that satan disguises himself as an angel of light, and sometimes, he is pretty good at it. >> that is all for this edition of dateline. i'm natalie morales, thank you for watching. fo r watching >> maxlength=32> i'm craig melvin >> and i'm natalie morales. >> and this is dateline. >> the neighborhood had everything a burglary wanted to find, private yards, wealthy homes -- >> and she had the worst of possible luck, in that he picture. >> yes. >> i'd like to report an attempted break -- in >> a mother, home alone. cops raced to her front door as she walks into an ambush in her backyard. >> how does somebody die in a matter of seconds with officers around her home? >> it was surreal, it was awful. >> it's really just came

crashing down. >> your first thought of that time? >> it's a burglary gone wrong. >> but the burglar caught red-handed starts pointing fingers. >> this is a guy who aspire to be a hit man -- >> she was a sitting target. >> does it now mean that you charge them all with? effort >> i have no facts. >> now detectives lay a trap. >> try to play cat and malice. >> we're getting really paranoid about being -- >> one are you? wired >> will they catch their prey? >> you hold your breath, the world's gonna stop. ♪ ♪ ♪ >> you never think it's going to be you. >> oh no! >> no. the young man is right. in fact, this is the kind of thing that just doesn't happen to anyone. >> no, never. never would've thought i would ever see anything like this.

>> no, not here. not in this neighborhood, in this house. but certainly not, surely not, at the very moment when at least three policemen were just outside the front door and just over the backyard wall and more than 30 feet away. >> we had to be told a few times just to get it in our heads, what happened. >> what happened here? in broad daylight and under the very noses of the cops? >> was murder. no long beach california, a town that might have been cheated a little by the city fire department. >> a lot of people assume it's like la but it's not it's different, it has its own identity. >> different culturally? >> i think so. i think long beach is sort of its own beast. >> sure. >> it's a little more working class. >> yes, and it's one of those

50 suburbs in search of a city that everybody calls l. a.. but long beach is a brawny city unto itself, half 1 million people, 52 square miles, a busy airport, a big university, an oceanfront, along beach. and its share of wealth and poverty. that of course -- crime. >> a lot of scope for a person who -- >> no shortage of work, for covering crime. >> tracy mansour it is -- the long beach press telegram. she was they trusted her. maybe that's why when one november morning -- >> contact from the police department came to me in the midst of this sort of press conference and said, you need to go to big speed, now. and i was a little taken aback. >> taken aback because big speed was not a name you heard in the crime beat. >> so was very clear to me that something major was coming going on.

packed up my stuff, ran out the door, and got to the scene. >> this scene wasn't picks be knowles, quiet in affluent, leave it to beaver homes and carefully tended tree lines treats. violent crime is virtually unheard of there, which is just the way they like it here. maybe that's why, as they grew up, here or moved here, they'd rarely leave. like rachel. >> everybody is very friendly, always waving. you don't get that a lot in southern california. >> rachel still lives in the house she grew up in. >> we were able to play's kids, at all hours of the day. we had nothing to worry about anyone ever hurting us or -- it's a safe neighborhood. >> but then came that november morning, but tracey mans would roll over there in her car. >> i had no idea what i was going, to what i was going to find. but i knew based on how i was

told about it that it was gonna be something very bad. >> oh and it was. >> i was barely out of my car when i saw the homicide lieutenant, the home homicide sergeant, two commanders, and obviously a bank of black and white. so my first thought was there was offshore officer shooting. or -- either an officer had been shot and killed or an officer shot someone. >> but none of that. no. what really happened was far stranger than that. >> long beach police department. >> yes i'd like to report, up, i believe we have an attempted break and going on at the moment. >> it was a neighbor who saw it. it was the start of some dreadful shock mood. it it was 11:03 am. >> it's taking place at my neighbors, which is the house just west of. me >> ok, one just west to you? >> yes. it is the shocker rested is. >> the shopowners, the colors

next door neighbors. several cops responded within minutes. >> and as they talk to the one one won't -- 9-1-1 caller, they saw a white dog barking incessantly at the window. >> not a very large dog. just a fluffy, yuppie dog. >> a petite framed woman came to the window to see if what her dog was biking barking. an officer suggested to her come outside. clearly bewildered, she find open the door. >> so he's telling her that they got a call from the neighbor that they saw a prowl or, and would be okay if they looked in her backyard? and looked around the house. and she had said that that was fine. >> but hold on, the woman said to the police, let me grab the key, the gate is locked. >> so she closes the front door, walks through the house and walks out the back door. >> three cops waited outside the front door. two more cops pulled in right

here, in the alley behind the house. and then, to their great surprise, the prouder jumped over the backyard wall practically into their arms. they searched him. found jewelry in his bag, and a taser, and a cell phone, and a knife with blood on it. the cops out front waited for the woman to return. she didn't. ten seconds, 20 seconds, did a minute go by? they decided, time to go in. they opened the door, look through the house. and what they saw was not just terrible, but a riddle, a deception, a piece of pure evil. >> coming up. what could've happened in that house? while it was surrounded by police officers? >> i couldn't believe it. i thought it was a joke. >> until your father arrived with tears in his eyes. >> that's when i knew something was wrong. >> when dateline continues.

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particular november 8th, california weather, not quite known. and as usual, it was quiet in bixby knolls, in long beach. quiet and, in that quiet, more menacing than anybody understood. as police responding to a call by a proud or waited outside the front door. neither they nor that half awake homeowners -- as she close the door in their faces, and when in search of a key to the gate in the yard. seconds tick, by the dog barks. the woman didn't return. so the cops, still not getting, it went in, too late. >> she's attacked and she was killed right there and then while the police officer was on her front porch. >> just extraordinary. >> yes. >> the victim's name was lynn schockner. they found her quite dead just outside --

her own backdoor, they could clearly see the bright red gash across her throat. how is it possible? the policeman were just outside her front door. and more cops were in alert mode out in the alley. but the only apparent witness to the silent murder of linda, was lynn's little dog, zoe. horrified officers found her lying by lin side, her white coats battered red. back at police headquarters, long beach cops, like undercover man, chris, nelson heard the chatter. >> we were sitting in the office and we used to have a police radio on in the office, listening into what's going on in the street. >> this was bad. >> we were right down -- the road down homicide. and you write a way that this was turning into a call out, where somebody got killed. >> now, crisis mode. detective richard brand saw called and said get down there fast. >> your first time at that -- your first thought at that, time you remember but it? >> just a burglary gone awry.

