being with us on a day of a lot of breaking news coming in from that panel. i appreciate you all watching this hour of msnbc. good to be with you. you can find me every week night at 5:00 eastern and we'll join you for the january 6th hearings, but "deadline: white house" with nicole wallace starts right now. ♪♪ ♪♪ 4:00 in new york and even with the public hearings of the january 6th select committee well under way there is new evidence that keeps trickling out day after day against the disgraced, de-platformed ex president and the republican party. today republican congressman barry louder milk is back in

focus. the january 6th tour taking pictures of hallways, tunnels and staircases inside the capitol complex, clearly not normal tourist fare and there's more. the committee has also released video of that same man you saw there near the capitol on january 6th issuing violent threats against house speaker nancy pelosi. senate majority leader chuck shumer and other democratic members of congress. >> we're coming in like white on rice for pelosi, nadler, schumer, even you, aoc. we're coming to take you out and pull you out by your hairs. how about that, pelosi? >> we're coming to take you out. we'll pull you out by your hair. we made the decision to play the video to you at all, not to amplify the threats, but to present the powerful evidence in

the hands of the committee that refutes congressman loudermilk's previous forceful denials that he was not involved with tours of any insurrectionist in the run-up to january 6th. today loudermilk doubled down denying once again that he was involved in a reconnaissance tour saying this very careful, sort of weasely denial. >> nowhere where i went with the visitors in the house office buildings on january 5th were breached on january 6th and comma, to my knowledge, comma, no one in that group was criminally charged in relation to january 6th. the new video also seems to contradict findings by the u.s. capitol police that upon their review of surveillance footage, was there wasn't any evidence that loudermilk's tour was suspicious in light of the newly released video from the select committee. the january 6th select committee put out video as part of its

renewed mission and request for cooperation from loudermilk saying this in a letter, while we had hoped to show you the video evidence when you met with us, the select committee provides the video in question for your review, and linking to the video for all to see. the committee adds this, quote, the foregoing information raises questions the select committee must answer. we again, ask you to meet with select -- with the select committee at your earliest convenience. we will get a chance to ask congresswoman lofgren, a member of the 1/6 committee about it all later in the show and we start with some of our most favorite reporters and friends. carol leonnig is back and former assistant u.s. attorney for the southern district of new york and the former majority council during donald trump's first impeachment trial. he's now a candidate for congress in new york. msnbc legal analyst and former u.s. attorney joyce vance is here and pete strzok is here former fbi counterintelligence

agent. dan goldman, i start with you. this denial is so specific and so parsed, i'm not even sure the two parties are saying anything all that different at this point. >> in the legal world we call this a strawman. you set up an argument that was not made and then you knock it down. nobody said that the surveillance was of any place that was breached on january 6th and no one alleged that any of the people on the surveillance tour were charged criminally by the department of justice, yet that's what, of course, representative loudermilk wants to point out. the fact of the matter is that he issued a very thorough denial last time when the committee asked him to come testify before they, at that point, they said they had evidence that he led a tour. now that evidence has been released. he denied it. he said no, i did not, and what

we're seeing and i looked at that surveillance footage and it looks very familiar to me having worked there. i have no idea why anyone doing a tour of any congressional buildings, the capitol or otherwise would be taking photos of random staircases or security checkpoints the day before what was an insurrection. of course, yes, those places may not have ultimately been breached, but not perhaps for a lack of trying and maybe that was part of the effort was to figure out where those tunnels were because although we don't know exactly where the members of congress went, we are almost certain that they went down into those tunnels to escape the insurrectionists. so certainly having some understanding and knowledge of tunnels is someone who was planning to violently invade, he needs to tell the public what he

knows and what he did, and at a minimum, he should be referred to the ethics committee right away for an investigation into whether or not he should remain in congress. >> let me put the video up one more time. this is a video of a congressman's have saidors taking pictures of stairwells and doors. if there had not been a deadly insurrection on january 6th i think people would still want to know why tourists were taking photographs of stairways and doors. this isn't [ bleep ] crazy. this isn't some sort of a maniacal surveillance plan. this has nothing to do with tourism. there aren't even humans in the pictures, joyce vance. at what point does common sense require someone to say as a member of the body, you should want to come before us and tell us what your guests were doing filming stair welles and doors? >> common sense requires that at

this point. looking at this video, it's hard to understand how loudermilk continues to dodge answering questions about it and nicole, you and i have played this game before where we turn this into a situation with the democrats engaging in wrongdoing. the republicans demanding accountability. if some democratic congressman had been leading a tour where vulnerable security bottlenecks and other places in the capitol were being filmed and the following day there was a violent insurrection with someone saying that they would drag mitch mcconnell off the floor of the senate by his hair, you can be certain that there would be enormous pressure on that democratic leader to come in and testify. loudermilk to be an oath to uphold the constitution. he's obligated to come in and testify. you know, we've had this real problem with congress' inability to enforce its own oversight. it may be here that the ethics committee provide a better venue to get that done, but honestly,

if he won't testify he ought to be served with a subpoena and compelled. >> carol leonnig, what loudermilk hangs his refusal on is that he was cleared already. this is the statement from yesterday, quote, there's no evidence that representative loudermilk entered the u.s. capitol with this group on january 5, 2021. we train on officers on being alert for people conducting surveillance and reconnaissance and we do not consider the activities we observed as suspicious. do we know if they're looking at the same tape, carol? >> we don't know, but you have to presume that the select committee shared this information with capitol police, but honestly, nicole, there is pretty embarrassing for capitol police. everyone on this panel was talking about it shortly after with each of us about pelosi insisting that she had heard from other members in the days after january 6th that these tours had been given after the

building was closed on january 5th. it had been closed for covid and many democratic members were now very suspicious. why were these tours being given? you know, when i look at these video images, it's hard for me to imagine as this doesn't rate as suspicious. consider for a moment and these were not suspected insurrectionists. consider for a moment if these were people from islamic countries who were visiting our country. they would have been stopped and questioned by the fbi. what are you doing, sir? why do you have a camera here in a federal building and why are you taking these pictures? you know that would have happened and so this is pretty strange. i think this is also embarrassing for loudermilk for a couple of reasons. one is he tried to pretend high didn't give a tour with a parsed statement before, and now his parsed statement is that, well,

to my knowledge, none of these people were charged. that's not a very -- that's not a very high bar. the bar is you gave a tour, people were behaving in an obviously suspicious way to a reasonable man's test and now we'd like to know who were those people and since you're from georgia and you're a republican who objected to the certification of the election, were you aware of what they were talking about? did you know that they had said they wanted or at least one of the individuals said he wanted to make sure that he could take out members of congress? >> i mean, pete strzok, the thing i keep thinking about is they have a witness already. the 1/6 committee has a witness whose title is special assistant to the president for legislative affairs and her name is cassidy hutchinson and we already know that she testified to more than a dozen republicans being aware of some of the planning around

january 6th. why don't these republicans, why don't they take this seriously? why don't they take seriously the months' long collection of evidence and not pulling anyone by the hair, but from someone from deep inside the trump bat cave? >> i think they did it in part because they thought that one, they were terrified of what trump might say or the people around him and they thought they could get away with it. the january 6th committee releases information and you have all of these voices from the inside in private who were saying what everybody on the outside knew that, you know, whether it was the vote was not stolen, whether that trump, in fact, lost and you know, going up to and including with this tour. i did surveillance for 20-plus years. i did it when i was going in advance of conducting an arrest or conducting a search warrant, and i did it on the other side

