on december 1st, of 2020, a few weeks after the presidential election, a republican state representative in michigan got a very odd voice mail message. we've played a recording of this voice mail message before. it was obtained by a small new service called the michigan information and research service. now, in light of new developments, this voice mail has taken on even more significance. >> hi representative, my name is angela mcallen -- personally reach out to you on

behalf of the president, as you got an opportunity to be a crucial part of his reelection. we just want to make sure that you knew how you could be helpful, and ensuring that every american is represented and can, rests to sure that their vote will be fairly incorrectly counted in this election. the united states constitution provides that those state legislators to or retain sold oratory to designate the presidential electors. you do have the power to reclaim your authority and send this slate of electors that will support president trump and vice president pence. >> you do have the power to reclaim your authority and send a slate of electors that will support president trump. just a friendly reminder, on behalf of the president, that you do have that power. obviously, this voice mail was one part of the trump campaign's fake elector scheme, where they assemble slates of fake trump electors, that they

intended to use to replace the actual electors in states that biden won. last month, we got reporting that it was rudy giuliani doing leading the effort for the trump campaign. but, who else? well, angela mcallen, the trump campaign staffer that you heard making that phone call, she was subpoenaed by the january 6th investigation committee in november. now, that language from her call about urging state lawmakers to reclaim their authority, well, that language is now showing up in new subpoenas for the january six investigation. this is from a letter accompanying a subpoena -- quote, the select committee is in possession of communications reflecting your involvement in a coordinated strategy to contact republican members of state legislatures in certain states that former president trump had lost, and urge them to reclaim their authority, by sending an alternate state of electors that would support former president trump. it appears that you helped direct the trump campaign

staffers participating in this effort. and then, if you check out the footnotes in the letter, the investigators say they are basing these allegations on, quote, documents in the possession of the select committee. in other words, material they have obtained from other witnesses or other subpoenas. and, who is this mike roman guy, that the january six investigation believes helped direct trump campaign staffers and the fake electors scheme? mike roman may have had the perfect resume for someone running a scheme to overturn an election based on false claims of voter fraud, because he was behind, what you might, call the old g republican stole an election narrative. do you remember this idea? back in 2010, this 80-second video clip of a guy hanging around philadelphia polling place was played, literally, wall-to-wall, nonstop on the fox news channel. it was just two guys outside

officially polling place. but, once fed through the fox news outrage machine, it became evidence of a massive campaign of voter intimidation, by radical black activists, that was being covered up by the obama justice department. elections were being stolen from obama and the democrats, it was shameless voter intimidation tactics. well, that video, the video that launched 1000 fox news careers, that video came from this guy, mike roman. and that kind of achievement will get you far in today's republican party. by the 2020 election, it really came full circle for mike roman. he was on the trump campaign pull watching team, spending election day accusing democrats of stealing the election, using this is evidence photos, and videos of black voters in philadelphia. after that, the january six investigation believes, mike roman went on to help the trump campaign's fake elector scheme.

he is one of several people subpoenaed this week, in connection with that scheme, as the investigation appears to be steadily building or a chart of how this paul was carried out. the investigation appears to be making progress on other fronts, as well. today, president biden rejected donald trump's attempts to block the investigation from getting logs from the trump white house. he directed the national archives to handover those logs within 15 days. and, honestly, trump and his allies are acting a little rattled. as the january six investigation subpoenas more and more people tied to the fake electors plot, a plot that rudy giuliani reportedly ran, and mineral reporting that rudy giuliani may be considering actually talking to investigators. juliana took to the right wing, pro trump news channel, last night, a rant about how the investigation is illegal and can't subpoena anybody. he also spent some time peddling a brand-new conspiracy theory. that hillary clinton spied on

