michael weiss, congratulations on the story. see where it goes in the weeks ahead. appreciate you being with us today. thanks to all of you for getting up with us "way too early" on this friday morning and all week long. weekend is almost here, folks. "morning joe" starts right now. good morning. welcome to "morning joe." blessedly, it is friday morning. friday the 13th, actually. may 13th. this morning, we're following a dramatic step out of the city you're looking at right there, a step forward in the investigation of the capitol attack, as the january 6th committee subpoenas five sitting republican congressmen, including the top house republican who could very well become speaker of the house in a few months. also, reports of another grand jury investigation into former president donald trump. this time over the classified white house documents that ended up at mar-a-lago. plus, russia vows retaliation if finland joins nato. it is all but certain to happen now.

what specifically is the kremlin considering? the united nations confirms a horrific discovery near kyiv as it steps up its investigation into russia's alleged war crimes inside ukraine. with us this morning, a great group. msnbc contributor mike barnicle. the host of "way too early" and white house bureau chief at "politico," jonathan lemire. former aide to the george w. bush white house and state departments, elise jordan. she is an msnbc political analyst. let's dive right into it this morning. we begin with the major step from the house committee investigating the january 6th attack, issuing subpoenas for five sitting republican lawmakers who have refused to cooperate in the investigation. including the top republican in the house, minority leader kevin mccarthy. congressman biggs of arizona, scott perry of pennsylvania, jim jordan of ohio, and mo brooks of alabama, seen on january 6th firing up the crowd before the attack on the capitol, all being

compelled to testify. with the exception of ethics committee investigations in the past, the subpoenas are believed to be the first ever issued to sitting members of congress. the panel said the congressmen, all allies of former president trump, have information critical to its probe of the january 6th attack. they all have dismissed the investigation as illegitimate. here is how some of them reacted to news that they had been subpoenaed. >> i have not seen this subpoena. i guess they sent it to you guys before they sent it to me. look, my view on the committee has not changed. they're not conducting a legitimate investigation. it seems as though they just want to go after their political opponents. >> the fact that they sent it to the press before they send it to the members is just proof it's all about headlines. this whole thing's a charade. >> well, i think this is an illegitimate committee, and they don't really have the authority to issue subpoenas, in my opinion. so we don't want to dignify what they're doing.

this has been a witch hunt from day one. this is an attempt to go after political enemies instead of trying to get at the truth. >> congressman brooks of alabama said yesterday he had not been served yet and would wait to respond until then. congressman jordan of ohio also has not responded. the panel claims he had at least one, and possibly many, communications with donald trump on january 6th. jordan previously told the committee he has no relevant information to share. we'll see about that. the chairman of the committee, congressman thompson, said there have been no conversations about contempt if the congressmen do not comply. he expects them to answer those subpoenas. let's bring in congressional investigations reporter for the "washington post," jackie alemany, an msnbc contributor, as well. great to see you. so as many as splashy, of course, because of the names involved, especially kevin mccarthy who well may be the speaker of the house in a few months, but not totally unexpected. these were key figures on january 6th who have said either

publicly or been reported to have had conversations with donald trump leading up to january 6th, during the attack, and then after. what is the significance here, and does the committee expect to hear from them? >> i'm not sure the select committee believes any of these members are actually going to appear. what they communicated to reporters yesterday was after really months of deliberation, that they felt like they needed to give congressmen and house minority leader mccarthy, this full group, the opportunity to respond to evidence they had found throughout the investigation. they had already issued voluntary requests for mccarthy, scott perry, jim jordan, months ago, actually at the end of last year, and had let those requests linger for quite some time. it is clear this along the way, they've found evidence that they simply cannot ignore that involves and indicts these lawmakers in some way, which is

why you're seeing them now escalate this and call them in via subpoenas. you know, lawmakers yesterday, democratic lawmakers at least, did not want to even flirt with the contempt conversation and what they're going to do if these lawmakers decide not to comply with these subpoenas. but, you know, part of the reason why they held off for so long on issuing the subpoenas was because they didn't want to get into protracted litigation and extend the investigation. but they've clearly made the calculus that in the interest of democracy and their investigation, they needed to take further steps to bring them in. >> elise, as i say, it is significant to call sitting members of congress with subpoenas, but these guys, we know from tapes we've already heard, from reporting in the media, that they were talking to donald trump during the attacks. mo brooks actually said publicly, "trump asked me to rescind the 2020 elections and immediately put him back in the

white house." he said that out loud. >> jordan had conversations with trump on january 6th. >> and mccarthy. >> what happened in thoeds those conversations? >> jackie, it is obvious these members have plenty of information that would be tantalizing to the january 6th commission, committee, frankly. they know what happened, and they know exactly where the bodies are buried, basically, so to speak. they aren't talking though, and it doesn't look like they will talk. this could be a protracted legal battle. how does it play out if they do charge them with contempt? could bit a months long process, and could it extend past midterms? >> that is the key question. before i map out what the process looks like, you reminded me, i do think that it is important to note that some of these members, particularly people like congressmen scott perry of pennsylvania, were the key conduit from the house gop

conference and republican lawmakers to the white house. it was scott perry who was directly advocating various white house officials to install a trump loyalist, jeffrey clark, who was exchanging conspiracy theories with scott perry and was advocating to seize voting machines on the basis of, again, you know, very conspiratorial views. if they're going to hold the members in contempt for not cooperating with the subpoenas which, you know, looks like it is probably going to be the case, then they're going to have to take a full house vote. that's going to make to it department of justice, then the department of justice is going to have to make that final decision on whether or not they're going to actually prosecute these referrals. we also know that, right now, attorney general merrick garland is sitting on some other important referrals, including the contempt referral of

meadows, navarro, and scavino. that'll been lingering some time now. if the house ultimately makes these referrals, merrick garland has got almost a dozen decisions he's got to make on his plate, a lot of them extremely politically loaded. >> good morning. it is jonathan. >> hey, john. >> charging contempt would be an escalation. it was pointed out the idea of issuing these subpoenas is sort of a no-lose situation for the democrats in the committee with this thought, that if the republicans take control, back control of the house this fall, which is expected, that, therefore, if they were to defi the subpoenas now, they'd be setting a precedent when, for sure, the gop will be issuing subpoenas if they take control. i want your thought on that. also, the public hearing from the january 6th committee, are they on track for early june? >> yeah. look, that's potentially true.

i know lawmakers on the committee and their staff have already been bracing for potential subpoenas and investigations if republicans do take back the majority in november. they've all been extremely careful in that regard. but i also think that the conversation that lawmakers on the committee are privately having is one that's a little bit more, you know, with a sense of patriotism and duty and obligation to their roles and the american people. which is that if these lawmakers were engaged in a conspiracy to overthrow, defraud the government, and stop the certification of the electoral college with no basis, that the american people ultimately deserve to know that. from all account and from what chairman benny thompson told reporters yesterday, the commit committee has collected evidence

as such. whether or not they make criminal referrals or how far they went in this effort to overturn the results of the elections is another conversation. but that the american people deserve to know the full extent that these lawmakers participated in january 6th, which is why i think they decided, you know what, we have to do this at the end of the day out of a sense of patriotic duty. that being said, right now, all eyes and preparation is on these june public hearings. those are supposed to start on june 9th. there is going to be eight of them. the committee is currently working to create a narrative, arc, and mission, since the public still hasn't coalesced around a cohesive narrative of what exactly happened in the lead up to january 6th and what happened in the aftermath. also, that narrative is being shaped around this idea that, you know, the insurrection is still currently happening in some regards with republican lawmakers continuing to propagate unsubstantiated claims of election fraud and trying the to pass legislation in various

battleground states on the unsubstantiated basis of a lot of these conspiracy theories that are still in the bloodstream. >> all right. the "washington post"'s jackie alemany all over this story for us this morning. thanks is so much. great to see you. >> thanks, willie. >> mike, let's underline, again, the reason the subpoenas were issued to five sitting republican congressmen is they didn't participate. they didn't cooperate with the investigation when asked to come in on their own. that's why these are being handed out. we talk about what we already know about some of these guys. mo brooks, the congressman from alabama infamously made the speech where he said it is time to take names and kick ass. are you ready to fight for this country? ready to do what you have to do? when confronted later, said, well, donald trump made me do it. the president of the united states told me i should go out there and do these things. you know, maybe they'll learn some things in these interviews and conversations, but we really already know, don't we, based on public information, the role some of these guys had on january 6th.

>> yeah. you know, what we know, what everyone in america knows has been reinforced here with the spectacle of subpoenas being issued to people and people just ignoring the subpoenas. federal subpoenas. members of congress ignore them. mark meadows, former chief of staff can ignore a federal subpoena. aye been subpoenaed federally a couple times. you have to reply. >> say more. >> it was a media case. >> oh. >> i mean, they will come and get you. but these people just walk. i mean, there's a bunch of subpoenas at the justice department the see whether they're going to be enforced or not. they're not going to be enforced, at least not to this point. the other aspect of it that is really interesting is the dual class of citizens, special citizens in congress who get away with things. the other aspect of this is it almost guarantees that if the republicans gain control of the house on january 2nd, next year, they will institute a special committee on revenge. nothing will get done next year in congress, as nothing much has

gotten done this year. >> they've already said as much, haven't they? okay. you want to play it this way? you're all getting subpoenaed in january when we take the house. >> the republicans have made clear that they're going to do the same. they talk about impeachment proceedings for cabinet members. they're going to -- get ready for the words "hunter biden." there's going to be all sorts of probes. this is what they're going to do. the people's business isn't going to get done. democrats, though, the silver lining for them, they think that if the house was to go to republicans and they were to launch all these investigations, the american people would get frustrated at them and may provide president biden with a foil for the second two years and his re-election. >> i mean, come on. this is ridiculous. what is merrick garland waiting on? come on, get in the game. fight, fight. he's going to be on the other end of power, the losing end.

you think republicans are going to sit back and be like, oh, we're not getting much legislating done because we'd look political if we did these investigations. this is legitimate. there are subpoenas out there. the fact that sitting members of congress don't care enough to reply and to actually go and report and speak the way that you and i are petrified to not go to jury duty is ridiculous. they need to get on with the business of the day. >> you know, one of the things -- and you just pointed to it -- that i think a lot of people in washington -- you might be better answering this than anyone because you go to washington. >> yeah. >> too much. but merrick garland, i've never heard anyone say anything negative about him. he's obviously a good guy, a smart guy, an honorable guy, but he acts like a judge. you need a prosecutor in these situations. >> there is growing frustration. one does not have to be in washington to know this.

there is growing frustration among democrats, among the inner circle of the white house, at how slowly merrick garland has proceeded here. they're not going to publicly pressure him. this president said he's not going to do what his predecessor did. bright lines between the white house and doj. but there is a real sense that garland has been unwilling to begin the investigations which are cut and dry. people defying subpoenas. they're held in criminal contempt. the question you hear a lot from 1600 pennsylvania avenue, democrat leadership, what is merrick garland waiting for? >> what does that look like, elise? what is the more that merrick garland could -- and we hear this again and again, that merrick garland needs to get moving and do more. what does it mean? he tried to let the committee do its business. what should we be doing? >> the ball is in his court. charge with contempt and -- >> it's been in his court for months. >> do it, keep going. i would say the parallel here is remember right after january

6th, there were many, many people who said, oh, we shouldn't in impeachment have direct testimony. we shouldn't have direct eyewitnessing coming and speaking. we need to get on with the business of legislation. the biden administration shouldn't get bogged down. look at what's happened since that moment. there's conspiracy theories running amuck, like we didn't get the first draft of history out there. we have to get the first draft of history out there for posterity. merrick garland has a critical role to play in making that happen. >> on the upside, we know there are reas and reams of information and texts this committee already has and has talked to trump officials. they'll get what they need, even without these five congressmen. we'll go live to washington, not just people who have been to washington, but analysis from people in washington. >> it's not that far. >> mike, you should go sometime. lovely this time of year especially. >> there is a rule against it, you can't be taller than the washington monument. >> we should do a segment.

