this sunday putin's brutal war. >> the russian war machine should be denied its capacity to attack. >> aimed at women and children hoping to escape harm. >> this case shows that they tried to kill civilians. >> this as more atrocities come to light in areas the russians have evacuated. >> i didn't expect they were so heartless. >> ukraine's foreign minister says the agenda is so simple.

>> they have three items: weapons, weapons and more weapons. >> just how much help will ukraine get from western allies? i'll talk to dmytro kuleba and national security adviser jake sullivan. >> plus -- >> ketanji brown jackson confirmed. as america's first black female supreme court justice. >> in my family, it took just one generation to go from segregation to the supreme court. >> winning three republican votes after a parade of republican attacks. >> it goes back to incredible character and integrity she possesses. >> also, inflation fears. >> it's scary to think about where it's going. >> i'll talk to someone who predicted inflation was coming and now says a recession is likely next year. former treasury secretary larry summers. join me for inside analysis, anna palmer, former republican

congressman carlos curbelo, kimberly atkins stohr, and josh lederman. nbc news correspondent. welcome to sunday. it's "meet the press." >> from nbc news in washington, the longest running show in television history, this is "meet the press" with chuck todd. >> good sunday morning. it's difficult to put into words the extent of russian cruelty. perhaps the russians have done it for us. on friday at the train station where russians bombed civilians who were simply trying to flee the war from ukraine's east was a missile fragment with a letter reading "for the children." is that a signal from the russians? it's not clear. what is clear is that some 50 people were killed, civilians trying to flee the war. ukraine's president zelenskyy called this an evil that has no limits as he begged, cajoled and demanded that western allies do

more to stop this slaughter. yesterday britain's prime minister boris johnson met zelenskyy in kyiv. as britain and slovakia announced new military aid for ukraine. even as russian troops pulled back from the north, zelenskyy says the russian horrors that shocked the world in the town of bucha are worst yet in other towns now occupied by ukrainian forces. i'll talk to the ukraine foreign minister. i'll ask security adviser jake sullivan whether the united states needs to do more now to stop the slaughter. we're going to begin with molly hunter. she is in kyiv where life has returned to a new normal. molly, describe kyiv right now, and watching the prime minister from britain walk the city streets with zelenskyy, what are you seeing in kyiv? >> reporter: chuck, good morning. look, an extraordinary video to watch president zelenskyy and

the british prime minister walk through the streets of kyiv. there is a little bit of normalcy. there are some cafes reopening. there are some bars reopeningening. but certainly the city doesn't look like it did two months ago. two quick points about that boris johnson visit. i think it makes the point, first, that kyiv is safe. this is a capitol city a few weeks ago predicted that it would fall into russian hands. here is president zelenskyy not wearing body armor, and the second really, zelenskyy is doing what he has been doing so well, chuck, is bringing the western attention to this country, keeping ukraine at the top of the agenda and having a prime minister like boris johnson walking around the streets of kyiv does just that. >> important to keep the west engaged in all of this, no doubt. this new russian general that's been appointed who oversaw their forces in syria, this seems to point to a more brutal russian attack in the east. what more can you tell us, molly? >> reporter: that's exactly

right. this is news that kind of broke overnight. alexander dvornikov. he is apparently one of putin's favorites. he was the one that called in many of the airstrikes and is accused of calling in many of the air strikes on residential buildings in syria, on hospitals, accused of atrocities, of carrying out russia's scorched earth policies. this really fills a power vacuum that apparently russia has been miss as key battle field commander, and this focuses now to the east of the country. we are hearing from ukraine defense officials, though, that this may push to the east. a lot of the troops that pulled back from the north and the northwest where i am around kyiv, they're not ready to go back in, so we're told this morning by u.k. defense officials that they are literally recruiting people that have been discharged in the last ten years, in addition to troops from neighboring countries. so a lot of the success in the east is going to depend on

whether russia can really show up with the number of people that they actually need. >> perhaps they're more vulnerable than anybody realizes. molly hunter in kyiv for us. molly, thanks. joining me now from kyiv is ukraine's foreign minister dmytro kuleba. foreign minister, welcome to "meet the press," sir. >> the pleasure is mine. >> let's begin with the visit by the british prime minister boris johnson, the symbolic walk through the center of town, the importance of the symbolism, but also, what promises were made that you hope are carried out? >> well, i would say it's about symbolism, it's also about sending a message of confidence in ukraine and the ukranian leadership and the ukranian army that is capable of defending the capitol. and it's true to say that ukraine won the battle for kyiv. now another battle is coming, the battle for donbas, and, of

