is not over. how the next coup could be unfolding in front of our eyes right now. and why dozens of requests for information on the police response to the massacre at robb elementary in uvalde, texas, have gone completely unanswered. then, what you need to know about reparations this juneteenth in a story of one woman who actually made reparations a reality. good morning. good morning, it's sunday, june 19th and happy father's day to all who celebrate. enjoy your afternoon nap, all you dads. i'm sam stein filling in for ali velshi. the january six committee has another busy week ahead, with two more public hearings scheduled for tuesday and thursday. in its first few hearings, the panel has focused on the trump team's election from conspiracy theory and the subsequent effort to pressure mike pence editors fitting. this week, investigators will

detail the schemes to state legislators involved in overturning the election don's favor. here is what the committee's vice chair liz cheney said at the end of thursday's hearing. >> over the course of our next hearings, you will see information about president trump suffers john eastman's efforts, the trump legal team's efforts to apply pressure to republican state legislatures, state officials and others. and we will examine the trump team's determination to transmit materially false electoral slates for multiple states to officials of the executive and legislative branches of our government. >> now, tuesday's hearing will revisit one of the most infamous moments from the last days of donald trump's presidency. scheduled to appear as a witness is georgia secretary of state brad raffensperger. now, on january 2nd, 2021, raffensperger received a call from trump during which the former president asked georgia's election

administrator to simply find him some more votes in his favor. >> all i want to do is this. i just want to find 11,780 votes, which is one more than we have because we won the state. so whatever gonna do here, folks? i only need 11,000 votes. fellas, i need 11,000 votes. give me a break. >> doesn't get any less remarkable to listen to. now raffensperger has continued to be a thorn in trump side. he recently won the georgia primary against shohei hice, former congressman dose by trump. a few weeks ago, raffensperger also testified before a special grand jury investigating possible election interference conducted by trump and his associates. joining me now is katie banner, she's a justice department reporter for the new york times an msnbc contributor. also joining us this former u.s. attorney barbara mcquade, she's a professor at the university of michigan law school and an msnbc legal

analyst. thank you both for joining us. some of the best in the business. katie, let's start with you, i want to dig into the pressure campaign placed on state legislatures. you've reported that the justice department is investigating the team of lawyers involved in the alternate electoral scheme. so who are they pursuing, would kind of trouble might they find themselves in right now? >> just a small part of clarification. i wouldn't say the justice department is pursuing these lawyers but we do know is other justice department stephen beaufort formation, pertain to them. we do not yet know that there are technically targets of the investigation. one of the people of interest of course this john eastman, he's made a large, a big appearance of the hearings. we see that he was involved in a lot of the various schemes to keep donald trump in power. and we also saw that he knew in the background, he never said publicly but he knew when he was having conversation with others that a lot of the scheme is probably not constitutional. even if you represented them as such. when he was made public statements and when he would ask people to do things for him that would keep the president

in office. one of them was to overturn the electoral key swing states. and replaced -- with slates of fake electors who falsely say that joe biden lost the election. >> and let's pick up on that point about eastman. the hearing so far have placed intense focus on associates just like him. he's the attorney for those who drafted the plan for mike pence to overturn the election, he privately conceded, we find out. privately conceded that his plan was illegal. have you seen any compelling evidence, however, that people beyond eastman or that evidence that essentially directly implicates donald trump himself and not just his associates? >> we heard evidence the other day that trump was in the room when john eastman admitted that his plan violated the law. that's about the closest that we've come so far. but of course, we have unexplored we're going to hear this week which is these efforts to other states and you

mentioned brad raffensperger which i think will be the key witness because we know about that phone call. but there are also other states where they made these -- i know my hope she's american is one. and that summer hook and legislatures in michigan were summoned to appear before the committee. so did they have to say? winner similar overtures made in other states. and what compelled by raffensperger to recorded that phone call? knowing that he's would have a phone call with on trump, he brought the recording equipment. where their conversations before that call? and maybe even after that call? that are equally or more in various. and so i think they'll be, that will be the key that we're looking for. we know what they did to try to steal this election which is horrific. but the key fact for a criminal prosecution is going to be donald trump's fraudulent intent which means he knew that what he was seeking to do is illegal and try to do it anyway. we've heard some evidence of that but i think prosecutors are going to want that evidence to be very strong. so i'll be listening for more of that in the coming week. >> in katy, one of the things