the trump white house. you may have heard something about this, if you ever dip your toe into the right-wing media ecosystem. donald trump himself has put out no fewer than five increasingly irate statements about. did i'm not going to deconstruct this whole strange conspiracy theory right here, though, i do recommend you head over to madel bob for a great explanation from our own steve bannon. i will say, that to spy on the trump white house, hillary clinton would've needed a time machine, because all the supposed evidence being waged around by trump and giuliani and company, a stuff that happened before trump was president. those clintons in those timesheets. but, i digress. no matter how many new shiny objects donald trump and his allies throughout to try and shift the attention to some other imagined scandal, they cannot change the fact that the january six investigation is moving steadily ahead. they can't change the fact of

the january 6th investigation has already amassed so much damning evidence. today, the washington post published a feature on just one strand of evidence. the thousands of text messages that the january 6th has obtained from key players around trump. on january six, and the days leading up to. it quote, thousands of frantic, ephemeral text messages that might have otherwise been lost to history, are now key to piecing together the most vivid and comprehensive picture to date of the events surrounding the chaos of the capital. texts that go all the way back to the day after the election. like this one to trump's chief of staff, from former -- rick perry previewing what would become one of the attempted strategies to overturn the election, quote, here is an aggressive strategy. why can't the states of georgia, north carolina, pennsylvania, and other republican controlled

state houses declare this is bs, and send their own electors to vote, and have a go to the supreme court. okay, now, rick perry. this is one of trump's chief of staff woman unidentified member of the far-right house freedom caucus, just a few days before january 6th. quote, if potus allows this to occur, we're driving a stake in the heart of the federal republic. texts like those are just the beginning. the post reports, quote, the committee, so far, has public revealed only a sliver of the thousands of text messages it has received so far. joining us now, the lead author on that piece, washington post congressional correspondent, jacqueline alam a knee. as of today, she is also now an msnbc contributor. jacqui, thank you for being here. congratulations on coming to the family. let's talk about these text messages. >> so, you know your reporting

to the committee has revealed a sliver of the thousands of text messages. how many of those text messages do you believe were provided by former chief of staff mark meadows? >> yeah, alex, that's a good question. it was provided the majority of the text messages that the committee has received so far. we believe that number is upwards of 7000, but meadows himself provided 4000 personal text messages. those of which were actually -- the former president's legal team since they were retrieved from a personal device. meadows's text messages were actually viewed by the select committee investigating the january 6th insurrection as sort of a connective tissue that is really pulling all of the desperate threats about planning, leading to january 6th altogether. these text messages especially if you are --

we pulled every text that the committee has so far released. it's really helping to paint a picture of what happened, especially since there's been such a chasm between public station bag, lawmakers in fox news, versus the concern in panic and put directly into mark meadows inbox. >> yeah, the releases of -- these it's like a serialized drama. how is the committee deciding which texts are released publicly and when to release them? do we have a sense that they're holding on to texts, that are maybe even more explosive in terms of public reception? >> absolutely, the committee is trying to ensure that they have the most -- public hearings possible and that means pulling back some of these text messages. that being said the trail of bread crumbs they've left so far in releasing some of meadows's text messages with people like jim jordan, sean hannity, and as we reported this morning james o'keefe. have been fairly juicy.

they have needed to release those, in order to make a persuasive argument to hold mark meadows in contempt. a lot of those messages were released in the contempt report that the committee handed out a few months ago. we're still waiting on whether or not the doj is going to ultimately take up that contempt referral. but, there is a fine line that were straddling to apply public pressure, to get people like sean hannity to cooperate, versus holding back some of these messages and holding -- public presentation is possible, to draw the american public. and >> yet, some of the things we have our splash-y and explosive, and drawing the american public and. the text messages sent to mark meadows from rick perry, a day after the election, which is essentially a pit strategy, aggressive strategy, in typical

perry fashion. the strategy lays out, in texas, -- that's basically the plan as it was laid out and executed, right? and yesterday we find out that the committees issued subpoenas to members of the trump campaign who it says had a role in directing that steam. i wonder whether you think the committee is ahead of the public, the public reporting we have, on that aspect of the campaign, do we effectively know what's transpired than we've digested in the press as yet? >> i think they do. i think -- done a good job getting out ahead of these stories. before the committee was previously aware of them. but when it comes to the information that we've gathered so far, the volume of these text messages, documents, and records make it such that there is inevitably gonna be some news and reveals. it's also important to note about these text messages other than the content and some of

