tv Dateline MSNBC June 19, 2022 11:00pm-1:00am PDT
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and is no different. richard chirac is that, is quirkiness, adventurous spirit, devotion to those boycotts, all gone. >> we had a thing, it was called a richard file, if it wasn't stocked up and burning bright in the flames, almost leaking the treetops, it wasn't a good fire. so if you want a richard, fire that's the fire you've got to have. and when we are at scouting events, we have the big fire in the smoke coming up, we'll talk about richard. >> that is all for this edition of dateline, i'm natalie morales, thank you for watching. watching dragging me through the night, it haunts me. i didn't know that people were capable of that. he destroyed the rest of my life. >> intelligent, educated, accomplished.
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>> i am a professor, i am trying to seek a meaningful life. >> she had a prestigious career, a loving husband, a young daughter, but she also had a secret. >> i lived with this nightmare for 18 years. >> and it centered on murder. >> they followed him, they kidnapped him, and then they dumped his body. it was clearly planned. >> but did she know? >> i was in complete shock. they were dangerous and they were violent. >> why did she do it? >> i didn't realize she was involved as deep as she was. >> scholar, professor, mother. >> what is going to happen to my daughter? >> she certainly knew. >> she is a killer in your eyes? >> yes. >> everything was at stake. >> i could face life in prison, i am willing to do anything
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that needs to be done. now, i have the strength. she was the embodiment of the american dream, an immigrant who described a childhood of poverty and abuse. attended elite schools and rose to the top of her field. against all odds, norma patricia esparza became the well-respected psychology professor and a champion for children's health care, around the world. a success story, a life 40 years in the making. so, how on earth did it come to this? >> whatever the charges are, that they're asking me to plead guilty for, it's essentially something that i cannot accept. it would essentially be a lie. >> the professor's case would draw international attention.
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young mother and a professor, who is now in custody. >> the 39-year-old woman says she is the victim. >> and it started a heated debate. >> this is not america. this is not justice. this is abuse of power. >> did this well educated mother orchestrate a horrific murder? then sabotage the investigation? >> you don't get a pass to become a vigilante, and kidnap people and kill them. >> or, was she the victim at the center of it all? >> do you ask yourself, how did i get here? >> oh, absolutely. absolutely. i rewind so many events in my life. i rewind so many things in my mind. >> to try and make sense of this mystery, you do have to rewind. all the way back to 1974. the year patricia was born, in a small farming town, in southern mexico. >> it was just a very rural, rustic place. it's a town with unpaved streets, no sewage, no
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running water. >> the family moved to southern california for a better life. but patricia's life here wasn't easy. she says her dad physically abused her mother. >> my father had lots of difficulties, he was an alcoholic. he was quite violent with her. >> and patricia says she too was victimized by her dad. claiming he had sexually abused her, beginning when she was just five years old. >> as a five-year-old, i couldn't go to anybody for help. who could i go to? i couldn't go to him, he was the one abusing. i couldn't go to my mother. and, she couldn't stop him from beating her. so, i really had nowhere to turn. >> apparently, patricia didn't tell anyone at the time. both her mother and sister learned about the abuse later. patricia's brother said their father eventually admitted to
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him that the abuse had happenned. but the brother also said, his father would not respond to our questions about it. >> the way that i dealt with all that chaos, to throw myself into my books, into education. >> so, the bad things that were happening in your life were really driving you, to essentially be a better person? >> absolutely. >> to better yourself? >> and all her studies paid off, she excelled and earned a scholarship -- a prestigious boarding school in new hampshire. >> it must have been a culture shock, to go from the life that you had to this very privileged surrounding? >>. oh, absolutely. >> did you feel like you are living the american dream? >> oh, absolutely. i've always been so grateful to the u.s.. >> she probably could have had her pick of any ivy league school, but chose to attend pomona, a top notch college near her families california home. >> but on one weekend, in her
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sophomore year, her dreams of a happy college life were dashed. it was march 1995, when she made a decision that would haunt her for the rest of her life. >> i was a very serious student, wasn't a drinker, wasn't a partier. >> although she didn't go out often, one saturday night patricia decided to go to the el cortez nightclub. there, someone caught her eye. >> i met this person. we exchanged numbers. >> what was it about him that attracted you? >> there was really nothing attractive or unattractive, it was just somebody, somebody who seemed to be nice. i didn't think that i would see this person again. >> but, he called the very next morning and invited patricia to breakfast along with her sister and friend. after they ate, he offered patricia a ride back to campus. >> when we get to pomona he
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says, before i go would you mind if i get a glass of water? so, we go to my dorm, my dorm room. >> and it was then, she says, the casual day turned terrifying. >> when we're inside he tells me that he wants to have sex. i tell him no, i'm not interested. he starts to get aggressive and starts to try to kiss me. i push him away. we're struggling and then ultimately, he takes off my pants and he forces himself on me. when he's finished, i just turn away from him and i, half naked, curled up into a ball and started sobbing. when he gets to the
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door he tells me, you have a lot of problems, and he walks away. >> patricia says she was raped. like many victims, she felt somehow it was her fault. >> oh, god, i felt so dirty. so ashamed. i was just blaming myself. i thought like why did you -- why did you do this? why did you bring him here? why did you trust him? >> patricia didn't call the police. but, the next day she went to a college health center, where she said she saw a nurse. but, says the nurse didn't take any action to report a rape allegation. >> i told her i had been raped and i remember her reaction because it made me feel just as ashamed. she didn't want to deal with it, she walked away. >> patricia herself, had walked away herself from terrible experiences before, but moving on from this proved nearly impossible. especially, with just weeks later police finding
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a body. coming up, that discovery would lead to a strange and sinister puzzle. >> i've been to a lot of scenes in my career but this one was a little more gruesome. >> a mystery victim, a crime of passion, and on the phone bill, a clue. >> there was a handwritten note that said, patty. >> when dateline continues. ovies can be a lot for young homeowners turning into their parents. bathrooms -- even if you don't have to go, you should try. we all know where the bathroom is and how to us it, okay? you know, the stevensons told me they saved money bundling their boat insurance with progressive. no one knows who those people are. -it can be painful. -hand me your coats. there's an extra seat right here. no, no, no, no, no. we don't need a coat wrangler. progressive can't save you from becoming your parents, but we can save you money when you bundle home, auto, and more with us. no one who made the movie is here. when you really need to sleep. when you bundle home, auto, and more with us. you reach for the really good stuff.