that's been intriguing to me is the sort of conflict, this tension that's built up between the justice department and the january six committee. you reported this week about it. tell us about the relationship and, the relationship between doj, january six and why are they not actually on the same page at the structure? >> i think that from what i can tell from the people i spoke with inside of the justice department, i don't think that their relationship of soured if the committee had not spent the first part of this year probably saying that they want the justice department to prosecute donald trump. that the justice department did not do so it isn't there election -- i think that that, those are really strong words. the committee. when the justice department has said, we actually do need information you have in order to do that to be given now that feels if nothing else somewhat hypocritical and quite mysterious. if you really want them, the justice department is thinking, if you really want to prosecute people close to donald trump circle but we cannot do without evidence that it's in your possession. and you will not give us that

evidence for a month or even several months. then you can't expect these prosecutions to happen quickly. >> barbara, let's pick up on that. do you think attorney general merrick garland feels boxed in? >> no, i think ultimately he'll make whatever decision he thinks is appropriate in terms of charging. but i think the tension with these transcripts is that there are statements out there boatpeople who they are considering as perhaps witnesses or targets of investigation and i think that very much like to know what else they have said. if someone has come in and is prepared to cooperate for example, and wants to plead guilty, i think they're going to want to know with this force and has already some of the committee. or they cooperative their, did they say things contrary to what the telling justice department now? and those are really important just right now as are assessing their credibility as witnesses. so i can understand why they would want this information, as they go down this path. i can understand the frustration. i think merrick garland for the very frustrated that you hear these outcries from congress urging them to investigate and

then when they try to investigate, they say but you can't have our transcripts. it sounds like some promises being made there. my guess is that the committee doesn't want anyone stealing it's thunder as it rolls out these carefully prepared hearings. but the justice department itself, i don't think we'll do that. would have to turn over in discovery certain materials that it might have and so i think the theory that when other handsome to test these things, they could get out there not in the public domain. >> thank you both so much for joining on sunday morning. new york times katie bennett, former u.s. attorney barbara mcquade. really appreciate you coming on. joining me now is the democratic congresswoman, stacey pocket, of the u.s. virgin islands. last year, she served as an impeachment manager during the second impeachment of donald trump. congresswoman, thank you so much. on a friday, donald trump appeared at the faith and threw them conference in nashville. it's his first on camera mark since the january 6th hearings began. let's take a quick listen to what he had to say and come back on the back end of that.

>> mike did not have the courage to act. bill barr was afraid of certain things and you know what they were? please don't impeach me, don't impeach me, bill barr, i said please, was for being impeached? i got impeached twice and ripple numbers on up. >> what's wrong with being impeached? as a former impeachment manager, i'm just curious, what is your reaction to that comment? >> well, no, i think that he of course lives in the now and lives for his own gain. not for the american people. and any individual would be a gas at the thought of being impeached. that being said that they were trying to dismantle this democracy. but donald trump is not interested in our democracy. he's interested in power, interested in as we've seen it, creating a slush fund from the big lie for his own monetary

gain. so of course he's not gonna be upset about that. fair enough. the man does not do well with shame. now during the speech, former president also suggested the video sent testimony on january from the january six panel were chopped up, and selectively edited. sort of what he does. but i have a question, do you believe it would be who the committee to simply release all of their primary details? transcripts, documents, research, whatever has when it formally concludes to essentially undercut any complaints from trump and his allies? >> well i think a sign from privacy issues or any that might be there legally that would restrain them from doing that, i believe that the committee has said that the conclusion of their investigation, they would be releasing quite a bit of the documents. you know, you were in a discussion about the department of justice. remember that the january 6th committee is still doing its own due diligence and investigation. there are just now saying that they're calling ginni thomas.