>> more on mike barnicle's litany of subpoenas. >> the next hour is blown up. we'll come back to this story. but the united nations human rights council voted to deepen its investigation into war crimes inside ukraine. this comes after the u.n.'s human rights chief revealed more than 1,000 civilian bodies have been recovered in areas around kyiv and other areas previously occupied by russian troops. several hundred of them reportedly were executed. yesterday's vote passed with 33 in favor. only two countries, one of them china, voting against it. meanwhile, russia is warning finland of consequences if it joins nato. russian's foreign minister said moscow would be, quote, forced to take retaliatory steps to stop what he called threats to his nation's security. finland and sweden would become possible targets if they become

members of the organization, which they are set to do. nato secretary general has welcomed the move and promised a, quote, swift and smooth process to get those countries into that body. the white house also has said it'd strongly support both finland and sweden if those countries apply for membership. both finland's president and prime minister yesterday called for joining nato without delay, saying it was critical to their country's national security following russia's invasion of ukraine. finland's decision is a setback for russian president vladimir putin who has been trying to undermine and weaken the organization for decades. nato supreme commander, four-star navy commander james stavridis. security and diplomacy analyst for nbc news and msnbc. extraordinary how things have changed in the course of a couple months now. if vladimir putin wanted to weaken nato, he's done the opposite. finland and sweden poised to enter that body. now, russia threatening

retaliation if they do. what does that mean? is that idle talk? what would that be if it weren't? >> willie, that distant explosion you hear is vladimir putin's head blowing up in frustration. it ought to. be the consequence of his illegal and immoral invasion of ukraine, he has caused two superb militaries to throw in with nato. and i -- just to do the numbers for people for a second, finland and sweden combine have a defense budget of about $15 billion. russia's defense budget is only $60 billion the $70 billion. we're adding 25% of the russian military budget with the stroke of a pen. more importantly, the finns have 280,000 highly trained in their army. 280,000. they have 1 million reservists. their reserists are very good.

when i visited finland, i worked with and saw them, i commanded these troops in afghanistan, in the balkans, and libya, by the way. sweden sweden, turning to them, premier fighter. if you can build a volvo, you can build a fighter plane. when you combine all that, it's a windfall for nato. i used to say when i was supreme allied commander to both the finns and the swedes, look, tell us you want to come in on wednesday. we'll have you in by friday. i think it is going to be roughly that quick. the next shoe to drop -- and i'll finish with this, willie -- is going to be sweden sort of signing up, if you will. finland has already made the commitment. sweden coming right behind them. they'll come in as a pair. it is going to be a great pair of horses for nato. >> admiral, first of all, i want to congratulate you on perhaps giving me subtle permission to join you in a relaxing friday.

i might take my tie off. i mean, you look very relaxed, which is wonderful to see. but on a more serious note, obviously, george kenin is alleged to have said years ago that further encroachment of nato toward russia is not a great thing to happen. it makes russia feel threatened, and we should relax on doing that. do you agree with that sentiment uttered decades ago, now that finland, sweden are perhaps on the verge of becoming nato members? >> i have great regard, as we all do, we ought to, for george kenin. one of the great diplomats of america. by the way, he served a tour as a junior foreign service officer in estonia. he knows russia -- or knew russia as well as anybody. a lot of disregard for him, but i'm going to disagree. because history moves on. i think those sentiments might have been true at some point in the past, but at this stage, when russian tanks are rolling

to the west, it is a different ball game. i assure you, this is why the germans are effectively doubling their defense budget. this is why sweden and finland want to join nato. this is why the hottest membership card on the planet earth right now is nato membership. it is because russian tanks have rolled west. not only in ukraine but prague in '68, budapest in '56. open the book of history, i'll show you multiple pages of those russian tanks rolling west. they're rattling old ghosts in europe. we could snap our fingers and bring george kenin back. we might say, "i have to go with nato membership at this point." no, i don't agree. the aggression here is coming from the east. it is coming from vladimir putin. >> if you were, again, supreme commander of nato, what would be your recommendation with regard

to the black sea, russian naval operations, and perhaps implementing a blockade? >> great question. the first thing i'd do if i were still supreme allied commander, mike, i'd put a tie on. but in terms of the sea, thank you for giving an admiral a chance to opine about the sea, i think it is premature to put a blockade in place for the same reasons we don't put a no fly zone up and don't put nato boots on the ground. it is highly confrontational. however, i'll give you an alternative to think about. that would be to escort merchant ships in and out of the port of odesa. we did it in the persian gulf, operation earnest will. google it. that's a way that doesn't quite set up a blockade or a direct confrontation but does get grain and products moving out.

last thought, it's not just the black sea, by the way, in a maritime context. with sweden and finland coming in, you put the arctic at play. it'll be another interesting zone of competition, shall we say. so big, big game of risk at play here. i'll tell ya, i think, again, this is a good day for nato in terms of finland and sweden coming in. >> admiral, it's been a while since we had to say this, but the russians have actually had some progress. they made some advances in the east. per reports, they captured some towns in the donbas. give us, if you would, your current assessment of the state of play. the type of fighting you are seeing in that region and whether or not the new batch of western weapons have made it to the front. >> yes. the batches of weapons are there already. there's more coming. once you get that u.s.-nato industrial machine rolling, you really can't stop it.

so that piece of it, the foot race of logistics is being won on the ukrainian side. in terms of the front, i think it's kind of grinded out. i'll tell you what i feel as a former four-star commander. i feel that the russian generals not only are getting killed, that's kind of the two stars, the ones foolish enough to talk on cell phones and go to the front lines, failed leadership, by the way, but the far stars, i feel they're timid. they were slapped around, obviously, by putin, and their defense secretary following the failure of the campaign in the north. they're not doing well really in the northeast and around kharkiv. down in the south, they're playing very conservative ball. if you want to kind of put it in football terms, it's three yards and it's not even a cloud of dust. they're just kind of inching along, using artillery. i think their military feels frightened in order to really

launch something big, they can't afford another setback. that long, long hand reaching out from the kremlin is grabbing them by the back of the neck. it is putin. >> quoting george kenin and woody hayes in the same thought. incredible. >> yeah. >> retired four-star navy admiral james stavridis. thank you, admiral. still ahead on "morning joe," ambassador to russia john sullivan will be our guest. plenty of questions. rand paul standing in the way of $40 billion in aid to ukraine. we'll tell you why the kentucky senator is blocking that money and show you the criticism coming from leaders of both parties. including his fellow senator from kentucky. also ahead, the shortage of baby formula is a real crisis right now for american families. what the biden administration and a major manufacturer now are doing to get it back on store shelves urgently. and a first look at what

scientists call the gentle giant. we'll have more about this super massive black hole at the center of our galaxy. >> i saw it last night. >> you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. e watching joe. this is art inspired by real stories of bipolar depression. i just couldn't find my way out of it. the lows of bipolar depression can take you to a dark place. latuda could make a real difference in your symptoms. latuda was proven to significantly reduce bipolar depression symptoms and in clinical studies, had no substantial impact on weight. this is where i want to be. call your doctor about sudden behavior changes or suicidal thoughts. antidepressants can increase these in children and young adults. elderly dementia patients have increased risk of death or stroke. report fever, confusion, stiff or uncontrollable muscle movements, which may be life threatening or permanent. these aren't all the serious side effects. now i'm back where i belong. ask your doctor if latuda is right for you.

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called the proposed measure, quote, unconstitutional. president biden and lawmakers on both sides of the aisle are scrambling to address the baby formula shortage across the united states. after receiving an update from retailers and manufacturers yesterday, the biden administration announced it'd move to cut red tape in hopes of getting formula to stores more quickly. officials said they'd crack down on formula price gouging and increase imports to boost supply. baby formula maker abbott, which you might remember had a plant shut down after concerns of tainted formula, is looking now to restart its operations, but it could take up to ten weeks to get formula back on store shelves. this is an urgent problem for a lot of families in this country. we'll be talking to a couple of sitting members of congress about what can be done to move that formula onto the shelves coming up in a bit. meanwhile, scientists have known there is a major black hole at the center of our galaxy for some time, and now we're actually getting a look at it. nbc news correspondent tom

costello explains. >> reporter: take a deep look into what scientists call the gentle giant in the milky way. a massive black hole called sagittarius a. orbiting around it, a pull of super heated gases, dust, and chunks of old stars, 4 million times the size of the sun. >> the material was swirling around sagittarius so quickly, the appearance can change minute-to-minute. >> reporter: like a sci-fi movie, it changes shape and time. exactly what einstein predicted in his theory of relativity. what's on the other side of the black hole? >> you're actually going into the future. so if you get close to the black hole, but miss it and come back out, you'll discover that, you know, an hour has passed for you but ten years has passed for everyone else. >> reporter: no one could

survive going through. 11 telescopes with 300 researchers around the world captured the image. a trapdoor in space and time, just as einstein predicted more than 100 years ago. >> nbc's tom costello reporting on that view of the black hole. coming up next, democratic senator jon tester of montana made his way to new york city and joins the table in a moment. plus, we have an update on the long shot who won the kentucky derby. what the owner of rich strike is saying about running the horse for the remainder of the triple crown. we'll tell you when we come back. we'll tell you when we come we'll tell you when we come back. now's the time to learn more about an aarp medicare supplement insurance plan from unitedhealthcare and get help protecting yourself from the out-of-pockts medicare doesn't pay. because the time to prepare is before you go on medicare.

