it's pinned to "the beat's" twitter page at the top of the feed if you want to find it and share it with others. is that does it for me, "the reidout" with joy reid is up next. hi, joy. >> thank you, my sister, have a wonderful, wonderful evening. >> you too. >> cheers. >> we begin "the reidout" with president biden addressing the nation as omicron, the dominant strain surges across this country. >> this is not march of 2020. 200 million people are fully vaccinated. we're prepared. we know more. we just have to stay focused. look, the unvaccinated are responsible for their own choices. but those choices have been fueled by dangerous misinformation on cable tv and social media. you know, these companies and personalities are making money by peddling lies and

misinformation that can kill their own customers and supporters. it's wrong. it's immoral. i call on them to stop it, stop it now. >> the country is back on a war footing in its response to covid-19 and indeed very much a war. in the u.s., covid has killed more than 820,000 people. confirmed cases have topped more than 51 million. the president today unveiled the battle plan that focused not only on vaccines but also testing. the initiatives include 500 million rapid at home covid test kits shipped free to americans starting next month. new federal testing sites with several of them debuting in new york city before christmas. use out defense production act to produce the tests and fema response teams prepared to help

hospitals at capacity. it comes two years in a pandemic that refuses to quite. the anxiety and frustration and fatigue of the moment is amplified by the unpredictable nature of the variants how they can get us back to the early days of the pandemic. the long testing lines are back. outbreaks on cruise ships are back. hamilton and other shows on broadway are cancelled through christmas. several nba and nhl games are now postponed as covid up ends the sports world once again. new york city mayor-elect eric adams is delaying his inauguration ceremony and several senators to governors are reporting positive tests. this nightmare scenario could not come at a worse time during what will likely be the busiest travel moment of the pandemic. this is the part president biden wanted you to hear, those holiday plans can continue

without fear of covid's worst outcomes if, if you're vaccinated to the millions who remain unvaxed, he's talking to you. joining me now is u.s. surgeon general. thank you very much. always great to have you here. i feel like we have just gone around in a circle. due to the number of americans unvaccinated. this spring is spreading. this is omicron. who knows what the next variant will be. what do we do at this point? we're not moving the people who refuse to get vaxed and the pandemic and morphing and morphing and morphing thanks to them. what do we do now? >> well, joy, trust me, i hear you on the fatigue and frustration. a lot of people wonder where we go from here and a couple of things that i want to put in

perspective. one is as frustrating to see cases go up and this new variant we have more tools than we had when this started to protect those us with the health of people around us. we didn't have vaccines back in march of 2020 but with omicron, if you get vaccinated and especially if you get boosted, you get protection up to pretty high levels and have great protection against the worst of covid, hospitalization and death. the thing we have to do is not only get vaxed and boosted but encouraging the people we love to do the same. we have seen time after time, joy, it is conversations between family members and friends that ultimately can help people get vaccinated and boosted and use our mask to reduce spread and use testing and rapid testing to make gatherings safer, it's a layered precaution you can choose to add.

the bottom line is if we have more tools, joy, i believe we'll get through this omicron wave. it's going to take some time and weeks for cases which will go up and we'll get through it. >> i believe president biden tested negative for covid nbc news is reporting. he was masked during contact with an aid that tested positive for covid and so he's testing negative so that is actually good news but the white house is anticipating more cases in the coming days. if somebody like president biden who is very careful, someone in his vicinity, someone who is around him winds up testing positive, for a lot of people that are vaccinated, part of the fatigue is we still know a lot of people getting sick, not really sick but catching covid. it feels kind of unstoppable at this point. do you think that perhaps we waited too long to send out massive amounts of tests, that

maybe we should have gone back into something like a lockdown? are we reacting and chasing our tail now with this disease? >> that's a good question. over the days ahead many of us will have family members and friends who tell us that they're testing positive for covid. the reason for that is because this is an incredibly transmissible variant. when delta arrived, we talked about how more transmissible that was than alpha but we're seeing with the omicron variant, this is a new level of transmissibility. those breakthrough cases will happen but and here is the key, the most important job of the vaccines, the most important job is to save our life and keep us out of the hospital and by that measure, these vaccines will still work especially if you are boosted but we are going to hear about these breakthrough cases and i realize that can and will