they are still collecting information in so i think their thought is rather than compromise that, they would rather have waited to give everything just department. and the snow is of the justice department doesn't have subpoena powers on its own. it's able to get document and much more rapid fashion then the january 6th select committee. and so i know that they're going to work this agreement out. and it's my hope that the justice department does its job and that job is to investigate and when necessary, bring charges against individuals whomever they may be that have broken the law in this country. and that have put our democracy in jeopardy. >> among the new evidence that the committee has released this past week was a video of a colleague of yours, congressman, georgia congressman -- the letter mcaleenan tour of the capitol on january 5th, the day before the riot.

at least one of the men on that tour attended the january six rally the following day. were you aware of this video before it became public? >> i was not aware of the video before it was released. it's very disturbing to me and i think what's even more disturbing is the change and my colleagues argument asked to what he was and was not doing. recalling that one, individuals were not allowed in the capital during that time because of the pandemic. the fact that first he said that he did not do a tour than he said he was had a family on a tour and now we see that it's a much larger group of people who are also taking videos, taking pictures of people. would you not of your own volition want to turn that information of who doesn't of a jewels were over to the proper authorities, knowing that the next day there had been an assault on the capitol. the fact that he would not be forthcoming in that, leads one

to question what his own intentions were at the time. >> let me stick with that. it's 18 months since the insurrection. do you have any lingering concerns about your safety? in addition to that, what's it like to work around colleagues who may be linked, came to the capitol on january six and rioted. >> let's say this first. i have great confidence in the capitol police officers who were there to protect us. the democrats at least have put up more money for security, for police at the capital to ensure that they have the resources that are necessary to keep us. those men and women held the line against a mob for hours. so i don't doubt their ability to protect us. but, and i think that most of my colleagues are coming to washington to do what's right for people who want to sit and work.

but you know, there are quite a number of individuals in the right who will do anything to stay within the good graces of donald trump and stay in the good graces of what they call face. many of whom have voices, racist antisemitic, anti-american sentiments. and that is the more disturbing part. >> all right. democratic congressman stacey platt. >> can i just say one thing, sam? i'm so sorry. you know it is father's day. if i cannot give a shout out to my own father, leroy, i will be -- that will be not a good thing. >> criminal. you have to do. it of course. >> and of course to my husband. and my own son. arielle, who just became a father. so, blessings and love to all of you. >> congratulations. yes. this is going to be a repeated feature of this show. we will shout out fathers throughout the two hour broadcast. congresswoman stacey plaskett,

thank you so much. congrats to your son unbecoming a father. still ahead, it has been 50 years since the watergate scandal shook our nation in changed washington forever. we will go back to the scene of the crime with the cops who responded on that fateful night. we will talk to two veterans of the nixon impeachment about how today's constitutional crisis compared to that one. and, you probably do not know the name of your secretary of state. but they play a major role in maintaining democracy as we know it. with you need to know, in the new term months away. right after the, break inflation. turning, gas groceries, and everything in between. with the feds major rate hike make a difference? we've insisted that into so much more. this is velshi. s velshi like the new supreme meats, topped high with new italian-style capicola. that's one handsome italian. uh... thanks. not you, garoppolo! ♪♪ subway keeps refreshing and refreshing and refres-

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straight everyone, i mean everyone, is talking about the same thing.

interest rates. the most aggressive move since 1990. for the central bank raised its benchmark rate by three quarters of a percent this past week. interest rates are the federal reserve's greatest weapon to fight inflation. chairman jon powell says that the fed is willing to lose it again if they have to. >> the labor market is extremely tight, and inflation is much too high. we are not going to declare victory until we see a series of these really see convincing evidence, compelling evidence, that inflation is coming down. >> all right, what does that mean for the average american? for you and for me? to answer that question, kate silver, the editor in chief of investor pena. and, frankly he is much smarter than me about the stuff. caleb, let's start with the fundamental point here. what's does this rate hike mean for the average american? >> good to be with you and happy father's day.