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effort yesterday to swiftly send $40 billion in aid to ukraine. senator paul wants to create a special inspector general to see how the money is spent. chuck schumer and republican leader mitch mcconnell took to the senate floor to press for a quick passage of that bill. >> he is not even asking for an amendment. he is simply saying, "my way or the highway." right now, in conjunction with leader mitch mcconnell, i'm giving senator paul an opportunity to do that. i'm offering to hold a vote on his amendment, even though i disagree with it. >> ukraine is not asking us to fight this war. they're only asking for the resources they need to defend themselves against this deranged invasion. and they need this help right now. sending assistance to ukraine is not some kind of philanthropy. this conflict has a direct and

major consequence for america's national security and america's national interest. >> joining us at the table here in new york, democratic senator jon tester of montana and one of senator tester's former colleagues, claire mccaskill of missouri. she is now an nbc news and msnbc political analyst. good morning to you both. senator tester, welcome to new york. great to see you. >> great to see you guys. >> let me ask about the package of $40 billion in aid to ukraine. it's been an extraordinary months' long effort by this administration and those of you in congress to get the aid to ukraine. do you see this rand paul stunt as holding this up, or will it get through quickly? >> it should have been through yesterday. i think it'll get through next week. it should get through next week. it should have got through yesterday. the point that mcconnell and schumer make on this is absolutely right. ukrainians need this support. we all know it. and for senator paul to hold

this up is completely inexcusable. i assume that it'll be picked up monday or as quickly as it can. this could have been done wednesday night. i mean, everything was ready to go. it is one of the problems with the u.s. senate. when you have one person that can obstruct everything. we had this debate in january, we shouldn't allow this. if grow want to hold the floor, hold the floor. at some point in time, that has to end. when it comes to help for ukraine, i mean, we see what the ukraiian people are doing. they're fighting with their lives to protect their country from a tyrant, and we need to support democracy. i think that's a bipartisan effort in washington, d.c., but, yet, we have one person stop it. and time is important here. getting money in a timely manner helps the ukrainians defend themselves. it's not money, it's reps,

frankly. half this package is defense, half is humanitarian. it is a little bit distressing and speaks to the dysfunction in washington, d.c. >> senator paul likes to be the guy who holds it up. let me ask about a talking point we've started to hear from republicans. this is an awful lot of money going out the door to a foreign country when we have all these problems here at home. why aren't we taking care of the home front. it probably goes without saying that both can be done in a country with the size and strength of the united states. what would you say to the criticism? >> i don't think, in my opinion, i don't think ukraine is the end of putin's threats here. he's already threatened finland because they want to join nato. i just think this guy is out of control, and the ukrainian people are fighting. they're giving their lives up for it. we need to do it. and we also need to take care of the issues we have here at home, that you guys talk about every morning.

we can walk and chew gum at the same time. >> senator, obviously, another major story in washington is the leaked draft opinion on roe v. wade. there was a vote this week to codify roe v. wade. it was obviously defeated. give us your perspective. you're a democrat representing a red state. the filibuster, should that be done away with for this issue, for voting rights? what is the status of that? what more can be done to protect abortion rights? >> look, we had this debate on a different issue back in january, and there simply wasn't the votes there to deal with the filibuster issue. it wasn't about eliminating the filibuster. it was going back to the days where people could talk. once they were done, we voted. so there's that. what can be done with the supreme court decision, quite frankly, when it comes to people's personal freedoms and women being able to make their own health care decisions, it is fundamental in a state like montana. it is privacy. we don't want women regulated,

so to speak. i think people have to show up if they believe strongly in that perspective, as i do. they need to elect the people that share that perspective. >> senator, your former colleague claire mccaskill has a question. >> first of all, i know something special must be going on. i know where you'd rather be. you would not want to be in new york. i know you really well. you want to be in sandy hook. you want to be home talking about whether or not you got the planning done. but let me ask you, first of all, let's make sure everybody understands, rand paul is by himself here, as he constantly is. from the outside, john, that i can now see, that's what frustrates people. we have rules in the senate where one person doesn't have to get anybody else to agree with him. >> that's right. >> they can really literally have blood on their hands for not getting aid to a country that's fighting for everything they've got for freedom and democracy. here's the thing interesting to

me. trump surrogates were saying, don't vote for this bill, including don jr. why do the republicans cower in front of trump constantly, but they're willing to defy him on this? do you real rumblings that anybody is worried about trump going after them if they support this aid? why is this different? why are they scared of him all the time? >> i don't know. it may not be different. we'll see what happens next week. the bottom line is this, you know, donald trump wanted to destroy nato. what would we have today if nato were destroyed? putin would be able to walk through ukraine and potentially other places, too. if they've come out and they've done their social media to threat folks in the united states senate they shouldn't vote for this, it is inexcusable. an old saying, freedom isn't free. the ukrainians are proving that. we need to support them.

i think there is a bipartisan effort to do that. hopefully folks will do the right thing in the united states senate. that is overrule what is going on with the senator from kentucky and senator paul and move forth with getting the ukrainian folks the weapons they need to be successful and win the war. >> you know, it strikes me, listening to you, senator tester, and claire mccaskill, former united states senator, that the two of you speak like ordinary people. too many politicians today who we have on here or who are with us every day don't speak like ordinary people. so you give the impression that you lead ordinary lives, even though you are a united states senator in a dysfunctional organization. so what do you do? senator mccaskill, you can jump in here, as well. what do you do when you're confronted with the ordinary issues that affect and impact ordinary people, like inflation?

to most people, and understand what i'm about to say out here, ladies and gentlemen, it is the paramount issue in people's lives. >> absolutely. >> not roe v. wade right now. >> yup. >> inflation, they're getting crushed by the two gs, gasoline and groceries. what do you say? >> congress needs to roll up their sleeves and go to work on it. i'm glad you brought it up, mike. thank you for the compliment of talking like a normal human being. i appreciate that. it is about doing things in the areas of food. i've got a couple bills, not to toot my own horn, but it happens to be with that, with grassley, fisher, and widen, to put more food transparency in the industry. it'll help not only the cow and calf guys but the consumer. we have four companies that control 80% of the beef in this country. if we have more transparency on that, get competition into the marketplace, along with the work that the president has done, getting low interest loans out there for the small meatpackers to expand, we can make a difference in the grocery store.

as far as gasoline goes, and it is a big one, i'll tell you that, gasoline, fuel in your car, this is an opportunity not only to drill for our natural resources, but to set up so we can have renewable energy moving forward so there is more competition. we need to deal with climate change and also make energy more affordable going into a future that doesn't put aco2 into the air. we put a man on the moon in the '60s. we now need better battery technology, better hydration, energy fuels, carbon sequestration, making nuclear waste benign, those kinds of things. if we do that, we will continue to lead the world, no doubt about it. energy is a big part of that. it'll be more affordable for the people. i say "if," and when a person

says, "ifs don't do me a damn bit of good," we need to do it in a bipartisan way. we need to set the politics uni only thing people talk about. what can i do to buy ads and put on tv that may be truthful and get re-elected? this is about doing the right thing for the american people. we can do it. there are proposals like i mentioned, mine, and there are others to really make a difference here for the consumer. >> claire mccaskill, you are doing your own grocery shopping now so it is your turn. no three syllable words. go ahead. >> first of all, we don't know very many three syllable words, jon and i. i've been doing my own grocery shopping a long time, thank you very much. >> yeah, mike. >> let me correct the record. >> yeah, mike. >> before the people of montana rise up and scream, he is from big sandy, not sandy hook. >> that's good.

>> i misspoke in the last segment. >> safe. >> jon is hitting on something with the baby formula thing. the oligarcholigarchies we have country, it is dangerous. jon lives it. this is somebody who actually plants and harvests and actually work on a farm with his family every year, year in and year out. he knows what is happening to food in this country. they're controlling food from birth to table. just a few industry. they have way too much power. just like three companies controlling baby formula. when you have that, bad things happen. guess who is funding all the dark money ads like jon is talking about? it is all of those mega companies writing mitch mcconnell six-figure checks. you want to clean this sh -- stuff up, before i use a bad word. if jon and i were talking, we'd

be using different words. you need to go after campaign finance, and you need to go after this concentration. that's another place merrick ger land needs to get off his you know what. >> senator, you bring out the best in claire mccaskill. >> elise. >> i like putting more value in investing in local farmers, at the end of the day, something we can all agree to support. but how -- what's a concrete way that big ag can be broken up snp. >> i'm not saying we ned to break it up. we need more transparency on it and more competition in the marketplace. those are two different things. but let me say this. i think how you do it is you put teeth in the packers and stock yard act. it was passed in 1921 because there was too much concentration in the industry. really didn't make any difference. today, it is more concentrated than it was in 1921. so we are going to put -- if this bill is passed, it'll put a

special investigation into the department of ag. number one, if they're doing anti-trust activities like under under-cutting the small meat plant to put them out of business, we can enforce that. i'm all about capitalism and businesses making money, but when i have generational ranchers that are calling me saying, "i'm going broke because the price for my calves at the farm gate is so bad." i have consumers calling me saying, "what is going on with meat prices? they're going through the roof." i'm saying, "the middleman is out of control. we need to shine light on it. it is the best disinfectant in the world, and we can get our arms around it. "it can happen quickly in the meat industry. >> you walk a line in the state of montana. went for donald trump in '16 and '22. yet, you seem to keep getting

elected there. so i know montana is its own case, but what is your message to democrats this year heading into the midterm elections where there is a great fear and expectation that they'll lose the house, but to hold onto the senate. what would you say to people? >> it is basic. that is, i think people throughout this country, certainly people in montana, appreciate hard work. get out there and work your tail off. then talk about what's happened. we're having record investments in infrastructure. something that's never been done maybe sent the 1950s in the interstate system. we're putting money into highways, bridges, broadband, rails, and the list goes on and on and on. and then talk about the fact that we're stepping up, making sure that our country is getting into a position, whether it is helping ukraine or making sure our cities and towns are being solvent, to be able to move forth into this century in a way that helps folks and moves the

country forward. look, i look at the united states as the greatest country in the world and it is. but it doesn't have to be that way. we can't have obstructionists in the senate to stop things just because they can and you'll report on it, which you should. but the bottom line is we need to have a vision. democrats need to talk about that vision. there are a lot of good things that are happening. unemployment is at an all-time low. if you want a job, you can get a job. pay is going up, a positive thing. from not a cattle standpoint, they're in trouble. a wheat standpoint because of ukraine, we're seeing wheat prices go through the roof. that's kind of good for people like me that raise some grain and raise some food, but on the other side of the coin, we also have to watch that. you don't want to price folks out of the marketplace. here's what it is, you have to talk about the issues that people connect with. i happen to have eaten last

in the restaurant. the young man didn't like democrats or republicans because they talk too much, which i'm doing right now. and they make promises and never follow through. he's right. what have you done for me lately? what are you doing in the future so my kid has a shot? what are you going to do to keep this country secure? >> great to have you. jon tester, the pride of big sandy, nice to see you. claire mccaskill, thank you, as well. on fire this morning. good to see you. ahead, more from ukraine as human atrocities are discovered there. the u.n. deepening its investigation into whether russia performed war crimes. the u.s. ambassador to