these crazier in unexpected reactions to things, these frantic, ephemeral concerns that were raised which of otherize would be lost to history. they were memorializing text message. is the forensic analysis that i believe that the committee investigators could do of a social networking. obviously, these text messages showed the direction between the white house since box news and also shows some of those relationships that are more personal that we've realized. for example, the fact that mark meadows had been texting relationship with james o'keefe. that is also helping piece together a lot of these various schemes that were concurrently going on. yeah, it's the first beginning a flush worked out trump universe in its power grid, if you will. i have to ask about today, the white house is effectively clearing the committee to get access to the trump, -- what could be in those that might not be in the texan other

communications that we have been privy to, thus far? >> yeah, that is a very good question. you know, i'm not all that certain that we're going to get that much from these logs, just yet. as a recording has worn out, in the last few, weeks we know that this is a president that subverted, ignored and failed to follow most procedures. it's unclear if these white house visitor logs were meticulously and accurately kept. or, if the president was sneaking past these processes that were implemented for a reason, to document and keep the most comprehensive picture of history, in order for the american public to look back and be able to, potentially, know who was visiting with the president, at this crucial juncture, in our democracy. but, it's unclear if trump was doing that. on the other side of the point,

any names that are on their of people going in and out the white house, that we don't already know of, will be extremely helpful. we know in those final weeks that the president was trying to overturn the results of the election, there were fringe figures like michael flynn, mike lindell, sydney powell going in and out of the oval, and the white house residence. i think that, at this point, any documents at the committee can get their hands on, is a win. >> yeah i, if the president was flushing record on the white house toilets, goodness knows what happened to those visited. logs we weigh reporting on all of it. i'm sure you're going to be on some important stories in the very near future. jackie allen manny, congressional correspondent, and now an msnbc correspondent, thank you joining us. >> thanks, alex. >> up next we have breaking news from the white house. one official now, says that russia is sending troops to ukraine's border, not withdrawing them. ben rhodes joins us next. rhodes joins us

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the national sports complex in kyiv. as government employees marched 220 yard ukrainian played around the same track. [inaudible] singing the country's national anthem. ukraine's across the country proudly displayed their flake from inside parliament to the streets of odessa, to western ukraine. roughly 70 kilometers from the border of poland, where military cadets raised a large flag, as they too, saying ukraine's national anthem. they did all of this, because president zelensky designated, today, ukrainian unity day. he chose this day, february 16th, because it was, allegedly, the day that russia had planned on invading ukraine. well, it is already the early morning hours of february 17th and ukraine, and so far, fingers crossed, no invasion. it appears, for many, the feeling on the ground in ukraine's, let's just just say,

not necessarily one of panic. the washington post spoke to 1:24-year-old ukrainian, who told the paper, quote, everyone is talking about war and what will happen and blah, blah, blah, before people working, it's all the same. just an ordinary day. a retail manager told the post, quote, i have to go to work, that is all. meanwhile, thousands of miles above the streets of kyiv, ukrainian airspace remains open, nonetheless, no international carriers are trying to fly over the country, right now. as it has been four days, the situation in ukraine remains murky. very murky. late this evening, we got yet another reminder of that. even though many of the citizens of ukraine are still just going about their business, the international community continues to sound the alarm. both secretary of state, and then he blinken, and nato said, despite putin's assurances, there are no signs of russian troop withdrawal. biden said, on the contrary,

russia continues to amass troops at the border. tonight, we have more detail on that point from a senior biden administration official. that official notes that russia has at it as many as 7000 troops to the ukrainian border, with some arriving as recently as today. that official, tonight, rejecting russia's assistance, that there has been a reduction of forces. they've received a lot of attention for that claim, both here in around the world. but, we now know was false. that official also noted a market increase in false claims by the kremlin, including fake reports of unmarked graves in eastern ukraine with citizens, allegedly, killed by a ukrainian forces. it's thought that russia might use false claims, like these, as a pretext for invasion. we should note that the official spokes reporters on -- did not provide any underlying evidence for the alleged troop buildup, but it is yet another data point in what is an

