good to be with you. i'm katy tur. the senate is an hour away from drawing a bright red line, who is for a woman's right to choose

and who is against it. majority leader chuck schumer is calling a vote on the women's health care act, an unusual move because he doesn't have the votes. only 49 senators are expected to say yes, 11 short of what it would need to pass. speaking from the senate floor, schumer said he was pushing forward because it was time for each member of that body to tell the american public where they stand. >> before the day is over every member of this body will make a choice, vote to protect the fundamental rights of women across the country or stand with five conservative justices ready to destroy these rights in one felled swoop. today's vote is one of the most consequential we will take in decades because for the first time in 50 years a conservative majority, an extreme majority on the supreme court is on the

brink of declaring that women do not have freedom over their own bodies. >> this is also about the mid terms for democrats with polling and a century's worth of history keeping a congress an majority. democrats are looking for an issue to galvanize their base and hopefully voters on the other side as well. this they hope will be it. the bill known as the whpa would go beyond protecting access to abortion nationwide, it would invalidate state-level restrictions to abortion access like the new six-week bans passed in texas and oklahoma. all 50 republican senators are against this bill. that does include susan collins and lisa murkowski, who are in favor of codifyingio but no, sir as the this does. their own bill would order a

more narrow set of allowances including religious and moral objections to abortion. this is at least one democrat not on board. west virginia senator joe manchin sold reporters he will vote no. >> the vet we have today, i respect people who support but make no mistakes, it is not roe v. wade codification. it's an expansion. it wipes 500 laws off the books and it expands abortion. we're voting on a piece of legislation that i would not vote for for today. i would vote for a roe v. wade codification, i was hoping for that. during the trump

administration, bridget amiri defended the abortion rights of an inmate in federal custody identified as jane doe. why is senator schumer bringing forward this particular bill and not one he can get the support from murkowski or collins or manchin? >> what democrats have said, including democrat collins from connecticut, they believe it's important to stop the state around the country that have enacted bans that they consider to be and that are outside of roe. now, i don't think, katy, it's out of the realm of possibility that they will put something else on the floor at some point. it suits kind of the public policy interest and the political interests of all involved. lisa murkowski and susan collins do have their own bill that

codifies roe and they've been pushing for a vote on the floor. collins has been talking to dick durbin and cain of virginia but the leadership has decided to put this up for a vote. i don't think the story is all said and done when it comes to floor action on abortion rights. i think the house will take more votes. they're holding a hearing next week on abortion rights. they'll have a big rally on the steps of the capitol on friday. i think this is going to be a dominant issue for the next couple of weeks and months. >> ali, you have more on that. you spoke to senator durbin, what did he tell you? >> there is not an appetite among rank and file democrats to move forward with this. when i was talking to democratic leadership aides leading up to this week about why they were choosing to move forward with a

bill that wouldn't great republican support, the few republicans they could get on this anyway and the view on that was they don't want to have something that wasn't meaningful in their words, basically saying if they're going to vote on something that's a half measure, that's not going to energize their base and this is play for the mid terms. nevertheless, work is happening on that murkowski-collins proposal. here's durbin talking about that earlier. >> why have democrats chose not to work with susan collins, lisa murkowski and try to get a bipartisan result? >> i think that effort is under way. the votes today are important, baseline politically but we're going to continue to reach out and try to build whatever margin we have today. >> i think the underlying consensus here, katy, is democrats and the strategy they've chosen today that we'll see start unfolding in about an hour, they have chosen to go forward on this in a way in a

will fail in partisan fashion effectively. 49 democrats voting for the women's protection act and 51 people, one democrat among all the republicans, voting against it. >> it's very interesting, jake, that senator casey says he's going to be voting for this. senator bob casey is not for abortion rights in general. he has not been in the past. what does that say to you about his position in pennsylvania or just the electorate in pennsylvania for a senator from in a state where there is a big formerly gop seat open and a senator seat open. what does that say to you in. >> the point that democratic aides keep making to me and others is the world has changed. this is no longer a theoretical exercise and casey kind of said that in his statement that was released i think yesterday that

