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of no payments for 18 months. good day to all of you from msnbc world headquarters in new york. welcome to alex witt reports. we're beginning with breaking news. thousands of people around the world are taking to the streets today to protest against russia's aggression, and in st. petersburg, russia, anti-war protesters were arrested today, although we saw some protesters still out on the street just this last hour. also new this hour, growing concern for civilians caught off guard by russia's offensive. the u.n. is reporting 150,000 people have already crossed borders into romania, hungary, slovakia and moldova. people are seeking out any means of transportation out of kyiv and other cities that are under attack. and another 100,000 people are displaced inside ukraine.

they're taking shelter as you see there in subway systems and any other underground protected spaces. >> it's very serious, i mean, obviously, families are backed up for 25, 29 hours in some places. the numbers coming over are increasing by 30%, 40%, 50% every day. and it stems from putin's increasing brutality and the way he has sent missiles and shell fire and tanks into civilian centers. >> european countries are now saying they will join the u.s. to send more weapons to the region. italy is now deploying fighter jets to romania. germany has pledged to send ukraine more anti-tank weapons and stinger missiles. spain is sending humanitarian aid to border countries. they're taking in refugees. monitoring the very latest for us this hour, a team of our reporters, producers and videographers overseas in ukraine, moscow and poland and of course stateside here in

washington as we welcome you all, first to matt bradley in eastern ukraine. let's get an update on the latest there. >> reporter: yeah, i mean, the situation here, we're not even -- i've been here about 24 hours, alex. i haven't heard bombardments like i did in kharkiv to the north of here but the city is still incredibly tense and i think that goes for the whole rest of the country. one of the things you notice when you're going around the city is that there are military forces just deployed on every single street corner and if you're a young man or not so young, anywhere between the ages of 18 and 60, you could be stopped, frisked, and you could be made to see your i.d. now, this is interesting because they are forcibly conscripting men off the streets. they will press gang you into joining the military, training you and giving you a gun. that's how desperate the situation is. it's one of the reasons why we don't see people walking around, and i should say, i need to caution, a lot of men are joining voluntarily. they are just going and they are picking up a gun themselves. but those who aren't can expect

to be asked to and if they say no, they can expect to be forced to. another thing that we're seeing is just a lot of people taking matters into their own hands, making molotov cocktails, getting together, training women and men how to make molotov cocktails, how to make homemade weapons for sabotage and this is setting the stage for an extended fight in which civilians become involved. we saw that back in 2014. another thing that people are doing that's kind of interesting is when you're going around on the streets or the highways and my colleague, richard engel, drove up here from the southeast, he was saying that you were seeing people who were walking around pulling down street signs because they don't want the russians to be able to know their way around. they want to confuse them. so only locals will be able to know their way around so you'll see people tearing down street signs all over the place, not just here in dnipro. so again, the situation is really tense. i haven't made it outside, but my colleagues have, and they said that they were stopped by

civilians who announced themselves as security. one of the men, his hands were shaking as he was demanding i.d. and demanding to search our vehicles. so, again, they made our security consultant put his hands on the dashboard of the car while they searched the car. it is extremely tense here. but i also, alex, want to bring you some of the latest breaking news. we heard from germany, whose chancellor, olaf scholz, has been widely pilloried as the weakest link in nato, especially compared to his predecessor, angela merkel, who famously stood up to putin during the 2014 crisis, last time russia invaded this country and olaf scholz was so reluctant to cancel that nord stream pipeline and i was very reluctant to even use the words, nord stream pipeline, which was kind of bizarre as far as a lot of other western allies were concerned. and he wasn't going to give lethal aid. now, what he said at the time, what other german politicians said was that historically, it's

not a good look because of the fights that germany has had, that nazi germany has had with russia and because of the conflict between east and west germany throughout the cold war. now ever since the fighting has actually picked up on the ground, mr. scholz has definitely changed his mind. i used to be they were only going to give 5,000 helmets and germany was widely pilloried for that, mocked for just giving helmets. now they're switching to lethal aid. they have agreed to give 1,000 anti-tank weapons and 500 stinger missiles that are going to the front line. >> wow. okay. that is a significant uptick from those helmets earlier. thank you so much, matt bradley, for that detail. let's go from there now to nbc's keir simmons in moscow. keir, we know there have been the anti-war protests in st. petersburg today. what are you hearing about them and what is the message from these protesters and also from leaders at the kremlin? >> reporter: well, alex, we are hearing tonight that there have been more than 400 arrests at