who were surveilling things they shouldn't do. it was hard for me to look at this video and conclude that this was anything other than surveillance. so we're talking a lot about congressman loudermilk and there are folks that could be talked to and first and foremost are the people filming and photographing the stair welles and the security arrangements that lead into and out of the buildings. those people aren't protecting by free speech and debate protections and those were people who were back home who i would like to know and clearly you have not and the committee has not provided the gentleman's name and they can be approached and asked, what are you doing there? what did you do to that footage? who did you talk to before and after, getting the internet records, to make sure the files weren't affecting anyone else. i think part of the benefit of what's going on is as that information comes out, it is harder and harder for people to maintain some lie about what they were or weren't doing on

january 6th? >> the lies are even annihilated. i was not giving reconnaissance tours to insurrectionists is not true. the story changed, i was not giving tours to people who photograph from the surveillance tour ahead of the insurrection an area that was successfully breached of insurrectionists and nor am i aware of criminal charges levied on insurrectionists. that's the story today. i think we know enough about the 1/4 committee to know that is unlikely. this ends here. don't you already have enough reason to want to learn more and scrutinize this? >> nicole, one of the things we talked a lot in the first impeachment was the adverse interest -- adverse inference from refusals to cooperate and you can't do that in a criminal trial, but you can do that in the civil case and what that

means is if you refuse to testify, if you refuse to give information that the jury in that case or the judge can infer that whatever information you have is adverse to your interests and that's what we need to do here with representative loudermilk. that's what we need to do with the five other republican congressmen who have refused to testify to the january 6 committee even though we know that they have relevant information to what the committee is investigating and the only thing that we can, therefore conclude is that there are republican congressmen currently serving in congress who were complicit in donald trump's effort to overturn the election and perhaps in the invasion of the capitol on january 6th, they are still serving in congress. they are still voting, and they are still functioning members of that body and they undermine the credibility of that party every day and they undermine the

credibility of that party as a hopeful and constitutional part of our political system. it is an abomination. it's a shame, and it needs to be dealt with, if not by congress itself then by the american people. >> and i think we know, carol, that kevin mccarthy saw it that way for at least a few hours or a few days. the tapes that we have heard of him speaking with liz cheney, so maybe we know where the leads came from in terms of kevin mccarthy's fears about the danger that members of his own caucus represented to his own colleagues. talking about the rhetoric and the things they were saying and he was talking to scalise and liz cheney at least and we have tape of it. what do you think this represents in terms of the knowledge -- the knowledge at the time of the insurrection that some members of the republican caucus by word or deed were a threat.

. i think it's pretty powerful information because kevin mccarthy were on a hot mike, so to speak, but he was caught in the moment speaking the truth, and then later -- and this is not just a problem for him. it's a problem for a number of other members, lindsay graham comes to mind of people who sort of change their tune, change the story once the danger has passed and once they were less focused on life and limb and the possible, complicit role of their fellow republican members in helping donald trump try to drive a stake through democrat see and try to hurt his -- their fellow republicans, this complicit was a big deal at the moment when they were afraid for life and limb, but they changed their tune when that danger was

passed and they were focused on the political danger of not sticking with donald trump. as a piece of evidence you are so right to focus on it because it shows you that there was concern, was there suspicion even within the republican party. liz cheney said it best probably to jim jordan as we reported in our book, as she's crouched down on january 6th hiding in a series of pews. jim jordan decide as it female lawmakers need to be protected and pushed further back away from the ends of the aisles and she uses some epithets i won't say now, but essentially she says get the heck away from me you f-ing did this. so there was some strong belief within the gop because of communications they had with fellow lawmakers about who was participating in egging on this mob. now i'm not saying loudermilk has done that, but i'm saying he

has some questions to answer because the tape doesn't match what he described. >> speaking of tape, he was just caught on tape by some of my nbc news colleagues. let me play that for you, joyce. >> in the video, the conclusion of the individual taking photos of a security checkpoint in the basement and the capitol. >> what they were taking a picture of is i took the family and think, the other folks that were with him had two young kids that wanted to see the little trains that take congressmen. so i took them to show them where the trolley was in the rayburn tunnel. >> why do you think the pictures were taken of the stairwell, around security. if you go to the stairwell there's a golden eagle sconce. >> these are folks that had never been to washington, d.c., and they were here to visit their congressman. >> why not speak to the committee? >> because the committee's never called me and asked me anything.

>> they -- >> to who? >> your office never received it? >> no. never received a letter, never received a phone call. they send it to you guys i find out about it on my way to the airport a month ago, so when i get on the plane i see my picture on tv screens all over the plane as some evil conspirator. they're not interested in the truth. they're creating a narrative for you guys. there's nothing there. >> paging the postal service. i saw the address on the letter, and it certainly is his office building. what do we make of this denial that he was never contacted by the 1/6 committee. they didn't have any interest in talking to him, carol? >> you know, i find this interesting and it's a good window for the public into how lawmakers dive around things. first, he says they never contacted him and then he says he finds out about it while he's on a plane. so if he wanted to answer the

questions he had plenty of time to do so. if he didn't want to answer the questions then he should say why, and he's alleging at least at the end of this interview that he believes it's political and so his answers aren't important or it's not important to him to provide them. i have to say as a reporter and an invest 28ive reporter i want to give him the benefit of the doubt. is it possible that people were taking photographs of something that was off-camera that people can't see? let's look. let's find out. i want to bend to the possibility that there is nothing nefarious here and him answering the questions makes me feel like let's just get him up here and answer the questions and then it will all be put to rest. if there's no problem, there's no problem. >> i do not have any of those instincts, joyce, but i think if you wanted to clear your name among everybody you would send to the same press where you saw your picture, pictures of your

constituents' little tiny trains and the golden eagle sconce, and this would be over. why -- do innocent people have this difficult of a time proving their innocence, joyce? >> you know, carol's a much better person than i am. i don't find any credit in these excuses and one of the reasons is if you're taking those pictures for your kids, your kids are going to be in the pictures, and maybe it's unfair to draw this conclusion just from looking at the raw video, but it doesn't look like the kids are in any of those videos. it doesn't look like cameras are pointed at the sort of angle that would suggest those sort of pictures. most of us have been down in that part of the capitol and seeing it. there is an easy way, as you point out of making conclusions about what was going on here. partially, that's for the congressman to appear and testify under oath.

nothing that he said so far really holds water. in fact, the more he dissembles the more he looks like he has something to hide. as pete points out, there's another easy way to get at that and that's to have the folks on the tour come and answer questions. if they were taking pictures for their kids, they shouldn't be afraid to say that. i'd love to take a look at the meta data on their phones and see where those photos ended up. i'd love to see if similar photos ended up on cameras or on phones of any of the folks who were involved on january 6th, because there is a possible dark interpretation here. we've all heard that there was some suggestion that there would be a secondary attack that would go after memberses of congress as they were put into the tunnels. there was talk of gas, very hard to know if that was serious or if it was really planning or if that was just talk, but the fact that there are photographs being taken in areas that would access that part of the building are deeply disturbing and they

deserve more than an awe shucks and a shoulder shaking from a congressman who should be taking them more seriously. >> pete, especially because the tourists end up talkingbout grabbing ncyosi by her hair and taking her out of the capitol. they don't end up acting like normal tourists after their surveillance tour. >> they didn't go home and show their friends and neighbors the picture of the dark hallway nor the other footage that you showed that the committee released as they were marching to the capitol and they weren't showing you pictures of cute little trains and eagle sconces. they said nancy, we'll be on you like white on rice. clearly, their intention, and their actions the very following day speak directly to violence against the speaker of the house, aoc, senator schumer and

other folks who were clearly targets of their rage. now there's a question of did they actually go into the capitol or not? again, from a law enforcement perspective, that is a straightforward reason. one they believe would be plenty of information to predicate opening an investigation and a very reasonable thing for a couple of fbi agents to show up at a person's house and say, look, the congressman said this. we're just trying to explain, what can you take pictures of can you talk to us about what you did on january 6th and anything else that what joyce was just talking about. the congressman's explanation doesn't hold water especially with the people taking photographs. >> it is also the third version -- the first version is i did no such thing. the second version is i didn't do anything that resulted in an area that was breached and those people that i gave a tour to haven't been charged and the third thing was they were taking

pictures of teen trains and golden eagle sconces. so we'll see what the fourth story is. everyone sticks around. when we come back, steve bannon's role in the leadup to the insurrection has been of keen interest to the committee. he was back in court again trying to keep what he knew about the riot at the capitol a secret and how that's going next. a deal about gun makers on gun safety reforms is better than no deal, but is it enough? will it move the needle and will it keep people safer in any meaningful way on the extraordinary epidemic levels. later on the program, the far-right's grip on the gop continues to tighten squeezing out more anti-trump lawmakers and how the big lie features prominently in the midterm elections and all of that when "deadline: white house" continues after a quick break. stay with us. continues after a quick break. stay with us stories of bipolar depression. i just couldn't find my way out of it. the lows of bipolar depression can take you to a dark place. latuda could make a real difference in your symptoms.