>> did you have at the same time a sense of how could we screw up like? that >> like everybody else you're trying to discern why why she did what she did, but did the officers, say what was a conversation? >> oh yes, there were lots of questions. this would be ugly. why did she go back in the house? why did the cops let her? why didn't they move in faster? how could they let the murder happen right under their noses? >> that was really disturbing and, you know, you hate to second judge another cop but there were mistakes made. >> after all, a neighbor reported a prouder in the back alley. a prouder who may have sneaked into her house. but she, the victim, didn't seem to believe that. >> she had a little eskimo dog, barking butterflies. and there is no way that there would be a -- >> she was wrong. >> she was wrong. >> her son, charlie, was a freshman in high school then. he was sitting in math class.

somebody told him that he was wounded in the principles office, on the way there he thought he was in trouble. and then, when they told him -- >> i didn't believe it. i thought it was a joke. >> until your father arrived with tears in his eyes? >> that was when i knew something was wrong. >> his father, manfred, or fred as most people call, and came to take charlie home. >> how is your father? >> upset. he was definitely one -- he was crying. he couldn't drive. i didn't really have eyes for him in that moment -- >> you are just a mess? >> yes. >> and charlie still could not believe what he was hearing. >> it really didn't set in until i saw the house and then it all came crashing down. >> his home was a crime scene. >> the house was taped off and, there were people going in and out of the house. a lot of neighbors around. like everything you see on tv.

>> you never think it's going to be? it's surreal. very much so. >> what is that lost feel? >> yeah, i can't put it into words it was tremendous, it was awful. i immediately called mark and babbling on the phone, i couldn't even speak. >> mark was charlie's uncle, lynn's brother. >> after the initial shock, here is disbelief. then burst into tears right away, i started screaming, i was just stunned. >> linda grew up in ohio, she was the baby of the family, the only girl. here she is with her two older brothers, john and mark, but lynn was not like them. >> she was a tentative girl, where is my brother and i were very outgoing.

>> their father died young, lynn all often fought with her mother. >> codefendant, love hate, call it what you want. >> she got married, moved to california with a brand-new husband, it didn't work out, it ended pretty quickly. but then one day she went to a ball game, dodgers somebody, who knows, and she found him. the right guy, her guy. fred shopowner. he was almost 14 years older than she was but it didn't seem to matter. it didn't hurt other that fred was a successful. matt anytime -- anyway, this time it clicked. they had an intimate wedding on a boat off the california coast. the captain did the honors. and they live together in that house and big speed knows. until finally, after 11 years, they had a son. who grew up to be charlie. as parents, they encouraged him to try new things. >> it was like -- it was the olympics, and we

were watching gymnastics and i teach my parents and said, i'm going to do that. and i think a month later, i rolled into gymnastics. so there it was a supportive environment. >> and lynn doted on her only son. >> it might be tried to say this, but she loved him more than life itself. he was the center of her universe. >> so, after what happened, mark flew out to california right away to come for charlie and fred, and to make funeral arrangements for his only sister lynn. and at the very same time, as if in another world altogether, world devoted to the minutiae of violent crime, detective richard poked around the entrails of this burglary gone bad. he could perhaps ride up a report, and make the bad press go away. but, no richard -- was a troubled man. >> we said something is wrong. we feel like something is,

wrong but we don't know. yet >> wrong? well of course it was. but the wrong that the detective had in mind was not the grief or the loss of the -- thrown at the police. no, it was almost like a smell, the kind that sticks in your nose, something off. coming up. one of the strangest things of all was the alleged killer himself. not your typical burglar. >> in his words, he always wanted to be a cop. >> and this was not your typical burglary. >> i've been in the burglary division for four years -- >> when dateline continues. or waiting for the 7:12 bus... or sunday afternoon in the produce aisle. these moments may not seem remarkable. but at pfizer, protecting the regular routine, and everyday drives us to reach for exceptional. working to impact hundreds of millions of lives... young and old.

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to grow up in a place like bixby knolls. >> tree lined street, beautiful neighborhood. it was a wonderful place to grow up. and i would escape. our take my dog around. >> he was lucky two to have that in for a mother. how did you make you feel? >> as parents should. >> safe? >> loving. welcome. they just good. >> but now, lynn -- was gone. killed in a burglary. charlie was 14 and grief stricken, was so angry at the

police. >> you didn't do your job, how could that happen with you being right? there that negligence. >> charlie was far from the only one. this was a broad daylight murder. police officers just outside their front door when it happened. i can imagine people would be kind of acts set in the neighborhood, that a burglar had been there? >> yes. >> and dropped a house, killed women, and the cops can prevent it? >> right. i think the majority of the neighborhood was just stunned and shocked by the violence. how does somebody who is in her own home die within a matter of seconds with officers all around her home? >> tracy's paper, the long beach press telegram, reported the community backlash. there was anger. cops often tend to pull together in the face of a thing like that, but in private, harsh judgments, from the undercover cop, chris nelson. >> i'm sorry, but just don't let her go back into a situation like that.

police 101. >> so what was -- >> the very minimum, you go in with her. >> so i was the top around the the department when this happened? >> that they messed up. >> detective richard birdsall is used to being -- used to asking tough questions, suddenly had to answer them. >> i had the feeling that the department would adopt a sort of defensive stands at that point because the questions would be, how could you let that happen? >> yes they did. because you're trying to defend the officers who didn't do anything wrong. you're waiting for someone to bring you the key. they waited a short period of time, within a minute, they're yelling for her, ma'am, can you come back, hello? where are you? >> just a minute or so. enough freeland to surprise the burglar who stabbed her in the neck, grab some jewelry, and ran into the arms of the police. the detective filed around the crime scene. >> we saw the bedroom drawers were open, jewelry, things were thrown around. so you look at a lot of things

in disarray. >> it looked like a standard daytime burglary, gone horribly bad, of, course when lynn encountered the rubber. but one thing stood out, like, well, a bloody knife. >> i've been in the burglary division for four years but i've never had one come with a device simply for killing. >> so, time to focus on that so-called burglar. caught with a bloody knife in his pocket. his name was nicholas harvey, he was 22 years old and this was unusual. >> he didn't have a criminal background, he never had trouble with the law before. >> he seemed like a nice man? >> he was very personable, he wanted to cooperate with us. in his words, he always wanted to be a cop at some point in his life. >> and here he is robbing and killing a woman? >> correct. >> well he was a personal trailer at a local gym. he's a big muscle bouncer of a character? >> correct. >> from port hueneme?

>> port hueneme. >> but that's way up the coast. >> yes by ventura. >> in other words, 70 miles from the crime scene. but why would he commit a robbery from so far away from home? >> that's one of the facts that immediately came up. >> when detective richard birdsall and his partner's first saw him, nick gave them an answer that did make. >> since he came with his initial story, i heard that this was a good area. >> really? there wasn't a good area closer to home? well, then, nick gave them another answer. >> you wanted to -- he wanted to get out of his area, he looked at the local gym at the area and did martial arts with police officers, they felt like they would recognize. >> and when he said that, did it's impossible? >> no it wasn't possible at all. >> and one other thing, remember how when police arrested him they found jewelry in his pocket?

turns out it was fake. even though lynn had lots of real diamonds, right there to be taken, along with other valuable items. >> if you can do a daytime burglary, and kill somebody, you could make the effort to get the good. stuff but he didn't. >> so either nick harvey was the world's worst burglar, or the burglary wasn't the point of his visit. the detectives pushed him hard, but -- >> he did want to change the story. we were added for hours. we walk out of there saying, this is, done this is what it seems to be. >> just a hunch of course. no way to prove it. until, 70 miles up the coast, a man picked up the phone to call the police. coming up, a family feud -- >> i wrote that line letter, i signed the letter, i handed it to my sister, and i dared her to give it to him. >> what is that all about? when dateline continues.

