>> i don't understand why you're asking me that question, it's public knowledge and has been so last 35 years or so. it's totally accessible to you if you want it. >> for the public? >> to the public. >> great. look forward to >> doctor fauci's answer to, is public information. senator moran? >> what's more on. >> we are going to end the night with jesus. that is our broadcast for this evening, tune in tomorrow morning for my interview with republican congressman and january six committee member, adam kinzinger. right here on msnbc at 9 am eastern. until then, i'm going to crawl under this desk and go to sleep. on behalf of all my colleagues and the networks and nbc news, good evening.

>> we've got a lot going on in the show tonight, after president biden's voting rights speech, in atlanta georgia, all the fallout from that. going to be talking tonight with a senator who is that the speech and who has a little bit of an inside track on whether or not the senate is actually going to deliver on what vice president harris and president biden called for today. this is a senator who has been with the president all day. she's going to be joining us live in just a few minutes. after she touches back down in d.c., on the air force one flight back from georgia. very much looking forward to that conversation. also going to be speaking to one of the leading voting rights activists in the country. someone who, to be honest, has actually given president biden a really hard time on this issue. has been really confrontational with president biden and the biden administration on this issue. been pretty relentless in saying that president biden needs to do more. needed to say more. needed to go further to make

sure that everything possible was being done to protect voting rights. this activists told us today, that he thinks president biden in atlanta today, hit it out of the park. that this is exactly what he was hoping to hear. so we are going to hear from him in a few minutes tonight as well. he has a really interesting perspective on this stuff. so we are going to get to all that. briefly though, before we get to all of that. i do want to tell you about a new, interesting development in a story that we have been chasing for a little while. and it suddenly seems like we are starting to get somewhere with this and i want to give you an update. this is something that we first talked about on the air last month. just before christmas, when we obtained this document. from wisconsin. this document is a forged document. purports to be the official slate of electors, chosen by wisconsin in the last presidential election, but it is not. in wisconsin, joe biden be donald trump. so that means wisconsin chose biden electors.

the state chose democratic electors to cast the states vote in the electoral college. but last month, we reported on this document that was created by republicans in wisconsin after the election. they actually sent it into congress. they sent it into the national archives. they tried to pass it off as an official document. as if they were actually the real electors and they the republicans, were casting wisconsin republican votes. and they were casting them for trump and pence. so we talked about that forged documents from wisconsin here on the show last month. and we did that in the context of this, ongoing open question in wisconsin. as to whether or not anybody is going to get in trouble for that. whether or not the state election board, or in fact state prosecutors in wisconsin are going to pursue the ciders of that fake document. potentially on forgery charges. so that is sort of where this story started for us and boy did we hear from you our viewers about the story, when

we started covering it. we got a lot of feedback. a lot of people expressing concerns about how serious this seemed to be. and you know, it is a big story. wisconsin republicans taking the whole election denial mission got. one step beyond. actually sending the national archives and congress a forged document. where they pretended to be the states real electors, when they were not. it is a fascinating story and i understand why a lot of our viewers were disturbed by and contacted us about it. that was where we were last week. last night, thanks to reporting from politico.com. reporter nicholas woo. we were able to show you additional forgeries from additional states. turns out, it was not just wisconsin. republicans in michigan and republicans in arizona also created forged documents after the election. where they try to pass themselves off as the real electors for those states. when in fact, they were not the

real electors for those states. and again, they didn't just brief pair those documents for home scrapbooking on how i wish the election had gone. they prepared these documents, made them look as official as possible. they cited u.s. law. they proclaimed themselves, quote officially to beat the legal representatives of the state. and they sent these things into the government. to be counted. pretty astonishing thing. we first got the documents last month, last week we showed you similar forgeries from michigan and arizona as well. now, if you watched last night show. when i was talking about the story i said raise your hand, if you think there's going to be any more of these. that didn't take long. turns out, there is more. and let me show you this. this is what the real one looks like. this is what the real document