the ground has shifted from under everybody and he's not advocating for no restrictions on abortion but this impending release of this decision, which again we don't know what the decision is going to be for sure but it certainly seems like it's going to chip away, if not get rid of roe underscores the fact they need a new pro active approach. i don't think it says anything about casey specifically. he voted for cloture, to advance the bill the last time. it's symbolically important politically for chuck schumer, the senate majority leader, to have all democrats on his side besides manchin. and i don't think we should understate that. that is a very important political dynamic for schumer at this point to draw that contrast

with republicans and with the other democrat, joe manchin. i think that is what's at play here. schumer, if i had to take a guess based on my reporting worked him pretty hard and that's at contrast they're trying to draw. >> senator casey's dad is the casey in planned parenthood while he was the governor of pennsylvania, in case you didn't know that. briget, let's talk about the politics of this out there across the country. democrats want this to be a galvanizing issue. republicans doubt that it will be. they say in the past it's been more of a galvanizing issue for their voters. what's your sense of how this might affect the mid terms? >> we're already seeing people come out in the streets and have their voices heard. we're seeing people push their elected officials to vote for the women's health protection act. in my home state of michigan

we've seen tremendous energy on the ballot initiative that would protect the right to abortion in that state. that is critical. we are at a crisis moment in abortion access in this country right now, and it is incredibly important to have everyone engage and everyone to let their politicians know where they are on this issue. >> we're going to put up recent polling on this issue and see where the country stands on it. there are concerns out there that given the language used in this draft scotus opinion that there will be other rights that could be at risk if roe v. wade is overturned. briget, what more can you tell us about what those rights are? >> absolutely. if banning abortions in half the states is what would happen if this draft opinion were adopted, if that wasn't bad enough, they will push for a national ban in all states, they're going to push for a ban on contraception

and they're going to take away the right to marry who we love and they're already attacking all of these issues and we're going to see that attack so much for exponential. >> the scotus draft leak says this doesn't apply to any other rights but the language is so broad at that there are concerns those rights would be potentially at risk as well. we're going to go to illinois. president biden is at a family farm to talk about soaring food prices and to announce new initiatives designed to boost food production, lower prices and support jobs in rural america. this morning there was another difficult inflation report showing an annual increase of 8.3%. it was the first time in eight months that inflation did drop compared to the previous month, but consumer prices are still, as you know when you go and try and by anything, at a 40-year

high. joining me now is nbc news business and tech correspondent jolene kent from washington, nbc news correspondent shaq brewster from florida and also joining us is a farmer and the president of the his association. >> i just got out of a meeting on the numbers for inflation and it was a disappointment for the white house. they say there's still much more work to be done. the idea here is that the white house wants to continue to focus on the measures that we've been reporting on here regarding broad band internet access subsidies and making food prices more accessible. i asked brian about what can american farmers expect from the biden administration, who just

got back from missouri. we were talking about a one farmer and a mom, a five-generation farm. she was telling me her fertilizer costs has gone up seven times since last august. i put that question to the director of the national economic council. listen to this. >> how long will it take to make a difference in the price of fertilizer and the price of food? >> the president is taking action right now, not waiting a single day. he's going to double federal funding for fertilizer assistance starting this week. he's going to work with farmers to do things like double cropping so they can increase their crops this season. they're not going to solve every problem but they'll make a real concrete difference, particularly in agriculture. >> i also pressed him about whether or not the fed acted too slowly and not aggressively enough when it comes to raising those interest rates first a couple months ago and of course the rate hike last month.

he says there really is a separation between the two institutions and didn't want to comment on that but acknowledging that the fed does have the most power here to impact inflation. when you look at the report, it's an uphill battle for the biden administration. gas prices up 44%, used cars 23% but perhaps the number i'm really looking at closely, chicken, milk, furniture, all up 15%, beef prices up 14%. as the biden administration looks toward the mid-term election, this is all of pretty serious concern. the overall goal according to the white house is to really focus on these measures they have announced to try to bring relief but republicans vehemently disagreeing with that and there is very little cooperation so far here in washington on that front, katy. >> so the president is go b to speak and i'm going to go to him once he does and i'm going to

