back fill what's been used. that's going to be much more difficult. don't expect russia to do that and find ways to achieve that goal and not easy. the message for ukraine is we'll do everything that we possibly can as a country. united states as an ally nato and other nations around the world. >> thank you so much for your time. >> thank you. >> i'll see you on nbc news now. "deadline: white house" picks up the coverage now. ♪♪ hi there, everyone. 4:00 in new york with breaking news here at home and abroad. history being made in washington, d.c. today. president biden announcing judge jackson as the pick to replace justice breyer setting in motion a process that is likely to

bring us the country's first black woman ever to sit on the supreme court. we'll have more on that historic announcement. but we begin with the russian invasion of ukraine which in just a few hours enters the third day. the capital city of kyiv is preparing for an assault of forces with explosions across the city. officials warn the residents to stay inside and instructing them as to how to prepare molotov cocktails. harrowing scenes like the ones on the screens unfolded all across the capitol. including this one. a tank crushing a car during a russian attack. the driver survived the attack. crowds were seen swarming a train station in the city desperate to get out. 50,000 people have fled ukraine in the last 48 hours. according to the u.n. in what could be the beginning of a major crisis brought on by

russian attacks in nearly every corner of the country. despite the advances a senior u.s. defense official saying russia is facing more resistance than expected. there are signs that the russian government is resorting to a hallmark weapon of the putin regime. disinformation. one u.s. official says that russia publishing false reports of mass sunder of ukrainian forces to threaten to kill the family members of soldiers if they don't surrender. dispelling false claims by russian media that leaders fled the capital just hours ago president zelenskyy posted a video of himself and the leadership on the streets of kyiv and say we are defending the independence, our country, glory to the defenders, glory to ukraine. on a video call with european leaders earlier president

zelenskyy said that it may be the last time any of them see him alive. zelenskyy spoke to president biden today as the u.s. and western allies stepped up the response to what's been the gravest security crisis on the european continent in decades. nato for the fist time in the history activated the response force in order to shore up the defense of its members in eastern europe. a few moments ago white house press secretary psaki announced the u.s. is joining the partners to impose sanctions directly on vladimir putin as well as russian foreign minister lavrov and other top russian officials. we begin with cal perry in ukraine and in moscow nbc' raf sanchez. cal, take us through this hour and go back through the day for us. >> reporter: so what's happening right now are the air raid

sirens going off in kyiv. rockets heading into the city and you have fighting on the outskirts moving to the center of the city. erin mclaughlin heard a fire fight. you have an exodus from the city of kyiv and east coming to the west. i had a chance to spend part of the day at the train station here where i am in lv iv and you have families waiting to move on and folks to get out. these are the folks lucky enough to get where they are. the look on peoples' faces of shock, horror. is of real sadness having to leave their lives behind. picking the pets over luggage. and then going the other direction. soldiers as young as 18, kids, if you're a fighting age and a male in this country you are no longer allowed to leave.

you can take your family to the border with a 7-mile wait to cross the border where people walk with no guarantee to get across and then return back to fight the russians in kyiv. i had a chance to talk to folks outside the train station and why would they fight and be willing to put the lives on the line. here's what they said. >> we have to fight because -- >> yeah. >> i'm not sure how it can be possible not to fight for this country where there are people and people we need to fight. >> we need help. >> military help and other help. every help possible because if we are not defeating russia probably -- >> you will be the next to fight. >> yeah. >> reporter: there was a real sense at this train station that more needed to be done by the international community. that that s.w.i.f.t. transaction not part of the sanctions should be and that i think is possible.

what is unrealistic that people want is a no fly zone and where nato is. the rockets inside kyiv is a political issue. nato is focusing on the refugee crisis. i can promise you that's an underestimate based on the pictures to see from the ukrainian capital. >> cal, what do people say as they are making the excruciating choice what to bring with historic horrific echos on the continent and why they didn't leave sooner? >> about whether they what? i'm sorry. >> why they didn't leave soon every. u.s. intelligence is pushing out aggressively intelligence suggesting that vladimir putin would do exactly what vladimir putin has spent the last 48 hours doing. do any of the families wish they had direction or options or plan

to leave sooner? >> reporter: yes. absolutely. and part of that is a displeef. people did not believe. so many people didn't believe it would happen or confined to the eastern part of the country or it would be only a minor incursion and sort of heard from the president a few weeks ago. the idea that kyiv choked off and could be fierce fighting, rue hours that russian soldiers are putting on ukrainian uniforms for insider attacks in the city. there's time by the ukrainian president down playing the threat and people just did not have the time in the last 48 how shalls to prepare that they would have in two weeks. president zelenskyy didn't want

the country to fall apart unnecessarily. russian military is destabilizing the nation. up to 5 million people on the move averages show us 1 in 3 refugees ten years later return. 2 in 3 don't go home. you can change the nation without huge military gains. it is going to have an effect on the surrounding countries, as well. >> i want to talk about where you are. tell me what you hear about where you are and about where diplomats i know pushed out. are things changing hourly there? >> reporter: yeah. they are. and what's happened in lviv is security concern about an insider attack. it reverb rated around the country. it is incredibly effective

raising the suspicion everybody is not who they say they are. the military is stopped at check points. this city has gone into basically a lockdown. we are under curfew and i am 350 miles from the ukrainian capital. i am only 50 miles from the polish border. people never thought this place would be the place to go in lockdown and a curfew. the american diplomat corps moved here and planned to stay here and so unstable and that they are going to remain in poland. they were commuting back and forth every day. the embassies here are not advertising and not saying where they are and concerned about security. >> amazing. stay with us. i want to bring raf sanchez into this conversation. i think the world was transfixed by something you don't see every

day, massive protests on the streets of russian cities. i guess the reaction is predictable by the putin government but tell me what happened today. >> reporter: extraordinarily despite the crackdown last night people were back tonight once again protesting. a placard said peace for ukraine and freedom for us. and to state the obvious if you go out and protest against vladimir putin's war in russia this week you are doing so at massive personal risk, risk not just of violence and arrest on the night but prosecution and of a criminal record that can follow you for years and years and make it difficult to get a job going forward. and i think it is a sign of the strength, feeling in some quarters in this country that people know those risks, living under vladimir putin's rule for

two decades and know the consequences and gone out and they have taken that step anyway. cal was talking about the sense of disbelief in ukraine that this war has gone ahead. there's something of disbelief here in russia not only that putin has invaded but that he is invaded in such a max millist bay. this is an attack on ukraine from all directions and i think a lot of russians are looking around and asking, what is the exit strategy here? and a lot of them are asking what does this tell us that we didn't know prior about vladimir putin and about the risks, the gambles he is prepared to table in pursuit of his beliefs about ukraine being part of a larger russian sphere. >> i wonder, this i think leads a lot of people in this country to wonder, i think there's been

almost awe of the ability that putin has to spread disinformation and have it accepted by american politicians, one of the two parties but seems like limits to how credible he can be and his own country and wonder if you can tell me what that conversation looks like. outside of state media. there must be real questions about even what he said the night that the invasion commenced that this was a special operation. this is clearly a full-on invasion of the entire country. >> reporter: people are under no illusions that this is a limited military operation. they can see that there are hundreds and thousands of their sons, brothers, fathers who have been deployed into this fight in ukraine. what's interesting, you watch state television here why there's very little battlefield

