with other shelters across the country. thank you watching the katy. franco can also govern besides on the msnbc hug hub on peacock every thursday and friday. velshi starts. right now. t now. >> today on velshi, how speaker nancy pelosi becomes the highest ranking u.s. official to visit kyiv since the start of the war. we have got details on that trip. an exclusive reporting on the influx of weapons heading to ukraine, that could change the pace of this war. plus the latest escalation on the war on women's reproductive rights, who have health care workers talking about medical refugees in america, forced to flee between states to get the health care they need, right here, in 2022. this is what we can have nice things. my thoughts on marjorie taylor greene, -- hawthorne, and the death of a shame in donald trump's

republican party. then, i will be joined by legendary author of a darkly dystopian and eerily oppression to book, that is as relevant today as it was when it was first published in 1985. the one and only, margaret atwood. two will join me for this week's meeting of the velshi banned book club, to discuss her frequently banned blockbuster book, the handmaids tail. velshi starts and now. good morning to you. i am ali velshi. it is, sunday may the. first it is day 67 of russia's unprovoked invasion of ukraine. we begin this morning with breaking news. because just hours, ago the house speaker nancy pelosi led a small delegation, a congressional delegation, on a trip to kyiv. she met ukrainian president volodymyr zelenskyy. she spent about three hours on the ground in the capital. pelosi is now the highest ranking u.s. official to visit to kyiv. since the start of the war in

february. this comes about a week after the defense secretary lloyd austin, as the secretary of state anthony blinken. met with zelenskyy in kyiv. pelosi spoke while in kyiv, and also what are returning to poland. >> we believe that we are visiting you, to say thank you. to fight for freedom. this is a fight for everyone. and so, our commitment is to be there for you until fighting is done. [inaudible] i would say that our conversation was president alaska was no surprise. his detailed knowledge of every subject we brought up. a master class of leadership. >> the delegation also consider

the representatives gregory meet, jim mcgovern, jason crow, and adam schiff. other representatives are listed as part of the delegation. however, they did not travel to kyiv and instead remained in poland, where the full delegation is having meetings with the polish president. poland is also in the news this morning after reaching a deal with slovakia, and which slovakia is sending his fleet of war planes to ukraine. and, while waiting on moderna replacement jets, poland would patrol slovakia's skies with its fleet of as 16. they also recently sent their soviet era defense system to ukraine. a deal between poland and the u.s. to get poland's fleet of soviet air war planes to ukraine fell apart several weeks ago. neither side wanted to be seen sending the planes directly to ukraine for fear of rattling russia, something that slovakia clearly is not afraid of.

it continues to be vital to get ukraine the substance that needs, because with east passing day we continue to learn more about the medieval ways in which russia is going about its war. with eyes on the destroying ukrainian culture through murder and pillage, and through old-fashioned plunder. there have been documented reports of russian troops stealing everything from school electronics in the suburbs around kyiv, two tons and tons of cell phones. two loads and loads of washing machines. now, ukraine's deputy agriculture -- says that russia is also stolen several hundred tons, perhaps millions of tons, of ukrainian grain. which is the lifeblood of ukraine's economy. also the literal lifeblood for people around the world. if stealing other cultures food seems barbaric, a recent situation that took place in the city of mariupol was much more bizarre. local mariupol officials say that a russian-speaking man

dressed in a white lab coat, flanked by heavily -- russian troops wore a pair of special gloves and used a pair of long tweezers to steal at least -- pieces of a skinny and gold artifacts. along with other priceless items and relics. these gideon empire was primarily based in the crimea region. cynthia goal is extremely important. almost sacred with an ukrainian culture. as the mayor said of the looting, quote, the oaks have taken a hold of our scithian gold gun. they also say that russian troops have plundered more than 1000 pieces from the city's art museums. once again cue the nazi comparisons. and by nazis i mean the real german nazis, not the fake ones that russia claims it is fighting in ukraine. because that's a lie, about

russia and ukraine, was once again used by russian puppets in crimea was. who called -- nazis, and said they would be quote, captured and lead through mariupol on a train. according to russian state media. russia's actions in ukraine continues to be ungodly. they say that prince -- reached out to prudent three times to get a vatican led evacuation of people from mariupol. reports game four vatican flagged vessel to be used to evacuate women and children strapped in the steel factory in that city. putin reportedly rejected all three of the requests. nonetheless, ukrainian officials reported that around 20 civilians were able to be invokes evacuated from that factory yesterday. a ukrainian commander says that he hopes it will be taken to exonerate. ceta more than --