course, we are preparing for it, working with our partners to get all necessary weapons, and basically everything that one needs to win a battle. the united kingdom has been taking the lead in working with us on the issues which we need the most, such as armored vehicles. or shore to vessel weapons to contain the fleet of the russian federation. >> earlier when this war began, the united states made a distinction between defensive weapons and offensive weapons. you yourself even said you didn't understand the difference, we're defending our country. any weapon needs to be used here to defend. now our pentagon is saying ukraine can win this war. what weapons do you need that we're not sending to help you win this war?

>> i don't think the difference that he mentioned still works for the united states. the united states has done more than any other country in the world to provide us with necessary weapons. however, some countries in europe like germany, they still think in terms of defensive/offensive, so we have to work with them more on this. the problem with supplying weapons to ukraine is that sometimes it comes to it. if we didn't waste a lot of time discussing the issue of defensive against offensive and what ukraine needs and what ukraine doesn't, then we would have been in a different position now, a much stronger position. another issue that we have is the timeline. the timing of supplies. when i met with secretary blinken in brussels a couple of days ago, i made that point clear. i appreciated, that we ukraine appreciate everything that you are doing, but the time line is crucial. every day matters.

things must be supplied on a daily basis to strengthen our defense capabilities. we're working with the united states on a range of issues, including things like heavy air defense systems and the supply -- also i would like to mention the united states are helping us in our relations with other countries to get weapons from them, weapons which we need. so this is a mutual beneficial cooperation. >> do you think your military alone with all these military supplies can defeat the russians? or if you are a member of nato, you would be asking for more nato troops? >> well, if we were a member of nato, this war wouldn't take place. it's a strategic mistake that was made in 2008 by germany and france who rejected the efforts of the united states and other

allies to bring ukraine in is something that we are paying for. it's not germany or france that are paying the cost for the mistake, it's ukraine. so the reality is that we know how to fight. we are capable. i believe it will not be an exaggeration to say that ukraine proved to be one of the strongest armies in the world, maybe the second strongest after the united states. not in terms of numbers, but in terms of experience and the capacity to fight. but all we need is state of the art weapons of all kinds supplied to us. we propose to the west and to nato, you provide us with everything that we need, and we fight so that you don't have to step up in the fight when putin decides to attack on the north

atlantic treaty and the nato countries. >> the attack on the train station, when you see what they did in targeting the civilians, it begs the question, i know you want peace, the president has talked about peace. can you sit down and make peace with the russians? >> it's extremely difficult to even think about sitting down with people who can find excuses for all these atrocities and war crimes who have inflicted such horrendous damage on ukraine. but i understand one thing. if sitting down with the russians will help me to prevent at least one massacre like in bucha or other attack in kramatorsk, i have to take that opportunity. whatever i feel, if i have a chance to save a human life or a

village, a town from destruction, i will take that chance. >> the russians apparently are appointing a new general, aleksandr dvornikov, and the assumption is he'll do what he did in syria, target civilians and that this is going to be more brutal than the east. what message, what should nato do, to help in response to this? and does this signal to you that the russians want to fight you for months, if not years? >> well, let's go back to the very beginning of the war when russia's plan was to defeat the entirety of ukraine in something like three days. so now this plan failed, obviously, and now they have another plan. but we have our plans. and history will demonstrate whose plan will prevail.

so whatever russia is planning to do, we have our strategy, and this strategy is based on the assumption -- on the confidence that we will win this war, and we will liberty our territories. timing is important, but we don't calculate how much time it will take. >> the national security adviser jake sullivan is listening to our program right now and willard be on this program right after we conclude our talk. do you have any message or question for him? >> well, i think that i would send regards to jake sullivan with whom we met in warsaw a week ago when i was received by president biden and we had a meeting with secretary blinken and austin. i think that the level of mutual understanding that ukraine can bring a lot of good to the world

and to europe. so i think that we should, i believe that we should open all doors, and ukraine is ready to be a reliable partner, a strategic partner of the united states, but we need everything that jake is perfectly aware of, as soon as possible, to put an end to this war, to restore the country, and to strengthen the europe atlantic security. >> mr. foreign minister, i appreciate you coming on. thank you. >> thank you. and as i mentioned, joining me now, who was listening, national security adviser jake sullivan. jake, welcome back to "meet the press." >> thanks for having me. >> i'll give you a chance right now to respond. obviously when a country is at war, the weapons never come fast enough when you've got people coming in a hot shooting war. what can the united states be