be unsettling for many people. we're unfortunately seeing this around the world. the u.k. and south africa and countries throughout europe are seeing the rapid spread and it's stuff to watch. >> you're one of the smartest people that i get the pleasure to talk to on the -- i love talking with smart people general, but i'm going to ask you about one of the dumbest people, sorry to say in public life. his name is jessie waters. he would run up on people in the street and try to embarrass him and that got him a sweet deal at fox news for a show. he made a comment in which he used the term kill shot to talk about dr. fauci. there has been this sort of war on dr. fauci, which caused him to face death threats but he talked about him and used the term kill shot saying that people should ambush dr. fauci and record their confrontations, their kill shot confrontations

and ambush him and accuse him of basically causing covid but i guess he thinks somehow dr. fauci invented covid or got together with some scientist in china and invented it and invested in the creation of it. it's the dumbest stuff ever and i hate asking about stupid things but i'll ask you, have you heard that about that comment and do you have a response to jessie? >> he's a public servant that served the united states of america for more than four decades and he's somebody we should thank to keep us safe during covid-19 but for anybody out there to use language that would encourage violence or speak to violence, not just against dr. fauci but against

anybody, especially somebody who is trying to go for the country, that's reprehensible. it's not modelled in a kind of values i would certainly hope to raise my kids with. i'll tell you this, too, joy, we as a country have to come together. we shouldn't be splintering apart. we shouldn't throw bombs at other people and trying to turn people against one another. the voices of disunity, voices that endorse violence that tear the country apart or make it harder to get through a pandemic like this and if somebody like that worked in my office in any organization i ran, they wouldn't be working much longer after a comment like that. we have choices to make whether we support or endorse values and statements like that that endorse violence and this is a time where we have to take a stand against the kind of

nonsense and rhetoric that poison public debate and turn people against each other and we need people to come together and face this dangerous pandemic. >> i appreciate you always being willing to come on and talk with our audience, people are nervous and scared and you're a calming presence. surgeon general, i appreciate you, sir. have a wonderful holiday. >> thanks so much. joy, really good to be with you. >> thank you. joining me now is msnbc political analyst and member of the "new york times" editorial board and presidential historian michael beschloss, host on peacock. we reached stupid phase of the pandemic i have to say. we have readily available vaccines that are free. administration is going to send for free the test kits, which are kind of expensive. $25. if you don't have $25, that's

expensive. they will send them to anyone that wants them for free. they're going to use the military. they're going to use the resources to make it easy for you to get tested and there are, you know, we can treat covid now a lot better. we know more about it. we still have 800,000 bodies on the ground, in the ground because people are like i don't believe covid is real. i don't know what to do at this point. you suffered through it. you've dealt with covid. i don't know what else to say. do you have any words to offer me as a word smith and brilliant woman? i don't have anything left to say. >> i would say that, you know, i think we're all so weary we're starting to lose perspective here but what is true is that we are going to see the end of this pandemic, i believe. i think that things are better

than they were a year ago, better than april, march of 2020. we don't want to lose sight of that. it is true this variant is spreading rapidly, the death rates are still much, much lower than they were and so that's just something to be grateful for. i really think that this is a time for public officials and public health officials, as well, to just stay the course in terms of urging people to get vaccinated, to get boosted but also i think we really need to start talking about some urgency around not just expanding testing but really marching forward with research and production of treatments that are going to break this link between infection and severe illness and also, longer term outcomes like long covid. part of what is heartbreaking about the timing of this variant striking now and in new york where i live is that we are probably just several weeks or months away from seeing drugs

from pfizer, which are going to potentially cut down the risk of severe illness particularly for the millions of americans who are high risk and we're talking about tens of millions of americans who could become severely ill from covid. people with diabetes, obesity, people who are older, people who have asthma. so i really think that public officials should really work hard to create urgency around that. that includes hopefully seeing the white house enact the defense production act so we can actually produce those pills that could be life saving and get them into the hands of more americans. yes, we're going to live with this virus, the difference is hopefully we need to live with it in a way where it doesn't end or change people's lives. that's the goal and we need to stay the course. >> yeah, i think that if they're going to use the defense production act, we should be sending them around the world to countries where people are not going to -- well, i don't want it. people want it around the world