is supposed to look like. when a state finalizes and certifies its elections results. they then know which candidate won the state. that tells you which candidate electors will cast out states vote in the electoral college. right, a trump won, it is going to be trump electors. if biden won, it is going to be biden electors. this is a real process and here's what it looks like for real. here for example, this is michigan. and all of the states do it a little differently, in terms of presentation. but the basic point is to convey all of the same official information. here is the real elector certificate from the state of michigan. kind of looks like a diploma. let's do another state. let's do the real electoral or certificate, we have the one from arizona. yeah, the arizona is very nice. looks kind of like a medical degree. and not all of them are fancy like this. this one from georgia for

example is all business, just the facts. same with the one from wisconsin. wisconsin's cold this time a year. dave time friendly for perry, just get to the point. some states end up in the middle. something that looks like a diploma, something that looks like a gas station receipt. this one is from nevada. it is very typical. every state does look a little different, but these are all real. and the basic information is the same. we the undersigned, being the duly elected and qualified presidential electors for the state of x. and then they have the votes cast from the electors, from the relevant candidate, they have the signatures and all of the people who are the qualified electors. that is with the real ones look like. can we put all those up on the screen together? i think we got them from a bunch of different states. there is the five that i just mentioned. as you can see, it is the same basic information on all of them. all of these documents serve the same purpose. they'll meet the constitutional threshold they need to me in order to convey this

information officially. but they all looked a little different. they all conveyed information visually a little different, depending on how fancy the state felt about this particular topic. and what kind of nice stationary they have laying around, full seals and the rest of it. now, i picked these five states. to show you with the real electoral vote ascertainment documents look like. i picked these five. because thanks to the watchdog group, american oversight. we now know that in all five of these states. republicans also prepared for forged fake documents. that were sent to the government. claiming that these other actors were from the states. casting the states electoral college votes, not for biden, but for trump. just watch this. tell me if you notice something essentially. this is the documents from georgia. in georgia, that is the real electoral vote document on the left. that is the forgery that was

created by republicans on the right. now let's do the nevada. in nevada, that is the real one on the left and that is the fake one on the right. here also is wisconsin, where we reported on their forgery last month. that is the real one on the left, and the fake one on the right. here's michigan, where we reported their forgery last night. the real one on the left, the forgery on the right. and lastly, here is arizona. the real electoral vote document on the left and the fake one on the right. it wasn't one state, wasn't three states where they did this. it was at least five states where we have now obtained forged documents created by republicans. and it is not like they, again, created these documents to hold close to their chest and fantasize that this had been the real outcome. it's not like they created these documents just to keep themselves as a keepsake. they sent them into the government, as if there are

real government. in a solid day sentiment like, hey we are not the electors, cause biden won here, here is our names for your records, no they actually created these fake documents purporting to be the real certification of them as electors. i mean, here it is. the forged document from georgia. we the undersigned, being the duly elected and qualified electors for president from the state of georgia, do hereby certify you are not the qualified electors from the state of georgia. you are not. but that language, or language just like that, isn't all of these. you might have noticed something, when i put them all up there. when i put those five out there against the real documents from each of those states. again, all the real certificates and electors from the states, they're all different, they're all unique, every state is a little different, they all have their own corks, thrown fancy or not fancy paper. decorations and seals. contrast that with the forged republican documents.

look at them. they all match. exactly. same formatting, same font, same spacer, almost the exact same warning, all the. you might remember on last nights show, we know that the forged documents from michigan and wisconsin, looked really similar, looked really alike. but the arizona one, actually looked a little bit different. here is the amazing thing that we discovered today about arizona. it looks like there were actually two sets of forged electoral college documents sent in by arizona republicans. there was the hoop the different one that we showed you last night that has notary stamps all over and stuff. that was the one obtained by politico.com that we showed here on the air last night. but as of today, thanks to american oversight, we have obtained another one, also from arizona. also forgery. a whole different set of republican impostor sent in this one in arizona. and that one, not just exactly, all of the other forged electoral votes from the other

six states that we have found. from the four other states, excuse me. this is kind of not, right? i mean, arizona alone. in arizona, they are so around the band, that two different sets of republicans sent into the national archives and congress, two different sets of forged fake documents purporting to be the electoral college votes from the state of arizona. one of those forgeries was maybe freelanced. let's get a notary design every page, that will make it look real. but the other one from arizona matches the exact form, foreign, language, exactly the forgery sent in by republicans in at least four other states. in these five states, one of the two 40s from arizona and those other four states, the forged documents all match. this would therefore appear to be a coordinated effort. or at least somebody gave