>> -- >> thank. you this rate hike means everything you, finance everything it is tied to the federal funds rate, those interest rates are going up. things like our loans are going up. mortgages have already risen. the 30 year. fix up to 60% in some places. that is going up as well. any sort of credit card interest rates are flipping a pr, that is going up as well. that's what we call the overnight lending rate, the rate which banks lend money to each other, and all rates are set after that on top of that. so rates have already been moving in that direction, moving higher. because everybody knows that the feds have to raise interest rates to cool down inflation at a 40 year high. that is what they are doing. spending a lot more through the rest of the year. >> slowing down the housing market. fewer people buying cars. the question, i guess, is the power move too slowly? we knew inflation was a problem, have a year to your. go would he be in a better place how he moved aggressively earlier? >> it is. powell but it is also the federal open market committee.

that sets rates. and yes, the fact really actually raise interest rates three quarters of a percent last week, very big rate, largest in several years, they were too late to the party. too late to cool down the economy. and inflation got out of control. we learned the week before that cpi, the consumer price index, that rose again to 8.6%. that is another 40 plus year high. you cannot have an economy with prices that high, because it is hitting people where they pay the biggest. bills so gas, prices obviously. groceries. rant. airfare. electricity. feel oil. all those prices are sky-high. the only way to roll the school have done is to raise interest rates, which makes people think twice about borrowing money to buy things. >> there is a flipside to this argument. it's a comes from articulating by the former secretary robert right. he tweeted, why is the fed raising interest rates. ? because they assume that inflation is being driven by rage increases which is incorrect. wages are lagging behind

inflation. more accurately, corporations jay corporations with outsized -- are driving up inflation. in other words, this is corporate. great oil companies are making great profits. charging consumers a huge amount. they could charge last, but they are not. what are your thoughts on the reich argument. that this is about consolidation, in corporate greed? >> you can argue that because -- 's army's profits. but what happened all persons with, negative when there was no demand during the pandemic. with a losing money on purpose? no, this is a function of supply and demand. maybe they are making extra profits. now anything over $50 a barrel, for oil, companies is pure profits. they are enjoying very high oil prices right now. these oil companies. and they are passing it right on down to the consumer gas prices. over $5 across the country. so with the federal reserve is actually doing is trying to pull the economy, but not send it into a deep freeze, by raising those interest rates. there's interest rates, they go up, it makes businesses think

twice about borrowing money to expand. or potentially pay higher wages. but it also makes consumers think twice about risky purchases. that is going to cool the economy. the worry is that as it sets the economy into a recession. that is very painful. those could last quite a while. it is very painful, especially for low income folks. >> that is an understatement. we're sessions are very painful indeed. caleb silver, thank you so much for joining us. and as always, happy father's day. now, right after the break, secretaries of state holding the keys to free and fair elections. many far-right election deniers are on the ballot for the crucial -- across the nation. with the committee for american democracy in this crucial moment. this is velshi. is velshi i grow all my own vegetables shingles doesn't care. we've still got the best moves you've ever seen good for you, but shingles doesn't care. because 1 in 3 people will get shingles, you need protection. but, no matter how healthy you feel, your immune system declines as you age

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get access to critical levers of power, including over the election office itself, this fall. more than 100 peddlers of the primaries across the country so far this year. one is even more concerning is that dozens of republican candidates have spread lies about the 2020 presidential election, and have been nominated for offices that are actually responsible for the certification of results. but others have elevated candidates in recent races who were governors, secretary states, attorney generals. including in crucial swing states. most recently in the body. jim marcia, who continues to falsely claim that joe biden did not win the election in his own state. became the republican nominee for secretary of state this past week. on the november ballot, marchand will join the likes of other election night as a pennsylvania gubernatorial candidate doug mastriano who won his primary in part by touting ways to decertify the presidential election results. and attorney general ken cox