and we could save a lot of lives around the world. michael beschloss, i feel like there are two presidents who committed really what should amount to criminal negligence when it comes to pandemics. it woodro wilson is a terrible man, racist and horrible human being but also let more than 670,000 people die. civil war level death from what the so-called spanish flu. just out of sheer negligence. i want to add president regan who looked the other way as far as the aids pandemic and wouldn't say the words. donald trump who clearly criminal negligence what he did in allowing, knowing it was airborne, admitting it in february it could kill people and letting people die. and so now president biden inherits that mess. what do we do? what can he do? >> well, i remember, joy, you and i have had good talks about woodro wilson, especially the fact that he was happy to take

all sorts of presidential power and use it to fight world war i and make himself popular but when it came to fighting in the pandemic of 1918, he not only didn't do anything about it but hushed it up. it killed a lot of people, especially warriors and wartime. nowadays we expect the president to use every power in his command to deal with an emergency like this and i hate to mention the unmentionable 45th president and i will not mention his name, but think when -- what this would have been like a year ago. you remember every day he would make a statement on what he was doing or more or less to the point not doing about covid and i don't know about the two of you but i think i know about the two of you, but i won't presume

to. i would watch those things just praying he would not say something that i knew would lead to the deaths of hundreds of thousands of people unnecessarily. remember the time when he said i told my people slow the testing down, please. >> yes. >> that is almost a crime against humanity. what i'm saying is joe biden may not always be perfect and he may not always say the perfect thing, although, he's done awfully well on covid in again general but you have a president who respects science and is compassionate and has a heart and we shouldn't be as terrified as a year ago. >> joe biden isn't perfect. there are a lot of things we can complain about but he's a caring human being who does want the whole country to survive this and there are just people there

who are decided to turn him into the devil just because they would rather hear, you know, tucker and all of those clowns in a vaccinated -- probably the most vaccinated company in america is fox news. they're all vaccinated. they're going to live through this and let their viewers and fans die because they don't give a damn. it clicks to them. it's just -- they don't care what happens. this is fun for them. you know. god bless colliden. >> hundreds of thoses of people are supported to die to undermine joe biden. >> it's sad. that's what they think. let them die. if it gets them power, let as many people die as will die. thank you both and happy holiday. thank you for being here. >> episode of "fireside history" is streaming now on peacock. you can check it out. the january 6th committee

turns its attention to a sitting member of congress as it ways criminal referrals for trump and others. plus developments as we await verdicts in two closically watched trials. kim potter and maxwell, the potter jury has come back with a couple questions for the judge and tonight's absolute worst, bad faith and bad decisions lead to bad outcomes for the people you're supported to represent. "the reidout" continues after this. "the reidout" continues after this in austin, texas. i work as a personal assistant to the owner of a large manufacturing firm. i've got anywhere from 10 to 50 projects going at any given time. i absolutely have to be sharp. let me tell ya, i was struggling with my memory. it was going downhill. my friend recommended that i try prevagen and over time, it made a very significant difference in my memory and in my cognitive ability. i started to feel a much better sense of well-being. prevagen. healthier brain. better life. ♪ ♪ 'tis the season to break tradition in a cadillac.

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the select committee investigating january 6th is getting serious about accountability. they now are considering more criminal referrals and not just for contempt of congress. "the new york times" reports they're now weighing whether they have enough evidence to recommend charges for a range of crimes including two in particular. wire fraud by republicans who raised millions of dollars off the election was stolen despite knowing the claims were not true. and whether trump and his allies

obstructed congress by trying to stop the certification of electoral votes. now criminal referral does not mean that charges will necessarily be filed, only the justice department can do that. but at the very least, it could be the wakeup call that attorney general merrick garland needs to finally open a criminal probe. meanwhile, for the very first time, members of the sell lelgt -- select committee requested documents from congressman scott perry of pennsylvania to answer questions about his role in an effort to install trump loyalest jeffrey clark as acting attorney general following the election. and just one part of a larger scheme by trump and his allies to use the credibility of the justice department to service the big lie. the evidence suggests that congressman perry was central to the scheme which may explaincoo. joining me is joyce vance and david jolly, national chair of the serve america movement,