those protests here in moscow and st. petersburg and multiple cities today, that adds to the thousands of arrests across russia. alex, you know, this is an autocracy. this is president putin's russia so it's important not to get ahead of ourselves, but he is now fighting this war in ukraine on multiple fronts outside of ukraine, and i'm going to look down because there are so many developments that we are tracking today. just the latest. roman abramovich, the oligarch close to president putin, just in the last few minutes, actually, has announced that he is handing the chelsea soccer club, that world famous club, in to stewardship of trustees. he says he's doing it currently, but that is just one example of how the picture for multiple russians and russian society is shifting, it seems, dramatically, so just to go through some more. 200 journalists here in russia signed a petition calling for

peace. a lawmaker who voted just this week in favor of -- for president putin's actions, now saying, i didn't vote for kyiv to be bombed. there is a petition as well from directors, including the director of the world famous bolshoi theater, saying, we want peace, and conversely, meanwhile, here in russia, facebook and twitter are being restricted. i suspect the fact that that seems to be this growing resistance to president putin's plans in ukraine may be part of the reason why we are seeing this. so there are signs not just in the protests but in many parts of the russian society, if you like, that people are deeply unhappy. alex, children of oligarchs, including, according to reports,

roman abrahamovich's daughter and even one child of a russian official, reportedly posting on social media their opposition to the war in ukraine. we've said it again and again in the past few days, just pointed out the deep connections between russians and ukrainians, so even if president putin switches off social media, there are millions of russians who are -- will know people in ukraine, will know people in kyiv, will be hearing about what's happening, despite what's being said on russian television where they're just going over history, kind of propagandizing, going over the past few years and trying to make the justification for what's happening. another fascinating thing that happened today, the russian government and ministry of defense coming out and saying, we paused. we paused the campaign against kyiv for around 24 hours because we thought there would be negotiations. now, that is not what is being -- what we're seeing on the ground, but i think it

suggests that the kremlin is concerned that their campaign is going slowly, and i would say something else too. i think from talking to people who know the kremlin well, there is concern too, and they do say this publicly, that they want to try to limit casualties at this stage anyway because they know and they fear the impact that will have on russian public opinion. now, clearly, that could change and there are people dying, but i just want to give a picture of how -- president putin's support seems to be shakier than i have seen it in russia for a very long time. he does have a lot of support here. but there do appear to be multiple tipping points, including what matt was talking about there, with european governments and capitals turning against president putin even viktor orban's hungary supporting russia being removed from s.w.i.f.t., and i'll finish

with one anecdote, alex. we're hearing from russian businesses that they are very worried now about russia being evicted from s.w.i.f.t., that payment system. hotels contacting guests to ask them to pay now because they're worried about whether the payments will go through later. a lot appears to be shifting. again, what i said at the beginning, this is president putin's russia. it is an autocracy. we don't want to get ahead of ourselves, but there are a lot of people very worried here in russia tonight. >> and there's good reason for them to be, because as you know, the discussions about putting s.w.i.f.t. on the table as a sanctioning mechanism are under way right now. let me ask you quickly, these oligarchs, abrahamovich, for example, could they put pressure on putin to stop this because it's not benefitting them. >> my understanding from one person who knows what happened is that president putin gathered business leaders together, i think yesterday, perhaps the day

before, and that he told them on camera, while i have no choice but to do this, when the camera was switched off, apparently he told them, don't think that you won't do business with the sanctioned banks and businesses here in russia because you might be punished. if you try and do that, i will punish you, and that story gives you a picture that there is not an oligarch or a business leader here in russia who is not there simply because president putin wants them to be there. so you can't underestimate his control. he has people who are friends from kgb days, decades back, in multiple senior positions across russian business. that being said, clearly, the pressure is having an effect, and i do think that we shouldn't underestimate the pressure of the russian people seeing kyiv, an onslaught on kyiv and the connections that there are here in russia with ukraine and what

