's new mexico movie set. the actor this week in an abc interview claimed no responsibility for the fatal shooting. >> do you feel guilt? >> no, no. i feel that there is -- i feel that someone is responsible for what happened, and i can't say who that is, but i know it's not me. i mean, honest to god, if i felt that i was responsible, i might have killed myself if i thought i was responsible. and i don't say that lightly. >> however, the district attorney in santa fe county says charges are still possible against the three people who handled the gun on set, and that

includes alec baldwin as well as the assistant director and armorer. cinematographer halyna hutchins was shot and killed by a live round. the parents of the michigan school shooting suspects made their first appearance a short time ago. who might have tried to help those parents elude the law. nts. ♪ limu emu... & doug ♪ ♪ superpowers from a spider bite? i could use some help showing the world how liberty mutual customizes their car insurance so they only pay for what they need. (gasps) ♪

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a very good day to all of you from msnbc world headquarters here in new york. welcome, everyone, to alex witt reports. we're following breaking news out of michigan where just hours ago james and jennifer crumbley, the parents of the suspect in the michigan high school shooting, were arraigned in court on four counts of involuntary manslaughter. both pled not guilty to all charges as a judge set their bonds at $500,000 each. >> these charges are very, very serious. there's no question about that. there is a -- there's court does have some concern about the flight risk along with the public safety given the circumstances that occurred yesterday and the fact that the defendants did have to be apprehended. >> james and jennifer crumbley were arrested early this morning in detroit following an hours' long manhunt prompting new reaction from the prosecution and denial