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here's what's happening. police in sacramento, california, are searching for several gunman involved in a shooting that left six people dead. officials say a fight broke out early sunday, and all 18 people were shot. police have asked the public to help in the investigation. estelle harris, the actress best known for her role on seinfeld has passed away at the age of 93. she died of natural causes in palm desert, california. just weeks before her 94th birthday. now, back to dateline. ay now, back to dateline. >> detective richard birdsall don't believe for a moment that he was investigating a burglary. gone bad. for one thing, burglars don't travel 70 miles to break into a house. but for all his suspicion, he could not prove a thing. that is until a man who knew nick harvey called the police. and said. >> nick harvey came to him and offered him some money to say,

can you drive me down to -- >> they agreed. they met at a parking lot and he drove knicks car. the driver also said that nick told him why he needed to get along beach. >> nick harvey -- local drug dealers out there. so he's going out for that one reason. >> honestly, he had no idea that the agenda included the murder, said the driver. >> he never knew that he was gonna come down to take someone 's life. >> of course, the guy was probably lying. so they put him under arrest. anyway, his claim that he thought he was driving a drug enforcer did make a lick of sense. the notion that lynn schockner or was somehow tangled up with drug dealers and targetted for execution was frankly preposterous. lynn had been leading a quiet life for 25 years, married to a man with a lot going for him. >> he was a wealthy man. >> for years, fred earned top dollar in the aerospace

industry, not to mention all the family money that he inherited. >> they were able to afford things that none of us growing up could possibly afford, we were a blue collar working class people and we didn't know many millionaires growing up. >> he bought her things, jewelry that, sort of thing? >> right from the beginning they bought a very nice home in an exclusive some suburb of long beach. bixby knolls. that was a step up. >> marks remembers flying up to sea limb after she got married. >> she was dying to show off her home, show off her new live. >> lynn seemed happy, said mark. >> she sat out -- i think with special determination, having had her first marriage not last, to make this one work was

important to. >> to make a complete family, a desire that only intensified once charlie came along. >> she wanted her son to be the best person he could be and would stop at nothing to make sure that he got that. >> around bixby knolls, they considered it completely normal for them to be an upscale family. certainly not the type of people to be targeted by drug dealers. but family members had a slightly more intimate perspective. mark, for example, loved his sister. but found spread a little obnoxious. >> he was not shy about dropping hints about the extent of his holdings. >> mark did not see them very often, he lived way across the country in georgia, but when he did come to visit in long, beach and they went out to dinner, fred always managed to monopolize the conversation and somehow stick mark with the bill.

>> cheap, totally opinionated, absolutely self involved. >> so, when he invited lynn charlie to visit him in georgia -- >> i basically told my sister not to bother to bring him, she could stay as long as she wanted, leave her own head at home. >> and on one of those visits, mark told lynn exactly how he felt. >> i said, how can you let someone run your life and forget about yourself? >> afterward, he sat down and wrote many of the same things in a harshly worded letter to fred. >> i wrote that letter, i signed the letter, i handed it to my sister, and i dared her to give it to him. >> did you think she actually would? >> i didn't know but she did well. >> that took guts. >> it did, it did. >> and frankly, mark was pleased, one of here is later,

after a quarter century of marriage, lynn told him that they were splitting. and fred moved out of the house in bixby knolls. >> she changed somehow after your father left? >> she seemed freer, happier them. more able to get excited, just really interested in everything and very light hearted. >> but, her happiness was short lived. and when mark first heard she was murdered, his mind went to a very dark place, could fred have something to do with it. but as much as he disliked fred, there was no way he could see it. >> there were no connections in their personal life to this person who committed the crime. >> no, it seems pretty clear, fred had nothing to do with lynn's murder. besides, lynn changed the locks on the house after fred moved out, could it be someone she hired to install some protection, actually come back

to rob her and kill her? after, all such a person would've seen that land had valuable things around the house in this very nice neighborhood. >> the neighborhood had everything a burglary wanted to find, private yards wealthy, homes -- >> and she had the worst of possible luck in that he picked her. >> yes. >> and now the family came together in grief. and when he saw fred -- >> we hugged, shared condolences, within five or ten minutes, he mentioned the letter. he said, do you still believe that? i said, no, that's water over the bridge. we need to get on with our family, we need to stick together. >> fred moved back into the family home. he and charlie and the rest of the family leaned on each other. >> well around the neighborhood

absorbed the news that there is a possible accomplice in custody. neighbors wondered, were more people involved? >> there was concern that there are others that might come back to more houses and more homes and that they were violent. >> but that fear soon turned to anger when another bit of news swept through -- bixby knolls. the police let the driver go. coming up, detectives were convinced nick harvey didn't have a motive to commit murder, but maybe someone else did? >> my partner discovered that there was a person that he talked to multiple times right before the murder. >> when dateline continues. media is trying me. i'm trending so hard that “hashtag common sense” can't keep up. this is going to get tens and tens of views. ♪ ♪ ( car crashing )

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call us now and find out what your case could be worth. you u mit bebe sprisised >> ever since lynn schockner ♪ the barnes firm injury attorneys ♪ ♪ call one eight hundred, eight million ♪ was murdered in her home while police stood outside, criticism of the long beach department has been intense, emotions were raw. >> the officers were extremely upset. my understanding was one of the officers who was on the call had a nervous breakdown or an episode like that afterward because it was so -- too much for him. >> detective richard birdsall knew, even as he investigated lyyn's murder, that her family was angry with the police.

>> they were upset like anybody would be, like the press. everybody was upset with us. that we didn't do our job to protect someone's life because that's what we are supposed to do. >> lynn's husband, manfred schockner for, even threaten to sue the long beach police department for not protecting his wife. and so detective birdsall knew that -- more news leaked out and released information about the suspected killer and then released. him and that's exactly what birdsall did. released the man who admitted that he driven the man to the crime scene. but the detective had a plan. >> we actually put knock to feed on his phone, we wanted to find out who is talking. two we have the driver, we have the killer, now we want to find out if there's more people involved. >> detective birdsall don't believe that harvey was a drug enforcement, just didn't buy it. it so he hoped that by releasing the driver and tapping his phone, he could uncover what was really going on. there was only one problem,

after he was let go, the driver didn't reach out to anyone. >> the only person ever spoke to was nick harvey. >> the driver was not part of a larger group. he had nothing whatever to do with lynn's murder. >> so he was telling the truth? >> it turns out, yes. >> dead end. so they kept on digging into nick's background, and remember, this was a guy with a clean record. he came off with a perfectly ordinary young man. >> we talk to the family, they were all incredulous -- >> next? family >> next. family. correct >> incredulous? >> it didn't fit his persona. they never thought that he would be capable of doing something like this. >> so when you asked his family about, him how did they characterize? >> at that time, he worked out a lot, he was doing steroids, we had one -- he was a trainer for the local gym up there. and that's all he did.