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a live picture at the top of the hour. 7:00 in the morning at the white house. welcome back to "morning joe." mike barnicle, elise jordan, jonathan lemire still with us. we have a lot to get to. the january 6th committee sending subpoenas to sitting members of congress. they want to hear from a group of republicans, including the highest ranking republican member of the house, kevin mccarthy. plus, a lot of empty space on shelves where baby formula should be right now. democratic congresswoman abigail spanberger will be with us to talk through the story and what's being done to expedite it and help families who need it so

badly right now. we begin this hour with the latest developments in the war in ukraine. the decision by finland to apply immediately for nato membership is evoking a strong response from russia as forcs continue with its assault on the ground. kelly cobiella reports. >> reporter: as russia intensifies its assault on eastern ukraine, the kremlin vowing retaliatory steps after finland's announcement it'll seek to join nato, with sweden expected to follow. finland shares 800 miles of border with russia and has been neutral for decades. >> if that would be the case we join, what my response would be, you caused this. look at the mirror. >> reporter: russia previously demanded that ukraine not join nato, using it as a justification for its invasion. ukraine's president conceding

back in march it was no longer possible because nato would likely not let them in. president elenskyy said if ukraine had been part of nato before the war, there would have been no war. ukraine's prosecutor general announced the first captured russian soldier will stand trial for alleged war crimes. a 21-year-old sergeant charged with shooting a 62-year-old unarmed civilian on a bicycle. why did you leave your village? ivan and maria told us they escaped their small village 80 miles from mariupol. a rocket hit our house. it blew up our home. but we, by a miracle, survived. she says russian forces are stealing everything. furniture, cars, and sending the locals to russia. >> kelly cobiella reporting for us there from ukraine. joining us now, u.s. ambassador to russia, john sullivan. mr. ambassador, thank you for taking time with us this

morning. we appreciate it. let me start with a broad question. you are a diplomat. are there any diplomatic conversations, high level, going on now between the united states and russia? admiral john kirby, the pentagon spokesman, was here yesterday and suggested you all made the calls but no one is picking up on the other end. >> well, good morning. thank you. it is great to be with you. yes, we've tried for some time. secretary of defense, our chairman of the joint chiefs, have reached out over the last if many months to try to have conversations with counterparts at the russian defense but failed to do so. we think it is important for two nuclear superpowers that senior leaders, particularly in national security roles, be able to communicate with their counterparts here. to your other question, limited discussions between the united states and russia. i'm really involved in almost,

you know, most of what the discussions we have, and they're very limited. they're about essentially two things. first, the operations of our embassy here in moscow and the russian mission to the united states. diplomatic issues involving our two countries. then my advocacy for american citizens who are detained here, that's been a big focus of my discussions with the russian government. >> yeah, and we appreciate that, for security reasons, we won't get into the details of those conversations. we do know you're actively work on that. what is your response to what we heard from the foreign ministry of russia just yesterday about finland applying for membership, likely to join nato very shortly here? saying, if you join nato, finland, we will retaliate. you're on our border, and we'll take that as an act of aggression. what is your response to that? >> well, this is a reprise of what we've heard for months and years from the russian

government about ukraine. russia presumes to tell other countries around the world, particularly in europe, what's right for their security, those other countries' security. they have this notion of -- you've heard them use the phrase, indivisible security. what that as a practical matter is russia seeks to have a veto power over whether european countries decide, independently, as is their sovereign right, what is right for their national defense. finland, sweden, ukraine, for that matter, should make those decisions, not russia. the fact that russia threatens another country like finland, should they dare to exercise their sovereign rights, is shocking, frankly. what's even more shocking is they've launched an aggressive war against ukraine because they disagree with ukraine's decisions about its territorial

sovereignty. >> mr. ambassador, good morning. jonathan lemire here. president biden has made clear that any sort of diplomatic solution will come from the ukrainians. i'd say it is not going to dictate what should be done there. i know, obviously, there are discussions back and forth with kyiv. you know, the state department. can you give us a sense as to where things stand? there had been halting peace talks in the early days of the war, not much since. what you're hearing from the ukrainians, is there any diplomatic solution here in the offer? >> well, i think the ukrainians would be interested in a diplomatic solution that protects their sovereignty and territorial integrity, but there needs to be an interlocutor on the other side. the russian government, president putin, in my opinion, isn't interested in diplomacy at this point. the russian government's rhetoric, its actions, committing atrociies across ukraine is not consistent with a

country interested in a diplomatic solution at this point, which is why we've said that one person, one government, started this war, russia, president putin, and it is up to them to stop it. president biden, our administration has been working hard in a variety of ways, both to invoke sanctions, export controls, pressure on russia, supporting ukraine, and also bolstering our nato allies to make sure that they know that the united states is committed to their defense. your nato allies under article 5 of our treaty. >> mr. ambassador, you are a career diplomat, and now you are posted in basically what is a wartime post. i'm wondering, from your position and your standing in moscow, what's the sense that you get from the information about the information that the average russian is getting about

ukraine, the war, casualties, and what's going on? >> well, terrific question. what the question russian hears and sees on russian television is an alternate universe. you know, it is a function of the russian government effectively crushing independent journalism and civil society here. so what the average russian hears is that president zelenskyy, the democratically-elected president of ukraine who is jewish, what the average russian hears, and it's all he or she hears, is that president zelenskyy is a nazi who is engaged in genocide in ukraine against russians and russian speakers. everyone else in the world recognizes that that's preposterous. when the foreign minister seeks to defend the position, he seeks further problems from russia, as you know, when he suggested that

adolph hitler was himself a jew, had jewih blood, to quote the foreign minister. created problems with russia's ties with israel. but it's all they hear, and it is a huge concern. many russians, primarily younger russians, seek for information outside of this country or outside of the government's control, but it is very difficult. very difficult. the russians are doing their best to crush the technical means that average russians have to get other sources of information. >> ambassador sullivan, elise jordan here. you have plenty of intrepid state department officers going under you, reporting, sending back their analysis of what is happening in the country. can you talk about the impact that the sanctions package has had on the russian people? who are you hearing?

>> sure. >> has there been a trickle-down effect, or has the administration managed to crack a package that hits mostly the top echelon of russian power brokers? >> certainly, the sanctions have been targeted at those, as you say, power brokers, oligarchs, et cetera, those that are affiliated with the russian government and support russian government's policies. the sanctions, the sanctions and export controls that the united states and our allies and partners are not directed at the russian people. our beef is not with the people of the russian federation buzz with their government that's launched this aggressive and par barbaric war in ukraine. the decision president putin made to launch this war, the russian people are going to pay the price economically.

we've already seen that in, you know, the performance of the russian economy the past few months. two caveats. first, the russian people are not suffering the way the people of ukraine are, obviously. we see that every day, hourly, with graphic, horrific pictures of the catastrophe committed by russia. the government, which has some talented technocrats and economists who work for them, including their central banker, who have worked very, very hard to try to prop up the russian economy, the value of the ruble, for example, over the last couple of weeks and months. that is a band-aid. i've said to others here, it is a beautiful day today here in

mid-may in moscow, but for the russian economy, winter is coming. the effect of sanction and export control over time are going to be crushing for this economy. most especially for the russian defense industrial base, which is something we do want to make sure doesn't target other countries, isn't able to control its aggression against ukraine or target other countries. >> that seems to me, ambassador, one of the many miscalculations putin made. nato expanding. the world rallying behind ukraine. putin's military being turned away from the prize of kyiv he thought he'd roll tanks into and have a military parade and install a puppet government. as someone who understands russia and putin better than most, what is your sense of his new end game or new aims?

in other words, when will vladimir putin will finished with his war in his mind? >> well, my assessment is that this is -- these are objectives in ukraine he's had for a very long time. his historical view of ukraine and its relationship with russia, with the rush people, those are long-held, deeply held views and convictions. but to your question, the very things that are happening to russia now, all of the economic and strategic consequences, secretary blinken -- we've been saying this for months before the invasion started on february 24th. don't do this. this will result 234 catastrophic economic

consequences for russia and will only strengthen those around the world who are opposed to russia's aggression against you. what is what has happened. >> beautiful day in may in moscow. what is it like to be the american in moscow? you stand forward and represent the united states there in an empty room. what is it like that vladimir putin blames the west and the united states, in large part, for this war? what is it like to be there right now? >> well, it's a bit surreal, as you can imagine. i am, in effect, behind the wrong lines here in moscow. the united states is not at war with russia either directly or by proxy, but i am certainly not viewed as a welcome presence by the russian government or by a number of russian people whom i drive by with my american flag

on my right front fender. i often get a one finger salute that tells me i'm number one. so there's no doubt about that. there was a small protest outside the embassy yesterday. it was, you know, relatively modest. the security situation from my perspective, i'm talking about physical security of the embassy and personnel here, you know, our security profile really hasn't changed all that much. so it's -- you know, i don't have as many appointments, very, very few, in fact, with russian government officials, or for that matter with other russians, just because people -- the russian government -- i'm not going to meet with them because we don't have -- we have no business to discuss. those russians who would like to

speak, many cannot be seek with me because of the threat they'll be investigated and prosecuted if they speak with me, if they say things that putin is doing is a war instead of an operation. that gaffe and you can be subject to 15 years in a russian labor camp. it is not a good place to be. >> ambassador sullivan, at least the one fingered salute you receive sometimes driving down the street must remind you of being back home in boston. but in any event, what can you tell us, if anything, about vladimir putin's inner circle? is there an inner circle, or is it just him? >> well, you know, it reminds me of the kremlinologists who used

to study who would appear on, you know, atop lennon's tomb to view a parade with chairman, you know -- the general secretary and so forth. a lot of speculation about, you know, what people president putin listens to. if i knew, i would be advising my government to try to influence those people who could influence president putin. my suspicions are that it is a very small number of people. but as i said before, his convictions on these issues, particularly regarding ukraine, are entrenched over time. i believe he deeply believes and is committed. i'm not sure he listens to a lot of people who tell him things that are contrary to what he thinks about ukraine. what he thinks about ukraine is it is not an independent country. it is part of a larger russian

world, and he should be directing what goes on in the country. >> ambassador, before we let you go, there's been speculation about vladimir putin's health, just not looking well, different than he has in the past. do you all have any information about that? >> i don't. i'm very cautious about making those predictions because in prior government service, i listened to my colleagues in government telling me about the imminent demise of the leaders of iran and others, and it was not correct. i don't know is the honest answer. with the references to boston, i have to say, i'm also deeply troubled by the health of the red sox franchise. >> yes. >> not really doing that well in the american league.

i hope their health will improve at least later this season. >> for all you have on your plate, you still have time to worry about the boston red sox bullpen. >> great ambassador. >> you fit in well with the "morning joe" crew. >> ambassador john sullivan who served 40 years under five presidents of different parties, thank you for joining us from moscow. appreciate it. we'll talk to you soon. >> my pleasure. at the end of march, few weeks after the start of russia's invasion of ukraine, the united states senate confirmed deborah lipstadt for combating anti-semitism. in an exclusive interview with nbc news correspondent josh lederman, ambassador lipstadt accused russian president putin of using nazi tactics to distort reality and to justify his invasion. josh is here with more now.

josh, good morning. what'd you find out? >> willie, it has been one of the most confounding aspects of president putin's war on ukraine. his exploitation of world war ii elements and his description of his military operation as an attempt to de-nazify ukraine, a country run by a jew, president volodymyr zelenskyy. but in this interview, the first interview the ambassador has done since being sworn in in march in the middle of this war, she makes what is the first accusation by the u.s. government, drawing direct comparisons between president putin and adolph hitler. and she says that the holocaust teaches us lessons that are applicable to russia's war today. >> i think we learn from the holocaust exactly what happened here. it doesn't begin with genocide.

the nazis didn't begin with genocide. they didn't plan on gas chambers, but it's step by step, how much can i get away with? what will the world accept? how far can i push? how far can i go? i think we've seen the same thing here. if you look back at the nazis, they really thought that the world was sit silently by as -- and much of the time it did, as jews were murdered, as critics were put in concentration camps. they test. the bully, it is a bully on an international stage who doesn't want to just make you feel uncomfortable on the playground but wants to kill you and murder you. the bully tests andest t tests tests. >> we've heard that word, bully, applied until the last several weeks, willie, to president putin himself. ambassador lipstadt also told me as someone studying the holocaust for decades, she doesn't shock easily, but she was flabbergasted, her word, but

russia's government claiming that it didn't matter that president zelenskyy was jewish. according tolavrov, hitler was jewish partly, which has no his historical basis. that language, that it was okay because he was jewish himself, that was holocaust denialism, something she says president putin and russia's government is committing itself. >> we heard ambassador sullivan sitting in the middle of moscow criticizing those comments, as well. nbc's josh lederman, thank you so much for the report. appreciate it. still ahead on "morning joe," democratic congresswoman abigail spanberger is working with the white house to solve the baby formula shortage, which is a crisis in this country now. she joins us next. when the former president left office, boxes of classified

information made their way to his home in florida. the department of justice is taking action to get their hands on the documents. and run him or rest him? that is the dilemma for the owner of rich strike. we'll tell you what's next for the long shot kentucky derby winner. might be surprised by the answer. "morning joe" coming right back. "morning joe" coming right backl stories of bipolar depression. i just couldn't find my way out of it. the lows of bipolar depression can take you to a dark place. latuda could make a real difference in your symptoms. tuda was proven to significantly reduce bipolar depression symptoms and in clinical studies, had no substantial impact on weight. this is where i want to be. call your doctor about sudden behavior changes or suicidal thoughts. antidepressants can increase these in children and young adults. elderly dementia patients have increased risk of death or stroke. report fever, confusion, stiff or uncontrollable muscle movements, which may be life threatening or permanent.