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wa-hoo! ha ha! no! no ha ha! i told him that the stuff that his people were shoveling out to the public was [ bleep ]. that the claims of fraud were [ bleep ]. there was never -- there was never an indication of interest in what the actual facts were. in my opinion then and my opinion now is that the election was not stolen by fraud, and i haven't seen anything since the election that changes my mind on that including the 2,000 mules movie. [ laughter ] >> the laugh gets me every time, and i hope there's a drinking game for every time bill barr says b.s. that was former attorney general's bill barr's testimony to the january 6th committee.

we heard all of that earlier in the week about some of the claims being made of election fraud by trump and his allies, claims that the attorney general at the time found to be disturbing, crazy, laughable b.s., that ultimate truth telling didn't sit right with steve ban know no, the former trump adviser who faces trial next month for his own contempt of congress charges. well, bannon is now calling barr a liar and threatening litigation against him for blowing off bogus fraud claims. it's just the latest example of how the ultra-maga treats, i don't know, should we call it maga-light of actually telling the truth? watch. >> we're coming for you, bro. you're sitting there lying about this? this is the type of crap that we're stopping. you're not just going to sit there any phone this in and throw out a couple of lines and we'll deconstruct this and we'll come after you legally. we're not just going to sit here

anymore. >> huffing and puffing and he'll blow your house down. i guess people follow him and yet there are threats against the former attorney general who it would appear now telling the truth and helping the select committee. it all happens while at the same time a federal judge rejected steve bannon's latest attempt to get his doj indictment dismissed against his argument that the january 6th subpoena was illegal. the criminal referral of steve bannon for refusing to talk about a meeting he attended the day before the insurrection and comments he made that day about, quote, all hell breaking loose tomorrow. we are back with our panel. dan goldman, it's less interesting to me, i guess, that within the tarantula bowl that tarantulas are going to tarantula. what's interesting to me is judge after judge keeps affirming the subpoena power and legitimacy and that seems to have a longer term tentacle and

perhaps impact of any legal or criminal cases that emanate from it, no? >> well, it removes the obvious and persistent talking point from republicans who tonight want to go and testify that they claim it's partisan and improperly conceived committee and judge after judge has said no. it is perfectly legitimately conceived to issue subpoenas under congressional rules and congressional authority so then where do you go next? several republicans flout the subpoenas issued by their own body. so what does that mean? they're basically saying, okay. we have judges saying this is a lawful subpoena from my own body where i work, and yet i'm not going to accede to it and go

testify and they should expect it hear those arguments coming back that they made, but the broader point, nicole is that these investigations really help to drill down on is steve bannon is off on his own island doing whatever steve bannon does. he enjoys getting charged because it brings more attention to him in criminal courts, but the reality is and what we've seen in the first two hearings is republican after republican after republican testifying that donald trump was more or less off his rocker and that all these election fraud claims were completely bogus. this is not, you know, nancy pelosi saying that donald trump's election fraud claims were bogus. these are his own senior officials, his own white house officials, his own campaign officials basically everybody other than rudy giuliani and sydney powell said this was

complete bogus. that will have long-term ramifications, both, i think, for this committee, for senior members of congress involved in this and also potentially for a future criminal prosecution. >> carol, i picked up that there are some with the right adjective is, surprise or exasperation on the committee's part about how some of the witnesses are being received. i think it's legitimate that a lot of people are very skeptical of these witnesses, but i think from the committee's vantage point, they work so hard to get these witnesses to come in. it was touch and go that bill barr would participate and then they convince him to film the deposition and now they've been able to air it and the committee views it as one of the star witnesses of monday's hearing. what do you make of sort of being bill barr and now facing the ire of once or twice pardoned steve bannon on one side and the revulsion from the

left that he didn't speak up from the rule of law at any other point up until the coup plot. >> i'm going to take that in two parts. good questions. first off, i'm pretty sure bill barr doesn't care at all what steve bannon thinks or says, and recognizes him as a partisan whose fund-raising still all of his shrill commentary that you just played earlier is about raising hackles, raising money and continuing to beat the drum to stay relevant in his mode. as for, you know, liberals who are furious, he didn't step forward sooner. bill barr didn't make any bones of who he was. he was a partisan that wanted to see his president succeed and in 2020 as we've reported, repeatedly, he was getting fed up. not just that president trump was detached from reality, but

that he was consistently undermining the safety of the country. you know, even bill barr, it was too far for him to claim or stand by while the election was claimed to be rigged because that was going to hurt republicans in the long term, in his view, to question the integrity of the election with no credible evidence. i think one of the important strengths of bill bar's testimony whether you want to karate chop him, the strength of his argument is that he had a team. he deputized u.s. attorneys across the country and specifically in swing states with fbi agents to dig interest all of these claims that rudy giuliani kept throwing up on the wall like spaghetti, he had his team look at them and so when the president was in these private meetings saying, bill, why aren't you guys doing anything about this, he could

specifically lay out to him why these things were not possible. bill barr looked intently into the dominion software claim. remember the ghost of hugo chavez was, like, changing the votes from trump to biden in certain places? he actually looked into that nutty scheme and concluded that if there had been any fraud there would be paper ballots underneath that that they could audit and check to be sure that that had not happened and indeed, that's what they did. so his strength is he knew in real time, sorry, donald, no chance. no evidence and we've looked. >> yeah. i guess you could argue it either way, though, right? there's probably a whole other conversation for another day about using the justice department even ahead of the election to run down crazy stuff, but i think in bill barr's telling, i think he writes this in his book it's what he thought would give him the upper hand in telling trump

it was all b.s. we know that that didn't work either, but it is fascinating. carol leonnig, joyce vance, pete strzok, thank you for starting us off on another extraordinary day of revelations. when we come back, ten republicans and ten democrats appear to have found common ground on gun safety regulation. it's a step and a start. will the push for anything more significant go away now? we'll talk about what happens next. y now? we'll talk about what happens next

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if you're not going to outlie everything, you have to at least make it harder to get those -- those crazy guns that everybody's using. i don't think you should be able to just walk in there and buy one. you have to be able to go through a rigorous process to be able to buy something like that, i think. hopefully the people that get paid to make those decisions figure that out. my job is to play football, but hopefully the politicians can figure that one out. >> god bless him for using his platform to say that. that was cincinnati bengals quarterback joe burrow joining the chorus of voices in america calling for gun safety legislation particularly speaking there about the ar-15 style rifles and pushing congress, the guys who get paid to deal with this, to do something about the epidemic of gun violence in america. last night mitch mcconnell told reporters he would support the senate bipartisan deal on guns. it's the strongest indication yet that the deal could avoid the gop filibuster.