doing right now to accelerate this process? because clearly, whether it's president zelenskyy in his interview with the associated press, or what you just heard there from the foreign minister, none of it is coming fast enough for them. >> when you're in the middle of a war when you're being attacked by your neighbor, by russia, in the brutal and vicious ways russia is attacking ukraine, it only stands to reason that you would be asking that things come as rapidly as possible, that they get there yesterday. we're doing everything we can as the united states, working around the clock to deliver our own weapons. as the foreign minister just said, organizing and coordinating the delivery of weapons from many other countries so ukraine has what it needs. weapons are arriving every day, including today. and this week, along with chairman milley, i spent two hours on the phone with the chief of ukrainian armed forces and president zelenskyy's top aide.

we went through every weapon system that ukraine is seeking in priority order, and we have developed plans to deliver those as rapidly as possible. some have been delivered, others are in the process of being delivered, and we will continue to work aggressively to get ukraine what it needs to strengthen its hand on the battlefield and to strengthen its hand at the bargaining table. >> a few weeks ago you made a distinction between defensive weapons and offensive weapons. it was interesting to hear the foreign minister say he actually thought the united states was no longer seeing it through that prism, but he did say he thought other members of the alliance were, and he singled out germany. first of all, is there a distinction anymore in your mind, and if there is, is it time to give ukraine offensive weapons so they can win this war? >> so given the nature of the battle, how things have shifted and adjusted and what the russians have done, frankly, killing civilians, atrocities,

war crimes, we have gotten to a place in the united states and across many members of the nato alliance where the key question is what does ukraine need and how can we provide it to them? that is the work that we are doing every day. i'd just like to point out, chuck, something very important, which is that the foreign minister just told you eye crane won the battle of kyiv. kyiv stands despite russia's attempt to take and conquer the capital. and it stands because of the bravery and skill of ukranian fighters, but it stands because weapons were in their hands, stopping tanks, shooting down aircraft, and turning back the russians, and we are proud of that contribution, but we are not resting until we have given them everything that they need to be able to succeed in their aims. >> is our posture now we're going to do everything we can to help ukraine win this war? i say it that way, because a month ago, i don't think there was a thought, how do we end the violence and get to the negotiating table?

how do we get peace? i know peace is still a priority here, but if the russians aren't moving from the east and this importance of a new general seems to indicate they're in it for the long haul, is our policy unequivocal on this? we're going to do what we can to help ukraine win this war and push russia out of the east? >> our policy is unequivocal that we will do whatever we can to help ukraine succeed. and it will be ukraine. president zelenskyy and the democratically elected government of ukraine that determines what that success constitutes. which means we need to keep giving them weapons so they can make progress on the battlefield, and we need to keep giving them military support and strong economic sanctions to improve their position, their posture at the negotiating table. but at the end of the day, what we want to see is a free and independent ukraine, a weakened

and isolated russia, and a stronger, more unified, more determined west. we believe that all three of those objectives are in sight, can be accomplished, and we will do what it takes to support the ukrainians and their effort to help bring those objectives. >> are we now going to do what it takes to get them fighter jets, if that's something they need? i know that had been up in the air before. has that changed? >> so the only thing that the united states has expressed reservations about is sending fighter jets from a u.s. air base in germany into contested air space over ukraine, flying them from point a to point b. if a country in eastern europe wants to supply mig 29s or other forms of soviet aircraft, we have said that is their sovereign decision. the only thing we said we would not do is make that transfer from germany. from our perspective, though,

the weapons that the ukrainians are really focused on right now, that the chief of the ukranian armed forces walked through with us, our weapons, if they're not in american stocks, and many of them aren't, we're working very hard to acquire them, source them from other countries, get them delivered and into the hands of ukranian fighters. that's an ongoing process day by day, and the whole of the u.s. government under the direction of president biden is working overtime to make that happen as rapidly as possible, because we agree with the ukranian foreign minister time is of the essence and we are in a race against time and we intend to win that race. >> on the punishment front of the russians, 19 different countries this week expelled diplomats of one flavor or another. we have not. by some estimates there are some 400 russian diplomats circulating in this country. i know that there are some that are concerned that maybe these folks will be helping with a cyberattack or helping with

