♪♪ a very good day to all of you from msnbc world headquarters in new york. welcome, everybody, to alex witt reports. we begin this hour with breaking news. military officials in ukraine are reporting more shelling near pro-russian controlled sections of the country. this as pro-russian rebels begin evacuating women, children, and the elderly while urging able-bodied men to sign up to

fight. u.s. and nato leaders are keeping a close eye on developments as they immediate in munich to present a united front against russian with the vladimir putin. vice president kamala harris delivering a stern message. >> and we will not stop with economic measures. we will further reinforce our nato allies on the eastern flank. in fact, together, we have already taken steps to strengthen our deterrence and collective defense. we have deployed an additional 6,000 american service members to romania, poland, and germany. we have put another 8,500 service members in the united states on a heightened sense of readiness. >> and growing concern as some new satellite images show russian ground attack aircraft, helicopters and air defense units at airfields right near

ukraine's border. the latest u.s. intelligence suggesting the russian military is moving ahead with plans for an incursion. and while russian president vladimir putin skipped the munich security conference, choosing instead to oversee drills involving russian nuclear capable weapons, british prime minister boris johnson called on his fellow european leaders to shore up their energy supply policies. >> whatever happens in the next few days and weeks, we cannot allow european countries to be blackmailed by russia. we cannot allow the threat of russian aggression to change the security architecture of europe. and we must now wean ourselves off dependence on putin's oil and gas. >> well, joining me now, nbc's chief foreign affairs correspondent andrea mitchell at the munich security conference, nbc's matt bradley is on the ground in ukraine, josh lederman at the white house and i'll speak with nbc's chief international security contributor retired admiral

james stavritis. how is the white house reacting to a possible invasion in the coming days? >> reporter: alex, at this point, the u.s. has been at this literally for weeks and officials here feel fairly confident that they have laid it out all on the table and taken the steps that they can, both in disclosing fairly shocking amounts of intelligence in realtime about what they're seeing on the ground from the russians as they try to undermine russian attempts to muddy the waters about what's actually happening there. they feel like they've also been fairly forthcoming in giving a good amount of detail in what the u.s. response, along with its nato allies, will be, the kinds of economic sanctions that are on the table if putin invades, and they also feel like they've been specific in terms of what the u.s. could talk with russia about if it were open to serious diplomacy, which was the phrase that kamala harris used when she spoke to the conference today. vice president harris making it clear that the u.s. is going to

continue trying to work in realtime to point out disinformation, wrong information from russia to make it impossible for the russians to try to distract from what's actually happening. listen to what she had to say at the conference. >> russia continues to claim it is ready for talks. while at the same time it narrows the avenues for diplomacy. their actions simply do not match their words. if russia further invades ukraine, the united states, together with our allies and partners, will impose significant and unprecedented economic costs. >> reporter: harris's speech at that conference, a major moment in the foreign policy spotlight for the vice president as top biden administration officials

have really been fanning out across the globe in the last few days to try to project a unified front along with nato members against russia, including the secretary of defense, who said he concurred with president biden's assessment that putin has made a decision. the secretary of state also heading back from that security conference where u.s. officials made it clear that the costs for russia will be, as kamala harris put it, unprecedented if putin goes ahead with this invasion that at this point biden says he believes putin is prepared to launch. alex? >> okay, josh lederman, thank you for keeping abreast of things at the white house. we appreciate that. let's go to matt bradley, who's in kharkiv, ukraine. the question first of all, is president zelensky back home from munich yet and i'm curious how the ukrainens are reacting to all these developments.