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>> was this a minor traffic accident? >> it was just a fender bender. >> gonzalo ramirez's pick up truck had been rear-ended by a white van. his friend in the passenger seat said not to stop. >> he said no, we won't pull over and exchange information. >> as the friend later told police, when he got out of the truck, several men got out of the van and the men attacked him. the friend ran to get help. >> he just turned and ran down the street at that time. >> his friend came back to the accident scene with police. but the white van was gone. >> the police arrive. is gonzalo there? >> no, he's nowhere to be found. >> he has just vanished? >> correct. >> any signs of a struggle? >> there were. >> i believe a shoe, that we believe belonged to mr. ramirez, a watch. and then, there was
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also a small amount of blood. >> gonzalo is now missing. possibly kidnapped. police had no idea where he might be. or who would have kidnapped him. now frantic, the friends called his family, at three that morning. after hearing the news, that his brother was missing, carlos ramirez started making phone calls. >> i called his friends. hey, have you seen my brother? >> carlos drove around that night searching, but never found gonzalo. >> and 8:30 the next morning, easter sunday 1995, investigator larry montgomery got a call at home. he immediately knew something bad had happened. >> it was my sergeant, and he told me there was a body found. and i was to respond. >> montgomery at the time was an experienced detective with the irvine california police department. he was used to dealing with murders, but this one stood out. >> i've been to a lot of scenes in my career, but this one was
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a little more gruesome. just because of the sheer amount of injury to the body. he was definitely hacked to death. >> the man's body had been found near a stretch of the 405 freeway. he had clearly suffered a brutal death. his body was sliced dozens of times, with some kind of heavy bladed knife. like a meat cleaver. or machete. his right-hand was nearly severed, and oddly there was some kind of blue towel-like material bound around the body. >> the blue towel was wrapped all around him, from the torso and legs, all the way up to the neck area. it was wrapped around five times around the neck. and then several times around the eyes. >> one thing was clear to police, this murder was personal. >> after looking at the victims injuries, i would say it was really consistent with someone who had some sort of heat or
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passion. the injuries were just consistent with someone very angry. >> detectives had so many questions, who was this man? why did this happen to him? >> one of the problems we had was we had no identification of the victim. >> another day passed and it was now monday. gonzalo's family heard that a body had been found in the area, praying it wasn't their brother, they called police. >> when this man called, he identified himself that he had a brother that was missing from the santa ana area. and, he was possibly kidnapped. and, he thought that it was very possibly his brother that was the victim. >> police were able to connect the dots rather quickly. the body they had found was that of gonzalo ramirez. and, when his family went to identify his remains, they could not believe how he looked. gonzalo's brother, benito. >> when we picked up my brother, we could not recognize his face. >> it's very sad. you know, i don't want nobody to see. one of his family the way we saw it. >> gonzalo left behind two little daughters, just one and
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two years old. >> he was a very good person. he was a responsible person. we have no idea why. >> police were also trying to find out why. their only witness was his friend, the last person to see him alive. >> he was pretty detailed and able to give the responding officers at that time a lot of good physical descriptions, of both the vehicle and the suspects. >> but the friend said he had no idea who the men in the white van were. or why a fender bender turned into a kidnapping and murder. >> where do you go from there? when you don't even know who these men are? >> generally, you would start with the individual who has been kidnapped. looking into their background and see what's going on in their life. whether they have financial issues, maybe a love relationship that has ended. >> detectives interviewed gonzales's friends, work
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associates and family members and got nothing. >> i don't think they were able to provide anything that could point the detectives, in that time, to the right direction. >> eventually investigators stumbled across something in gonzalo's home. something very curious, scrambled on his phone bill. >> there was a handwritten note that said, patty. and there were two numbers. >> was this patty someone they needed to speak to right away? >> it was. >> coming up, i was weeping and crying. it was really hard. >> patty is about to open up to the police. >> that's kind of a twist. threw a new whole element into the investigation. >> when dateline continues. ♪♪ age before beauty? why not both? visibly diminish wrinkled skin
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solve the mystery of who had kidnapped, tortured and murdered gonzalo ramirez. the leaves were thin until they stumbled along gonzalo's phone bill, where he had written the name patty. along with two phone numbers. they were eager to find her. mike murray was an orange county district attorney, he had worked this investigation back in 1995, but later joined the case. >> they called this patty? >> they did. >> where did it lead them? >> they contacted her and she agreed to come down to the police department and discuss gonzalo ramirez. >> the mysterious patty was