impact that might be having. i'll just tell you one more story. i spoke to a official in the russian foreign ministry just yesterday, and she told me, i have friends and family in ukraine. so, just inside the government, remember, there will be officials who have loved ones and connections in ukraine. now, some of them will be russian-speaking in parts of ukraine that have been calling for independence, clearly, but many won't be. so, again, president putin, under a lot of pressure tonight. >> the picture you're painting there, it's like president putin is a general with his loyal lieutenants surrounded around them but there may be some fissures being created. thank you so much, keir. as russian forces are advancing more than 100,000 ukrainians have fled to poland and that is where we find nbc's kelly cobiella. welcome to you. what are you hearing from all these refugees coming across the

border? >> reporter: yeah, alex, we've seen the numbers increase again today. the only reason we're not seeing a huge volume of people coming in all at once is because the ukrainian officials and people on the ukrainian side simply can't handle the volume of people wanting to get out of the country. we're talking about lines that people standing in line, women and children, in a line that stretches a mile long if not longer, just waiting to get their documents processed so that they can go to the next step and show those documents to the polish border patrol, who are -- say they're letting them in within seconds. really, the hold-up is on the ukrainian side because so many people are desperate to get out. we spoke to one woman who got out with a couple of her children, a couple of days ago, and she's now being waiting ever since for her 72-year-old mother to get across. she said she felt like they had to get out because of her

mother's age and because of the concern about what's happening now in western ukraine, where there are fears that the russians could advance or could carry out attacks there. but she said she was just frustrated at not being able to get her mother out. take a listen to what she told us today. >> translator: she's saying they are really grateful for polish help because they are treated them good on the border, but on the ukrainian side, there was very bad and ukrainian guards said to her mom -- [ speaking foreign language ]. >> translator: why? why you are going there to poland? >> your 72-year-old other, they asked this?

>> reporter: as we've been reporting over the past couple of days, men are not being -- fighting age men are not being allowed over the border. there is a conscription in ukraine. there's martial law. those men are being brought in to fight as matt bradley pointed out just a little bit earlier. but there's also this frustration among women and children that they're not -- they're waiting so incredibly long to get over the border as well, and we saw these very emotional reunions on the polish side of the border today with women hugging their friends and relatives in poland, but interestingly, alex, not everyone is trying to get out. we are also seeing people going back in. we saw a group of about 20 men who were very clearly fighting age men and they were all headed straight for that border crossing to go back and fight. we spoke to some of them yesterday about how they were so determined to pick up arms for

their country and defend ukraine, and also today, we talked to a young woman, probably in her 20s, and she was loaded down with bags of supplies, and she said she was going back because her husband is going to fight and she wanted to see him. before he left. alex? >> that is just heartbreaking, knowing what lies ahead potentially for her husband. anyway, kelly cobiella in poland, thank you so much. joining me right now is massachusetts congressman seth moulton, a democratic member of the house budget, armed services and transportation and infrastructure committees. he's also a marine veteran who served four tours in iraq. a good friend to us. always good to have you here and your voice on the show. thank you for joining us. i'm curious, congressman, your assessment of how things are playing out in ukraine, and do you expect russia's attacks will expand beyond ukraine? what is a threshold for which that could happen? >> well, first of all, let's just assess the situation. i mean, russia has made

remarkable progress to be within 20 miles of the capital on day two of their invasion. but now they're running into trouble, and as i can tell you from experience, urban warfare is some of the toughest. it's much easier to defend in urban territory, in a city, than attack. and the russians are going to have a really rough next week as they try to actually topple the capital city and other cities around the country. now, in terms of what happens next, i mean, this is the question that should be on everybody's minds because if there's one lesson that we have to take from putin's military adventures over the last decade, is that we cannot expect him to stop here. we've naively assumed that in the past. always been wrong. and now, he is within inches of a nato country. poland is a nato country with american troops, thousands of them, stationed there. if he attacks a nato country, americans are going to fight and die. that's how high the stakes are right now in ukraine. >> couple of questions from that