earlier you said it's like business as usual. >> reporter: yeah, well, we don't know if president zelensky is back home. his official instagram account showed a picture of his plane preparing for takeoff in munich and said that he was on his way back. that was only just recently. i imagine, alex, that he's probably going to make the return trip back home and unless russia does something crazy within the next hour or two, i think he's probably going to be making it back to kyiv and will return to doing the business of state. that might not be the main concern here. the real issue, as you mentioned, is the uptick in violence that's going on in the eastern part of the country, not far from where i am standing right now. that is very concerning. we started to see more and more incidents every single day, but you know, to your question, alex, you asked, how ordinary ukrainians are reacting. here's the thing. they don't see this as something that represents an entirely new issue because remember, they see

themselves as having been at war with russia for the past eight years because of that fighting in eastern ukraine against russian-backed separatists in which 14,000 ukrainians have died over the past 8 years so for them, the threat has always been ever present, and this, while it does mark a major uptick in the potential for violence and they certainly are seeing it on their news shows, that there's going to be a lot of fighting in the eastern part of the country, you're not seeing a hair on fire kind of response here because this still, to most ukrainians, is just business as usual. alex? >> it is extraordinary. okay, thank you for keeping close watch on things there in kharkiv, matt. let's turn to nbc's andrea mitchell who's at the munich security council. strong statements from kamala harris and president zelensky today. what message did they bring? >> reporter: ukraine's president zelensky gave a fiery speech to the world leaders gathered here at the munich security conference, telling them that ukraine will defend itself but where have they been? where has europe been for the last few years as russia has

advanced on ukraine? you know, as russia took crimea in 2014? and saying that the u.s. and the other allies should put sanctions on the table, not impose the sanctions necessarily, but list the sanctions so that putin will know exactly what he is facing. the u.s. position was outlined by vice president kamala harris, her first major speech in a form of this importance at such a critical juncture in history, and she laid out the position that president biden has been making, that secretary blinken made here yesterday, very strong speech from kamala harris that the u.s. will defend ukraine, that ukraine's sovereignty is not negotiable, and that vladimir putin has to step back or the u.s. is prepared to punish him with strong and severe sanctions. that will obviously mean some pain for americans back at home. there are a lot of ways that they can punish vladimir putin. one is with energy sanctions, which he will retaliate against.

another, of course, is that he could retaliate with cyberattacks against ukraine, as he has already, and also against the united states, and u.s. infrastructure, u.s. corporations, so there's been a lot of warning coming from the white house in recent days that america has to look to its own defenses against cyber, that the private sector has to, because we don't know what vladimir putin will do, and of course, we heard that very strong warning from the president himself just last night, saying that the u.s. intelligence, the latest intelligence is that putin has decided that is very clear to u.s. intelligence, that he has decided to invade. it's only a matter of time. u.s. officials are telling us here in munich, though, that there is a possibility that he will still decide on diplomacy, and as long as that possibility still lives, the u.s. is pushing and pushing really hard for diplomatic solutions. andrea mitchell, nbc news,

munich. >> thank you so much for that. well, joining me now, retired u.s. navy admiral, james, former supreme allied commander of nato and also our contributor. admiral, always a pleasure, sir. so, you just heard andrea's report. i'm curious your read on how the talks went at nato today and at this munich security conference. >> i think the talks at nato went perfectly in the sense that we see continued alignment between the united states and our partners across the atlantic within the alliance. i think secretary of defense lloyd austin laid out the dangers here in a pretty vivid image, saying that now the russian snake, if you will, has uncoiled, and it is ready to strike. pretty vivid imagery there. and i think the vice president's speech, when you marry it up with the president's comment yesterday, that putin has decided to invade, puts the

starkest possible warning on the entire system, and frankly, alex, as you know, it's like a burglar approaching your house. the idea here is get the lights on inside so everybody on your side can have full visibility and on the other side, turn on the lights, shine them out there, it encourages your team and discourages the burglar. let's hope that putin gets that message over the next few days. >> you know, something that the defense secretary said he recollected a 1994 operation when he was then a lieutenant colonel. he had a parachute on his back, he was ready to go, i mean, this was minutes away from being launched into actual action, right, the operation that he was involved in. could something like that happen still? i mean, it could get right up there to the brink. i mean, are you confident that

