pages at ari melbur and we talked about vaccines and vaccine hesitancy. if that interests you, check it out. that does it for me. we have a very special addition of "the reidout" with joy reid coming up next, hi, joy. >> happy new year, ari. you're having too much fun only three days in. >> happy new year. i'll be watching for news that will be made in your big interview tonight so we'll be watching. >> oh, thank you very much. really appreciate it. >> good evening. happy new year to you. welcome to 2022. sure hope it doesn't pick up nasty habits from 2021. i want to thank tiffany cross for holding down the bridge for me last week while i took a few days off for a much needed vacation. i literally did nothing but sit on my couch and bing watch stuff and sleep late. i loved it. last year was a lot. we can agree.

the covid pandemic took the lives of 800,000 fellow americans with three free vaccines out there and for the first time in humanpublicans ac of those who refuse to take the shot. we had an actual insurrection which we're under an investigation and resulted in 700 arrests and prosecutions, just not of anyone at the top. none of the presumed planners have been charged with anything including donald trump. the u.s. became a declining democracy in 2021 because of the trump coup attempt and a large chunk of the republicans essentially dropped its support for democracy in favor of ruling this country by any means necessary passing hundreds of jim crow style laws that attempt to block any voters who likely wouldn't vote republican from the polls, mainly black and brown voters of course enacting bizarre redistricting maps and

even empowering local republicans to overturn lawful elections. and so we're confronted as we start this new year with two very different concepts of citizenship that are struggling to exist in the same society. there is one, which says that particularly when faced with a crisis that as a member of a national community, i should do what i can to help other people. that we should help other people as a society. so if people are poor or hungry, we should pass laws making food and resources available. or if people are getting sick, i should put on a mask and get my skpefl my family vaccinated so not only do we not get sick, we don't risk getting other people and other people's grannies sick and take care of the planet since we have to share it. and if the candidate i vote for in an election loses, i can object to that and refuse to embrace the winner first amendment, baby. i'm not doing to storm the capitol and beat up police officers and leave people dead just because i didn't get my way. we'll use governmental oversight

if there are issues and at worst we'll fight it out in the next election and then there is this other version of citizenship which essentially says the purpose of a society is not to advance a lot of us but advance me and people like me and i have no obligation to the greater society because anyone other than me should not be my problem. it's a really extreme form of great man lib tarry and a brazil and moscow chaser so if people are poor or hungry, that's on them. i don't want to pay a penny more in taxes to help. hell, if i play my cards right i might be the next bezos and take trips to space. if i choose, i'll do it but you can't make me help other people. it's a version of citizenship that doesn't just depend on toddler level citizen shipss and must be appeased for things ton fair and secondary citizens

whose feelings don't count and a society designed to make me the member of the special citizen group and people like me feel good all the time so if a school history lesson makes me uncomfortable because it presents people like me in a negative light, no one can be allowed to learn that lesson. my special citizen ship means all history has to compliment me and make me happy all the time. never mind that the other people who are stuck in the secondary citizen groups had their history consigned to being secondary characters in the american story and just slaves that seem happy enough to my ancestors so what is the big deal and the railroads and no important history or the japanese in turn cannot talk about why that was or that they were actually amany -- americans except as the indian with the thanksgiving corn. you don't get to change my happy narrative about me to one that's more accurate because changing

that would make me feel bad so the laws should and must stop that. books that make me uncomfortable should be banned or burned and abortion makes me uncomfortable so ban it. when i vote, the candidates who i select have to win otherwise it's a literal crime and i get to react with no consequences. i like guns, so if i use mine and shoot you, too bad i like them and you can just be dead. oh, well, no limitations on me. and if i'm the police, sorry for ya. literally everything i do is fine because i am a special citizen and who are these special citizens? they're white so-called christian conservatives who feel like this country was built by them for them and so everyone but them needs to suck it up and let them have their way or else and their party, the republicans have gone from pretending to be the party of personal responsibility to unmasking themselves as the party of selfish people that cannot play

