and connect moo me, that would be okay. >> fred, appreciate your condolences, your offer and you going through what is this -- this grim part of this process. fred guttenberg thank you. hopefully we will talk under better circumstances. the special coverage here on msnbc continues now. >> good evening, everyone. howial doing? you tired? because i'm going to be honest. i am tired. tonight we should be talking about the many primary elections taking place across our country and the importance of democracy and that's what we should be doing tonight and we're not doing that because the thing that never seems to change happened again here in america so we begin "the reidout" tonight with yet another devastating tragedy that leaves us frankly all emotionally spent and exhausted and angry and

indescribably sad. 14 little kids and one of their teachers are dead in texas, and countless more are traumatized after yet another mass shooting. this one at robb elementry, an elementary school. the school is nrlt uvalde county texas, 58 miles west of san antonio. texas governor abbott identified the shooter as an 18-year-old uvalde res den. >> he shot and killed horrifically and incomprehensively 14 students and a teacher. in addition to that, it has been reported that the subject shut his grandmother right before he went into the school, and there is -- i have no further information about the connection between those two shootings, and the subject is reported to be a student -- to have been a student at uvalde high school.

>> he added that the shooter abandoned his vehicle and entered robb elementary with a handgun and possibly a second firearm. abbott added that the shooter was likely killed by responding officers but the events are still being investigated. it is unclear what prompted this man to harm these 14 children. president biden has been briefed on the situation and is expected to address the country once he lands in more than an hour from a trip to south korea. moments ago the white house said biden spoke with abbott and offered any assistance that he needs this. devastating news comes just ten days after another 18 yearly, a self-identity white supremacist, entered a supermarket in buffalo, new york and methodically shot and killed ten people while they were shopping, including three more, almost all of them black. the funerals for those dead have not even been completed when the uvalde killer struck. robb elementary parent rushed to a reunification center to await news from the school about their kids. the scenes of those parents

waiting, a patients' literal worst nightmare are eerily similar to that god awful day back on december of 2012 in new town, done conwhen yet another 18-year-old killer walked into an elementary school killed 26 people, mostly kid and some of the teachers. 21 were children between 6 and 7 years old, and 6 were adult staff members. nationally 134 american children have been killed by gun violence just this year, and it's only may. according to the "texas tribune" with tuesday's shootings there's been eight shootings in texas alone in which at least four victims were killed. in 2018 a student opened fire at santa fe high school near houston killing ten people and wounding 13 others. under governor abbott texas has proudly pursued laws to get more guns into more hands and abbott famously tweeted that he was embarrassed that texas was second behind california for new gun purchases. he urged texans to pick up the

pace, get more guns. he along with the former president trump and senators john cornyn an ted cruz are scheduled to speak at the national rifle association's 2022 annual meeting on friday in houston. joining me now texas congressman joaquin castro. congressman castro, thank you for being here. it is -- it is the worst kind of deja vu to have to have this conversation with you because it feels like it's a conversation that leads nowhere. i don't know how many kids have to die before someone wants to do something about it, but i want you to just talk about this community which is very near the community that you represent. what are they dealing with going through, what is happening and i just want you to talk? >> well, joy, just like every american just heartbroken at this tragedy today and uvalde is about 75 miles from my house, and it's kind of the midway point when you go from san

antonio to highway 90 towards dell ryo and the u.s.-mexican board, and it's a tight-knit community, you know, just people -- it's a kind of place where most people know each other, and, you know a small town friendly place. it's overwhelmingly mexican american. it's almost 80% mexican american, and i couldn't help when i heard the news but think about those parents who dropped their kids off at school this morning the way i did. i have a 6-year-old and an 8-year-old, i dropped them off at elementary school, and the fact that they won't be picking their kids up, they didn't get a chance to pick their kids up this morning was the last time they saw their kids alive and, you know, you wonder, you know, what possesses somebody to go gun down 15 people much less, you know, 14 little kids but that also as a society you wonder what -- what possesses us to enable through our laws somebody to do that, to have

weapons of war that allow somebody to kill people, you know, a bunch of people in a matter of seconds before people can even turn around, before you even have a chance to respond, you know. texas -- >> i apologize for having to interrupt you, congressman, but you'll understand this. the vice president of the united states kamala harris is speaking now, and she is going to address this shooting so let's listen to vice president harris. >> thank you. thank you. what an incredible room, and judy, thank you for that introduction and for your leadership on so many levels. tonight's a rough night. we planned for a great celebration, but i'm sure most of you have heard the tragic news about what has happened in texas, so i had prepared comments about tonight which i will speak, but i just first want to begin by saying a few word about the tragedy that