he was a bouncer at a bar. he never really got in trouble. >> but for some, reason he got himself in trouble. police are trying to figure out how when they went through his phone records. >> my partner discovered that there was a person that he talked to with and multiple times right before the murder. >> frank jaramillo? >> frank jaramillo, aka el cubano. he once managed to the gym where nick trained. and a person, just before committing a murder. unless of course he was in on it. how to find out? step one, said chris nelson, go back to nick harvey, lean on him a little bit. >> you have to talk to the sky before he gets arraigned. because once he is arraigned, you are screwed. he's gonna get an attorney. and his attorneys are gonna tell him to shut up. >> just what's birdsall and his partner were thinking. so they confronted nick again, now two days after linda's murder. >> you need to be fully truthful with my partner and i

right, now because it's only gonna you know benefit you to tell the truth. this is getting uglier and uglier. >> we went out it won last. time he reiterated it almost exactly what he said before. >> which was that he killed lynn schockner because the burglar he tried to carry out went bad. the cops still didn't buy it. >> you need to take nick into responsibility now. take care of nick, now please. and tell -- be truthful with us. because we are not gonna stop nick. >> and that's when the story started to change. >> i might as well break -- >> i was hired to hit the house. i don't know why. i don't -- i deny. >> that, is set, nick he was hired to commit a burglary. one that depending on what he could steal, might prove very profitable. >> what's the amount you were promised? >> what was in the house, plus

$2500. >> bs, said the cops. he was hired to kill. and they knew it. because those phone records told a very different story than he did. and finally, nick harvey cracked. >> when we were in the car he said, yes, you guys are good, you got. me > just like that? numrows=2> >> just like. that and then he cops out. ever since lynn shock near was murdered in her home while police stood outside, emotions were raw. >> the officers were extremely upset. -- cubano really, and why would he pay a guy to kill a housewife in long beach? coming up, there is always the husband, right? but in this case, police didn't seem to think so. >> the detective was very quick

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simpler said had been. ugly nick harvey, in exchange for just $5000 was to kill a long beach housewife named schockner, stage like a burglary, and get away clean. instead, nick was in jail facing murder charges and detectives were wondering about a conspiracy. nick had already told them that he had been hired by a man called frank jaramillo, who went by el cubano. >> he wanted the job done. and the burglary. staged >> nick met el cubano at a restaurant where he said he was paid half upfront. >> would you do with that money? >> i will moved so i had to buy a bunch of new bedroom stuff. >> he spent the 2500 on furniture called the couch

potato. but when the time came to earn the rest of his money, to kill lynn, he said, for a moment, he got cold feet. >> truth be told, when i got there, the i didn't want to do it. one at all. in fact, when i was sitting there, i was sitting actually, back by the door and i was -- where the messed apart is i actually -- thought >> that's when he went into something like fight or flight mode, he said. he killed. her and then he quickly ran into the house, pulled out some drawers, grabbed some jewelry to make it look like a burglary, but then when he escaped, to his horror the cops were, or appeared, to be waiting for. him so, then listen to this, harvey had a question for the detectives. >> can i ask you guys a question? i don't know if you guys can

answer, this how are you guys there so fast? >> neighbor. there's people in the neighborhood. someone saw you get out of the car. did you know the cops were even out there? >> not until i got back over the wall and i saw the van. and when i saw the, van i guess that's when, i said this is gonna be a setup. >> that is, he thought he was being double crossed by his friend, frank, aka el cubano. that's why he decided to stick to the botched burglary story, he said. maybe he would just get second degree murder, and once he got out of prison, he was going to find frank. and -- >> take care of him myself. >> the detectives played along, of course, but nick dream up any conspiracy made him. happy but meanwhile the requisition was el cubano's phone records. and they found something. surprising >> he was talking to nick, harvey but he was also talking to the husband. >> fred schockner? >> fred schockner. >> fred schockner, lends

husband of 25 years. on the surface, it didn't make much sense. after, alfred had been cooperative with detective since day one. and, yes he had moved out of the family, house but he told them that the break was amulet, he she is my best, friend he said. and not long after the murder, young charlie sought out birdsall and whispered a cruel question. >> does my father have anything to do with? this >> truly remembers what the detective told him. >> we he said that -- he was quick about it. that if they have thought that, they would've looked into him, and not to worry about that. >> is that what detectives really believe? well, no. >> we have to sit there and look at him in the eye and say, well kate -- let you know if he is. involved >> but not say we suspect.

>> exactly. >> they believe they couldn't tell charlie, or the rest of the family, but they were discovering. afraid that fred would find out, stop talking to them. so charlie stayed at home with his father. his uncle mark was allowed, even encouraged to believe, that fred was not involved. even as the detectives were getting the real story from the hit man. nick harvey. >> do you know who talked to el cubano regarding this? >> yes. >> who did? >> her husband. >> so, doesn't that mean you can know you can now go out and arrest him and? >> we wish, it's just a conspiracy statement, i have no. facts it's a statement from one. person >> that person, nick

harvey, was an admitted killer and demonstrated liar. and with the police department under so much scrutiny, they didn't dare arrest anybody with solid proof. just think of the scandal on top of everything else, the prosecution failed. they did find frauds business card and frauds wallet, but that wasn't enough either. meanwhile, the public, lynn's family, would be encouraged to believe that it was a case of a burglary gone bad. a murder that cop should've prevented. >> i can go out there and defend my department as much as i wanted to. >> you can say anything? >> and i can't tell the press, i can't tell -- you can't defend ourselves because we have suspects of interests are the ones we are looking. at we don't want them to get lawyers. >> so inside and outside the long beach media, the pressure was. on >> my department was one of the -- we have a black, i the press was just beating us up daily as to what we did. >> so the clock was ticking. detectives wanted to prove the murder. and they needed to do it fast. >> that was the whole, game trying to play cotton, miles trying to get more, we wanted to get them to, talk to communicate. >> but, it wasn't going to happen, by the look of. it even though they kept

talking to fred. >> we kept going to the husband. >> playing dumb, of course. but hoping he'd panic and call was el cubano. >> i one point to recalling each other every day. but try to give them a reason so that he would be more suspicious than he was already. >> one more. sir >> just like colombo, one more. sir >> this was a game. but with deadly consequences. deaths also has a way of bringing people together. lynn was a private woman, a very -- had very few friends beyond her son charlie. and yet -- >> we had a big service for her. it was amazing how many people came out for her. it was with nice. i just remember i, at that point, i couldn't even cry. i was still depressed and shocked. well i felt bad for that for a

long time but -- >> well, that's pretty normal. >> yeah. >> did the tears gum? >> yeah. it took a while, but they did. what >> meanwhile, detective richard birdsall was chipping away at the case. but far too slowly for the likes of his bosses at the long beach police departments, still under fire for not preventing a. murder the detectives had found some connections among the three suspected conspirators. but not nearly enough to go to court. >> when you have to go arrest everybody. i'd love to. but do i have probable cause? no, i don't really. i have to prove. more >> and you couldn't even say that either one of those people was a suspect? >> correct. one and i was 16 when i started, i was five two when i finish. there was so much pressure to do it and make arrests. >> coming. up fred and frank finally start

talking. >> we had 60 plus phone conversations between them. >> are you doing bud? >> it has been a rotten, rotten time. >> but will it help detectives catch the killer? >> when dateline continues. did i tell you i bought our car from carvana? yeah, ma. it was so easy! i found the perfect car, under budget too! and i get seven days to love it or my money back... i love it! i thought online meant no one to help me, but susan from carvana had all the answers. she didn't try to upsell me. not once, because they're not salespeople! what are you...? guess who just checked in on me? mom... susan from carvana! [laughs] we'll drive you happy at carvana. pre-rinsing your dishes? you could be using the wrong detergent. and wasting up to 20 gallons of water. skip the rinse with finish quantum. its activelift technology provides an unbeatable clean on 24 hour dried-on stains.