there wouldn't be any sort of a misstep that despite calculations to pull back on either side, it would happen? >> well, this is the grave danger, alex, and you know, we got to remember something. in your example, lloyd austin was probably 25 years old, and the young men and women who are out there flying those jets, driving those destroyers, operating these radar systems, they're in their 20s, maybe their 30s. when i commanded a destroyer for the first time, i was 37 years old. in that sense, these are young, inexperienced people. these are not our statesmen, diplomats on the front lines. these are warriors who are trained to fight. so that concern you commented on is perhaps the greatest worry at this point as you see these two massive armed forces, they're now 200,000 russians, 250,000

ukrainians, they're all within a few hundred kilometers of each other as you can see on the map in front of you. and at any given point, there could be a miscalculation which could lead to a greater conflagration. it's a very dangerous moment. >> today, president zelensky reminded the conference today that ukraine gave up all of its nuclear weapons. that happened in exchange for security guarantees. what, sir, were those guarantees, and can they really be fulfilled if russia attacks? >> well, we got to remember they've already been completely shredded by the 2014 invasion and the annexation of crimea. at the heart of the guarantees were the sovereign territorial rights of ukraine as a state, essentially its independence. we've already seen vladimir putin and russia invade in 2014 and bite a chunk out of it, crimea, which gives them real

control, them, the russians, around the northern part of the black sea. so, unfortunately, it's already been violated, and what we're talking about now is a second violation, and frankly, as the international community looks at the entire situation here, we got to recognize 2008, this playbook was used on georgia, a small democratic country in the caucuses, a neighbor of russia, invasion, annexation. then again in 2014, and clearly that same playbook was dusted off and is in use right now. bottom line, alex, these current situations in the southeast where these rebels are pulling women and children out, it's all part of a pretext that putin will use to say, i'm only doing this because i have to, to protect these russian speakers, these russian ethnics. by the way, putin has handed out

hundreds of thousands of russian passports to ukrainians who live in the southeast. it's all an elaborate scheme to give him justification as he sees it. all the more reason the administration is doing the right thing, shoring up the nato alliance, moving troops to do that physically as well as, above all, show putin the sanctions. >> yeah, admiral, we've been looking at the new satellite images that show russian air units deployed right near ukraine's borders and then last week, you know, there was reports of u.s. and russian aircraft flying dangerously close to one another. when you look at all these images and know those reports, what comes to mind for you? how concerned are you about this? what kind of reaction needs to take place to dial this back? >> well, i'd start by putting myself in the shoes of my previous job as supreme allied commander of nato. as i look at it, i'm thinking, as a military commander, what is here in front of me? and it is an absolute war

college level blueprint of how you would stage forces to conduct a multi-axis envelopment into a foreign territory that you're invading. number two, alex, i'm thinking about cyber. you mentioned the possibility of cyberattacks, as did andrea mitchell. i think that's going to be the first thing that moves across this border, even before those attack helicopters and missiles, which will surely follow. and third and finally, to your question, how do you defuse this? the only path at this point is through the mind of vladimir putin. we have to convince him that this is a misstep, a significant strategic misstep for him, and i'll close, i don't think putin has a lot in common with an american president from 100 years ago, teddy roosevelt, but it used to be said about teddy roosevelt that he had to be the bride at every wedding and the corpse at every funeral,

meaning, he had to be the center of attention. we've got to convince putin that being the center of attention here is going to be too expensive for his ego and for his nation ultimately. >> everything well said, admiral james stavridis. appreciate you. we have breaking news from ottawa, canada, where police are making more arrests at that ongoing freedom convoy protest of truckers but today marks a significant turning point in the ongoing standoff. cbc reporter katherine tunny is yoink us now. welcome to you. what can you tell us? >> reporter: i would say today has been characterized by two main things. one of them is ground control and the other is an increase in police tactics and police use of force. so, around 9:00 a.m. this morning, we kind of saw the resumption of a tactic that started yesterday, and you can kind of see it on your screen right now, a wall of police officers, a few officers deep, moving through the crowd, warning them that they cannot be