well with others and they even have their own cable networks plus something called get her, which kind of sounds like porn. moving on. any whom, "star trek" reminds me of charlie from that classic episode. the annoying alien that destroys everything around him when he doesn't get his way. so the special citizen says i don't want to wear a mask and if you try to attack me i'll attack the low waged clerks at the store. i don't want to get vaccine, joe rogan said it's fine. my kids aren't going to get vac -- vaccines, f those other kids. so this midterm election year we're going to find out which brand of citizenship is stronger and the answer will tell us whether our democracy is strong enough to survive. with me now, michael eric dyson,

professor at vanderbilt university and author of "entertaining race performing blackness in america" and tom nickles contributing author for "the atlantic," the assault from within our modern democracy. thank you both. i'll start with you because you write about the idea of performing race in this society and it's interesting the context of this is that we do -- it does feel to me like we are having the redemption period after reconstruction a certain percentage of america chances feel like the country used to fix on them and they don't get to do what they want and have their way, it's an outrage and crime and goes back to the way they thought it should be. can you walk us through someone that looks at history how we get out of the circumstances because the last time i don't feel like it was permanent, our exit from

that mess. >> right, or the latest reissue of "leave it to beaver" or "dennis the menace" take your pick. you want to take it to yourself. we're faced with a malignant narcissim. that period of redemption, post reconstruction where we fight for the future of this nation and say finally, we'll put the metal of democracy to the test we will figure out if we're truly committed to it or if it's been all words, not deeds and what we're finding now your brilliant geology you would be applauded right now. what is interesting is the genealogy you presented to us is so spectacular because it really condenses and distills a view point that is about strict

self-reguard and interest. not that self-interest is bad or self-regarding is bad but to the -- at the expense of the common will, what benjamin franklin understood to be the common good that's contributed to by our actions and deeds. no founding father or mother or brother or sister could condone what we see going on now. we use their words in vein. they were about despite their flaws, the democratic process small d, expanding the parameters of our society as we were willing to sacrifice for the greater good. the people you have sited are the exact opposite and this move of ex traction is about the expansion of their narrow concern about what society is. when you talk about black people who were enslaved getting free, trying to make this country better and then people saying

nope, you got too much already you shouldn't have had what you already have. you used to work for us and don't anymore. let's rejigger the system to make you subservient again. that's where we are. the denial of it, the denial of it is especially tragic and i'll end by saying when you lay on top of that a dangerous spear wn who is a president can dictate the terms of those with who he disagrees to the point that they are illegitimate, that they are not true american citizens. this is the utter definition of a factious impulse that is our consistent commitment to expanding the boundaries of democracy but then again, the asian folk, chinese folk, japanese folk, the african folk in america, the immigrants, those whose bodies have born the burden of the expansion of democracy must once again rescue

this democracy from those who have been its privileged inheriters. >> it's interesting, you mentioned the founders and tom, you know, little maddie tweeted the founding fathers would never recognize this country. they wouldn't. me and michael would have been slaves. they wouldn't have been on television. they wouldn't have been able to imagine television. one of the ways they wouldn't recognize this country is it originally wasn't envisioned as multi racial democracy. we put forward the very unique idea for democracy, a solid idea for democracy and apply it to something they didn't intend, which is multi racial democracy and we're struggling because we don't really have a blueprint for how to do that and tom, what i worry about is one of the things that's the biggest impediment to us doing it is number one this narcissim that

somehow we've gotten into. you write about this a lot and talk about this a lot and we tweet about this a lot. the sense of i have to win and have my way or it's not fair and also this kind of almost religion of conspiracy. when you mix those, i'm not sure we can have a multi racial democracy with those things in place. what do you think? >> there is a lot going on there. one of them is this culture after narcissim has filled this yawning gaping hole where spiritty has become a search for meaning. life is supposed to be interesting and heroic and fun and noble and the idea that previous generations took pleasure, a civic pride, a pleasure in civic virtue by serving others and being stoic and not constantly talking about your sense of grievance and your sense of anger and outrage, that

is completely alien to multiple generations now of americans who are all about vocalizing a sense of loss even though they haven't lost anything. you and michael were talking a moment ago about people who have had something taken from them. the irony is a lot of people storming these barricades have had nothing taken away from them. they've been told they had things taken away from them and their acceptance and embracing of that notion has given their lives some kind of meaning and what michael checked -- name checked "leave it to beaver" but joy, you had me at "star trek the original series." that character is internal adolescent, which is what we have become in this country. we're eternally adolescent. we take offense at everything.