if it becomes law it would be the first major piece of federal legislation addressing gun violence since the year 1994. however, it does not do anything to address ar-15 style assault rifles like the ones used to kill 19 schoolchildren and two teachers in uvalde nearly one month ago now. joining me is shannon watts, founder of moms demand action for gun sense in america, and charlie sykes and msnbc contributor. what do you think of the legislation? >> the it is an important step and the fact that we're breaking this logjam, if we do and i think we will, is historic and we have to keep in mind that just a decade ago, about a quarter of all democrats in congress had an a-rating from the nra. today none do. the fact that republicans are in conversation with democrats and coming up with a framework that would save lives, it is very important and i want to keep in

mind that this legislation will save lives, whether it's close the boyfriend loophole or making it more strict for people who want to buy guns and red flag laws and giving money to the states to make those more robust. all of that will save thousands of lives and we can't lose sight of that. >> charlie, i'm of two minds. i was on the air when uvalde happened and as a country decide no one should have their hands on a weapon of war so heinous and then you run in and save children. that's what the weapons that are out there and to create new muscles and to have democrats and republicans that create gun safety legislation of all things that they don't agree on anything and it's hard for some republicans to answer who won the 2020 election. it's a pretty remarkable first step. >> no, i agree. it is nowhere nearly enough. it certainly does not solve the

problem and it's an important first step and i have to admit that i was wrong because i have the muscle memory of cynicism of watching congress fail over and over again to do something so this is an incremental step, and i'm happy to see the parties working together because what it does is it shows that you can actually enact remedies. they may not be solutions. they won't solve all of the problems, but at least that -- that momentum is important for the next time as opposed to the blanket veto. now again, i'm hopeful about this. we will see whether or not the nra and the extreme gun rights movement mobilizes against this and finds some way to scuttle it, but so far what i am pleased about is that unlike many of our debates, the extreme, absolutist position has not driven everything. we have not made the perfect the enemy of the good, and i think that that is something that is a

very, very rare moments of celebrating how the legislative process actually can work in a period in which it works so seldom. >> so, shannon, charlie put aside his cynicism and i'll borrow it back a minute. progress is progress, but do you think we are at this place and having this conversation because the politics are doing nothing? we are actually worse than the politics are doing something? >> i do, and look, i want lawmakers and republicans specifically to have a change on this issue. it could be a change of heart and mind, or it could be political expediency. i frankly, don't care and i want them to come to the table and be on the right side of this issue and nbc reported some behind the scenes conversations about senator mcconnell is worried about inaction and what that would do to their voting support in the suburbs. i'm a mom of five. i'm a suburban mom, can i can't imagine a lawmaker doing nothing

after children are slaughtered inside an elementary school. our movement has spent the last decade weakening the nra. they're sort of mia right now and we shine a light on how corrupt we are as a supposed non-profit and all of those things have come together and all of the work we've done in the last decade and not just in the federal level and statehouses and schoolboards and city councils and all of that has created the momentum. i want to be clear this is the first step, every republican senator who votes no on this bill will be held accountable and finally, there's some kind of bipartisan agreement that something has to happen. >> charlie, i didn't mean to rob this moment of absence and cynicism. i do want to put this poll up. 89% of americans require background checks of all gun

sales. 68% support a ban on high-am nigsz magazines and the numbers are so lopsided. the nra membership is more than 23% of americans. they've lost their own lobby. what do you think happens after this legislation passes and is signed into law, god willing, that's where we're heading? >> those numbers are so significant because they suggest as shannon was hinting at that the nra has been reduced to a sort of wizard of oz type of institution where if you push back they don't even speak for their own members. they don't speak for responsible gun owners around the country who have no problem with gun safety legislation. so there's a real gap between these extreme positions which have had a stranglehold on the republican party and frankly, grassroots gun owners including some of their own constituents.

so what i've talked about before is that even republicans who stood up against the nra know who basically cut through the smoke and the mirrors and the smoke and everything will often find out that they do not speak for anything close to a plurality or majority of the voters. so maybe this will undermine this political dynamic that americans are watching what happened, and they cannot understand why can't even have common sense legislation. ? shannon, i can't stop thinking about the victims and all of the families of the victims and fred guttenberg who lost his daughter and the newtown families who have beeorced into public advocacy. yourself, i mean, you're doing this work. i can't imagine talking about what a gun does to a body is nothing anyone wants to do. the reality check is how heinous. we had to feel like drop-off at third grade might be the last

time we saw our babies for anyone to do anything. >> well, look, that's certainly what got me off the sidelines. i want to be clear. black and brown women have been doing this work for decades without much attention at all and when we talk about mass sho horrific, and they get so much attention because there's such a high body count, but the reality is that it's the everyday gun violence, mostly with handguns that is killing over 110 americans and wounding hundreds more, and so it's so important that we talk about how can we prevent gun violence, the daily gun violence that's tearing apart the fabric of our communities. thankfully this framework that's been put together addresses gun violence more holistically, and it can help that everyday gun violence as well. >> shannon watts, charlie sykes, a big and important topic today. thank you for joining us to talk about. when we come back, president joe biden signed an executive order aimed at combatting anti-lgbtq bells and laws across

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i know i did the right thing. i was defending the constitution. you can't have a president rile up a crowd and send them down to the capitol and have him sit in the white house and watch for

three hours as the crowd beats up the capitol police officers and have five people killed. i think it was well beyond the pale and i think he had a responsibility to act in a more presidential way. that's why i voted to hold him accountable, and i would vote to hold him accountable again tomorrow. hi again, everyone. it's 5:00 in new york. that was a dispatch from planet earth but that's not where we're living anymore. that was the first primary carnality out of the ten house republicans who voted to impeach donald trump for inciting a deadly insurrection on january 6th. that was tom rice of south carolina. he is a five-term congressman. he was beaten by a trump-backed primary challenger last night, and as you just heard, tom rice ran a campaign where he was unafraid to criticize the ex-president and where he staunchly defended his impeachment vote. it looks like that pro-democracy anti-trump position no longer has any place in today's republican party. rice stands in contrast to

another south carolina incumbent who also faced a trump endorsed challenger last night. that would be congresswoman nancy mace. she voted to certify the election results for joe biden and criticize trump in the wake of january 6th, but she worked really, really hard to get on the ex-president's good side. she even stood in front of trump tower and filmed sort of weird video outside of it to prove her loyalty to him. well, last night mace won. two races along with the others we've seen so far in this primary season send a blaring signal to the rest of the gop as our colleagues put it, you can ignore trump's pleas to overturn an election, see brian kemp in georgia, you can criticize his behavior, but you cannot be a hostile opponent, which is the exact tact liz cheney has taken in his role as the vice chair of the select committee. her courage all the more extraordinary given the republican party's near absolute devotion to the twice impeached

deplatformed ex-president. whether she survives her primary in august will send another signal about where her party stands when it comes to democracy and truth and the constitution as the ex-president's big lie has become the central litmus test, there's new analysis in the "new york times" that dives deep into the party's lunch for the right. from that reporting, quote, as the halfway point in years of the midterm year that is vastly friendlier to republicans, the party's voters have nominated dozens of candidates for offices with power over the administration and certification of electionings, people who have spread falsehoods about the 2020 presidential contest and sowed distrust in american democracy. the only way to restore trust these candidates say is by electing them, like last night's primary. on tuesday nevada republicans chose as their nominee for secretary of state jim merchant, an organizer of a trump inspired