there and they will face arrest if they stay and pushing against the crowd to regain territory, to regain the street from these people who have been camped out in front of the parliament buildings for almost -- over three weeks now as part of this protest against various covid-19 pandemic measures. so, we're seeing that line being pushed down. they're now moving them away from parliament and further south through the city. and we've also seen an increase in police force as well. so, police have said that they're facing assault, that the crowd is pushing back and that they're responding to that. with batons. and we also saw, and the police have said they've used a chemical irritant as well, so looking for a little bit more information about what that is. police are giving an update at 3:30 but we did see something being sprayed into the crowd and police said that it was a chemical irritant and they're doing that as the crowd becomes

more aggressive. >> so, cat, when you talk about those protesters being parked in front of the parliament there, of canada, for three weeks and some, that certainly speaks to their resolve, but what about the mood of the people of ottawa? are they ready to see this all end? or do you get a sense they're out there supporting the protesters? >> well, as someone who lives downtown as well, i would say, talking to my neighbors and talking to people as a journalist, most of the residents want these people gone. we're the capital city. i think most people understand freedom of protest and the right to protest the government and get your voice heard. ottawa has been home to many large protests. this is a bit different. this is, you know, some people have used the word occupation. you can't drive down certain streets in ottawa because cars have been parked there. businesses have been closed just as they were allowed to open, just as ontario lifted some of its pandemic measures. and there have been reports of

violence, people being yelled at for wearing masks, confrontations between the protesters and the city of ottawa or the residents here. can't speak for everyone but that is the overarching vibe in the city. that being said, the protesters here have a lot of resolve. their livelihoods are on the table. this started as a protest against the federal mandates requiring truck drivers to be vaccinated. until recently they had been exempt from that. so, it started as that, but it's really grown into a protest against anyone who is upset about either vaccine mandates or mask mandates, various public health measures being used, so they believe strongly that they shouldn't have to get vaccinated or follow these rules, and they're standing in the streets, even though they have been told many times that you face arrest and on top of it, there have been reports of some families down there as well, and the government made it illegal to bring children, anyone under 18,

to this area, so i think that also speaks to the fact that they believe so strongly in this that they're even bringing their children down. >> okay, cbc reporter cat tunney, thank you for bringing us the latest. coming up next, we're talking about george conway's new op-ed in the "washington post." why he thinks you know who's luck may be running out. st." why he thinks you know who's luck may be running out. that help rebuild your skin. dove men+care. smoother, healthier skin with every shower. okay everyone, our mission is to provide complete balanced nutrition for strength and energy. woo hoo! ensure, complete balanced nutrition with 27 vitamins and minerals. and ensure complete with 30 grams of protein. ♪ ♪

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donald trump is facing new scrutiny over his handling of white house records. the national archives has confirmed some of those documents trump took when he left office were considered classified. nbc's ali raffa is joining us from capitol hill. what could the doj do with this new information? >> reporter: well, alex, there's a lot of developments here, so last weekend, we spoke about the house oversight committee launching a probe into these 15 boxes recovered from former president trump's mar-a-lago home. the committee submitting a list of questions to the national

archives. well, yesterday, the national archives got back to the committee in this letter and basically their answers are raising even more questions and concerns, even bringing in the attention of the justice department. the archives is saying that they know of several missing records, gaps in these records. also, they found torn-up documents, classified records, and now they're asking the justice department to come in and investigate whether there was any wrongdoing, federal wrongdoing by former president trump. the archives specifically mention social media records that are missing, like some deleted tweets from the former president's personal twitter account. now, some democrats here on capitol hill are saying that it looks like the trump white house may have intentionally kept some of these records. listen here. >> it's another example of trump just thumbing his nose not only at norms but at laws, and i believe he's put himself in some real legal jeopardy, both in