footage. you don't see apartment buildings hit by bombs why the coverage is fairly ant septic. seeing putin and officials speaking behind podiums and not seeing a lot of what is happening on the ground but despite that people know what's going on here. there isn't the same level of social media censorship in russia as china, for example. the russian prosecutor general said he'll move ahead with posing a censorship on facebook. we have just been checking here at the bureau in moscow. facebook is up and available in russia but we are execing that some media outlets and voices critical of the war may find themselves censored on facebook but vladimir putin will have a real task on the hand to

convince the russian public at large that this is a battle to take part in and inflicting this pain on the ukrainians and said it's worth it. >> an unbelievable moment. grateful to you both. thank you. stay safe. joining the coverage military analyst retired four star general barry mccaffrey and msnbc national security analyst evelyn farkas. joining me here on set is nice to say that again. msnbc plit cap contributor ben roads and john heilemann. also a msnbc national affairs analyst. ben, you were telling me about an interview you did today that

tells the story of what is happening on the ground. >> i was talking to a ukrainian journalist and describing how much things changed in the last 24 hours. she went to the grocery store. there's no food. described scenes of chaos at the train station. described being in a bomb shelter with a young family that had to evacuate with explosion near them. they did not plan. they had a 6-month-old baby and all they were able to grab before they slept a few pieces of bread and water and diapers. so you know, part of the explosions and think of physical violence but this is now a city where people are totally cut off and basic propositions are not there. while i was talking to her there's a huge explosion outside the window and had to run into the bathroom to get away from it and then go down stairs and why

people waited she said they did not believe that russians would do this to them. there are deep ties. many people in ukraine have family in russia. people in russia have family in ukraine and unthinkable and may do things in the donbas and eastern ukraine but the idea that people that they do share such cultural and family ties with would do this to them is astonishing and sense in her a sense of complete anxiety about the future. no idea how to stay alive even in that context. she said to me, this country will never be the same. and that is sinking for all ukrainians and other thing she said that's manifested in president zelenskyy's comments is to resist and part of what she was doing as a journalist trying to resist the disinformation campaigns that

she said on telegram channels that is ironically a russian created channel that ukrainians use and flood of information that zelenskyy left the country and then seeing him. the flip side is what ukrainians are doing on telegram is telling them this is what your country is doing to us and the president doing to us. get in the streets and stop this war. >> to that end, do you have a sense of what the actual numbers are of lives lost and casualties on each side or is it now -- is that information now part of each country's sort of weapon against the other? >> this is part of the information war and we have seen president zelenskyy talking about casualties in the low hundreds why ukrainians said russian casualties. the russian said they suffered no casualties which is entirelien credible and the reality is we saw in 2014 and '15 in donbas them acting like

no russians in donbas. it is a grave political threat to vladimir putin when body bags come home and try to suppress that information and so simply communicating the costs to the russian people. families will know if the loved ones aren't coming home and something to watch here. the capacity of the government of ukraine to gather information is choked off, too. the ability to communicate. i don't think we can know with certainly what is happening in terms of casualties because ukrainians can't gather that information and the russians won't put it out if they have it. >> one more question about the interview today. i imagine there's the disoriented phenomenon that cal explained and you have that this is happening but around these tables, jen psaki made the comment we have been describing the attack as imminent over a week. that said, do you feel abandoned

and alone to fight this? >> yeah. first of all, a point that all made to me is to communicate why they're so surprised. kyiv is a major western country and don't imagine something like this happening. other parts of the world. and to them i think it was an unthinkable reality as it is to us. that this would happen to them. you know? but you also said something to me that i have heard from every ukrainians which is an appeal. we are alone fighting for the democratic word. we are alone fighting for freedom. where are the sanctions that would really mean something? where are the sanctions to cut off the russian economy at the knees? where's the mill tash support? and there's an appeal to do something to help us. they're going to fight. every indication that we have gotten and want to know what are you going to do to help us win in that fight?

more severe sanctions like s.w.i.f.t. or energy exports or whether it is the provision of weapons or whatever support to provide financially to the people. but there is this kind of appeal and said, i said i think we express the solidarity. she said go to the leaders and tell them to do more to help the people of ukraine. >> general mccaffrey, what would that look like to do more? >> you know, such a tragedy. clearly the refugees will be a mass humanitarian disaster. the fighting in the field has been intense. tremendous courage and bravery on the part of ukrainian military and zelenskyy. and the political officers. very touching sense of courage and commitment to ukraine. the objective of the russian armed forces is the destruction

of the ukrainian armed forces. they want to destabilize the capital. turn off the electrical grid. zelenskyy is arming civilians. urging homemade molotov cocktails. a military perspective absorbing the russian armed forces in street to street fighting if s a good option and destroy this as ben said beautiful capital city and involve massive civilian casualties. you can't defend a city on the perimeter. you have to fight inside the city so tough questions for zelenskyy to answer. my assumption is the last battle is the battle in the east where the preponderance of the armed forces are. they will be encircled. will they fight?

can they fight effectively? they have almost no air cover or air defense. command and control will unravel on them. probably has already. these are tougher days for ukraine. >> let me ask a question that may sound silly to someone steeped in military practices and history but is there any advantage to the side of the underdogfighting against where people are protesting their presence? the very existence of this aggression in ukraine. is there any diminishment in that might because there'm dissent at home about what they're doing in ukraine? >> the russians are protesting on the streets. astonishing. that's a police state. putin murders opponents at home

and abroad. locks them up. they will -- the protests are being beaten senseless and hauled off to prison. so it's remarkable. putin sounds somewhat deranged. drug addicts, nazis. calling on a coup to overthrow ukraine and same time will negotiate. the lad is going unstable himself. must be scared. i think there's surprising courage and effectiveness on the part of the ukrainian armed forces. having a kyiv airport recaptured by the ukrainians was a big deal to me. so hard to know where this is going but again, you know, ukraine has a huge mismatch of combat power. the good news by the way is nato has come together. the biden team, the secretary of

state, secretary of defense and others got them energized. they remember the devastation of '39 to '45. they're going to start getting serious to confront putin's next step which will be the baltic states, romania and poland. and declaring the nato rapid response force today is powerful. the u.s. does have 80,000 troops in europe. my old division at fort stewart, georgia, flying 7,000 troops that will follow equipment in europe. they're doing the right thing but ukraine is on their own. f-35 will take down the russian air force but we won't start open combat with the russian forces in the coming weeks. >> before we came on the hour white house press secretary

psaki announced the u.s. to join european allies in enacting sanctions against vladimir putin himself. explain how that's different from the sections we have been hearing about for days. >> yeah. generally, we don't sanction heads of state or even ministers of defense, foreign ministers because they're people we want to meet with them and without them having a problem to get a visa to meet with us where the meeting takes place. and we also try to leave room so it don't feel quite so personal. this is throwing down the gauntlet and president biden saying he's gone way too far and not negotiating with him and not meeting with him. i think it is different. is it going to change anything? no. but it isn't really important. i have to say about sanctions. it takes a while for them to take effect and another reason why they're important. i have spent time on zoom

sessions with people who are supporters of alexey navalny and an associate says i don't care how big the sanctions are. i want the world to condemn what this government is doing. so i think this kind of falls into that category. not going to change much but it's a condemnation and i hope it's global at the level of united nations and can't happen in the security council but could in the general assembly. >> there's much more to get to as the fears of fall of kyiv grow by the hour here and there. plus the other big huge breaking story of the day, president biden's history making nomination to the united states supreme court. what we know about judge jackson and how much republican support she might get. all those stories and more when

