this sacred space, a citadel of democracy, in this capitol. generation of generation of americans debated great questions, have done great things. we fought for freedom, expanded liberty, debated totalitarianism and terror. we built the strongest, freest, and most prosperous nation the world has ever known. now is the hour. our moment of responsibility. our test of resolve and conscience of history itself. it is in this moment that our character of this generation is formed. our purpose is found. our future is forged. well, i know this nation. we'll meet the test. protect freedom and liberty. expand fairness and opportunity. and we will save democracy.

as hard as those times have been, i'm more optimistic about america today than i've been my whole life. because i see the future that's within our grasp. because i know there's simply nothing beyond our capacity. we're the only nation on earth that's turned every crisis we faced into an opportunity. the only nation that can be defined by a single word, possibilities. so on this night, on our 245th year as a nation, i've come to report on the state of the nation, the state of the union, and my report is this: the state of the union is strong because you, the american people, are strong. [ applause ] we are stronger today. we are stronger today than we were a year ago. and we'll be stronger a year from now than we are today. this is our moment to meet and overcome the challenges of our

time, and we will, as one people, one america, the united states of america. god bless you all. may god protect our troops. thank you. >> president biden closing out last night's state of the union address, vowing to save democracy. good morning. welcome to "morning joe." it is wednesday, march 2nd. with us here in washington, we have pulitzer prize-winning columnist and associate editor of the "washington post," eugene robinson. former ambassador to ukraine, bill taylor. in new york, along with willie geist, we have the host of "way too early" and white house bureau chief at "politico," jonathan lemire. president on the council of foreign relations, richard haass. a lot to get to. first, joe, your take on the president's speech last night. >> i know we'll get to ukraine quickly, and then we're going to circle back around.

willie, a couple quick thoughts. i'm curious what your take was. first of all, it was a return to normalcy for state of the union address. not a lot of puffing of one's chest out, talking about -- the president talking about the president nonstop. very few mussolini type gestures up there. you had a unifying speech. a defense of western democracy. a guy who embraced americans as being champions of democracy in ukraine and fight for western values, for liberal values. then he moved on to, again, a unifying message about made in the usa, which took up a substantial portion of the middle of his speech, which people supported. then at the end, he said what those democrats in those swing de states desperately needed him to say. we don't want defund the police,

we want to fund the police. we went on to talk about, it's been too long. let's open schools and keep them open. of course, that rousing closing. a very unifying speech last night. >> it was. >> and the tone of unity was set by the gestures toward ukraine right out of the gate. the first 15 to 20 minutes of the speech were about ukraine. you had people from ukraine, ambassador up in the rafters. so i think that was the tone of the day, was, okay, we're going to rally around ukraine. we're going to rally around democracy and freedom. when he stepped into domestic issues, obviously, it gets more contentious. there were even standing ovations around immigration, where republicans stood up and said, yes, we have to do something at the border. responding to the president. there were, of course, moments around build back better and some of the things that president biden has touted as achievements that republicans don't like that were divisive. there were outbursts from extremists in the room. by and large, as you said, it

was a conventional state of the union speech, against the backdrop of a war in europe. we will get to the parts of the speech that had to do with a lot of issues here at home, but let's dive right into what's happening abroad. it was another violent day in ukraine, as russia strangles major cities across the country with heavy shelling and air strikes. in kyiv, a russian missile hit the main tv tower and nearby holocaust memorial, killing at least five people and injuring another five. the attack temporarily forced television stations to go off the air. according to moscow, its military was engaged in high-precision strikes against facilities that are being used for information attacks against russia. ukraine's second largest city, kharkiv, also came under intense shelling. air strikes hit kharkiv's residential buildings, killing at least ten civilians.

president zelenskyy denounced the attacks, saying, quote, nobody will forgive. nobody will forget. kharkiv has been the target of some of the worst aerial assaults since the invasion began. other cities also came under constant barrages of shelling as ukrainian officials said russian forces had blocked off a major port city on the black sea. nbc news has not been able to independently verify that claim. according to britain's defense ministry, three ukrainian cities are now encircled by russian forces. this as ukraine's interior ministry said yesterday that at least 40,000 people were without food and water. u.s. officials say the 40-mile long russian military convoy heading toward kyiv seems to be advancing more slowly than expected, partly because of fuel and food shortages. joining us now from kyiv, ukraine, nbc news foreign correspondent richard engel.

richard, what is the latest? >> reporter: the mayor here in kyiv this morning warned people to stock up. there seems to be a period of relative calm here, although just a few minutes ago, we heard the air-raid sirens going off. the mayor was telling people to use this opportunity, because it could be the last opportunity, before that convoy arrives, to prepare themselves. prepare bomb shelters and stock up on food, water. there are fights all across the country. according to medical officials in the -- in kharkiv, there were at least 20 people killed. 20 civilians killed just over the last 24 hours. the convoy, as you mentioned, does appear to have slowed down, but u.s. officials believe that it is just in a phase of regrouping. it is still on its way to kyiv, and once it gets here, the plan is to surround the city, besiege it, attack it, and try to force a government collapse.

that is what were seeing in kharkiv, where the city has been surrounded. they are attacking from the outside. it is what we are seeing in a smaller city, which has changed hands there. russian forces surrounded the city and are negotiating with officials, saying unless the city surrenders and hands over control to russian authorities, it'll be severely bombed. >> all right. nbc's richard engel, thank you so much for your live report. >> reporting on the ground. >> stay safe. president biden warned during his state of the union address last night that president vladimir putin would pay, quote, a high price for his actions in ukraine. let's go now and get the reaction from moscow. nbc's senior international correspondent keir simmons. what's moscow's response to the president's state of the uniyn union address last night? >> reporter: the spokesperson was asked about the speech in a briefing with journalists today,

his daily briefing. specifically, he was asked about president biden's claim that russia's economy is shaking. he said in his response, the russian economy is experiencing a serious blow, but there is a margin of safety. we will stand on our feet. joe, though, i think the 6,800 people who have been arrested for protesting, the more than 1 million who have signed a petition in russia, those people, i suspect, would have wanted to hear more from president biden about ukraine. frankly, i suspect they would have wanted to have the whole speech be about ukraine. in the end, watching from here, it segued into domestic politics, some sitting and some standing. it was uncomfortable to watch when you are here and watching the battle between autocracy and

democracy. but that is democracy. not agreeing with each other, that is democracy. the challenge here in russia, and we talked about it again and again, is that everybody has to agree with president putin. now, let's be honest, people in europe, people in russia, don't stay up overnight to watch the state of the union. it's not going to have, necessarily, a rousing impact. people don't hang on the president's every word. i suspect what is more likely to have an impact on people here in russia, for example, is if they see those sieges of those ukraine cities. because just remember, that this is a country where a siege on a city is seared into the historic memory. the siege in world war ii, st. petersburg, more than a million people died. it is a question or the kremlin, not whether if the russian people saw what president biden had to say, but whether they see

what will be happening in the days and weeks ahead in ukraine. >> i'm curious what the reaction is, when russian leaders keep talking about nuclear war, threatening nuclear war. we've heard frit vladimir putin. we heard it from people on russian tv about reducing enemies to ashes. we've heard it from russian diplomats. an hour ago, "reuters" reporting sergey lavrov starts talking about nuclear weapons and world war iii. certainly, russians understand if a nuclear war begins at russia's hand, it'll be russia that will be obliterated from the face of the earth. russian leaders are talking about engaging in a war that would end up killing them. what is the reaction to this constant nuclear saber rattling that, basically, has russian leaders saying, let us go in with this illegal invasion. let us go in and seize ukraine. if it doesn't go the way we want it to go, then we're going to

make sure the entire world faces nuclear annihilation. what do russians think about that? >> reporter: well, russia has a policy, has had a policy for a while. they call it escalate to de-escalate. it's not entirely clear what that policy means, but in principle what it means, that you make those kinds of threats, nuclear threats, in order to turn a conventional war in your favor. so the russians have heard that before. of course, and we've talked about it, russians who are watching state television are getting a very reassuring picture of events. there are other russians who are wondering, and worrying, about what might be going on behind the walls of the kremlin and the state of mind of president putin himself. look, there is a lot of rhetoric in what russians say, including president putin. but he has, chillingly, said in a speech before, russia doesn't

need the world if there is no russia. >> nbc's keir simmons in moscow, thank you so much. ambassador, what do you make of the constant nuclear saber rattling that we continue to get, again, from diplomats, from vladimir putin himself, from state tv, and an hour ago from sergey lavrov? >> joe, i think, i think that this is performance. i think this is not a serious threat to use nuclear weapons against ukraine. >> if it is a performance, doesn't it indicate how badly this war is going for putin? >> exactly. this war is going very badly for russia. they can't believe that they're not already in kyiv, in the capital. >> what tells you that this is performance? when has he performed before? okay. every time he's tried to invade, whether it be crimea or go back, he has done so. >> by the way, this is a discussion that's being had in intelligence agencies -- >> i think we should believe him, bill taylor.

>> hold on a second. across the western world, this is what the cia and other intel ainl agencies are trying to work through. this debate here. >> on one hand, people say this man is unhinged. we've heard this, and it is troubling. on the other hand, we have heard people who tell me that he's not crazy. he doesn't abide by the same kind of costs and benefits calculations that we do, but he is still rational. if he's rational, he's not going to commit suicide, which is what he would do. >> but he is doing -- >> could he make himself think, okay, we won't use this strategic nuclear weapon, the icbms, but tactical nuclear weapons. battlefield nuclear weapons, as if there were such really such a thing. >> right. >> the question is, richard haass, what do the generals around him think? what are other military leaders around him thinking? they didn't want to go to war.

their soldiers don't want to be in war in ukraine. they have relatives in ukraine. what are the oligarchs thinking, oh, really, he is going to blow up my yacht? he is going to blow up my mistresses? he is going to blow up my $200 million flats in london? i mean, what are russians thinking every time this guy, sergey lavrov, and let's never forget sergey lavrov and other diplomats are talking about nuclear war. they're talking about nuclear war. is it performance art, or is this putin on the edge? >> i think it is likely putin trying to intimidate us. what's scary to me, joe, is not so much he will use nuclear weapons. i think the odds are strongly against it, but that he could probably if he wanted to. he has so weakened constraints on decision making in russia, he probably has more freedom than 1962 in the missile crisis.