front. surely vladimir putin is aware that american forces are there in poland. is there any calculus that's rooted in logic that you think he would try to take on the united states, mano a mano in combat? >> well, alex, i hate to break it to you but i'm not a putin whisperer. this is very hard to determine. i've talked to a lot of experts, especially last weekend at the munich security conference who have worked directly with putin, who try to understand his mindset. one of the things that's been happening over the last year is vladimir putin is deathly afraid of covid, and so he has not been meeting with people, even some of his closest advisors, he's had very limited contact, so he seems to be truly living in his own world, believing his own propaganda, including this warped view of history that says that he is righteous in invading a sovereign country that doesn't want to be invaded. and we really don't know exactly

what his end game is here. we don't know what he plans to do next. so that's one of the things that makes this so dangerous and why it's important that not only are nato allies standing together today but that we're prepared for what might come next, that we strengthen nato, that nato doesn't look like it did ten years ago in the next ten weeks. >> you heard kelly cobiella, who preceded you in this story of that woman who was taking supplies back to her husband, who was returning, and in fact, as you know, civilians between the ages of 18 and 60 have been called upon to take up arms and defend their country of ukraine. from your military experience, your discussion about street-by-street combat, how it is easier to defend than attack, explain that. try to describe that to us, what this man may be facing. >> sure. so, the basic scenario, as you can imagine, if you're defending a building, you're defending a city, you have placement in a

building, you're hiding very well disguised. you can shoot very easily troops coming down the street. now if you put yourself in the russians' shoes, they're walking down the street, they have no idea where the next gunshot is going to come from. they have to face a choice as, get shot at, do they level a building, potentially kill a lot of civilians and maybe make more enemies than they kill because people will be so angry at them, or do they take casualties as they try to figure out where that single sniper is? i hope that paints the picture of why it's easier to defend a city than it is to attack it. and although of course you want to have military trained troops defending a city, there's a lot that civilians can do. imagine a civilian just throwing a molotov cocktail out an apartment window five stories up on a group of russian troops below, taking a bunch of casualties, what do they do? he goes to the next room, he scatters down the stairs, he

goes to another building, they can't even find him. that's why this is going to be so difficult for russia in the next few weeks, and i think a lot of russian -- well, let's just say vladimir putin, maybe not other russian leaders, but certainly vladimir putin just underestimates how strong the ukrainian psyche is, how willing they are to fight. i mean, i don't think that he understands the power of freedom and liberty. what these people know and what they're defending. he's someone who's an autocrat. he's afraid of freedom and democracy. i also don't think he understands it. >> how could he? i mean, it's clearly not in his vernacular. let's talk about one of the most remarkable developments and that is the way that president zelenskyy refuses to accept american offers to evacuate him. he refuses to leave. talk about how you think that is impacting morale, how important that is and the effect that has on the public and the military and those public citizens that

have become, in essence, a citizen military. >> i mean, in terms of morale, i can't imagine anything more important, short of an ally coming in and bombing the russian troops. the fact that their leader is willing to stay and fight, and he said very publicly, i will die before i leave. that's got to mean so much to the troops on the front lines, you know, imagine being an 18-year-old soldier, very little training, barely out of high school, you're fighting the russian army. a superpower, right? and that's a scary prospect. but when the president of your country says, i'm with you. i'm standing shoulder-to-shoulder, not just back in some room in the capital saying, i support you. i'm willing to fight alongside you. that means so much. and it doesn't surprise me that you see these stories, as you just reported, of ukrainian men coming back, going back across

the border to go and fight, to stand alongside people like their president and stop the russians. >> you know that nato has activated its nato response force. that is the first time this 40,000-person force is being deployed in any sort of a collective way. so, what does this mean for u.s. troops, and what is nato signaling with this move? >> well, what nato is starting to signal is that the status quo is no longer going to be the status quo. i mean, look, to be critical, nato is designed to stop russia, right? the whole point of the nato alliance is to prevent a russian invasion of europe. now, ukraine, of course, is not part of nato, but you could make the argument that the current posture of nato was not strong enough to deter russia from taking this action against not a nato ally but a country that's clearly aligned with nato allies. so, what western leaders are doing right now is saying, we've