coalition of far right candidates united by their insistence that the 2020 election was rigged. marchant a former legislator from vegas told voters your vote hasn't counted for decades. nevada's current secretary of state was censured for not doing enough to investigate claims of election fraud. meanwhile, marchant's number one priority is this, quote, to overhaul the fraudulent election system in nevada. a staggering display of the big lie metastasizing and threatening our democracy coming just days after hearing testimony from those people closest to the ex-president, every one of them knew and testified under oath that his claims of fraud were all unfounded. the far right's frightening grip on the republican party is where we begin the hour with some of our favorite reporters and friends, "new york times" domestic correspondent is here, also joining us msnbc political analyst matthew dowd, the founder of country over party,

and cornell belcher, president of brilliant corner's research. i start with you, nick, and i want you to take me through this piece of reporting because it hues so completely to the data, the number and the statistics, and the results are painting this picture you've been covering really since the earliest months after the 2020 election that it's not just the conduct and the lies of republican elected officials, it's a hunger among the republican base to have those people ascend. >> yeah, and we're seeing them, you know, be nominated up and down the ballot in these republican primaries. what last night showed us is that georgia might be an out leader, seeing governor kemp and raffensperger fend off challenges. we've now seen in new mexico there was a secretary of state candidate audrey trujillo, she was running unopposed and she is

part of the america first slate of secretary of state candidates who dispute the election, doug mastriano in pennsylvania gets the republican nomination for governor. he was in d.c. on january 6th. he was one of the leading challengers of the 2020 election and the pennsylvania state legislature, and even wrote letters to the justice department, you know, looking for and asking them to further investigate the 2020 election. now in nevada last night, we have a secretary of state candidate in jim marchant clinch the republican nomination. as you saw earlier, he spret countless doubts about the election and lost his own election in 2020. he lost by about 16,000 votes. he also claimed fraud in that. he has a long history of doubting election results and american democratic norms. in the senate, adam waxalt, you know, he was talking even before yesterday's election about forming a legal team to challenge eventual election results and we had audio of him from earlier this year talking

to supporters about how important a legal team was to challenge election results, that he would even take from his campaign's field team to pay for it. these are candidates that are putting it at the front of their campaigns and they're getting rewarded by the republican base, you know, and they're choosing them to be their nominee in november. >> in any of the states or races that you discussed, was there any voter fraud in 2020? >> there was not, no. there was no voter fraud in any state in the country that impacted any race from, you know, the lowest denominator to the highest, and we've seen that, you know, as it's been evidenced in the january 6th hearing. bill barr said all these allegations of, you know, voter fraud were something that i won't say on television. >> you can say it. i've been saying it all week. we broke the seal here at 5:00.

>> it's been very, very clear since the election really, we've done numerous stories about a week or so after the election, my colleagues and i called every election official, every top state election official in the country and asked was there any widespread fraud. do you have any concerns, and to a t, all 50, with the exclusion of had to talk to the governor said no. we've known this, this has been clear yet it's still being spread through, you know, these candidates for secretary of state, state legislature, congress. even on monday, likely the secretary of state candidate in michigan after winning the state convention there was on steve bannon's podcast listing reasoning how she thought the michigan 2020 election was stolen, and that was just this week. >> so matt dowd, republican candidates are running on what bill barr describes as bull shit, and if they were running on finding imaginary panties that would make everyone four inches taller we'd be looking

for the ecstasy ring, but because they're looking for something that donald trump softened the earth with for so long, sent his supporters to the capitol to engage in medieval hand to hand combat, that's the sworn testimony by law enforcement officials who faced trump's supporters at the capitol, they're now using that delusion. again, what bill barr called absolute bs to win elections. what do you do next? >> well, and then you add to that everything that you said is factual. add to that, they have an entire news network that has facilitated this, and so it's all of those things been facilitated by a news network and many websites and then coupled with the lack of courage of many republicans knowing full well this is all a lie to push back and stand up and say this is all a lie, and so it's fostered this virus. it's allowed it to spread, and i

have a fear. my fear is we came really close. we came this close to losing our democracy in 2020. it was but for a number of secretaries of states and attorney generals and governors in key states that stood the line, and then you had a house of representatives that was willing to count the electoral votes. if this election doesn't go well for the democrats in 2022, all of those pillars from michigan to nevada to arizona, to pennsylvania will be gone, and if the republicans take back the house of representatives, this sets up in my biggest fear, my biggest fear in this time is it sets up for no matter how the race turns out in '24, if you have all of these pillars that have been knocked down with election deniers in place, a house of representatives run by the republicans, it doesn't matter in my view what the actual results of '24. that's when we have a constitutional complete meltdown in crisis in this. i think the only thing we can do

is keep speaking the truth and keep saying this over and over and over again, encourage democrats to make this a major part of their campaign in the fall. i know they're worried about inflation. i know they're worried about gas prices, but if this is a race about those things, they lose. if this is a race about the fate of our democracy and i'm not a person that you know that's prone to hyperbole. it really is about the fate of our democracy. all of these people take the minneapolis of people who stood in the way of corruption of our democracy, if those people of integrity are gone, there's no telling what would happen in 2024 in an election, even if a democrat won by 7, 8, 10 million votes. >> i mean, it's a very bleak picture. it is an opportunity for democrats, cornell to use -- i mean, not just democrats but liz cheney is running against the

candidate that one of her star witnesses this week, bill stepien is advising. the campaign he's running is against someone running on these lies that liz cheney is trying to purge from the body politic. how do you run a campaign that gets to people at a gut level and makes clear that the republicans are playing them for fools. they all knew. stepien's testimony is about donald trump's knowing peddling of a lie, and we know that stepien proves that trump knew because stepien told him, so does the campaign lawyer. when you have a rough night, you call in the pollster, you call in matt. don't get what we want from that guy, you call in the guy with the counties, right? so how'd we do in, you know, bucks. really, all those people have testified on tape that they knew trump lost and they told trump he lost, so what do you do with

all of that sworn testimony from republicans now asserting on camera it was all a lie? >> well, first, nicolle, i'm going to take this time to say all the trump supporters, if you send me millions of dollars, i can get to the bottom of this fraud stuff, so just start sending me also millions and millions of dollars because i'm pretty sure i can get to the bottom of this fraud. but look, to a certain extent, the testimony -- i think you'll see democrats using the testimony and hopefully fingers crossed in campaigns moving forward into the fall, but to a certain extent, does it matter? and look, there's evidence, and look, there was great reporting at the top of this segment, great reporting about this all being fraudulent and being a lie, but they keep buying into it, right?

to a certain extent, you know, trump, whether or not trump endorses these republicans or, you know, he's backing them is moot because they all propagate the big lie, and nicolle, the big lie now is larger than trump. it's bigger than trump. the big lie right now really is about fear. it's about being replaced. it's about the other. it's about losing power, and so regardless of whether they are backing or being endorsed by trump or not, across the board you have these republican candidates who are propagating the lie and the lie is basically rooted in this fear of losing their country. now, i worked for a guy in 2008, nicolle, who talked about 2008 was going to be the most consequential election of our lifetime, and he said it in

speech after speech and i thought it were true. so picking up on dowd's point, nicolle, 2022 is going to be the most consequential election of our time. as the reporting has shown, you've got hundreds of these people who are literally running on the ideal this i'm going to overturn an election if it doesn't go our way. >> yeah. >> nicolle, i think in 2022, we're going to find out whether or not ben franklin's refrain, we're going to answer ben franklin's refrain whether or not we can keep this republic and if republicans do win this election to dowd's point in 2024, we're going to lose democracy. >> well, and i think president -- former president obama gave that speech at the convention in the summer before the 2020 election, and every national security official that you spoke to during every moment of the trump presidency said the country might survive these four years. it would not survive another four years. i think what wasn't considered

is that trump's ideology, the anti-democratic impulses that he sort of oozeed out of all his pores affected it. i wonder in your view what does the campaign look like to cure us of that? >> first off, you have to take a look at like what groups and who you're talking to, right? so i divide the country right now into a third a third a third, and a third is completely been infected by this big lie, that doesn't care. all the things that cornell was saying about the replacement stuff and all the things they're worried about, that's a third. they're gone. that's a third of the country. a third of the country is genuinely engaged, watches the hearings, watches your show, is very concerned bt is worried about the democracy, is worried about a number of things loss of freedom. and then there's the third of the country that basically is like i'm a little concerned about that. is it really true?