>> i'm glad you brought that up. i think he has more power khrushchev. there are no major checks on the power we see right now with vladimir putin. that is a frightening spector. are there any generals that can rein him in? >> coming back to the speech, it was a missed opportunity last night. i was not as thrilled with the speech as some others seemed to be. i thought there was a real missed opportunity to speak to the people around putin. to basically send messages that he -- this was not just putin's war, but he was potentially leading this country over the cliff. they would not be allowed to prevail. if they continued one way or another, russian forces were not going to succeed in ukraine. we would determine over time to basically do there whatever needed to be done, as we did in afghanistan. i also would have sent a message to the russian people. all the brave people getting

arrested, coming in the streets and saying, our problem is not with you, people of russia. russia is a great country. we want russia to be a part of europe and a part of the world. vladimir putin, however, is the threat. what i would try to do is encourage a movement, be it among the inner circle of generals and oligarchs who are paying an enormous price, or with the russian people. it's one of the very few ways, joe, this can end well, if there is a move against vladimir putin. either to constrain him or replace him. i would have been reasonable about negotiations as an option. the one thing that's not going to happen, russia is not going to be allowed to prevail through escalating through conventional arms, cyber, expanding to nato, much less nuclear arms. i think there were messages that ought to have been sent last night that simply were not sent. >> president biden did take new measures last night, talking about russia. announcing the united states would ban russian flights from flying over american air space. and saying vladimir putin mezcal collat ed

mis-calculated how the world would respond. >> ukrainian's determination inspires the world. groups of citizens blocking tanks with their bodies. everyone from students to retirees to teachers turned soldiers, defending their homeland. in this struggle, president zelenskyy said in his speech in the european parliament, light will win over darkness. ukrainian ambassador to the united states is here tonight, sitting with the first lady. if you're able to stand, stand and send an unmistakable signal to the world. thank you. [ applause ] thank you, thank you, thank you.

she's strong. she's resolved. [ applause ] yes. we the united states of america stand with the ukrainian people. tonight, i say to the russian oligarchs and the corrupt leaders who built billions of dollars off this violent regime, no more. [ applause ] i mean it. the united states department of justice is assembling a dedicated task force to go after the crimes of the russian oligarchs. we're joining with european allies to find and seize their yachts, luxury apartments, their private jets. we're coming for you and your ill-begotten gains. tonight, i'm announing we will join our allies in closing off american air space to all

russian flights, further isolating russia and adding additional squeeze on their economy. >> again, jonathan lemire, the president opening the state of the union address on the theme of ukraine. a powerful moment with the ambassador up in the gallery. the chamber was draped, really, in blue and yellow, the colors of the ukrainian flag. announcing news on the air space and others, going after the oligarchs, expressing some new steps. how did the president try to weave in and try to set the tone for the speech with ukraine? >> yeah, certainly in recent days, the speech underwent a number of rewrites and revisions. white house aides told me it was to make the conflict in ukraine the centerpiece. it received bipartisan applause. there was real cheers from both sides of the aisle during the first 12 minutes. almost 20% of the speech was devoted to ukraine. it is noteworthy, the oligarch's yachts, you can track these

things, and they're fleeing barcelona, monte carlo, other ports, trying to get ahead of western authorities. they're we're trying to get the arms and supplies to ukraine. there have been challenges getting it over the land borders. there is some look at the russian convoy and speculation. the equipment is old and broken down. morale among russian soldiers not very high. certainly, that still poses a threat and there is a fear it may not be used to invade kyiv but encircle it, to try to cut off supplies from reaching the cap capital. they're not sure what to make of the slow pace. we had press secretary jen psaki on with me on "way too early," and she didn't rule out the sanctions to the energy industry in russia, oil and gas, which is the lifeblood of the economy. that would have ripple effects for western economies in europe

and the u.s. it is something, she noted, they've unleashed massive sanctions on russia and don't intend to stop. >> ambassador taylor, we had a member of the ukrainian parliament on yesterday, making an impassioned plea for the united states to do more. she called for a no fly zone. in your experience, given what you know, what is realistic? what is practical? what more can the united states be doing here? sanctions have been tough. arms are flowing in. is there more the united states could be doing to help ukraine right now? >> there are a couple of things. one is the no fly zone is probably not going to happen, but we can jam the russian's electronic jamming. we can get in the way of the russians trying to mess up the ukrainian air force operations. we have the ability to do that. we can do that from nato air space. there are things like that that are practical, that are effective, and that can help the ukrainians as they fight the russians. >> so, gene, are we doing

enough? do most americans believe the president is doing enough? you look at the numbers last night. a couple of flash polls of people that saw the president. i think cbs, something like 70% were positive on the speech. same number with cnn. people who watched the speech very positive about it. >> absolutely. i mean, you know, you say sanctions, you know, three weeks ago or whatever, and it doesn't sound like a lot. you actually look at the sanctions that are being imposed and coordinated by the united states, as the world's, you know, superpower, leading the free world, and they are really impressive and really tough. obviously being felt in russia, as the ruble, you know, shrinks before our eyes. i mean, worth considerably less than a penny right now. >> yeah. >> now, ambassador taylor raises a good point.

things that we can do, potentially in cyber. some kinds of cyber offensives that we wouldn't want to take, obviously. we wouldn't want to get into a tit for tat cyber war, but things like unjamming the jamming, that seems like a logical thing. one assumes that we are also giving, already giving logistical support of some kind. perhaps not with personnel but in some kind of the supply chain that's getting weapons to the ukrainians so they can continue to fight. but that's not the kind of thing you can really talk about. >> but are they getting there fast enough? are they getting what they need? because the russians are closing in. >> russians are closing in. the flow is going. the weapons are coming through. it needs to be faster, absolutely.

they are running through their stocks. their ammunitions must be getting lower than it was, so we need to increase that. we can't fly them in any longer. we can't go into airports. we have to go over land. we have trucks. this has to be ramped up, yeah. >> back to the nuclear question, are there ways we could increase the strangle hold on russia, whether it be through energy and economic sanctions, even if it does raise gas prices here in the u.s.? easy for me to say. but for a world leader making a decision, i would believe putin on the nukes. i would make decisions that might save the world. >> we are still buying a lot of oil and gas. the western world is buying a lot of oil and gas from the russians. even though we are squeezing, exactly as you say, that flow of funds still goes in. it has to go down. >> richard haass, i'd say something that may be unpopular with some people that watch "morning joe" every morning, but it seems to me, our dependence on russian oil continues despite the fact we're the largest producer in the world.

despite the fact that we actually are not getting the energy out of the ground, all the energy out of the ground that we can get. temporarily, because of this war. wouldn't it strategically make a lot of sense for the united states to ramp up oil production so they can cut off the dependence on russian oil? we have the ability in this country to produce enough oil nor country and energy for this country that we can depend a hell of a lot less on russia. can we not at least do this temporarily, in the cause of freedom? if democrats want to go back to current positions later, they can do that. but why not, if we have the ability to not be dependent on russian oil, why wouldn't we take that step right now at a

time of war? >> that was discussed. i thought the president might say more in the speech, but clearly there was a split in the administration. we should go after russian energy. it should be sanctioned. we should rethink the balance between energy, security, and climate change policies. the good news is you can have energy security and responsible climate change policies. more broadly, joe, i think that was missed. i think we also missed the idea, perhaps, of telling the american people they would have to deal with higher energy prices for a while, if this is so important. that's a sacrifice the american people should be willing to make. we've sacrificed in the past for our principles, for our national security. we should be prepared to do that now. i think that was there. look, these speeches have got to be educational. they can't just be laundry lists. i think the president missed the opportunity to say, here's why what we're doing is about right. here's why we're not doing more, why we're not doing the no fly zones or putting boots on the ground. here's why we're not doing less. again, i think he basically missed an opportunity.

the good news is the policy is better than the speech. the bad news is he lost a real opportunity, i thought, last night to educate americans about what is to come and some of the tough decisions we need to make down the road. >> ambassador taylor, thank you very much for coming on early this morning. we'll be watching this with you and see you again very soon, we hope. coming up on "morning joe," hundreds of thousands of ukrainians have fled the country, as russia continues on its warpath. we'll get a live report from poland on that. plus, former national security adviser john bolton trashes his former boss donald trump, saying he barely knew where ukraine was. those pointed new comments are ahead. also this morning, comedian and activist jon stewart joins us to discuss his latest push to help veterans of the wars in iraq and afghanistan. and opening day for major league baseball has been delayed. the latest on the effort to end the lockout. and a programming note.

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welcome back to "morning joe." >> 33 past the hour. >> gene, for 15 years, right? >> i know. >> you try to get a password to get online in a studio, whether it is here or 30 rock. you have to literally call bill gates and say, "bill, how do i get on here?" >> okay. >> you'd think they'd have a password where you could get on, right? i know you're trying to get tim cook right now. >> exactly. >> it is 3:00 in the morning on the west coast. >> exactly. he's not answering. look, you know, technologically, we do amazing things.

you know, richard from kyiv. keir from moscow. >> willie, 50 years of "morning joe," and 50 years of, how do i get to the wi-fi? hold on a second. mr. gates is in seattle right now. >> it seems a little off topic. >> we're not off topic. this is what we're all thinking about. i'll tell you what america is thinking about, willie, baseball. it is unbelievable. these owners, and specifically the owners that are at the table negotiating this, are just awful. they have basically sold out baseball. they've sold out the fans. the players, i don't naturally go with the players. if the players are off, i blame them. but in this case, the players came with a good faith compromise a couple days ago. the owners told them to pound sand. those four owners that are at

the table, they're horrid. they don't give a damn about the game. they don't give a damn about the sport. they're basically telling the players, screw you guys. we don't care if there's not baseball in april or may. screw you guys. screw the fans. we don't love the game. we're just going to sit here. i mean, it's really such a disgrace. after fans have sat through two years of covid-shortened seasons, now the greed of these owners at the table is driving baseball into the ground. >> i would like to say, first, i hopped on the internet in our studio at 30 rock without incident this morning. you'll be happy to hear that. >> willie geist. >> must be nice. >> it was great. but you're right, this is incredibly short-sighted, incredibly greedy. we could get into the arcane details of what they're fighting about, but the bottom line, it's about money. there is a big pot of money. baseball is doing pretty well. players feel like, okay, if you're making that much money, we're the players, we'd like a

greater share of the money than we have now. there was a good faith offer put out by the players. the owners rejected that. now opening day of the baseball season is going to be pushed back. it is pushed back already as of yesterday when they couldn't reach a deal, jonathan lemire. we've talked about our kids who, you know, there are a lot of kids who are on the fence anyway about baseball, given all the entertainment options. kids up trying to watch a yankee game and it is 9:30 at night, the fourth inning, and they lose track of it. it is hard enough to keep people with baseball right now. this certainly, certainly is not going to help. >> this is going to turn off fans. it is kids. the future of the sport is going to suffer here. they've been excited for opening day. my boys among them. i've been talking to people on both sides of this negotiation in recent days. let's remember a couple things here. the players association said, hey, there's no need to have it just yet with opening day still a month away. the players felt like the last

cba, they got the short end of the stick. they took a harder posture this time. max scherzer at the table, as well. joe is right. the owners here, it's hard to not put most of the blame at their feet. a lot of the small market owners, in particular, who i have been told said they'd be okay with no baseball in april because they don't make much money in april anyway. they have a hard time drawing fans to the ballpark. they're willing to throw away a month of the season. this is most damning of all, opening day canceled. there is no set date for the next negotiations and talks. there's no urgency. the league is likely going to reach out in a couple days, maybe tomorrow, to set up the next round of negotiations but they're not going to lose a week here. it'll stretch into several weeks, potentially most of may. it is deeply upsetting. it is a self-inflicted wound. it is hard not to come back -- the defining image yesterday,

commissioner rob manfred photographed practicing his golf swing, the back of the "daily news." height of negotiations, they thought they had a breakthrough monday night. they were closer. the league, in particular, thought they were close. players association said, hey, this is a good step but we still have divides to bridge. yesterday, tone got tougher. it fell apart. rob manfred was more concerned about golf swing than figuring out the season. >> the man is killing baseball, willie geist. he is killing baseball. these owners that are at the table that don't give a damn, who have said, "we don't care. we don't care about baseball in april. we don't make that much money anyway," they're a disgrace. manfred is killing baseball. the owners they've put at the negotiating table that don't give a damn about the fans are killing baseball. we sat around and talked about the nfl every day for a couple of months. why did we do that? you know what? because our kids were awake. you're exactly right.

i'm sitting there with my 13-year-old boy, and we're watching the games. i'm on the phone with my other boys talking about the games. friends are talking about games. fantasy football league. football, the nfl, for all its problems, everybody is going to be waiting for opening kick-off next year. with baseball, seriously, people like mike barnicle and me, it is a health crisis every time the red sox make it into the playoffs because we got to stay up too late. guess who else is not staying up late, my 13-year-old son who watches 162 regular games a year whenever he can when school is not in. this is a disgrace. these people -- let me just say it, they're greedy pigs who are destroying america's game. manfred is a disgrace. he should resign. he's going to go down as the worst commissioner in baseball history. he's sitting there worrying

about his backswing while kids are knowing they're not going to get to see opening day because they decided, these small market guys who want to throw away april baseball, who want to throw away opening day, they're glad. because they don't make money much in april anyway. they're pigs. seriously, they don't deserve to be associated with the sport. >> okay. >> tell us what you really think, joe. >> we hear you. >> i think they're mean, selish pigs who are destroying america's game. >> maybe g7 economic sanctions on the baseball oligarchs, you think? >> willie, take it. >> how about putting owners at the table who give a damn about the sport. >> might be a good idea. richard haass, is there anybody in that room who remembers 1994 and the damage done to the game, the long lockout, how long it took and how hard they had to work to get fans back in the ballpark. the lengths they went to. this, again, is coming at a totally different time for young people. i don't think the owners

appreciate this. i don't think major league baseball appreciates this. they'd rather be playing fortnite than watching a yankee game until 10:00 at night. >> this is risky for baseball. two years of covid. people lost habits. this is a chance to basically get off your electronic toys, get out and do things again. >> yeah. >> i think this is stunningly short-sighted, about losing a generation, not reinforcing, if you will, the baseball muscle or habit. it won't be america's game. people learn to live without it. >> well, it's not. football is. >> football or basketball, what have you. this is just stunningly short-sighted. you almost could have made the opposite argument. forget about the details of the financial things now. we have to get the game back. we have to reestablish the habit of going to baseball games. >> yes. >> this is stunningly short-sighted. >> gene robinson, when we were growing up, what'd we do? get our gloves. >> yeah. >> go out with friends and play baseball every day. >> exactly. >> it was america's game.

we'd go around pretending we were hank aaron or willie mays or you name it. by '76, mark "the bird." i remember america stopped that night when mark went on the mound in monday night baseball. baseball wuss on the mound. >> it is not america's game now. it isn't. football is. basketball probably is second. baseball is hurting itself. richard haass is right, this is more than a missed opportunity. this is self-harm. there you have it. i mean, it's self-harm. it goes down another notch. >> okay. richard haass, thank you very much. some of the headlines from last night's state of the union was about what biden did not say. we're going to get into that next on "morning joe."