incredibly complicated situation, that we're all desperate to make sense of. joining us now on this quest to make sense of what is happening is ben rhodes, former deputy national -- to president obama. he was in that post when ukraine invaded russia in 2014. ben, it's always good to see you. especially, and k e audit times like this, my friend. >> thanks, alex. >> first, let's talk about this latest assertion from the white house, that contrary to the russians are saying, we're seeing a buildup of troops on the border. i tend to believe the u.s. government more than the russian government, but what do you think is happening? is this just international gaslighting? >> here's what i think is happening, alex. russia tries to do what they have -- military aggression, is create a pretext that they're acting in defense. in 2014, when they annexed crimea, they claim that ukrainian nazis were threatening russian ones there. one russian separatists shot down an airliner in 2014, they

claim that the ukrainian had to shut down the plane. right now, as you said in your report, they are suggesting that, potentially, genocide is happening against the ethnic russian population in eastern ukraine. i think the scenario that the biden team is worried about is that by saying that they are open to diplomacy, but they are de-escalating, the saying they're pulling back troops, they are trying to create an international impression, that they're not there to threaten ukraine, that they're pulling back. and then, they will cite some pretext for an invasion. just as the biden administration is tried to deny president putin that capacity to do that, by publicizing all of these moves for the last several weeks and months, i think, right now, in this very tense moment, they're pointing out the russians are saying something we can't believe. we're looking at the hard evidence, we're looking at the troops on the ground, and we're not seeing any signs of a pullback. instead, what we're seeing is a

continued effort by vladimir putin to set up his forces for an invasion. that would be an offensive operation by russia, not a defensive. one >> yeah, the biden white house is aggressively countering this russian strategy, right? i guess, i wonder, is it to another audience, to an international audience? does it become a game of he said he said? is anybody actively believing the russians, at this point? the u.s. has been countering, every day, with information, and it's being radically transparent about it. does russia -- is their game working? do you think it's possible that they're able to convince anybody that they're operating from a defensive position, rather than offensive one? >> here's the thing i say, alex. i once sat in the white house, and was responsible for this battle over international pinion. the russians probably assume that most americans trust the u.s. government over the russian government. their audiences in europe. their audience is around the

world. united states, if russia invades, is going to have to convince as many countries as possible to go along with the u.s.-led sanctions. to go along with the u.s.-led pressures of russian response. would russia needs to do, from an information standpoint, is not necessarily convinced everybody, that they're correct, but so one of doubt, that it is a he said he said kind of thing. that it is a situation where, russia claims that their forces were being attacked, and people were being massacred and used. ukraine but the u.s. says that this was a preplanned you invasion all along. who knows what the actual answer, is and to sow chaos and doubt about this, enough that they can create divisions in the coalition that would have to respond to russian aggression, with support for ukraine, with sanctions on russia. that's all they need to do. in some ways, alex, -- from where donald trump needs to do here. he doesn't need to convince people that everything he says is true, he just has to sow enough doubt, right? enough doubt in people's minds that it's all partisan, all he

said she said. so, you can't really trust anybody. therefore, it's not worth your effort. that's essentially the russian information game. they don't have to convince people that they're right, they just need to sow doubt about what the united states is saying. >> i'm struck by the confidence with which they are lying. if you listen to with the russians are saying, in response to questions about western warnings of an invasion -- i think, today, russians ambassador to the eu is asked by a german reporter, whether russia was going to attack on february 16th, today, on wednesday. he responds, wars in europe really start on the wednesday. i mean, that's just the best international gaslighting of ever heard. it's also indicative of a country that -- they sound remarkably confident in their position. it makes me wonder, it feels like putin is a little bit of a chess master. he sounds like he is ready to play a long game. one gets the sense, to some