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schockner was the mastermind behind the murder of his estranged wife lynn. but they still don't have enough evidence to make an arrest. so the detectives kept dropping in on fred, all very non threatening. and then finally, they asked him if you have been to know anyone in the port hueneme area. that's where nick harvey lived. fred said, yes he did. the man he knew, he said, was

frankie jaramillo. just a guy he met one frank managed a gym in long beach. in fact, set for it, he bought a used bmw from frank, for $25,000. and frank was going to deliver the car when he returned from an overseas business trip. in new delhi. of course, from from records, the cops knew perfectly well that frank, aka, elk about, was in fact at home. about 50 miles north of long beach, and with -- but fred kept talking. and there was more chatter -- more than $100, 000, which made sense given what detectives had already learned about frank. >> he had a fetish for watches. living a lifestyle of the rich, he really didn't have any full-time job. >> but if frank thought he was taking advantage of fred, the detectives believed it was just the opposite. >> i think fred schockner

wanted to own frank on some way. >> so we already had $100,000? now, he's on the hook, big-time to fred. and he says, to get off the hook, you got me -- >> correct. >> then, swipe swipe clean. >> yeah, absolutely -- >> so, and the detectives view, fred was the mastermind, using his financial leverage to -- who in turn hired nick. but fred still didn't know the cops even suspected him, he didn't have any idea for example, that they were tapping his phone. so one fred actually began calling the cops to play mr. cooperative, he recorded every word. >> hello, officer. this is fred schockner. >> hey, how are you doing? >> so, there has never been anything as bad as this in my life. and then, i hope they never will be. >> i don't blame you. >> but you ask me up a couple

of questions, and i'm gonna give you some information. >> okay. >> the check that i wrote to frank was cashed on october 29th. >> for $25, 000, okay. that was for the bmw? >> that was for the bmw. >> look at this, on the check, there is a note that indicates the bmw, be delivered between 11 seven and eight. lynn was murdered on the 8th of november. >> i called him today and asked about the status of the car on the voice mail. okay. >> you called him today, did you happen to ask him if he was back in the country -- >> know, i just left a voice mail. >> okay. >> does this sound like freight 's heavy fun 20 with the cops -- >> and other questions that you have for us at this time? >> happy fishing. >> why is it going so long? that's a good question because the fishing isn't answering, right? >> well, like i said, you know, i told you from the beginning it's a pretty simple case.

>> yeah. >> hold on a second, the other line is ringing. >> amateur the conversation, fred got another call, from frankie jaramillo. fred puts him on hold, and continues to speak with detectives. even offering a theory about the color, mccarthy. >> you know, the kid from port hueneme may have been someone that was associated with the lock change. it may have been someone associated with someone she met and try to help. >> exactly. >> fred hung up with a detective, and picked up his cell phone to talk to jaramillo. that call was also recorded. >> hello, did you hear a lot of that? >> -- >> okay, good. >> i don't need to talk about it. >> okay. >> how are you doing, but? >> it has been a rotten, rotten time. >> there's so much sympathy and so much activity surrounding it. it's unbelievable.

>> just as the cops have been hoping, fred and frank talked, but not a word from either one to establish they were involved in the murder. >> we had 60 plus phone conversations, between them. >> and recapping them all? >> we are tapping them all. >> but they just didn't slip up. so it was time the detectives decided to launch the undercover squad led by chris nelson. >> i was armed with information now. nick harvested the homicide guys and then they told me,, if you are frank and fred, your biggest concern is nick's top. >> yeah, of course. you wanna make sure he's not gonna say anything -- >> first, detective nelson decided he'd go for broke by phoning fred schockner himself and claiming to be the hired killer, nick harvey. >> so, how did you go about doing this? >> i went to county jail. i was one of their inmate phones because i wanted to

pre-recorded -- heat >> you are receiving a call from a california institution, blah, blah, blah. and he hung up on me, i think the first time. they ask you if you want to accept, and he said no, click. and then i waited about five minutes, and i called him again. >> at this time, fred took the call. >> i said, on the guy that did that work at your house for you. i said, well, i'm gonna need my other half. i'm gonna need my money. you know, for an attorney. and he says, you already have it. >> i said, no. and he said, well you need to talk to your guy. >> your guy, you can only mean frankie jaramillo. but he didn't say the words. he didn't say anything incriminating. and so, he try something different, much riskier. can you get uncle john involved? >> coming up, hey, frank. >> yes. >> frank, hey. my name is john.

>> detectives set a trap. >> i'm the one that can keep -- you're gonna give me money. >> although frank -- >> is more an acquaintance, i don't know, i we don't have money to help him out. >> when dateline continues. teline continues or waiting for the 7:12 bus... or sunday afternoon in the produce aisle. these moments may not seem remarkable. but at pfizer, protecting the regular routine, and everyday drives us to reach for exceptional. working to impact hundreds of millions of lives... young and old. it's what we call, the pursuit of normal. ♪ ♪ if you're washing with the bargain brand, even when your clothes look clean, it's what we call, the pursuit of normal. there's extra dirt you can't see. watch this. that was in these clothes... ugh. but the clothes washed in tide- so much cleaner. if it's got to be clean it's got to be tide hygienic clean. >> after days of repeated calls

and interviews with fred schockner, detectives had solicited some tantalizing details, but not enough evidence to arrest him for leanne's murder. so, they decided to focus on suspected middleman, frankie jaramillo, el cubano. undercover cop chris nelson had a plan to set a trap, to make frank believe he was about to be fingered by the hitman, nick harvey. so he'd phone frank, and portray himself as -- >> relative of knicks with a past of my own.