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46 past the hour, as russia continues its bombardment of kharkiv. citizens are sheltering underground, struggling to find food and supplies. the crisis in ukraine is drawing 100,000 ukrainians a day to flee their country. we have reports from nbc news senior national correspondent tom llamas and international correspondent matt bradley. >> reporter: it was kharkiv's freedom square that took a colossal hit. ukraine's second largest city pounded, leaving the city hall in tatters. its opera house damaged. first responders rushing bodies and injured people out. seven people died. 24 were wounded according to ukrainian state officials.

president volodymyr zelenskyy still defiant, condemned the freedom square attack. this is the price of freedom, he said, what a morning. one part of a day of destruction in kharkiv, with civilians carrying the bulk of the burden. russian rockets also destroyed this residential building. in response, the city moved underground. >> this is my little child. the bombing and shooting and we don't know how to sleep and what will -- how we will live tomorrow. please, we don't have enough food for my baby. >> reporter: she is sheltering with her five-month-old baby and other family members in their basement. supplies and morale are low and getting lower. other infants elsewhere in the city have been scrambled to safety. a whole maternity ward moved to a bomb shelter. one rocket devastated a house just behind where the family was

sheltering. this family has been walking through train tunnels to find supplies and food. everything here is dwindling. only hope remains. >> reporter: the wave of refugees sweeping across europe is growing. the u.n. says more than 600,000 ukrainians have escaped in just six days. many of the refugees boarding outbound trains are children. some too young to understand. families desperate to escape the looming onslaught in the east. this woman's husband staying behind. >> me and three children, we came into the train. >> reporter: from trains to hungary to buses to greece and poland, even by foot to romania and slovakia, the reasons to leave are the same. >> to save my life, the life of my baby. >> reporter: but some black immigrants say the journey out is getting harder and harder for them. >> mostly, they'd consider the

white people first. indian people, arab people before black people. as long as you are black, no one likes you. >> reporter: as so many scramble out, others are standing by. in western ukraine, the lviv art center now feels like an amazon warehouse. everything is on the move. food, clothes, diapers. not for customers but for countrymen. >> it's all volunteers. it is all the staff from the people who want to help. >> reporter: the civilian eh for the to take on the russians is not just about fighting. it is also helping. inside the bags are food and winter supplies that are going to the victims of the war, ukrainians across the country whose neighborhoods have now by bombed out. before the war, vitali was a student at kyiv university. now, he is on the front lines of the aid effort. are you scared of the russians? >> no, i'm not scared. because we know what we fight for. we ukrainians fight for justice and for freedom and for liberty.

russians, they do not know what they fight for. >> what an extraordinary summation of this war. we're fighting for freedom. we're fighting for liberty. we're fighting for justice. the russians don't know what they're fighting for. >> they didn't know they were going to fight, a lot of them apparently. they thought they were doing a training exercise. >> the pols are coming out of homes to help the refugees. they're not responding to a call of action. they're showing up. >> they're showing up. >> everything. >> clothes, food, whatever they have. >> yeah. >> it is extraordinary. >> beautiful. >> the way the countries around ukraine are. >> hold on, there was an african student there saying that black africans, the ukraines were not allowing them across the border. mika called her brother three, four days ago after first seeing it on twitter. a "reuters" story carried it a couple days later.

she called mark and said, listen, there's some chatter about this going on. >> they're trying to find it. >> sent a message to the ukrainians, you know, "cut it out. you are going to undermine the war effort. you're going to undermine the uni uninem -- >> they put out a statement, saying the policy, of course, is everyone should be treated equally. there are a lot of people from all over the world who are in ukraine. they want to leave, and we should facilitate their leaving. that's what the government said. >> yeah. >> you know, they have to get that policy enacted at the border crossing. just ahead -- >> it's creating problems, obviously. it's not just the nigerians that are having problems but

algerians, middle easterners. >> people of color. just ahead, we're going to go live to the border of poland and ukraine. as we said, hundreds of thousands of ukrainians have left their homes, and humanitarian groups are struggling to keep up with the flood of people. almost 700,000 people leaving ukraine. my asthma felt anything but normal. ♪♪ it was time for a nunormal with nucala. nucala is a once monthly add-on treatment for severe eosinophilic asthma that can mean less oral steroids. not for sudden breathing problems. allergic reactions can occur. get help right away for swelling of face, mouth, tongue, or trouble breathing. infections that can cause shingles have occurred. don't stop steroids unless told by your doctor. tell your doctor if you have a parasitic infection. may cause headache, injection site reactions, back pain, and fatigue. ask your asthma specialist about a nunormal with nucala.

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57 past the hour. former national security adviser john bolton pushed back hard in a recent interview on the claim that former president donald trump deterred the russians from invading ukraine. >> we didn't sanction nord stream 2. we should have. we should have brought the project to an end. we did impose sanctions on russian oligarchs and several others because of their sales of

s-400 antiaircraft systems to other countries. but in almost every case, the sanctions were imposed with trump complaining about it and saying we were being too hard. the fact is, that he barely knew where ukraine was. he once asked john kelly, his second chief of staff, if finland were a part of russia. it just is not accurate to say that trump's behavior somehow deterred the russians. this is not really a policy argument. this is about trump's lack of any significant historical knowledge, his lack of strategic thinking, and, frankly, his lack of thinking about pretty much anything other than what benefitted donald trump. why was he concerned about ukraine in the summer of 2019? because he wanted that dnc server. why was he concerned about corruption in ukraine? because he was looking for an excuse to cover the reason he was refusing to second $250

million of security assistance to the ukraine. >> willie geist, there is a guy that was at donald trump's side through it all there. >> yeah. >> just absolutely eviscerated this asinine argument that trumpists -- by the way, pro-putin trumpists -- keep saying. >> who got it here. >> who got it here. >> yeah. >> oh, if only donald trump had been there. as we heard time and time again, every time congress passed sanctions against russia, donald trump was the one that his advisers were having to drag him along. he was constantly complaining and blackmailing ukraine. as john bolton said, his national security adviser said, trump was the one that was blackmailing ukraine and didn't want to send those weapons because he was trying to dig up dirt. he was trying to get servers. >> yeah, that's the key point right there. as you say, john bolton made it, too, the entire reason donald

trump was impeached the first time was because he was trying to hold up security aid to ukraine for moments like this, to defend itself against a russian invasion. and that is john bolton, and i understand the arguments with john bolton and bill barr, as well, too little, too late, reputation laundering, all that, but in this case, john bolton is telling the truth about an argument made on newsmax, which is a purely pro-donald trump network, where they lead you to the answer they're hoping to get. in that case, john bolton didn't give it to them, saying, no, this argument that donald trump was tougher on russia is asinine. john boston is not always a huge fan of joe biden, but here, he is punching holes in the idea that if donald trump were president today, things would be different in ukraine. it is probably true but not in a good way. >> what stood up to ukraine is the strong alliances in europe and nato. both things donald trump undermined repeatedly during his time in office. i was there in brussels when he

threatened to walk out of nato. when he would not commit. pointedly, he took out of the speech the commitment to article v, the mutual defense pact. he wouldn't say it in brussels in front of the european leaders. he warred with the other heads of state over there, saying the eu was one of the united states' biggest rivals and used the word "foe" to describe them. of course, he was impeached over trying to blackmail ukraine over the defensive missiles they are now using, the javelins and such, to repel russian forces. we certainly know there is a long history of him cozying up to vladimir putin as candidate and president. no more so than in helsinki when he sided with the russian president over the u.s. intelligence forces. all right. it was another violent day in ukraine, as russia hit major cities across the country with heavy shelling and air strikes. in kyiv, a russian missile hit the main tv tower and a nearby holocaust memorial, killing at least five people and injuring another five.

the attack temporarily forced television stations to go off the air. >> by the way, can you believe, they hit a holocaust memorial. you talk about the cynicism. >> sick irony. >> destroy a holocaust memorial when they're talking about fighting nazism. talking about fighting a nazi president who is jewish. it is grotesque. everything that vladimir putin is doing is grotesque. the lies are grotesque. they're clumsy. he has been exposed to the world and leaders around him have been exposed for what they are. while there is aid on the way and money being supplied, when you look at the map, major parts of ukraine are being strangled. russia is closing in, even with the problems they are having. according to moscow, its military was engaged in high-precision strikes against facilities that are being used for information attacks against russia. ukraine's second largest city

kharkiv also came under intense shelling. air strikes hit kharkiv's residential buildings, killing at least ten civilians. president volodymyr zelenskyy denounced the attacks, saying, quote, nobody will forgive. nobody will forget. kharkiv has been the target of some of the worst aerial attacks since the invasion began. other cities also came under constant barrage of shelling as ukrainian officials said russian forces had blocked off a major port city on the black sea. nbc news has not been able to independently verify that claim so far. according to britain's defense my industry, three ukrainian cities are encircled by russian forces. this as ukraine's interior ministry said yesterday that at least 40,000 people were without food and water. u.s. officials say the 40-mile long russian military convoy

headed towards kyiv seems to be advancing more slowly than expected, partly because of fuel and food shortages. willie? >> all of this, mika, leading to a massive and growing refugee crisis. joining us from a train station at the polish border with ukraine is nbc news correspondent kelly cobiella. good morning. what are you seeing there? >> reporter: good morning, willie. well, we're hearing from people today that more of them are coming from kharkiv and kyiv as the fighting in those cities gets more intense. people are telling us that it is still taking hours, days, in fact, to get here. getting to the train station and then that very difficult journey just on incredibly packed trains. sometimes from the capital coming all the way through, taking 11, 12, 15 hours to get here. we spoke to a mother just yesterday who had arrived from the center of the country, from

the same town that the president, volodymyr zelenskyy, is from. she said she left her sister, her husband, her parents behind. she didn't want to leave, but she said they had to get the children out. take a listen to what she and her daughter told us. >> reporter: unicef is saying that half of the refugees who are coming are children. not hard to believe based on what we've seen over the past six days now. and you know we've talked ability this before, the volunteer effort is absolutely

astounding. it gives you goosebumps to see these people being welcomed so warmly here. there have been a few incidents, or at least one incident overnight, sadly, a disturbing incident of a group of men attacking some indian citizens who came over from ukraine. but the locals here are saying they've brought in more police. they're trying desperately to keep people safe here and get them shelter, get them to a warm place, somewhere they can recover from the trauma they've been through. >> as the numbers grow, people flooding to the border of poland. mika, the front page of the "new york times" shows a family, a mother in tears tolding her holding her children as they escape through moldova. the u.n. calling this perhaps the greatest refugee crisis of the century. >> unbelievable. the response in poland is truly incredible. we're talking about up to 700,000 refugees now fleeing

ukraine. many and most of those ending up in poland. president biden last night in his state of the union address talked about the situation in ukraine and talked about the american response. take a listen. >> our forces are not going to europe to fight ukraineto allie moves west. we have mobilized american ground forces, air squadrants. the united states and our allies will defend every inch of territory that is nato territory with a full force of our collective power. every single inch. [ applause ] i know what's happening can seem alarming to all americans. but i want you to know, we're going to be okay. we're going to be okay.