what's going -- can we really lose our democracy? oh, by the way, my laundry soap costs more and the price of gas is 5.14, yeah, i'm worried about like choice being taken away and i'm worried about guns and i'm kind of confused. that's where the race is going to be fought over, and those folks, and even a smaller subset i talked about, those folks are people that don't like joe biden and don't like donald trump, and so in order for democrats to win, they have to not worry about defending the legacy of joe biden or whatever else it is, they have to somehow in a very visceral way connect the dots of what does it mean if you lose your democracy. there goes your health care, there goes your freedoms. there goes everything you've counted on. there goes the idea that america is the greatest country in the world. there goes all those things, all those things you count on, public schools, all those things are completely sitting at the fate of whether or not we have a democracy, and it's speaking to those folks who are slightly disengaged who love our country

but also don't really like joe biden and really don't like donald trump. >> nick, does your reporting -- >> nicolle, can i get in real quickly? >> yeah, go ahead. >> i want to double down on this campaign, this ideal, and in campaigns we have these ideals of, okay, to that third that dowd was talking about, they got to understand they have skin in the game, and right now they don't really believe they have skin in the game is the point that dowd's making. campaigns, we got to give them a reason to feel they have skin in the game, that this is important to them that losing income is important to them and whether it be not -- whether or not it be telling women that, you know what, women? you think you're losing your rights now, what do you think is going to happen if we don't have democracy. you know what african americans, african american men who are showing the lowest motivation to turn out in this midterm, you think things are tough for you right now. where do you think you're going to stand in a country in america where there's no democracy, where they have absolutely no interest at all in respecting

your rights. we've got to let these people understand they've got skin in this game, and we've got to scare the hell out of them because quite frankly, nicolle, they should be afraid that we're going to lose our democracy. >> because that is what's on the line. nick, what i was going to bring you on, you've covered since the aftermath of 2020 all these states and their 400 and some odd voter suppression laws making their ways through 48 states. we spent a lot of time talking about georgia's and the law in texas, but i wonder how much you see out in the states that people have changed their outreach to voters. not only is this the landscape, not only is there a different economic message for all campaigns, but especially democrats to grapple with. it's also already harder to vote. have those adjustments been made in the states? >> i think in some states. if you look at the turnout in

georgia, it was setting records compared to recent primary elections, the turnout was exponentially greater, especially in early voting, and a large reason for that, i think, was a lot of the groups on the ground, voting rights groups, civil rights groups, a lot of faith leaders in georgia, they saw this law passed last year. they know the speed in which legal challenges to these laws go, and it can take years. they're like okay, for the 2022 election we're going to have to deal with this and organize the best we can around it. so i think they focused on early voting in person. they said only kind of vote by mail if you have to. this is some of the georgia faith leaders telling their congregations that. so you saw a big rise in early in-person voting. so i think there is some organizational level in terms of voter outreach, voter education that is dealing with this, even when it doesn't go as well. so in texas, you know, the secretary of state's office did try and do outreach through

billboards and youtube videos about their new voting law. it just clearly wasn't enough because there still was about 18,000 ballots in the top 15 counties, population make up 65, 70% of the state population. those balances were likely disenfranchised. 18,000 is a big number. is it going to swing in an election? in texas probably not, but that's 18,000 people whose voting rights were taken away. >> that's incredible. >> i think there's this organizational push. there's also a rhetoric that you're starting to see from some democratic candidates that frame a lot of issues in the realm of voting. i was talking to the new mexico secretary of state, i can make people -- if you want to change gas policies and tax policies it has to be through the vote. that's how you'll get change here. >> we'll keep watching it. thank you all so much for starting us off this hour. you all make me smarter. when we come back, our guest will be one of the members of

the january 6th select committee as we look ahead to tomorrow's hearing and what the committee has learned about that pressure campaign against vice president mike pence and that tour that was given the day before the insurrection. congresswoman zoe lofgren is our guest. don't go anywhere. plus, our good friend and colleague katy tur will be here on her stunning new memoir and what she makes of the job the 1/6 committee is doing. and later with eastern ukraine in increasingly dire straits, calls are growing from the ukrainian people on two fronts, keep military aid coming and please, please do not forget about what's happening here. we'll speak with former zelenskyy adviser igor novikov who's in kyiv later in the hour. "deadline white house" continues after a quick break. don't go anywhere. a quick break. don't go anywhere. (vo) when it comes to safety,

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so even as it prepares to continue to keep a laser focus on donald trump's relentless, perhaps even illegal attempts to have mike pence stop the electoral votes on january 6th, the committee is again through its evidence revealing where it might be going next. we told you in the last hour and we showed it to you that new video. it's right here on your screen, associated with the committee's investigation into congressman barry loudermilk who's accused of giving tours to rioters the days before the election. it's something to continue to keep an eye on as the hearings go on. in the here and now, the committee is preparing to drill down tomorrow on what happened within mike pence's inner circle. expect to hear the name john eastman a few times tomorrow. that lawyer who even after trump's coup attempt failed made

news to disrupt the peaceful transfer of power. joining us now is congresswoman zoe lofgren, a member of the january 6th select committee. thank you so much for spending some time with us. i just want to quickly dispense with the schedule this week, just tell our viewers there was supposed to be a hearing today. tomorrow's hearing is as planned. the witnesses are as scheduled, but tell us when we can expect to hear the evidence and the testimony that would have come today. >> likely next week. it's a logistical issue. it's not really a story. >> so we're heading into tomorrow hearing, which is during the daytime, and it is piercing the pence inner circle. i wonder if you have any updates on whether mike pence will appear. >> i do not expect the vice president to appear tomorrow, and -- but i think youill see

through the evidence that we have quite a complete picture of what went on on the pressure campaign with relative to the vice president. you know, we're taking turns taking the lead on each hearing and my colleague from california, pete aguilar, member of the committee will be the lead on tomorrow's hearing, and i think he will do an excellent job. i'm looking forward to a smaller role in tomorrow's hearing than i had on monday's hearing. >> that's probably a relief. we have seen from the evidence that's been made public and some of the investigative journalism into the same events that you've had access to literally everybody around the vice president except the vice president, his chief of staff, his chief counsel, judge ludig who's an outside legal adviser. there's so much known about how concerned they were about violence directed at mike pence,

and in congresswoman liz cheney's opening remarks, she really underscored donald trump's celebration of what his supporters wanted, and that was to hang mike pence. how much is the violence going to be the theme of the evidence that we see tomorrow? >> well, i don't want to step on the hearing. i think people should watch and see what evidence we have. i've been gratified that there's been a great deal of attention given to these hearings, even during the daytime we had a very large audience and people are paying close attention to the evidence and the information they were able to deliver, and i expect that will happen again tomorrow. >> former attorney general holder said in an interview on this program that one of the public services of the story telling that you're doing and

the sharing of the evidence and i don't know that we knew at that point that all the depositions had been videotaped but he talked about making the justice department's work easier, if they were to embark on an investigation, they would ultimately have the ex-president as the subject or target. is that on your mind? i know there's been some back and forth about a criminal -- do you view your work in tandem with any substantive investigations? >> obviously we're legislating the committee, and we're doing our work pursuant to the charging we received when we were created. however, we will not discuss as a committee what we're going to do relative to all the information that we have acquired, but it would be my hope and expectation that we would make everything available at the appropriate time to prosecutors if they wish to have the information.