former republican congressman no longer affiliated with the party. let's start with them. this is the committee's statement on congressman scott perry today. it says representative perry has information directly relevant to our investigation if members with directly relevant information decline to cooperate and instead endeavor to cover up the select committee will consider seeking such information using other tools. joyce vance, other tools could mean another contempt of congress, citation for this man. he's a current representative. what could these folks who refuse to cooperate potentially be facing in terms of legal charges? >> i suspect what happens next here is a subpoena to sort of ratchet up the level of compulsion. so it seems very likely that they had a plan in advance and

that would involve constantly going at the next level, seeing what happens when they issue a subpoena and if he declines to come -- comply, a big part of that calculous has to be if perry gets away with refusing to comply, they have very little ability for the folks behind him. >> what do you make of the fact we reached our first member of congress who could wind up getting a contempt charge. meadows is a former member. what do you make of the fact you have this sitting republican member of congress refusing to compile with the request for the body he serves in. he serves in congress. >> that's right. first, joy, i came on to listen to joyce's legal analysis because this is actually a really unique situation.

let's start with the baseline, which is who would not cooperate with the january 6th committee? member of congress or not. if you have information related to the events of january 6th. you share them. that is the calling of patriotism but you do have a sitting member of congress who now is trying to ultimately will try to invoke some privileges and defenses against testifying house members have what is referred to as the speech and debate clause, which is this wide latitude given to members overall types of speech, whether it's in the chamber or outside of the chamber and i'm curious. i think to overcome that, i think the committee would really have to suggest that there was criminal activity when they make a referral to the department of justice if they do. i think they have to say they have a strong suspicion that the member had engaged in i'm criminal activity to compel a member to testify. >> i mean, it feels like joyce, i'm not a lawyer but seems like they're building a case for a broad conspiracy. we have memos and bizarre power

point where they're saying here is the walk through of how to, you know, twist our system to keep donald trump in power. you have this guy, this member of congress who apparently was the one saying no, put this gentleman clark in at justice to basically provide the backstop from that end. feels like a broad conspiracy and the people not compiling like michael flynn, he sued the committee in hopes of blocking it from obtaining phone records trying to keep things away. it doesn't feel like these are innocent parties who were just chatting on the phone. it feels like a plot to an insurrection. you add in wire fraud allegations, and a potential that donald trump himself obstructed congress, you start getting all the way to the man at the top. can you foresee a situation where the justice department can ignore all of this as the committee, you know, goes along maybe to be disbanded if republicans get back the house? >> that's the question i think we're all debating, and this is

one of those cases where doj's practice of conducting its investigations behind a curtain of silence is incredibly frustrating because we simply don't know the answer. there is some talk merrick garland decided to sidestep this investigation. there are other people that believe it's being conducted in silence or perhaps more likely that the information that's being uncovered in the course of the congressional investigation may have nudged doj into action perhaps even the fact that getting a referral from a bipartisan congressional committee could give them the cover that they need to forge ahead. so joy, i think, you know, it's the former president who once said only the guilty take the fifth amendment and there is that appearance here when we have people who were clearly participants in these events declining to testify to the committee and david says something that i think is really on point.

he says who wouldn't want to help congress get to the bottom of what happened? january 6th was not an everyday pedestrian sort of tourist event. it was a once in a lifetime, maybe more like a once in a lifetime of our country sort of effort to overturn the republic and there has to be a way to hold these folks accountable starting with compelling their testimony. >> well, we hope it's once in a lifetime, david. here is the problem. it's probably not once in a lifetime. the first attempt at a coup. there are three generals, one of the most chilling things i've read in a long time. they wrote an opt ed we're chilled to our bones at the thought of a coup next time and along partisan lines from the top of the chain to squad level is significant should another insurrection occur. they're talking about people saying i will not listen to commands from the commander in chief because in my mind, trump is my commander in chief or some governor. this is the problem.