get to you after we go to the president. i do want to get a sense from you, shaq, because you're in florida in jacksonville talking at that voters. if i remember correctly, joe biden did win that county. what are you hearing now from those voters and what does it mean for the democratic party? i these conversations reveal why it's a big political issue. it's a personal issue. they see it at the pumps, at the grocery stores and how the housing is increasing. we stopped by a food pantry and they said they're seeing a dramatic increase and more than 80% of the people that come to get food donations, many of them have one source of income and many are seniors. others are seeing it how they

travel or adjust their trips. listen to a few of our conversations here in jacksonville. >> i feel like with everything we've gone through in the past few years, it's just like natural that you're going to see this change in prices and stuff. and hopefully as time progresses, we'll see things come back to normal. >> i didn't agree with the last stimulus because the market was moving in the right direction in regards to inflation. but going forward right now, i think everyone just needs to come together and figure this thing out. i don't think one party can fix it. >> you know, that would be nice, the idea of everybody coming together to figure this out as opposed to it being a political matter where everyone is fighting and sniping. shaq, john, we'll come back to you. let us listen to president biden. >> not a joke. firefighters are incredible. who else is crazy enough to run into flames, you know? but all kidding aside, what

you're doing in terms of helping conservation as well out in wyoming is astounding. it really is. i don't want to make you stand, i'm sorry. the whole point of my raising this is and we're not going to be able to talk much about it today but conservation is also pretty darn important and climate is pretty important. i've been to every major fire but two this year because fema is working again. we show up. we don't wait. we don't have to wonder. governors only have to call me once. here's the deal. more timber, more land, more territory has been burned to the ground this year than the entire state of new jersey from new york all the way down to virginia, the entire state of new jersey. and so what this young man does is amazing what they do trying to -- and it relates to lack of water in most of the places i've

flown over those reservoirs that were 200 feet deep that are now two inches deep, literally, not figuratively. later i want to come back and talk about climate but thank you for what you're doing, man. i really mean it. thank you. folks, i know it's hot in here so i'm not going to talk more than an hour and a half. [ laughter ] look, i want to make a few fairly important points. first of all, i want to thank jeff for that introduction and eugenia for your hospitality you extended today. i joined congresswoman robin kelly here, the real champion for working families and farmers and she's gets clean water and

internet for every person across the district. we wanted dick durbin and tammy duckworth. there's a vote in the united states senate and they're unable to be here. they're two of the most genuinely reliable people i've worked with. and i want to thank tom vilsack. some and i became friends. tom has forgotten more about farming than most people will ever learn. i'm sure this room knows as much. but the idea, tom talks about how critically important that agriculture is to the united states in every single solitary way. but the real reason i'm here is to thank the american farmers, thank farmers. you feed america. you got us through a pandemic and you're literally the back bone of our country. it's not hyperbole. but you also feed the world. and we're seeing with putin's war in ukraine, you're like the backbone of freedom.

i was at a factory not long ago, eight days ago down in alabama and they make javelin missiles to help the ukrainians stave off the russians, beat them back in their aggression. and i pointed out that the true point that america's a democracy, that's what they are. we are the arsenal of democracy. i stand here today to thank american farmers who are the bread basket of democracy. you really are. we talk about every investment banker can leave their job. if every farmer left, we'd all starve to death. think about it, right now america is fighting on two front. at home it's inflation and rising prices. abroad it's helping ukrainians defend their democracy and feeding those who are left hungry around the world because russian atrocities exist and jeff and the american farmers

understand putin's war has cut off critical sources of food. ukraine was the world's largest producer of wheat and corn and cooking oil but wheat the largest. for example, ukraine says they have 20 million tons of grain in their silos right now. 20 million tons. they tons don't get to market, an awful lot of people in africa are going to starve to death because they are the sole suppliers of african countries. i won't go through them all. because of what the russians are doing in the black sea, putin has warships and battleships preventing the access to the ukrainian ports to get this grain and wheat out. it has prevented ukrainian farmers from planting next year's crop and next year's