when the history of this era is written, putin's war will have left russia weaker and the rest of the world stronger. [ applause ] while it shouldn't have taken something so terrible for people around the world to see what's at stake, now everyone sees it clearly. we see the unity among leaders of nations, a more unified europe, a more unified west. we see unity among the people who are gathering in cities and large crowds around the world, even in russia, to demonstrate their support for the people of ukraine. in the battle between democracy and autocracies, democracies are rising to the moment. the world is clearly choosing the side of peace and security. this is the real test. it's going to take time. let us continue to draw

inspiration from the iron will of the ukrainian people. six days ago, russia's vladimir putin sought to shake the very foundations of the free world. thinking he could make it bend to his menacing ways. but he badly miscalculated. he thought he could roll into ukraine and the world would roll over. instead, he was met with a wall of strength he never anticipated or imagined. he met the ukraiian people. [ applause ] >> president biden in his state of the union last night. joining us now live from lviv, ukraine, nbc news foreign correspondent matt bradley. matt, what is the latest? >> reporter: well, i was driving down from kharkiv in the northeast of the country, and we've been on a several long day, you know, drive all the way from east to west. what we've seen is regular bombardments, air-raid sirens, a population that is really very

much on edge. even when they're far from the bombardments that have been shelling in places like wherewe started our journey. we saw shelling that went from the outside of the city. when it started, we were hearing it in the distance. then we started hearing it very, very close to the center. that's when we decided it was time to leave. so we took off. since then, the russians have been taking that city to task. they've been shelling residential areas, hospitals. in freedom square, right next to the hotel where we were. shelled and nearly destroyed what is essentially the city hall and the opera that was right near it. killing civilians. you know, using cluster bombs which the u.s. hasn't used in decades. they're banned by 110 different countries. russia is not a party to the ban. the united states isn't party to that ban. the international community really discourages the use of cluster munitions.

we're seeing them used quite in a widespread way. the reason why is these cluster bombs, they drop, then they cluster. they spread sort of bomblets around an area, and it makes it very hard to target places that don't have civilians in them. instead, they're essentially indiscriminate bombing. that's what is threatening about them. that's the tide we're seeing turn here. we're starting to see the russians as they become more frustrated. remember, they really believed that they would be -- have an easy victory here. the ukrainian military would flee, and their overwhelming military capability would take over the country. and some cities, like russian-speaking cities, might welcome them with open arms. that's not happened. we're seeing a dejected, frustrated military that probably didn't realize they were signing up for this. you know, moving into cities and city centers, not being able to take them. so we're starting to see

civilians in the crosshairs, on the front lines. it's really very, very sad. we left the city a couple day ago and moved south to an industrial city right in the center of the country. since then, we've heard a lot of bomb sirens and some bomb raids. we've haven't seen quite as much in the way of actual bombardments. now, we cross the country, and that's where we joined an exodus of hundreds of thousands of cars who were crossing the country. this was really shocking. we spent hours and hours in traffic, crossing successive checkpoints with ukrainian soldiers who were extremely jittery. at one point, we were wearing our body armor, and i was kind of dozing off in the car. soldiers came up to the car with ak-47s drawn, demanded we get out. they made members of my team sort of kneel on the ground with their hands up. i was with my hands up, too, standing, staring out into the woods while they checked our

cars. we could hear themcocking and re-cocking the ak-47s. even when they're not on the front lines of places like kyiv, it is a population on guard. they're worried, in addition to the shelling they're seeing and this massive convoy of armored vehicles and tanks that are coming down from the north, they're worried about these sabotage squads of russians that had made their way into the capital of kyiv and were starting to wreak havoc long before the front line started to move toward that city. there's a lot to worry about, even in places like here in lviv, where we've been hearing, since i arrived here late last night, the air-raid sirens going on and on, even though there hasn't been a single bombardment that was audible from this city. again, this is just a population that is just waiting for the other foot to drop. here in this city, this is a jumping off point to the border with poland and hungary. there are a lot of folks here who are desperate, absolutely

desperate to get out. guys? >> matt, last night, we heard president biden talking about a reinforcing of the ukrainians, getting weapons to them. we've been hearing the eu, nato nations all talking about shipping weapons to the ukrainians. i'm wondering, from your vantage point in western ukraine, whether you are seeing evidence of that, or whether you're hearing on the ground that actually all of those supplies, those military supplies are, in fact, coming in. >> reporter: i mean, i have to tell you, joe, i just got to lviv last night around 1:00 a.m. after this 16-hour drive from the center of the country. >> okay. >> reporter: but every place we've been since in this long drive we've had all across the country, everybody who says, when we say we're americans, they say, "we need guns. we need help. we need support. tell america to send weapons, to send help." that's the message we keep getting. they're welcoming this.

even after this situation where we were greeted at gunpoint, once they were satisfied we weren't carrying anything bad in our cars, they were all smiles. they were slapping us on the back. they said, you know, "screw the russians." except they didn't say "screw," you know. there is a spirited movement. if you're from the west, americans, you're in a position to help. they feel they can fight the russians off. everyone though this is russia's battle to lose, they think they have the upper hand, because they do. they have shown so far, they've belied every single military assessment that's come their way. surprised and really impressed the world. guys? >> nbc's matt bradley, thank you so much for your reporting. please be safe. richard haass is back with us. also, former senator claire mccaskill. she served on the arms

committee. also, national affairs analyst john heilemann. he is in poland this morning. richard haass, what do you know? what have you heard about weapons getting from western powers into ukraine? all the pledges are there. all the commitments are there. we've heard about the eu fighters that are going over there. again, every ukrainian saying, we need weapons. we need ammunition. have you had any reports about how the progress is going there? >> joe, one of the ironies of this war is both sides underestimated what it would take to prevail. on the russian side, they thought it would be easy. their armed forces are not really prepared to fight this kind of a war. they're obviously running into tons of logistical and other problems, the conscripts don't know what they're doing, are not effectively trained. on our side, we hadn't prepositioned nearly enough equipment for the kind of war we

now find ourselves in. the emphasis was on deterrence. plan b is what would happen if deterrence failed. what we're trying to do now is catch up, to scramble into plan b. the problem is we can't fly things in. you've got to get stuff over to europe, poland or romania from the united states. you have to connect it with ukrainian troops. you have to get the equipment to the soldiers. sometimes the soldiers to the people. you have to train people up in some cases. we are playing catchup, and that's the situation. so you have these duelling timetables. you have the russian siege, which is going more slowly than they thought. and we have our ability to help ukraine, which is going more slowly than we should. that's where we are. >> claire mccaskill, obviously, we've known who vladimir putin is for a very long time. he invaded georgia in 2008. invaded ukraine in 2014. 2015 into syria. we know exactly who he is.

he's been bombing hospitals in syria, killing civilians. going out of his way to inflict massive civilian casualties across curious, why has this country been ill-prepared over the trump years and the past 10, 12, 13 years? >> i think there was probably too much wishful thinking, that putin would not back his way into what i see as a historical trap for him. how does he exit this without distancing russia from the rest of the world for decades and decades to come? the pain on the russian people is going to be severe. i do want to point out, one of the things we haven't talked about enough in this, is the reason putin was so pro-trump is he was counting on trump to get the united states out of nato. that's what putin wanted. that's why he waited.

he thought if he could get trump a second term, he would finally bust up nato. that's how he builds his empire back. that's what this nutjob wants. he wants the go back to an empire. he wants all the countries that broke away from the ussr to come back under the russian umbrella. the key to that is busting up nato. donald trump was his best friend in trying to bust up nato. that's why he didn't go under trump. that's why he is going now. he saw this as his last opportunity, when he believed there was still divisions between nato and divisions of such in the united states that would weaken us. >> it's chilling. >> we weren't as prepared as we should have been, but i think we are a hell of a lot more prepared than putin thought we would be. >> it is chilling, but everything trump was doing as it pertains to russia, secret meetings, cozying up to putin, getting dirt on a political rival, it kind of explains where we are today. it set the scene. it set the stage.

>> yeah. john bolton actually laid it out very clearly. there's a reason why he have trying to gut nato for four years and why he openly had contempt for nato. >> trashed it. >> the reason why is we're seeing right now just how powerful nato can be when the united states is behind it. in fact, nato is now more powerful after donald trump was talking about trashing it, more powerful today than it has been at any time probably since the early 1960s. >> at least. i mean, it is amazing. condoleezza rice the other day said the biden administration had brought nato together in a way that was amazing and that hadn't been possible since the end of this -- since the beginning of nato. she said it on fox to a surprised looking host. >> yeah. >> but no, it is extraordinary. two extraordinary things have

happened. number one, the way the allies have come together. number two, the way the world has been inspired by president zelenskyy and the ukrainians, the way they have fought off the russians. >> right. >> i think part of the reason there wasn't more prepositioning of material and weaponry and everything is that nobody really thought that the ukrainians could resist an all-out russian onslaught, right? >> right. >> if it came, the russians would take over, and then we'd deal with it later. that's not the way it worked out. the ukrainians not only fought back but have fought back so effectively and so bravely and so inspiringly, i think. >> yeah. >> you know, i mean, history is not deterministic, right? individuals make a difference. in this case, that's an individual, president zelenskyy, who is making a huge difference in the world right now. >> speaking of making a huge difference, we have to say it, and it was eluded to, also that

vladimir putin has done more to bring nato together. >> absolutely. >> the miscalculations extraordinary. but while talking about nato, john heilemann, i want to reflect on a conversation last night when you were in poland. i was talking about a friend of mika's, whose parents had, you know, memories of what happened in world war ii, with nazis coming in, then soviets sweeping in. you know, their suitcases are packed and at the ready. you were talking about people in estonia and lithuania and latvia, also fearful that the united states might not defend them. i thought it was so important last night for those reasons. i thought one of the more powerful moments of the speech was when joe biden made no secret of the fact. he said, every single inch of nato territory will be defended

with the full might of the united states of america. there's really no gray space there. he's saying, an inch -- if a russian steps onto the ground in estonia, latvia, lithuania, in poland, in romania, good luck and meet the 82nd airborne. it is going to be a really long week for you there. >> and they're there in poland. >> right. >> yeah. guys, first of all, i got to spend the morning with mika's brother, mark, who i know he gets a lot of praise on this show, and he deserves it. he is a wonderful guy. i think maybe mika, as brilliant as your father but not quite as intimidating. he did call me stunningly superficial at least once in the conversation, which i felt good about. >> he would never, yeah. >> there is a history there, as joe remembers. you know, joe, you're hitting the thing, the first thing we talked about this morning. we went back and looked at the -- all of the foreign policy

section of the speech lastwatch together and talked about it. mark honed in on those words, "every inch of territory." in diplomacy, all those words are carefully chosen. the sequence in that speech, in which he named some of the countries you mentioned, romania, latvia, estonia, poland, which i think maybe was not feeling as insecure, was intentional. he enumerates them and then says every inch of territory, nato will defend. mark brzezinski's point of view is that was exactly the message all these countrcountries, coun that border ukraine and may soon be bordering the russian federation if vladimir putin takes over ukraine over the course of the coming weeks and months, they need to hear that. i think, you know, in poland, mika knows, you know, and mark confirmed today, there's trepidation here.