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to address it now. republican governor abbott accused the administration of providing baby formula to migrant families at border facilities, putting their needs above american citizens during the shortage. blayne alexander has the latest. >> reporter: this morning, for millions of parents, the frantic search for formula is getting closer to home. >> it is scary not knowing if you'll be able to feed your kid. >> reporter: the shortage is growing. 43% of the nation's baby formula supply is ow of stock. >> there was one day i went to 11 different stores and could not find any. >> reporter: overnight, the white house announced new steps to address the crisis, as president biden met with retailers and manufacturers, including walmart, target, and gerber. >> our message to parents is we hear you and want to do everything we can. >> reporter: the administration is facing growing pressure. >> this is not a third world country. this should never happen in the united states of america.

>> reporter: the new measures include increasing imports of formula, cutting red tape, and asking regulators in states to crack down on price gouging. but the white house acknowledged there is no timeline for when parents can expect to see the results on the shelves. >> we encourage any parent who has concerns about their child's health or well-being to call their doctor or pediatrician. >> reporter: for many families, the need is dire. according to the cdc, only 25% of infants consume only breastmilk through their first six months. many rely on specific formula brands. >> i've seen moms in the store crying in the formula aisle because they can't find their baby's formula. >> reporter: inventories are so low, some major stores put limits on how many baby formula you can buy at a time. the months' long shortage comes from a voluntary recall by manufacturer abbott nutrition. that prompted the shutdown of a major plant. all of it made worse by supply

chain issues. now, parents are scrambling for solutions. online, searches for homemade formula spiked. experts warn against making your own or diluting formula, as both could be harmful for your baby. >> we try to help parents to remain calm and make sure they contact us. >> blayne alexander reporting for us there. goes without saying, giving formula to some babies at the border for migrant families is not the cause for this crisis. let's bring in congresswoman abigail spanberger. thank you for taking time this morning on this important issue. let's take a quick step back in your assessment of why we're here. this crisis sneaked up on a lot of people, but it has been coming in the pipeline, i guess, for some time. what happened? >> well, so we know that there are a couple issues at play. one, there's been supply chain issues because of the pandemic ebbing and flowing. certainly in the early days of the pandemic, as so many people were stockpiling toilet paper, parents were stockpiling

formula. we know then there was a shift and there has been ebbs and flows in actual production. then in recent months, there was a shutdown of an abbott plant where there had been a bacteria that ultimately resulted in the death of two babies. but when we have such centralized processing within a market, there's only four major producers and abbott represents 43% of the baby formula in the united states, that consolidation quickly becomes a major issue. and so between the supply chain issues, between the shutting down of this particular factually, we are where we are right now. there were no ringing alarms along the way, which is a major issue and one that, legislatively, i intend to work on with a republican colleague across the aisle. >> i know you spoke to the white house just yesterday about this issue. you've got legislation that you're working on. a lot of this stuff feels like

long-term solutions to a problem that's clearly there. but for a mother going into walgreens or cvs today, what do they do? what is the recourse here? >> well, i have three school-aged children. all three of them i relied on formula to feed my babies. so my heart is breaking for the parents who are worried about what comes next. worried about even if they can buy formula today because they're being limited in the stores as to how much they can buy, that they'll be able to buy it a couple days later when they need more. so my attention to this issue is complete. i have talked to the white house yesterday, the day before, spoken to the president's chief of staff. the important steps and the immediate things right now, cutting through red tape, ensuring we can get formula imported from overseas, quality formula that typically isn't coming from the united states because we do have our own domestic market, but making sure we're bringing in that supply. i am not going to be satisfied with the results or the plans

until there is formula on the shelves across the united states and parents have that peace of mind. then long term, we have to look at what happened to get us to this point. where there not enough alarm bells along the way? do we not have a stockpile of baby formula? could the white house leverage the defense production act right now, or can we meet the needs of parents through removal of red tape and tariffs and bringing in foreign supply? these are all of the things i'm continuing to work on today and until this situation is solved. planning for the future to make sure we never have this type of supply chain disruption again. >> congresswoman, elise jordan here. thank you so much for taking on this issue. i cannot imagine anything more petrifying than not having enough formula for your child that's under the age of 1. this is critical. my question for you, as you mentioned, some of the restrictions on imports of

foreign but safe baby formula might be lifted. how quickly can that happen so that this immediate need is resolved? >> so these are -- this is the conversation i was having with the white house. ideally it should be done quickly. various formula produced throughout europe meet or exceeds standards. sometimes different formulation but still meeting the basic health needs of babies. certainly, meeting the standards that we put on the baby formula that is marketed here in the united states. as a former cia officer, i had one of my children overseas and relied on foreign europe-made baby formula to keep her healthy and safe. so it's an issue of how fast can the federal government move on this. my hope and expectation is quickly. i think, elise, as your viewers are thinking about what this means, we're talking about parents who endured a pregnancy

through covid, the shutdowns, the lockdowns, the fear that went along with that, and finally, as we are in this place where we're starting to really return to some future of a post-pandemic normalcy that we all hope for, to see the supply chain issue be so deeply focused and frightening for parents is just another hurdle that people are facing. one that i want to see resolved as quickly as possible because i know what that fear must be like for the parents. we are working on this issue. >> congresswoman spanberger, it's been quite a while since i've been to the store to buy simelax late at night. you mentioned there were no ringing alarms along the way to the crisis we're involved in. this is the united states of america. how is it that we get to the point where there is a scarcity

of baby formula? if you were going to make a list of essential items, baby formula would certainly be on that list. what has happened? >> well, first and foremost, i'm following up directly with abbott, the formula producer that accounts for 43% of the u.s. market share. they're coming before congress in two weeks, but i want answers from them sooner about how it is we got to a point where they were clearly on a path towards not producing what was didn't ring alarm bells. there is no structure in place, that when -- and for other products there is, but there is no structure in place that when it comes to baby formula, if producers, manufacturers recognize that we are on a path towards potentially having a shortage of supply, there's no requirement that they ring alarm bells. secondly, another issue that exists is there is just consolidation in the market. you had senator tester on

earlier talking about consolidation within the meat processing plants and meat processing industry. i work with him on that issue and carry the house companion of his special investigator bill because we've seen the problems that exist when there are supply chain disruptions and closures within a consolidated meat processing industry. and the same is the circumstance that we are witnessing in the baby formula manufacturing industry. it is so consolidated, that when there is a disruption in the supply market, and when there is a closure of one factory, months later, we find ourselves in a circumstance where parents are desperately trying to feed their children and cannot obtain the formula they need. this is, i think, to your point, this should not occur in the united states of america. looking at the consolidation in the '90s, there was lawsuits brought forth against the baby formula industry, about

anti-competition practices.unsu. clearly, we need to look at whether there is monopolistic behaviors or anti-competitive issues in market that contributed to the reality of where we are today. >> congresswoman, good morning. jonathan lemire. great to see you again. i want to shift gears to the situation in ukraine. the house obviously passed a significant aid package to ukraine that's been held up by one republican senator, senator paul of kentucky. i want to get your response to that. also, to the growing chorus of republicans who are questioning whether or not all this aid is truly needed, and should americans' money be spent at home instead? >> in regards to senator paul holding up this broad, bipartisan piece of legislation that is meant to render aid, support to the cause of the ukrainians fighting for their

freedom, it is shameful. it is disgusting. it is unthinkable. frankly, it signals greater problems within the united states senate, that one singular person can do vladimir putin's bidding and preclude the will of the american people and the united states congress from being able to help and support our allies as they fight for their freedom. i spent time with a ukrainian parliamentarian who is in washington, giving updates from back home. why this matters, democracy is under assault. it matters because the russian federation, vladimir putin's russia has invaded a neighboring country. they are raping, assaulting women and children. they are killing civilians. they are committing war crimes. they have invaded a sovereign nation that is our ally, and we

have committed our support. we have committed our aid. and if russia is not stopped within ukraine, if the ukrainians are not successful, and i believe they will be, what is to stop russia from forward movement into nato countries? so this investment in supporting democracy and our friends and allies is also an investment in keeping the united states from having to go further in our support of the ukrainian people, in our support of our european neighbors and our nato partners and allies. the ukrainians can win this war on their own, but they need support. they need help, which is why the united states is devoting that help and support. importantly, nato is, as well. this is not just a united states effort. we are working in partner. we are leading the way in this effort, but our nato partners have committed significant dollars, significant aid, significant support, and we are a part of that effort so that this war can end as quickly as possible. that the ukrainian people can be

free again and that the massive atrocities we are witnessing as part of this invasion of ukraine by russia will be stopped before it gets further. >> you can hear the frustration in the voice even of rand paul's fellow kentucky senator, mitch mcconnell, about holding up the $40 billion worth of aid. congresswoman spanspanberger, t you for taking on this issue of baby formula. let's hope it gets on the shelves as soon as possible. thank you. >> thank you. yesterday, we took you inside the plane that a passenger with no flight experience landed after the pilot suffered a medical emergency. now, we're going back to florida where kerry sanders can show us just how difficult it is to bring down a plane safely when you've never flown one before. we'll be right back. we'll be right back. what goes on it. usually.