harvest and they're not doing to darn well in russia either. russia is the second largest producer. but we're doing something about it. our farmers are helping on both front, reducing the cost of price of food at home and expanding production in feeding the world in need. 800 acres of soy bean, corn and wheat. we talked about farmers all across america, what they're experiencing to $. in addition to putin's war in u ukraine. it's been cold and wet like it was here. it was 80 degrees when i showed up. as jeff just shared, american farmers always find a way. they always feel something extra, a spark of patriotism. that's not hyperbole. a spark of patriotism. a sense of never giving up, all

finding a solution. all our farmers, i want you to know your congresswoman, me, the secretary of my cabinet, we have your back. robin has your back. she's always looking a the what's going on in the agricultural world. for example, reducing the red tape so it's easier for farmers to preserve double crop. harvesting two different crops from the same field in the same year. that's what jeff does with wheat and soy beans, which america is a top producer of soy beans. and wheat will be harvested around july 4th if all goes well, god willing and a creek not rising, as my grandfather would say. then you plant soy beans and double cropping is a real risk. if the season is short and weather can'ts aren't ideal or at least good, then the timing of everything is thrown off.

but it's a risk we need to take. that's why my administration is looking at how to extend crop insurance coverage to give financial security to farmers like jeff who practice double cropping. secondly, also farmers worried about rising fertilizer costs and what are the content of the fertilizer. the u.s. department of agriculture announced it would invest $250 million to boost fertilizer production. but on the plane here to air force well, i turned to tom and said, double that, make it 500 million. it's so desperately needed. you can't take chances. it critical to get this done. when i leave here today, i'm heading to chicago. tom is heading to the airport to germany. so the g-7, that is all the democracies in europe getting together and their raeg rahal teams are get together.

and to solve some really big problems. we're going to see what action we can take to increase fertilizer supplies globally and identify how we can work together to prevent export restrictions on food and bring more global production to market, which will stabilize prices and bring more certainty to our farmers and keep people from dying of hunger. this bill is from other ways as well. my administration has been working to drive down the cost of farmers and prices to consumers. to reduce gas prices last month, i was in iowa. a biofuel processing plant, at a biofuel processing plant. i announced an emergency waiver to allow e-15 gasoline to be sold across america during the summer. it's an extraordinary evident but it had to be done for this summer. e-15 uses more ethanol on crops grown here in illinois and around the country. it will reduce the up i know

it's a big deal and robin is a big supporter of this and she's pushing it in the house as well. only four big companies, by the way, control more than half the markets for beef, pork and poultry. without meaningful competition, our farmers and ranchers have to pay whatever the four big retailers say they'll pay for their chicken, their hogs and their cattle these big companies can use their position as middle men to overcharge grocery stores and families. just consider this. 50 years ago ranchers got over 60 cents on every dollar spent to produce the beef they raise. today they get 39 cents. 50 years ago hog farmers got 40 to 60 cents for each dollar the family spent today's at a about

19 cents. the prices you see at the grocery store has gone up and the prices farmers receive has gone down. this reflects a market distorted by the lack of competition. so last year i signed one of the first executive orders i signed was the competition to make competition more available and level the playing field. and though the american rescue plan, we're investing about $1 billion to help smaller meat processors expand their capacity, give farmers, ranchers and consumers more options and better prices. look, i'm a capitalist but capitalism without competition is not capitalism. it's exploitation. it's exploitation. folks, we can make sure the american agriculturier exports will make up for the gap in ukrainian supplies. during my first year in office, american agriculture exports shattered all previous records, $177 billion last year alone.

i remind people my predecessor did not come close. by traveling in our -- we can't -- we have to keep investing in our farmers to reduce the cost be, to reduce prices to consumers and have the most productive and efficient farmers in the world here in the united states. we've always combined generations of know-how with cutting-edge-technology to feed us and the world. i'm going to keep fighting for family formers luke -- i hope congress will have me and we have to invest in farmers like jeff and feed the world. look at the family farms like this one as a reminder of the bounty, beauty and generosity of this nation. i know this and you're tired of hearing me say this the last two years. it's never, ever -- i was at a

tibetan plateau with xi jinping. i traveled with him and spent more time with him than any other world leader has in china. he said -- he was talking about america is a diminishing power. and i said, mr. president, it's never been a good bet to bet against the american people. no one's ever won betting against the american people. and i said, by the way, you went on and said can you define america for me, just me and a translator, and him and a translator, simultaneous translation. i turned all my notes over to the state department. it matters. but what happened was he said can you define america for me. and this is the god's truth because it's been quoted a thousand times now. i said yes, one word. possibilities. we're the only nation in the world, the only nation in thele world that has come out of every crisis stronger than than we