occurred today in uvalde, texas. as many of you know, the reports are that it was a mass shooting at an elementary school, and the preliminary reports are that 14 children have been killed and the details are still coming in and, of course, the president and i are monitoring the situation closely, so while we don't know all the details yet, we do know that there are parents who have lost children, families that have lost children and their loved ones, of course, and many others who may have been injured, so i would normally say in ma mom like this we would all say naturally that our hearts break, but our hearts keep getting broken. you know, i think so many -- there's so many elected leaders

in this room, you know what i'm talking about. every time a tragedy like this happens, our hearts break, and our broken hearts are nothing compared to the broken hearts of those families, and yet it keeps happening so i think we all know and have said many times with each other enough is enough. enough is enough. as a nation we have to have the courage to take action and understand the nexus between what makes for reasonable and sensible public policy are to ensure something hike this never happens again. so the president will speak more about this later, but for now i will just say to the people of

uvalde, please know that this is a room full of leaders who grieve with you, and we are praying for you and we stand with you and it is difficult at a time like this to think about much else, but i do look around this room and i know who is here and i know this is a room full of american leaders who know and have the courage to take a stand and so let us tonight as we doer time we all get together recommit ourselves to having the courage to take action, and so that does bring me to the leaders who are in this room and the leaders of apaics. >> vice president kamala hey, and i want to note for everyone, and can you see the signs behind you, she's speaking the at the asia-pacific mesh institute for

congressional studies, the organization she's speaking in front of, in d.c., their awards gal, a. she went there to speak about asian american and pacific islander community leadership, and can you see that that was the speech she hadn't prepared to give but like all of us plans change when little kids get mowed down at an elementary school in this case in the state of texas. i want to bring in representative joaquin castro. i interrupted you and the i also want you to finish and i would love for you to expound upon -- i mean, you serve in the house of representatives where common sense gun reform has been passed year after year after year after year only to die in the united states senate, and two of the senators who have killed it are the two senators from texas, senator cornyn and senator ted cruz who offered the usual thoughts and prayers today, paper statements. ted cruz made some comments about protecting the rights of gun owners. they have refused to do anything

to stop the next elementary school from getting shout, and they are more passionate about protecting the rights of gun owners about protecting, at least that is the appearance, because that's where their passion seems to be, so i would love for you to talk about that, of being a legislator who is actually trying to legislate this issue and it gets stopped in the other body by the other party. >> i think you're right, joy. i mean, we've tried on universal background cheques. we've tried to make it harder for people who are meantry unfit to get weapons. republicans have made it easier. weave tried to take weapons of war off the street, and each of those initiatives, each of those pieces of legislation has been stopped cold by the republican majority. you know, they have tried in the house and they have done it in the senate, and, you know, when these things happen over and over and over again, and, you know, we just went through buffalo. texas had the massacre few years

ago. we've had shootings in florida and texas and connecticut. you know, it's hard not to reach the conclusion at some point that, you know, that -- that there are policy-makers who are okay with this happening because they are not doing anything about it. they are not trying to do anything about it, and yet, you know, again here, just like sandy hook where you had many kids killed, you have 14 kid killed, so what is the congress going to do about it, and what is the texas governor and the legislature, what are they going to do about it? greg abbott made the state more dangerous over the last few years by allowing for permitless carry, basically no questions asked carrying a gun, you know, and it's made the state more dangerous, and so, yeah, i mean, people are frustrated with congress and think congress is worthless because congress hasn't done anything, but there are many of us who have tried to do something. but as you know, this is a representative democracy.

it's not a monarchy. we can't force republicans to vote a certain way, you know, and they stall reform every time. >> i want to -- you know, my wonderful assistant just sent me some numbers, you know. every time research does these numbers about the shootings that take place around the world, by their count and we'll -- we'll go and look and verify this, the united states is by far the place where it's the most dangerous to send your child to school, 288 in 2022 school shootings. as you mentioned, this community, uvalde, is very close to the mexican border. you know how many school shootings were in mexico so far this year? eight, eight, so just across the border it's 288-8 by this count from every town. i mean, and every other country you can go all the way down through turkey and even russia, and it's single digits. it's only the united states that are in the triple digitsbled a

the year is not even over. we're not even into june, so, you know, i'm going to give you the last word on this. what would you say to ted cruz in response to his thoughts and prayers and to -- let's not let john cornyn off the hook. >> i would ask our senators and the united states senate to listen to the american people. the american people have actually made up their minds on this issue. 930% of the american people, that means republicans and democrats alike, overwhelmingly support things like universe a.m. background check. it's the politicians like john cornyn and ted cruz who are not listening to the american people. they should listen to their constituents. >> including the vast majority of gun owners, the vast majority of gun owners support background cheques because they understand that a firearm is not a toy. it's something that's -- that's