it's not a once in a lifetime. it was a rehearsal. >> that's right. >> the military is worried about it. how can the doj be quiet if the military is worried about it? >> there is a reason the trump team is putting their people in the capitals around the country. that's where the action would start and the words of the retired generals should concern all of us. to your point, this is incredibly important should we play this forward the need to hold the former president accountable. i can tell you what is going on in the speaker's office now. the duty of the january 6th commission is to gather this information and if they've clearly identified elements, they have a duty to put that in a report and the house has a duty to share that with the department of justice. if that happens, if nancy pelosi's house clearly identifies criminal activity and refers it to the department of justice, that is now how joe biden's administration will forever be defined. does he indict the former

president? >> absolutely. >> or not. that's a moment in history. >> and if merrick garland doesn't at that point, then shame on him. he will have failed his greatest test in history. his greatest test wasn't even when he got mercked after getting off the supreme court, it's this. this is his moment. if he lets it go, god help us all. joyce vance, david jolly. thank you. tonight's absolute worst is still ahead but first, some interesting questions from the jury on day two of deliberations in the kim potter trial. we'll bring you the latest, next. r trial. we'll bring you the latest, next

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jury deliberations will continue in two major trials we've been following in the sex trafficking trial of box well. jurors went home without a verdict. she faces six charges.

former minnesota police officer kim potter, charged with first and second degree manslaughter in the shooting death of 20-year-old daunte wright during a traffic stop in april. she's pleaded not guilty to both charges and claims to have mistakenly used her gun instead of her taser when she shot wright in the chest. jurors in the potter trial submitted two questions a short time ago asking what if the jury can't reach a consensus and what guidance and steps should be taken and if potter's gun could be handled outside of the evidence box. the judge reread jury instructions and ruled the gun could be handled. deliberations will resume again tomorrow. joining me is katie phang and paul butler, georgetown law professor. katie, what signals does that send to you the jury wants to handle the gun, not the gun and taser and asked about basically kind of what if we're a hung jury? >> yeah, so the last question is the one if you're a prosecutor, you're worried about, right?

it's the suggestion like you said they can't reach a unanimous verdict because the law requires that the 12 jurors in a criminal case come to a unanimous verdict. it's not majority vote with somebody's liberty. the handling of the gun is interesting. jurors sat through eight days of testimony and heard a lot about i meant to go for my taser, not my gun and part of it is the interaction of the juror to see and feel and touch the physical evidence in the case because sometimes you don't have physical evidence but i find it to be curious maybe they want to weigh, literally weigh the difference between the taser and the gun but the taser was bright yellow. by visual differences she should have been able to tell the differences. there is two charges and these are going to be the thing that i think the gun handling is going to go to. first-degree manslaughter is a tough road to sew for the prosecution. it's the killing of doaunte

wright through the reckless handling of a firearm but the second juryman slaughter, recklessness that came into play with the handling of that gun versus the taser and maybe that's exactly why the jury wants to be able to touch that gun and see is that a credible explanation? is that a credible defense? is it a mistake i went for my gun instead of my taser? >> i feel like she's going to walk. i always feel like the police will walk. the jury is nine white, two asian-american, one black, six men, six women. i was saying to the team before we came on i feel like thanksgiving worked in favor of the prosecutors in the case of the chauvin trial. i feel like christmas is working in potter's favor, though. because you have -- she did the tears. she did the crying. there are enough women and men on the jury that might be sympathetic to her demographically might relate to

her, seems like family. i feel like the tears plus christmas are going to help her. that's what i think. what do you think? >> i agree. i think the jury composition is key here. i believe the manslaughter two should be a slam dunk for this jury. the question is whether a reasonable officer would have mistaken a gun for a taser and then use it to kill a person who she stopped for a traffic infraction. that's not a hard question. so if some jurors are struggling, it may be based more on their sympathy for this officer. maybe her tears on the stand were like the tears of kyle rittenhouse moved his jurors. i hope some of these jurors have the same sympathy for the victim, daunte wright. >> we'll see. let's go to maxwell. are you surprised that the jury is still out and it's not a quick -- everybody herd about