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then college student, patricia esparza. >> i'm detective meza, this is corporal buckles -- >> we work for the second -- >> she told the police that, gonzalo ramirez was a young man that she had met in santa ana, several weeks prior. they had danced together, she liked him, he seemed to like her, they had exchanged phone numbers. >> that's how her name and numbers came to be scrambled on his phone bill. but patricia didn't seem too concerned about why she was being questioned about gonzalo. >> at what point does she say, what is this about? why are you asking me about this man? >> she never does. >> she never asked? >> i don't ever recall her asking that question to the police during that interview. >> in the interview, patricia reluctantly told her story about what happened in the dorm room with gonzalo. >> while in your dorm, he took sexual advances of you, to the point of even possibly being
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raped by him. was this correct? >>. yes. he turned around and kissed me, and i just stopped him right away. i got up the instant when he kissed me, i was walking towards another chair, and then he got up also. that's when it happened. >> she told the police that he had sexually assaulted her. >> that's kind of a twist. that threw a whole new element into the investigation, what do they make of it? >> well, initially, they just wanted to hear what she had to say. >> she said the rape happened about two and a half months earlier. but, this was the first time she was reporting it to the police. all the while, she says her world was falling apart. >> i was just weeping, crying, it was really hard. really hard to put myself together. i wasn't doing my assignments as i should have, my grades were
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dropping. i was wasn't able to deal with the rape as well as i had wished i had. >> she also told police, that after the alleged rape, she confided in an ex-boyfriend named gianni van. they dated for about seven months but we're no longer together. still, one day when gianni stopped by her dorm room, she broke down and told him what happened. >> that must have been hard to finally open up. >> yeah, i didn't feel that i wanted to but i guess i did want someone to be there and understand. i wanted someone to just listen to me and make me feel that i wasn't so dirty and so ashamed. >> did he help you? did he make you feel better? >> at first, but then he became
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angry. i didn't understand why. yes, of course, you would be angry, of course, if someone did it to your sister, your friend. but we weren't together anymore. >> she told detectives about gianni and they listened very carefully. >> did you have a boyfriend at that time? okay, what's his name. >> gianni, well he wasn't my boyfriend at the time, actually. >> he was upset about it? >> yeah, of course. >> she did tell gianni that she had been raped by a man named gonzalo, but she said she wouldn't tell gianni what his whole name was or anything about how to locate him. she just wanted gianni to comfort her. she didn't want him to try to find this guy or retaliate in any way. >> did he express that he wanted to retaliate? >> she said, that he was angry. she didn't say he wanted to retaliate, just that he was angry and wanted more details than she wanted to disclose.
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>> an angry ex-boyfriend, could he have been angry enough to track gonzalo all on his own? investigator, dean folger. >> did this give the detectives something to cling on to, that he was so angry about the rape claim? >>. absolutely. you now have a motive for somebody wanting to do what they had done to mr. ramirez. >> detectives wanted to talk to gianni van and they would soon find a key piece of evidence that they believed would tie him to this murder. >> so, the detectives must be thinking, we've got our guy. >> they did. >> coming up, you tell me, right now, why you're not the guy. >> intense moments in the investigation room. >> was it a meat cleaver? >> just what kind of evidence did they have against a man named gianni van? >> it was a huge clue. >> when dateline continues.
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investigators now believe that this could be a case of an old boyfriend seeking revenge and they wanted to find ghani. >> did they go to talk to him. ? >> they did interview mr. van. >> where did that go,? he denied any involvement with the death of gonzalo ramirez? and told police that he could not have had any role in the murder, because patricia knew few details about gonzalo, including how to find him. >> do you know who this guy's, said no i just met him at the club that i don't know. it seemed like a nice guy and offered a ride home and that is it. dragging me through the night, when ghani came in for questioning, investigators were not buying the story. and they questioned the story particularly when he had a white van registered to him >>
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white van, that was there, rear-ended gonzalo ramirez, which is a big clue in this case. >> it was a huge clue. >> remember, the only eyewitness said several men in a white van beat and kidnapped gonzalo after a minor fender bender. >> where is the van? >> when police asked him if he was familiar with the white van or if he owned one, gianni denied owning one. when they confronted him with the fact that there is a white van registered in his name, he said, i don't own the van. it's registered under my name, but it actually belongs to a guy i know, who owns a transmission shop. >> police got search warrants for the transmission shop. and sure enough, the white van, registered to gianni van, was there. but that's not all they found. >> the people who process the shops, found one single drop of blood, in an office.