republicans and all of these states, the same template for creating these false records. because they all have the exact same language, they all have the same phone, they have the same spacing, they have the same format it. that doesn't happen by accident, who organized this? in these five different states. we know a lot now. we have learned a lot in the last year, but all of the things former president trump and his associates did to try to seize power. try to falsify the election results and prevent the newly elected president from taking over. now we are starting to figure out that those efforts appear to include someone, somewhere, coordinating an effort in at least five states, to have republicans create and submit to the government forged documents, in which they claim to be the real electors from their states, when they were not. electors for trump. even though these were all states that biden won. this was not a clear and coordinated effort before, but now we know was. who coordinated this effort?

now, at the time that this was happening, pennsylvania republicans. pennsylvania is not one of the states that we have been talking about here. they put out a statement saying that the trump campaign had asked them to create and certify within the republican party, a republican set of electors for pennsylvania. as they explained in their press release at the time, the pennsylvania republicans didn't forge a document to make it look like they were the real electors, they created a new document that said they would become the electors if a court ever ordered that the republican side had actually won the election in pennsylvania. they didn't for documents saying that they believe they were, they were purporting to be the official electors. they created the document that said, if a court ever says that, republicans won in pennsylvania, then will be the electors. now, they'll say the trump

campaign advises them to -- which i'm to track down the claims in that statement, if in fact the trump campaign was commissioned -- not just to -- reversed by courts, but if the campaign was commissioning republicans to forge documents in multiple states were throng electors purported to be real electors, we'll do our best to get to the bottom of this. here's something else know, after these fours documents were created in submitted to congress and the national archives, from these five states, these fake slates of electors saying where the -- electors of our states, after that happened, we know that at least one trump loyalist at the department of justice was aware that republicans had done this in multiple states. now, one of the trump officials, who has by the fifth, who has invoked it, in order to avoid

testifying to the january six investigation, his name is jeffrey clark. former trump justice -- clark, you might remember, he's the one that trump reportedly tried to install as attorney general. the best we can tell from public reporting, trump seemed to like the cut of his jib, after jeff clark drafted a letter that he insisted must go out on justice department letterhead, to some of the states that trump lost, including georgia. this letter, that was reportedly drafted by jeff clark was addressed to the state government instate georgia, and was going to be sent to other states as well, the letter falsely stated that the u.s. justice department was investigating serious credible claims of fraud and the election. that the state legislator, there, should consider holding back -- jeff crowd drafted this letter

from the u.s. justice department to go to georgia and other states. because the rest of the justice department wouldn't sign off on it, trump tried to install jeff clark as attorney general, so that he could senate sign it and send it. had that happened, -- had the u.s. justice department jumped in, the way trump wanted to, the way jeff clark proposed, had the u.s. justice department told republican led states, informal letters, don't send in biden electors, on advice from the u.s. justice department, you better not do that. how do you think republican legislators in those states would've acted? it's one thing to get an off the wall call from trump berating you, right? it's another thing for the u.s. justice department to formally advise you, over the signature of the united states attorney general, that you cannot send in your electors, because there are real problems with the vote in your state. how would republican

legislators deal with that? how would ever spawned? it we would be living in a very different country, right now, had that u.s. justice department letter gotten out. i'm not sure all of us would be even living in the same country had a letter got out. that was just insanity. that would have been as radical as trump's other reported idea, to send the national guard out to seize the voting machines, and we won the election. it would've been just that radical, had the u.s. justice department intervened to stop the administration of the election. here's the thing, that insane draft letter, written by jeff clark, which made trump want to install image to tierney general, that insane letter, was created let last general -- that letter, explicitly describes these forged slates of electors, from multiple states. it says in the middle of the letter, the department believes that in georgia and several other states, both as a slate

of electors supporting joseph biden, and a separate slate of electors supporting trump gathered on december 14th at the proper location to cast their ballots. both sets of those ballots have been transmitted to washington d.c. to be open by vice president, pence. in fact, i don't know why the justice department believes that to be true, but that was correct. we now know. multiple states, republicans in multiple states, had sent in false assertions, forged documents claiming to be the electors for their states. matt that draft letter was dated december 28th, how did that guy -- that trump guy at the justice department know that two weeks earlier, republicans in at least five states had in fact created these forged electorate occupants? did the trump justice department know about it, because they help republicans in those states do it? we don't know.