ten who sued to overturn biden's victory in december 2020 is running for reelection in texas. joining me now to discuss this is janet griswold, the democratic secretary state for colorado. she's also the chair of the democratic association of secretaries of state. thank you so much for joining us on this sunday morning. really appreciate it. question for you right at the gate. do you think it was inevitable that so many election deniers would run for office this cycle and could something have been done to stop it or prevent it? >> well, good morning, sam. thank you for having me on. and in terms of whether it was inevitable or not, of course. the former president could've stopped lying, he could have not tried to steal the american presidency. but he did. and then extreme republicans sitting in governorships, in the senate, in congress decided to embrace the big lie. so at this point, when it comes

to secretary of state races, we have seen candidates either be endorsed by their republican assemblies or win primaries. big lie candidates in nevada, michigan and even here in colorado. tina peters, a county clerk who was indicted for a ten counts of compromising her own voting equipment won the republican assembly to run against me. and to put it in context, this would be like electing arsonist to oversee fire departments. these are serious no believe in democracy and your viewers can join me in defeating tina peters and the big lie by joining me at janet griswold .com. >> let's talk about that race with tina peters. tampered with her own voting equipment, correct me if i'm wrong, lied about the election results and is this true, she's been barred from working on elections this year altogether? >> that's right, i filed a petition with the judge last year and this year asking the judge to remove her from

oversight of her counties elections. because, frankly, someone who is already cost our county 1 million dollars under indictment for working with mike lindell and qanon to compromise voting equipment is not fit to oversee colorado elections. but this extremism is spreading across the country. and we need to make sure that we have secretaries of state who will uphold the right to vote. my job as secretary of state's not to help democrats. it's to make sure that every eligible republican unaffiliated and democratic voter has access to free and fair election. >> let me, there is a prevailing wisdom now that voters maybe not democrats but voters, with large stones value this issue, electorally. that they care more about gas prices, price of groceries, you know, their economic well-being. and that issues of democracy will take a backseat when it comes to the ballot. do you sense that that's

happening right now? how much of a problem do you feel that presents people like you who are running in these critical races? >> well, i think sam that both issues are crucial. i grew up on food stamps in a cabin up in rural colorado. very blue-collar so i understand what americans are going through. the prices, the inflation, these are real issues for american voters. at the same time, just yesterday, i was at the juneteenth parade in denver. and three people came up to me with tears in their eyes over the right to vote. so i think coloradans in american voters are incredibly concerned. and to put it frankly, democracy is on the ballot in 2022. americans are gonna be able to choose between candidates who protect the right to vote, ensure the stability of our country or those who allied, destroy, all to help their own

party. democracy is on the ballot and i'm confident american voters will say that in 2022. >> yes. on a personal level people in your position have faced an immense number of threats since 2020. it's been well documented that since the election, it's provoking the source of violence. a man from nebraska i believe is facing two years prison time after pleading guilty on thursday to threatening you on instagram. language like this, do you feel safe? you shouldn't. and your security detail is far too thin and a competent to protect you. this world is unpredictable these days, anything can happen to anyone. on a personal level, how freaked out are you? how are you feeling about this? more broadly, can anything be done to protect you, to enhance your safety and the safety of other election officials? should more be done? >> we have seen thousands and

thousands of threats to secretaries of state and election workers across the country since last year. and i will tell you, at one point there were so many threats that the colorado state patrol couldn't even go through them all. and when someone is telling you over and over that they're going to come and cause you harm, you have to believe them and take it seriously. with that said, i will not be intimidated. it furthers and emboldens my resolve because i know that the work i am doing is important to safeguard democracy. secretaries of state, the democrats, we will not be stopped but we have to take it seriously so this year in colorado i lead legislation to make it a crime to docks anybody or retaliate against election workers i was able to pass the first law in the nation on instead of threats it is now three -- compromise voting equipment. and i also passed legislation to guarantee state protection to myself. >> janet griswold, thank you so

much and please obviously stay safe. i appreciate you coming on on sunday morning. all right, 50 years ago, the nation was embroiled in another political scandal. right after the break, we head back to watergate. what drives you? what do you want to leave behind? what do you want to give back? what do you want to be remembered for? that's your why. it's your purpose, and we will work with you every step of the way to achieve it. at pnc private bank, we'll help you take care of the how. so tell us - what's your why? ♪♪ ready to style in just one step? introducing new tresemme one step stylers. five professional benefits. one simple step. totally effortless. styling has never been easier. tresemme. do it with style. ♪ ♪