an awesome responsibility toll have, and when you get a background check you get licensed, you get trained. you learn how toll use, it store it, how not to shoot yourself accidentally with it. you learn the gravity of it and the fact that texas is saying no, just go ahead and have one. i don't even know what to say. congressman joaquin castro. thank you. i'm joined by the former chief of detroit police as well as detroit public school and the former assistant director for counterintelligence at the fbi. i am going to start with you, frank, just for a moment to talk about the ways in which you would back into investigating an incident like this in which the shooter is dead. how do you even begin to fill out how and why someone could kill their own grandmother and then go, you know, mow down more than a dozen little kids. i don't know how you get in the mind of somebody when would do

this, but how would you investigate this crime? >> sadly we have too many sim layer shootings. we need to look at the shooter's life including mental history, physical health history, interactions with classmates, teachers, counselors. extensive amounts of interslews andries search history and ratings. they almost had all present, and i always use these traj you can moments to remind viewers that we're got to take responsibility which we can do which is understand the warning signs and indicators that someone is on the path towards violence, because increasingly, joy, americans are killing each other

at record-setting rates. the fbi just yesterday came out with its an dwrul report on active shooter incident, and the numbers also stagger. . there's an over 96% increase over the last five years and the death count for each of those is going up which means acguess to assault weapons. boy, it's going to keep happening until we do something about it. >> that's the thing, chief godby. i spoke with my youngest child and noted for me, and he's right, so many of these, you know, murders, mass murders, they are 18, 19 years old. there are troubled 18 and

19-year-olds all over the world. the lockdowns and covid restrictions took place not just in the united states but all or the world. people play video games all over the world. people have mental issues all over the world. nothing else is different about the united states, right, which is the most violent non-war torn country on earthch the only thing that distinguishes us from all those other countries where they have the same kind of teenagers and the same kind of young adults, they have the same kind of everything is the access to assault weapons. that's the only difference. there are more guns here than people, amend it's easier to get them here than anyelse in the world. there isn't anything else that distinguishes the united states so i wonder for you, you know, as a former police chief noting that just literally today one of the buffalo super market victims

were buried today. not all of the victims were buried, and there's yet another one. i wonder at some point does law enforcement demand gun reform because law enforcement also has to be out there in these streets dealing with a population so many of which are armed to the teeth. that can't be good for law enforcement either. >> absolutely not. and, joy, you make some astute points and as always asking the right questions, and not only to boot over 400 million weapons that are traceable, but you have ghost weapons, but let's be conservative and say if we have six shots per weapons, you're talking about billions of opportunities to end a life, so law enforcement, we really do have to be much more vocal and vocalized about the proliferation of guns. even if you can't be altruistic and look at the benefits for the community, officers have to face

this every day, you know, but, what juxtaposes that position, number one, with hold the second ament sacrosanct as if we hold that in a higher regard than the toria, the holy koran and the bible. the constitution is amendable and until reasonable people, and unfortunately, i don't know if it will happen in my lifetime, take a look at the proliferation of guns and the love of guns and the lowest common denominator is the proliferation of weapons, again, like you said, you have mental health issues all across the world. you have anger and fights all across the world. the lowest common denominator in the united states of america is the proliferation of guns. i mean, and if we didn't make a change after new town, connecticut, if we didn't make a change after columbine and didn't make any changes after buffalo, new york, even though it's fresh in our minds, what gives us any hope that a

feckless congress is going to do anything that's bought and paid for by the national rifle association? >> absolutely, and, you know, frank, you know, i've been to mexico. i've been to south africa. i've been to europe. there is no country on earth where i ever worry i can get shot here, but here in the united states you can get shot in the wal-mart. you can get shot in the topps supermarket. your kids can get shot at school, not just high school but elementary school. there's nowhere you can be safe in this country. it's not clear, right, whether you're in a red state, blue state, because each in the blue state they are bringing in ghost guys from the easy-to-purchase gun state, trekking them in where they are easy to get. there's nowhere where you might feel safe from a mass shooting, even if you're a child, frank. i just want to go through a couple of things that went no effect. this is just in texas, and i'll

let both of you comment on this. i'll start with you, frank. in september of half year, just in texas, texas put in a law that would let most texans as we heard the congressman say carry handguns in public without going through any training or ever having to get a gun permit. the law dubbed the second amendment sanctuary state stops them from enforcing new gun law, a law exempting firearms suppressor that remain in texas -- that remain in texas and federal law and regulations, allowing hotel guests to carry and store their firearms and ammunition in their hotel room, a law that removes the requirement that hand guns must be carried in a shoulder or belt holster, expanding what kinds of holsters are least. could i keep going o.they have allowed texans to carry guns in church in, synagogues and places of worship and allowed texans to carry guns in a state of disaster, they have banning