we continue after a quick break. stay with us. a quick break. stay with us

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thinkorswim® by td ameritrade one of just many tragic and heart breaking scenes and stories unfolding in ukraine right now. as that country faces invasion from russia. video from "the new york times" that shows newborn infants from an nicu in a children's hospital moved into a bomb shelter in the city of eastern ukraine. that's the target of missile

strikes. babies. we're back with the panel. john heilemann, i left you off the last conversation and come in with the human calamity that we watch unfold. >> yeah. i mean i think the thing is the trajectory is on the worst path. that there's no -- we are nowhere near as bad as it will get and all of the -- everything you here from kyiv is grim and the real assault hasn't begun. we know what that can look like when they turn on the full strength jets. and you can see that on the neighboring countries. the preparation's made for the massive refugee crisis. general mccaffrey talked about that. i mean, i don't want -- one speculates how grim it could be and cast your mind forward to where we will be a week from now, i mean, it's a really horrendous thing to contemplate

at the level of displacement and death and injury but just people who are going to be fleeing on foot trying to find food, trying to find a way to communicate with anybody. could be a great humanitarian crisis in the heart of europe. >> images of people in the subway doubling as a bomb shelter with the smartphones and very little. very small children holding a pet on a leash and small sort of bags over their shoulder. i just come back to what else we could have done to help people prepare and what can we do to help as refugees come leave the country? i think obviously there's a massive deployment of military and nato troops and see what's going on on the border in poland. extraordinary structures built and human capital is being put in place to wait for the refugees but the thing that gets me is smaller details.

some of the things that ben said a second ago. you see on twitter someone said outside in the bomb shelter there's three guys with kalashnikovs. that's new. the tiny incremental things and the things that we can build refugee centers and everything at the mass scale that we want to do and the details to hear by the minute as the things get worse in kyiv and break your heart and things to do nothing about at this point. >> general mccaffrey, i think john is making a point and not sure ready to hear how much worse things can get for them. tell me what in your estimation and analysis is next for the russians. >> well, you know, i don't think we have much greater information. the tact kawhi leonard site looks like on the ground. the ukrainians are calling up. civilians not protected by the

laws of war sniping at the notion of sniping at russian armored troops. i think in the next five to seven days the battle will be decided outside the urban areas and ukraine and army given a bloody nose to the russians and set them back on their heels and started a new political process or they will have been annihilated or surrendered and the situation looks grim to me. we have talked about how can the u.s. and or nato intervene with more training and weapons and give team air defense and enhance their air force? it can't be done. u.s. embassy was pulled out i think for domestic political concerns. benghazi, kabul. so we don't have a mass team of courageous diplomats who could continue to liaison for us and

the u.s. military advisers. they're all out so i think the battle will be decided and not decided by sanctions. nor by new initiatives on the part of nato or united states. but by the courage of ukrainians. they're fighting an uphill battle. the situation is grim. >> evelyn, what does the white house sort of accept and acknowledge and what is the planning look like for the other side of which the general just described? >> well, for the white house it's pretty grim because what general mccaffrey described involves bloodshed for innocents and russian that are a conscript military. many of whom are going to be in a fight that they don't understand. vladimir putin said they're fighting against nazis.

anyway, so it's going to be bloody. and i think that will be a problem frankly for the white house and for the west. we're already uncomfortable. we don't want to be involved directly and correct not to be because of what we are dealing with with vladimir putin at the moment and deeply worried about the war spreading. either indirectly. because of something vladimir putin does to one of our nato allies but the other part of when you say on the other side not just the u.s. and nato and don't forget and you didn't because we have a correspondent here from russia, the russian people and some other russians are being pretty courageous. a russian rock star said he refuses to play a concert until there's peace. a man that just won a tennis

tournament in dubai said no war please and joined by medvedev in the plea for war. they're not calling out the president by name but these things do matter and i think the body bags. when i was in the white house the situation room in 2014, 2015 and we saw the body bags going to russia, the response from the kremlin was to the families, you but ri the people at night. to the journalists we beat you up if you write about it. they're sensitive because there's still anti-war movements, mothers against war, from the afghan war from the '80s and those people are active right now on social media and elsewhere. so i think we should also watch what the russians do and encourage them. >> i want to sort of button up the point of what's happening on the ground in russian cities.

we know that vladimir putin is as thin skinned as the last president of this country. and the way that the ex-president raged against "the new york times" and other news outlets. that's a sensibility shared with vladimir putin. i guess a most glaring distinction is that's a country without a robust free press and without the right to protest. so how -- what are the limits i guess of these very high profile protests against putin? >> i think chiefly putin himself. and the sense i got from talking to people in moscow is that this is a man who has taken increasingly strict control obviously of the country and also been in pretty extreme isolation during the covid period. the circle of advisers around him is steadily closing over 20 years and accelerated dramatically.

seeing that security council meeting he held with some members of that security council born in ukraine and knew they were launching a war against a country they came from. that was not an effort to gather information. this is not a man listening to anybody except the voices in his own head and in that dynamic where you have been in power for 20 years thinks he knows what's best, feels he is on a historical mission to restore the russian empire and his subordinates are absolutely terrified of him because if they say the wrong thing and saw that in the security council meeting it is like he'll press a button. >> north korea. >> that means he is not capable of absorbing negative feedback. seeing the protests in the street and probably an indication of broader unease and just the people who come out. i think that the only thing that

might permeate that bubble is that kind of mass mobilization among the russian public because otherwise he's built a system where he is not going to take the feedback. >> general, evelyn, thank you so much for spending 40 minutes with us. ben and john are sticking around. inside the history making nomination of judge jackson to be the next justice on the supreme court. that story is next. that story is next they replaced the glass and recalibrated my safety system. that's service i can trust. >> singers: ♪ safelite repair, safelite replace. ♪ r adults who are undetectable, cabenuva is the only complete hiv treatment you can get every other month. cabenuva helps keep me undetectable.

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learn all the ways to save with amazon. as it happens, i share a birthday with the first black woman ever to be appointed as a federal judge. the honorable constance baker motley. judge motley's life and career has been a true inspiration to me as i have pursued this professional path. and if i am fortunate enough to be confirmed as the next associate justice of the supreme court of the united states, i can only hope that my life and career, my love of this country and the constitution, and my commitment to upholding the rule of law and the sacred principles upon which this great nation was founded will inspire future generations of americans.

>> much of the world's attention remains on ukraine here at home a groundbreaking and historic day. that's judge jackson, president biden's overwhelmingly qualified pick to replace justice breyer on the u.s. supreme court. president biden's selection is fulfillment of a promise made two years ago today that if given the opportunity to nominate the first black woman to serve on our country's highest court but that worthy effort of diversify should not distract anyone from judge jackson's brilliant resume, qualifications, as we said, profoundly equipped for the position to which she is nominated. clerked for justice breyer in 1999. now the fight to be confirmed begins. joining us is sarah murray now a law professor and neal katail

and a law professor and both msnbc contributors. melissa, i want to play more of judge brown jackson on what was a really personal note and read about it in newspaper coverage of her and not seen her talk about her uncle and her family's history and in law enforcement. let's watch. >> you may have read that i have one uncle who got caught up in the drug trade and received a life sentence. that is true. but law enforcement also runs in my family. and n addition to my brother i had two uncles who served decades as police officers, one of whom became the police chief in my hometown of miami, florida. i am standing here today by the grace of god as testament to the love and support that i have received from my family.