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arrested for breaking into the democratic national committee headquarters. today, we know it as the watergate scandal. brought down the president of the united states. on that night of the notorious break-in, no one had any idea it would become one of the defining offense of the 20th century. nbc's justice correspondent, pete williams takes us back. quite literally, to the scene of the crime. >> early in the morning, 50 years ago, these two men or washington d.c. police officers responding to a report of a break-in at the headquarters of the democratic national

committee. walking through these very same halls, they didn't know what to expect. >> i think we're on to something yes but i have no idea how big it's going to be. >> no idea that the arrest they made that night would lead to the discovery of a political scandal that ended with richard nixon becoming the only american president ever to leave office in the middle of his term. >> therefore, i shall resign the presidency effective at noon tomorrow. >> watergate change the american political system and the very language of scandal. >> at first a look like a petty crime. five minute rested, june 17th, 1972 after breaking into the democratic national party headquarters. paul leaper and john barron responded to the police radio call. while they were on regular duty as part of a plainclothes detail. a security guard at the watergate office building called police after noticing that someone had to use tape to prevent the stairwell doors from walking.

with guns drawn, based search room by room in the sweet democratic office is now occupied by a publishing company until they came to a room of cubicles. officer john parents suddenly saw an arm. >> i yield something to the effect, get your hands up, et cetera et cetera. expletive deleted, i'm sure. and paul came in, jumped up on a desk, pointed his gun down. the five hands go up here. >> this photo shows the actual desk the watergate burglar's head behind. one of them was holding a raincoat and wouldn't drop it. they aren't feared it was hiding a gun. >> he dropped the coat, he didn't have a gun in his hand but it was precarious that point, i almost was getting ready to go around. go >> you're thinking this might be a burglary. so what do you think when you see five guys stand up and suits? >> these guys all look like businesspeople. so i'm thinking, is this some kind of international thing? >> you mean like spies? >> i don't really want to, i

know i mean something big. >> the white house at first called it a third rate burglary. it soon became clear that something much bigger was involved. even though all these years later, it's never been firmly established who ordered the break-in or what the purpose was. but from the beginning, a big question was how high out today go? as the scandal spread to nixon's aides, he claimed he knew nothing. that defensive began to unravel in part based on facts uncovered by washington post reporters bob woodward and carl bernstein. a year later, the senate opened its marathon watergate hearings. a key witness, john dean, the white house counsel said nixon knew about efforts to cover up the break-in. >> i began by telling the president that there was a cancer growing on the presidency. and if the cancer was not removed, the president himself would be killed by it. >> then a spectacular discovery. virtually all important oval office conversations were recorded on audiotape. because president nixon had ordered the installation of

recorders. >> good evening. the country tonight is in the midst of what may be the most serious constitutional crisis in its history. >> when a special prosecutor archibald cox, push to get the tapes, nixon wanted cox fired. both the attorney general and deputy attorney general refused to do it and quit. in what became known as the saturday night massacre. under an order from the supreme court, the white house eventually turned over the tapes in july 1974. after a house committee voted to impeach in key republicans told nixon they'd lost faith in him. the 37th president of the united states resigned amid a tearful goodbye to his staff. >> always remember, others may hate you but those who hate you don't win unless you hate them. >> many of the presidents top aides were convicted for the roles in the scandal. nixon successor, gerald ford, give him a full pardon. it all started with a routine

police radio call and to very surprise policeman. >> the thing just kept growing. in my mind. i'm thinking about every hour or so, my god, what are we involved with here? >> pete williams, nbc news, washington. >> incredible stuff. you just heard the watergate scandal referred to, contemporaneously, as the most serious constitutional crisis in our history. which is what it was at the time. but today, the country is grappling with with feels like a ruling constitutional crisis. judge michael let a testified that donald trump's scheme on january six to stop the certification of the election could have set off a revolution within a constitutional crisis. next, more on the history of watergate and the parallels between these two scandals. e two scandals nt to make the right moves fast... get decision tech from fidelity. [ cellphone vibrates ] you'll get proactive alerts for market events