refugees have been taken in by russia by the way. although being a ukrainian refugee and russia is a bit of an oxymoron, with various people saying that russia is essentially kidnapping men women and children, taking them against their will and often without documentation, to russia, where they will then remain stuck. despite when a senior u.s. defense department official says is slow and uneven progress in gaining ground russia is successfully continuing its attacks on ukrainian infrastructure. the airport in the ancient southern coast of ukrainian city of odessa is now in operable after russian missile strikes yesterday, according to local officials. or should also recently struck ukraine's main producer of fuel products, which has led to a shortage of already scarce oil and other energy. and speaking of oil and energy, the eu could announce, as early as this week a phased embargo of russian oil. several eu officials and diplomats involved in the

process tell the new york that the eu is expected to give members until the end of the year, this year, to completely ban russian oil imports. although some countries, which are almost entirely dependent on russian oil's hungry and slovakia for instance, are expected to give in a longer period of time. joining me now live from lviv ukraine's raf sanchez, nbc news correspondent. the speaker of the house in senior congressional delegation comes on the heels of several other major world and european leaders visiting zelenskyy. what's the least visits do for them? >> they give these leaders a real, on the ground sense of the war with ukrainian people, that they are. fighting into pelosi is a big drop once she gets back to washington. she has to steer that 33 billion dollar ukrainian aid package that president biden is asking for, through that unruly congress. and i expect ali, that you want

to be in a position which he sits down across the table from members who may be wavering on voting on this and say look, i was in the bunker with president zelenskyy. he tells us that he needs these weapons for these reasons. the soldiers in the donbas need them for the. yes it was interesting ali. she brought the chairman of another of very important committees with our adam shift intelligence committee gregory meeks the foreign affairs committee, and jim governs the rules committee. so i think this was a foreign trip by the speaker of the house. but as always, she has an eye on what is going on in congress. what is going to strengthen her hand as she tries to get this enormous package through. this is not easy politics. there are some covid issues, there are some immigration issues they're threatening to derail this. but president biden says it is needed. and speaker pelosi says that she will get it done. you mentioned, ali, a glimmer of hope in mariupol. yesterday, some 20 civilians were able to get out.

the russian ministry of defense is now saying that an additional 20 or so got out in the evening yesterday, for a total of around 40. these civilians were not taken from mariupol to zaporizhzhia. they wednesday take into russian control territory east of the city. ali? >> thank you for your reporting. we will stay close to this morning. nbc news foreign correspondent raf sanchez, in lviv, ukraine. joining me now is the award winning journalist and the executive order of new voice of ukraine. veronica -- good to see you, again thank you for joining us. you have been providing us with some remarkable accounts of what it is like to be in some of these places, and try to escape. i was reading one of your accounts about a girl, talking about her parents. she said that during a filtration, the filtration where the russians determine who you are and where you should go, during filtration, the occupiers scanned past points, asked about people's

political positions, check their smartphones on social media, and even searched the history of ukrainians. searching for something that provides that the person has a pro ukrainian position. which signify to the russians of this person was or not to. this will be the way that she deleted her social media profile, and some contacts. but her father didn't do the same. he wiped his whole phone clean, which immediately got him into trouble with the russians. what's happened next? >> as she told me, they started beating him. and they beat him to an extent he started losing his sight. then, after that they forced him to drive a car. to zaporizhzhia. during the night. so, they just kind of set the minds over the side of the road there, just to direct the column of civilians, as they want to. these people are forced to

drive next to a very dangerous, deadly mine. and this is how they discovered that their father was losing a side, because he didn't see those mines. he had to basically tell him where to go. left or right. in order not to touch these minds. >> you are constantly documenting these atrocities. the things are actually happening to people. i don't mean to use the word atrocities lightly. obviously some are worse than others. but this constant evolving fear that ukrainians have, those who decided they would park their goods and leave their city, particular in mariupol influxes like, that never left because they were told the safest place to be would be in their apartment buildings. and now i'm showing you pictures of apartment buildings that were targeted by missiles. and someone can go live in the hallways. then, someone go live in the basement. and survive on very little food.