>> melissa, i wish i could play the whole thing but what were your thoughts as she spoke today? >> first thing is that this is probably the supreme court nomination speech that most impose the question of faith. spoke of her faith at length. guided by faith and there by the grace of god. i think that disrupts this narrative one side of the political aisle has a monopoly on faith and godliness. i think she showed the duality of the black experience in terms of criminal justice. she has family members who have been caught up on one side of the justice system and the other side enforcing law and will not be able to pin her down and it is not monolithic and important joining the court where she will go toe to toe with someone

monopolized the black experience since 1991 and that's clarence thomas. >> neal, i want to play more from judge brown jackson's speech today and some of what she said about justice breyer. >> justice breyer in particular, not only gave me the greatest job that any young lawyer could ever hope to have and exemplified every day in every way that a supreme court justice can perform at the highest level of skill and integrity while also being guided by civility, grace, pragmatism, and generosity of spirit. justice breyer, the members of the senate will decide if i fill your seat, but please know that i could never fill your shoes. >> the entire white house event was quite extraordinary.

this was one of the most graceful notes i have heard anyone make in this moment. >> yeah. on this dismal set of days this is a really great day for the court. really great day for our country and agree with melissa there's stuff about faith and the political reactions but to me i practiced before the court and i want a great justice. the country needs a great justice and what we are getting in this nomination and you heard her talk about the reverence for justice breyer and we share that for her and everyone so excited to hear she would fill this seat. she is so respectful and lovely and never could fill your shoes but she very well could fill those shoes and in particular one thing to talk about is her temperament because justice breyer like we come in as law

clerks and justice scalia say something mean in a draft opinion and he would say, no, no. that's not how we do things. always up and up. every time. no matter how hard the slings and arrows came at him and i look at her as carrying on that tradition of grace and civility, and at a time when the country is so polarized, when the court itself has polarization on it, i could see her being a bridge builder in the way that justice breyer very much was. >> yeah, it was like salve for the soul to hear her talk about, in addition to civility and grace, generosity of spirit and pragmatism. i'm going to ask melissa and neal to stick around. we have to sneak in a quick break, but i want to ask both of you what happens next on the other side of the very short break. stay with us. on the other side of the very short break. stay with us

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for a 3-month prescription. what are you recommending for muscle pain? based on clinical data, i recommend salonpas. agreed... my patients like these patches because they work for up to 12 hours, even on moderate pain. salonpas. it's good medicine we're back with melissa murray, neal katyal, ben rhodes and john heilemann. neal, i saw the republicans who voted for judge ketanji brown jackson when she was nominated not too long ago already saying, oh, i don't -- lindsey graham had a ludicrous tweet that i'm not going to read on the air, but even senator lisa murkowski said, oh, it doesn't mean anything. what is your sense of how important it might have been to president biden that she had very recently garnered three republican votes in the u.s. senate, which doesn't sound like a lot, maybe, to someone who doesn't follow this every day

but in these times, that's momentous. >> it is momentous and the way that it wasn't years ago. so, years ago, like justice breyer was confirmed overwhelmingly, and yes, you know, i think it is significant that less than a year ago, three republican senators, including lindsey graham, voted for her, and now graham is saying, oh, the radical left has won because of this nomination. i mean, i'd like him to point out what she's done in the last year since he voted for her the last time that has now made her the radical left nominee. i mean, it's ridiculous. and i'm pleased to see, like, senator collins saying she's going to keep an open mind about this, even mitt romney, i believe, has said nice things. the republican mayor of miami and so on. but to me, the fundamental question is, justice breyer had, you know, overwhelming republican support for his nomination. it's very hard to paint her as any bit to the left of justice breyer. and so, if you voted for justice breyer, and you're not voting for her now, what's changed? it's something about your party and what's happened to it.

>> melissa, what are your thoughts as she enters into this part of the process, the confirmation process? >> well, there will surely be republicans who raise objections and i think they do so at their own peril. again, as neal said, this is someone who's just confirmed by this very same senate and she's been twice confirmed before by the senate. she's actually been senate confirmed three times. in order to raise objections about her, i think you have to dig really deep, and if you even manufacture things and i think that most americans looking at her resume, her credentials, her sterling experience is profound and she will add not only race and gender diversity to the bench but also a diversity of professional experience. she comes from a world where she was working as a public defender. that's something that's been important to president biden and it will be important for the court where currently two of the justices were former prosecutors so it's going to be hard to raise objections without looking churlish and indeed like you're

making things up. >> churlish and making things up, of course, is their brand. melissa and neal, thank you so much. ben and john stick around. the next hour of "deadline white house" starts after a quick break. n and john stick around. the next hour of "deadline white house" stas rtafter a quick break. because platforms this innovative aren't just made for traders —they're made by them. thinkorswim® by td ameritrade i have moderate to severe ulcerative colitis. so i'm taking zeposia, a once-daily pill. because i won't let uc stop me from being me. zeposia can help people with uc achieve and maintain remission. and it's the first and only s1p receptor modulator approved for uc. don't take zeposia if you've had a heart attack, chest pain, stroke or mini-stroke, heart failure in the last 6 months, irregular or abnormal heartbeat not corrected by a pacemaker, if you have untreated severe breathing problems during your sleep, or if you take medicines called maois. zeposia may cause serious side effects including infections that can be life-threatening and cause death,

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to see this happening to the country is just devastating. i just -- i just can't believe someone could be so evil. >> hi again, everyone, it's 5:00 in new york. midnight in kyiv as the situation in ukraine has turned even more dire today and

tonight. ukraine's capital preparing for battle as russian forces have reached that city. explosions and air sirens rang out all day throughout kyiv as its mayor says the city has entered a phase of defense. ukrainian president zelenskyy, who has refused to leave kyiv, posting a video earlier alongside government officials saying this, quote, we are here. we are defending ukraine. that follows an acknowledgment by zelenskyy overnight of that grim intelligence he received that, quote, the enemy marked me as target number one and my family as target number two. they want to destroy ukraine politically by destroying the head of state. according to zelenskyy, 137 ukrainians were killed and more than 300 were wounded in just the first day of fighting. today, we heard a significant announcement from nato. for the first time in its history, it is deploying elements of the nato response force for collective defense and deterrence. however, that does not mean that

u.s. or nato troops will go into ukraine. the move is a shoring up of allies on the eastern plank. in just the last hour, white house press secretary jen psaki confirms that the u.s. will sanction russian president putin directly as well as foreign minister sergei lavrov and members of the russian national security team. a senior u.s. defense official telling nbc news, russia has launched more than 200 missiles into ukraine. about one-third of the combat forces russia had amassed on its border are now inside the country, but this official also noted that russians have lost a bit of their momentum, not advancing as far or as fast as officials originally thought they would. ukrainians across multiple cities are now either fleeing, like the woman you heard at the top of the hour. she made her way to poland. or they're hunkering down, in some cases in subway stations and makeshift bomb shelters. joining us now from ukraine, nbc's matt bradley.