got to improve nato. we've got to strengthen nato. we've got to make it clear that the nato of 2022 is not the nato of 2012 or 2014. nato is strong. we're standing here, ready to fight. we're ready for what might come next from vladimir putin. >> massachusetts congressman seth moulton, what a valuable voice you're bringing to this conversation today. thank you so much for your time. good to see you. coming up next, there's a critical new development on the russian sanctions front. a dramatic statement by a nato country that could change the financial dynamic. ukraine's former finance minister joins me to talk about that. ukraine's former finance minister joins me to talk about (judith) no - we actively manage client portfolios based on our forward-looking views of the market. (other money manager) but you still sell investments that generate high commissions, right? (judith) no, we don't sell commission products. we're a fiduciary, obligated to act in our client's best interest. (other money manager) so when do you make more money?

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breaking news as we approach the bottom of the hour. right now, hundreds are rallying outside the white house in support of ukraine. it is just one of the many anti-war protests here in the u.s. and around the world. let's go to nbc's ali vitali

joining us from washington. welcome to you, my friend. also today, president biden speaking about the invasion in a new interview. can you tell us what he's saying about it? >> reporter: the president in a new interview taking on a wide range of topics, including the nomination of his supreme court justice, ketanji brown jackson, and of course focusing on the ongoing situation in ukraine. you mentioned those protests going on outside the white house. several hundred people gathered there over the course of the last few hours. you'll hear those chants behind me throughout our live shot with you, but the president speaking today after a week of sanctions, continuing to be ratcheted up by the united states, considerations on an international level of whether or not to kick russia out of the s.w.i.f.t. banking system and for biden, he says in this interview, his goal from the beginning has been to make sure the international community, especially nato allies, are united against what putin is doing in ukraine. listen. >> my goal from the very beginning was to make sure that

i kept all of nato and the european union on the same page, because the one thing i think that putin thought he could do was split nato, creating a great aperture for him to be able to walk through. and that hasn't happened if you notice. it's been complete unanimity. and russia will pay a serious price for this short-term and long-term. >> reporter: to that end, alex, talking about nato bolstering its forces on the eastern front, the united states also sending $350 million in military aid to ukraine, and then on the other side of pennsylvania avenue, when congress comes back next week, where i typically spend most of my time, we expect that they're going to begin acting on a supplemental funding bill. our sources telling us and one congresswoman on with you earlier confirming around $6 billion in aid requested,

roughly half will be for military aid, the other half for humanitarian aid. it's not sure if that's going to be rolled into this larger omnibus funding bill or if it's going to be stand-alone but that's what we're looking ahead to as the week starts next week in washington. >> okay, ali vitali outside the white house, thank you so much for that report. let's go now to those breaking developments in just this past hour on the efforts to oust russia from s.w.i.f.t. the german ambassador to the u.s. now says germany is working on how to limit the collateral damage from banning russia from s.w.i.f.t. that is a european-based messaging network and that connects financial institutions around the world. president biden thus far refraining from banning russia earlier this week, saying the move does not yet have widespread european support. well, joining me now is natalie jaresko, ukraine's finance minister from 2014 to 2016. natalie, big welcome to you. glad to have you here and want to ask how you read this message coming out of germany and its

government today. does it signal to you that they could indeed ban russia from s.w.i.f.t., and if so, how effective would that be? >> thank you for having me. i think that banning russia from s.w.i.f.t. is imminent. i think most of the european countries have come around to it. the ukrainian diplomats have been working day and night to get there, and i think the last piece of the puzzle is the united states at this point. but that said, i tend to agree that it's incredibly important. it's psychologically very important for the ukrainian people to know this has happened, but i think we need to continue with even more on the financial side. in particular, sanctioning -- full sanctions blocking the central bank of russia with immediate sanctions. >> before i get to other things, let me just ask you how crippling sanctioning s.w.i.f.t. would be. i mean, can you give us examples of things? i'm going to reiterate something that my reporter many moscow said, which is, in advance of that possibility, you have, for example, hotels that are asking