we look for reasons to take offense because to respond to it is empowering. we take no pleasure, i'll get off the soapbox but take no pleasure in adulthood anymore or simply saying there are burdens to be shared, not everything goes my way. there are things that have to get done every day that are not fun or interesting and it used to be that your father's generation, mine, our parents, my mom, my dad, they took a certain silent pride in saying why am i a hero? i get up every day. i get my day started. i go to work. i take care of my children. i plow the driveway, whatever it takes. that's not enough for people anymore and that's when democracy starts to fall because then that emptiness and that lack of meaning is something they project onto the government and they say it's the government's fault. >> i feel like this is so -- i wish we had an hour to do this. it would be such a shame if we lose our democracy because of

bordom and people not feeling like they have meaning and so qanon gives them meaning and believing children are locked up in a pizza shop and donald trump's sadness because he didn't win the presidency again. i agree. it's a search for meaning but a search for meaning in really vicious, vicious ways. i wish we could do more but we have to move on. up next on "the reidout," we are learning more about what the president at the time of the insurrection did or didn't do. long-time partner of brian sicknick joins me next and changes to the filibuster to get voting rights through the senate. senator schumer will join me. it's not even ground hog day but tonight's absolute worst finally emerged promising many more months of covid winter.

yay. "the reidout" continues after this. "the reidout" continues after this ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪

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it's been nearly a full year since the january 6th insurrection and we're learning more and more about republican members of congress played in perpetrating and enabling the attack on our democracy. select committee chair liz cheney, vice chair said there is firsthand testimony of how trump watched the attack understand -- unfold and did nothing for hours. >> the committee has firsthand testimony now he was sitting in the dining room next to the oval office watching the attack on television. we know as he was sitting there in the dining room next to the oval office, members of his staff were pleading with him to go on television to tell people to stop. we know leader mccarthy was pleading with him to do that. we know members of his family, we know his daughter, we have firsthand testimony that his daughter ivanka went in at least

twice to ask him to please stop this violence. >> the committee learned trump recorded several unreleased videos before ultimately releasing one telling insurrectionists to go home and he loved them and they were very special and requested those videos from the national archive. this comes as the committee continues to receive documents and testimony from witnesses including former nypd commissioner trump legal advisor and pardoned former felon bernie karik but it's what karik did not provide including a with held document called draft letter to potus for the 2020 elections. we're also learning more about the end goals of the january 6th committee including leg slaigs -- legislation to prevent this from ever happening again. >> there is legislation we hope to recommend with this report that congress needs to adopt so that who occurred on january 6th will never happen again.

we came critically close to losing this democracy as we've come to know it and so it's our duty as patriots, as americans, as members of congress to make sure we get it right. >> though we haven't heard a lot from the doj, it says it's also taking steps to hold the insurrectionists responsible with attorney general merrick garland planning to update the country on those efforts on wednesday. i'm joined by long-time partner of fallen capitol police officer brian sicknick and it's so good to see you, happy new year to you. i want to start by asking you about this idea that you heard the congressman and the chairman of the committee say about planning legislation to try to prevent a future insurrection like the one that resulted in the death of your loved one, brian sicknick. what do you make of the fact it is highly unlikely if

legislation came out of the committee it would make it through the united states senate because the insurrection itself is a partisan football. >> it's very depressing. very, very depressing. you know, these -- the majority of these republicans have just acted incredibly defiant, you know, they for whatever reason have remained loyal to donald trump even though there is overwhelming evidence especially now that the committee uncovered that, you know, just like most of us had pretty much assumed that he instigated this entire event. he stood by for hours and watched what was going on at the capitol during this insurrection watching everything unfold like it was an action movie.