we haven't actually -- at the beginning we didn't do videotapes. i'm sure you noticed that mr. donohue had an audio only. that's because we didn't start videotaping, and then we realized with the volume of interviews, there's no way we could have live witnesses at every hearing, and we started doing the videotaping as well. >> did anyone object? >> not that i know of. >> it's just remarkable to see hours and hours of bill barr and i know you have i think nine and a half hours of one of the closest advisers to former vice president pence. i wonder if you can take us inside what the tape is able to convey to the american people. you talked about being gratified that people are watching. part of the reason they're watching, it's all on tape. you can't spin it. you can't politicize it. it's trump's closest advisers in their own words. how important is that? >> i think it is important.

i think all of our witnesses so far have been republicans who were part of trump world, and the reason for that is they're the ones who saw and who heard and who are able to give firsthand accounts of what happened and i think, at least what i'm hearing from people in response is that that's having an impact. this is -- these are republican witnesses talking about what happened, what president trump did, and what some people in his inner circle did. so you know, it's important that the evidence that we have received become known to the american people and that it be delivered in a way that's credible and i think that credibility is enhanced when witnesses are all part of trump world. >> and just seeing with our own eyes, the evidence that was released today is something we can see in our own eyes is anything but a normal tourist

visit. it's congressman loudermilk's constituents taking surveillance video of hallways and security check points with multiple telephones in this man's pocket. tell me what you're hoping to elicit from mr. lauder milk who actually said that he never received a letter or call from the committee. is that really the case? >> i can't imagine why. i mean, we sent the letter and he certainly has it now. i mean, if you take a look at what video you're looking at now, that is, you know -- he's taking a video of the tunnel between the rayburn building and the u.s. capitol. that's the tunnel that i was evacuated through the next day. it's, you know, we didn't accuse representative loudermilk of

anything. we just said we would like to talk to him. this is not normal behavior on the part of this group, and as we know, they went on the next day to threaten to kill or threaten violence against nancy pelosi, and jerry nadler, the chair of the judiciary committee, and chuck schumer. they took pictures of the staff, the democratic staff of judiciary committee. we'd like to know more about these people and i think it would really be very helpful we reemphasized it today, if mr. loudermilk would come in and talk to us about it. i can't understand why he wouldn't do that. >> he said today to one of my colleagues that they were filming the trains and a gold eagle sconce. did you see any photographic evidence that that is what was filmed? >> i did not.

now, that's -- this is a picture of a -- that's a stairwell that goes up to the ways and means committee room, which is where evacuated members of congress were held in a secure location the next day. you know, taking pictures of a stairwell is not usually what tourists do, so we'd like to know more about this. >> i wonder if you're interested in speaking with or if you have already spoken to capitol police who at least in loudermilk's telling and in their public statements appear to clear him of what he thinks he's accused of. >> well, we -- first, we didn't accuse him of anything. we asked him to come in and talk to us, number one. number two, i read the chief's letter, and, you know, maybe they didn't look at the same tapes we did, but you can clearly see on the videotape that this rioter was taking a video of the tunnel between the

rayburn building and the capitol, that very same tunnel where i was evacuated along with other members from the floor of the house the very next day. it's concerning. >> it's terrifying, and i guess my last question on this is have you shown the video to kevin mccarthy or anyone currently in leadership and asked for their cooperation in finding out if one of their members who we know from a tape released by "new york times" reporters kevin mccarthy thought his members could through their words or deeds represent some threat to other members of the congress. have you shown this to him and asked for his help? >> we asked mr. loudermilk who's a member of the house administration committee to come in and talk to the january 6th committee, and we reiterated that request today in the hope that he does that, and i can't understand why he wouldn't. >> it's an amazing piece of evidence, congressman zoe

lofgren. it's a remarkably busy week for you. we're really grateful to you for taking some time to talk to us about it. thank you so much. >> any time, nicolle. >> thank you. when we come back, i will be joined here at the table by my good friend and colleague katy tur. her exquisitely written new memoir rough draft tells the story of her childhood, and the lessons, some of them tough and painful one that taught her -- hello, friend, i'm so glad you're here. quick break for us. we'll be right back. break for us we'll be right back. lar depress. it made me feel trapped in a fog. this is art inspired by real stories of bipolar depression. i just couldn't find my way out of it. the lows of bipolar depression can take you to a dark place. latuda could make a real difference in your symptoms. latuda was proven to significantly reduce bipolar depression symptoms and in clinical studies, had no substantial impact on weight. this is where i want to be. call your doctor about sudden behavior changes or suicidal thoughts. antidepressants can increase these in children and young adults. elderly dementia patients have increased risk

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a regular viewer of this network, and i know you all are, like me you watch our next guest every day at 2:00. my friend and colleague katy tur has followed up her very successful and exciting "new york times" best selling book about her experience covering trump and the trump campaign with a new story, in some ways more wild, in others more heartbreaking, her own. her book, rough draft, a memoir tells her story starting are from her childhood raised in the skies from her parents news helicopter to her complicated relationship with her dad to her rise as a broadcaster journalist covering the streets of brooklyn to the boston marathon bombing to being right here at this desk a couple of hours before me every day at 30 rock. joining me now is my friend katy tur. i read it, you gave it to me and i read it. it is so good, and it is so harrowing personally and heroic

professionally, and i wonder if your head those were like two threads for you or if they were all connected. >> they were, and then i realized as i kept going that they were really interconnected. there was no way to take one and separate it from the other. i am who i am because of the way i grew up, the good, the bad, and the ugly, and sometimes it was pretty ugly. >> you write about your mom and your dad, and i've seen -- i know we're going to start with your dad, i want to start with your mom. your last line in the book is what an incredible journalist your mom is. >> my parents just to give some back story, my parents were helicopter news journalists in the '80s and '90s in los angeles. they covered every breaking story you saw on tv. sean penn and madonna getting married, o.j. on the slow speed pursuit, the guy that got pulled out of the red gravel truck, any police pursuit, my mom was the

camera woman. she would hang out of the helicopter strapped in a belt, is and look down with a 40 pound beta camera on her shoulder. sometimes during the riots h they were getting shot at in the helicopter and they found bullet frag nlts in the battery below her seats. she was brave and incredible as a journalist. she still is. she didn't get the credit because my dad was the brand, bombastic and out there and really compelling. there was one instance and i wanted to set it right. my mom shot the reginald denny beating and they won an emmy for this coverage and she wasn't on it. her name wasn't on it. it was taken off by the news director and they added a couple of people who worked on the desk. all the men conspired and took the only woman off of it. i feel like that's so unfair, and i wanted to acknowledge that she was and is amazing.