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♪ only at vanguard you're more than just an investor you're an owner. that means that your priorities are ours too. our interactive tools and advice can help you build a future for the ones you love. that's the value of ownership. as the country marks the 50th anniversary of watergate, the house committee investigating the january 6th attacks prepare us for another world when we can public hearings. these two major political scandals maybe nearly half a century apart but the investigation into the watergate scandal has been widely hailed as a potential model for how the january six committee could have -- its own inquiries the restriction. the new york times notes a few key differences, writing quote, the president they panel is racing the clock, and funding

to uncover all that it can with the recognition that republicans may win back the house majority and pulled the plug on the committee's endeavors come january. nixon was defiant, but not at the level of former president donald j trump. and truth was not up for debate in 1973. joining me is elizabeth holtzman, she's the former u.s. congresswoman who served on the house judiciary committee and voted to impeach for nixon. she is currently running for the house seat in new york's tenth congressional district. and she's the author of the case for impeaching trump. in addition, we have michael conway, he is the lecturer at northwestern university and served as counsel for the house to -- u.s. house judiciary committee in the impeachment inquiry of president nixon. thank you for joining us. michael, i want to pick up on that point about truth not being up for debate during the watergate investigation. you've actually written about this. you argue that folks are often missed remembering the watergate era.

can you expand on that? how so? >> of course, sam, so initially, the republicans objected to the investigation of. calling it gerald ford than a congressman called a witch hunt. the house republicans for pretty much at the outset, before the tapes were released saying that this was completely a political event. it changed of course when the tapes became known and certainly with the tapes or played. but also, we have to remember that there were democrats serving with congresswoman, represented a man from south carolina. his district has voted 80% for richard nixon in november of 1972. so even the democrats for not necessarily in support of an impeachment inquiry the president. but one thing i will mention is on the house voted to authorize the impeachment inquiry.

410 members voted in favor of starting the inquiry. not necessarily impeaching the president, but starting the inquiry. you would never get the level of bipartisanship today. >> that's funny, that's my question for you, elizabeth. the seven house republicans from the house judiciary committee of the time voted to impeach richard nixon for abuse of power. this go around, only two house republicans are willing to associate themselves with the january six committee. one of whom is retiring, the other who is likely to be defeated in her primary. what do you, how do you explain the differences here? is it just different times or is that something bigger? >> well, it's hard to understand what happened in watergate in terms of the house judiciary committee. it's that, excuse me, the republicans were willing to follow the facts. they didn't necessarily want to agree with democrats. they were following the facts, initially they thought, as michael said, that there was

nothing there. there was no there there. but the fact is what they followed. in fact, the rest of the republicans on the committee did not join in the impeachment vote. they kept saying, well the facts don't show that nixon was involved. but they were wrong and ultimately, when the smoking gun tape came out, all the republicans joined. so it became not just bipartisan, it became unanimous. nixon had to resign. now what we see is that there's an alternative reality. it's not that the republicans have following the facts, they make up their own facts. and there is no way that our democracy can function if people make up their facts. and that's the danger we, that's the danger we confront today. and by the way, the same thing happened in the senate. the senate had its own hearings before the house judiciary committee had hearings. the top republican, howard baker, a conservative