terms of the classified material and the broader issue of nod protecting the material required to be protected and transferred to the archives by law. >> now, the former president is denying any wrongdoing. he actually issued a statement late last night saying, quote, the national archives did not find anything. they were given, upon request, presidential records and an ordinary and routine process to ensure the preservation of my legacy and in accordance with the presidential records act. now, alex, a key question that the justice department has to now look into is whether the former president knew these records were classified, whether they were clearly labeled as such. there have been reports that they have been labeled as such, but this is definitely a key question the justice department has to look into because remember, there's a big difference between launching an investigation or charging a former president with federal crimes, alex. >> yep. there is a huge difference. you're right, allie raffa, thank you for that. another legal blow for

donald trump this week. a new york judge ordered the former president and his two children, don junior and ivanka, to testify under oath in the civil fraud investigation of the trump organization's business practices. lawyers for the trumps are fighting subpoenas from new york attorney general letitia james, who's been conducting a years-long investigation into allegations the trump organization improperly inflated its financial statements in exchange for favorable loans or a reduction in the taxes it pays. but this week, the manhattan supreme court denied the trumps' claim the investigation was politically motivated and ordered them to comply with james's demands for documents and testimony. some are wondering if this is the moment trump's run out of luck. joining me now, david k. johnston, author of "the big cheat." welcome back to the broadcast, david. let's get into this, because the judge said the former president and his two kids could be deposed in the next three weeks or so.

what will the new york attorney general's office be looking for if they do get a chance to question the jumps? trumps? >> well, the judge, who reviewed all the evidence in this case before issuing his ruling, said that there is abundant evidence, copious evidence of financial fraud, and that the attorney general has the clear right to question donald trump, don junior, and ivanka about their role in these matters, and the attorney general is widening her investigation into additional areas, and that's just one of a number of law enforcement proceedings that are closing in on donald. >> okay. as for trump's attorneys, i mean, you won't be surprised that they argue that tish james wants to improperly question trump and his children in the civil trial, but this to help a separate criminal investigation that's being run by the manhattan d.a. so, explain that connection, david, and if the argument has

any merit. >> months ago, i predicted they would do this. they would argue that there's a bootstrap relationship between the civil investigation by attorney general letitia james and the criminal investigation by the grand jury in manhattan. it's a nonsense argument, but i predicted they would raise it, and indeed, that's exactly what they did and the judge dismissed it as ridiculous. trump's claim is invalid for a simple reason. he and his two older children can simply take the fifth amendment if they think any answer they would give in the civil proceeding would incriminate them. in fact, that's what eric did two years ago. eric trump took the fifth amendment more than 500 times, and let's not forget that donald has said on many occasions, people who take the fifth amendment, the only reason they do it is they're guilty. that's not the law, but that's what donald trump says. >> right. which then you turn it around like, so, why would you? anyway, having said that, tish

james has compiled a significant amount of evidence in the process but she says she needs to question the former president and his children and then determine the next move, so what if they're taking the fifth and she's not able to extract any information from any sort of an interview or testimony that's offered? >> well, in new york law, and i'm not a lawyer, but i'm -- i do teach law at syracuse university. under new york law, in a civil proceeding, a judge can instruct a jury that exercising your fifth amendment right in a civil proceeding is grounds to draw an adverse inference from that. that is, the reason the individual took the fifth amendment was because answering the question would show wrongdoing on their part. so, they got real problems here if tish james ultimately, as i'm confident she will do, files a civil lawsuit, and she could ultimately seek the dissolution of the trump organization, just as previous new york attorney generals got donald trump's fake

university shut down and his fake charity shut down. >> david, you have been studying the trumps for so long now. are you implying that because of this, donald trump could be at risk of personal bankruptcy? >> oh, it is possible that donald, at the end of the day, will be left with nothing but his presidential pension and his union pension from his tv show, because those are the only assets he has that would be protected. and given that donald brags about how much he loves money, he cares about money more than anything else, that's his words, not mine, this is a very troubling for him, but yes, he could lose not just the trump organization but his apartment, his mansion in westchester county, his golf courses, mar-a-lago, all of that can be at risk in these both criminal and civil proceedings that are coming against him in a number of jurisdictions, especially if the new york attorney general arranges to have his business