degree, he enjoys the fact that russia is in the limelight. the fact that we're talking about nato in a way that we wouldn't have even considered a few weeks ago. i guess i wonder, whose game are we playing, right now? >> we are all responding to vladimir putin. i'm sure he likes nothing more than the fact that the rest of the world is wondering what's putin's thinking. look, i sat in the room with putin, and lavrov, the prime minister, these are people that can live very easily with a smile on their face. it is not something that is discomforting to them, to tell a lie after lie after lie. frankly, what we've seen is, since putin is taking a much more aggressive stance, the lives of come more fast and furious. once you decide that you don't have to abide by any rules, whether those rules apply to telling the truth about matters of war and peace, or whether those matters apply to things of annexing things of a -- once you decide that you don't

care about the rules, in some ways that gives you an advantage. i think, one thing we have to recognize, putin has been building this up for a long. time these troop deployments clearly took a long time to plan. you don't move 150,000 troops from across the vast country, like russia, to surround ukraine, without planning for that for at least a year. we've seen russian stash away reserves, cash reserves of over 600 billion dollars, precisely because they probably anticipated the kind of devastating sanctions -- it's quite likely that putin's been on a ramp up for this moment for a long time. the question is whether he wants to use that ramp up to, as you said, put a spotlight on the notion that he will not accept further nato involvement. ukraine will never be nato, people are going to have to respond to that, diplomatically, or, whether this is been a buildup to an inevitable invasion of ukraine, which you want to topple the ukrainian

government, and essentially govern the affairs of a neighbor that he sees as a buffer state, between rough shy and nato. that's where we have to wait and find out. that action on the ground, unfortunately, continues to suggest is the latter scenario. >> magic eight ball is highly unclear on this. ben rhodes, i'm glad you have with us. former deputy national adviser tomorrow. always >> thanks, alex. good to see you, thanks >> still to come, it is no ben. secret that air travel has gotten, shall we say, messi. during the pandemic. now, several republican senators want to stop the government from doing anything about all that mess. that is next. we're carefully designing our bottles to be 100% recyclable, including the caps. they're collected and separated from other plastics, so they can be turned back into material that we use to make new bottles. that completes the circle and reduces plastic waste.

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>> this morning another disturbing video showing another scare in the air. passengers on board a delta flight from la to atlanta pinning a man down. after the airline says an off-duty delta flight attendant tried to take control of the

plains pa system. the captain took to the intercom asking passengers to help. >> strong males to the front [inaudible] passenger. >> air traffic control diverted the flight to oklahoma city friday night wore police took a passenger into custody. it's just the latest incident involving with the faa says is a surgeon bad behavior in the skies. earlier this month, another delta passenger was arrested after reportedly attempting to breach the cockpit and on this southwest flight from sacramento to san diego in late may. a passenger punched a flight attendant causing her to lose two teeth. >> since the start of the pandemic it's been, incidents involving dangerous passengers on planes have absolutely skyrocketed. this past sunday to separate american airlines flights were forced to divert their flight from their flight path because passengers were causing a disturbance. on one of those planes passenger tried to open the

plane door into flight. this uptick of in-flight disturbances has put flight attendants in a terrible spot. essentially turning them into club bouncers. who have to mitigate dangerous oftentimes violent and drunken situations at 30,000 feet. airline often keeps list of these unruly passengers and banned them from flying with the for the airline again. but nothing stopping them from hopping on a flight with a different airline and doing all that nonsense all over again. earlier this month, the ceo of delta airlines wrote to the u.s. attorney general posing a more permanent solution. one that would prevent unruly passengers from flying airline tickets. he prevent the asked for the justice of degree and national no fly list. a list that would be shared among all the airlines and would ban people convicted of dangerous, violent behavior from all flights. it would work the same way as the no fly list for terrorists. who have found to be unruly or violent on an airline you'll be