other ways to punish the west or to retaliate against the west. why haven't we sent some of these folks out of the country and expelled them? >> first of all, chuck, and sorry for not letting you finish the question. we have, in fact, expelled 12 russian diplomats, and many of these countries that announced actions this week were catching up to the previous american announcement of expulsions. of course, we're always on the lookout for anyone connected to espionage and spy services and we will not hesitate to take further action to declare persona non grata to expel to kick out further quote-unquote russian diplomats if we determine they're spies. but we did take expulsion action a few weeks ago. >> sure, but 12 is not 400. >> no. i mean, if you look at the way that we do this, every year we take an assessment of who we believe is operating undercover of one of the russian spy services. if we make a determination that

someone is here not as a diplomat but as a spy, we kick them out and will continue to do that. >> it was quite the symbol to see prime minister boris johnson walking the streets of kyiv with president zelenskyy. it raises the question, are we going to see president biden in kyiv? >> president biden doesn't currently have any plans to travel to kyiv. but what i will tell you is he sits in the oval office and the situation room on a daily basis organizing and coordinating the world when it comes to the delivery of weapons, and you heard from the ukranian foreign minister no one has given more than the united states and the united states is at the center of the effort to deliver from other countries and organizing and coordinating the world to take actions like the one last week, to kick russia out of the human rights council. so president biden will stay focused on that, and make sure that he is showing his support and solidarity to the ukranian people through those kinds of decisive actions. >> would you rule it out?

if there was a reason to go, he would get there? >> president biden has been to kyiv before. he looks forward to going to kyiv again. but we're not currently planning a trip. >> jake sullivan, the national security adviser, thank you for coming on and sharing the administration's perspective. when we come back, we're going to switch gears. larry summers predicted inflation was coming and here it is. now the former treasury secretary says look out for a recession next year. y says look recession next year. we' the new italian-style capicola. it's savory, smoky, and spicy. man, this is the triple-threat of deli meat! subway keeps refreshing and refreshing and refreshi-

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welcome back. on inauguration day if someone had told president biden that inflation would be at 6% and dropping and wages up and the stock market way up, at a four-decade high for inflation. and that has americans soured about the economy overall. the latest nbc news poll, adults disapprove of president biden

with the economy, by a two to one margin. and it only continues to grow. one person who saw inflation going is former secretary larry summers and says the u.s. may fall into a recession next year if things don't change quickly. mr. summers, good to see you. thanks for coming on. >> good to be with you. >> let me start with, what did you see when so many others missed? we've seen predictions of inflation the last 40 years. you're the one that seemed to have gotten the timing of this hit right. what did you see? >> i saw that we had a tidal wave of demand between zero interest rates from the fed, a huge outpouring of saving that people had pent up from the covid period, and massive fiscal policy from the december bill and then the stimulus bill that was passed.

it just seemed to me that demand was going to overheat, we were going to have labor shortages, the bathtub was going to overflow, so to speak, and the inflation rate was going to pick up. and i think that did happen. and then things that i certainly didn't see, and i don't think others could have seen, the ukraine war and all of the interferences in supply associated with that have created a bit of a perfect storm. >> i'm curious, is it possible that with covid and all the disruptions that caused, did we have basically two choices, a recession in the moment or throw money at the problem and risk inflation? were we sort of stuck between two bad choices here? >> i think we had very, very difficult choices, and i think

people with good faith made choices, and i think while i disagreed with them at the time, i think the choices reflected the consensus of many outside economists. i think we were too slow to pick up on how rapidly the economy was recovering, and, therefore, we injected more demand into the economy, both in terms of deficits and in terms of monetary policy than looks today to have been the right amount. some of it was we were buying an insurance policy that we turned out not to have needed, just like i bought life insurance last year, and in a sense i wasted my premiums, but in a sense it was necessary to spend that money. but i was concerned last year

that we were injecting too much demand into the economy given all the configurations. and i don't think it was a sound strategy to create these big labor shortages as the labor shortages we did create. >> so a recession, is it inevitable or is there a way to avoid it? >> nothing is inevitable or certain in economics, chuck. the painful facts, though, is that historically when we've had inflation above 4 and we've had employment below 4, essentially always, since world war ii, that's been followed by a recession within the next two years. perhaps we will be fortunate and there will be sufficiently rapid adjustments in commodity prices and other bottlenecks that will

make that not happen. perhaps the fed will be extraordinarily skillful. but i think the -- and lucky. but i think the fed has a very, very difficult job. i think we can make a contribution by doing things like the strategic petroleum reserve release that holds down where oil prices would otherwise go. i think this is the time when we need to be looking at tariff reduction, because potentially that could take a percentage point off of the cpi. i think we need to look wherever we can at buying things more inexpensively when the federal government is purchasing. we need to look at immigration flows so as to address this labor shortage.