and had no empathy, no care in the world for these officers that were being beaten and pummeled, the innocent people and the capitol, it's a very, very frustrating process. and i'll not just like you were eluding to, i'm not so confident of how far we're actually going to get, i honestly feel and very frustrated trump belongs in prison, period. unfortunately, he's had decades of experience of this legal wrangling, you know, and how to skirt the system and draw stuff out and it's very, very, very frustrating. actually, i'm reading a book right now on suffering and i learned that the word patience is actually derived from the latin meaning to suffer so we

just actually have to remain patient, unfortunately and suffer. you know? and that's what trump enjoys. he revels in it. >> you know, i want to play -- i think what you're saying is so poignant. he does seem to revel in suffering and find it sort of fun, a bit fun but i cannot tell, i don't know if you feel like you can tell, i don't know if any of these members in congress ever bothered to talk to you. i know it was difficult to get them to face you and talk with you at the time but i want to play for you, this is a fellow brother officer of the late officer sicknick harry dunn. he was asked how it feels to continue to work in a space with members of congress who are ignoring the insurrection. >> doing your job as a police officer, you look at what is important and how the mission of your job is. the person is not important but

the seat they represent is important and as long as you keep that prospective, you're able to do your job because it's not about a person. you think about what that seat represents and that's the thousand, hundreds, millions of people that that seat represents. >> what do you want to see merrick garland say when he speaks on wednesday? what do you hope to hear from the department of justice? >> you know, i would like them to say that they're going to, you know, really work very hard to say the wheels of justice will get that but a lot of people suffered greatly and it's not just the officers, it's not just the families of the officers that were harmed in this. you know, it's the american people. the american people that voted

and, you know, wanted their voices heard and trump and all the people that enabled him wanted to over throw that and it's scary, we just had three, i think three generals that came out and did i think an op ed that said they're fearful another coup attempt is looming in 2024. that's terrifying. terrifying. >> do you -- would you want to see members of congress prosecuted if they were involve in planning or knew in advance about the insurrection? >> oh, absolutely. i believe there are some that did know, absolutely. ally alexander said there was. i don't see any reason why he would lie about that. i mean, i could be wrong but, you know, i mean, there is just too many dots when you take them separately and then you kind of

connect them that show that there was some prior knowledge here that shows that they were aware. you look at gosar consorting with some of these people affiliated with the oath keepers, you know, and some other shady things that were said and done. you know, it's just too coincidental. >> yeah. >> very disturbing. >> indeed. and i will note for our audience there is a poll that shows 52% of republicans think the insurrectionists were protecting democracy. washington post has a poll finding one in three americans say violence against the government can be justified siting fears of political skism in the pandemic. we're not in a good place. always appreciate you coming in and sharing time with us. appreciate you. tonight's absolute worst is still ahead but first, senate majority leader chuck schumer joins us on his push to change

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in advance of this week's anniversary on assault on democracy, in a letter he vowed to hold a vote on rules changes to the senate filibuster to move forward on blocked voting rights legislation. schumer wrote quote, let me be clear january 6th was a symptom of a broader illness, an effort to delegitimize the process warning out senate action, the vents of january 6th could become the new norm. schumer said we must adapt and evolve like it has many times before. the senate will debate and consider rules on or before january 17th. the martin luther king junior holiday assuming republicans

will continue to block the legislation, which you should. chuck schumer joins me now. thank you very much. appreciate you being here. tell us what are the specific rules changes that you are considering putting on the floor? ? first, joy, let me say what happened on january 6th is a direct continuation of the big lie, which donald trump perpetrated created january 6th and a continuation what is happening around the country. we had mrs. sicknick on and we all pray for her peace and mourn her loss. non-partisan election officials, just plain people doing their job to count votes are being threatened in state after state with violence, a few of them have had to have police protection so the idea that january 6th is totally a run off is wrong. it's being perpetrated by this attempt to take away voting rights of so many people, people

of color, young people, people living in urban areas, hanicap people, elderly people. we have to fight against this and as you said, joy, it would be great if republicans would join with us. in the past it was bipartisan. president regan, president w bush, president h.w. bush supported voting rights but the new republican party under the leadership of donald trump is viciously against voting rights and not only our elections but our whole democracy so if we can't get republicans, if we can't get republicans to join us, we're exploring a variety of different rules changes and we'll work and trying to get all 50 democrats including senators manchin and sinema to go along because if we don't change rules, they will block this and our democracy could be at risk and wither in real ways. >> and i think everyone who is