store owners from storing their guns or ammunition in the parking lot of the school, and one more for you. in 2016 they passed a law allowing people to openly carry weapons into a mental health hospital. that's where you really want to have lots and lots of guns that you can drop or forget to unload. your thoughts. >> let's make no mistake about this. more guns equal more shootings, period. the date sax there. if you look at the background check numbers over the last two year, the mandatory federal broc ground cheques, texas doesn't want to do a background check on you, but the federal background cheques have gone up in the last few years by millions, that's millions more weapons being purchased, and those are just the background cheques that we know about because, why? because many guns are purchased without ever requiring a background check because we know

congress has yet to close the gun show loophole. now you -- you asked a question just a minute ago about, hey, isn't it time for law enforcement to step up and say something about what they have to encounter on the streets every day, so listen to this. the september 1st law that you just cited in texas where no license, no permit, no training required, the largest law enforcement organization in the state of texas came out publicly and said to the governor we oppose this move. it's going to make luv more dangerous for cops and for citizens. so that's the largest law enforcement association in the state of texas, so the cops get it. they have to deal with it it every time they pull over a car, every time they respond to a call for service. they understand it, they are coming out publicly against it and our lawmakers are ignoring their own police officers. they are ignoring their own

police officers and ignoring 75% of people who own firearms in this country. yes, people have to have a loy sense and know what they are doing with this firearm. ralph god if i and frank, thank you very much. let's bring in morgan chesky. we joins us now from uvalde. i'll let you tell us what's happening. >> i'm sorry, it's not a good evening. we arrived several hours ago. there's pain everywhere in this up to. we're across the street from the robb elementary school and there's a massive law enforcement primp ter that have gone up around it and hundreds of officers have descended on this town of 15,000 people that's the scene of a massive investigation following an unspeakable tragedy. behind this elementary school, joy, police say an 18-year-old gunman who lived in this community walked in around 11:30 this morning with a handgun and

potentially a rifle. that's where he opened fire and according to governor greg abbott he killed 14 elementary school students and a teacher and in case you're wondering how tight knit is, when i parked on in block, i asked a gentleman sitting in front of his home and he asked me why i'm here, he said the teacher that was killed in the school was my niece. this is a town where everybody knows everybody and everybody felt safe until today, and right now we don't note motive of this gunman. we are hoping to find out more in an update from officials here within the next few hours, but as investigators pore over this scene inside and outside this elementary school, there's a civic center about a quarter mile from where i'm standing where they made it a reunification site so all of the students who for hours today huddled with teachers, quietly inside their school as they had potentially trained for in the

past, they were taken to this civic center where frantic parents rushed up to make sure that their child was still alive, that they were okay today. we spoke to one gentleman there, joy, who arrived at the elementary school earlier today because he wanted to give his wife flowers. it wasn't just her last week of school this week, it was her last week of school ever. she was retiring two days from now and he says he had just walked out of the school when he heard pop, pop, and he knew something had gone horrifically wrong, and from there we have just heard update after update that only makes that tragedy more heartbreaking, and right now there are so many questions out there, but the one thing we know is that what took place this morning here in uvalde, texas, has created just a gutting feeling in this town. authorities do believe that this gunman acted alone and they do say he is deceased and right now. i think a lot of people are

just trying to wrap their head around what exactly took place. when you see this happening in other communities across the country, unfortunately, it's one thing and then the people that we're speaking to here are finding out it's entirely different when it happens in your own backyard. indeed. >> morgan chesky. a harrowing report. it's not a good evening. really appreciate you. want to bring in sharon watts, founder of moms demand action. shannon, you have the most difficult job in the world, that you have to constantly convince normal human beings that we shouldn't let our kids get slaughtered in school and yet as somebody -- you joe, jemel hill noted it, the most prescient tweet in the history twitter, somebody had tweeted if sandy hook didn't to it, nothing was ever going to do it, you know.

those 6 yearlies and their teachers, you know, 6-year-olds got mode down in sandy hook and america shrug it had off and moved on and now more little kids. i can't imagine what you're thinking this evening, but, please, try to tell us if you can. >> well, first of all, just utter devastation for this community in texas, you know. as you said, we are just watching people be buried who were shot and killed by a white supremacist in a mass shooting in buffalo less than ten days ago. this is outrageous, but what makes it even more outrageous is that we know how to stop it. we know how to keep black people from being killed while they grocery shop. we know how to keep second graders from being slaughtered in an elementary school in america. the data shows us how to stop it. these aren't acts of nature. these are manmade acts of inaction, of cowardice, of corruption by lawmakers who

refuse to act, and i thought it was very prescient that amanda gorman said it takes a monster to kill children, but to watch monsters kill children again and again and do nothing isn't just insanity, it's inhumanity. what does it mean if you are a lawmaker that has the power to stop this and you do nothing? what does that say about you? >> let me go through some of the top recipients of ra money and the nra, let's just be clear. they are not about gun safety anymore like they started with. they are not about gun reform when they were very much in fair of when they wanted to disarm the black panthers. mitt romney, just to make y'all clear, it's not just the wild maga faction that's taking this blood money it's also myth romney, number one. $thrown million. richard burr north carolina, number two, roy blunt, cory