but, somebody up and do it, because they all file the exact same document, in the same font, in the same spacing, with the exact same language, so somebody help them do it. we are working on figuring it out. i will also just tell you one other thing about this, in a lot of these states, for whatever reason, the forged, fake electoral votes, these documents that were faked and sent in, they also, in addition to the assertion that these where the duly elected electors from the states, which is a lie. a lot of them also included a lot of substitution's, meaning that the people who were originally supposed to be trump electors from those states had trump won, the original would be trump electors, had their names dropped, and they were replaced with other names, without the republicans who did sign these documents. so, when these fake documents were created to try to pass as the state elected, lose some of the people who had been slated to beat trump electors, weren't the people that signed them.

they will replace, they were substituted at the last second. and almost every state that did this, people who were originally supposed to be trump electors got replaced with these other republicans before the force documents were sent in. why is that? we're trying to get to the bottom of that to, but i can tell you, at first pass, in at least one state, at least one of the republicans, who was substituted for -- whose name was dropped, as a intellect or, one republican who was replaced by somebody else before that force document was silence and in, that republican told us this evening, that substitution was deliberate. that person had their name taken off the list, and replaced, because that person did not want to be part of that effort to forge a slate of electors, that was not the real electors from that state. one of the republican electors who was replaced in georgia. that person told us this, tonight, quote, i knew the meeting was taking place, but i did not wish to attend. i did not wish to give my

electoral vote knowing that president biden had already been certified by the state. what you would hope would be the reaction from every republican approach to sign their name, as if they were real elector, in his state that was not one by their candidate, but in fact was one by the other guy, so they were going to be electors at all. you would hope that would be the reaction from everyone who is approach to forge document like this and sign their name to it, under circumstances like this. but, in at least five states, we know they filled out a full slate of electors. fake electors who were willing to put the names there. there was, at least one republican, who balked. who know this force electors thing was fake, and didn't want anything to do with it. there were at least a dozen other republicans who also substituted out, who were supposed to be trump electors from those states, but for whatever reason, didn't end up signing the forged documents. they had their names replaced. another republican sign instead.

we know at least one of those decisions was a matter of conscience and patriotism, from one georgia republican. we will see if we could find out about the others. now, as we reported here in december, there is an open question in this wisconsin, as to whether the forgery there is going to be pursued by the state election board, or indeed by the state prosecutors. those people in wisconsin said they were the state electors, and they were not, and they tried to pass themselves off that way. that would appear to be against the law in wisconsin, it is an open question if that will be pursued as a criminal matter by the state election board. this is new, in michigan, the detroit news just reported that the matter is part of an ongoing investigation by the state attorney generals office. here's the detroit news, a spokeswoman for the -- declined to discuss the legality of the republican certificate in detail, saying it was part of an ongoing probe. quote, that matter is part of an investigation into election

related matters, we are not currently in a position to share specifics as the review remains ongoing. so, in terms of whether or not the people who did this will individually get in trouble, open question, and at least two states. not sure about the others. this is a thing that happened. it apparently happened in five states, at least. this is a new element that we did not previously understand about the way trump world manoeuvred, to try and falsify the election. to try and stop the transfer of power. it may have put an individual legal jeopardy all of the republican who put their names on these efforts, in at least five states. widening the lens a little bit, the basis for all these efforts that they made throughout the real results in the states, were these false claims of fraud. which, frankly, they started hyping before the election. they're still hyping them now. they're still hyping them now,

both to justify new restrictions on the right to vote, and to justify the continued effort to subvert the reality of the last one. that is a connection, that in atlanta, president biden argued loudly and, clearly. >> here's how they plan to subvert the election, the georgia republican party, this aid legislature has not given itself the power to make it easier for partisan actors. their cronies to remove local election officials. think about that. what happened last election? the former president and allies pursued, threatened, and intimidated state and local election officials. election workers, ordinary citizens were subjected to threats, menacing phone calls, people stalking them in their homes. remember with a defeated former president said to the highest