put out of business. you and i have a right to live, but corporations are privileged creatures created by the state, and the government can shut them down for wrongdoing. >> how much did things complicate for donald trump when mazars dropped him, his accounting firm said, we're not going to work with you anymore, we can't even trust the compilation of documents that we've put together for now in these past years? >> this is actually very troubling news. first of all, it opens up the prospect that lenders can call loans, that insurers can cancel policies. he could have banks refuse to even run checking accounts on reputational risk for him. and donald bender, the mazars partner who prepared his tax returns, has turned state's evidence. he testified before the manhattan grand jury, and under new york law, when you testify before a grand jury, you are immunized, so he can not be charged with any crimes from what he testified about.

that means he is likely to be a witness if and when the grand jury indicts donald trump, as i expect they will, and his company on a new york state racketeering charge that will certainly include tax counts, bank fraud, business record fraud, and other charges embedded in the racketeering charge. >> wow. i have been adding this all up, but i got to say, talking with you, david k. johnson, i think donald trump's in a whole world of trouble. thank you very much for giving it as you see it. speaking of trouble, trouble at the gas station. coming up next, the tools the biden administration has to make things a little easier on your wallet. ration has to make things a little easier on your things a little easier on your waetll ♪ your dell technologies advisor can help you find the right tech solutions. so you can stop at nothing for your customers. (burke) this is why you want farmers claim forgiveness... [echoing] claim forgiveness-ness, your home premium won't go up

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who's got more from portola valley in the bay area. scott, welcome. what can you tell us about this smarter strategy? >> reporter: well, the first thing to know about it, alex, is that there are -- there is leeway for municipalities and for businesses for how they respond to this, and that's why we're here in portola valley. i'm in san matteo county. if you walk into the market behind me, you no longer have to wear a mask. if i were across the street in santa clara county, i would have to wear a mask. they're waiting for the case rates to become lower, and it also applies to local bids businesses. they can make their own rules as well. our colleagues at nbc bay area talked to a salon in fremont in alameda county where the salon owner is requiring masks and also asking her customers for proof of vaccination. >> we'll still keep it six feet from each station, and we have

divider, and i feel very safe, and -- but with our guests, it's pretty close, especially in the shampoo bowl, we're face-to-face, we're shampooing, and we are with our guests sometimes two hours, two and a half hours, so i would like to have some cover. >> reporter: now, all that said, here's where the state is going with the strategy that governor newsom has dubbed s.m.a.r.t.e.r. because everyone has to have an acronym when you're in politics. it stands for shots, masks, awareness, making people aware that the disease is still there, even if case rates are lower, readiness, they want to be able to flood the zone with healthcare workers if there's another surge, testing, that includes monitoring the waste water, education about the disease, and the "r" is rx for prescription treatments for covid-19.

>> we now move into a new phase of addressing the challenges and realities of this disease. we move out of the pandemic phase and we move into a phase which should allow you confidence that we are not walking away, that we're taking the lessons learned, and we're leaning into the future. >> reporter: important to note, public health experts say we're not quite at the endemic phase, the classical definition being low case rates and predictable case rates. we're not there yet here in california or anywhere else. governor newsom says that his plan is a recognition that there is no end point for covid-19 and what we're seeing here, this idea of just being ready for a disease that's ever present, it may be something that you can get used to elsewhere in the country as well. alex? >> okay. scott cohn from portola valley, california. thank you. a democrat-backed proposal to suspend the federal gas tax through the end of this year is getting pushback from

republicans and some democrats. the proposal is an effort to curb gas prices, which you all know have hit recent highs. joining me now is austin goolsbee, former chairman of the council of economic advisors for the obama administration. good to see you, austin. thank you for joining me on this. the big question is how impactful could a gas tax halt be? >> i've never been a fan of temporary tax holidays of this form. i mean, you got to remember, the gas tax goes to funding infrastructure, so if you turn that off, then you got to fill a hole in some other way. it would have a modest effect. if you want to have a short-run modest effect, you can release some oil from the strategic petroleum reserve, but it feels like the bigger issues happening now in the overall gasoline and oil market are, we've got a war