but it's not going to be easy starting from where we are. >> you believe most of the work probably has to be done by the fed. but if for some magical reason, the administration could get something passed with this congress, of the agenda, you've been a supporter of most of the build back better agenda. what could be focused on that would actually reduce inflation and avoid a recession? >> i think probably the most important thing, ironically, is some of the revenue increases that the president has talked about. there would be very substantial benefits to closing a whole range of tax loopholes and secretary yellen's -- >> you don't like the billionaire tax. what other benefits? >> you're right, i don't like the billionaire tax, but i

do like the provisions that really go after corporations shielding money in the cayman islands, shielding money in ireland. we negotiated an historic agreement to enable the world to tax global corporations, which it was losing the ability to do, and that agreement could fail if we don't do our part to implement the u.s. measures that are part of it, and we sacrifice a lot of revenue and pump up a lot of demand. so i think that is a very important set of steps. i think it's important to remember that over the longer term, the president's infrastructure bill is going to increase the capacity of the economy, and that will be a favorable development. but over the nearer term, i

think the concentration on revenue is probably most important. for other reasons, i would very much like to see the green investments that the administration is proposing, which over time will reduce our dependence on fossil fuels. >> larry summers, there is a lot more i would love to be asking you, but i am limited by the amount of time i have today. i really appreciate you coming on and sharing your perspective. in short, the fed and interest rates and possibly some taxes might be the best way to get a soft landing. mr. summers, always a pleasure. thank you. >> thank you. when we come back, was ketanji brown jackson's supreme court confirmation the last big success president biden is likely to have before the midterms? that's next dterms that's nex wait, you're new too nobody told you? subway's refreshing with better ingredients,

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correspondent josh lederman,

kimberly atkins stohr, carlos curbelo and anna palmer. i want to set up what this moment for soon to be justice ketanji brown jackson means. let's hear what she had to say about this moment. >> it has taken 232 years and 115 higher appointments for a black woman to be selected to serve on the supreme court of the united states. [ applause ] >> but we've made it. >> when you entered law school, did you think this moment was going to happen this fast? >> no, absolutely not. i was lucky enough to have the encouragement of my family members, but i didn't have someone like a justice jackson to model what might be a future for me in the law. in fact black women in the law

and in all professions but certainly in the law were such a small percentage. when i was practicing law, i would go see days without seeing a black woman practicing as well. this is so important not just for black women and little black girls but for all americans. it's important for all americans to see that the default of a supreme court justice is not in the mold of a white male, that it can be anybody and that it should be reflective of the country. so this is an incredible, incredible moment. >> carlos, october 1, there is a majority of the court that is not going to be white male. it's a big deal. why did half the united states senate seem to go out of their way not to help celebrate this moment? >> well, chuck, identity politics in reverse. i think republicans want to make the point that we don't have to emphasize these kinds of issues even though they are historic. you heard marco rubio say, when i ran for president, i didn't ask anyone to vote for me

because i was hispanic. >> he never used his identity in his campaign ever? i don't think that's true. >> that's what he said. but i think by today's standards, this was a smooth, positive confirmation process. >> by today's standards. >> even republicans who didn't vote for judge brown said nice things about her. she had a big role in showing great temperament and restraint and not taking the bait in these hearings, so i do think this was a big win for this administration and a big deal for the country. >> all right, but here's something we don't see by today's standards, anna palmer, it was a post-confirmation attack ad sponsored by lindsey graham. let me play a portion of it. he went out -- we'll get that queued up in a little bit. but he went out and he seemed to

be very angry compared to brett kavanaugh and amy coney barrett, conveniently leaving out the merrick garland situation. what's going on with him in this part of the senate? >> i think what we're seeing is just an anger here, a reaction to what happened with justice kavanaugh, and they want to go bring it back to that. i think the other thing is he didn't get his choice. he wanted judge michelle childs who he really supported, but i think this is more look forward. republicans are not going to support another biden nomination here if that comes to be. you know, and his anger, i think, also foments what you see with republicans using this as a campaign tactic. >> we have the clip. >> the game has changed. remember amy coney barrett, how they came after her? remember kavanaugh? i do. compare that hearing with what happened to judge jackson is ridiculous. she wasn't ambushed. i asked her hard questions and she gave bad answers.