people are nervous. they're not panicked though. the difference between people who are nervous and panicked is a huge gulf. the reason is people feel the full embrace of nato. they think that, joe, your point last night, this is, you know, if putin ever decides to push into poland, russia will be incinerated, evaporated by the 82nd airborne and other forces. it doesn't feel that -- that level of confidence is absent in some of the smaller countries. it is absent because a lot of them feel as though they've been telling us, the larger countries in the west, that this is what putin was going to do. they've been telling it to us for 15 years, and we've been ignoring them. you see their defense ministers and prime ministers and deputy prime ministers all over european television saying, "we told you this was going to happen eventually. you didn't listen. we'd take the apology any time you'd like. you might want to listen now,

when we say if vladimir putin takes ukraine, he'll be looking at us next. he won't stop with ukraine. believe us. we were right before, and we're probably right now." i think joe biden was speaking directly to people in those countries, people with those fears. again, for mark brzezinski's point of view, who knows this country way better than i ever will, he felt like, for this audience, that joe biden said all the right things last night. it is definitely the case that this audience here in poland and around the region, they were definitely -- they didn't necessarily watch live last night, but they woke up today and were watching the speech to hear what biden had to say. >> the war on ukraine was front and center last night. the president led with it. he spent 10 to 15 minutes on it. you had moments of bipartisanship, which are vanishingly rare these days. to see republicans and democrats stand and give an ovation for ukraine and for this cause. how did the president handle that within the context of the speech, and a larger question,

how is he handling the american response to what's happening there? >> i think he captured this rare moment of unity in our country right now. i think he led with it. for joe biden, i think he did a pretty good job of getting everyone to the same place at the same time, all going the same direction, which is a remarkable achievement. we need to thank putin for that. he has unified our country, which has been a tough thing to do lately. i think the other thing that was interesting about the speech, after he set the table with the unity around ukraine, he did move into other things where there is also a lot of agreement in the country. some of the domestic policies. importantly, joe biden, at a moment that i think it matters, said secure the border. and reform immigration. and fund the police. fund the police. he said that several times. and do that while we're reforming the police. so he really went straight at

the republican talking points. if you noticed, when he said fund the police and people stood up and slapped, even mitch mcconnell had to stand up. he could barely move his arms to clap, but he stood up. this were times, i think, that joe biden did exactly the right thing last night. by going to those places where there is such broad agreement in the country. >> ted cruz leaping to his feet on the immigration for president biden, too, something we don't see often. jonathan lemire, the president saying, open the schools. keep the schools open. we have to move forward through this. >> yeah. he did indeed. he wanted to turn the page. the backdrop of the capitol itself provided evidence of that. it was not shoulder to shoulder. there was some distances. some republicans stayed home, adding to the empty seats. lawmakers were not wearing masks for the most part. it was an effort to symbolize, we're in a new phase in this pandemic. that was part of the speech. the original hope for this speech, before the russian crisis really escalated, was to

use it as a domestic reset. claire, i want to get to more on that. it's noteworthy in a state of the union, what the president talks about, and it is also what he chooses not to talk about. he didn't mention donald trump's name, but he rarely does. he gave voting right asa passing mention. he put the centerpiece of his presidency, save democracy at home to prove it works abroad. he didn't mention january 6th at all. no talk of the insurrection last night. he never used the phase "build back better," though he talked about the individual programs. how did the president focus things at home? >> i was grateful for the fact he didn't use the term "build back better." he said american rescue plan. nobody knows what the american rescue plan was. they know child tax credit was in it. there was help for businesses to stay open.

then he did talk about infrastructure, which people do know what it is. >> sure. >> the democrats have to begin to be simple and consistent and disciplined about a message. joe biden created more jobs in the first year of his presidency than any president in the history of america. that's startling. most americans don't know that. the democrats have not had that simple, disciplined message. i think joe biden tried to get there last night. you can say a lot of things that are important got passing reference, jonathan. we got to the laundry list part, which drives me crazy. i don't know why every president thinks the state of the union has to be a laundry list, but it began to feel like a laundry list. it made it feel like the stuff he was mentioning wasn't important. of course it was. that's why it was on the laundry list. >> there's a lot going on. claire mccaskill, thank you very much. still ahead on "morning joe," former "daily show" host jon stewart is headed back to capitol hill to push for a bill for america's veterans. before we talks to lawmakers,

he'll join us on set. as we go to break, children in new york are back in school this week without masks after new york governor kathy hochul lifted the mandate. the vaccines helped make that possible. i recently sat down with two leaders from pfizer who were at the forefront of vaccine development. foster and boyce worked on the front lines of pfizer's efforts to develop a covid vaccine, juggling work and family throughout the pandemic. their inspiring story is on knowyourvalue.com. catch it there. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. stress seems to evaporate into thin air. which leaves us to wonder, where does it go? does it shoot off like a rocket? or float off into the clouds? daddy! or maybe it takes on a life all its own.

perhaps you'll come up with your own theory of where the stress goes. behind the wheel of a lincoln is a mighty fine place to start.

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save up to $750 on a new samsung device with eligible trade-in. for more than two years, covid impacted every decision in our lives and the life of this nation. i know you're tired, frustrated, and exhausted. because of the progress we've made, because of your resilience, and the tools that we have provided by this

congress, tonight i can say we're moving forward safely back to a normal -- more normal routine. the shutdown of schools and businesses, we have the tools we need. it is time for america to get back to work and fill our great downtowns again with people. people working from home can feel safe and begin to return to their offices. we're doing that here in the federal government. the vast majority of federal workers will once again work in person. our schools are open. let's keep it that way. our kids need to be in school. the most fundamental right in america is the right to vote and have it count. look, it is under assault. in state after state, new laws have been passed that not only suppress the vote, we've been there before, but subvert the election. we can't let this happen. i call on the senate to pass the

freedom to vote action, pass the john lewis voting rights act. while you're at it, pass the disclosure act so americans know who is funding the elections. the answer is not to defund the police. >> that's right. >> it is to fund the police. fund them. fund them. [ applause ] >> fund them with resources and training. resources and training. >> a lot of republicans stood up for that last night. he did not mention former president trump. only a couple of tax cuts for the wealthy. he did not mention the january 6th attack on the capitol. he didn't mention the party's stalled build back better legislation by name. joining us now, former chief of

staff to the dcc. senior aide to the hillary clinton and biden presidential campaigns. msnbc contributor mike barnicle is with us. and the host of msnbc's "politics nation" and president of the national action network, reverend al sharpton is with us. good to have you all this block. first of all, reverend al, your thoughts on the president's comments last night, especially about funding the police. did he say enough on issues pertaining to black lives mattering? >> i think the statement about voting rights, i would have loved him to elaborate more. but he did talk about the freedom to vote. he talked legislation and john lewis. because we must remember, as we are talking aboutukraine, we ha laws being changed to suppress

the vote in the united states. you can't be a global democratic defender and a domestic allower of repressing the vote. according to some reports, a percent of the early voters, their ballots were thrown out. talking about funding the police, the devil is in the details. i think he said, at the same time, he's got to deal with police reform. funding them to do what? they must work on the ground with community groups because we must deal with reforming police. but at the same time, deal with public safety. just last week, a federal jury

convicted police for being accomplices or complicit with the death of george floyd by a policeman. so we can't act as though we're not dealing with all these issues at one time. so i'm glad the president addressed them. i think that he could elaborate more. but i'm glad he raised them because you can't have the state of the union without dealing with the voting crisis that we're in and the police misconduct and public safety crisis that we're in at the same time. >> we were talking about this off air, the president had a lot of audiences. vladimir putin and our allies, the american people. but let's talk about his message and people who had to really like what they heard him say. those 25, 30 democrats that are in the swing districts that are going to determine who is going to be the next speaker of the house. he talked about funding the police, not defunding the

police. that takes that attack off. >> yeah. >> he talked about strengthening the southern border and reforming immigration. so he spoke to that issue. what else did he talk about that would be unifying and also would help democrats in those swing districts? >> yeah. he also talked about inflation. you know, joe, there have been a lot of polls out there that showed that the american people do consider inflation and rising prices to be a top priority, but they don't always see that coming from the -- making that a priority from the white house. he nipped that in the bud last night. he made it very clear that he had a plan for dealing with inflation, and he didn't go into, oh, i'm going to pass the build back better act. we went line by line in terms of how he'll address inflation. expanding the child tax credit. lowering the cost of prescription drugs. he made it clear, he wasn't going to lowering wages. he was going to lower the cost for american families. really explained how he was going to do that. i sort of called him the

explainer-in-chief last night. when it comes to why ukraine matters to us politically and economically here at home, how he is going to deal with the other domestic issues we're facing at home, ranging from inflation to, of course, what the reverend talked about, police reform, voting rights, things that need to get done, he explained not only house he was -- how he was going to do it but why it was important. >> finally, finally, instead of saying build back better and then, you know, some monstrous figure, right, of $1.9 trillion or whatever, he talked about the individual items. yes, are or were in the package, but that are actually really quite popular. one by one, explained what they are. here's what i'd like to do. here's how it is going to help. you know, certainly in

retrospect, it's how it should have been from the beginning. better late than never. >> mike barnicle, i was struck by how unifying this speech was. joe biden has been criticized over the past year by pundits for running as a moderate, governing the first year, talking like a progressive, being too extreme for a lot of people in the suburbs who voted for him. last night, he talked about funding the police, strengthening borders. he talked about bringing insulin prices down. he talked about making big pharma negotiate on medicare costs. he talked about making billionaires -- like, these are what we call in the political business 90/10 issues. he talked about freedom in ukraine. he talked about made in usa. how important it was to have it stamped in there, made in usa. he touched on a couple of issues that are 50/50 issues that might divide americans. for the most part, this reminded

me of bill clinton's school uniform speeches. the era of big government was over. where clinton was mocked. we republicans derided him for saying those sort of things. but it connected with the middle class people. it connected with middle america. i thought, despite it all this morning, last night was a reset for the joe biden presidency. >> you saw last night in 62 minutes the difficulty and the expanse of the job of being president of the united states. it's a hard job. daily, it is a fire hose of issues and problems, all day, every day. including weekends. doesn't go away. in 62 minutes, you saw the commander in chief talking about ukraine. you saw the president of the united states talking about domestic iissues, about funding the police, getting kids back into school.

you saw joe biden say happy birthday to the young boy who was there with diabetic. you saw the expanse of his personality in full blossom. angry about ukraine. really angry about putin. frustrated about empty office buildings here in new york and throughout the country. frustrated that more kids haven't been in school full time for a while. frustrated about the normal issues that plague american families. gas prices. you saw it all last night in 62 minutes. i think it was a very, very solid night for the president of the united states, for the commander in chief, and for joe biden, citizen of america. >> open the schools and keep them open. i also thought there was a nice moment, mika, where we actually saw joe biden saying, i know we were divided. we can't change that. let's come together as a country and recognize this as the deadly disease that it is.

let's do it in a bipartisan way. republicans and democrats standing up for the moment. it was a nice touch. >> a lot of opportunities to unify. joining us now, the co-chairs of the house problem solvers caucus. democratic congressman josh got haimer of new jersey and congressman fitzpatrick of pennsylvania. together, they delivered a bipartisan response to president biden's state of the union last night. congressman fitzpatrick, i'll start with you. what was the response, and where were the places you could come together and solve problems? >> mika, good to see you. ukraine is the top issue on the minds of everyone right now. i was handing out flags, ukrainian flags, to every member of congress last night, mika. everybody from the freedom caucus to the progressive caucus and everyone in between happily took it. this is an issue that unified our congress right now. it is unifying our country, as

your panelists mentioned earlier. this is a moment we have to capture. because this is going to be a pivotal point, not just for our country but for world order, for democracy, for freedom-loving nations across the world. what we do here matters. we have to get this right. that's why we got to make sure the sanctions package is full and complete. the defensive military assistance to ukraine is full and complete. the participation of our nato allies is full and complete. there was an eu vote yesterday that's going to advance to the full, you know, security council vote that will go to the full nato and then also an eu vote yesterday regarding ukrainian membership into the eu. some nations are still abstaining. we are going to be speaking to them and making sure that ukraine has the unapologetic support. >> representative gottheimer,

talking about members who are in the rare swing districts must have liked what they heard last night. joe biden talking about, hey, let's open schools and keep them open. talking about not defunding the police but, instead, funding police. strengthening the southern border. making big pharma negotiate on medicare. bringing down insulin prices and not letting pharmaceutical companies gouge people with diabetes. making billionaires pay their fair share. i mean, these are -- again, these are 90/10 issues. joe biden, it seems, tried to speak to the middle of this country and also to the very things you all work on every day. >> i agree. i agree with adrienne in what was said. it was a moment of unity. you could see republicans and democrats coming together on ukraine, standing up for democracy, of course, and also on issues like affordability, whether it is prescription drugs or making sure people could afford gas prices or groceries.