banned from flying again. not just from that one specific airline but the full stop. it seem like kind of a nonpartisan, no-brainer, totally reasonable solution for this problem. until a group of republican senators came out against the plan this week. the fact that this spike in airline services coincides with the pandemic is of course not coincidental. close to 6000 unruly passenger reports investigated by the faa last year 72% of them or because of passengers who refused to wear masks. and that's why these eight republican summit on against the no fly list. they're worried that creating such a list might unfairly like in an anti mask or many of them republicans to a terrorist. the senators ranked this to the attorney general creating a federal no fly list for unruly passengers who are skeptical of this mandate would seemingly -- actually take the lives of

americans and perpetrate attacks on the homeland. joining us now is sara nelson president of the flight attendants, miss nelson thank you for being here. >> thank you, alex. >> let's start with the suggestion of a of an actual no fly list. for what i would call dangerous passengers. does the union support the list, and were you at all involved in the i-ten ration? >> i actually testified three times in the -- on this very assertion courage in doj, faa to work together put this list together so that the government can actually control that, communicate that in realtime. we can have a transparent process with due process, because a lot of people are concerned about that due process with good reason. but, we need to use this as a consequence for people who are acting out on planes. we already have fines, you've heard about the high fines from the faa, you've heard that the

doj started prosecuting, although we have made all the way through those prosecutions with a conviction, and people landing in jail. but we have this other option -- along with all of us and other airlines are supportive of this. too we need to work together to resolve these issues to use the threat of losing your ability to fly if you are causing this much problems on a plane. because you are putting everyone at risk when you're doing that. and it's very much like the other no fly list that we have for -- >> yeah, i mean when we call them unruly passengers. these aren't people mad that there is no cranberry juice cocktail, these are people trying to open flight doors in the middle of a flight. which is a hazard, a life-threatening hazard. >> yes, and access the flight deck. we had that just this last week. we had a flight attendant who used a coffee pot, the crew remember self-defense training

that we worked so hard to get into place, that pfa manages. and made it available to flight attendants because of these issues. the spike in these. issues every single day, when flight attendants go to put on their uniform they think, is this gonna be a sign of authority and leadership in the cabin or is this gonna be a sign for someone to launch a vicious attack, a violent attack against us. that's very. different i'm a 25 year flight attendant, this used to be a concurrence that would happen on a bad day. one, two, maybe three times in a career. and every single day flight attendants are facing this. and what's causing is people don't want to pick up as much time, they're having a difficult time staffing those flights because of that. there is a consequence all the way around. -- is that 61% of these and up are also followed by racial, gender, or homophobic slurs. people are taking the brunt of this.

we've got a stop it, this we can expect this to be the new. norm >> when you lay all of it out the new brainer, something needs to be done. but obviously we're running into resistance here. specifically partisan resistance. why in your mind are republican senators coming out against a nationalist? >> well, if they're making it all about masks but i want to be really clear that while a good number of the reports for the past year have been, have including mask issues, the vast majority of the violent events have happened had anything to do with masks. so, they want to set a certain narrative here. that are conflicts on planes in the first place people are at a stress level ten all over this country because they have had -- not knowing what to believe. they've been told to different things throughout this pandemic. to totally opposite things. and now, they've been told that they're at odds with each other. and what we find when we get up in the air is that americans actually creep solidarity.

they actually want to come together, and that's what we do is flight attendants. we bring people together. we're not there to tear them. apart but people are coming to the door of our aircraft, having told them to different things and those eight senators are directly responsible for that confusion, that anxiety, and the stress levels of everyone around this country because there have been two sets of information here that have been given to people. and people don't know what to believe. and specifically about masks. they have made a political issue, this public health device, that can keep all of us safe. they've made a political issue. and they have put people in harm's way. more people have died, and the work space that i work in has become combative and has become a very difficult place to be. and as long as they continue to do that and make this the new norm, they're also putting our neck anomalous acuity at risk as well. because people at a certain

point are not -- if this is gonna think they're signing up with. >> as someone who flies very often in my heart goes out to you and all the attendants that had to face these dangers network. let us hope that these eight republican senators -- where the rest of our party's gonna be on this very sensible seeming national no fly list. sarah nelson, president -- thank you so much for being here and up there. >> thank you. >> we know republicans spend every waking moment from now until november's midterm hammering democrats on their preferred topics like critical race theory, and open borders. but how much energy should be democrats extend fighting back. and what issues should democrats be getting republicans on. simone sanders joins us live. coming up next. coming up next. coming up next the full benefits of turmeric.