republican, that was a complete ally of richard nixon. he came up with the questions. what did the president know, when he know it? he thought the answers would show the president knew nothing. but when the answers became the president know something, he followed the facts and not the press. >> don't ask question you don't know the answer to. michael, picking up on that point. there are, this is the real contrast in my view. the public didn't know about nixon's involvement in the watergate break in until very late in the scandal. whereas right now, we knew about trump's involvement almost in realtime. the recording of his call, for instance, with georgia secretary of state raffensperger came out pretty quickly after it took place. what do you think is the difference here and how that impacts public opinion. is it just at the public's condition to this being trump? we know about this stuff. we kind of factored into the

equation. whereas with nixon, it was a huge bombshell that completely moot public opinion when it became public? >> well i think the existence of social media is a huge difference. back in 1974, when our committee was doing its work, you saw the news on the major networks, the southern news on nbc. you couldn't go to your partisan corner and get a different version of the facts alternative facts, as a congresswoman said. i think another key differences the personality and demeanor of president nixon versus president trump. nixon was in a very close election in 1960, there were advisers then who urged him to challenge the election. and as a lawyer, he concluded no, it would be too disruptive of the country. and so he didn't challenge jack kennedy's election despite allegations of voter fraud. and it with the supreme court ordered nixon to turn over the

tapes, he obeyed. i think if the supreme court today or president trump to turn over something, i think it's more likely than not that he'd be defiant. so part of it, i believe, is just the personality, there wasn't really the cult of richard nixon as there is the cult of donald trump. >> fair enough. elizabeth, less of the stage. 1972, you are the youngest woman ever elected to congress. you're on the hostage share committee. i'm kind of curious. in realtime, do you recognize the historic endeavor that you are now part of? and how does the mood change among members of the house specifically on the committee as you get into this, as you are involved in this impeachment process to the stakes feel heightened? do you guys talk in height in terms. how does the mood schiff among sitting members when you're involved. >> when i was elected in november 1972, the cover up,

the watergate cover-up was so successful that i didn't even want to be on the house judiciary committee. and they put me, the leadership of the house, put me on the house judiciary committee against manuel. they never would've done that. if anybody had any clue that the judiciary committee would be sitting in the middle of one of the most historical moments of the 20th century in american history. so that's what's consciousness was. it was only after judge serena imposed tough sentences and the burglar said, one of the burglars broke down and said you know there are higher ups involved that this watergate cover-up started breaking apart. i think for me, what we were presented with as members of the judiciary committee was fact after fact after a fact. we had these big black books, no books that were secret

material. we had to put him in our saves in our offices. but the fact of the matter is that every single day, we would sit down, head of the judiciary committee staff would read us a statement of fact. by the time that finished, i felt as though i were in a swamp. just going down, down, down and quicksand, that there was no bottom to the level of criminality of richard nixon. and it made me really of set an angry because even though i disagreed with his policies, i did not want to see my president engage in this conduct. and so by the time the vote came, it was a very sober moment because i knew that i was, there was overwhelming evidence but i didn't want to be in the position of having to sit in judgment of a president of the united states and finding that he engaged not just criminal conduct but abuse of conduct. by the way, watergate included much more than the break-in in

the cover-up. it included illegal wiretaps. included seeking the irs on political enemies. it included all kinds of misuse of power to guard to cambodia. and then we find out the president, president nixon tried to and succeeded in stymieing the paris peace talks thereby prolonging the vietnam war and the death of americans and the vietnamese for four more years. his abuses of power were huge. and the interesting thing is he was held accountable. not fully but partially. >> all right, elizabeth holzman, michael -- i cool do this probably for another hour but we don't have the luxury of doing it for another hour. but thank you both for joining us on sunday afternoon. really appreciate it. we do have another hour of velshi coming up so please do not go anywhere. meets power? you try crazy things... ...because you're crazy...

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19th. father's day. i am sam stein, filling in for ali velshi. the january six committee is pressing on with its hearings, for the next week. the committee will hold two more public hearings to present to the american public the findings of its investigation so far. in his hearings last week, the panel presented testimony about how donald trump handles associates butting heads with many members of his own administration. most notably vice president