those are the issues on people's minds. standing by law enforcement and standing up to crime and getting past covid. it was great to see people taking their masks off yesterday as we move to the next phase here. people really want us to come together as a nation. they want us to get things done for them. domestic manufacturing, made in america. these are issues that people care about at home. it's what i hear about all the time. they want us to work together and get things done. there was a unity agenda that the president laid out. you're talking about opioids and cancer and mental health issues. these are all items that brian and i worked on together and the problem solvers caucus worked on. we can and must get it done. >> co-chairs of the problem solvers caucus, congressman brian fitzpatrick and josh gottheimer. thank you very much. important work you are doing. reverend al sharpton, thank you, as well, for coming on this morning. >> rev, stay with us, if you will. i have a question on the other side of the break. coming up, the latest on the

fighting in ukraine, as the country resists russian forces for a seventh day. plus, the chair of the house veterans affairs committee joins us, alongside jon stewart, to discuss health care for american as we mentioned, president biden spoke last night about the need to lower the cost of prescription drugs. that's something democratic senator elizabeth warren has been fighting for. she joins us ahead. plus new reporting on the intelligence community's effort to get inside vladimir putin's head and understand his thinking. "morning joe" is coming right back. "morning joe" is coming right back -dad, what's with your toenail? -oh, that...? i'm not sure... -it's a nail fungus infection. -...that's gross! -it's nothing, really... -it's contagious. you can even spread it to other people. -mom, come here! -don't worry about it. it'll go away on its own!

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. our troops in iraq will face many dangers. one being staged at bases breatheing in toxic smoke from

burn pits many of you have been there. i have been in and out of iraq and afghanistan over 40 times. these burn piecings incinerate waste. the waste of war, medical and hazards material, jet fuel and so much more. and they come home, many the best trained warriors of the world. never the same. headation, numbness, dizziness. a cancer that would put them in a flag-draped coffin. i know. one of those soldiers is my sonoma josh bo biden. i don't know for sure if the burn pit that he lived near that his coach was there in kosovo caused his brain cancer and disease of so many other troops, but i am committed to find out

everything we can. >> president biden speaking last night about the toxic capitals he believes his late son was going through in afganistan e iraqi. he is working on a healthcare coverage for 3 million veterans dealing with similar issues. joining us democratic congressman from california, the chairman of the veteran's affairs committee and jon stewart is with us. the show is "the problem with jon saw the ready." >> he will go for for this. >> on apple tv. he's an advocate of the bill. he's worked tirelessly to help veterans and health responders get the help they deserve. >> tell us about the while to surpass? >> well, it's a comprehence ev aroach. it mainly deals with expose

years to iraq veterans. it concedes 3.5 million veterans, they get access to healthcare. we have 23 presumptions, we've reformed the presumption making process so that it's fairer and we don't put the burn on our veterans. >> right. >> we give them the benefit of the doubt. they shouldn't be in a place where they are fighting their own government for healthcare and benefits -- >> can you explain, a lot of people heard the president talk about burn pits and have no idea what they are. can you explain what they are and why the president believes his son may have actually gotten cancer from one of these burn pits? >> look, when you are moving hundreds of thousands of military personnel into an area,

100,000 i've seen the infrastructure of the place. in order to deal with the trash, the refuge, old computers, whatever, tires, the military dug up these huge burn pits, by the way, would never allowed in any town in the united states of america poured jet fuel on whatever they put in there and lit them on fire and our military service members were subjected to this 24/seven. >> houveng has that been going on? is this an ongoing? >> it's been an ongoing issue. we don't apply osha regulations to the military, it's true. >> they have sovereign immunity if they are doing it if it's

dangerous. it's not like you can sue them. >> i was talking to john before the segment. look, we know that when you burn plastic, you burn diesel and you are subjected to that exposure, it's going to cause cancer, there are going to be health effects. but here's the thing, the military never kept good records on what they put in these puts. that's being used as the reason for why we can't scientifically link the expose year to the veterans and their illnesses. >> willie is in new york. he has a question. >> i appreciate the great work you have done for veterans, i think our much cal wal friend deserves a lot of respect for bringing this to people's attention many, many years ago. his state of the union was

extraordinary and welcome. my dad was in yeem. he suffered adverse effects from agent orange. so to your point, it has been going on a long time. what is the response on capitol hill? you famously had to fight and shake your fists at a bunch of congress people to get them to may attention. are things different in terms of responding to this issue for you? >> i think it's getting there. ground zero after 911 in some ways, the original burn pit. ground zero was a burn pit. all those materials, cement, plastics. the same as in afghanistan as well. jet fuel on top of those. those fumes because fdny was so meticulous in their longitudinal health studies for their members before 9/11.

we were able draw conclusions on their illnesses after 9/11. you didn't have that kind of record, so it's a little bit more of a rough hill. the advocates burn hill 3 victims. vso with paul rye croft and jeremy butler and tom porter, jen birch. they have been working for years to get this to people's attention, finally we've got the pact act on the floor of the house. it's a comprehensive bill. there is going to be a bait and switch. you guys understand this as well as anybody. ranking member boss has a bill that says, okay. the pact act is what's necessary. that's what's going to fix the problem. what if we give the veterans what we can get away with? how about that? it's keeper. it doesn't actually fix the problem. there will be an amendment on

the floor of the house to substitute this comprehensive bill thatistically says why don't we expand access to healthcare from five years to ten years around call it a debt. >> instead of worrying about the specific. >> instead of worrying about the specific problem, burn pit exposure, toxic exposure. i can remember you go down to walter reed if 2003/2004, their prosthetic and amputation care was you know, you'd have guys lost both legs, just above the fee and their physical therapy was they'd lie on a matt and roll a medicine ball back and forth. if you go down there now, it's world class, state of the art, the adaptive rehabilitation is technically advanced. they're corrective surgeries. but that was intentional.

they made it intentional. our toxic exposure care isn't first class yet. the pact act changes that. it makes it known that what these soldiers are exposed to is like an ied that goes off in your body seven years later, ten years later. it will not take care of what needs to be taken care of. >> in case people wonder if this is some obscure ar cane issue. according to iava 86% of post-9/11 veterans reported expose years to burn pits and toxins. almost everybody that served over there, iraq, afghanistan, is impacted in some way by this. >> absolutely. you couldn't escape stuff like that, whatever theater, afghanistan or iraq. jon stewart off what willie pointed out, what do you think the problem is with our culture in that i bet more people can tell you what's on netflix

tonight that could tell you about the fact that one in three veterans come back from our wars afflicted by invisible things, post-traumatic stress syndrome. drug addiction. depression, anxiety what does it say about us as a nation the gift of a dpraftful nation we are not gratifying enough, not pleasing enough, you know, to recognize the issues that face veterans? >> i hate to say this, in some ways it's by design. you saw in the vietnam era when there was a draft and people's sons and daughters were involved in this. it created a nationwide protest movement and unrest and an all volunteer army issese year to put off. but the burden of our wars, the onus on the war on terror has been born by less than 1% of the

country and the rest of under the circumstances, famously what did george bush say, consume. you go ahead, everybody go shop. we got this. well, he didn't have it, it was the families, not just the soldiers, but their families. the care-givers, daniel robinson, who was there last night. who is the wife of sergeant first class heath robinson who died of lung cancer caused by toxic exposure. the blog 10 acres wide, burning 24 hours a day, seven days a week. you know, their families and care-givers bear the entire burden of our wars. when you look at strongal appropriations, man, we always have money for war and we support the troops until the troops need support but we never have main to pay for the consequences of those. >> there is a bidding going on between the parties who can support ukraine more. the president said 6.5 billion.

congress is saying, that's not enough. let's do 10 billion. i want that same sort of one upsmanship to return to taking care of america's veterans. there is unfinished business. this generation of veterans, burn pits are what are to act org agent orange was to vietnam veterans. i had the pleasure to push through the vietnam veterans act which extended agent orange presumptions to our naval service members. that was four years late. >> right. >> a lot of these guys died before they could see the benefits of this bill. >> right. >> the danger of bait and switch and addressing 16,000 veterans

versus the 3.5 million who might have been exposed is that we will repeat the terrible history of agent orange. >> you are so right, john, are you so right, everybody salutes the troops when they leave. they like putting the bumper sticker on the back of the vans saying 10 sponsors off ihop. >> this is happening forever. you come back, suddenly the veterans are forgotten. >> this is the true cost of war. you got lamp le jeune, soldiers down there were drink benzene in the groundwater. this is about recognizing the toxic exposure is a part of the cost of war. >> i have to ask you before you go about another comedian, zelenskyy. >> yes. >> it's just an extraordinary. >> extraordinary. i mean, for, look, i am a comedienne, i know comediennes.

i don't know that we would be able to rise to the challenge of being in a movie about war. >> right. >> you see this gentleman's courage and tenacity, the way he is leading his country. it's incredibly moving. i just my fear for ukraine is that we're going to get sucked into this idea of a heroic narrative while these folks get surrounded in a long-term siege that will cause so much more death and instruction. >> so much more to worry about, thank you both very much for coming on. >> thank you for having us. i have a suggestion for you, have you ever called of a show called afternoon joe? >> we're kind of moving that way. >> we love starting early. >> we manifest where we kind of move forward. >> this doesn't just happen.

>> what about licked? >> kristen is going to take over cnn and i look forward to them coming back to colbert in about three months. >> there you go. >> i tell john. >> we want to get to the latest on the ongoing bloodshed. we will have a live report in just a moment. first, here is a scene from british parliament an often fractious place that today stood united in support of the ukrainian people. >> finally, i have the ukraine ambassador, i welcome the ukraine ambassador. >> here, here!

. [ applause ] >> an interesting note there, prime minister boris johnson says he believes war crimes have already been committed, so there are implications of what can be coming at the haiku. all this amid a violent day in ukraine, russia hits heavy shelling and airstrikes. in kiev, a russian missile hit a tv tower and nearby holocaust tower. it forced television stations off the air. the military was engaged if high precision strikes used for information attacked against russia. that's their propaganda, not very precise. the second city kiev came under intense shilling. joining us, cnn correspondent

keir simmons. good morning, what else can you tell us? >> reporter: i think we got an insight into the attitude inside the kremlin from some comments made by dmitry peskov just today. he was asked about the decision to halt nord stream 2 between russia and germany. he said economically it doesn't make logical sense and he said that it will open at some point and just keep in mind when i read these comments to you that all kind of companies like dominos are cutting their connections to here. apple, google pay. but dmitry peskov said this. reopening nord stream 2, the hysterical reality so far makes this impossible. sooner or later his theory will pass, sober assessments will take its place. that i think is an insight into what the kremlin believes about the attitude of the west and the economic challenges it is

facing. if it can ride it out and dmitry peskov pretty much said this in response to what president biden said at the states of the union. if the economy is experiencing a serious blow as a margin of safety, we will stand on our feet. you know really we were talking last hour about the siege of leningrad, that siege seared in the memories of the russian people. i wouldn't underestimate that siege mentality that president putin is trying to tap into, to say we russians are stronger. we will finds our way through this. of course, ukraine, too, is under siege and i think on the flipside of that, because they are subjected to russian siege. how will the russians respond to that if they see that because of that memory of the one of the worst sieges in history in st. petersburg, where 1.5 million people died.

in terms of the battle on the ground, the battle of the hearts and minds. think you are seeing that on a daily basis here in russia and at the same time, of course, state television telling people a limited amount of information and we've seen independent radio, independent television shut down just overnight. i would say this, too, willie, the 6,800 protesters who have been arrested so far are more than a million who signed a petition in russia against the war i suspect those people would have liked to have seen president biden devote his entire speech to the situation in ukraine. >> nbc news' keir simmons, thanks so much. mika. >> all right. let's bring in nbc news chief foreign affairs correspondent and host of andrea mitchell

reports, andrea mitchell, a 26-year veteran of the cia serving in iraq and afghanistan and is one of the agency's most decorated field officers. good to have you all on board with us. >> andrea, your take on what joe biden had to say last night. how it will play out in the war. >> me should have done more on ukraine. it was rallying, bipartisan. it just felt he left it too soon to go through a more traditional state of the union. i get he wanted to revive his democratic agenda, domestic agenda. i thought very smart on funding the police, very smart on covid, could have not tackled the other stuff. focus on talking about why we care. why should we care about ukraine in. >> a national world moment. >> this is a moment in history.