not perfectly lacking cops. i'm the one that can keep nick quiet. and what are you gonna give me an exchange for that? you're gonna give me money. >> afraid frank would recognize the trap and hang up on him, detective nelson elected to make up a very unthreatening persona. >> so i thought, well, i'll be uncle john. you know, that his mother sat down from the bay area, to see what's really going on, and whether harvey got himself into that. >> so, uncle john places a call to el cubano. >> hey, frank. >> yes. >> frank, my name is john. >> now, to set the trap, he said nick needs money for a lawyer. >> he seems to think you are fred, and will help them out. he didn't want a public defender. >> okay. >> frank tells uncle john he knows nick, but -- >> he's more unacquainted. i don't really know i don't

have money to help him out. >> first, friend doesn't seem to take the bait. >> yeah, it might be if i can help him i understand i would. i'm sorry that i apologize, i can't. >> then carefully, uncle john reels him in. >> he seem to think that if somebody didn't reach out to him, he told me not so much you, but she told me to tell, have you tell fred that if he didn't get some help pretty soon, he was gonna go to the cops? >> okay. >> give me a call tomorrow we'll see what i can do to help you out -- >> but, after all that friend did not make the all-important and incriminating call to fred schockner, asking for money. and so, the very next day, uncle john tried again. >> hey, did you get a hold of fred? >> no, but between you and i, i don't mind taking care of him, bud. >> frank asked for time, and agreed to meet uncle john in person, to hand over some

money. >> do you know where the thousand oaks mall's at? >> thousand oaks mall? >> it's off line road. >> yes, off the 101. >> lynn road. the irony was apparently lost. it was mid morning late november. detective nelson was worried, would he show up? >> he was in a parking lot by himself, and you kind of go over -- sure, your heart race is a little bit. you feel like everybody is kind of depending on you to get this done. and you wanted to go well. >> so the idea is you really like a fisherman, there are times that you don't know what's gonna happen? >> have a break. how did that happen a few times. >> but not this time. there was frank, and a brand new lexus as uv. >> -- >> that is not an iss. >> i asked referring to a less expensive car he said he would be driving. >> oh yeah, my wife took the

other car this morning. >> that is three. >> i don't know when you spend your money on. >> money from -- is frank did not take that bait. >> hard to tell from the video, but frank coughs up the money. >> i have a ground for you right now. >> who is? >> -- >> the detectives. >> are they looking? at you >> yeah. >> detective was inside a van, listening to the whole thing go down. >> do you feel like that is the nail in his coffin? >> so the instant he offered that thousand dollars, you -- >> we got him. he locked himself into it. >> and, a couple of days later, detective -- and his partner gave frank a visit, to -- >> they basically braced him with, you know, who is this guy john? so i understand he gave him

some money. he is like i don't know what you are talking about. i >> have never met any guy named john. >> -- a few minutes later >> whoops. >> yeah, it was -- of the century. >> then he realized you are caught? >> yeah. he just looked sick. the whole world came crashing down at that point. >> you can see the look in his eyes. then he started giving it all up. >> coming up. he would -- she would try and prevent, and that would produce an argument. >> and he would beat her. >> at home with fred, behind closed doors. >> you thought all families were like? that >> yeah. it was always just, that is what families did. >> when dateline continues. when dateline continues

volodymyr zelenskyy made an appearance during a pre-recorded videos during the grammys. he said, tell the truth about the war on your social networks and tv, show support in any way you can but not silence. and southwest airlines cancels thousands of flights this weekend trip stranding thousands of spring breakers. -- bad weather in florida. now, back to dateline. >> nearly a month after lynn schockner was gunned down in her own backdoor, her killer was behind. buyers but her husband fred, was still a free man. back in the family home with charlie. -- long beach was in the dark. no one seriously believed. what's the police now firmly believed, that fred schockner paton ordered for his wife's own murder.

charlie -- even after she was killed because the circumstances, nothing pointed out fred. and the police did not point that friend. >> the, said detective -- they had their reach since. >> we used them and a lot of respects. you feel guilty because they are beating their chance, and they have no idea that the father of charlie is the one that that the whole thing up. >> well, remember, maybe some ideas. >> i always had my suspicions. in spite of the fact that it was a burglar, and the police said it was a burglar? >> you still suspected your father? >> i didn't want to put it past him, as much as a kid you not want to suspect someone of that. it just seemed false. like -- stuff that you would just seem wrong. >> it started the day his mother was murdered, when he

and his dad surveyed the house, ransacked during the burglary. >> he had me go back and clean up all the jewelry that was overturned and spilled out. >> what does it do to your mind? >> it made me very numb. very numb. i just, it was a task, and i did, and went to bed. >> and your dad went to bed in the house with you? >> -- >> charlie understand his father intimately of course, but he alone knew the secret, understood his father in a way that had been hidden from the outside world for years. charlie may have looked like any other happy suburban kid, but at home he said he understood normal life to be the constant expectation of moments of terror. frequent unpredictable rages, abuse, another desperately trying to -- >> and so he would want to be it with a belt, and she would try and prevent, and that would

produce an argument? >> and then he would beat her. >> how often? >> often enough that as a child i knew it was going on. but then, that was normal, so i didn't know it was not wrong. >> you thought all families were like that? >> until i had friends come over, and they noticed stuff, it was weird for them to notice things and comment on it. but yeah, it was always just, that is what families did. >> year after year, it -- mother came to whisper her own secret, finally going to leave fred. >> my mom was tackling me in that night when i was 12 or so, and she was talking about how she was thinking about doing this. and she was so nervous about doing it. she didn't know if it was the right choice or what to do about it. >> what did you think? >> my first thought was very

excited, because it was great to be able to think of getting away from him. >> and then finally, more than a year later, lynn hired family law attorney -- what did she tell you she wanted from you? >> she wanted a fair division of the property. >> fred controlled all finances -- >> so she didn't know how much money they had as a family? >> no. >> how much money did they have as a family? >> well, including the equity in the home, probably six to 7 million. >> which an illegal separation by california law, would be split down the middle. but lintel her fred would never part with any of that money. then also told her about fred's physical abuse. and so, with a pending separation, lisa worried about lin and charlie's safety. i wanted her to move out of the home with charlie, she wouldn't do, it she wouldn't disrupt charlie who was just starting

high school. they lived in the neighborhood forever, so she was a sitting target. >> did you understand it was dangerous? >> yes. absolutely. >> and she did it anyways. that is how important getting out of that relationship was for her. she was willing to -- >> she should at least get a restraining order against friend. >> it wouldn't make a damn difference. >> that is what she told? you >> -- >> if he's going to kill me, he will kill me. restraining orders won't stop him. >> too late now, of course. but what about charlie? the detectives worried about his safety, called lynn brother mark he went back across the country to georgia and urged him to invite him for an extended visit -- even though they did not tell mark about the suspicion. >> i was surprised, i am still to this day that fred allowed that to happen, but he did.