>> yes. these people are basically what -- russia did in the first days of wars is they had a mobile connection they cut electricity there. people were basically the only sort of news is from basements to basement. so it was basically people trying to get some food or water, and they have to leave this basement. that is how they pass information there. so this is what the people of mariupol were telling me recently. russians are saying that basically no one is waiting for you and ukraine. now, one once you are in europe. only in russia will you feel as if your brothers will give you food, give you everything you want. ukraine doesn't need you. russians know that the people there are desperate. they are suffering from hunger. diseases. right now, it is getting warmer. it is going to be really hard

diseases there. like cholera. others, very scary diseases. mariupol is basically full of corpses. and people want to get out. and russians are using it to lure them into russian territory. and then, all they get is 10,000 rubles. it is about $140. then, they are settled somewhere. rushers far east, with no ability to return. most of these people have no money to travel across the 9000 kilometers back to ukraine. >> that is. right an old-fashioned russian trick. getting into his own 9000 miles away. all of this detailed in this article from -- the woman of mariupol tell their stories of living under occupation and escaping the siege, an important read. thank you, veronika melkozerova, award-winning journalist an executive editor for the new voice of ukraine.

we are going to have much more in the or in ukraine. unspeakable as his major trip there, as well. plus, developments from the january six committee as we approach the much anticipated public hearings. they are scheduled for just over a month from now. later, joining me for this week's canadian addition of the velshi banned book club, we will have none other than margaret atwood, the author of the handmaid's tale. which has been prohibited by a handful of libraries across the country. you definitely do not want to miss that. keep it up. it up i grow all my own vegetables shingles doesn't care. we've still got the best moves you've ever seen good for you, but shingles doesn't care. because 1 in 3 people will get shingles, you need protection. but, no matter how healthy you feel, your immune system declines as you age increasing your risk for getting shingles. so, what can protect you? shingrix protects. you can protect yourself from shingles with a vaccine proven to be over 90% effective.

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america was in its reconstruction era. the union had defeated the confederacy in the civil war, and america was ready for a clean slate. so, lawmakers decided to revamp the u.s. constitution, adding three amendments known as the reconstruction or civil war amendments. the 13th, 14th and 15th

amendments were intended to guarantee the freedom of former slaves and grant them certain rights. section 43 of the 13th amendment is one that often forgotten are overlooked. it was added after the civil war, to keep former and future confederates out of congress. here's what it states. no person shall be a senator or representative in congress or elect or of president and vice president or hold any office, civil or military, under the united states, or under any state, who, having previously taken an oath as a member of congress to support the constitution of the united states, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given a or comfort to the enemies there of. this is a very straightforward passage, as the constitution goes. no one who has participated in an insurrection against the government can hold office in that government. fair enough! now, the 14th amendment doesn't

explain how to enforce section three, and maybe that's because america was being optimistic. betting that it stays a political rebellion where the thing of the past. , well the framers of these amendments must have been rolling in their graves on january 6th, 2021. when a mob of trump supporters, many supported variations or sporting variations of the confederate flag as fashion statements, stormed the u.s. capitol in a bid to overturn a free and fair election. now, section three of the 14th amendment, which was designed to ban traitors from holding office, is being used to try to prevent a sitting congresswoman from running for reelection. a campaign finance reform organization is suing to remove the georgia republican marjorie taylor greene from the ballot over her alleged role in the january 6th insurrection. marjorie taylor greene has made plenty of incendiary comments, publicly, before and after that fateful day in january. on january 5th, the day before, she declared that the following

day would be, quote, our 1776 moment. 1776 was, of course, the year that america declared independence from britain. it's also a slogan adopted by the far-right's extremist group the proud boys. she defended the january six rioters saying, quote, if you think about what our declaration of independence says, it says to overthrow the tyrants. and how about when she accused house speaker nancy pelosi of treason and suggested that she be executed? this is all public information. all you have to do is go to it and the statements pop-up. but marjorie taylor greene must have come down with a case of amnesia because, when asked about these statements, when she took the stand last month in a trial to determine whether she should be disqualified from running for reelection, she just couldn't recall. >> when did you first become aware that there were going to be large demonstrations in d.c. on the sixth? >> i don't recall. >> who put it on your calendar?