went in it every single time, regardless of what it was. no other nation has done that. it's one of the reasons why some places were call it this nation leads the world. we stand up for freedom. we're the united states of america. and when we're united, there's not a damn thing we can't do. it's not hyperbole. it's a fact. there's nothing beyond our capacity when we work together, nothing. so i'm here to say god bless our farmers and i mean this sincerely, god protect our firefighters and may god protect our troops. thank you for what you do. america owes you. they owe you big.

[ applause ] president biden in illinois at a family farm, addressing the rising costs of everything. john, you're a farmer. you do soy beans and cattle as well. what has it been like for you and what is your reaction to the president just then? >> well, i'd like to thank him for -- first thing for addressing farmers. we're the most overlooked population in the world. but i was looking for more details, the cost of fertilizer, $900 a ton. i was looking for answers for the high cost of diesel fuel, $5.63 in my county and i have 100-gallon tractors. that's $563 to fill this tractor up. i was looking for him to ask

corporate america, people like cargill who want to merge together and be big with no answers in the high cost of equipment, people like john deere, urge those companies to give back and help american farmers. we're at a crisis right now. as a black farmer in this country, we're still looking for aid from the federal government for $5 billion that we haven't seen one red cent of. and the president committed to sit down and have a meeting with me to discuss next steps on getting that aid to black and other farmers of color and that meeting hasn't happened. so right now many black farmers don't have farm operating capital. and the costs that he's speaking of, these are up-front costs for farmers. you have to be able to pay for the high costs of diesel fuel and many farmers don't have a

farm operating loan in place and the top ten banks we reached out to haven't came to our aid either. so the people watching today, we're at a crisis and the american people are the ones who are going to pay when you see empty food shelves in the local supermarkets in the coming months. you're taking out a region of the country with ukraine and russia that produces a lot of wheat that won't be in the food pipeline. where do we make up the difference when american farmers are struggling? today i'm trying to plant soy beans. it's planting season. we have a short window of opportunity, about 30 to 45 days to plant our crops, to get them in the ground, to security seeds and lime and fertilizer and all of these things that we need to

have in place. those things have to be in place and they have to be in place right now. so i want to urge this administration to take. this isn't a republican or democrat issue. this is an american issue. and if we want to see food in the supermarkets, you put politics april side and at this particular time put the farmers first. >> john, last time we spoke it was during the trump administration, we were talking about the tariffs that he was imposing. and i wonder, you know, you. >> what i was saying earlier is we've never recovered from covid, the effects of covid in this country. so it's been one catastrophe, manmade or had you ever you about it, after another. i believe this is one particular time that the country can come together and do better.

you know, this fiasco that we're watching on the hill right now with all of these things, not working together. that's not the american way. and if you want to move this agenda forward, we're going to need members on both sides of the aisle to come together and address this. you may not need a doctor or a lawyer but you're going to need a farmer just about every day because food right now is what we're talking about. so it's not about politics, it's about about food. of family in this country at some point needs healthy foods to put on their table. for this administration i'm urging swift action and swift answers for the thousands and,s i speak, the thousands of block and mr. president, we need

answers and we need them right now. >> you don't have any food, you know you're going to to need a doctor soon after that. >> that's true. >> and hearing with what john was discussion. snoo. >> he said that the president is focused on delivering, you know, more food supplies as quickly as possible to bring down the price of food across the country. the that's a solution for the medium term, perhaps the longer term but americans are looking at inflation across the board nearly every single category. so when you look at it from a paying your bills standpoint, it's still incredibly difficult to get that short-term relief. that's why i asked what other measures will the president take to bring some illegal proun, the

broad band, the deficit, going with greener energy to reduce gas prices in the long run, but there are no adgs. >> hi, danny. the president biden administration is effectively leaning on the from. they know the most effective tools and pr that they know that is the lever that has to be pulled carefully but aggressively to bring down before the critical mid terms hit. >> and you'll be having more tonight. we'll be looking forward o that.