>> perhaps fred had more pressing things to think about. whatever his reason, he put charlie on a plane to georgia just in time for the main event of the murder investigation. frank -- under arrest as the alleged middleman was expelling it all, telling police he took money from lynn's husband along with -- used a little of it to hire the killer -- harvey. frank agreed to help set a trap for these expected mastermind -- >> but wait a minute, did you promised him something? >> i didn't promise him anything. >> -- >> so why would he do it? >> i think in his mind, because we -- he was trying to dig himself out of a whole. >> or maybe frank didn't understand how -- deep the hole was. as undercover cop -- prepared frank for his big meeting with red, -- got a call from his wife. >> i said ham down here with

the cops, he goes on the home later, and he actually -- he even told me he goes, i don't kill her. i almost wanted to slap him and go, no you just hired somebody else to. >> well you have to be blind to death what -- >> you would think, we used to laugh like the sky for royal? >> thanks that it, up along with feds landline not the answering machine. >> i have reached the schockner. >> still, linda's voice, -- >> have a great day, bye-bye. >> neil, it's frank calling i wanted to convince even talk about a few things and get a couple things straightened up. i would appreciate it, i'm -- no -- >> fred picked up the phone. >> hello, hello -- >> you learn. >> what's going on. one >> nothing much. >> and they agreed to me at 7:30 in the, evening and a local restaurant. >> i'm trying to be there on

time. >> you can buy. >> less than two hours later, frank wearing the same hidden camera that the detectives used to catch him locked into the restaurant, to meet fred schockner. >> i set up their camera, the audio, and we got a couple of tables away to make sure that he didn't run. >> you had your eyeballs on him. >> we wanted to see everybody's reaction, and we had audio and a surveillance team outside listening to everything. >> coming up, undercover, -- minutes ticking by, no fred. >> we were already paranoid about being set up. >> but he showed, and what if he didn't. when dateline continues. dateline continues. . he looks more like dad every time i see him. -dad is old. -right. so, your message said you wanted to talk about insurance? i said, "i want you to talk about insurance."

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place, this moment, after nearly a month of painstaking investigations. detectives had engineered a face to face meeting between the middleman frank -- and his suspected mastermind lynn -- accept fraud was late. had he finally realized they were laying a trap? 7:30, 7:33, 7:35, nothing. if he didn't show, this could all fall apart. then, a signal from the surveillance van, there he was. >> he's outside. so i'm facing the place to make sure he wasn't -- he was already really paranoid about being set up. >> clearly. >> came in with his notepad. >> hailed -- >> now they have all eyes on frank and fred. >> they both at this point looked like they had been road

hard and -- just tired looking, and you can imagine the stress that must be going through him. then the old man who didn't look like he was doing well either. >> does he look frightened? >> yeah, they both look scared. they both look like chapter out on a burning ship. >> and as they feared, fred was suspicious. he sat down, said not a word, but he wrote something on his notepad. >> at which point fred lift him, and says are you wearing a wire? >> very possible. >> i thought he was going to walk, i thought he was going to come to a census and -- >> didn't. >> he stayed, and, they talked. frank tried to get fed to admit his role, fred deflecting his attempts. >> you know, you and i wouldn't be sitting here if you didn't

want lynn killed, you know that. >> i don't know in talking about. >> but frank kept going at, it and fred finding something slick. >> i'm scared fred, i don't -- understand you're scared to. you have to understand, we would not be in this position if it wasn't for her. >> if it wasn't full and we want to be here. >> that's true, and if it hadn't been sloppy on expire, we wouldn't be here either. >> -- nick harvey the hired killer for the first time connecting himself to lynn's murder. but frank kept going after, like they knew they needed more. >> we would not -- be here if it wasn't for -- we wouldn't. >> we wouldn't be here if it wasn't for the way things -- >> is not a question of -- being >> he -- has done me a favor --

>> if you got caught, that's him, he's doing the time for you. if you know that. -- >> it's like watching a married the old couple arguing back and forth, about whose fault it was. then it was cold or something. >> but of course, this argument was deadly serious. >> you have to understand, something we need -- to this problem. this is your problem. you have to understand this -- >> now. >> it's not our problem. >> this -- isn't it? >> i would have to say it's more your problem. >> fred was still very suspicious to frank, asked a few more times if he was wired. frank, frustrated now, -- >> i killed lynn? you're saying that i killed lynn? >> no. you alleged. >> no? >> you think i? colin >> who wanted her dad? who, who benefited?

>> -- >> frank argued like a man who wasn't acting. maybe he wasn't. >> who, really, who wanted me? >> -- >> the tension between the two seemed to reach a breaking point. -- >> you have to understand, that is why i'm here. >> now what you are here is trying to incite me -- >> really -- >> you know, why don't you go home. why don't you just go home? thank you very much. have a good evening, fred. have a good evening. thank you for everything. whatever money i, or you all -- pay back. get the -- out of my face. because -- you -- don't worry about me no more. do you understand -- questions. >> and, just as fred was

walking away, frank gave it one last shot. >> why don't -- you what you did. >> i haven't done anything wrong. >> okay and i did everything right? >> no. what you told me on the phone, you needed why nick family. he needed to quite examine your point not mine. >> i don't have the cash to quite an exam because you have all my calves. >> so if you want to give me the, castle give it back to you. and you can do what you want. >> and that was it. maybe not exactly the the detectives hope to hear, but after weeks of dense and intense pressure, getting fed on tape saying those things finally made his case. what was the mood in the venue are standing in? >> -- we got it now. >> finally, enough evidence to arrest him. but, they didn't. they let him go home, just to

see what he would do. so >> let's just see if he reaches out to somebody, because now he is scared. >> back at the restaurant, frank waited for an author signal from the detectives, and the waiter who frequently served the family stopped by to reminisce about lynn. >> she is very, nice very funny. >> putting frank in a very uncomfortable spot. >> there's nothing that anyone can say, -- >> he wasn't able to complete his thought. and soon, fred would be having a very different kind of conversation with police. coming up, -- fred forgot to clean up. >> he threw his trash in time? >> no. >> when dateline continues. n dateline continues and take. it. on... ...with rinvoq. rinvoq a once-daily pill can dramatically improve symptoms... rinvoq helps tame pain, stiffness, swelling.

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a 21. >> before he got mixed up with

-- aka all combine oh had so many possibilities. he had just recently married a woman, a schoolteacher who had no idea what her husband had done, or what he was facing. >> -- maintain our cool. >> but it was too late for that. frank did not go home to his wife that evening. he was slipped into a pair of handcuffs, and was brought to jail. and fred, well, fred did go home under the watchful eye of the undercover cops who also conducted a thorough search of the restaurant for those notes fred wrote. they found nothing. nor did fred contact anyone else that evening, and so, the next morning -- >> we showed up, 9:00 in the morning and -- disheveled, hadn't slept a lot that night.