incoming customers to pay now on their credit cards before they even step foot inside the hotel for fear of not having the ability to do transactions. i mean, is that the type of thing that would be cut off if s.w.i.f.t. were sanctioned? >> it is. s.w.i.f.t. is a messaging system, so all the transactions have to be messengered, and that messaging will be -- will cease to exist. i'm not sure what the germans are talking about with regard to exceptions or carveouts. i think for it to be most effective, it does have to be across the board, eliminating the ability to message from bank to bank on each transaction. you don't know whether a credit card is good or not. you don't know whether or not there's money on the other side of a transaction without that messaging system. >> extraordinary there. so, let's get to sanctions overall with the u.s. and other western governments now extending sanctions to include russian president putin, also his closest advisors, that includes foreign minister sergey

lavrov. it is unknown, the extent of putin's wealth, but some estimates put his hidden assets at about $100 billion, so how much real impact would these sanctions specifically have against putin? can you give examples of what kind of impact that would be? >> i think the greatest impact of sanctioning putin personally is psychological. his assets are probably very well hidden and i would suggest that there are probably none we have access to in the united states of america but i think the simple fact that we very rarely sanction heads of state is very meaningful and this is a man who is committing war crimes. people are being targeted in orphanages, kindergartens, and he deserves to be sanctioned. i think, though, that more meaningful and more broad sanctions against the elite in russia are what is critical. i mean, all the members of the national security council, all the members of the duma, which

the europeans have sanctioned. all the members of the cabinet of ministers and then the largest piece that you can of oligarchs, so-called oligarchs, the wealthy elites that are supporting him. >> natalie, you were ukraine's finance minister when russia annexed crimea in 2014. most of the sanctions then were directed against the russian oligarchs, so how do the sanctions today differ, and is there one that you think has the greater impact and hopefully your answer would be today's? >> so, i think that the sanctions when they illegally annexed crimea were narrow and they were a handful, again, of individuals of the elite with, unfortunately, too many exceptions and carveouts, even within those sanctions. had those sanctions been stronger, we may not be where we are today. and they didn't work in the sense of deterring putin from what he's doing. again, what i think is most important today, aside from s.w.i.f.t., is the full sanctioning of the central bank of russia, the reserves of russia. >> natalie jaresko, really good

to talk to you. i very much appreciate your expertise and insight. thank you so much for your time here. ahead, inside the mind of vladimir putin. what is he thinking? e the mind vladimir putin what is he thinking? as a small business owner, your bottom line is always top of mind. so start saving with comcast business mobile. flexible data plans mean you can get unlimited data or pay by the gig. all on the most reliable 5g network. with no line activation fees or term contracts. saving you up to $500 a year. so boost your bottom line by switching today. get the new samsung galaxy s22 series

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capital as dawn broke. citizens of kyiv waking up to sandbags in the streets and burned-out cars. the city's metro has stopped running. those stations now being used solely as underground bunkers. president volodymyr zelenskyy is refusing to leave the capital, despite saying he believes he is the number one target of the attack. he has been posting videos from the streets, urging his people to join him in defiance. several baltic nations have moved to shut their air space to russian airlines. estonia's prime minister has called on all eu countries to do the very same thing. president biden's choice for the supreme court is making history. in just a moment, someone who has helped prepare other supreme court nominees for their confirmation hearings. supreme court nominees for their supreme court nominees for their coirnfmation hearings. driven by our award-winning science, who uncover new medicines to treat mental illness. it includes the compassionate healthcare professionals, the dedicated social workers, and the supportive peer counselors we work with to help improve - and even change - people's lives.

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a big story here at home, the new supreme court nominee, judge ketanji brown jackson, nominated friday by president biden to succeed justice stephen breyer. >> if i'm fortunate enough to be confirmed as the next associate justice of the supreme court of the united states, i can only hope that my life and career, my love of this country and the constitution and my commitment to upholding the rule of law and the sacred principles upon which this great nation was founded will inspire future generations of americans. >> since graduating from harvard law school in 1996, jackson