ranking elected official in the state? he said, quote, i just want to find 11,780 votes. pray god. he didn't say that part. he didn't say count the votes, he said find votes. the ones he needs to win. he failed because of the courageous officials, democrats, republicans, who did their duty and upheld the law. with this new law in georgia, his loyalists will be placed in charge of state elections. what is that going to mean? the chances for chaos and subversion are even greater, as partisan seek the results they want, no matter what the voters have said. no matter what the count. the votes are nearly 5 million

georgians will be up for grabs, if that law holds. it's not just here in georgia, last year alone, 19 states not proposed, but enacted 34 laws attacking voting rights. there were nearly 400 additional bills that republican as of state legislators tried to pass. now, republican legislators in states have given plans to escalate the onslaught this year. the endgame, turn the world of voters into a mere suggestion. something states can respect, or ignore. jim crow two point oh is about to insidious things, voter suppression and election subversion. it's no longer about who gets to vote, it's about making it harder to vote. it's about who gets to count

the vote. whether your vote counts at all. it's not hyperbole, this is a fact. >> voter suppression and election subversion. president biden speaking today in atlanta, trying to rally the country in support of strong, new federal protections for voting rights. for the technocratic, non partisan administration of elections. he's rallying the country, speaking to the country today, but it is 100 americans in the united states senate who will make or break this issue. who are both the intended audience, and the instrument on which this tune as to play. whether or not it can be done, whether or not anything has changed, in terms of two conservative democrats who are blocking the possibility of this happening, we'll get into it next. with senator, amy clover sure. stay with us.

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advanced security helps keep your family protected online. pause wifi whenever for ultimate control with the xfinity app. and family-safe browsing gives parents one less thing to worry about. security, control and peace of mind. with xfinity xfi, it's all built in at no extra cost. >> i've been having these quiet conversations with members of congress for the last two months. i am tired of being quiet. state legislators can pass anti voting laws, majorities, they can do that then the united states senate should be able to protect voting rights by a simple majority. today, i'm making it clear, to protect our democracy, i support changing the senate

rules. whichever way they need to be changed to prevent a minority of senators from blocking action on voting rights. i when it comes to protecting majority rule in america, the majority should rule in the united states senate. >> president biden today making this forceful public case for voting rights. for changing the senate rules. whichever way they need to be changed in order to allow the senate to pass voting rights protections with a majority of the u.s. senators. majority of senators in the u.s. senate. tire being quiet, tired of negotiating behind closed doors with senators. so now here is the avery public madam, if you can keep it 1 million dollar question. will the senate act? what effect does this kind of

public query have for the president of the united states. have on the holdouts among democratic senators, who said thus far, however noble the cause, there are no. joining us now is senator amy klobuchar. travel to georgia with vice president harris tonight, aboard air force one. senator it is really good to see, i know it's been a long day, good to see. go ahead. >> just before i get to what is going on in the senate, i did want to say, president biden's speech was wonderful tonight. as was vice president harris's. there was this moment where he talked about how there is a moment in time, he brought up the bomb blowing up in that church. in birmingham. he brought up when john lewis crossed that bridge and when he got hit and when people got

killed and people got injured. and he brought up january 6th. this is one of those moments, it began on january 6th, it didn't and there. it's been a conservative effort. you just talked on your show. 400 bills introduced across the country, many of them passed to take peoples rights away to vote. as reverend warner has said repeatedly some, people don't want people to vote. that is what's going on in our very democracy depends on it. this is a moment where time stands still. and that is the argument that we are making to these two senators. . i was also struck with the way the president made the partisanship on this issue and how it has changed over time. speaking of atlanta, speaking of blue dot atlanta. making the case in part for how republicans, until quite recently, unanimously, all but

unanimously supported voting rights in the voting rights act. people like john thurman, had an extended -- anti-civil rights icon. who in the end, supported the voting rights act. and this is something that republicans needed to do in massive margins in the past. both an indictment of republicans and also of democrats who might need to do it is to be done, to get things passed. i want to put your reflections on how the partisanship around this issue has calcified in a way that we might have never seen before. >> i think mates the case, right. there is many of us. cherish the worker done. i think i mentioned that a few times in the presidential debate. stage, the point is that right now, they are not clinging on this right now. even though, i think that is why he felt it was important, making the case in the past.