>> i don't know. >> somebody on your staff, i take it? >> i have no idea. >> you yourself phase use the term 1776 to describe the events of january six, 2021. >> i don't recall, but if you say. >> but did you advocate to president trump to advocate martialized away to remain in power? >> i don't recall. >> you're not denying you did, it you just don't remember? >> i don't remember. >> marjorie taylor greene spent several hours in a courtroom, dodging questions about or text messages, social media posts and public statements regarding the insurrection and overturning the results of the election. at one point, as you just heard, she was asked if she and then president donald trump had discussed taking the incredible step of imposing martial law. she could not recall, she said. but there are always receipts. cnn obtained a text message purporting to show marjorie taylor greene raising a process prospect of martial law then,

to then white house chief of staff mark meadows. nbc news reached out to meadows for comment but has not heard back. the text in question reads, quote, in our private chat with only members, several are saying the only way to save our republic is for trump to call for martial law. i don't know on those things. i just wanted you to tell him. they stole this election. we all know, they will destroy our country next. please tell him to declassify as much as possible, so we can go after biden and anyone else. marshall, by the way, is not a typo on our end. that's, in fact, how congresswoman greene's it. green insists that she has no recollection of sending this text, while defending it in the same breath. her lawyer has raised doubts about the authenticity of the texas, but marjorie taylor greene has never been one for credibility. it's not really her thing. this is the same woman who frequently posted support for the qanon conspiracy theory and supported that wildfires in america have been started by jewish space lasers.

but greene is not alone in her propensity to bypass the truth, she is part of a new republican party that believes facts, words and history do not matter. there is no shame in it for them. large part, because there's no consequence for lying. no consequence for their actions. madison cawthorn, the freshman republican congressman from north carolina. he's racked up a list of antics that would get anyone fired from any job, let alone the u.s. house of representatives. in addition, he's paid a visit to hitler's vacation house in germany and he's called ukraine's president a, quote, thug. cawthorn said it was a fake news controversy, but it was posted on his personal instagram account and taken years before he tried to defend it. but none of these things drew the ire from anyone in the republican party. it wasn't until cawthorn started swinging around accusations of cocaine fueled orgies attended by elected representatives at the gop, that the gop started to give a damn. red lines don't exist anymore among elected republicans,

because there is little expectation that there will be any consequences to crossing those lines. the only line that most republicans are now scared to cross seems to be the one drawn by donald j trump. loyalty toward the de facto republican leader now outweighs any semblance of integrity. what you are witnessing is the slow and painful death of shame among a party that is poised to take control of the house of representatives, come november. ome november ♪ just till they taste what we've got ♪ [ tires squeal, crash ] when owning a small business gets real, progressive gets you right back to living the dream. now, where were we? [ cheering ] (driver) conventional thinking would say verizon now, where were we? has the largest and fastest 5g network. but, they don't. they only cover select cities with 5g. and with coverage of over 96% of interstate highway miles, they've got us covered.

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overturn the 2020 american election. his documents are expected to conclude communications between him and other trump cabinet. figures like rudy giuliani. between march 20th and january six. on top of the 100,000 pages that he is said to provide to the committee any day now, 27,000 additional emails remain in dispute. the committee may still explain this later on. these emails will be along the tens of thousands of other documents of records of the january six committee, which is already has in its possession. it will be one of the crucial pieces of evidence that the committee will present to hold a public hearings, beginning on june the 9th. meanwhile, donald trump chief of staff mark meadows, this man, filed a new complaint to a d.c. court accusing the january six committee of leaking a text message in an attempt to, quote, vilify him publicly. the filing asked the court to reject a committee which could force meadows to comply with the subpoena that has been set. joining me now is the

democratic congresswoman madly dean of -- she's a member of the house judiciary and financial service committee. leah's last year she served as a house manager in the second impeachment trial of donald trump. of, course when i lived in pennsylvania she is my member of congress. congresswoman, it is good to see. you like for being with us this morning. >> great to be with you, ali. thank you. >> let us talk about expectations. members of the committee have gone on tv, and they have said it is going to be big. these hearings are going to be big. congressman alaska says it is going to blow the roof off of the place. you i have to ask you because you observed as impeachment member before, what are reasonable expectations? given where we are as a country. given how polarized we are. what are reasonable expectations of success, the january six committee does and what these public hearings that we are expected in just over a month? >> i think the reasonable expectation is that the american people will learn the truth. you remember in the impeachment