>> yes. >> he is perfectly positioned by his training, the leadership on the foreign relations committee, his devotion to these issues. this is his moment. why do we care this is democracy versus autocracies, this is a moment we haven't seen since the fall of the berlin wall. i covered reagan and the armed control negotiations. why does this matter? >> let's talk about that for a second. you have perspective. those of us at the table, not you all, of course, but those of us who are older, we've seen through the decades. >> you are very kind. >> we have seen the cold war up to 1989. we saw freedom sweep across central and eastern europe. we saw authoritarianism creep back in, starting in 2014/2015. there, in central europe, we saw it here in the united states. talk about, though, how it almost seems like this is sort

of the coda to 1989, that we actually, all the things that populists across the west have been proven wrong that nato works. the eu works. these western institutions started by harry truman and started in the post-war world are actually working better today than they've ever worked before. >> and for any of the criticism, all of the criticism we didn't do enough for ukraine soon enough, nato is as strong as it is right now because of all the work done by this administration to repair the damage over the last four years, the previous four years, all that work, all those trips, the meetings that lincoln went to and secretary austin and all the others, that's the kind of work to repair those and there was damage done with the afghanistan withdrawal with our nato allies. because we didn't give them enough notice of the way we were wrauk. they were in that fight. so, you know, but we repaired

that. and then i just don't think, i mean, this is not to say that it wasn't you know a serviceable speech. i just felt that he should have lived in that moment longer. he still can. this isn't the end of the story. >> you've said even before this war started before the russian went into ukraine. you said the key here is going to be the bind white house, having the nerve, having the guts, after the invasion to give the ukrainians what they need, to bleed the russians out, just like, well, just like we were bled out in afghanistan, lining we were bled out in iraq. just like the russians, thanks to a guy dr. brezinski bled out helped to bleed out the russians in afghanistan in 1979. >> that's right. you know, joe, i think back to the first day where i showed up at cia headquarters january 3rd, 2003. i was on the afghan desk

amazingly enough, handing over my desk was a stinger missile. we provide to the after gage mujahedeen. he says see that weapon system, that won the cold war. a pretty remarkable statement. i think president reagan deserves a lot of credit for providing the stingers. make no mistake, the afghan mujahedeen came from a memo, mika, written by your dad. >> yeah. >> he said clearly, we have to believe the soviets. we talk about sanctions, that's the right move on the economic front. we have to plan for insurgency. the metrix are, it will be gruesome, how many russians we send home in body bags. >> do you think the administration, do you think those on capitol hill are going to do what they did in afghanistan, what the russians did to us in afghanistan? >> i think it remains to be seen. there is certainly reluctance.

we've seen reporting that the idea of providing certainly weapon systems and introducing special operations or intelligence community forces inside ukraine. that's probably a step too far now. make no mistake, the intelligence community and special forces to spend a decade with the ukrainian government. we have very established ties to the national security establishment. we can do this. one thing i wonder, is there another charlie wilson out there? a congressman who will take on that mantle and push at times a resals trant administration forward and pro i the assistance they need. >> this is one thing marco rubio and the democrats are on the same page. >> right. >> so this is an area where you might find that very support. >> your latest report is on the cia's latest assessment of putin. as we discuss options here, the russians are bled out. they are somehow driven away by their support and the grit of

the ukrainians, this is a "what if" and then vladimir putin says, okay, i lost and then goes home? absolutely not. >> exactly. this is the dangerous aspect of it. you talk about bleeding the russians out. the real reality this is born by the ukrainian people. the longer the war stretches out, the longer the 34r50d shed will occur. you look at signals from washington, you are seeing u.s. officials say actually the ukrainians were behind them, were pushing for them. it is not a time when the u.s. is signaling, hey, guys, cut a deal. when you have those talks on the belorussian border, we want you to make maximum concessions. the u.s. is very comfortable withdrawing this out, drawing the russians out, bleeding them out. make no mistake, this is being borne on the backs of these brave men and women showing an incredible level of resistance even today while hour by hour

there are human rights abuses, bombing of schools and hospitals. it's an extraordinary effort right now. if are you sitting in the corridors power in washington, d.c., you also have to make the calculation, when do you tell the ukrainians actually concessions at the negotiating table are going to save lives some that is a huge dispute in washington. it doesn't have the appetite to do that at this point. >> what would the concessions be? >> we seen clearly what the russians want. they put out maximus demands, demille tarization, the ends of the government. >> no possibility of nato acceptance? >> absolutely. you might see some bending in that area. the reality is, you both know this so well. everyone at the table know this is so well. the ukrainians have been strung along with the promise of nato integration for all practical purposes probably never going to happen so what do you actually give up by saying we're never going to be a member of nato in. >> there may be a compromise.

the compromise may but get into the eu. you don't get into nato and there may be some difficult decisions being made. at the same time, obviously, because of the war crimes that are being committed right now, it makes negotiations more difficult. certainly zelenskyy is never going to be removed from power unless a killing. i don't think that will be gorbacheved out at the table. i'm just curious as far as the democrats go, reverend al, the "new york times" is saying are you one of the most important forces, i'm curious, how much support will there be for a long engagement in the united states helping the ukrainians in this fight for freedom? >> i think there will be a lot of support. because i think that clearly we want to represent democratic principles around the world. i just hope we can also have that support here at home. and that we fight for the right of ukrainians but also fight for the right of people in texas and

north carolina, georgia, et cetera to vote. i am also concerned about the fact that we have gotten reports that some of the african students were brought from ukraine and i am grateful that we reached out to the state department, secretary blinken's office. there will be a zoom call later today or tomorrow on that on what the united states will do. i am grateful for mika, already talked to her brother who is an ambassador in poland about this and people in the u.n.. i think it's a challenge both for the ukrainian people at the border and a challenge to democrats in the united states that we must be consistent. you cannot stand up to putin and have a little putin-ism in your own back yard. >> certainly, that was a theme we heard last night during the president's speech. he said it's a sort of a central thesis of his time in office. you need to make democracy work at home as an example for the rest of the world. that's why, though, the mentions

were brief. he talks act voting rights yesterday. he did talk about protecting a democratic institution at home to be 'em overseas and, joe, mika, the white house aids i talked to say this is the central focus of the presidency right now. obviously, this crisis in ukraine. they are looking at sanctions in the coming days. they are harkened by the unified response from nato, the eu. they are watching nervously as that russian convoy so very slowly moves towards kiev to encircle it and potentially cut off the capital from supplies. they wonder how well positioned the russians really are. the equipment seems old. the soldiers seem not well trained. morale seems really low. certainly the fighting spirit much higher among the ukrainians

and the russian invaders. they are cautioned, there is a long way to go. russia has far more supplies and man power than the ukrainians do. >> they were reporting russians were abandoning their positions and actually surrendering. you know, andrea, i want to go back to just since you are here, just taking a bigger look at what's happened over the past couple weeks. the quote by lenin has been going around that decades go by, very little happen. weeks go by where decades happen. that's where we are. i remember back in '89, driving in my car, today east germany shuts down, today romania shuts down. it was coming at you so fast, it was hard to get our arms around it. i must say i was driving sunday morning around i had to do what i always have to do 6:00 sunday morning, i got to go drive and

get mika's coffee. she taps me. she's still sleeping. i get in the card and i hear a speech from the german chancellor and he's saying, we're going to have to do more than 2%. i'm going to change the constitution. and then that afternoon i see on the news, we're not neutral. the swiss. who were neutral when hitler was sweeping across europe said, you know what, neutrality, not for us anymore. decades happened this past weekend andrea, even after this conflict, what's happened this past week is going to shape the future of europe in a dramatic way. >> i'm so glad you are saying that. because in other areas as well, everyone was saying, well, he's got these reserves, central banks reserves so there is no way we can affect that. he has been preparing for years, putin, preparing and saving and

cutting consumer goods in russia and what did we do? this government organized the central banks and sunday what they did and saturday night we were first briefed on this and people were poo-pooing it. they said they'd basically disarmed and they did the central bank. the ruble collapsed. inflation went to 20%. that's a model for new things happening, an newberger on our show today spating malware and working with microsoft, these denial of services hits against these cyber attacks, which was sporadic. pin preks. the malware, what they have now done to start working with corporate, with the tech sector is to notify the ukrainian defense, then she went to nato, notified all the nato borderline countries. they learned about this new

malware from microsoft. that itself partnership. new things are happening. we shouldn't ignore that when we get down into the nitty-gritty of who is yelling and heck himming the president inappropriate moments and acting like jerks. let's take a step back and think about the way this government is working, but then you got to ask the question that reverend al was asking, why hasn't this administration stepped up to its commitments on relaxing the asylum procedures and bringing in refugees. with still have afghans in limbo, thousands that worked with under the influence. overnight poland did that. i am sure most of the american ambassadors in the background are talking about this. the eu saying no covid restricts, no asylum rules. you can get work permits for three years, all these people pouring over the border. we're not checking them, sticking them somewhere else albania and waiting years to get into the u.s. the way we are the afghans. who is talking about the

refugees and bringing them here? >> john, let's talk about you were writing about what the cea was assessing putin's mindset, look how badly this has gone for him. we have built him up to be something he's not. we have been anonymous. it's breaking into a different russian organization every day it seems, it's gutting them, making them, you look economically. they're a bask case militarily. nair just failing. they're having this morning lavrov has to come out again and start talking about nuke cheer war, which is the most pathetic sign of weakness. i mean, this is not only awakened europe, this is also exposed vladimir putin in a way that he never imagined this invasion would expose him. >> joe, all those factors that you mentioned are contributing to what intelligence officials have told u.s. officials in the

government is meanting a very dangerous picture of the state that putin is in right now. his war is not on time. he's facing resistance, he is surrounding himself with a smaller codry of advisers u.s. officials describe as "yes men." they are worried he is not getting access to credible information. when you don't get access to credible information, that can lead us to a dangerous place. >> like donald trump, serious, he got rid of all of his top advisers and nobody can tell him the truth. >> exactly. what results from that you start reading things that aren't exactly there that's why u.s. officials are being very careful with some ideas get thrown about. i know you talked about it this week, a no fly zone, the eu is sending fighters jets to russia. even though those proposals are very unlikely to happen, when putin hears that, it's very

difficult. for u.s. officials to be confident that he knows that that's not going to be in the works. >> i got to say, i watched responsible news people get on the air asking questions about no-fly zones over kiev when they understand that starts world war ii. why do you ask questions to a policy maker when you know the answer already which is we can't do that that starts world war iii. a nuclear world war iii. so layout for us the long-term here. and i understand we've talked about this a good bit. it's going to be grim for a wheel in ukraine? the ukrainian people are going to suffer a great deal in the coming months. >> so, joe, i think are you entirely right. there is obviously this incredible amount of emotion you know surrounding of course the bravery of the ukrainian people

and president zelenskyy who is this war-time leader in a tee-shirt crushing vladimir putin on information operations so there is a lot of positive towards this. but make no mistake, a siege of kiev can be pretty awful in terms of the carnage. vladimir putin was a war criminal long before this. i think some people forget that. you look what he did in 1999 in broz in iia, in middle east in aleppo in 2014, the russian air force killed thousands of syrians. so we might be in tough times ahead. >> you said killed, deliberately targeting hospitals. >> so this has been putin's behavior over some time so we have to really understand that. i this i one of the things the intelligence community will look for senior what john is saying is signs of the crash of the regime. from my old job as a cia case officer overseas. we look at what are russian diplomats doing the, military officers serving overseas. so right now, it's march 2nd.