gardner got booted out. marco rubio right there at number four. you keep going down. ted cruz isn't even in the top ten. he's like way down. they are all fighting to get some of these coins. that's what they care about, ron johnson, marsha blackburn, josh hawley, i could read them all off. many up for re-election in this cycle and maybe the next. is there a reason that politicians don't seem to pay much of a price for accepting the money of the nra? a bunch of them are speaking at their conference right there in houston on friday. >> yeah. you know, it is just shocking that they continue to have a stranglehold from the gun lobby, and as you said some of them will be speaking at the nra annual leeting this weekend and i guarantee you those leaders who are speaking, guns will not be allowed inside the venues and that's because they are scared they might be shot and yet they

do nothing when children are shot inside their schools or black people are shot inside a grocery store or the everyday gun violence. everyday shootings kill 110 people and wound hundreds more that's tearing at the fabric of our communities. look, i don't know that i predicted ten years ago when i started moms demand action as a full-time volunteer that is that what would shapp that the nra would lose power and its right wing agenda would be co-opted by extremists and white supremists and misonlynists and bigots who would make it an organizing principle around their work and any lawmaker that stands with a gun lobe needs to realize they are standing with that specific right wing extremist agenda. >> indeed, amen. shannon watts, thank you for all that you do and thanks for being here this evening. joining us houlian castro, former secretary of housing and urban development. had your brother on earlier. thanks for being here, secretary

cassie trop. i asked him about being a legislator and how frustrating it might be to actually pass gun reform over and over again and vote for it and do what's right for your community and care so much about your community, in this case, you know what, did he say, half an hour from where these too many died and have it go nowhere. i want to play you a couple of politicians on the senate side which is where the bills go to die. let's start with ted cruz. this is ted cruz talking today about this shooting. >> we know from past experience that the most effective tool for keeping kids safe is armed law enforcement on the campus. you know, inevitably when there's a murder of this kind, see politicians trying to politicize it. you see democrats and a lot of folk in the media whose immediate solution is to try to restrict the constitutional rights of law-abiding citizens. that doesn't work. >> think about the real victims

here. now sheer senator from another state, chris murphy, whose state of connecticut was home to the sandy hook master in 2012. look at the difference in passion between ted cruz and chris murphich here's chris murphy. >> sandy hook will in ever be the same. this community in texas will never ever be the same? why? why are we here if not to try to make sure that fewer schools and fewer communities go through what sandy hook has gone through, what uvalde is going through. our heart is breaking for these families. every ounce of love and thoughts and prayers we can send we are spending, but i'm here thon this flor to beg, toly rally get down on my hands and knees and beg my colleagues. find a path forward here. work with us to if find a way to

pass laws that make this less likely. >> senator castro, both of these men are human beings. they are both fathers. they both have families and have little kids in their lives. can i not stand to see a little kid cry. people love children. they are both presumably. why is it that these texas senators lack -- don't have the passion that this man chris murphy has, this senator has? do you understand it? i can't understand it. >> well, i don't, except to say that the contrast couldn't be clearer. when you have senator murphy who also has the heart and also a mind to try to fix this problem and hasn't forgotten why he's there, to try to keep the people of his state and of the country safe and do what it takes to many recall protect children, what you hear is his tone, what you have in ted cruz is someone

not the least bit interested in trying to make this situation before. it's parroting the nra talking points, bought and paid for by the national hockey association. he's opening that this all blows over and then we go back to the status quo. what we need are more legislators, especially on the republican side, who are there to do the right thing and are able to find the moral coverage to buck the nra and buck the political contributors and finally take some common sense gun reform measures, even if we just start with universal background cheques. 90% of americans say we need. they need to get started. >> it would be -- that seems so logical and, you know, i don't understand why the mass death of children does not move people to action, but then again i don't understand why millions of people dying from covid didn't move people either. i want to bring in matthew dowd, the founder of country over

party. thanks for being here. you live in the great state of texas. you're a textan. do you understand it, because i see chris murphy's passion, and that's how i feel, and i feel like that's how 90% of people feel when a bunch of little children get shot down in school and then ted cruz comes on, tweets out his thoughts and prayers tweet, maybe a staffer, and he said whenever these things happen everybody wants to come for the guns, yeah, we're not going to do that. i don't get it, do you? >> you only get it if you know that people like ted cruz are completely unprincipled who i know and he's xlitly unprincipled in this point in time ant doesn't really have a great deal of empathy in any part of -- in any part of his body. i mean, what we're arrived at. this is unbelievably tragic. and i'm glad julian is on, who has grew up and lived not many miles from the great