and i'm not going to blame one party or another, same thing that john boy jr. was just saying a moment ago. in your conversations with folks, is that the dominant and till. >> for sure. that is definitely that you hear from many of the voters here that is a swing county. it's the jacksonville area. you forget and people are both sides of the aisle are saying they want both sides to come together to find some sort of shrugs, but the other common thing that you hear is a lack of faith that. who are they blaming for the increase in inflation? about 63% of people blame the biden administration. you have about 84 -- 83% blame

the covid-19 pandemic, 62% are blaming the war in ukraine. >> so people understand there are but they want a solution right now and that's not what they're getting right now because they feelnd. >> there when they're going into the grocery store and paying their rent, they want solutions and think want to see impact right now. >> we had the past results a moment ago. almost 90% of floridians are blaming the supply chain. it a big issue. john boy jr., thank you. and if you get that meeting with the president, we want to you have back to talk about it. appreciate your time. and still mead, russian forces are being pushed out of ukraine's sakd largest city. what is happening on the ground there? and later senator lindsay was

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villages near kharkiv and in doing so they pushed russian troops out and back toward the russian border. the azovstal steel plant was surrounded once again by all sides and they are working to break through the final pocket. ukrainian resistance. the house passed a $40 billion aid package late last night and that bill now heads to the senate. joining me is peter baker, also somebody who is well schooled in the ways of moscow. peter, thanks for being here. it was said yesterday that it's believed the the conflict will be long and drawn out. is that the consensus in washington? >> it is, yes. you're hearing that from the white house and the pentagon. and you're hearing that in the $40 billion package that

congress is on the way toward approving is make to takes through the end of the fiscal year, which is another five months away so we're not doing it in piecemeal every week or two. it's an extraordinary investment on the part of the united states in this war. think of it this way. $40 billion on top of the $13 billion already committed by the united states equals $53 billion you know what the entire annual defense budget is? and $56 billion. it gives you a sense of the scope of the aid the united states is committing to this war. and they do do it because they think it's going to be a long-term ground battle. >> peter, which is that money coming from? >> it's coming from our credit cards. there's no offsets in there i'm aware of. nobody has tried to figure out how to pay for it. that is a concern on the part of some people in washington. you saw the heritage foundation, usually a very hawkish, pro

military, standing up to russia organization expressed great reservations about focusing on that rather than than issues here at home. the war in ukraine and the struggle in russia is a national interest and it's better the united states be a full-floated partner of ukraine than to be on the sidelines. >> peter baker, thank you very much. coming up, an nbc exclusive with the democrat favored to win the pennsylvania senate primary, which is one week away. why some believe he could lure donald trump voters back to the democratic party. well would you look at that? ♪ ♪ jerry, you've got to see this. seen it. trust me, after 15 walks it gets a little old.

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we are less than a week away from the pennsylvania primary for a heavily coveted senate seat. nearly 40% of voters say they are still undecided. lieutenant governor john federman has a huge lead in the available public polling and a major fund-raising advantage. he and his wife sat down for an exclusive interview with dasha burns where he laid out his strategy to bridge the gap in a

state that has razor thin margins by being himself. >> reporter: are you a progressive? >> no, i'm just a democrat that has always run on what i believe and know to be true. six years ago that was considered progressive but now there isn't a single democrat in this race or any race that i'm aware of that is running on anything different. >> joining me now from philadelphia, nbc news correspondent dasha burns. so he would take issue with the polling we've cited. he says the real poll numbers show him much closer. you sat down with john fetterman. and he is somebody who, we've interviewed him on this show a number of times. our viewers are familiar with him. he's someone who doesn't look like a regular politician. he wears sweatshirts a lot. he doesn't talk like a regular politician. he's actively courting the steele union steel workers, people he says are being left behind by democrats. there are folks out there wondering is this the kind of person that can bring back