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>> investigators found something else. remember those old style towel dispensers and gestation bathrooms? the shop had that exact type of dispenser. >> the towel dispenser had blue towels in the dispenser. and, details that were wrapped around, the cloth that was wrapped around gonzalo ramirez was blue cloth. >> yet later, when that blood drop found in the shop was tested, the result was less than conclusive. >> did the blood match gonzalo ramirez? >> when they were in the dna plummer file, they could not exclude mr. ramirez, but was not strong enough to say that it was his. >> that was a problem for the investigation. so, police brought gianni, the ex-boyfriend, back in a second time for questioning. >> this is elizondo, badge number 5806, i am going to be conducting an interview of gianni van. >> but this time police had more information, they learned that he was good friends with the transmission shop owner.
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>> what is the relationship between you and the girlfriend and gonzalo ramirez, and the transmission in the van? all that comes into play, quite obviously there's a chain there, i'm interested in the chain. the common denominator, the common denominator, you understand what i'm saying, right? >> here's an intelligent guy, you're educated, is gianni van. >> okay. >> so, all arrows were pointing at gianni van. if patricia esparza has no connection to accurate transmission, then you are the link. >> detectives pressed gianni, asking about the weapon they thought was used to kill gonzalo ramirez. >> i don't even know who you're talking about. >> was it a meat cleaver? >> this entire thing, i don't know what you're talking about. >> you know what i'm talking about. >> gianni told police, he could never kill another human being. >> tell me why you're not the guy? >> you tell me right now, you tell me why you're not the guy, and why you should not be going to jail for murder. >> because i'm not an angry
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type of person. i've always been a loving person. i'm not quick to have a temper, and i would never think of such a thing. that's absurd. >> everything is there, we have the motive. do you see gianni, i am right at this point, at this junction of the interview. it's coming to a close. now, if you don't come out and give me more, gianni, you're going to be going to jail. for murder. >> okay. i don't know about anything. i swear to god. i don't know anything about what you're talking about. >> despite his denials, in march of 1996, nearly a year after the body was found, detectives arrested gianni van, for the murder of gonzalo ramirez. but, what investigators did not know, was patricia had more secrets. that would have a big impact on their case. >> coming up. >> i feared for my life. >> patricia and gianni, their relationship was far from over.
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>> this is a major game-changer. absolutely. >> i didn't know that people were capable of that. >> when dateline continues. when i was 16. now i have end-stage copd. my tip is, if you keep smoking, your freedom may only go as far as your oxygen tube. (announcer) you can quit. call 1-800-quit now for help getting free medication. are you one of the millions of americans who experience occasional bloating, gas, for help getting or abdominal discomfort? taking align can help. align contains a quality probiotic to naturally help soothe digestive upsets 24/7. try align, the pros in digestive health. police thought they had a solid
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case against beyond --, for the murder of gonzalo ramirez. investigators were largely basing their case on the words of patricia esparza. she said gonzalo raped her. she confided in gianni and he got very angry. giving him a motive for murder. but then, prosecutors found out something surprising, something that changed everything. >> ms. esparza and gianni van had gotten married, in las vegas, after the murder. patricia, who told authorities gianni was her ex boyfriend, had secretly married him, one month after the murder. investigator, dean folger. >> based upon this false approved privilege, in the state of california, in no way was patricia going to be forced to testify against gianni, who was still denying any involvement. >> without her testimony, prosecutor mike murray, it would be very hard to prosecute gianni. >> this is a major game-changer. >> absolutely. because ms.
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esparza had so much information and was so immersed in the case that the prosecution would be hard turned, to the point that they wouldn't be able to prove the case beyond a reasonable doubt. so, rather than put the case in front of a jury and take the chance that without all that critical background information, that the jury wouldn't have a full picture. the decision was made to dismiss the case against gianni van. >> so, he walked. and investigators were, to say the least, unhappy with patricia esparza. >> i, as well as, because detectives prior to me knew that they got married, due to the simple fact that they needed to keep patricia from testifying from against gianni. >> why would patricia do that? she told us that in no way we were trying to protect gianni or the other men, in the white van, from that noise. she said she had no choice, gianni forced her into the marriage. >> so, how do you get into that situation? it sounds almost, -- how does that happen?