trial number two, which i was a part of, it was just weeks after the attempted insurrection, and attempted coup. our goal was to tell the american people the truth, as we knew it at that time. from what you could see on the surface, from the incendiary sending of riders to the capitol by president of the united states, but now, and when they've been searching for all along, is who else was a part of this. who were the participants? where was the money? who were the meetings with? who was a part of the planning of an attempted overthrow of a free and fair election? there is going to be so much. you know they have interviewed more than 800 witnesses at this point. and so, the only thing that i think matters is the truth, and that is what this committee can put forward in those eight public hearings. >> not only do or remember them, but i like many millions of americans, believed the evidence that i saw.

because we saw it live on tv. and then once you impeachment managers did is gave us timelines and narratives that made sense. you would've thought that the logical outcrop of that was that republicans would say, let's purge these folks from our ranks. let's not be the party that allows for an insurrection, and throws out rules that keep our democracy intact. that is not what happened. peoples positions hardened. to those of us that did not doubt what you did the first time around and you are not going to doubt and are gonna be possibly even more surprised with the evidence that comes out in these hearings, what is to be done at that point? because the truth is a valuable. but will truth prevent these anti-democratic forces from further dismantling democracy? >> i have. hope i hold out hope. i think the american people recognize it everything you spoke about a few minutes ago,

which is where is a shame? why don't they understand that by flip-flopping on the truth, people are unwilling to stand by the truth. i hope that voters will see that. and say, that is now a public service is all about. this week i had the honor of attending the funeral of madeleine albright. and you know that she spent a lifetime lifting in protecting democracy's. not only our own but around the world. but how difficult would you find the behavior of these elected leaders. i am very hopeful that what happens is the american people will recognize that the upcoming election is about so many things, but at its core it is about the protection of our fragile democracy, from folks who just want to follow an autocrat for their own power. >> this is not about your political's position is or where you are in the political spectrum. it is a binary question. where are you on democracy? yes or no. madeleine, good to see.

democratic representative madeleine dean, a pennsylvania. there is an american military adage that says, amateurs talk about tactics, but professionals study logistics. that phrase has been on full display with the war in ukraine, russia continuing to suffer major logistical setbacks. up next, an exclusive look at the logistics behind the u.s. effort to get much needed military aid inside of ukraine. ukraine n. ♪ ♪ of travel i've had my share, man. ♪ ♪ i've been everywhere. ♪ ♪ i've been to: pittsburgh, parkersburg, ♪ ♪ gravelbourg, colorado, ♪ ♪ ellensburg, cedar city, dodge city, what a pity. ♪ ♪ i've been everywhere, man. ♪ ♪ i've been everywhere, man. ♪ ♪ i've been everywhere. ♪ only two things are forever: love and liberty mutual customizing your car insurance, so you only pay for what you need. if anyone objects to this marriage...

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courtney qb has an exclusive look at the state side operation to get many of these weapons transported from the u.s. to ukraine. >> this giant cargo plane, loaded with lethal and vital cargo, destined for the ukrainian military. every few hours here at dover air force base, these commercial cargo planes depart, the pilot, civilians. with president biden pledging another 20 billion dollars and u.s. military assistance, the u.s. military is working overtime to deliver. this is ammunition for 155 millimeter howitzers. large artillery pieces which u.s. defense officials hope will stop russia's new advance in the east of ukraine. >> we are in the cargo hold of a 7:47. it can hold about 42 pallets like these, each of these carry 72 artillery rounds. so, we're talking about 3000 rounds in this plane. they're being loaded now, they could be in the hands of the ukrainian military in a matter of just a day or two.

this is a second mission for -- , former military pilots. what is it like to fly a giant aircraft full of explosives? >> i mean, you obviously know that there is explicit down there. >> -- , and that's it. >> you try to take off nice and easy on land ice and easy. so you don't have any cargo shifting during the process. >> every, day on my tractor trailers arrive packed with explosives from ammo depots across the country. they line up at dover, dubbed the superport for military equipment to ukraine. >> we've moved over 7 million pounds of material to ukraine, on over 60 missions. >> colonel barry flak commit the maintenance crew bent over that does the heavy lifting of ordinance. >> can you walk us through some of the weapons that you have moved out of here into eastern europe? >> we've moved anything from nine millimeter pistols to javelins to stinger missiles. >> those javelins and stingers