>> as a congresswoman in north georgia that is comparing the republicans using the p word, saying the pedophiles were supporting her, it doesn't sort of comport with that ad. >> it doesn't comport with that ad and it latches onto this narrative with judge jackson, soon to be justice jackson, that i imagine we'll probably here less and less about that now that she's actually confirmed. at the end of the day, everyone kind of knew a lot of this was not in good faith, right? republicans go after liberal justices, democrats go after republican justices. the evidence of that is you have senators like tom tillis who was efusely praising her, went up to her parents and said, you did an amazing job raising your daughter, and then turning around and voting against her. that's why we have folks like mitch mcconnell to say the door is open to simply block any future nominees regardless, a year, two years before the election.

>> its extraordinary that a democratic senate confirmed clarence thomas. to remind people. we're at a radical point though. no senator of the opposite party is going to confirm them. >> times have changed. this is just the toxicity of politics. >> is this the last big vote that president biden gets for the midterm, anna? >> i think you have to give him some credit. american rescue plan, infrastructure, omnibus. >> the things that larry summers said contribute to inflation. >> i do think you'll see something on the infrastructure package, you'll have to fund the government, but the child tax credit i have a hard time seeing. >> prescription drugs, josh, these are big ticket promises the democrats have made for a long time. >> you talk to white house officials and they don't dispute the fact this might be the last major achievement. they are excited about this bipartisan innovation act, they think they can use that in the midterms.

>> that's been sitting there for how many months? >> they want to be anti-china and look what we're doing for american manufacturing and whatnot, but nobody in the white house is claiming that they are definitely going to get any of those individual pieces, climate or the prescription drug stuff, they'd like to, but that's not the reality between now and november. >> i think there is a window for climate which would be a big deal for the democratic base. and there is a bipartisan consensus on climate. so i do think there is a chance there. >> i hope you're right. i haven't seen the evidence there. >> democrats have shown time and time again. they talk about the problems and some kind of legislative solutions. the republicans find issues they can campaign on and win elections on. that's exactly what's happening right now, that democrats haven't acted, for example, to get out ahead of title 42 and pass something in order to deal with this issue, knowing that you had basically expiration date on this policy and it had

to end sometime. they're just starting that phase now. republicans are already campaigning against it. democrats are always two steps behind. >> we have to pause it here before we go to break. we also want to talk about our latest episode. nbc news correspondent morgan radford helped us take a look at the explosion of online misinformation plaguing america -- latino community. >> do you think there is misinformation within the latino community? >> absolutely. >> are you kidding me? >> 110%. >> it's everywhere. not only misinformation but disinformation targeted specifically to the spanish language and the latino community. >> it's a belief backed up by national research with more than a third of hispanic americans saying they see misinformation often online. >> by a show of hands, how many of you have personally received misinformation? all of you.

where did it come from? >> everybody. >> you can see the entire episode on misinformation in the latino community any time you want on peacock or anywhere where you watch your streaming. coming up, good news about the economy. stay with us. eve rything like the new mustard rything rotisserie-style chicken. it's sweet, it's tangy, it's tender, it never misses. you could say it's the steph curry of footlongs. you could, but i'm not gonna. subway keeps refreshing and refreshing and re...

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november, a top concern, likely the economy. while measures the country's economic picture right mow is complicated, the nation is certainly not. the consumer sentiment index from the university of michigan is probably the best thing we have to measure where people think the economy is. when biden took office, it sat at 79. it went up a little bit in territory when the covid response improved. it's now sitting at 62.8. basically a failing grade. before the pandemic hit, this index was sitting at 101. people felt really good about the economy. there are good signs the biden administration will talk about when they talk about the economy. unemployment rate, now at 3.8%. we continue to add jobs. for what it's worth, the dow is down for this calendar year of

january to now but up overall. so why is everybody upset about the economy? it's this number, 7.9%. when biden took office, the inflation rate was sitting at 1.4%. as we've been digging out from covid, all this money thrown into the economy, we see what the inflation rate is doing. the question is, is it going to stop going up? this is why folks do not think this is a good economy. when we come back, with the culture wars heating up, this is not a good thing. stay with us. ng t to i refresh. because subway now has italian-style capicola on the new mozza meat and supreme meats. love the smell of italian food. subway keeps refreshing and refres-