community of uvalde. it's a beautiful place. wonderful people. 80, 70% hispanic. it is that until we hold them accountable people hike ted cruz will keep doing it. i mean. i'm a gun owner as i told you before on this. i have two rifles and we're all for it. >> a lot of people want gun reform with no loopholes they want red flag laws so that if someone is nope ton violent the judge can remove a weapon from

their home. a lot of us want it, and the problem is the leadership we currently have in the state does not reflect the desires and dreams of the majority are of texans and that's on us. that's on us to sort of do something about it. now, texans are going to have a very clear choice, and you just take this up issue in particular. you're going to have a very clear choice in november between what greg abbott does which is ease access, allow anyone any time to carry gun and beto o'rourke who want to do something, at least the basic things about gun reform to try to keep things from happening. we're at a time, this is so heart wrenching, we're at a time when we have a political party and leaders in texas who value guns more than life, and that's the most simple way to say it. they do not value life in the same value that they value access to guns, and i guarantee you something, joy, and julian probably knows this as well.

i guarantee you what's going to come out of their mouths soon is they are going to, one, try to blame it on the border. two, they are going to say let's arm teachers, and i think already the attorney general who is on the ballot today is saying this. arm teachers or, three, create fortresses at our schools. they are not ever going to talk about what the problem is which is access to guns. which is access to guns without cheques and without mental health confirmation and that's what you're going to hear from the republicans. they will divert it so they don't have to talk about the real problem which is access to guns. >> secretary castro, i'm sorry, but they will try that without any data because i just read this stat and i i'll say it again. school shootings by country. you want to make it sound like the problem is coming or the boarder from mexico, good luck with that. 288 school shootings in the united states thus far this year. 8 in mexico, 8.

we are scores of magnitude more dangerous on this side of the border than that one, maybe mexico should build a wall to keep the american mass shooters out because that would actually be more logical. >> joy, one thing, add canada should build a wall. you know how many gun -- victims of gun violence last year, 900 people were killed by gun violence last year. 30,000 in america. >> you know how many were killed in canadian schools, two. so it's 228-2. yeah, they should build a wall. they'd be safer. we are the ones who should be on the other side of the wall. i'm going to let you have the last word on this, julian castro. >> yeah. they will do everything that they can to deflect, to distract, to turn people's attention away from the real problem which is easy access to guns. they have been telling this big lie, big myth about guns, that the more guns that we have available, the safer that we're going to be, that you just need good guys with guns against bad

guys with the guns or as ted cruz said in his sound bite, have an armed guard there. in all of these situations where you have more guns, whether it's el paso or just last week in buffalo where you had an armed security guard who did shoot back at the shooter, that did not deter these folks from taking those guns and shooting up and killing so many people including today 14 chirp and one adult. more guns is not the answer. we need to enact common sense gun safety, and until they are ready to grapple with that, i think that they should be booted out of office and texans have a very clear choice in november because a governor who made the situation worse and has helped enable the kind of thing that happened today and a candidate in beto o'rourke who actually wants to take some of these common sense gun reform measures and still recognize the second amendment and what the supreme court has said on it. >> thank you both. julian castro -- i think you guys are going to stay with us.

i'm not letting you both go. gentlemen, please stay with me for a emt movement i want to do a little quick news update. spokesman for texas state senator roland gutierrez says that he spoke with a texas ranger and the news is not good. they have now said that 18 children and three adults have been killed. it is unclear whether or not the shooter is included in that list of deceased adults. i want to also let you know that we're waiting on a press conference that could take place any moment which is going to give us even further updates. so we're waiting for somebody to walk up to that mic phone, when that happens i will rudely interrupt my friends matthew dowd and julian castro but i want to let you all continue your thought, and i think i stopped you, julian castro, and i'll let you go first. when i was living in florida with my kids, raising our kids there, we didn't purchase guns at that time because we were

afraid our kids would find them and accidentally hurt each other and then have to live with that for the rest of their lives and i couldn't have lived with myself. i'm not anti-gun. i've been through the training, licensing and all that have stuff. it is so key because it teaches you to respect firearms. they are an awesome responsibility. they are not a toy that you can leave around your home. they had a security guard at our kids' school. she was a wonderful police officer, armed police officer who used to teach soccer. they had her do double diet, bewe always knew if we got that text or call that we have have to go to a nearby park and stand in that park and wait for our name to be called to know whether or not our children were alive or dead if there was a school shooting. that was a part of my third grader's, fourth grader's, fifth grader's growing up lives. there's no country on earth that's not at war. i think about ukraine kids are