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wow, look at that sunrise over dallas at 6:45 a.m. 7:45 here on the east coast. sad to say, there will be no triple-crown winner in horse racing this year. rich strike won't run in the preakness. dawson announced the plan to rest rich strike to be ready to run in the belmont stakes next month. at 80-1 odds, rich strike was the biggest odds to win the derby in years. respect to the trainer, he knows the horse better than anybody, but you have one shot to win the triple crown. >> i'm always sympathetic to the horses, but his win was spectacular. not because he was an 80-1 underdog, but how he did it. the comeback, the final stretch,

the sprint down the rail, the cut like an nfl player, and across the line. it deprives us of another sporting event. yes, you don't want the horse to be injured. felt like there is a chance for immortality. run the horse. that's my take. run the horse. >> trainer says you need five to six weeks rest for this horse between races and we respect the decision. would have been fun to watch him go for it. >> it would have been. but he already has immortality in addition to the 80-1 victory. the overhead shot of the horse coming down to the finish line is incredible to watch. it is such a dangerous proposition, being a jockey in that sort of circumstance. you have to think, or at least i have to think, part of it might be that the owners, they treasure the horse. they treasure the horse's health, but they want the horse to live in the memory of 80-1 rather than 80-1 victory in the kentucky derby, dead last in the

preakness. >> he wasn't going to be the favorite. you're right about that. but then we'll see him again in the belmont. can't we squeeze one more in the middle? what do we know? now to the story -- >> nothing. >> it's true, nothing is the answer. now the story we've been covering the past few days. the miraculous landing by a passenger aboard a small plane who had no flight experience. kerry sanders has been all over this story. also not a pilot, but he is beginning to show us how difficult it is to land a plane without training. kerry joins us from ft. lauderdale. good morning. >> reporter: i'm not a pilot. after what i just experienced, i have even more respect for the passenger-turned-pilot, harrison. i didn't get in a plane like this to fly. i got into a simulator and sort of handled, well, the real-world pressure that darren faced. it can take months to years to learn to fly a small plane.

so when darren harrison, a passenger-turned-pilot, safely landed a cessna 208 when the pilot became unconscious mid flight -- >> i have a serious situation here, my pilot has gone incoherent. >> reporter: -- it was nothing short of a miracle. >> the passengers landed the airplane? >> that's correct. >> oh, my god. great job. >> reporter: even professional pilots applauding. air traffic controller and weekend flight instructor bobby morgan safely guided harrison behind the controls. what were you thinking as you knew that the hardest part of this now was going to be bringing them in for a landing? >> mostly just staying calm. >> reporter: i found out that's not so easy. i'm in a simulator, and we're going to give it a shot. so the plane is in a steep dive. i'm going to try to pull it up nice and level. i'm not a pilot. i've never done this before. now, i'm going call for help.

mayday, mayday, i need help. >> no problem. keep calm. i'm here to help you. >> reporter: camilo ruiz is a certified flight instructor. what do i do? >> approach to the right. >> reporter: my approach was a struggle. i don't know. >> i landed, but then i crashed. it's a good thing that i'm in a simulator because if this had been a real plane, there's no doovers. >> what do you think of the passenger who became a pilot and stuck the landing? >> amazing. >> here i was learning for the first time and what i discovered is flying a plane is nothing like a car, so when you turn it's kind of delayed and then when you turn too much and you have to turn back, i overcompensated. i was able to get it on the ground, but i missed the runway,

and then i, as you saw, didn't really know how to stop the plane. where were the brakes. turns out, you can see in the video, i learned after the fact, on the pedals, you point your toes at the top, and that engages the brakes, but i think what all of this demonstrates is that darren is really one in a million and also that you never want me to fly a plane, guys. >> not quite ready for top gun yet, kerry sanders. there has been so much focus on the event and the landing of the plane, i want to check in on the pilot who was left unconscious that led to this extraordinary series of events. do we know anything about his condition? >> we know very little. we don't know his name and he and the family have asked for privacy. we don't have details. we know that the emergency response was able to get him out of the plane and take him to the hospital. that's about as much as we know right now. >> certainly hope he's doing well too.

kerry sanders has brought us this story in vivid detail. we appreciate it. the futures boards looking pretty good ahead of the opening bell. it's been a volatile and mostly negative week for wall street. our buddy stephanie ruhle will join us in the 4th hour to break down what's going on in the markets and also to talk through the major crash in cryptocurrency. we're back in two minutes. e majn cryptocurrency we're back in two minutes. you're a target for chronic kidney disease. you can already have it and not know it. if you have chronic kidney disease yoney health could depend on what you do today. ♪far-xi-ga♪ farxiga is a pill that works in the kidneys to help slow the progression of chronic kidney disease. farxiga can cause serious side effects including dehydration, urinary tract or genital yeast infections in women and men, and low blood sugar. ketoacidosis is a serious side effect

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increased role in global security since russia's invasion in ukraine. the white house has praised japan for the steps it has taken and president biden is expected to continue that when he makes his first presidential visit to asia later this month. he'll be in both japan and south korea. joining us now, the consul general of japan in new york, ambassador kyo. you came bearing a baseball jersey, and there's good reason for that, isn't there? >> tomorrow we're going to make a japan parade on central park west. they will host a japan heritage night, and i'll throw out the first pitch. >> throw out the first pitch. that's a big honor. are you warmed up, are you ready? >> not quite. >> new york fans can be tough. good luck with that. we'll look forward to the parade in new york city. let's talk about what we heard from the european union, and we have heard from president biden as well.

increased military spending from japan over the course of the last couple of months because of russia's aggression in ukraine. why has japan increased its defense budget, what role do you believe you have to play here? >> japan is spending defense expenditure not because of fighting. we cannot do that because of the constitutional limitation, but we are a japanese self-defense force. it's there to protect our own land with the cooperation of the u.s. forces based on our alliance. and in order to secure safer regional environment, japanese government is putting more defense budget to japanese self-defense forces. >> how much of that, mr. ambassador, has to do with china, which many people have pointed out is watching closely the way the world has responded to russia and ukraine because of china's perhaps ambitions in

taiwan. is this as much a response to china as anything else? >> well, it is more of multistake holder situation over there. japan is neighbor to russia itself, and as prime minister kishida pointed out in london, what's happening in ukraine may happen in east asia tomorrow. we have to be very careful observing the situation's development, be it in china or north korea or russia, and try to maintain a status quo of peace in the region, by putting every resources ready. >> mr. ambassador, moscow has delivered a stern message to japan saying they do not want to see your country participate in exercises with the u.s. and the west.

as you point out, you are neighbors over there. what has been the response to moscow after their warnings. >> the joint exercise is annual, self-defense forces have been participating almost every year, and not only with the u.s., some of the western-pacific allies, including australia or korea or other countries. and this is not to get ready to fight with russia, but as i pointed out earlier, how we can maintain peace and stability in the region is the most important target of these activities. >> in less than two weeks president biden is going to visit japan. >> yeah. >> one of two nations. he's also going to south korea, his first trip to asia. what's the significance of president biden coming to japan on this trip? >> well, president biden has shown a strong commitment to the

peace and stability in indo pacific, and it is said that president biden will put forth his initiative of indo-pacific economic framework. this is very strong sign on the part of biden administration to be ready to work with us and the people in the indo-pacific for peace and stability, and international order over there. secondly, he'll be participating in a meeting with japan, u.s., australia and india in tokyo. and this will send a very strong sign to the region and to the international community. >> ambassador, makio mori, we'll look forward to the visit, and more so we'll look forward to the pitch tonight. >> thank you.

i need that. >> don't throw from the mound. >> take a step inside the mound. see the glove, hit the glove. thank you, mr. ambassador. >> thank you. >> and we'll see you in our neighborhood at the parade. thank you for being here. it's a pleasure to meet you. coming up next on "morning joe," russia is making new threats after finland moves closer to joining nato. plus, the dramatic step forward in the investigation of the capitol attack as the january 6th committee subpoenas five sitting republican congressmen. "morning joe" is back in just one minute. congressmen. "morning joe" is back in just "morning joe" is back in just one minute - wooo. - wooo. wooooo!!!!! woohooooo!!!! w-o-o-o-o-o... yeah, feel the savings. priceline. every trip is a big deal.

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friday the 13th, actually, may the 13th. with us this morning, a great group, msnbc contributor, mike barnicle, the host of "way too early," and jonathan lemire. former aide to the george w. bush white house state department, elise jordan. she's an msnbc political analyst. let's dive into it this morning, a major step into the house committee investigating the january 6th attack, issuing subpoenas for five republican lawmakers, including kevin mccarthy. scott perry of pennsylvania, mo brooks, seen on january 6th firing up the crowd before the attack on the capitol all being compelled to testify. with the exception of ethics committee investigations in the past, the subpoenas are believed to be the first ever issued to sitting members of congress.

the congressmen, all allies of former president donald trump have information critical to the probe of the january 6th attack. they all have dismissed the investigation as illegitimate. here is how some of them reacted to news that they had been subpoenaed. >> i have not seen this subpoena. i guess they sent it to you guys before they sent it to me. look, my view on the committee has not changed. they're not conducting a legitimate investigation. >> the fact that they send it to the press before they send it to the members just proves it's all about headlines. this whole thing is a charade. >> i think this is an illegitimate committee, and they don't really have the authority to issue subpoenas in my opinion. so we don't want to dignify what they're doing. this has been a witch hunt from day 1. this is an attempt to go after political enemies instead of trying to get at the truth. >> congressman brooks of alabama said yesterday he had not been

served yet and would wait to respond until then. congressman jordan of ohio also has not responded. the panel claims he had at least one and possibly many communications with donald trump on january 6th. jordan previously has told the committee he has no relevant information to share. we'll see about that. the chairman of the committee, congressman bennie thompson said there have been no conversations about contempt if the congressmen do not comply, and he expects them to answer those subpoenas. let's bring in congressional investigations reporter of the "washington post," allison alimini, it's great to see you. this is splashy because of the names involved, especially kevin mccarthy who may be speaker of the house in a few months, but not totally unexpected. these are key figured who have said publicly or have been reported to have had conversations with donald trump leading up to january 6th during the attack and then after, what is the significance here, and does the committee actually

expect to hear from them? >> yeah, willie, you know, i'm not sure that the select committee believes members are going to appear. what they communicated to reporters yesterday is after months of deliberation, that they felt like they needed to give congressmen and house minority leader mccarthy and this full group the opportunity to respond to evidence that they have found throughout the investigation. they had already issued voluntary requests for mccarthy, scott perry, jim jordan months ago, actually at the end of last year, and had let those requests linger for quite some time. but it's clear that along the way they've found evidence that they simply cannot ignore that involves and indicts these lawmakers in some way, which is why you're seeing them now escalate this and call them in via subpoenas. you know, lawmakers yesterday, democratic lawmakers at least

did not want to even flirt with the contempt conversation and what they're going to do if these lawmakers decide not to comply with these subpoenas but, you know, part of the reason why they held off so long on issuing the subpoenas was because they didn't want to get into protracted litigation and extend the calculation. they have made the calculus in the interest of democracy and their investigation they needed to take further steps to bring them in. >> elise, as they say, it's obviously significant to call sitting members of congress with subpoenas but these guys, we know from tapes we have heard and reporting in the media, they were talking to donald trump during the attack. mo brooks said publicly trump asked me to rescind the 2020 elections and immediately put him back in the white house. he just said that out loud. >> and also jim jordan had conversations with donald trump on january 6th. >> and kevin mccarthy. >> exactly. so what happened in those conversations.