matt, i know you have moved around as i understand the situation is changing by the hour. tell me what you have seen today and tonight. >> reporter: yeah, well, actually, nicole, we started the day up north in northeast in kharkiv, the second largest city in ukraine, a russian speaking majority city. we started and i was going on msnbc this morning, midnight your time, telling ayman mohyeldin how quiet and tranquil everything was, how the streets were empty, and then as i was talking, we heard very, very close bombardment, and it was really stunning, just really rapid succession bombardment that we later learned were these sort of grad style rockets, one of which landed straight into one of the streets not so far away from the center of this huge city. and then after that, we started hearing sort of the rat a tat response of these anti-aircraft weapons. so we threw on our gear and

continued our broadcast with ayman mohyeldin, then we went down into what was for us our own makeshift bunker, the underground parking garage for the hotel we're staying in with other hotel guests and journalists, and then we made the decision to head down here to dnipro, which is a relatively safe city or at least for now, when we see kind of the movement of russian troops, they're kind of making a pincer movement that could come from the south and the north to join us right here where we are. that depends on the order of battle and how things go from here on out, and we heard from that -- those quotes that were gathered by courtney kube, our colleague, that said that actually, you know, the battle isn't going as well as the russians may have thought. and actually, the ukrainians might be doing better than they ever thought they were doing. i spoke with some ukrainian former defense officials and current defense officials a couple weeks ago. they were remarkably pessimistic, much more so than your average rank and file uniformed ukrainian, who i spoke with, who was just filled with vigor and ready to fight the russians.

but, you know, talking about defense officials, talking about people in uniform, all of this is falling on civilians, the kind of civilians that i saw when i was in our own makeshift bomb shelter and the kind we saw in the metro system back in kharkiv yesterday and i want to tell you what i spoke with some very young people. here's what they had to tell me. >> for now, i'm actually calm because i know it's a safe place. i mean, subway, underground, it's safe place. and for now, i'm mostly fear about future days because i don't know what we should do. should we stay here, or should we move? >> reporter: so, of course, he didn't know where to go. we didn't really know where to go. the problem is, when you're in a place like kharkiv, you're caught between a rock and a hard place. you can't go east because that's where a lot of the fighting is. that's where the sort of breakaway provinces are, these separatist regions, and if you

go west, you're crossing a country that is under bombardment, and you're kind of jumping from the pan into the fire, so that's why we decided to go south here where things are relatively calm, though there has been bombing. "the new york times" had some shocking video of premature babies who were brought into their own makeshift bomb shelter below their hospital, so i mean, things here are really bad, and again, the ukrainian military, they're determined to fight back, and that's actually the problem. if they weren't fighting back, this thing would be over, and the russians would simply take over, but they are fighting, and they are fighting fiercely, holding their own against some far more substantial force, and the problem is, that is going to be taxing for the civilian population here, nicole. >> matt bradley, let me just follow up on that. do the folks that you have talked to feel blindsided by something that we've been talking about here for weeks now?

the pushing out of the intelligence about russia and putin amassing troops on ukraine's border and those numbers growing and growing and growing. i know it was intelligence that zelenskyy at first didn't appreciate, but i wonder what the people say when they find themselves in the subway stations without a plan for tomorrow. >> reporter: yeah, it's a really good question, nicole. it wasn't really a question that i wanted to pitch to these people that i was speaking to. i didn't want to come off as sort of an "i told you so" because that just really wasn't the moment. >> fair. >> reporter: i've been here for about five weeks now, and when i first got here, i had a lot of skepticism. i got a lot of anger, actually, talking to some people, and zelenskyy himself, president volodymyr zelenskyy, when we spoke with him, he directly pointed his finger at the western media and said that you guys are the ones who are creating this crisis. they felt like they were being

taxed, literally paying the price for a fight for a war that hadn't been waged yet because companies were pulling out their money, airlines were canceling flights. they were starting to see all these negative developments that hadn't -- that weren't really responding to anything, but these increasingly shrill and alarmist western intelligence assessments that they just thought were unfair. and also, there were a lot of people who simply believed maybe the kremlin's lying, that they weren't going to invade, that this was all just sort of a plot by the west to intimidate and to frustrate and to undermine their government here in ukraine. well, a lot of those western intelligence assessments ended up being pretty accurate. not to the tee, but fairly accurate. you wouldn't want to set your watch by them, but they ended up kind of being fair. and a lot of these people that we spoke to really, genuinely, expressed surprise that this happened. they had made no preparations whatsoever, even in the eastern part of the country where people

are very used to instability and war. they told me, as of the day before it occurred, that they weren't expecting this to happen, that they knew that there wasn't going to be an attack, that vladimir putin wasn't going to roll in, and it's not out of simple or affinity for the russians or for vladimir putin. it wasn't out of some sort of sense of defiance or hubris. you know, in our hotel, a couple of days before this happened, there were -- there was a child dance competition. 700 parents from all over ukraine drove their children to within 35 miles of the russian border for a dance competition. you know, these parents evidently felt confident enough that there wasn't going to be an attack and that there wasn't a risk that they would drive their children right up to the russian border in kharkiv, where we were. it was extraordinary. and i mean, those parents and their children all have since left kharkiv, i think, and went to wherever they were in the

rest of the country, but it just goes to show -- and again, it wasn't defiance or hubris. it was just because they're used to it, and they weren't going to interrupt their lives, and because they didn't believe the western prognostications. >> it's just -- it's an amazing aspect of all this i think we'll talk about for a long time. nbc's matt bradley, thank you so much for staying up. thank you for your reporting. please stay safe for us. joining our conversation, msnbc senior national security have intelligence analyst, former cia director john brennan is here. also joining us, nola hanes, director of the west coast chapter of the women of color advancing peace and security and professor of political science and international relations at pepperdine university. back with me onset, msnbc political contributor ben rhodes, former deputy national security advisor and john heilemann, the executive editor of the recount, the host of the hell and high water podcast and an msnbc national affairs analyst. director brennan, i think ned price said on this program yesterday that -- and jeremy

bash as well -- that the intelligence community nailed it. you know, they got it spot on. matt bradley with a little more nuanced analysis of the intelligence, but tragically, the intelligence was spot on, and i wonder if you can just elaborate on -- and as matt bradley was reporting, i was thinking that the weekend before the world shut down for covid, i was on the subway, not licking the seats, but i may as well have been, taking my son to a birthday party, and i -- i can understand whatever this part of the brain is that can't accept something to horrible, that life is going to change completely, but that was this invisible thing and i wonder if you can just talk to me about your understanding of the ukrainian people and what seems to have taken the civilian population very much by surprise. >> well, nicole, as you pointed out, i think the u.s. intelligence community did an excellent job, because they have very good sources, human, technical and others, that gave

themming insight into the extensive preparations and planning that went into this russian invasion, so they could see all of that. they tried to release as much as possible and i give them credit and the biden administration credit for releasing that. from the ukrainian people's perspective, i think they always looked at vladimir putin as the kwichlt of a cold, calculating russian chess player who would make his moves based on his assessment of the strengths and weaknesses and limitations of his adversaries and not to do something as mad as this, which, you know, to have this wanton invasion and slaughter going on in ukraine. it's so unprecedented from the standpoint of, putin has never done something like this before. however, as we look at putin and we see now that he really reflects this very right-wing ideological base within russia, it's the equivalent of russia first, russia first, and this is putin's war that he has decided to prosecute, and you know, i think it's a combination of, he has now his own prism of looking

at the world and ukraine, but also, i think he has badly miscalculated because i don't think he has anticipated the consequences and the reaction, both inside ukraine where nationalism runs strong and deep, and so i do believe that what we're going to be seeing in the coming days and weeks is going to be fierce, fierce ukrainian resistance to this, and even though the ukrainian people, i think, were surprised and shocked by this, i think they are going to demonstrate the resilience of a national force basically that is going to oppose this russian effort to subjugate and occupy their country. >> and if you were in one of your former roles and looking at the images coming out of russian cities of russians, at great peril to themselves, not just physically and from a security standpoint, but reputationally and criminally, would you be surprised by the resistance that putin's war in ukraine has met in his own country?