watching the show agrees with that. those voting rules changes must happen because democracy is at stake. let me present you with a couple of rules change options that have been presented by people including on this show. al franken, friend of "the reidout" and norm have put forward one idea to reform the filibuster, meaning you'd flip the numbers from 60 votes required to 41 required to continue it moving the burden from the majority to the minority. the minority could prevail but require a major effort by the minority to accomplish the ends. bipartisan compromise might be the best way to do that. there is another option who is the former chief counsel to senator ted kennedy and could change without changing the filibuster at all. when it comes to major legislation, it would assure that the minority gets a full debate and the right to offer relevant amendments after an extended period of an amendment gaining bipartisan support, they

could move on, invoke closure, cut off debate by a simple majority vote. the minor would have say boom, and we could move on. have the two conservative democrats who have been standing in the way of the changing the filibuster sign on to anything that looks like either of the two options? >> we're having active discussions with them, several a day i just spoke to senator manchin and over the holiday break, the new years and christmas break we've been talking constantly, not just me but just about every one of the 48 democratic senators who supports not only the proposal, the freedom to vote act and the john least restore the voting rights act but changing the rules. there are a variety of different rules changes, some you mentioned and haven't which we're exploring with them and pushing with them and which ever one works to get voting rights

chucked to undue the activities of the republican legislatures, we will accept and we'll have constant discussions and said to them, both joe manchin and kyrsten sinema say they believe in voting rights. good, that's great. they are sponsors of the freedom to vote act and the john lewis act but just to believe in it and not change the rules and we're making it clear to them, joy, that even a paragon who believed in the senate rules, robert c. bird changed nine times and i have his quote accurately when circumstances change, the rules have to change. let me tell you circumstances changed dramatic by but donald trump, the big lie, the violence of january 6th and all the efforts to take away voting rights and just one more point, the link between january 6th and what's happening across the country in republican legislatures is crystal clear and we'll talk about that link all week. >> well, i totally agree with

that but i need to press you again. the second option, this is the option would not require you to make any change to the filler best buster at all. you could put the john lewis act on the floor and essentially make manchin and sinema on the floor decide whether they're siding with voting rights and telling the truth or side with republicans. are you willing to put these bills on the floor using that model, let everyone get in, et cetera and make -- >> the model is a walking -- >> decide. >> the model is a talking filibuster where the other side would have to talk and once they stop talking, you would not need 60 votes. that's the rules of the senate. the only problem -- >> could you put the bills on the floor with that? >> the bills will be on the floor. of course the bills will be on the floor but then you need a rules change if you're going to do something and one of the rules changes would be that you

can't just right now you can create a filibuster by sitting in your office. we'd have to say you'd have to be on the floor and talk about it. that's called a talking filibuster and one of the things we're considering. i don't want to get into specific details of which ones. we're pushing anything that would get us the john lewis act and the freedom to vote act passed and signed into law. >> very quickly before i let you go -- >> there is not one better than the other if they work and they allow us to get the bills to become law. >> very quickly, one last person, this is somebody you knew well and a friend of yours, the great harry reid who will lie in state soon in the capitol. my non-related name sake. he said the country is better off having a real democracy, not a fake democracy. 60% is not a democracy. he said later on in the year, get rid of the filibuster. it's nothing as barack obama said at john lewis' funeral,

it's part of the leftovers. you have to get rid of it. it's very bad. can you tell us any evidence that manchin or sinema has given to you that they care more about voting rights and the democracy continuing than about the filibuster because i haven't seen any evidence they actually have more support for voting rights and democracy than the filibuster. >> they have made public statements that particularly manchin he wants to get voting rights done and wants to figure out a way -- >> why should we believe that? >> let me just finish. let me -- >> take action -- >> we have to keep pressing them and pressing them and pressing them until they do. there is too much at risk. if they said yes to us, we wouldn't have to worry about this. we do have to worry and keep pushing but when senators go to them and say i will lose my