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(music) ♪ so i think to myself ♪ ♪ oh what a wonderful world ♪ ready or not, the midterm elections are officially here. both major parties have started

laying out their plans for how to approach the november showdown. it's true. over the weekend, the new york times reported that senator mitch mcconnell cool is quietly work my the scenes, to try and limit trump's influence on the upcoming election. the times reports that mcconnell has privately declared to other republicans that he, quote, won't let unelectable goof balls win republican primaries. mcconnell's house counterpart, kevin mccarthy, has some similar plans. the whole newspaper reports, mccarthy has a new strategy to try and emphasizes parties policy ambitions. we'll believe that when we see it. shifting the debate away from the former president, and the spreading of the big lie, and the january 6th attack on the capitol. that may sound like an effective plan for republican politicians heading into the cycle of history suggest that they'll do well, but the former president and his allies have other plans. for the past few months, trump has been throwing his weight around in republican primaries

-- some might even call them goofball candidates. so majority of whom have openly question the results of the 2020 election. so, we've seen republican politicians, cross the country, touting their anti-democracy bona fide days on the campaign trail, in interviews, and even in political ads. >> i was one of the first to support on trump's president. he made america great. the democrats rig the election. stop the democrats from stealing another election. >> lie, waste your money, regulations. i'm [inaudible] president trump says the election was stolen. he is right. >> as republicans argue amongst insults over the last election, democrats are gearing up for a fight this november. nbc news reports, today, that white house chief of staff, ron, plane is headed to capitol hill tomorrow, to talk strategy with senate democrats. meanwhile, political reports

that the democratic parties -- is developing a new strategy to push back against a host of culture war criticisms being pushed by republicans. the plan is to offer a strong rebuttal to political hits on the political hot button issues, like immigration and critical race theory. can democrats keep the majority while playing defense? should democrats focus their own political messaging on kitchen table issues, or should they trained their fire on trump, and the threat to democracy, posed by the former president and his allies? can democrats do both of those things, or do they have to choose? joining us now, simone, sandra's former chief spokesperson for vice president harris, and former senior adviser on president biden's presidential. campaign it's good to see you, thanks are joining. me >> it's great to see you. >> simone, let's start with the democrats. on one hand, there is this push to engage with republicans in

that cultural war swamp, around critical race theory, and defunding the police. up until now, the party has largely those those attacks. is it a good idea to engage -- or increase the amount of airtime that there are human actually gets? making it a bigger argument than it should be? >> it's a good question, alex. it's not a one size fits all answer. the answer is, it is a good idea to engage, but then, it's not a good idea to. engage, basically you have to pick your battles. democrats who are running in midterm elections, whether we're talking about house elections, senate elections, or many of these government races, governors who up for reelection, running to capture new governor seats, like stacey abrams in georgia. they have to engage on their own territory. understanding the issues in their districts, and in their state. president biden, for example, in his race for president, he largely shrugged off the defund the police narrative, because anybody that knows joe biden,

knows that that is not something that he, himself, believes in. frankly, it was a narrative that was taking hold in some places, until the campaign had a counter ad that said, this is where joe biden is. for it matters where you are talking about engaging. >> i guess i just wonder, i was in georgia a lot, before the runoff in january. i was with, now senators warnock, and the discipline those campaigns have. they refused to engage in trump and all the election fraud, even the day that the phone call came out between president trump and brad raffensperger, the secretary of state, overseeing the elections. that discipline paid off. they only wanted to talk about the, so-called, kitchen table issues. i wonder, don't you kind of have to choose, at some point? because, if voters really want to hear about issues that