and jackie, it's obvious that, you know, these members have plenty of information that would be tantalizing to the january 6th commission, committee, frankly. they know what happened, and they know exactly where the bodies are buried, basically, so to speak. they aren't talking, though, and it doesn't look like they're going to talk. this could be a protracted legal battle. how does that play out if they do have to charge them with contempt? could it be a month's long process, and could it extend past midterms? >> that is the key question. before i get into mapping out what the process looks like, though, you remind me, i think it's important to note that some of these members, particularly scott perry of pennsylvania were the key conduit from the house gop conference and republican lawmakers to the white house. it was scott perry who was directly advocating various white house officials to install

a trump loyalist, jeffrey clark who was exchanging conspiracy theories are scott perry, and was advocating to seize voting machines on the basis of, again, very conspiratorial fringe theories that had not been substantiated in any way. if lawmakers on the house committee decide they're going to hold these members in contempt for not cooperating with the subpoenas which, you know, looks like probably is going to be the case, then they're going to have to take a full house vote. that's then going to make it to the department of justice, and then the department of justice is going to have to make that final decision on whether or not they're going to actually prosecute these referrals. we also know that right now attorney general merrick garland is sitting on other referrals, including the contempt referral of mark meadows, peter navarro, and dan scavino. if the house does make these referrals, merrick garland has almost got a dozen decisions

that he's got to make on his plate, a lot of them extremely politically loaded. >> jackie, good morning, it's jonathan. >> hey, john. >> charging in contempt would be an escalation. it was pointed out that the idea of just issuing these subpoenas is a no lose situation for some of the democrats on the committee with this thought, that if the republicans take control, back control of the house this fall, which is expected, that therefore, if they were to defy the subpoenas now, they would be setting a precedent for the democrats to do the same. looking into the biden administration, and so on. i want to get your take on that, and also give us an update as to the public hearings that we should expect from the january 6th committee. are they still on track for early june? >> look, that's potentially true, and i know that lawmakers on the committee and their staff have been bracing for potential subpoenas and investigations if republicans take back the majority in november. they have all been extremely

careful in that regard. but i also think that the conversation that lawmakers on the committee are privately having is one that's a little bit more, you know, with a sense of patriotism and duty and obligation to their roles and to the american people which is that if these lawmakers were engaged in a conspiracy to overthrow, defraud the government and stop the certification of the electoral college with no basis that the american people ultimately deserve to know that. and from all accounts and from what chairman bennie thompson told reporters yesterday, the committee has collected evidence that indicates as such whether or not they ultimately make criminal referrals or how far they went in this effort to overturn the results of the election, another conversation, but that the american people deserve to know the full extent that these lawmakers

participated in january 6th and which is why i think they decided, you know what, we have to do this at the end of the day out of a sense of patriotic duty. that being said, right now all eyes and preparation is on these june public hearings. those are supposed to start on june 9th. there's going to be eight of them. the committee is currently working to create sort of a narrative arc and mission since the public still has not coalesced around a cohesive narrative about what exactly happened in the lead up to january 6th and the aftermath, and the insurrection is still currently happening in some regards with republican lawmakers continue to go propagate unsubstantiated claims of election fraud, and trying to pass legislation on the unsubstantiated basis of a lot of conspiracy theories that are still in the bloodstream. >> "the washington post" all

over the story for us this morning, thank you so much, jackie, great to see you. >> thanks, will legal. they didn't cooperate with the investigation when asked to come in on their own. that's why these are being handed out, and when you talk about what we already know about some of these guys, mo brooks, the congressman from alabama, famously or infamously made the speech where it's time to start taking names and kicking ass, are you ready to fight for this country, do what you have to do, and when confronted later, he said donald trump made me do it. the president of the united states said i should go out there and do these things. well, maybe they'll learn some things in interviews and conversations but we really already know, don't we, based on public information the role that some of these guys had on january 6th? >> yeah, and you know, what we know, what everyone in america knows has been reinforced here with the spectacle of subpoenas being issued to people and people just ignoring the

subpoenas. federal subpoenas, mark meadows can ignore a federal subpoena. i've been subpoenaed a couple of times. you have to reply. they will come and get you. but these people just walk. i mean, there's a bunch of subpoenas at the justice department to see whether they're going to be enforced or not. they're not enforced. the other aspect that is interesting is the duel class of citizens, special citizens in congress that get away with things, and the other aspect is this almost guarantees if the republicans gain control of the house on january 2nd next year, they will institute a special committee on revenge, and nothing will get done next year in congress as nothing much has gotten done this year. >> and they have already said as much, john, haven't they, okay, you want to play it this way, then you're all getting subpoenaed when we take over the house in january. >> it's about january 6th, it

dates back to investigations that the democratic controlled house did during the trump administration. they have made clear they're going to do the same. they talk about impeachment proceedings for cabinet members. they're going to investigate, get ready for the words hunter biden. there's going to be all sorts of probes at least. this is what they're going to do, and the people's business isn't going to get done. democrats think if the house was to go to republicans and they were to launch all of these investigations, the american people would get frustrated at them and provide president biden with foil for the second two years in his reelection. >> i mean, come on, is that the what the president says? this is ridiculous, what is merrick garland waiting on, get in the game, fight. fight. and he's going to be on the other end of power, the losing end, and then republicans, you think they're going to sit back and be like, we're not going to get much legislating done because we'd look really political if we did all of these investigations. this is legitimate, there are subpoenas out there.

the fact that sitting members of congress don't care enough to reply and to go and report and speak the way that you and i are petrified to not go to jury duty is ridiculous. they need to get on with the business of the day. >> one of the things, and you just pointed to it that i think a lot of people in washington, you might be better answering this than anyone because you go to washington. >> yeah. >> too much. but merrick garland, i have never heard anyone say anything negative about him. he's obviously a good guy, a smart guy, an honorable guy, but he acts like a judge, and you need a prosecutor in these situations. >> there is growing frustration. one does not have to be in washington to know this. there is growing frustration among democrats, among the inner circle of the white house in how slowly merrick garland is moving here.

they're not going to pressure him. there are bright lines between the white house and doj, there's a real sense that garland has been unwilling to take the plunge and begin these investigations which are cut and dry. these are people defying subpoenas, held in criminal contempt. the question you hear a lot from 1600 pennsylvania avenue, what is merrick garland waiting for. >> what does that look like, elise? because we hear this again and again, including from white house sources that merrick garland needs to get moving and do more. what does that mean? he has tried to let the january 6th committee do its business. what should he be doing? >> as jackie outlined, the ball is in his court, charge them with contempt -- >> the ball has been in his court for months. >> do it keep going. i would say the parallel here is remember right after january 6th, and there were many many people who said, oh, we shouldn't, in an impeachment have direct testimony, we shouldn't have direct eyewitnesss come in and speak

. we need to get on with the business of legislating. look at what has happened since that moment, conspiracy theories running amuck. we didn't get the first draft of history out there. we have to get the first draft of history out there for posterity, and merrick garland has a critical role to play in making that happen. >> on the upside, there are reams of information the committee has. they're going to get what they need even without these five congressmen. coming up, the latest developments from the ground in ukraine as the united nations confirms a horrific discovery near kyiv. we'll have details. russia vows to retaliate against finland after leaders say they will apply to join nato without delay. admiral james stavridis joins us when we come right back. l jamess when we come right back.

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the united nations human rights council voted to deepen its investigation into russia's abuses and violation of international law inside ukraine. this comes after the u.n.'s human rights chief revealed more than a thousand civilian bodies have been recovered in areas around kyiv and other areas previously occupied by russian troops. several hundred of them reportedly were executed. yesterday's vote passed with 33 in favor, only two countries, one of them china voting against it. meanwhile, russia is warning finland now of consequences if it joins nato. russia's foreign minister said moscow would be forced to take retaliatory steps to stop what he called threats to his country's national security. the russian envoy said finland and sweden would become possible targets if they become members of the organization, which they are set to do.

nato's secretary general has welcomed the move and promised a swift and smooth process to get the countries into the body. the white house also has said it would strongly support both finland and sweden if those countries apply for membership. finland's president and prime minister yesterday called for joining nato without delay saying it was critical to their country's national security following russia's invasion of ukraine. finland's decision to set back for russian presidential vladimir putin who has been trying to undermine and weaken the organization for decades. let's turn now to former nato supreme allies commander, four star navy admiral, james stavridis, chief international security and diplomacy analyst for msnbc news and nbc. it is extraordinary how things have changed in the course of a couple of months now. if vladimir putin wanted to weaken nato, he has done just the opposite. finland and sweden poised to enter that body. russia threatening retaliation, if they do, what does that mean, is that idle talk and what would that be if it weren't?

>> willie, that distant explosion you hear is vladimir putin's head blowing up in frustration. it ought to. by the consequence of his illegal and immoral invasion of ukraine, he has caused two superb militaries to throw in with nato. and just to do the numbers for people for one second, finland and sweden combined have a defense budget of about 15 billion. russia's defense budget is only 60 to 70 billion, so we're adding, we nato are adding 25% of the russian military budget with a stroke of the pen. more importantly, the fins have 280,000 highly trained in their army, 280,000. they have 1 million reservists. their reservists are very good. when i visited finland, i worked with and saw them. i commanded these troops in

afghanistan, and the balkans, and libya, turning to them. some of the absolute premier fighters. if you can build a volvo, you can build a fighter plane. it's a windfall for nato. i used to say when i was supreme allied commander, tell us you want to come in on wednesday, we'll have you in by friday. i think it's going to be roughly that quick, and the next shoe to drop, and i'll finish with this, willie, is going to be sweden sort of signing up, if you will. finland's already made the commitment, sweden coming right behind them. they'll come in as a pair, it's going to be a great pair of horses for nato. >> admiral, first of all, i want to congratulate you on perhaps giving me subtle permission in joining you on a relaxing friday, and i might take my tie off. you look very relaxed.

which is wonderful to see. but on a more serious note, obviously, george kennon is alleged to have said years ago that further encroachment of nato towards russia is not a great thing to happen. it makes russia feel threatened and we should relax on doing that. do you agree with that sentiment uttered decades ago now that finland, sweden are perhaps on the verge of becoming nato members? >> i have great regard as we all do, for george kennon, one of the great diplomats of medical care. by the way, he served a tour as a junior foreign service officer in estonia. he knows russia or knew russia as well as anybody. a lot of regard for him, but i'm going to disagree because history moves on. i think those sentiments might have been true at some point in the past, but at this stage when russian tanks are rolling to the west, it's a different ball game, and i assure you, this is

why the germans are effectively doubling their defense budget. this is why sweden and finland want to join nato. this is why the hottest member card on the planet earth right now is nato membership. it's because russian tanks have rolled west and not only in ukraine, but prague in '68. budapest in '56, opened the book of history. i'll show you multiple pages of those russian tanks rolling west, rattling in europe, and i think we could snap our fingers and bring george kennon back, he might say, i got to go with nato membership at this point. no, i don't agree. the aggression here is coming from the east. it's coming from vladimir putin. >> and if you were, again, supreme commander of nato, what would be your recommendation with regard to the black sea, russian naval operations and perhaps implementing a blockade.