knocking on the door between one of the biggest oil producers of the world in russia, and you've seen a lot of military attacks, terrorism and violence, saudi arabia, yemen and the middle east, and that's got everyone on edge, and that's on top of, there was a whole lot of demand as the economies were coming back. so that supply and demand is what's driving up the price. >> yeah, so, you've just articulated what you think is the downside to halting the gas tax, but is there any other arsenal in the administration tool that they could employ here to try to bring down gas prices? >> well, in a way, they can -- they could do another release of the strategic petroleum reserve. that was attacked at the time they did it. if you recall, people said, well, it wouldn't do very much. it would be short lived, but the timing ended up being pretty good on that, and it sort of ushered in fruitful negotiations with opec and some others that they agreed to expand

production. before the war talk began regarding russia, the price of oil had come down pretty significantly, 15%, 20% from its peaks, so i think that anything you can do on the geopolitical side to back off of violence among the oil-producing conditions, in the short run, that's your best bet to try to get the price down. >> 100%. so, despite inflation, what about the retail industry? because that's showing signs of improvement. we have the commerce department reporting that retail sales rose 3.8% in january. what do you think the explanation is for it? because that's january, after the holidays. >> yeah. and just for that month, you know, a strong month, it's showing a little life, a little kick to their step. i think if that's a sign that the fear-induced reduction in retail spending, which has just

been unrelenting for almost two years, is finally -- that the virus is loosening its grip on people's economic psyche, that would be a great sign. sign that, you know, maybe if we could put the virus into more endemic phase, as you described, that we could get back to something like normal. by the summer or at least heading in that direction. so, i think a lot of it is from that. >> so, if you look altogether here, january, bringing the economic wins for the biden administration with the retail sales being up that we've talked about. recent polls show, though, although job numbers are up too, we should add, recent polls show that most americans are not happy with the president's handling of the economy. where is the disconnect, austin? and i'm curious what you think the president could do to turn that around. if you were advising him right now, what would you tell him? >> well, you know, the problem of economic advice in a moment like this is that the economic

advice is on economic timetable that's not a political timetable. it's clearly on the minds of the white house and the leaders in congress, that there's an election coming in november, and so if they could get this all sorted out in the spring, that would make them feel a lot better, but i don't think that's realistic on the economic timetable. i think a large reason why, despite really rapid economic growth and very strong job market and wages up quite a lot, i think the reason that there's still a lot of dissatisfaction in consumer confidence surveys and things like that has a lot to do with the virus. we're still in a much worse place than we thought we were going to be a year ago, where we were all optimistic, the vaccines were coming in, the numbers were going down, and we did not see delta coming. we did not see omicron coming. and that we've had schools shut

back down, day care not be available, a bunch of vacations that we finally wanted to go take had to be postponed or canceled, that just puts people in a bad, bad mood and it doesn't matter if you tell them, but look at the numbers. gdp is up. you got a $3,500 tax cut last year. they still look and they say, this isn't where i wanted to be. >> yeah. and add to that whether or not people have to carry a mask with them all the time still, where you wear it, there's so much confusion. austin goolsbee, never confused after chatting with you. sandy hook families this week won what was called an unwinnable case. what it could mean for the future. unwinnable case. what it could mean for the future

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the families of nine people killed in the sandy hook shooting reached a $73 million settlement with the gun manufacturer. this landmark victory comes after a long legal battle over how remington marketed its

bushmaster ar-15 style rifle which was used in the 2012 killings of 20 first graders and six educators in newtown, connecticut. joining me now is chris brown, president of brady. chris, welcome to you. i see something of a smile on your face. what was your reaction to this multimillion dollar settlement? >> well, i was thrilled, alex. brady has been litigating cases like this for over 30 years, and successfully before congress passed a law more than a decade ago seeking to give immunity to the gun industry for any cases like this. the parents, nine families of 20 children and 6 educators killed at sandy hook have been litigating this case for five years, and they brought forth the theory that brady first put forth 30 years ago, that the marketing practices of these weapons are aimed at and targeted and have the impact of contributing to gun violence.