have been instrumental in taking out russian tanks and planes. it's a fast pace ballet of lethal weapons in a giant, mechanized warehouse. >> i see it on the news that, you know, they're actually using the equipment that we're sending out. >> when you're the one to help them, it just feels good. >> it takes about ten hours to fly to the drop off point and poland. how the weapons and get to ukraine's classified, for fear of russian attacks. >> are you worried at all, though, when you fly these things, that you could be a target for russia? >> it's a possibility, yes. but you can't think about that. >> defense officials say that the additional 20 billion dollars and military funding, announced by the biden administration this week, will include more of these 155 millimeter rounds and the artillery, the howitzers, to fire them. but, with the russian offensive already begun in the east, time is really of the essence to get these to the ukrainian military as fast as possible. ali? >> courtney hubie, thank you so much.

pentagon correspondent, courtney qb. coming after the break, russia is flexing one of its biggest muscles and that is oil. state energy giant gazprom announced it would halt exports to poland and bulgaria for electing not to pay for russian oil in rubles. this is just the latest example of why the eu needs to end its reliance on russian oil, but it will not be easy to do that. not be easy to do that. (emu squawks) kevin, no! not today. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ trelegy for copd. [coughing] ♪ birds flyin' high, you know how i feel. ♪ ♪ breeze driftin' on by... ♪ if you've been playing down your copd,... ♪ it's a new dawn, it's a new day,... ♪ ...it's time to make a stand. start a new day with trelegy. ♪...and i'm feelin' good. ♪ no once-daily copd medicine... has the power to treat copd in as many ways as trelegy.

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intimidate or blackmail its weight of the sanctions. we will not allow them to use their own gas to avoid consequences for the russians. we are working with other nations like korea and japan to support our effort to help european allies who are threatened by russia, with gas, blackmail, and their energy needs another ways. aggression will not win. threats will not win. >> that was president biden this week, after european leaders claim that european leaders are using russian oil and gas as a weapon against the west. to catch you up, russia's national energy giant gazprom announced yesterday that it is halting natural gas exports to poland and bulgaria, because those countries are failing to play for their supply in rubles, which is russia's currency. the head of the european union said that paying for oil arrow gas in rubles would violate eu sanctions.

a day later, the german chancellor olaf scholz says that his country was preparing for the same treatment from russia, as germany could be the next country to be cut off. and that would be a big problem, because unlike, poland russian gets its natural gas, i'm sorry germany gets this natural gas from russia through a pipeline. at this point, europe should want to get off russian and jason as possible. because it's quite clear that every dollar that goes to russia is helping russian wage war on ukraine. ian quitting russian efforts could mean that more than 40% of russia's foreign currency comes from selling fossil fuels like oil and gas, and like coal. that said, you are not just quick russian energy cold turkey. a recent report from moody's warned that completely cutting off oil and gas imports from russia could send europe into a recession. and germany, europe's largest economy, could be hit particularly hard by a russian gas embargo.

a potential 5% lost in total economic output. that could trigger even more drastic inflation and supply train delays worldwide. not just last, but germany in particular, if it wants to get off natural gas, currently does not have the infrastructure to do so. it would likely take years to build up the systems needed to change energy suppliers away from the worst purveyor on the planet, vladimir putin. a vicious dictator who's raging a war of choice on a neighboring nation. but that is the right when it comes to oil and gas. you cannot simply choose not to buy, it at least not at the drop of a hat. too much of modern society relies upon these energy sources, will most of the world's debates its relationship to russian oil. a brand-new documentary suggests that big oil companies are posing an even greater existential threat to the planet. even greater than russia right now. i'm going to speak with the award winning filmmaker advantage, one of the people behind the riveting an alarming new docuseries, the power of big oil.