going through that kind of trauma, but a country not at war, julian castro, can you think of any other place where -- where children, part of their life is to think about going to a parc in a big group so that their mom and dad will know that they are not dead in a school shooting? >> that is uniquely american, joy, unfortunately, and, you know, i'm a parent of a seventh grader and a first grader. my son is 6 years old, and to think about this generation of children growing up every day, going through these drills from time to time, looking over their shoulder, wondering whether somebody is going to come into their classroom and harm them, and the trauma that they face day after day, thinking about that especially after something like this. as a parent this is your worst nightmare to get that call and to have to wait and to wonder whether your child was injured

or even worse killed and this is who we are now. we thought this would be over and finally at sandy hook. finally republicans in washington, d.c. would take the steps necessary to start making this less and less likely and it didn't happen, and since that time we've seen so many other incidents. buffalo last week and today in uvalde, it still hasn't happened. let's get a update on the shooting. >> appreciate your statement. here to make a statement and not take questions is the uvalde chief of police.

i apologize. i did not realize we were not on. i'm the executive director of communications and marketing for uvaldecisd. this is a tragic time in our district so please know the investigation is not complete. we will only be sharing a statement with you, not providing questions. we greatly appreciate your patience and understanding. here to share the statement and not take questions is our uvalde cisd chief of police pete arenado. >> again, good evening. briefly as of now we're still working on this active investigation. once we're able to provide information to the families we will do so first and foremost obviously. our priority is to get information to our families and give them some information, so please bear with us in regards to that.

secondliance, once we do get information that we can release to the public we'll be doing that. once we do get some information we will share that with you and call another press conference. let me assure you the intruder is deceased and we're not actively looking for another individual or any other suspects in this case. we definitely ask y'all to keep the family, the familiar tlas are involved in your prayers. thank you so much. leer to provide a statement and not teak any questions is our superintendent dr. harold. >> good evening. this was a tragic and senseless event today, and my heart is broke today. our hearts and thoughts and prayers are with all our families as we go through this day and days to come. a few announcements that we need to make is beginning tomorrow at 10:00 a.m. weal have grief counseling an support at the civic center for our students,

our staff, community members, anybody that needs to come at that time are and we may be there one day or several days. our robb staff will meet at 8:00 a.m. at pacific center as well. we'll begin visiting with them, and -- and we'll see what those needs r.school will be closed. the school year is done. we'll have no school tomorrow or thursday. all activities are canceled throughout the district. no graduation is on people's mind. we'll come out with a notice on that at a later time. all the staff members, they will report to their campuses, the robb campus which will come to the civic center. again, my heart was broken today. we're a small community and we'll need your prayers to get us through this. thank you. 'll need your prayerst us through this. thank you. >> again, this is a tragic event in our community.

we are very sorry that we cannot provide you more information but greatly appreciate your patience and understanding during this very difficult time. we ask that you pray for all of the families affected. thank you and be safe. lies affe. thank you and be safe. julián castro and matthew dowd, i want to thank both of you. that was the superintendent of schools, how will harold, who announced that schools will be closed. that's a, school is done for the rest of the school year. before him, you heard the police chief for uvalde, who gave us some of the updates on the shooting, we do now know that it is 18 -- 18 students -- who were killed. i want to thank matthew dowd and julián castro for being here. i want to now welcome nikole, founder of sandy hook promise. she lost her six-year-old son

in the sandy hook shooting. nicole, i cannot imagine -- i cannot imagine how you feel right now. please share with us what these parents are dealing with. >> i -- i can only speak for my own experience and the shock that overtook me. i don't think that any of these parents have any idea what has just happened. and what is to happen in the days and weeks to come. this is just not normal, this is not natural in any way, shape or form. this is not something that you think about. we know there have been so many shootings. no one expects to take their child to school in the morning and then never to see them again. no one expects their child to be skilled killed in circumstances like this or in any other circumstance. so, i know i shut down after the murder of dylan.

it was several days before i could do anything. and even right now, i am feeling in shock yet again. i'm just reliving that day and thinking about what the families in that community are going through right now. >> i can only imagine. it is -- our children are supposed to bury us, right? that is the deal. that's what it is supposed to be. sandy hook was host to be the last time this ever happened. because people were supposed to be in such utter shock that even surely the most pro-nra politicians would pass the laws we needed to pass. how does it strike you, as somebody who lost a baby, a child, a six-year-old in sandy hook, that since then, there is nothing. nothing. at the state level --

some states, like colorado and others -- but at the national level, there is nothing. >> you said sandy hook should have been the last. sandy hook should never have been the first. indeed. it is just not right. and when i think about -- this is when we are going to start hearing all the scenes from the messaging coming out. >> yep. >> we will hear from all the politicians who voted no on simple measures, offering thoughts and prayers, but with no actions. we will hear politicians talk about how it is too soon and how others are politicizing, yet at the same time they will be talking about the need to arm people, having more on security guards. that is then politicized in the situation. we are going to hear the same rhetoric. and unfortunately, one of the things that has changed, since sandy hook, is the divisiveness that has grown in this country.