election unless we do something about voting rights, when senators come to them and say we will not have a democracy anymore, not just for two years but for ten years and constant senators of all different stripes including some of our most moderate senators, we have a group of three senators who is constantly talking to them, joe angus king, jon tester and the senator from virginia as well saying to them we were not for changing the rules but we've changed our mind. too much is at stake and it's a constant, constant discussion and we'll keep going until we succeed. i can't tell you they publicly said anything. you know they haven't. i know they haven't but there is a lot of things we're pushing hard on. i don't want to be, this is an uphill fight but too important to give up on. too important to give up on. >> chuck schumer, thank you very

much. thank you for your time. wish we had more time. >> thank you, joy, as soon as we hear something publicly, i'll be -- you'll hear from me. >> all right. that sounds like a plan. thank you very much, sir. >> thank you, bye, bye. don't go anywhere, everyone. tonight's absolute worst is up next and it's a doozy. you don't want to miss it. and . you don't want to miss it. oh yeah, we gotta take off. you downloaded the td ameritrade mobile app? yeah, actually i'm taking one last look at my dashboard before we board... and you have thinkorswim mobile- -so i can finish analyzing the risk on this position. you two are all set. choose the app that fits your investing style. ♪♪ (burke) with farmers auto multi-policy discount, the more policies you have with us, the more you could save on your auto insurance. (man) (wife) hi, honey! (man) like what? (burke) well, you'd get a discount for insuring your jet skis...

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we now bring you the saga of florida governor ron desantis. you would think it's code red instead he rung in the new year with a free florida mantra, one of the atmospheres for businesses and individuals with few restrictions and refused to say whether or not he received the booster shut when asked by fox news. >> have you gotten the booster? >> so, i've done whatever i did

the normal shot and, you know, that at the end of the day is people's individual decisions about what they want to do. >> desantis saw an opportuity and snatched it knowing some businesses didn't like the lockdowns and a nasty virus couldn't stop partying. herd immunity treatment over prevention that plays with people's lives. he boosts monoclonal antibodies a treatment one of his top donors invested millions of dollars in that is infective against omicron but freedom, right? the 62,000 floridians to die of covid-19. in december as florida shattered covid records, the leader desantis vanished, poof, nowhere to be found, not even on fox news, not even in cancun. speculations tore through twitter by folks that may or may not have included me. but i can assure you desantis

wherever he was was thinking a lot about an important election coming up in 2024 so that he can make america florida. that's because the grim reaper of florida chooses political am wish over leadership. the return of ron "death" desantis including a statement from his attorney general. stay with us. statement from his attorney general. stay with us they can practice earning every day. with a debit card just for them, they'll learn smart spending firsthand, while you monitor and set account alerts. and using their own chase mobile app, they can set big savings goals. all with no monthly service fee. chase first banking. ♪ limu emu... & doug ♪ ♪ superpowers from a spider bite? i could use some help showing the world how

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i think that particularly given the clinical profile so far of omicron, there's not justifiable to let fear overwhelm you. you can't let any type of hysteria undercut the normal functioning of society. >> those are the comforting words of the florida governor who until new year's eve had been missing from public view since december 17th with the exception of a december 19th fox news interview. while florida was facing its biggest surge in covid cases yet, with average daily infections exploding by more than 2,000% since december 6th, bringing with it an astronomical increase in demand for testing. responding to his absence today, desantis made a snide remark about president biden spending some time recently at the beach in delaware and his press secretary noted december 30 and 31st were holidays for state employees and desantis would be spending time with his wife who is fighting breast cancer. i commend the governor for that. and i pray for the florida first

lady's speedy recovery. but no one on his team has yet answered why the governor was invisible to the public for two full weeks in december before that. when covid was spiking in florida and mayors were pleading for help. instead of addressing any of those questions, he and his immunocompromised wife rang in the new year at a packed christian concert in miami, touting the state's alleged freedom. joining me now is daniel, florida-based attorney and chairman of the remove ron pac and dr. bernard ashby, a miami vascular cardiologist and florida state lead for the committee to protect healthcare. thank you both for being here. dr. ashby, i texted you this question earlier because when i saw the press conference by the governor, the specific comments that he made about his wife being with him two days after apparently she had had chemotherapy, which he talks about her having chemotherapy and the states that she had