>> well, i think you see that opposition within the cities. that's where the educated, the elite, the people who are not in line with putin's view of the world and his actions, and i think we're going to be seeing more of that in the coming days and weeks because there will be a fair amount of russian casualties that will be going back. it will have resonance inside that country and also since it's not going as well as or quickly as vladimir putin wanted, he's going to start to blame people. that's that authoritarian leaders do. there's a paranoia that surrounds them and he's going to be looking at his military generals and intelligence security officials, because i think it was their assessments and then his assessment that this was going to go, maybe, more smoothly than it has and so therefore, i think we have to be very mindful that we could be seeing additional cracks and fissures inside of russia on the streets of st. petersburg, moscow and other large cities but also within that broader circle of individuals within the

russian government. >> director brennan, is putin -- it's hard to ask this question this way, but is he more dangerous if the offensive in ukraine doesn't go as he'd intended and the reception in his own country is, at best, mixed but very polarized? >> i believe he is. i think his political fortunes are tied to how this whole initiative turns out. and if he sees that it's not going his way and the tide is turning against him, i think as a lot of these authoritarian leaders do, they will opt for desperate measures, and so i am very concerned about escalatory spiral, not just in ukraine in terms of the thousands and thousands of potential deaths among ukrainian citizens but what he might decide to do in terms of testing nato's mettle. we're looking at four countries that border ukraine that belong

to the nato family, and you know, the air space is right there next to one another. the potential for miscalculation, and so how far is he going to go to continue to press what he believes is what he needs is a reordering of the east-west geostrategic balance and i do not think he is going to recoil as a result of some of this ukrainian resistance that clearly is coming to -- into play. >> i want to bring nola into the conversation but i need to follow up with one more question. i mean, what are the scenarios that are being briefed, would you guess, to president biden about what that could look like? >> well, i think we can no longer assume that certain options are off the table for vladimir putin, and i think we need to be thinking, you know, there can't be a failure of imagination here. what might he opt to do? i think we have to be prepared

for all those contingencies, all the way up to potential existential confrontation between nato and russia. hopefully it's not going to get to that point, but again, he has decided to go down this course and is not an easy reversal for him, because he is playing to his domestic constituency as well as the international stage, and a leader like putin doesn't want to lose face and therefore how he's going to recover, if there are going to be continued setbacks, not only on the military battlefield but also on the economic and financial front, so i do think he has miscalculated, based on either his perception alone or the advice that he is getting from those sycophantic advisors that he has surrounding him. >> it's a daunting picture, i have to catch my breath. nola, i'm going to ask you to pick up on these threads but i would also like to ask you about the administration and our allies, very united front and response. just give me your analysis of

sort of the pros and the limitations of how we have responded so far to what putin has done in ukraine. >> well, i will say one pro definitely is the way that our security alliances have held up. you know, there are people who are intent on making this seem like this is somehow a mistake of the biden administration not being strong. i think -- i don't agree with that at all. i think that in the face of everything that has happened to our country domestically, and for the biden administration to be able to go out into the world and say, hey, we are restoring our partnerships and relationships that you can trust us, that is a huge, huge accomplishment. in terms of what could we do differently, what did we not do the best, well, it depends on who you're asking, and there are many people asking why aren't we physically in ukraine? why can we not physically help

ukrainians? they're fighting alone. ukrainians are also saying they're fighting alone, and that is a very long answer to a very complicated question, but at the end of the day, i think that the way in which the world has rallied around this problem is, by far, the largest achievement, and i just wish that the ukrainian people didn't have to pay such a large and physical cost for the -- what i see as imperial motives of vladimir putin. nothing about his actions right now are what we regard in international relations as rational. there's nothing rational about the choices that he is making right now as a leader. >> let me show all of you something that secretary hillary clinton said this morning on "morning joe." >> i think it's time for what's left of the republican party that has any common sense, not just to say, okay, go help defend ukraine against putin, but to stand against those

people in politics and government, in the media and elsewhere in our own country who are literally giving aid and comfort to an enemy of freedom and democracy. >> so, john, i know you and the good folks at "the recount" created a mash of what she's talking about. this is trump -- i don't even know whose minion anymore. so this is trump, tucker carlson, and pompeo. >> putin played this almost like a symphony conductor. they have a president. we don't. >> do you consider vladimir putin a shrewd or reckless leader overall? >> he is very savvy, very shrewd, elegantly sophisticated. i have enormous respect for him. i've been kritzed for saying that. >> putin is now saying it's independent, a large section of ukraine. i said, how smart is that. this is genius. you got to say, that's pretty savvy. >> why is it disloyal to side with russia but loyal to side with ukraine?

is he teaching my children to embrace racial discrimination? is he making fentanyl? is he trying to snuff out christianity? does he eat dogs? no. vladimir putin didn't do any of that. so, why does permanent washington hate him so much? >> that wasn't a reel from fox news. >> this is -- we labeled that as a jokey way, those are the artsy audition tapes for those four people, although at the end, you get to see that, in that two box, that tucker is actually on rt in addition to being on fox news. that's what the -- >> simulcasts by the end of the week. >> the most popular man in cable news is someone whose words about vladimir putin play unedited, unexpurgated, just in simulcast now on rt when he is singing the praises of vladimir putin, and i want to -- i mean, we could talk about this in a million different ways, but here's the thing that it links back to. john brennan did not want to say

the words i'm going to say. we talked about them on the set yesterday, which is nukes. we talked about nuclear weapons. vladimir putin came out the other day, basically threatened the west and said, i have nuclear weapons, remember that, and we talked about the french foreign minister was asked, do you take this as a threat? the french foreign minister says, yes, it's a threat and we're nuclear armed too so we have nuclear saber rattling between a foreign minister in nato and vladimir putin, and at that moment, when vladimir putin is invoking the nuclear threat over ukraine, that's what those four and others in the republican party are saying. in addition to, obviously, the dead on the ground in kyiv, all of the human suffering we're witnessing, which is all horrible enough, but on top of that, these guys, the former secretary of state, mike pompeo, the former president of the united states, oh, he's a genius, he's shrewd, so smart as he threatens the west with nuclear annihilation. i mean, it's -- i would say these words, they come out of my mouth, they're all true and as they come out of my mouth, i

look at them and go, that can't really be the world we live in. but that's the world we live in. and you know who likes that best of all? vladimir putin. he sees that as the end point of five years of misinformation, disinformation, dividing americans among themselves and poisoning the republican party, helping donald trump get elected. he now sits over there in the greatest propaganda coup you could ever have right now in his country to say, look, donald trump thinks i'm smart. mike pompeo says i'm shrewd. the most popular person on american cable, we can run him on rt. i mean, ben earlier talked about what's in putin's head. what's in his head is, he's fought four wars, small ones, and won them all. he fought a really big war, the information war in america, and he won that too. why does the guy think he can win this war? because every war he fights he's won, including a big one on our domestic soil. >> my question for you, ben, is it viewed as an end point? at least two of those guys plan to run for president in 2024, could lift these brutal

sanctions. >> well, part of what i think putin might have been counting on, leading into the last election, is that donald trump was going to withdraw from nato. >> he wanted to. >> he wanted to. and look, if the u.s. is not in nato, there is no nato. we are the predominant muscle and command and control force of nato. i think the other thing that we have to recognize here is it's not just kind of casual opinions for tucker carlson and donald trump. they share an ideology, you know, vladimir putin has been at the vanguard of an ethno-nationalist authoritarian ideology that is, yes, about claiming and holding power, but it's also about, you know, essentially a throwback to kind of a blood and soil nationalism. russia first, america first. they are a part of a trend that is not just in russia, that is not just in the united states, that is global. you have the european far right that has been ascendant. you have all manner of far-right and nationalist movements around