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from the effects of climate change, a new docuseries says the oil and gas industry knew decades ago about the dangers that their practices posed to the environment. the three part series from frontline on pbs, called the power of big oil, accuses companies like exxon oval to abusing their money to silence

critics and whistleblowers were trying to uncover how their methods contributed to climate change. >> but first i walked on to what's crucial point, which is it's not just co2 that is driving climate change. it's also methane. the paper said, the climate impact of shale gas is such that it's worse then cole. where's then oil. the reaction to the paper was disturbing. i had never been a coauthor of a paper that created a political firestorm. >> joining me now is -- an award-winning filmmaker who is that serious producer of the documentary, the power of big oil. dan, welcome to the show. thank you for being with us. >> thanks for having me on. >> what part surprises you about this? because i think people, certainly of my age, understand

full well that what the energy industry has done over the last half a century is very similar to what the tobacco industry did. they not only spread their own misinformation but they actively worked against those who came out with various bits of information that painted them as culprits. what is new and interesting that you've learned? that you want viewers to understand? >> a lot surprised me. the first big surprise, really, was the extent to which, 40 years ago, when i was a baby, the -- it was a golden age of scientific cooperation. between industry, government and academia. oil companies, exxon chief amongst them, where really at the vanguard of scientific research into climate change. at the vanguard of developing renewable sources of energy. so, solar and wind and so on,

lithium batteries. things that are really, really crucial to the energy transition that everyone's talking about today. so, really, what's most surprising and shocking, in a way, is the knowledge that we currently have now, with which we are trying to wean ourselves as a society often socials, we had 40 years ago. and one of the main institutions that had that knowledge was the oil industry. >> so, when we talk about the infrastructure needs of changing to a modern, fossil free industry, the know-how exists. if we decide we want electric cars, every castration could become an electric charging station. what stopped these companies, that had all this know-how and had all this knowledge, and would have allowed for them to profit from a move to a green society? what's stop them from not only actively pursuing them but actively trying to silence critics of the fossil fuel industry? >> there's a simple answer to

that, and there's a more complicated answer. the simple answer is money. the responsibility of a chief executive of the oil companies in the 1890s was to deliver prospects to shareholders. lee raymond, who was ceo of exxon in the 90s and the early 2000s, he said very openly that renewables, in the 80s, when exxon were researching them, we're just not going to make as much money as oil and gas. and he was right, at that point. so, the simple answer is money. the more complicated answer is one that implicates all of us, i think. and government as well, governments. fossil fuels made modern civilization, you know. they where, until we discovered the horrific flaw, they were magical. for a while, at least, they

were much cheaper and easier to use than these renewable sources. but what we came back, two time and time again in our year of research, more than a year of research, into the 40-year history of the story, is that if government and industry had made a big push 40 years ago, when the scientific knowledge was there, we'd be in a very different place to the position we find ourselves in now, in 2022. >> let me ask you about this. right, now you've got this whole issue every trying to get europe off of russian gas and or oil. and the immediate solution seems to be for the u.s. and qatar and australia and other countries like that to say, we will build our infrastructure, we will build the ports, we'll get you the natural gas in the oil in the coal that you need. there's a whole bunch of people who say, there's a better answer here. it's not easy but why don't we get europe to try to get greener than they have been prepared to go for a little while. >> it's a better answer. is it an achievable answer?

tomorrow, no. at no point in the 40-year history that we that frontline have been investigating could there have been a straight, simple switch. we're going to give out fossil fuel tomorrow. it doesn't work like that, it didn't work like that 80s and it still doesn't work like that today. i think it's very clear, from both a specific, geopolitical point of view talking about russia today, but also the planetary existential point of view when we talk about climate change or the next 20, 30 years. the whole planet needs to wean itself off fossil fuels and needs to be a short term, medium long term plan to do it. can it happen tomorrow? sadly, no. >> dan, thank you for great work. dan edge is an award-winning filmmaker and producer for the new pbs three part series documentary, the power big oil. don't know, there's plenty more you need to know the sunday morning. coming up, next the latest on speaker nancy pelosi's surprise meeting to kyiv and meeting with volodymyr zelenskyy. plus the latest addition of the velshi banned book club with

the legendary author margaret atwood who penned the handmaids tail. another hour velshi begins, right now. handmaid tail another hour good morning, it is sunday may the. first i am ali velshi. mark meadows text messages are a preview of things to come. a lot of people are going to have a lot of explaining to do. the 2319 text messages that meadows has turned over to the january six committee or at least to cnn earlier this week. and offered a candid insight into the coordination between various right-wing figures in their desperate efforts to keep donald trump in power in the weeks after the 2020 election. it has revealed donald trump's chief of staff directly involved in working to overturn the election, as well as a sprawling web of other people who were directly in touch with the white house, as the insurrection was underway. there are text messages from republican congress members like