the summertime is transfer season. ordinarily, better pay, better schools, they want to stay overseas. they are going home to north korea. so i would see, think that every embassy, western embassy, you know, right now hanging out their shingles saying what we call walk-ins welcome. volunteers, defections, that's what we will be looking for in the days andway weeks ahead. >> do you think the germans can turn on him? >> that is an enormous decision for a russian military officer to undertake. obviously, it goes back to how far is russia going to plummet into the dark ages? the isolation is quite extraordinary. i don't see signs putin's hold on the actual security state is eroding. but i do think that overseas

russian officials and also very much so the russian populations if they take to the streets, those will be awesome signs. >> the author of the book clarity in crisis, leadership lessons from the cia. washington post john hudson thank you for your reporting. andrea mitchell, we will be watching andrea mitchell reports at noon eastern here on msnbc. >> good to see you. here's a look at russian president vladimir putin back in the year 2000 when he first came to power. tom brokaw interviewed putin 20 years ago and gives his analysis on what has changed in the nearly two decades the russian autocrat has clung to power. you are watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. the president of the united states called for a symbolic gesture from all those present. >> if able to stand, send an

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when you were in the kgb you were sort of the agency that protected the ideology of communism once communism went away, you made a u-turn. is there an ideology at the heart of vladimir putin or are you ultd matly a pragmatic man? >> if you mean the communist ideology we used to live in a different country and a different world. we were brought up with different ideals. i think the communist idea is a beautiful one but fairy tale. it is clear the state cannot exist under this foundation. it is also about this that there

is nothing that can substitute this ideology except democracy. >> nearly 20 years ago, that was a younger and unknown vladimir putin who was elected president of russia. the former kgb agent succeeded boris yeltsin and inherited an economic crisis, a war in chechnya and deteriorating arsenal. to land a one-on-one interview tom brokaw. he joins us now, the author and historian michael beschloss. tom, you were there, first western journalist to get word that east germany was shutting down, the berlin wall would be coming down. the first western journalist to interview vladimir putin. i am curious looking back 22

years later what are your thoughts today on the putin that you saw then and the putin we are watching now? >> he just now changed. he was a kgb act then. he is operating now as a kgb agent. he may not realize the night if berlin wall came down, there was such joy in the west. putin when to the his home and cried in sorrow about what was happening. that tells you all you need to know about what he thinks his role issage it seems to me right now she trying to take advantage of a chaos not just in the united states but in the american western situation we have going on, not just here but in europe and other places as well. but my guess is, that he is probably a little surprised by the resistance. >> i was going to ask you about that, tom, 1989, obviously, you were there reporting on it. i know michael you and i both

old enough to remember the events of 1989 and how quickly history moved. it moved at an extraordinary pace. that seems to be happening again this week as you look at sweden. deciding they no longer want to be neutral. you look at germany now, rearming in a significant way for the first time since 1945. history is moving so quickly. tom, i wonder, do you think what we are seeing now is a coda to what we first saw in 1989? >> reporter: well, i hope michael agrees with me. we generally agree with most things. the fact of the smatter what we are seeing is chaos. this is a western world but almost everywhere in the world. a lot of it has to do with the kind of jet form of communications. you know, every 30 seconds the world changes.

and it's very hard to keep up with it. in many ways this is another calculation on the western leader. he thought he could get away with this. in some ways, it has unified the united states. but there are still many who are resisting. this president and his legitimacy, grinning with donald trump. so i think that this is a crucial time for the country and our system to think about what it is we want to send to the country and to the world. >> michael, i told the story of how in 1982, 1983, my professor of soviet history said the russians were far more concerned with a xeroxed machine than they were with reagan deploying cruise missiles to western europe. i thought especially looking back all these years later, 40 years later, i thought it was an

extraordinarily inciteful observation when you see how grossly vladimir putin underestimated just what this -- what tom was telling you about, this information age was going to do to his best-laid plans. >> right. that is absolutely true. i want to say, it is so great to be here with tom, because we americans have learned so much of what we know about russia from tom back to the point when he was one of the first western journalists to interview mikhail gorbachev remember in 1991 when the cold war seemed to be ended. now that democracy is coming to russia, we will never have to worry about a cold war again. and many people said, there won't be another tyrant like some neostalin, because russians now know what freedom is like

and they won't give it up. if the economy doesn't work, they'll demand a tie rant go and also that democracy does not lead to unnecessary wars. as recently as a couple of months ago, joe, tom, i think people in the united states had some reason to question whether we were all right. look what has been happening the lasted two days with putin, doing something that's totally against the interests of his people, totally against modern feelings about what democracy is and staying away from wars that are illegal and unnecessary even in russia, which we would have thought was a total dictatorship until almost the last few hours, it's beginning to crumble. >> tom, in that historic interview with putin, you also asked the russian leader about a subject that he's really rarely ever talked ability, his daughters. let's take a look. >> you have two young daughters.

what kind of country will they be living in 20 years from now? >> i would hate to see my country russia lose its identity, its face. what i would like to see that the cultural roots of russia that we are so proud of and so love that form us as people, shape us as people be preserved with all due respect to the common values of our world. i would like my children to see themselves as russians. >> you know, it's very interesting, tom, you can read between the lines now 20 years later and see that is vladimir putin. a man who openly wept when east germany basically closed down for business and the berlin wall started to come down. even there, read between the lines, he is saying we understand the common values of the west. but i don't share them. i don't want my daughter to grow

up in a western world here. we are russian. >> well, i think, joe, we have to keep a couple things in mind. just look at the size of his power. it's not all about the 11 time zones in russia. it comes from the upper people in russia. they control what he will do. the rest of the country is where it was 2082ers in terms of personal views and what they want for their own government. he's the most dangerous man that i can remember going all the way back to the early days of the soviet union because i just don't think he has a conscience. not just to his own people but to the world. and to the idea of peace and we are seeing that now. remember, 11 times there are full parts of it that i have been through east and west north and south where there is still

like in the 19th century. they feel no connection to this man. but he understands that this is a rare opportunity for him that he's going to try to take advantage of and i think it's up to the west to draw the line. >> michael beschloss and tom brokaw, thank you all so much as always. this has been an absolutely fascinating conversation. we really appreciate your input. we'll be right back with more "morning joe." r input. we'll be right back with more "morning joe."

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retreating from russia. exxon said it was halting operations at a major gas project in russia and would make no further investments in the country following the russian invasion. joining us now, democratic senator elizabeth warren of massachusetts. she's a member of the armed services finance and banking committees, so let's talk about that. >> great to have you with us. >> thank you. >> this is sort of a greatest hits collection last night. >> it was. >> i thought it was a very good speech. let's talk about some of the greatest hits that you have been a champion of. first of all, holding big pharma accountable. >> yes. >> let's talk about insulin first, it's personal to me. i've got a type one diabetic kid. i'm fortunate, i can afford to take care of the gouging. >> right. >> that big pharma is doing. i have so many people who have a son like that, type one, who say joe, i can't handle this. it's a crisis. >> and can't handle means that there are millions of people

with diabetes across this country right now who ration their insulin. when i was out in nevada, when i was -- which, by the way, rationing insulin, as the father of a diabetic, a nightmare, and it leads to long-term damage. >> understand what rationing means, for anyone who's not diabetic. i talked to a man who came up to me and said -- he was a veteran so he said he got access to insulin but his sister and niece were diabetic, they didn't have enough money in the whole month, so he said the last three days of the month, the three sit in the same room so they can decide who needs the insulin that's left the most. >> this is awful. >> now, this is in america, this is wrong, and especially in america, insulin has been around for 100 years. it should be available. we should be doing this generically. >> the cost has exploded for no

reason. >> i'm asking as you know, i'm a conservative guy, i want to know, though, and i think a lot of conservatives would agree with me that it's a scam that big pharma still doesn't have to negotiate with medicare. >> yeah. >> why do we keep hearing about that. >> i'm sorry, are you asking me if big pharma and other giant corporations have enormous political power in washington? >> but who's blocking it now? >> oh, it's the quiet blocking. it's the -- there's never a name on this. there are never fingerprints on this. >> is it both parties? i heard kyrsten sinema is actually blocking this. >> we have 50 democrats right now who are there on insulin. we do not have 50 democrats who are there across the board. >> how many do you have on negotiations. >> i think we have 49. >> so then it most likely it is

kyrsten sinema. another thing, i ask you this question, as a conservative, joe biden talked about going after billionaires, going after multinational corporations, not to gut them, not to be a socialist. you've said you're a capitalist, how about making them pay the same income tax rate as our teachers and our firefighters and our cops. >> you preach to the choir here, so remember what he did say, he said on the corporations he called out the fact that there are about 50 in the fortune 500 who collectively made $40 billion in profits on which they paid 0 in taxes, so part of what we're pushing forward is a 15% minimum corporate tax. >> by the way, nike, zero in taxes. amazon over the past couple of years, zero in taxes. >> so what i have been pushing forward is this 15% minimum corporate tax, and that's now part of the feature. this is part of what we're going

to push forward. we need to do the same with billionaires, though, and the problem there is you can't just call it income tax. because these guys have figured out they don't have income. elon musk, jeff bezos, they own huge amounts of stock. they borrow money against the stock, and never pay income tax. >> what's preposterous, mika, is you saw during covid, you saw their net worths going up hundreds of billions of dollars, and then their lawyers go, but wait a second, they haven't actually cashed in the stock so they really haven't made any money. >> that's right. reading from your tweet, putin and corrupt russian elites must pay a serious price for russia's invasion of ukraine. what more can be done to not just putin but the oligarchs and the people that he cares about? >> okay. so now we're really going to get into it. this is where -- this is where putin -- >> i have been waiting. >> this is where putin miscalculated. he thought he was going to get

this done in a few days, the west would be scattered and ultimately not only would he be protected, his oligarchs would and this would be over before it started. in fact, by having the whole banking system involved, this is now an opportunity to shut down the oligarchs, to shut down putin, where they have hidden assets all around the world. so it's going to be a pain staking process, but the keyword is going to be pain. because it's going to impose a lot of pain on these guys. this is going to be about doing things like seizing yachts, right, this is going to be a fun toe, right, when you grab the yacht and take it. but that's what's going to happen. >> what's the trigger mechanism to make it happen? >> we've already done this. it's under federal law. we have already declared, and here's the best part, so have other countries. this is not the u.s. by itself going out and trying to big foot. the best part, and this is where i want to give joe biden extra

credit. he's been spending the last many many months getting everybody together, sharing credit, offering to let others take the spotlight. so now it's not just the u.s. saying we're imposing sanctions on russia and then pounding on our allies to come along, instead, the nato countries and now south korea, australia, saying we want to be part of this. we're going to shut down these oligarchs and keep in mind the importance of this. those oligarchs are who keep putin in power. so putting the squeeze on them, making it so they don't get to keep that, you know, their giant penthouses in new york, and in london, so they get to travel all around the world and enjoy their time and parents, you start squeezing on those guys, and they say to putin, you've made my life a lot worse than it was. this is a government that is run on corruption and what we're going to do is start taking away

the profits from that corruption. >> we will be watching for that. senator elizabeth warren, thank you so much. adrienne elrod, thank you for being on today, and that does it for us this morning. stay with msnbc for the very latest on the russian invasion of ukraine, the world reaction, and the state of the refugees, now some 700,000 fleeing ukraine, most going to poland and other countries. chris jansing picks up the coverage right now. hi there, i'm chris jansing, live from our nation's capitol, washington, d.c. it is wednesday, march 2nd and we begin with president biden's state of the union speech, a speech traditionally used to defend a political and policy agenda but last night, president biden using the opportunity to deliver a powerful defense of democracy itself. delivered in a house chamber, a wash in the ukrainian national colors of blue and gold, the president called the war in ukraine a test and called for americans and free nations