the world so what we are seeing in ukraine is the most dramatic manifestation of a lesson we've learned again and again from history. that ideology leads inexorably to war. it led to two really big wars in europe that were supposed to have woken us up, that we don't tolerate that garbage, not just overseas but here in this country, and i think we became so numb to the fact that this is normal. it's not normal that the former president of the united states called vladimir putin a genius on the eve of him launching the largest invasion in europe since hitler invaded poland. >> it had commenced. it was on the laura ingraham program, which is in the 10:00 hour. >> his impulse is to call up and talk more about his buddy. >> one point you alluded to just now, but you can't put too fine a point on it. donald trump, mike pompeo, the guys -- >> the tucker carlson in there too. >> the guy from missouri with the little bird hands, josh

hawley, you know, ted cruz, ron desantis down at cpac, none of those people -- they are not praising putin, i'll be clear, cruz or desantis, but they're not attacking him. they're on stage at cpac with the republicans talking about the culture war, giving tacit permission to this. all of them are the 2024 republican political -- the front runners for the next republican nominee, and your point has been notice that the pro-putin wing is the wing that consists of people who are trying to -- who are likely next republican nominee in the party, and it's not a coincidence that's the case, right? and so, when putin advances these aims, he's also trying to do something, weaken joe biden, and pave the way for any one of them who he thinks all of them will be nicer to him than joe biden is. >> and i mean, director brennan, it is a point that was made to me by a former prosecutor who said, you know, forget about conduct that would have to be investigated by any sort of special counsel.

this is conduct that happens in full view. this is election interference innovated eight years after 2016, and it is clear who vladimir putin would want to help. the party, not just that loves him, that flatters him, that praises him, we know how much he likes that. it is the party that benefits by his election interference. >> yes, well, the comments of donald trump, mike pompeo, tucker carlson, and others of their ilk are utterly despicable and should be condemned by anyone with a conscience right now, especially as we see the wanton slaughter of ukrainian citizens at putin's direction. this is putin's war. he is responsible for this, and the more platitudes that are heaped his way, first of all, it emboldens him, but second of all, i think it reflects so badly on this country that we have a former president, a former secretary of state, a

former director of cia who is saying these things at this crucial time so i think it's critically important that we try to put out as much true information as possible and this is where the information operations and disinformation operations are really having an impact, unfortunately, in terms of attitudes and views around the globe, and the more that there can be truthfulness coming out from political leaders, as opposed to these efforts, that real dishonest speak which i see more and more of each day, it's appalling. >> an ex-president who withheld critical military aid from the ukrainians. no one's going anywhere. when we come back, the plight of the ukrainians. while many are trying to flee by the thousands to seek refuge across the border in poland, otherwise are taking up arms and they remain in ukraine, committed to fighting for their country. and later, two years to the day that then presidential candidate, now president joe biden, promised to nominate a black woman to the united states supreme court, today, he made good on that promise.

much more on the historic nomination of judge ketanji brown jackson later in the program. "deadline white house" continues after a quick brake. program. "deadline white house" continues after a quick brake.ak. ak supreme court, today, he made supreme court, today, he made

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i hope i will not use it. but in case, i will get prepared. >> a 28-year-old member of ukraine's parliament with nbc's erin mclaughlin earlier today in kyiv, and the ak-47 the government gave him. he's going to go to google. it has ordered all 18 to 60-year-old ukrainian men to stay in the country and fight the russian troops, even as their families try to move towards safety in the west. he said there, i didn't want to know how to use it, but putin made us. our nbc colleague, kelly cobiella, reporting from the border with poland that two ukrainian brothers who are crossing back into ukraine from poland to fight for their country. listen to them. >> i go to home, my family. >> reporter: are you going back to fight? >> yes, of course. like that. >> reporter: why? so many people are leaving, and you're going in. >> i know, i know. >> reporter: why go back?

>> but this my country. i love ukraine. >> we're back with john brennan, nola haynes, ben rhodes and john heilemann. i just keep coming back to this question. what did putin miss about this country, nola, and its people, who even from the safety of poland are going back in to fight for their country and even someone who's never touched an ak-47, clearly hasn't spent time in some states in our south, is going to go to the internet and figure out how to use it to fight for his country. >> you know, just because putin doesn't respect ukraine as a sovereign nation, which it is, because putin doesn't, you know, believe that ukraine should be its own culture, should have its own language, they do, and they should. it's a sovereign country. they can do whatever it is that they want to do. but you know, i've been

referring to the ambassador, the kenyan ambassador's speech the other day at the u.n. and it was such an important analysis that he lent in terms of how the engine of colonialism and, like, the project of empire building, what that looks like, and when you do not value a people as being people, when you do not value their territory, their culture, and their history, you're not valuing, you know, their pride. you're not valuing their skill sets and the fact that they're going to stay and fight for their country. i think that is part of the personality flaws when you are dealing with a dictator who has foolish tendencies. this is a problem. you know, he did not factor in that ukrainians would stay and fight for ukraine. >> ben, we have some video from an interview that we talked about at the top of the last hour that you did today.

let me play it and then you can explain to anyone that missed that conversation. >> what would you say to them, to our governments, to the u.s. government and european governments -- >> i think there's an explosion. sorry, i think i have to hide. at least in the bathroom where there is no windows. >> you just tell me when you're okay or if you need to go. >> it was one explosion. i don't know if it -- and there is no sound of warning to go to the bomb shelter. we couldn't get a chance to go and report from the streets because, like, every two hours, there is a warning to go to the bomb shelter.

literally, barely possible to report right now for journalists, you know? >> ben, explain who that was and what that interview was about. >> so, it's a young ukrainian journalist in kyiv, and as i was talking to her, there was a large explosion by the window, and instead of going right to the bomb shelter, she went into the bathroom to finish the interview, and she said, i'm a journalist, i want to do my job. and you know, she painted obviously a very grim picture as we talked about of kyiv but i also asked her about this question of resistance and what we're seeing from the ukrainian people, and she said, absolutely people here are going to fight. she said very plainly, we do not want to be a part of russia. and they may have changed this country forever with what they've done, but we never want to be a part of russia. we don't want to live as russians. that's not who we are. we're ukrainian. and i think it reflects a mindset that you see permeating everywhere from ordinary people to soldiers to president zelenskyy. it is clear that this country is coming together to resist at the gravest hour and they know the

stakes of where they are. they know the stakes of what vladimir putin has unleashed upon them, but i think the reality we've seen is that they are a distinct people with their own national identity, their own language, their own history, and they do not accept vladimir putin's version of history, and whatever happens here, putin has only strengthened that identity. since 2014, she also said to me, ukrainians have gotten even more determined to defend their democracy, to defend their sovereignty, and the reality is that however this goes, years from now, when vladimir putin is no longer with us, there will be squares across ukraine named for president zelenskyy, not vladimir putin. >> director brennan, play this forward for me. i mean, what are you watching in the next 12 to 24 to 48 hours? >> well, it's heart-wrenching to watch this footage and to listen to these ukrainian civilians talking about the act of resistance that is going to, i

think, thrive in the coming days and weeks ahead. i do think that russia, putin is probably going to unleash, you know, the full brunt of the russian military against the ukrainian military, and it will degrade the ukrainian military, destroy a lot of it. and at some point, it's going to transition from this active military, military confrontation, into a very active insurgency. if putin tries to take large cities like kyiv and others, the ukrainian people are not going to allow themselves to be subjugated. it is quite clear. they are a strong and proud people, and they're going to actively resist this war crime that vladimir putin is responsible for perpetrating upon an independent sovereign state. and so therefore, i think that the more that we can rally in support of the ukrainian people, providing the type of support that is necessary in order for them to maintain this type of resistance, i think if they can keep it going, i think it's

going to get increasingly difficult and uncomfortable for vladimir putin in russia, continuing this mass, mass madness that i think he has now unleashed. >> director john brennan, nola haynes, and ben rhodes, thank you so much for spending time with us today. john sticks around. an historic day at the white house. we will have much more on the groundbreaking nomination of judge ketanji brown jackson to the united states supreme court. that story's next. the united states supreme court. that story's next.