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welcome back. as we said, the culture wars appear to be heating up. carlos, our home state of florida has been kind of ground zero with some of this action, with governor desantis almost using the legislature as his primary vehicle for literally 2024, but there's not a lot of copy cat stuff going on in legislatures. let me put up the headlines in the don't say gay bill, when you

can talk about gay parents and things like this in schools, alabama, texas, ohio. one hallmark of the culture wars in this country is the party that overreaches and gets punished. are we at a tipping point here where the right's overreaching? >> chuck, right now republicans are winning the culture wars in this country. that's just the way it is. you look at defund the police, you look at defund i.c.e. now in florida, you look at the don't say gay bill. they take the position that students who are learning to read and write should be taught about sooult about sexuality and gender identity. i think democrats have consistently been at least perceived to be on the wrong

side of this issue, and ron desantis, if he runs in 2024, he's going to run on these issues. >> the right is so good about baiting the left to be specific. this bill has about 50-50 support. it's not decisive in either direction. >> the polling is all over the place. it's very difficult to poll in this kind of way. but yes, republicans see the win in the race in virginia and they say they can just take this playbook over and over again, and democrats don't have any way to message it. first off, desantis facing off with disney, if republicans are railing against cancel culture. if the government penalizes someone over what they say, that's the first amendment. the democrats legally are on the winning side of this, yet you haven't heard that message at all. >> it's been astonishing to me that the democrats haven't grabbed onto a libertarian attack on this. this is big government telling people what to do.

this is government saying they want to look in your -- want to know what your kid's gender is. get out of my kid's bedroom. >> that's time and again what we're seeing republicans do right now if we look at what's happening with abortion and all these other cases. i think democrats are on their heels particularly when it came to schools and covid and mask requirements and they have not figured out how to message around this. yeah, there are easy slogans you could push back on but they haven't found an animating slogan to kind of push back and get the public sentiment behind them. >> then again, we've seen democrats to allow their messaging to almost be defined by the other side that is so hard to get out of. the problems with the polling on this mirror the problems that democrats have in messaging on if you were to ask the average parent of a first grader, do you want your kid to be taught about sep in first grade? most parents would say probably not. but if you asked, is it okay if they read a book to your child

about two penguin dads, they are not going to have the same response and they are kind of ceding the culture war on this. >> and that's why democrats lose this messaging. that messaging does not connect with working class voters, with latino voters, so those numbers are going to continue to erode as long as democrats are perceived to be on this side of the issues. >> kimberly, it's interesting to see the deep dive debate inside the white house. you can see the disagreement inside the white house between those who want to be politically pragmatic and those who say, but this policy is wrong, and you're like, yeah, it's going to get weaponized against you. >> that's exactly what i said. democrats focus on the policies and solutions and republicans are way out ahead on the politics and how to use it to win elections. democrats could have solved this

problem or been out in front of what the problem is. we were just talking about the need for immigration to get more workers to help boost the economy. there are so many ways to do it and we just can't seem to figure it out. >> does a roe v. wade decision flip the script on this at all? >> i don't know. we haven't been able to see democrats kind of mobilize on this. i do think if it totally goes away, you're going to see democrats try find a way to get their base out to the polls. right now they have done nothing on voter rights, immigration, all these other things. there is a real issue for democrats in the midterms. >> it's interesting, normally when there is an economic story that's dominating, the culture wars fade. this is one rare occasion where we're going to get both in this midterm. that's all we have for today. thank you for watching. we'll be back next week, i promise, because if it's sunday, it's "meet the press." ss."

how are you? >> you know how i am. good to see you. >> very, very, very good to see you. how you are doing? >> it is an absolute pleasure to see you. fantastic to see you. how are you? >> you're well? >> yes. >> concerning what you've been through. you are strong. fantastic. you're absolutely. >> a slow of solidarity, with the ukrainian people, that's british prime minister boris johnson meeting with volodymyr zelenskyy in kyiv, after russia's failure to seize that capital city. but the assault continues in the