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>> i was, again, i was 20, i was not very educated, in terms of being streetwise. >> but why say yes? why say yes? >> i feared for my life. when i was told i had to marry him, that's when i learned that gonzalo ramirez had been killed. and i thought to myself, oh my goodness, if they are able to do that to him what are they going to do to me if i don't follow what they say. >> patricia says besides being naive, she was also extremely vulnerable. she described herself as haunted, a victim of an alleged rape in college and sexual abuse as a child. she questioned her own judgment and wondered how she could've ever dated gianni in the first place. after all, he was accused of a horrendous murder, one that included toturing the victim. >> i didn't know that people were capable of that. of course, you read things in the newspaper, you see things on tv,
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but you never think it's going to cross your path. you never think that you are actually going to befriend a person that's capable of doing that. >> why not just go to the police and tell them everything? >> i wish they had told me, we will protect you, we will protect you if you come forward. i wish they had told me that. i didn't know. i didn't know that they were capable of protecting me. >> and, so, she says she agreed to marry a man she believed was a murderer. >> were you in love when you married him? >> no, i was trapped. i just felt like it was another punishment for me. we never lived together, nobody knew about the marriage. i mean, how could you possibly be in love with somebody who's so horrific? >> patricia says she soon dropped all contact with gianni, but that didn't change her status as his wife. >> so, a marriage was
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potentially keeping a murderer free? >> correct. >> even though police thought they had solved the murder, it went into the cold case file. as for patricia, she says she just wanted to put the whole, unbelievable tragedy behind her, and get her life back. >> i thought to myself, you're not going to allow them to take away what's so valuable, and that's the ability to trust. how in the world am i going to continue on? >> but she did, she studied abroad in africa. then graduated from pomona, the first person in her family to get a college degree. she went on to work as a political activist. all the while, santa ana detective, dean folger, was keeping track of her and beyond even. >> patricia's life really changed over the years. >> yes. >> three, four, five years passed, the terrible events in california seemed further and
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further away. and in 2000, came another dramatic turn in patricia's life, when she met a distinguished caller. >> she had this freshness, this honesty, that i found very rare. >> of course, he had no idea the patricia had dark secrets in her past. >> coming up. >> he's been my strength ever since i met him. >> a new romance, and a stunning revelation. >> she broke down and started crying, i was willing to take any risks, whatever it was, in order to be with her. >> when dateline continues. s that fit you in 3 easy steps. tell us your style, size and price range. we learn what you like and what you don't. then, our expert stylists deliver pieces that match your vibe and fit your wallet. with try before you buy, keep what you love, and send back the rest. plus, shipping and returns are on us. discover new looks with a stylist by your side. stitch fix.
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until she met someone special. >> this was really a fresh start for you? >> meeting jorge. >> yes absolutely. he's a wonderful human being. >> his name was jorge mancillas. >> was it like the first time you laid eyes on patricia? >> when i met patricia, she was this tiny little woman, who was intelligent, very well organized, a real leader. she was inspiring everyone around her. >> patricia, now 25 years old, fell for jorge, while they worked together on a california political campaign. >> did you two have an instant connection? >> i certainly was taken by her. very quickly. we both came from very limited environments in mexico. we have both worked very hard to open up opportunities for ourselves, through education. >> just like patricia, jorge was a high achiever. with a ph.d. in neuroscience. they
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both have degrees in psychology. one thing he particularly admired in patricia, was her desire to help people. >> she wanted to get a ph.d. because they had a children's clinic. because she wanted to help children. learn how to deal with difficult circumstances she was faced with as a child. >> it wasn't long before the 48-year-old decided he wanted to spend the rest of his life with patricia. he proposed to her at new york's world trade center, in august of 2001. >> patricia was thrilled when i proposed to get married, and she, of course, accepted. >> did you feel like finally my life is taking a turn for the better? and maybe i can put all this behind me? >> oh absolutely. absolutely.
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he has been my strength ever since i met him. >> but within hours of that proposal, everything suddenly turned upside down. >> that night she broke down and started crying and told me that she could not marry me, because she was already married. but it was a forced marriage, not a real marriage. but she could not tell me of the circumstances, because she felt it would put me at risk. and she did not want me to live under the threat she was living under. >> so, this is the first time we are hearing about her past? >> yes. she refused to tell me. and she was crying. and i had never seen her like that. >> patricia says she begged jorge not to ask her details about her first marriage. >> he was very respectful of my privacy. he did not ask me. i told him not to ask me. because i wasn't able to tell him. and he said well, whatever it is, we will deal with it together. >> the couple faced a dilemma. they wanted to become husband and wife, but of course, could not because patricia is already married. so, jorge hired a
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lawyer. and patricia ended up telling that attorney everything. >> after she talks to the lawyer, she told me that he could not share the facts with me. but that she was right, it was better for me not to know. >> one thing he did know is that he really wanted to marry patricia. so he asked that lawyer to help. after three long years of negotiations, nine years after the murder, gianni finally agreed to a divorce. jorge and patricia got married. but jorge still did not know her deep secrets. >> weren't you so curious? >> i was curious. i was completely mystified by why and what it was that was so threatening. >> was it because you love her so much? >> i not only loved her, but i realized how unique she was. i
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felt so at ease of someone, who i felt i could completely trust. that i was willing to take any risks, whatever it was, that was lurking in her past, in order to be with her. >> in 2004, the couple would. life moved on, and they relocated to a small town, in france. both comuted to jobs in nearby, geneva. patricia worked for the world health organization, as a consultant. became a psychology professor at a local university. five years later, in 2009, came another life-changing event. the couple welcomed a daughter, ariana. >> after all you've been through, what was that like for the birth of your daughter? it must of been like a rebirth. >> oh my goodness. i know that every parent knows how different the world looks, once you have a little tiny, little human being, looking up at you. you feel that you want to go out there and actually create a better world. >> finally, patricia had a
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loving husband. a happy family. a successful professional career. she even rubbed elbows with the likes of hillary clinton. it was delayed she always dreamed of. but while patricia esparza was building a perfect world, the murder of gonzalo ramirez remained unsolved. her two daughters was just tyler's when there were. killed by 2010 they were a young women, growing up in mexico it just some photographs to remember him. >> it's not the same. it was very hard. >> it felt like we really wanted him to be there. >> gonzalo's brother carlos saw the pain. >> i see on their eyes. they get sad. it's really sad. >> carlos and his brother benito, were left with so many questions. >> we felt frustrated, because we could not find out what happened. why my brother was killed. and we did not know nothing.