chemotherapy on the 29th and two days later, she was at this big event. i don't know if we have video of it. it's in miami. it's lots and lots and lots of people, unmasked, all near her, and he had also gone to another public event in miami in kendall before that. is that wise? >> well, of course it's not a good idea. i'm sure her oncologists were petrified when they seen her at an outdoor event or an event with multiple people right after chemotherapy. so, that is exactly what you don't want to do. and so, i know we're going to get into it, but i've always said from day one that desantis, aka jim hanson and the muppet baby with incredibly irresponsible and reckless and what's happening right now during the unprecedented surge that we're seeing is that both of them are derelict of duty and they are completely crickets when it comes to anything

related to mitigating this pandemic. typically when it comes to testing. and so i don't know if you know this, but back in may, they shut down all the state-run testing sites and now floridians are having to wait hours just to get a test done and then wait days to get the result after that. you know, again, it's a fundamental dereliction of duty and rather than address that issue, they're saying that testing is unnecessary now, which couldn't be further from the truth. >> let me very quickly play the surgeon general saying that and actually making it sound like testing is just some sort of psychological, you know, tick. here it is. >> we're going to be working to unwind the sort of testing psychology that our federal leadership has managed to, unfortunately, get most of the country in over the last two years. we need to unwind this testing sort of planning and living one's life around testing.

without it, we're going to be sort of stuck in the same cycle. >> and dr. ashby, he's sort of reflecting marco rubio who tweeted, record numbers testing positive for a sore throat isn't a crisis. the real crisis is hysteria that has people waiting hours for tests. it seems to me that based on what you've seen, this governor genuinely believes in sort of survival of the fittest herd immunity, right? let everybody get covid, the strong will survive and we'll vaccinate the elderly and the rich. >> clearly. i mean, from day one, when they were listening to folks by the likes of atlas, it's clear they're pursuing a herd immunity strategy and ruboi needs to shut his mouth because he has no business talking about public health and this is something that is life and death for particularly immunocompromised patients and he is not helpful whatsoever. >> let me go to you, daniel. thank you for being here and welcome to the show.

have you been able to determine -- i know you've been tweeting about this and following it. have you been able to determine what happened to ron desantis for those two weeks when mayors were saying, where is ron desantis? we need testing, we need help? >> well, the thing about ron desantis is that he wakes up in the morning with make-up because he's always ready to be on tv or press conference so it was highly unusual for him to go 17 days without a press conference, and so what we believe is that he takes these victory laps all the time, and he put himself in a box, and he couldn't deal with it because there was no explanation and the cases were exploding, and he decided to just sit back and do nothing. and florida is -- has a horrific experience with covid. we have had, in terms of -- in 2021, florida has had over 40,000 reported deaths. we are fourth in the country in death rates since the vaccines

have been made available to all adults. we have -- the cases are skyrocketing, and the governor went m.i.a. i mean, we looked, and from november -- early november until december 17th, when he did not appear, he had about 17 press conferences. some of them were twice a day, and he was on fox news, and then he went m.i.a., and we believe that he has a repeated -- does this repeatedly. when things are going well, he's out there, yo, and he thinks they're going to -- all these fake victory laps, but we at "remove ron" have been following him and trying to show what really is going on and he was just absent, and that was just, in the case -- and today, he appeared with the surgeon general with excuses, really blaming the president, with this theory of, let's unwind testing. >> yeah.

>> it is orwellian to suggest that we're going to deal with these huge lines of tests. we've got people waiting hours all over the state, and we're going to unwind it. we don't need to unwind testing. we need to remove ron desantis. >> it seems his opponents have a strong case for that. daniel, dr. bernard ashby, thank you very much. that is tonight's reidout. all in with chris hayes starts now. tonight on "all in". >> members of his staff were pleading with him to go on television to tell people to stop. >> new revelations from the january 6th committee. >> we have firsthand testimony that his daughter, ivanka, went in at least twice to ask him to please stop this violence. >> tonight, how donald trump is solidifying support amid dire warnings about the state of our democracy one year after the insurrection. then, jesse wegman of the "new york times" editorial board on why his