served at every level of the federal court system, including her current role at the d.c. court of appeals. if confirmed, judge jackson will become the first black woman to serve on the nation's highest court. joining me now is harry litman, former u.s. attorney and host of "talking feds" podcast. good to see you. let's talk about this. i'd love first your reaction to judge jackson's nomination. what did you think when you heard? >> you know, it's kind of a home run, alex. she clicks so many boxes, it's not simply her experience and gold-plated resume. but she really brings a diversity of experience that the court doesn't have. she's been an assistant public defender. it's really important, someone who's represented accused people, that's such a big part of what the court does, half their docket. she's been the vice chair of the sentencing commission, that's a huge part of the docket and breyer, who was an expert, is now leaving. she has also been a district court judge, only sotomayor has

been in the current court, and that really makes a difference, to know how cases start, so she checks all the boxes in addition to being kind of off the charts in traditional ways as well. so, you know, i think it's a very important landmark day that she is an african american woman, but there's much more than that here to the nomination that will really contribute to the court that she's about to join. >> i have to say, i was really impressed when i heard the clerks from all nine supreme court justices, those with whom she worked contemporarily and also since, have signed this letter and supported her nomination, and i think that speaks volumes about her. so, let's talk about -- >> right. wouldn't always happen, trust me. >> oh, 100%. i agree. so, again, that is a huge, huge endorsement. so, thursday, we had the president, who sat down with jackson, and also two other candidates before making his final decision. what is it about judge jackson

that you think won out over j. michelle childs and leondra kruger. >> both candidates had things going for them. kruger in traditional ways. i think michelle childs had the political muscle but also it was important that she offered different background. frankly, they were all excellent, but i think a really big thing that kept her sort of in the pole position until the end, she's been confirmed with bipartisan support, three votes from republicans who will be hard-pressed not to vote for her now, so i think that gives just a little extra assurance, and i think biden, who, you know, this is big for him, he's done four in the senate, two as vice president, i think he would really like to have somebody with bipartisan support, so that, i think, was an extra kind of oomph that gave her the benefit of the doubt, and they looked very hard at the other

two, but never found a reason to really put them past her. so, she started from the beginning, i think that was a big part of it. >> that -- that number in the confirmation, it was 53-44. do you expect a similar number or even greater, potentially? >> very good question. so, i think romney is in play. you could even see, because the republicans know she's going to be confirmed, and she will be, so it doesn't make sense to have a sort of blood battle. you could see even a few more. on the other hand, it's so terribly polarized there. my best guess is the upside is four or five, and if they get three, the white house will be happy. >> how long is this going to take, this process? does it get done by the end of the current term? >> yes. and now, of course, breyer says he's there until his successor's confirmed and he's worked through all his cases.

the congress wants to do it quickly. the white house, i think, wouldn't mind taking a little more time. so far, it's been faster than normal. they are pointing toward confirmation hearings beginning april 9th, and i think the hope is by the end of april. that would be pretty fast, but it's doable, especially because i don't think there will be a serious opposition to her confirmation. there will be ferocious words and, you know, talks about liberal activism and the like, but not really threatening to her. so i think it's very plausible she will be confirmed by the middle or end of april. >> so, give me your sense on what advice you would give judge jackson as she's getting ready to face this divided senate, based on the fact that you have helped prepare numerous nominees in various hearings. what would you tell her? >> well, look, there are two kinds of nominees, controversial and uncontroversial. i wouldn't call her

uncontroversial, just because it's the supreme court, but it is hers to lose. so, she wants to stay in her game, basically, stay within herself, let people, you know, if they want to say antagonistic things, just let it run off her back, and really be focused. she just has to -- she'll be very, very well prepared on everything. she just has to put one foot in front of another, maintain her ekwan imty and all indications are she's got a winning personality that will stand her in good stead. basically, she will not have a self-inflicted wound. >> always a winning discussion with you, my friend. thank you, harry litman, for joining us on this. meantime, anlizing putin's next move and what to expect from him. a former cia analyst who has studied the russian leader joins me in three minutes. who has studied the russian leader joins studied the russian leader joins me in three minutes. because your body is capable of amazing things