democracy triumphs. more important than a divide between us. right now, because of the shadow, the large shadow of donald trump over the republican party. there are very few people that are willing to stand up. like you are seeing with liz cheney, with the january 6th commission. that she is willing to stand up over in the house. and that is just not happening right now in the senate when it comes to voting rights. the case i made my colleagues in those rooms, we wanted it to happen. is that the filibuster is unbelievable. change to the filibuster are not radical, they've happened 160 times rachel. changes have happened, where bills have been passed without the 60 vote. 1977, national gas policy. 1980, selective service system. 1987, national defense bill. 1995, endangered species bill. the bush tax cups, the trump

tax cuts to reconciliation. what just happened with mitch mcconnell in the debt ceiling. history is riddled with exceptions and changes that were made. it is robert byrd himself, i've told him this, to senator manchin several times, who once said, you know you change the rules when there is changed circumstances. rachel, an all out assault on our democracy is a changed circumstance. >> we are going to see if we believe senator schumer about the timing here as soon as tomorrow, as late as monday, martin luther king day. we are going to see a vote in the senate. is there anything else that we should look for ahead of that? in terms of conversations, events, pronouncements, we just wait to see how it is going to go when it happens. >> there's a lot of drama right, now i'll give you that. i think that's, good that's democracy. we are negotiating, we are talking to both senators, groups of people. our whole voting group that has been involved in the beginning.

including senator schumer. and senator merkley, cain, king, warnock. it is a group that is not giving up. and as our other senators, who have been involved. meeting with senator sinema. people feel so strongly about this. i want to make clear to your viewers today, this is not a little moderate divide. there are two senators who are working through this with us. but there are a whole bunch of moderates, people from states, senator tester of montana, who see a good democracy rule. sunday after 15 years, we have same-day registration taken away in that state. we have thousands of people who are relying on that. just one example that you don't always hear about. that is this all of us out on democracy across the country. and when you look through history, we were there in georgia, where history happened. federal government response, they may not do it right away,

but we can't wait anymore. the federal government responded when there was civil rights violations. the federal government responded throughout history when things have happened. and it is on us right now. we are just making the case to these two senators. seriously, i'm giving you a lot of the arguments that i use all the times. as we can, this is not a radical change. what is radical, is people who are undermining our democracy. that is what it is radical. and it is on us to write it. >> we can always have difference of opinion, democrats and republicans. our job is to make sure that the votes are counted fairly. that people aren't doing sham audits, fake certifications. they are not throwing people off of an election board. they are not taking and dismantling those election boards. those things would be solved through the freedom to vote act. simply set minimum federal standards for the country. grounded in the u.s. constitution, which clearly says never questioned the congress can make altered to the laws regarding federal

elections. >> senator amy klobuchar, chair of the rules committee and the senate, freedom to vote, senator thank you for joining us tonight. as you said, a lot of drama right here now. we look to thunder stand, thank you for being here. >> okay, thank you rachel. we'll be right back, stay with us. l be right back,est. panera. live your yes. now $1 delivery. us

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senator, every american should remember. history is never been kind to those who have sided with voter suppression over voters rights. it would be less kind to those who side with the election submarine. i ask every elected official in america, how do you want to be remembered? at consequential moments in history, they present a choice. do you want to be on the side of dr. king, or george wallace? do you want to be on the side of john lewis or bull connor? you want to be on the side of

abraham lincoln, or jefferson davis? >> some of the most pointed remarks from president biden today, as he urged a change in the rules of the senate in order to pass voting rights protections. the speech today came amid pressure from activists, urging the biden impression ministration to do more. -- has included a hunger strikes, rallies, and marches, and nonviolent civil disobedience, including this. outside the white house, last fall, when civil rights and religious leaders were all arrested. the man you see in the t-shirt on the left, that's been jealous. he's been one of many voting rights activists who has been hard on the administration, calling on president biden to do more on this issue. mister jealous is taking part in five such protests, outside of the white house. he was arrested four times, spend a night in jail, all in order to push the administration to do more, when it comes to voting rights protections. ben jealous was there today, in