matter to them, right, not the democracy should it matter to them, but if they want to hear about health care, they want to hear about the economy, they want to hear about jobs, they want to hear about student debt. it takes up a lot air time, in which you can't really talk about the january 6th election stealing in the big lie. >> yes, it does. look, democrats have to run their races for their districts. point blank, period. i know that we on the national level like to talk about, i think it's very important, talking about january 6th, reminding people what happened that day, and that the people on the capitol that day, those insurrectionists, they went home, okay? we can't let that slide. i think the committees doing an amazing job continuing to dig down on the core of what happened, on peoples layers back. but, if you're trying to win a midterm election in georgia, if you're trying to win reelection in michigan, and the governor's mansion, you have to talk to your voters. you have to be responsive, and

engaging with folks where they are. democrats don't need to preach to folks they -- just need to go on there and talk about the amazing things that they have done, and why they should be reelected to continue to do them. and they need to talk about understanding what they haven't been able to get done, and their plan to address those issues. they should not take the bait. the last maternal oh action, another correctional committee had a lot to say about the last midterm election, where democrats did win a lot of seats, but it was still extremely close. well, in that midterm election, democrats ran to their districts. you are traveling around the country, alex, you know. when you don't get distracted, when you say focused on the issues at the voters care, about that is how you do well. that's how democrats are going to hold on this midterm election. for those people that you get distracted, for those folks that do think donald trump is some kind of magic wand, news flash, there are no such things magic wands. the voters in districts don't want to hear about donald trump. he is not the president. he is not on the ballot.

they want to hear about the democrats are, foreign weather going to do to make their lives better. >> in the meantime, mitch mcconnell is going to focus on not electing goof balls. we'll see how that experiment pans out. simone sanders, -- and former senior adviser on president biden's presidential campaign. thank you for your time. but to see. >> thank you. >> we have one more story to get to tonight, don't go anywhere! t to tonight, don't go t to tonight, don't go anywhere psoriasis really messes with you. try. hope. fail. no one should suffer like that. five years clear. real people with psoriasis look and feel better with cosentyx. don't use if you're allergic to cosentyx. before starting get checked for tuberculosis. an increased risk of infection, some serious and a lowered ability to fight them may occur. tell your doctor about an infection or symptoms or if you had a vaccine or plan to. tell your doctor if your crohn's disease

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progress and the tools that we now have, we are moving towards a time when covid is not a crisis. but, is something that we can protect against and treat. >> a positive message, out of the white house, as covid continues this dramatic down tick across most of the country. also today, the white house made two key hires to its team of top scientist advisers. last, week the highest rank science official in the biden ministration, eric lander, resigned, after accusations that he had demeaned in disrespected his colleagues. he held tools, as the presidents top science advisor, and the head of the office of science and technology policy. tonight, president biden chose a laundry nelsons, who eric nelson's deputy, to lead the police -- in his place. and to fill the role of top science adviser to president, biden has tapped francis collins, who until late last year, led the national institutes of health. the white house says that nelson and collins will perform these new rules on a temporary basis until permanent candidates can be nominated and confirmed.

that doesn't press tonight. we will see you again tomorrow. now, it is time for the last word with lawrence o'donnell. word with lawrence o'donnell there are no goofball candidates who get elected as republicans to the senate. but, does he have a plan for getting rid of the good balls but, does who are already in the senate he have a plan but have, you know, six year for getting rid of the golf balls -- terms? >> it is an ironic proposition, right? someone should flag it for mcconnell. just in case he doesn't know. there are goof bulls already in. >> they are in the building. already. thank you, alex. >> thank you, lawrence. >> thank you. well, if you think that donald trump is stupid and you have a right, to a magic and. imagine what his lawyers think of him. new york's attorney general releases a letter that shows that mazars, the accounting firm, has dropped donald trump. donald trump's insane ego