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it was my father who started me on this path when i was a child, as the president mentioned. my father made the fateful decision to transition from his job as a public high school history teacher and go to law school. some of my earliest memories are of him sitting at the kitchen table, reading his law books. i watched him study, and he became my first professional role model. >> from a 4-year-old watching her father read law school books, all the way up to the united states supreme court, the highest court in the land. what a story. what a journey. what a person judge ketanji brown jackson officially nominated today. she will become the first black woman to serve as the supreme court justice. joining our conversation, fatima, president and ceo of the

national women's law center and the reverend al sharpton, host of msnbc's "politics nation" and the president of the national action network. fatima, we have had so many conversations, i have never seen you smile like that. tell me what this announcement -- this is a remarkable speech, a remarkably qualified judge, someone with bipartisan support, not too long ago, which is a big, big deal in today's washington, d.c. what were your thoughts as you watched her today? >> well, i have to begin by saying i was emotional watching her. this is a big deal. i'm not sure that i understood that i would see this happen in my lifetime, and i was on a million text threads today with so many friends who were saying the same, that the emotion is real, but also just watching her today, you're reminded, this is someone who's not just qualified, who's overqualified, who has exceptional credentials, and who has been confirmed three times by the senate, including just last summer, and so it's also exciting because you can

see that this will be a reality. she will be our next supreme court justice. >> reverend sharpton, a huge day for the president as well. a promise made, a promise kept. your thoughts? >> i think it was a huge day. president biden had said when he was running that if he were given the opportunity to appoint someone to the court, he would appoint a black woman. and some of us challenged him to say, well, since you said you were going to have a woman as a vice president, why don't you have that as a black woman as well? you may not get a seat. well, today, he's done both. he's given us a black woman vice president and nominated a black woman to the supreme court. so, it's a huge day to the base that has been, in many ways, disappointed the senate did not pass the voting rights bill or the george floyd bill as of yet. and i must say that as i watched this, as you know, nicole, when i was 18 years old, i was one of

the youth directors at shirley chisholm's campaign for president and to see a black woman going to the supreme court and a black woman vice president standing there, and i think about the days where shirley chisholm had to face misogyny even among black leadership, it was a day that meant a lot to me. also, i think that what's not raised enough is that judge jackson has a background of doing work for defendants as she has a most extensive defense lawyer background that we've seen since thurgood marshall and the sensitivity of someone in the room that does not only have a prosecutorial background, i think, is something that will add to a lot of the discussion between the justices, because when you talk about defendants' rights and things from their point of view, we now have someone in the room that has worked in that area that usually is not in the room. >> fatima, one of the

conversations that we pull you into on this show almost every day is this court's commitment to overturning roe vs. wade. now, obviously, this seat doesn't change the ideological make-up, but tell me how you think judge ketanji brown jackson changes the conversations on the court. >> well, if this year has taught us anything, it's really that courts matter and who is on the court matters, and so in many ways, we're thinking about this nomination as important for today and as important for the next generation. 30 years ago, when i think about justice thomas, he was writing decisions in the minority, the deep minority, often by himself, maybe with justice scalia, and so soon to be justice jackson will have decades to shape what the court looks like, but she

also may enter the court right as they will have decided around roe. and i think that matters. it matters in terms of how she will be perceived, but it matters in terms of when we think about this court and what is needed, i think that contrast is going to be really, really important. >> you know, rev, something i wondered today, we talk a lot about the low esteem in which the united states supreme court is held. i think just around 40% of americans, according to gallup's most recent poll, approve of the u.s. supreme court. it's down 20 points in 20 years. i wonder if you think that the chief justice or people close to him might make it clear that, i mean, the democrats don't need any republicans to confirm her to the court, but if you think the court might think it's good for the institution to at least have the same bipartisan support for her in this role as it had

just a year ago for her current seat. >> i think that the institution does need that. i think that the chief justice and others do need that, because then, we begin to start to say to the american american public that the supreme court is not just a partisan maneuver for whoever is in charge. they're going to lead that way. if there's bipartisan support it begins a slow walk back toward the court being above partisan bickering and making decisions that we would want to believe, whether we do or not is another issue. it's not based on putting them into the court and just some

skin in long black robes. you can't get bipartisan support for her, then when and how are you going to get it? so i think in many ways we're going to look and say wait a minute have we become so partisan and so divided you can't vote for somebody you just voted for? >> yeah, it is certainly the question of the hour. thank you both so much for spending some time with us on this today. quick break for us. john and i will be right back. ks john and i will be right back. thanks to realtor.com's home alerts we were able to see the newest homes on the market, super fast.

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we're back. you started the week in this chair and i asked you to come back and finish the week with me. first on the president's day. >> you were saying in the last segment joe biden made this promise. she is certainly going to be confirmed and that's going to be great. i keep going back to what you were saying apoort from the fact it's obviously important to see a qualified african american female justice on the court, it seems like she's so committed to being out in schools and emication and building up the image of the court and trying to restore it to its proper place. it's taken such a beating and i think she'd be able to help that recovery for the court. >> what's weird is that today on a normal day that would have been our top story. but because of events it wasn't. >> because the fact we're in the middle of most significant land

war in europe since world war ii, and that's been our week. here we started the beginning of the week oh, my god, this is going to happen. the thing that keeps ringing in my ears which is that the dangers of the failure of imagination, right, that we all kind of even though all the intelligence said putin was going to do what he did, everyone, us, so many people around the world, people in kyiv were like it couldn't happen, in the same way a lot of us couldn't imagine donald trump becoming elected in 2016, terrible things happen when we don't stretch our minds to imagine them and we're caught unaware. but the other thing is i started out this show today saying things are going to get worse, the trajectory is getting worse and worse, more death, more horror. but we've got 50 odd cities in russia where there are protests. people are doing heroic things. the fighters in ukraine.

we should allow ourselves to imagine maybe there's a possibility to imagine. >> maybe it's putin's failure of imagination. thank you so much for helming the show at the beginning of the week and spending the last two days with me. >> as tough as this week was, i'll help you out any time you want. >> the chair is yours. we'll be back after a quick break. s yours. we'll be back after a quick break.

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because that's the last thing they need you to be. you don't have to save the day. you just have to navigate the world so that a foster child isn't doing it solo. you just have to stand up for a kid who isn't fluent in bureaucracy, or maybe not in their own emotions. so show up, however you can, for the foster kids who need it most— at helpfosterchildren.com thank you so very much for letting us into your homes during these truly extraordinary times. we're grateful. "the beat" with ari melber starts right now. >> thank you so much. our coverage continues as we track two major stories. president biden making history today and breaking a barrier as he nominates the first black woman ever to the supreme court. it is a momentous development, and we have special guests live with their first reaction right