atlanta, in the front row, when president biden gave his speech. joining us now, ben jealous. president of the -- former president and ceo of the naacp. thank you for making time to be here, tonight. i've been dying to talk to you about this. the >> thank you, it's very good to be here. >> i honestly did not know what you would think of president biden's speech. i know you told our producers that you thought he hit it out of the park. that you heard what you needed to hear, what you wanted to hear. i love to hear take on it. >> first of all, i appreciate you showing so many clips of it tonight. it's important that people hear the entire speech. what we needed to hear wasn't just what -- that he had a plan for dealing with it. he presented that plan, today, and frankly made the case to everyone in his party, even the more conservative members, on why they need to get on board and get on board now.

i have every faith that he will follow up, and do what happens after something like this. which is to push hard, in the senate, publicly and in private. frankly, today looks like the beginning of a winning presidential push. >> in terms of senator manchin and senator sendoff, who were really talking about, who are in the way, president biden is in singling them out by name, directing people to pressure them, but certainly, one of the effects of a public colic this, is that people are going to lobby in pressure, and try to reason with those two senators to try and move them on the issue. are you optimistic that those efforts might succeed? >> i am. you know, nelson mandela told us, it's always impossible until it's done. we've heard again and again, it would be impossible to get joe manchin on this bill. he said he would never support

the for the people act, or the freedom to vote act. but -- he's one of the principal authors. we heard him today, he said he would support rules changes by not ending the filibuster, where you don't have to end the filibuster in order to -- you don't even have to have a carve out in the filibuster, you can change rules in ways that would allow ultimately for an upper down vote. the filibuster has been so bastard over the years, you can do a lot short of getting rid of it, changing rules that would allow for the vote. kristen sinema, i heard the president speak to directly, when he said, who side you want to be on. bullet honors or kings? the reality there, well aware that the arizona is the last state to support martin luther king day as a holiday. she doesn't want to extend that. if manchin comes over, and there's a lot of movement --

many of us have become students of manchin, watching him, he's moving in the right direction. once he crosses the line, she will fall to. she does not want to be all alone. she does not want to be on the side of goldwater. >> ben jealous, president of the -- for the american way. former president and ceo of naacp. i know it's been a long intense day, i'm glad you're able to be here. >> thank you for having me. >> we'll be right back. stay with us. stay with us are you taking a statin drug to reduce cholesterol?

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voice was often gentle. -- in president self he was stone cold silent. -- fairness and prosperity, his voice would echo, and will echo for generations in the state. >> something to be eulogized by not one, but two united states presidents. that was president biden, former president barack obama, eulogizing ally in harry reid, at his funeral, las vegas this past weekend. tomorrow, former senate leader larry read -- half this is also very, very rare honor. the service, in his honor, will start at 10:30 am eastern, there will be speeches thereafter. it will be an elaborate event, you can watch it all here, live tomorrow. at msnbc we will be right back

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tonight, we are expecting a very busy day, particularly in washington tomorrow. harried, former senate majority leader harry reid, will be lying and stay on the capitol dome. capitol rotunda. we'll have live coverage of that memorial, starting tomorrow at 10:30 eastern. if you listen to senate democrats, it is also possible that at any point they could be taking up that vote on voting rights and whether they are going to carve out something from the voting rights rule. from senate rights rule, in order to keep voting rights protected in the legislation of the united states senate. eyes open, heads up, busy time.

that's all, now it's all time for the last word with lawrence o'donnell. >> good evening rachel. who's breaking during this hour, includes us from politico about senator sinema, meeting with a small group of senate democrats on rules changes this evening. in the lbj room, in the capital. this is possible indication that the public pressure that both joe biden and judge schumer put on senators manchin and sinema today, might be nudging them a bit. the report says that the senators in this meeting, in addition to sinema were, tim kaine, angus king, jon tester, brian schatz, elizabeth warren, ben cardin, chris coons, maggie hassan. rachel you were talking earlier about how some moderates in the senate have been on board for a rules change. and maybe among the most effective people lobbying