-- heard about this case and trial. are you surprised this isn't a quick verdict? >> no, there was a lot more testimony in the maxwell trial than the kim potter trial. today one juror question came out is asking for the transcripts of the testimony of three of the victims in this case, which is an important thing but ask for the fbi notes, which are called 302s which are not in evidence and part of that is because the defense hammered on prior inconsistent statements made by the victims to the fbi and law enforcement, versus what they testified to in the trial but the second note that came out today, joy, that was interesting. they asked for confirmation from the court as a matter of law that if they believe the testimony of annie farmer, one of the victims in this case, whether that was evidence of conspiracy to entice miners to travel state lines and the judge had to say yes, you can consider that. as a prosecutor, you think that's a win and good sign they will convict on counts one and three. >> real quick, paul, do you

think the absence of jeffrey epstein makes it for a prosecutor more likely that the jurors will want to hold someone responsible, which means it's good for the prosecution or might see her as a scapegoat? >> the evidence suggests all four victims testified they were under 18 when they met her. the prosecutor said in her closing statement that these girls ordinarily would have been creeped out by jeffrey epstein but ms. maxwell was older and seemed high class and she made it look like everything was on the up and up. the evidence presented at trial suggests that ms. maxwell was a high class pill for epstein and abused some of the girls herself. it hard to believe the jury will find that all four of these survivors are lying, if the jury believes these women, there should be a conviction on all counts. >> we shall see. our dream team here. katie phang, paul butler, thanks

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>> nothing and i mean nothing captures the hypocrisy of joe manchin pretending he represents the average west virginiaen than this video from don winslow that has more than 600,000 views and counting. >> for me, it's all about west virginia. >> welcome to television's unchallenged authority on wealth, prestige and success. it's another dazzling lifestyle of the rich and famous. meet the stars of show biz and big business, discover how life's winners live, love and spend their fortunes. >> i mean, don winslow is right.

he would fit right in on lifestyles of the rich and famous. he made it clear yesterday he was always negotiating in bad faith and never planned to vote for build back better. >> i knew where they were and i knew what they could and could not do. they just never realized it because they figure surely to god we can move one person. the bottom line i knew we could not change. it never was going to change. it never could change with that many people. for the last month what are we going to do? how about this? >> he pulled a full j.d. vance showing open contempt for the people he supposedly is doing such a bang up job representing. he actually had the nerve to raise questions and concerns that parents would use their child tax credits on, oh, yes, on drugs. well gee, mr. manchin and the

yacht, call your constituents welfare queens and get on with it. there is actually data that shows nine in ten americans use their child tax credit on necessities like food and shelter and education. ton top of that, manchin raised the concern that people would abuse paid leave time and use it to go hunting. this is somebody who has claimed that d.c. doesn't understand west virginians but here he is reducing them to a stereo type. what is really sad is how much build back better would have helped west virginia and the leadership and power is not exactly in the best shape. west virginia ranks 50th in infrastructure, 48th in economy, 47th in health care and 45th in education. as a 2019 west virginia had the highest rate of drug overdose deaths in the entire country and according to the associated press, one in five children in west virginia live in poverty

and 93% of children qualify for the child tax credit payments. the bill would provide access to child care for 94,000 children and expand rental assistance for 83,000 renters in that state who are rent burdened and expand health insurance to more than 30,000 people in west virginia not to mention the climate change that would create jobs but the coal lobbyists didn't like that. faith negotiating and obstruction of a bill that would truly help his constituents, joe manchin is tonight's absolute worst and up next, we'll dig more into how maserati manchin misrepresents his state. i manch misrepresents his state. crepe corrector lotion... only from gold bond.

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this piece of legislation. i just can't. i've tried everything humanly possible. i can't get there. >> no, you haven't. with those few words west virginia senator joe manchin killed the most transformative legislation of the 21st century. he said he can't explain a bill that lifts thousands of kids out of poverty, cleans up pollution and helps parents take care of their kids. i'm not sure how hard a sell it is. that is his excuse. it begs the question. is it that he can't or he just doesn't want to? i remember the west virginia democrat executive committee, who criticized manchin for years, gave this possible explanation to "the new yorker." quote, if it does not personally benefit joe, his major contributors and/or his family, he is unmoved. unquote. joining me, grace siegers, staff writer, contributing at "the atlantic." i want to start with you, ms. siegers, the united mine workers association came out and criticized his reversal on build