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we are back now with more breaking news on russia's invasion of ukraine and growing concerns over vladimir putin's ambitions and motivations behind this attack. >> joining me now, tracy walder, former cia operative in russia. tracy worked on counterterrorism and focused on vladimir putin. so with a big welcome to you, tracy, under these circumstances, give me your interpretation of putin's rationale for launching this attack. does it at all square with his image and his history as a wily former kgb agent? >> thank you for having me on. i actually agree with both of those assessments. i think, you know, really, if we look at putin, he's 69 years old, and has really spent 50 years of his life, quite frankly, either in government or working for the kgb and i wholeheartedly agree with some former statements made by senator john mccain a few years back that, you know, when he

looked into putin's eyes, he saw three letters, k, g, and b, and i think for the vast majority of putin's time in office, that's really how he's operated. he served in east germany, really when east germany fell and the soviet union really fell apart in 1991. that's when he was there. and i think he views that as almost a personal defeat. he grew up at a time in russia in the '50s, '60s, really at their -- really some of their strongest point, and i think that is -- he wants to restore russia really back to that, and he looks at ukraine right now as being occupied, almost, by a foreign country, and that foreign country being sort of the west's influence, if you will. >> well, here's what french president emmanuel macron said recently about putin, and it was reported in the "wall street journal." that mr. macron noticed a change in mr. putin's demeanor when speaking to him on the phone over the course of the pandemic. he tended to talk in circles,

rewriting history, a close aide to mr. macron said. if you look at the video of putin talking to leaders across those long tables, there we see right there, what does all this suggest to you, the level of isolation that he has endured due to his paranoia about covid? >> i completely agree with that. that is one thing that i have noticed lately, even -- and i know this sounds superficial, but if you really just look at pictures of him, which i tend to do quite a bit, the shape of his face has even changed. he looks different. he speaks differently, and he's crossed over to what i think i consider to be almost the dark side of history. look, putin was never a friend, if you will, but most of the things that he was doing was really sort of cyber, psychological operations, those kinds of things. now he's really crossed over sort of that red line into, you know, this full military warfare, but then part of me wonders if we should be this

surprised. just a few years back, he kind of made this famous quote that if a fight is inevitable, you must strike first, and i think he always viewed that ukraine, at least for him, was going to be a fight. i think the annexation of crimea, for him, back in 2014, was never going to be enough. and i worry that maybe we thought that it was enough and that this sort of caught us off guard, but i completely agree with macron that this has -- his demeanor has really done a complete change. >> and add to all that that putin's speeches this week have been fact checked, and many of the claims he made were totally debunked. let's listen to some of what he said yesterday. here it is.

>> neo-nazis, banderites and drug addicts taking over ukraine. we are all familiar with the saying, the first casualty of war is truth. but does this go beyond war propaganda? >> these are wholly untruths and are clearly easy to fact check. you know, we know zelenskyy is jewish. a lot of his extended family was killed in the holocaust, and ukraine has a rather large jewish population, so this is wholly, wholly untrue, but i do think, because what we're starting to see is sort of, you know, facebook being controlled in russia and the kind of cultural narrative being controlled there, and i do think that by putting out these untruths into a vacuum where, you know, there is no discrepancy or rebuttal allowed, he is looking to kind of change the cultural narrative, and i think that that's what he's doing. >> can i ask you quickly, given your experience, do you think he has the full support of those in his close orbit?

>> that is an excellent question. i personally do not think that he has the full support of those in his orbit. you know, we're starting to see, obviously, lots of protests, almost 3,000 people have been arrested in russia for protesting this. i think in terms of his close circle, i think there is some disagreement. however, i do not know that they're going to voice that disagreement necessarily. >> well, that is a wise assessment. tracy walder, coming from you, thank you so much. look forward to seeing you again. for all of you, that is going to do it for me on this edition of "alex witt reports." in just a moment, katy tur continues our coverage. , katy tr continues our coverage

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good to be with you, i'm katy tur. it is 3:00 p.m. in new york and 10:00 p.m. in kyiv, ukraine, and here is what we know right now. the ukrainian government is still in control of the capital city, but russian forces are trying to advance. releasing a bombardment of russian missiles from the sky, video showed a missile striking a residential building in kyiv just hours ago. ukraine's minister for foreign affairs says that russian artillery killed two and injured at least six others. that strike prompted a sudden and chaotic evacuation of that building and