donald trump voters? and folks are wondering, is at the kind of personal who can motivate black voters across pennsylvania? >> reporter: when you watch him on the campaign trail, his sweatshirt and shorts, when you talk to him, when you talk to his wife, when you visit their home, which we did, which was a former car dealership and it's across the street from a steel mill instead of living in the lieutenant governor's mansion. when you talk to voters about him, you get a sense, he's trying to do something different. he's wearing that not your typical democrat type of brand. a lot of folks in pennsylvania are turning their heads at that. they are interested to hear somebody talk kind of frankly, like donald trump. that's what i hear from a lot of voters. i hear similar descriptions about him that i've heard from trump voters. he's not your typical

politician. he speaks plainly. that's been resonating according to the voters that we've intend speaking with. and he's had some choice words, too, for his fellow democrats in washington. i want to you hear a little of that conversation. >> if you are a joe manchin democrat, then i will disappoint you if i make it to washington, d.c., because i believe our party needs to agree on a core set of values, come together, and get some things done. and we are squandering in my opinion, an enormous opportunity to do some transformative good through legislation that is being stopped by a senator like joe manchin. i'm not criticizing him. i'm simply saying i would vote differently. if that makes me anything, i don't believe it is a moderate to derail your party's and president's agenda.

>> so he's talking to union voters. he's trying to bring back some of those folks who turned to trump. at the same time, he's talking about policies like universal health care, like a $15 minimum wage, like voting rights. and he has his wife gisele. we interviewed them together. she came to the u.s. from brazil as an undocumented immigrant and they're straddling this old school, new school democrat. and this will say a lot about where the party is headed, especially if he wins in november. >> thank you. and new audio times have come to the surface of lindsey graham criticizing the former president's actions directly after the january 6th insurrection while also praising the incoming joe biden as the best guy to clean up the riot's aftermath. >> he's misjudged the passion. he maze the tv game and he went

too far. >> biden will help that in. >> totally. he'll be maybe the best person to have. i mean, how mad can you get at joe biden? >> joining me now, political national correspondent msnbc contributor betsy woodruff swan. that doesn't sound like the lindsey graham we hear from today. >> not very much. he's one of numerous very powerful senior congressional republicans who did rapid and dramatic pivots in the wake of the january 6th attack. once they realized that it would be a politically disadvantageous for them to push back against what president trump was saying. what is really notable is that even now, even moving this far out from the attack, trump is still criticized in some parts because of the way graham talked about january 6th. specifically, lindsey graham said he didn't think the january 6th attackers who received

criminal convictions should get presidential pardons. trump responds tom in a news max interview by saying that lindsey graham was a rino and didn't have a great grasp of how much these patriots deserve. it really shows the extent to which any deviation whatsoever from where trump is at now on this issue. this issue of an attack on the american capitol building is something that will generate vociferous pushback, regardless of how much they like it. >> what does the january 6th committee do with a tape like this? >> it's a good question. they so far have proven loathe to use any of their leverage to try to compel members of congress to come in and participate in their query. to my knowledge, they haven't even reached out to any senators. the members of congress they've reached out thus far have all

been house republicans. all of whom have rejected their invitations to come in. i think it is very unlikely that this select committee will decide based on this tape that they need to push further and use more tools than simply politely asking in their efforts to get a fuller and more detailed picture of what trump's lawmaker allies thought. the other challenge is that they're almost out of time. >> yeah. there is a little video that i'm sure you remember from right after the riot, after lindsey graham said he was done with donald trump. he met at an airport. we're going to show it. being harassed by trump supporters. i wonder, how much does this still play into republicans' thinking in their support of donald trump? we don't have much time. if you can answer quickly. >> what the mid-terms will show is the extent to which trump

really controls the republican base. last night showed that it is a mixed bag. he doesn't totally govern how republicans vote but he does have a tunnel of sway. that has a lot of republicans watching very closely. a lot of lawmakers watching very closely to see how much are the voters willing to deviate from trump's endorsements and directives. >> you have a lot of lawmakers feeling threatened physically after the january 6th insurrection, not feeling safe going against donald trump. thank you so much for joining us. always good to see you. that will do it for me today. hallie jackson picks up the coverage next. coverage next. ♪ i see them bloom ♪ ♪ for me and you ♪ ♪ and i think to myself ♪ ♪ what a wonderful world ♪ a rich life is about more than just money. that's why at vanguard, you're more than just an investor, you're an owner

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