>> you do that. the last line of the epilogue, this book is not about scoring settling except one. >> that's it, exactly. we could talk for three hours about all your story telling about your childhood and about your dad, but i want to just ask you to talk about the call you got when you were covering the boston marathon, about to eat a hamburger. >> it was a crazy day. i ran up to boston to cover the marathon bombings, and it felt like a professional coup because i got there before any other network correspondent and it was a big, big, big story, and it was early on in my career, and at this point and there's a lot of back story, it's in the book. my dad and i had a strained relationship, a note about pronouns, when i talk about my dad -- i'll tell you, okay, so i'm sitting on the bed and i'm eating a hamburger and my dad calls and i remember thinking to myself do i have the energy for this now. and i answered the phone and my dad said katy, are you sitting down? and i said yeah, and my dad said

i'm not bob tur. i'm zoe tur. i'm a woman, and it at the time took me by such surprise. my dad flew helicopters, wore leather jackets, like punched cops, super masculine, super in your face. and it was a wild thing to be told in the middle -- anytime but in the middle of a news story, and it was before orange is the new black, before laverne cox was a household name, before caitlyn jenner, didn't have the vocabulary. >> it's also your dad. >> it's my dad, you know, and it was interesting because from an outsider perspective, interesting just to experience it, but from my perspective, i had to wrestle with what makes a person. what makes you who you are, and my dad at the time felt like going from bob tur to zoe tur meant that everything that bob tur did was gone. >> expunged. >> bob tur's dead he told me, hard thing for a kid to hear, and that precipitated -- or it

laid even more bare how complicated our relationship was. >> well, you wanted him to own all parts of being your father. >> of the person, yeah, exactly. i wanted to talk about the way we grew up and the violence, the emotional violence, the physical violence, i wanted to have a reckoning with it because if we're going to move forward together, let's talk about it. i mean, and let's celebrate the good stuff, and let's understand the bad stuff, but let's do it together, and i wanted this and my dad just didn't want to do it. and you know, now we're estranged, and it sucks, and it's hard. i miss my dad and my grandkids miss their grandfather. >> my kids miss their grandfather. >> i wanted to ask you about it seems like a book that maybe only a mom can write, right? because it's when you have your own kids that you'reeaching around them with all your might and you're also reaching forward to your parents, and you just want to stand between those two intact relationships. >> but you also want to be the

best version of yourself, and for me this was in order to be the best mom i can be, the best wife i can be, the best person anchor, journalist, everything that i can be, i had to go back to go forward, and i had been running away from my childhood for 15, 16 years literally running in some cases. i moved to london. >> all over the world. >> all over the world. >> and for me to be a better version, i needed to confront it so that i didn't allow that rage, which my dad had and which i sometimes will feel in myself take over, i mean, it's cliche but to break the cycle. >> so we work in this world where our beloved viewers are the exception. there's a lot of nastiness that gets directed at us, and to put your whole story out there, your whole family out there, your whole self out there was just so inspiring. nobody writes about their story at a point when they can't put a bow on it, and it was so beautiful and brave. and i get to talk to you for a

whole hour tonight at the 92nd street y. >> and we hopefully get to talk about the hearings and the politics. >> and your love story. we buried the lead, but there's a beautiful love story that you tell and i've never seen it in so much detail. >> i love my husband. i love him. >> reading the book i love your husband. >> congratulations. >> without sounding weird, i'm so proud to have you as a friend and a colleague. >> i'm so proud to have you as a friend and a colleague. i'm going to start crying. >> it's so good. >> we should let everybody read it and then come back because i think you write about things that are really hard for people not only to write about but to even talk about, and especially from your perch as someone so accomplished. i think a lot of people look at your life and think you're perfect, and you are, but to talk about the journey was just really amazing. >> i try to write about it in a way that is real and authentic and honest but is also kind of fun. there are some funny moments. i hope you laugh if you read it. i intend for you to laugh along

the way. life is not all good, not all bad. it's everything all at once. >> exactly, exactly. i can't wait to talk to you more. thank you for talking to us about it. it's called "rough draft." it's out right now. read it, buy it, you will love it. you will cry. thank you for spending some time with us to talk about it. president joe biden announced more military aid for ukraine today just as his country needs it most. we'll talk about it after a quick break, don't go anywhere. quick break, don't go ywanhere i brought in ensure max protein, with thirty grams of protein.

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today president biden spoke with president zelenskyy to reaffirm the u.s. commitment to stand by ukraine in the face of unprovoked russian aggression. president biden also announced he is sending another $1 billion in weapons assistance for ukraine's intensifying defense in the donbas region as well as another $225 million in humanitarian assistance to help the ukrainian people get safe drinking water, health care and food. meanwhile, there's some breaking news from "the washington post." this afternoon there's reporting the families of two missing americans feared they had been captured by russian forces. both are u.s. veterans from alabama who went missing in the last few days near kharkiv, ukraine, near the russian border. all the while ukraine is trying to send the world a message, our friend sent us these pictures, an installation in central kyiv showcasing the tragedy there.

one sign on a car with bull holes says children. and among a tower of sandbags more signs reading simply and powerfully, world, help us. former zelenskyy adviser, our friend joins us now. he is back in kyiv. we will deal with that shirt at the end. tell us about your kyiv and how you find your country. >> well, i can't stop smiling, to be honest. that just blows my mind because nothing has changed. i even saw my first cruise missile fly overhead. even that was welcome because it's home. it's incredible. the country itself is a very -- in a very black and white mood. there's a lot of contrasts. summers are incredibly beautiful. it's a beautiful city. restaurants are open, cafes are open. people are trying to go about their normal lives. but you still have that ominous feeling. that installation pictures i sent to you, those are burned

out tanks and children are playing in them. and you have to understand somebody died in that tank. and it's just horrible to think that's the reality that these kids have to go through and just like a few months before that life was usual and it's never going to be the same again. >> that's what guts me every time you are here. 113 days ago you were doing what i'm doing, juggling work, juggling life, who is going to pick up the kids, who is doing the homework, and your country has been terrorized by the russians and in the eastern part of the country the fighting is more brutal than at any other point. explain what's going on there. >> well, that's why the news of that military assistance is welcome in ukraine because the donbas in eastern ukraine is different terrain, flat terrain, and russia is -- we're basically out in terms of artillery war

that's happening. in effect russia is just destroying everything can artillery and my cousin on the front lines told me for every shot that we fire we get at least 20 or 30 back, sometimes 100 back, trying back at them. so it's a different war, we're outmatched and we need that gear, that hardware to make sure we can level the playing field. >> igor, we've talked so much over the last few months about the surprise came on the battlefield in the ukrainians acumen and heart and in the hearts of the people. i wonder if you can tell us how that is holing up against what by the russian size and gunned brutality of putin's military. >> well, to be honest, there's a lot of people in ukraine to fight to the very end, whatever that end may be, and if i got the same feeling once, i can

cross the border back and into my house. i'm not going to leave for good. i'm not going to be a refugee. they come to the region, we'll be here to fight them. so that hasn't changed. what's changing is the casualty numbers are increasing on the ukrainian side as well. to be honest, the most tragic fact that my cousin told me is that he actually signed a contract so he volunteered for the military eight years ago, and he said there aren't many of us left. so the majority of people fighting now the people have been mobilized one way or the other. those veterans are gone and another story just from today, a very tragic story. a friend of mine volunteered to give to the army and the unit has been killed. there's nobody left out of that

unit. that's the reality. so i just want to remind the world this war is not over and this war extends way beyond ukraine in terms of the repercussions am we are fighting for the future of the entire planet. >> fighting and dying for your democracy and for your country. you have to come back because we didn't get to the shirt. it says, no, i'm not jimmy fallon. there's a story there. we're going to pull you back in before the week is out, igor. >> thank you. >> stay safe, please. a quick break for us. k for s . this is art inspired by real stories of bipolar depression. i just couldn't find my way out of it. the lows of bipolar depression can take you to a dark place. latuda could make a real difference in your symptoms. latuda was proven to significantly reduce bipolar depression symptoms and in clinical studies, had no substantial impact on weight. this is where i want to be. call your doctor about sudden behavior changes or suicidal thoughts. antidepressants can increase these in children

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thank you so much for letting us into your homes during these extraordinary times. we are grateful. "the beat with ari melber" starts right now. thank you, nicolle. i'm ari melber. new video evidence showing even more advanced planning for the insurrection including this moment before trump fans stormed the capitol. >> it has begun. here at the washington monument, washington, d.c. say hello to facebook. >> hey, what's going on, man. >> this is our fearless leader. >> check out my flag i made, guys. can you see it? >> there you go. >> for a certain person. >> that's for somebody special. somebody special. >> just a sampling of the menacing mood.