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>> investigator, carefully reviewed the case file from the mid 1990s. >> what did you want to take a second? look at >> at that time dna, in the mid 90s was fairly new. but it was also advancing rapidly. so i just simply requested that the crime lab, re-examine the blood. >> the blood found in the transmission shop, the shop that the prime suspect, gianni van had access to. the original dna test said the blood might be gonzalo ramirez. but there is nothing certain. >> was it different a second time? around >> there was a significant change. although the crime lab could not say it was definitively mr. ramirez. the numbers were astronomical, that i had to be his. >> more sophisticated testing, led to a stronger conclusion. >> we missed a ramirez had been inside that transmission shop. >> so, in 2010, 15 years after the murder, investigator filch or brought the case to prosecutor mike murray, who is known for his work on cold
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cases. he intern contacted gonzalez brothers. he says they were surprised to hear from him. >> both brothers said that they had figured that with all the years that had gone past since his murder, that nobody was paying attention anymore. that he was just another young hispanic man, who had been killed and the police probably were not even investigating the case anymore. >> the confirmation of his dna in the shop, was an important step. but the prosecutor knew they needed more. a stronger connection between gonzalo ramirez and his suspected killer gianni van. >> we still needed to establish, how it is that gianni we would have known who it was who allegedly raped patricia esparza. >> was that kind of the missing piece all along? >> to me that. was >> patricia is the key to helping them connect the dots. but as far as the authorities knew, she was still married to
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gianni and could not be compelled to testify against him. >> i was constantly running their social security, numbers all their information. finding out where they were. and then i would try to locate a divorce certificate. wherever they were. >> so you're just constantly doing random record checks. >> correct. >> it took years of random checks, but finally, the detective got hit from patricia in chicago. where she had attended graduate school. with a one phone call, he learned patricia and gianna were no longer married. >> how did that feel, after all those years, that you finally get a hit on a divorce certificate? >> it felt. good there's no doubt about that. >> he immediately caught a plane to chicago. >> our next move was, to just show up at her doorstep. and try to have a conversation
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with. her >> surprise, we're here. >> what happened? >> we got to chicago and we found out she had married, and move to europe. >> moved to france. out of his jurisdiction. was it a bit of game cat mouse with? patricia >> yes you can call it. that >> coming up. an explosive new detail about that night. >> it certainly made me realize, that patricia was involved. >> the past patricia thought she'd escape, is about to come charging back. >> i wanted patricia esparza to know that we knew she had lied. i wanted to see why she did that. >> when dateline continues. progressive, but there's no saving that casserole!" [ both laugh ] i just love that word "bundle." it's so fun. two things coming together like a force of nature, like it was really meant to be, y'know? yes, yes, i do. and i'm so glad you wanna save money.
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rodney, set up a bundle for jon hamm. mm! of course! jon, is it still cool if i catch a ride home with you? i never said it was. but technically you didn't say it wasn't. it's not. yet. ♪ ♪ fight fleas and ticks with seresto. eight months continuous protection against fleas and ticks. it's effective and vet recommended. seresto. learn more at seresto.com. ♪ ♪ one prilosec otc in the morning blocks heartburn all day and all night. prilosec otc prevents excess acid production that can cause heartburn. so don't fight heartburn, block it. with prilosec otc. detectives on the hunt for
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partner wrote an email to patricia, asking for her assistance in the gonzalez ramirez murder case. he said i hope you believe me when i say that you are not a person of interest, nor are you a suspect in this case. >> did you all believe this, at the time? or was this a technique to get her out of the rabbit hole? >> i think there was a thought process amongst all of us, that we didn't know if she was involved or not, my intent if we could ever get an interview with her, was to try to get her to give us the information we needed to arrest kuany. >> your primary goal was to talk to? >> correct. >> but the email didn't work, but russia wouldn't agree to be interviewed. however, investigators didn't stop there and building a case. if prosecutor murray couldn't get patricia to testify, they needed to find someone else, who could link giuliani and gonzalo. >> is it like finding a needle in a haystack? finding that person to shed light on it? >> as it turns out, no.