back better saying it would have helped miners, coal miners. can you give us insight into that? >> yes. so the biggest issue for coal miners and for the mine workers of america is the funding of an excise tax. it is going to get real wonky here for a minute. so there is an excise tax that funds the black lung disability trust fund which provides benefits out to coal miners with black lung, which is a very severe respiratory disease. now, this tax that funds this fund is set to expire at the end of the year, and tucked into the build back better act was a four-year extension of this tax rate. so without this extension, the tax rate is going to be cut in half and the black lung disability trust fund, which is already facing insolvency, is probably going to sink deeper into debt, which will then in

turn affect the miners who depend on it. >> and so, you know, molly, here is a cool baron whose family is in the cool biz, whose daughter was in the expensive epipen biz, who is rich with a yacht and maserati saying the poor are lazy, don't give them money, it will make them lazier, don't give them help, they'll do drug, the same ronald reagan stuff. meanwhile, the business he is this is coal and he is blocking getting black lung money for coal miners. your thought? >> it is amazing that you can have a democrat like this in this time. i mean just incredible. it is hard to believe, but i will say he's a democrat in a state that went almost 69% for trump. so he has really good cover for not doing progressive things because he can say, well, i'm a red state democrat. >> right. >> also, that state is filled with people a little bit older, they're sicker, they're poorer,

and they're very attached to coal. so if democrats can't explain why -- you know, that build back better isn't just taking away your coal, they get -- you know, these voters don't quite get it. ultimately, i think it may be -- look, there's clearly a lot of questions about manchin and his portfolio and who even knows what is in there. but i would say part of it is that i think the voters are not hearing what is in it. >> well, so i guess that question back to you then, grace. i mean if -- i think it is a valid point. if people don't know what is in it and they hear it is going to be trillions of dollars, if you are a conservative-leaning voter you go, i don't want to do that, i would rather not be spending trillions of dollar. has there been an in-state sales pitch to explain this is your black lung money, this is to make sure you can take care of your kids, has that happened to your knowledge? >> there's been a lot of advocacy by the national black lung association, by the

appalachian citizens law center talking about the need for this tax to be extended from the mine workers of america as well. there has been in-state advocacy for it, but there's no way around that it is a ginormous bill. this is on a very small paragraph, very far down in the bill, and it is kind of difficult to get across that, hey, this is in here and it benefits sick veteran coal miners. >> you know, molly, this is the challenge i have. we will put the stats back up. infrastructure, the state ranks last. economy, 48th. health care, 47th. education, 45th. you know whose job it is to turn that stuff around and to explain to people, here is how i'm going to do it, how i'm going to make your life better? that would be joe manchin. joe manchin who claimed, i'm for this, i will put my name on this, oh, i just want it to be $1.6 trillion and in bad faith

lying, making the white house think he was negotiating and he wasn't. it is his job, his power to turn the statistics around and he seems determined not to do that. your thoughts? >> yeah, i don't think he cares too much about the people of west virginia. >> clearly. >> right. and i don't think now -- again, the stuff, the portfolio, he makes money on -- i mean who even -- i don't think senators and congress people should own stocks, period. they are making the law. they shouldn't be able to profit off it. it is insane. but i also think he hasn't been -- you know, democrats have not been good enough at messaging to people what is in this bill can change your life. so there hasn't -- you know, for him he can go on fox news, that helps him in this state. he can be the hero of this right-wing state. >> 100%. >> right. and he is taking things away from his people they desperately need. it is so upsetting to me as a person to see all of this poverty and the things that government can help these people. >> you know what an oligarchy

is? a state with one billionaire and everybody else is poor or struggling. that is west virginia. the one billionaire is the governor. i bet the next billionaire will be joe manchin and he will get to billionaire eventually because he is working them. "all in" with chris hayes starts now. tonight on "all in," the right wing december scent into darkness continues. tonight the glorrive indication of violence by way of kyle rittenhouse and what it means for the country. then as the january 6th probe considers criminal referrals for the former president, congressman adam schiff on his republican colleague that the committee says has information directly relevant to the investigation. plus, hunter walker with new reporting on the trump campaign's connection to intimidation of a georgia election poll worker, and my interview with the director of the cdc on the president's new push to deal with