>> great question, the first thing i would do if i were still supreme allied commander, mike, i'd put a tie on, but in terms of the sea, thank you for giving an admiral to opine about the sea, it's premature to put a blockade in place for the same reasons we don't put a no fly zone up and boots on the ground, it's controversial. an alternative would be to export merchant ships out of odesa. we did that in the gulf, that doesn't set up a blockade or direct confrontation but does get grain and agrarian products moving out. last thought, it's not just the black sea, by the way, in a maritime context, particularly with sweden and finland coming

in, you put the arctic at play, i think that's going to be another interesting zone of competition, shall we say. so big, big game of risk at play here, but i'll tell you, i think, again, this is a good day for nato in terms of finland and sweden coming in. >> admiral, it's been a while since we have had to say this, but the russians have actually had some progress. they made advances in the east, per reports they have captured towns there in the donbas. give us, if you would, your current assessment of the state of play there, the type of fighting you were seeing in that region, and whether or not the new batch of western weapons have made it to the front? >> yes, the batches of weapons are there already. there's more coming. once you get that u.s. nato industrial machine rolling you really can't stop it, so that piece of it, that foot race of logistics is being won on the ukrainian side. in terms of the front, i think

it's kind of grinded out. i'll tell you what i feel as a former four star commander. i feel that the russian generals not only are getting killed, that's kind of the two stars, the ones that are foolish enough to talk on cell phones and go to the front lines, failed leadership, by the way, but the four stars i feel they're timid. they were slapped around, obviously, by putin, and their defense secretary following the failure of the campaign in the north. they're not doing well really in the northeast around kharkiv, so down in the south, they're playing very conservative ball, and if you want to kind of put it in football terms, it's 3 yards and it's not even in a cloud of dust. they're just kind of inching along, using artillery. i think their military feels frightened in order to really launch something big. they can't afford another

setback, that longhand reaching out from the kremlin is grabbing them by the back of the neck. it's the hand of putin. >> admiral james stavridis, great to see you. thank you so much, sir. coming up, other stories making headlines, the shortage of baby formula creating a crisis for american families, and a louisiana republican backs down from his extreme plan to crack down on abortion and potentially to prosecute women who get them. "morning joe" is coming right back. who get them "morning joe" is coming right back wealth is shutting down the office for mike's retirement party. worth is giving the employee who spent half his life with you, the party of a lifetime. ♪ ♪ wealth is watching your business grow. worth is watching your employees grow with it. ♪ ♪

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from house republicans and louisiana's democratic antiabortion governor who called the proposed measure quote unconstitutional. president biden and lawmakers on both sides of the aisle are scrambling to address the baby formula shortage across the united states. after receiving an update from retailers and manufacturers yesterday, the biden administration announced it would move to cut red tape in hopes of getting formula to stores more quickly. officials said they would crack down on formula price gouging and increase imports to boost supply. meanwhile, baby formula maker abbot which you might remember had a plant shut down after concerns of tainted formula is looking to restart its operations but it could take up to ten weeks to get formula back on store shelves. meanwhile, scientists have known there's a major black hole at the center of our galaxy for some time, and now we're getting a look at it. nbc news correspondent tom costello explains. >> reporter: take a deep look into what scientists call the

gentle giant in the milky way, a massive black hole called sagitarisos a. >> the material was swirling around, that the appearance could change from minute to minute. >> and just like a sci fi movie, the hole itself represents the warp of speed and time. its shape, size and location precisely what albert einstein predicted in his theory of relativity. so what's on the other side of that black hole? as you fall into the black hole, you're actually going into the future, and so if you get close to the black hole but miss it and come back out, you'll discover that, you know, an hour has passed for you, but ten years has passed for everyone else. >> but no one could survive actually going through. the event horizon collaboration used 11 telescopes with 300

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now to the battle at the southern border over a trump era policy that allowed the government to turn away asylum seekers due to covid. the biden administration's push to end the policy comes amid another record surge at the border. a court hearing is set for today to determine if the order will stay in place. nbc's gabe gutierrez has more. >> reporter: with border

crossings at the highest level in decades, the biden administration is facing concerns the surge could grow larger. >> there's bigger groups, cubans, haitians still coming in the area. >> reporter: in march, customs and border protection reported 221,000 crossings, the highest in 20 years. texas has launched a controversial multibillion dollar effort to crack down prosecuting some migrants without children for trespassing. >> this is something you see day in, day out around the clock. >> this is nonstop, yeah. >> over eagle pass, texas, we ride along with troopers from the texas department of public safety, and see migrants wading across the rio grande, some holding children. one group including 100 people, many from cuba. >> the influx is constant. local authorities we spoke with say if title 42 lifted, this surge will be even worse! title 42 is a public health policy that the trump administration used during the pandemic to expel migrants. the biden administration now wants to end it.

saying it denies asylum seekers their rights, but 21 republican attorneys general have sued arguing lifting title 42 would attract even more migrants. some democrats are against lifting it, especially in an election year. >> title 42 needs to remain as is. we don't have the infrastructure, the facilities. >> reporter: joanna from ecuador who's pregnant said she could not wait. >> why did you come to the united states? >> i want to work, she says, describing how a gang back home threatened her. she and so many others risking their lives to come to the u.s. as a legal battle that could ultimately determine their fate plays out in court. our next guest just won a pulitzer prize for her team's reporting that now has the attention of the pentagon. we'll explain next on "morning joe." of the pentagon. we'll explain next on "morning joe.

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wow, our director t.j. dialing up all the right shots this morning. 6:48 in the morning, look at the rockies from denver. a surprise candidate is closing the gap in the final days before pennsylvania's republican senate primary. her name is kathy barnett, gone from little known to serious contender. just in the last week, the conservative group, club for growth spent $2 million on ads for her. she has campaigned on extreme far right views and false claims that the 2020 election was stolen. "the new york times" offers some more background on barnett writing this, quote, ms. barnette has a history of incendiary remarks including calling president obama an adherent of islam which she says

should be banned and writing about the homosexual agenda. and a two candidate race shows is almost a dead heat among the three candidates heading into tuesday's election. elise, this got interesting real quick. bathy barnett, go online and read some of the extreme, some of the views that she has. abhorrent applies to a lot of them. but she's moving up. up 15, 17 points since the last poll. she may sneak into the nomination here. >> strictly in terms of political theater, it really doesn't get much better than this. having a candidate who has had no money the entire race, within striking distance of actually winning against two multi-millionaires who have spent upwards combined of

$25 million on this republican primary. and i wouldn't bet against bathy barnette at this stage in the game given that she has the momentum and you look at dr. oz, how he's pretty stagnant. he hasn't -- he's up since the trump endorsement and was leading but it is not overwhelming. and then david mccormick is just really the tragic figure in this race. because i wish that he had just been himself, authentic and not tried to go to the trumpian maga route because he would have been a fine senator. but the odds are slim. >> would have been a better candidate. would have been himful. >> and it is still is a three candidate race. no one is out of it. it is tied right there. but they were all jockeys for president trump's endorsement. oz went up 7 points and kathy barnette has tried to hug donald trump close, and she's up 10 points since the last poll. >> trump put out a mysterious

statement yesterday saying he praised her and she has a bright future in the party but she needs to -- he thinks oz would win and barnette would lose and a lot of his supporters back her. but this is setting up, whether it is mccormick or oz or bernette, wanting to move to the right. that is opening up the possibility for the democrats to keep this come fall. this is going to be damaging for republicans chances to win it in general election. the lieutenant governor there is ahead in the polls and the general election match-ups. this is a state that could be put in play. as much as we think about republicans gaining come november, there is a chance that it might keep the senate 50/50. >> if you're a democrat and you're looking at the names we had up there on the poll and you were honest and saying to yourself now which candidates, mehmet oz, david mccormick, kathy barnette, which would i not want to face in a general

election this fall. if you're a democrat asking that question, you would absolutely honestly say i don't want to face dave mccormick. >> absolutely. >> he would be the strongest candidate. >> he still may be. trend lines are working against him. that is coming up soon. a little bit farther out, the state of georgia. so much going on down there. and i know you're heading down there to talk about the governors race and the senate race. >> georgia is fascinating this cycle. it is the nail-biter that will answer a lot of questions. donald trump has endorsed former senate david perdue and he's up against brian kemp who trump has a huge grudge against for not throwing him the election. and so it is really that race, kemp is popular within the race and it is not like he's some rino country club populist. he's very conservative. so will the trump endorsement

help purdue and move the needle against brian kemp as the reason that he sees he's not president right now. >> how do you do the group? is it a series of questions. >> you try to get people in a room who have similar views and just let them talk. and you let them hear out what they say about how they came to a conclusion. and so it is a comfortable environment. you sometimes have these just aha-moment where you see how an idea is percolating within the electorate. >> so it is a split thing happening in georgia right now. donald trump backing herschel walker, he's going to roll to that nomination despite the baggage and allegations, he's a god in the state of georgia. the heisman trophy winner, and maybe the best player in s.e.c. history, but on the -- bo

jackson is there too. and period due is lagging behind brian kemp. >> there are questions whether herschel walker lives in georgia. it doesn't matter. he's the republican nominee. the governor's race is a different story. purdue has made his entire campaign the big lie and he's not being rewards for it. he's way down in the polls. and kemp stood up to trump in the election and over saw the election to restrict voting access in georgia. but he's become the figure that other republicans are rallying around. and some of them are those governor ricketts of nebraska, former governor christy and mainstream republicans willing to defy donald trump and are backing kemp. and traveling to georgia to campaign for him, mike pence. and again leaning into this difference breaking with his

former boss as he eyes his own run in 2024. >> and the governor race matters because it is a test of do you have on the ballot for georgia's governor, do you have brian kemp up who upheld a free and fair election or purdue who is a trump ally and is going to help trump come out ahead and so donald trump as he potentially is looking for 2024, he's installing his allies or trying to all over the place. and so that test between who is sont the ballot is one that another -- nail biter. >> trump has promised to support democrat stacey abrams if it does become versus kemp race. >> if you're a democrat in georgia, you have got to be giddy over your observation that you just threw out. that there is some question whether herschel walker lives in the state of georgia. >> i mean, he is -- but because that may not matter because he's far up in the polls.

that senate race facing rafael warknock and has to face voters again in potentially unfriendly environment for democrats. >> what is the money race between the two of them? >> warnock has done well. walker is not having issues. he has money himself. but warnock has had in shortage of cash and he's well financed for this race. >> will herschel walker be able to peel away any voters from warnock. he's popular with democratic voters and you look at herschel walker and all of the oppo that stands to drop. the allegations that he beat his former wife and things like that, it could get nastier when he is really put inner the spotlight. >> that is the problem with the fringe candidates may help democrats in the campaign. >> and he's been in hiding. that will perhaps change. and also going into the state of

georgia, to rally against donald trump's candidate and the governor's race, chris christie, governors do see ricketts and chris christie going in against donald trump. >> maybe donald trump just should have called chris christie when he was in the hospital suffering from covid and maybe he should have been a better friend and perhaps he would have a ally. >> we're rolling into the fourth hour, glad you're with us. a lot coming up this hour. latest from the war in ukraine. russia now vowing retaliation if finland joins nato and moscow is pulling back from a key northern city in ukraine. we'll be joined by retired army four-star general barry mccaffrey. plus the growing concerns over a nationwide baby formula shortage. we'll hear from the member of the white house team on the steps the biden administration is planning to take. and the great crypto market

plunge. a broad sell-off, erasing more than $200 billion from the entire market in just one day. what is up with crypto? we'll look into that. but first the house committee investigating the january 6 attack issues subpoenas for five republican lawmakers who have refused to cooperate in the investigation, including house republican leader kevin mccarthy who may well become the majority leader in a few months. congressman andy bigs of arizona, scott perry, jim jordan of ohio and mo brooks of alabama. also being compelled to testify with the exception of ethics committee investigations in the past, the subpoenas are believed to be the first ever issued to sitting members of congress. the panel has said that the congressman have information critical to its probe of the capitol attack on january 6. all have dismissed the investigation as illegitimate. let's go straight to garrett

haake in nbc senior capitol hill correspondent. so, garrett, talk us through this, the significance of this, the likelihood that any five gentlemen will respond and the roles they played in the days leading up to and the day of and the days after january 6. >> i was looking at that graphic and we talk about scheduled to appear. that is because that is when the committee wants these men to appear but scheduled is probably a bit strong. none of them seem at all inclined toward actually answering these subpoenas. these are all folks who the committee has been trying to get to come testify voluntarily for quite sometime. and you go through the list, you have kevin mccarthy and jim jordan, constantly in contact with donald trump in the lead up. scott perry was involved. there is a senate report on his involvement with the doj and kind of pulling some levers behind the strings of doj to change leadership there to make it more trump friendly to the claims of a stolen