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>> re-reading the file, he noticed a name. nancy lunar. she had been with patricia at her sister's the night when they met gonzalo adel cortez. murray said investigator -- and when he did lunar told him something that changed the case completely. she said that, patricia brought giuliani to the club and identified gonzalo at the met as the man who raped her. >> she told her boyfriend, who gonzalo ramirez was and brought him back to the club and pointed him out to her boyfriend. >> this was a bombshell, patricia high told police all along, she didn't know anything about the murder. now, a new witness could pace patricia in the club with peony, the nightgowns olive was clint. >> did that change the focus of patricia? >> it certainly made me realize that patricia was involved. >> it also made him take a fresh look at everything patricia had said to police,
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and led to a disturbing conclusion. >> even after knowing that gonzalo ramirez had been brutally murdered, she was willing to sit down, at the age of 19 or 20 with harden homicide it vista gaiters from the santa ana invite department, and lie to them, repeatedly. >> now murray had a stronger case against gianni and he was starting to think he had a case against patricia as well. so of course he wanted to question patricia. >> i wanted mrs. pars out to know, that we knew that she had lied. and that she had tried to derail a murder investigation for 20 years. i wanted to see why, she did that. i wanted to give her an opportunity to explain why she would marry the person who, seem to be the prime suspect in a burger murder. >> but remember, patricia was in france. out of reach. >> when somebody is in another
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country and you don't have jurisdiction, there's not a lot you can do. she was not willing to speak, which was her right, shouldn't have to. >> their only hope was that she would return to the u.s.. so they put her name on the homeland security watchlist, in case she did. the next move, was hers. >> so, we waited. >> waited for? >> misses far to come back to the united states. coming up, a surprise for the professor. >> that was the longest night of my life. >> and another for investigators. >> consular was there at the club and i identified him. >> did any of the details surprise you, about what patricia had to say when she finally broke her silence? >> i didn't realize that she was involved as deep as she was. >> when dateline continues. (terrie) if you're a smoker. i have a tip for you. make a video of yourself... before all this happens.
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the murder of gonzalo ramirez, prosecutor mike marie got the colleague been waiting for. patricia esparza had boarded a plane in geneva, headed for the u.s.. >> i know your patient man, but what is a bit of a shock when he got that call? >> it was a bit of a shocking i was getting impatient. >> he just hop on a plane to go talk to? her >> yes that's exactly what we. did >> i was coming to the u.s. for professional travel. and boston was a layover for me. >> she made her way through customs at logan airport and handed her passport to the customs after the. sir >> i noticed something was wrong when he stop talking. any started to turn red. he asked me for my social security number, to make sure i was the person on the screen. and, i realized at that point that something was wrong. that this was not a regular procedure.
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and that's when he gave the document to another woman, another officer who took me to a back room. search through my luggage. and then handcuffed me. >> patricia had no idea, that murray was about to confront her with new evidence. and new suspicions about the role she may have played in gonzalo's murder. >> that was the longest night of my life. >> the meeting happened at a holding facility in the airport. >> i was not naive. she had lied to investigators in 1995. she had married the primary suspects in the case. she had a life in france. that i'm sure she did not want to give up. i was reasonably certain that ship is not going to talk to. us >> did you get anything? >> no. we did not. >> that must have been really frustrating. >> to me, it was more about giving her that opportunity, and having her remember that opportunity later. down the line. >> marie then delivered a big blow, patrician ever saw coming. he charged her with
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first degree murder. >> was that a complete? shaq >> oh absolutely. and the first thoughts, that ran through my head was what's? what is going to happen in my daughter? >> she called her husband. jorge mancillas, who is back in france with a three-year-old daughter. he knew patricia had a dark secret. but never knew how dark. >> are you, thinking now i need to? now >> i need to know what happened. >> she told me the basic points of the case. and i immediately started searching now that i had a name and some information. >> patricia was brought back to orange county, to a jail in santa ana. >> i felt as if i was transported into a different planet, when i went into jail. i mean that is a world that i was completely unknown to me. how you have no control over what you eat, when you eat it, where you eat it, when you sleep, everything is stripped
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away from you. >> the prosecutor hopes sometime in, jail with a murder charge hanging over her head, might finally cause patricia to break her silence. about what happened to gonzalo ramirez. >> i made it very clear to her attorney in the beginning, that i was interested in speaking to patricia esparza, if that was something she wanted to do. but i could not make any promises about what would or would not happen with her case. but i would give her an opportunity to make in immunize statement. we would assess was it is she had to say. and we would decide whether we would offer her anything, or nothing. >> patricia spent two months behind bars. finally, in december 2012. she broke. behind closed doors, patricia and the prosecutor came face to face once again. >> i don't know if you remember miss aspires a. i met you in the airport. >> with their lawyers sitting next to her, she finally opened up. starting with the encounter
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with gonzalo ramirez, all those years ago in her dorm room. >> as a struggle, more he, he became a bit more aggressive. i was pushing him back and i am, and some, point he pinned me down, and i was wearing a pair of jeans. and he took those off. >> she told the prosecutor how she then confided in gianni about the alleged rape. >> that infuriated him. he got really upset. he asked me who was it. and i told him his name is gonzalo ramirez. >> i met emmanuel cortez. >> for the first time with investigators, she admitted that she was at the club the night gonzalo is killed. >> i remember gianni being really an edge that night. and i just felt, i just felt so much pressure at that point. and we went to al cortez. we were there for, i don't know, i actually don't know. i don't know. but gonzalo ramirez was there at the club. and i