>> did he look shocked? worried? >> very shocked. and our response was -- >> they took him away. and when they searched his house, they found one last piece of evidence in a trash can. one of those notes fred scribbled in the restaurant. sloppy nick it said. >> he did throw his trash in time? >> nope. across the country in georgia, charlie got the news. >> yeah, that was another kind of happy moment, to be honest. >> that is quite a place to get to in life? when you are happy that your father has been arrested for murder, or murdered your mother? >> yeah, it's -- i mean no one wants to -- no one would want to actually say gosh, yeah, that is a good thing, but after everything growing up with him, in the house, it seems like a bit of justice. >> almost three years after

linda's death, the three men charged with her murder finally went on trial. and detective -- undercover -- cop both retired now where there. >> it's nice to see a case all the way through, see it getting in my opinion, get what they got coming to them. >> so you got a special weird look -- from >> when they walked into, court the only one that looked good that day, like rested and fine with nick harvey. you could tell he had come to terms with what he had done, and he knew he was never going to see the lay of the again. >> the other two were really struggling with it. they looked really be. >> they were so different, the three of them. they were a very unlikely trio of criminals. >> when the thomas russell, a reporter for the long beach press telegram at the time

covered all three trials. nick rvs was first. >> i would have to say he was more brown than brain. he -- and i don't mean that to be insensitive, but, he -- this is a guy who took the witness stand and his own defense, and he said that he aspired to be a hit man, that he -- >> he said that on the witness? >> yes. >> what did you think? >> i thought you're not the brightest fault on the marquee. no. so, he said he toyed around with being a hitman, that he had idolized the hulk as a child. the incredible hulk. and, he said that he had taken steroids just to get bigger and stronger and -- it was very hard for the jury to have sympathy for him. >> and they didn't. the jury found him guilty in about 35 minutes. first degree murder, and

burglary. next was frank. >> he said he wouldn't have done it had -- not threatened his wife and his in laws. >> so he did it out of fear? >> yeah, he said literally he said on the stand that he had sacrificed his life for his family when we all know that he had sacrificed limbs life for his pocketbook. >> but that was the defense? >> that was his defense. >> the verdict, a guilty of first degree murder. now it was fred's turn. >> and the man had aged at least ten years, he looked so frail. >> but this wasn't over just yet. when fred schockner took the witness stand, he told the jury he could explain everything. do tell. telcoming, up he was very defi, and completely maintained his

innocence. >> will a jury believe him? >> i had a moment of just sitting there, just started crying, i hug my family. >> when dateline continues. when dateline continues eep formula combines 5 key nutrients that can help you fall asleep faster, stay asleep longer, and wake up refreshed. the brand i trust is qunol. >> you hold your breath, the

world kind of stops. >> a hush courtroom in long beach california. fred charged with commissioning the murder of his wife, caught on tape, blaming a sloppy hitmen, took the stand in his own defense. >> he was very defiant, and completely maintained his innocence until the end. i mean, in the face of this overwhelming evidence, he maintained his innocence. >> it was all a tragic misunderstanding, said fred. he didn't pay for murder, just for a used bmw. all those calls as alleged coconspirator, --

fred said they were, wait for, it pocket calls. and they prove nothing. >> the jury had to consider all possibilities naturally, but there was no shortage of nerves among members of linda's family. charlie, just 17 years old that day, watched the jury back in. >> its law on order, and everything right there. you sit there, everyone comes in, and you hold your breath. the world kind of stops. you don't know what's the outcome is, because they have all the power. whatever they say is the truth or what is going to be the truth. >> a lot of butterflies in your tummy? >> oh yeah. >> he looked at their faces for sign, waited nervously for justice for his mother. >> what was it like to hear the words? >> emancipating. it was just unbelievable. >> the verdict, guilty.

first degree murder. >> i had a moment of just sitting there, i just started crying, i hug my family. >> you know, it's interesting you say about your family, because somebody who doesn't know the whole story might say you lost your family, but, they don't know the whole story? >> yeah, no. yeah -- they were having my mother side of the family, her two brothers, and family with me. it was amazing. it's what family should be. they were all there for me. >> the judge allowed charlie to address his father in court. >> i had this whole speech prepared, this vindication of everything, but i was so angry, just shaking. and not really able to get my words out. but i managed to say that i'm no longer your son. i can't believe you would do

this. you are going to where you belong. >> that would be a pretty scary moment, i mean making moment. >> it was terrifying. to know that it was actually going to happen, that this was the culmination of everything. it was a lot of emotion. >> so you are saying goodbye to him. >> yeah. yeah. >> through all of this, fred maintained his innocence. in fact, even before his trial began, fred did carry out a threat he added, right after the murder. he launched a lawsuit against the long beach police department for not protecting his wife. >> he went to the city, and filed a claim which is a precursor to the lawsuit against the city of long beach. blaming the long beach police department for not preventing

the murder of his wife, because they had not followed through -- followed proper procedure. >> wait a minute, it's their fault because they didn't serve end me from killing my wife? >> exactly. >> the claim was rejected. but now, on the day of his sentencing, he tried the same argument again. >> that was the chargers response to. he called sophistry, and he called him a defense costing human being, and he did not miss words. >> fred was sentenced to life without parole. they all were. >> in a few sentences, but what do you think the motive in this verdict was? >> money. >> and one word apparently. >> for whatever reason, three or 4 million was not enough, for men fred, he wanted six or eight. >> even from prison, fred shacknai fought to keep it all for himself, his own son, his

own blood. he tried to prevent charlie from getting his share of the schockner estate. and the charlie was granted some of the money, fred kept millions for himself. know how he managed to spend in prison was unclear. we wrote letters to all three of them. nick harvey, -- and -- asking to hear from them, what happened. fred wrote back, and said he was convicted on, highly skeptical circumstantial evidence, and that there should have been more than enough to prove my innocence. nick now in his 30s called us. he has matured in prison, he said. he was mad at the world back then. but as found god now. but listen to this, though he takes full responsibility for what he did, he is also been nursing a strange and very lonely conspiracy theory. >> i have always believed --

>> they intentionally sent her back there to be killed? >> yes. you don't still believe that though? >> well, i'm not a big believer in -- situations like this. >> lots of time to think in prison, but on things like that, but also about charlie. >> oh, charlie, he -- why did to charlie's haunts me every day. >> yeah. >> you know, i took so much from him. >> but whether nick knew it or not, charlie was in the very capable hands of his uncle mark who received a commission from his word sister than before she was murdered. >> if anything happens to me, take care of my son. >> and he did. >> how do you feel about that? boy >> the snow is going to be

tough. i always look back at that moment as the greatest gift i ever received, from the man who i still hate more than any person i have ever known. and, my wife and i didn't have children of our own, now i have the best son in the world. >> well it has been great. mark and -- are just they are great, i love them so much. >> and so, in a sad, and strange way, a lot of unimaginable evil and loss, came love. a real family, and unexpected blessings. >> why has he done for you personally? >> having him in your life? >> it's like getting another life. like somebody opened the door,

and said here is -- a second chance. >> a good reason to get up in the morning? >> -- a recent alive. >> mark and susan are now his mom and dad. he has taken their last name. and charlie, is more -- than he is thriving. >> i'm going somewhere, and i'm going fast. >> he got his masters and landed his dream job and theme park design. he has learned in spite of everything, that -- the rest of lessons to accept and move on. >> i know it happened, and i know it influenced me, but it is not defining me. >> but there is one thing that defines him, his mother's character. and that follows him everywhere. >> my mother was just ethereal, she holds a very special place. she is just everything that you

think of as good, everything that is kind, everything that is great about people. it is what's embodied. and i carry that with me. >> this sunday, is russia withdrawing or reloading? >> there is what russia says and what russia does. we focus on the latter. >> ukrainian in the north. and retreating forces in ukraine east. >> it is clear the russians want to reprioritize their operations in the donbas area. >> real questions about what vladimir putin is being told. >> we believe putin is being misinformed by his advisers about how badly the russian military is performing. >> my guest today