and so much in the last ten years. so, while i am hopeful and all of us will be hopeful that there is going to be change, i just don't know how many people and how many children have to die before politicians stop caring as much about their political careers as they do about their constituents and the lives of the children where they live, and where they grow up. because the shootings are everywhere. >> yep. >> and it is just -- i don't know how they look themselves in the mirror most days. there are some courageous people there. and there are a lot of people that i just wonder sometimes if they even have a soul. it is ridiculous. and things will change. but i also think that i am not relying on congress to make those changes. i am looking for the people. and i am looking at --

this is a generation, when i think about sandy hook ten years ago, that these are kids who have only known this, their entire life, school shootings. and the psychological trauma of that and the impact of that, they are the ones that are going to create the change. because our congress is not going to do it for them. but these kids that, for over a decade now, we have traumatized through our inaction, they are the ones who are going to be shaped by the fact that we did nothing. >> the parkland kids, who i adore, who grew up 15 minutes from where i was raised in florida. they were the sandy hook kids ten years older. you know? they were the sandy hook kids. >> right. >> we seem to have learned nothing. i want to read you something that senator chris murphy, who is the most passionate -- because when we say we are giving up on congress, let's just be clear. democrats in congress have passed gun reform repeatedly.

it is not the house of representatives that is not trying to do it. democrats and housekeeping to pass these bills. it is the senate. and the senate is maybe ten or 11 votes. we cannot always count on the senator from west virginia. we are 11 senators away. in a country of 327 million people -- we are 11 people away from getting the gun reform that would at least -- it can't change or give any meaning. it is senseless what happened to your baby. but at least it would mean that maybe there would not be another man that has to deal with what you are dealing with. we are 11 people away! y'all, this is not impossible. we just need to replace 11 people out of 100 senators. and then you could have change. i want to read you what senator chris murphy said. he is a good guy, he is trying. he said, as he is walking off the house of the senate floor, he said spare me the bs about mental illness. we do not have any more mental illness than any other country in the world. you cannot explain this to the prism of mental illness because

we don't. we are not an outlier on mental illness. what do you say to the people who are trying to get the mental illness excuse when these massacres happen? because it is true. there is mental illness all of the world, there is video games, mental illness. there is isolation, in sales, everything. the massacres are only happening here. >> i agree. and there are solutions that we can do in terms of someone who is troubled because we know -- we know -- that there are signs that come out. there are events that escalate into these things. people do not just snap and then take their weapons and kill other people. especially going into an elementary school -- that is not an everyday behavior. however, chris murphy is absolutely right. he is a champion. it is about the access to weapons. so, the 11 people that you are talking about, obviously background checks is something that has been debated and there is not even a bill on the floor right now, as i understand it, in the senate to even have that

debate. so, that is an action that can be taken. there are also message like measures like safe storage. how are children getting their hands on these weapons? it is not about taking away the guns. it is about being responsible with who can access them and at what point. and i still do not understand some of the weapons of choice of mass shooters. i don't know which weapons the shooter used. but i am sure that we will learn more as the investigation comes out. but there are significant actions that congress can take and that should be bipartisan. because it is about -- it is really about being people partisan, it's about doing what is needed for people to live their lives. living free and happy and living out their lives. habut i also think that there is no more that can be done as well. i am not just relying on congress because i think this is a behavioral thing as well.

and we cannot legislate for behavior but we can certainly enforce behavior change that we want to see. >> indeed. we have heard some really innovative solutions put out there. making gun owners who want to buy ar-15s -- short, by one, but you have to take out insurance. and take responsibility. you can purchase an ar-15 for an 18 year old, then you ought to be responsible. you cannot just by a kid a gun or a teenager a gun. if you do that, okay, you do that. but then you need to take out some liability insurance. there are things you could do that are not about confiscation -- because you cannot confiscate 400 million guns. it's just not possible and no one wants to do that. i will give you the final word here. if you could speak to these moms and these dads that are, in your position now, in uvalde. if you could give them more, it's what we say to them? >> give yourself the space and

patients to find a way through this. it is a very dark path that you are entering that i cannot lie about. but there is always a way through it, threw it to something more positive. look to the people that love and support you. and embrace and take the embrace from your community, from those that want to help you. and from myself, i am certainly they are at anytime to be of any private or public assistance that can be of use. to share experience, to be a shoulder to cry, whatever you need. >> thank you nicole hockley, thank you and god bless you. this is not easy to do and thank you for doing it. we really appreciate you. and have a wonderful evening. as wonderful as can be had on a horrible night like this. that is tonight's reidout, our coverage of tonight school shooting continues next with chris hayes. chris hayes.