and the court heard that, and remington fought them every step of the way, trying to say that this case was barred, and here, justice was served. they were able to move forward, and this case settled. i wish this case never had to be brought. i wish gun manufacturers internalized the risks of their products and stopped marketing in this way, but this is a step in the right direction, and i'm really pleased. >> yeah. i can tell you you are. frankly, i am too, given what it's all about. have you heard anything about the settlement details? >> what we do know, and i think it's so important, is that the general public is going to have access to some of these documents, and the lawyers made sure that happened. i'm proud to say that brady participated in the case with an amicus brief. we want the public to know this. you know, sunshine is the best disinfectant, alex, and i think it's really important, just like with the big tobacco cases, that the american public understand

that gun manufacturers are targeting our youth with this kind of marketing, with things like, get your man card here. about these kinds of weapons. and they're not internalizing the carnage. this is about selling as many guns to as many people without consequence to them. it's about their bottom line. and that needs to change. >> and look, you and i both wish that we never had to talk about these issues and never had another story like this again but on the heels of this, what kind of a message does it send to the gun manufacturers, and does this open the door to other similar lawsuits in the wake of any tragic gun violence? >> absolutely. and in fact, brady has suits that are pending right now, alex, that can be advanced with this kind of settlement and the fact, by the way, that remington tried to get the supreme court of the united states to stop this case from going forward and the supreme court said, no. they let it proceed. so, that's very, very important.

and yes, you know what? gun manufacturers should not be treated any differently than any other industry in the united states of america. they should be subject to liability. >> you know, kris, on that comment, "the washington post" had an op-ed, and it detailed the parallels between this case and all those cases against big tobacco that were happening back in the 1990s, and one expert said one of the great things that helped in that success were the lawsuits. he said, as a result, the whole industry became something of a pariah. do you see the sandy hook case, this one, as being the first step in regulating the way that the gun industry markets firearms? >> yes, i think it has that potential, but we have to make sure, and the public has to know that we, as americans, have been denied the information about these marketing practices, because more than a decade ago, congress sought to stop this from happening. the reason this case is so

important is the court said, you know what? their marketing practices are fair game for litigation. we need to have more of these cases, and brady is bringing these cases so that all of americans understand what's happening in the boardrooms, has a consequence for our children at school, in movie theaters, in synagogues and churches, in our public squares all over this country. so, absolutely, litigation is key and crucial to bring justice and to change practices so they stop marketing to our kids. >> amen to all that. kris brown, always good to have you on the show. thank you so much. so, they are under pressure on the world stage and they're facing windchills of, oh, minus 25 degrees. we have an update on team usa from the beijing olympics next. we have an update on team usa from the beijing olympics next

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it occurred about 1:10 eastern time so less than two hours ago. as you can see, it came pretty close to the shore and to swimmers there in the water. the two people on board have been rescued. they have been taken to a nearby hospital. last word, they are in stable condition. just extraordinary there. we're going to bring you more on this story in our next hour here on msnbc. more breaking news to share for you. remember that former miami dolphins head coach suing the nfl for discrimination? well, he has a new job. the pittsburgh steelers have announced that brian flores has been hired as the team's senior defensive assistant and linebackers coach. flores is suing the league, along with the dolphins and two other teams for alleged racist hiring practices. really quick update on the olympics for you, which ends in beijing tomorrow. the conditions for athletes have been pretty rough, wind gusts up to 40 miles an hour, prompting delays at several events. windchills down to minus 26 degrees. in men's freestyle skiing, team usa captured a pair of medals,

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♪♪ hi, everybody, i'm yasmin vossoughian on a very busy saturday afternoon. an angry condemnation of the global community from the ukrainen president just hours ago in a speech on the world stage.ian president just hours ago in a speech on the world stage. as russia is poised to invade his country at any time. we are following the major developments on the ground in ukraine as russian president vladimir putin ratchets up