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identified him. >> when gianni told you we wanted you to point this guy out at the club, did he tell you what he was gonna do? >> a, intimidate him, scare him, rough him up. >> the long cold case turned away hot. police thought they finally had enough evidence and re-arrested gianni van a second time, for the murder of gonzalo ramirez. and this time they made more arrests. two other people who are at the transmission shop that night. >> it was clearly a plan. they had identified gonzalo ramirez at the club. they followed him from the club. they staged a car accident. they kidnapped him. they taken him back to a transmission shop, from santa and it's a coastal mesa. then they dumped his body intervened. that did not just happen spontaneously. >> all of them pleaded not guilty. it took a long time, but gonzalo ramirez family found out they were finally
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getting some answers. and possibly some justice. >> we tell the prosecutor, we tell the detectives, we trust in you. we trust you guys. i hope this guy is going to get what they deserve, for the grime they did. we still trust the law, of california. >> now authorities had to consider the fate of patricia speier's a. under one, hand her cooperation made the case against the other defendants, on the other, she admitted to playing a role in the murder. investigator dean fault. sure >> did any of the details surprise you? about what patricia had to? say when she finally broke her silence? >> yes. i knew she was the catalyst for this whole. thing i knew she had some involvement. i did not realize she was involved this deep. >> just how deeply? as you'll see, that would become a matter of dispute. but in return for her cooperation, patricia was granted bail. and allowed to keep her passport. meaning, she could return home to europe. >> in 20, years i've never agreed, to recommend velena special circumstance murder
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case. >> why now? >> she, was willing to use her mother's home as collateral. and said that she would come back, for any subsequent hearings. i did not believe that she would jeopardize her mother's home. and financial security. and flee. >> her husband, jorge mancillas was back in europe. trying to understand the secret his wife had kept from him for years. >> i could not understand how she could be living with such a traumatic event in the past. i was very moved, that she tried to protect me. because then i understood, what was the threat for me and our family. >> there was no anger? she should've told me. i should have known what is going on? >> no. i felt frustrated, because i thought that perhaps i could've done something. had i known what the circumstances were. >> patricia arrived home just
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before christmas. >> i cherished every minutes of the day, when i was with my daughter. when i went back to geneva. i felt so blessed. and so fortunate, that my life had been given back to me. the life we had work so hard to create. >> those days around christmas and new year's were very happy. we thought the nightmare was over. >> but the nightmare was far from over. coming up. defiance. >> he is willing to destroy a family, knowing of innocence. >> the professor and her husband straight back. >> i knew her, heart i knew her soul. >> this is the persecution of
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an innocent woman. >> when dateline continues. of bipolar depression can leave you down and in the dark. but what if you could begin to see the signs of hope all around you? what if you could let in the lyte? discover caplyta. caplyta is a once-daily pill, proven to deliver significant relief from bipolar depression. unlike some medicines that only treat bipolar i, caplyta treats both bipolar i and bipolar ii depression. and, in clinical trials, feelings of inner restlessness and weight gain were not common. caplyta can cause serious side effects. call your doctor about sudden mood changes, behaviors, or suicidal thoughts right away. antidepressants may increase these risks in young adults. elderly dementia patients have increased risk of death or stroke. report fever, stiff muscles, or confusion, which may be life-threatening, or uncontrollable muscle movements, which may be permanent. these aren't all the serious side effects. in the darkness of bipolar i and ii depression, caplyta can help you let in the lyte.
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learn more at seresto.com. ♪ ♪ ♪♪ making friends again, billy? i like to keep my enemies close. guys, excuse me. i didn't quite get that. i'm hard of hearing. ♪♪ oh hey, don't forget about the tense music too. would you say tense? i'd say suspenseful. aren't they the same thing? can we move on guys, please? >> >> generous hearings resume alexa, turn on the subtitles. and dim the lights. ok, dimming the lights.
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this week. we'll focus on accusations that then president trump leaned on state officials in attempt to alter election tallies. one of the witnesses scheduled to testify is georgia secretary of state brad raffensperger. now, back to dateline. back to dateline. >> many of the details of the murder plot that began with a strange kidnapping at this intersection in santa ana remained a mystery for almost 20 years that was, until this patricia is parcel was arrested and finally agreed to speak to investigators about the final night gonzalo ramirez was
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killed. >> i was in complete shock. i felt it was clearly orchestrated, and here i am. oh my goodness. it had to be orchestrated. >> but her role in the case and the killing was far from clear. we'll see a victim, or a witness? or something much more sinister? >> she has certainly allowed gonzalez family to sit for 20 years and wondered what had happened to their brothers, to their father. >> do you think patricia is far as a is just as responsible as the others? >> well when you say just as responsible, if you're asking if somebody aids and abets in a crime, and is a willing participant in a crime, are they just as responsible in the eyes of the law? are they guilty of that crime? the answer is yes. an, yes. are they morally as responsible? maybe not.
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>> patricia, charged with first degree murder, and out on bail. was offered a deal in exchange for her testifying against her ex husband gianni van and the other codefendants. -- plead guilty to voluntary manslaughter and served three years in prison. in november 2013, patricia returned voluntarily to the united states for her next court hearing. at that time, the prosecutor was hopeful the deal was done. but patricia had other plans. she would take her case to the court of public opinion. she and her husband called up a last-minute news conference outside the arch county courthouse. >> good morning, thanks for your patience. this is my wife dr. patricia sparta. she has been charged with murder in the first degree, with special circumstances, which carries the possibility of life in prison without parole, for a murder she did not commit. she
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is being charged for the murder of the men who raped her 18 years ago. >> standing with her four-year-old daughter, every anna, patricia made a very public statement. aimed directly at the district attorney. >> it is unfortunate that he is willing to destroy a family, that he is willing to strip me away from my daughter, knowing that i'm innocent. it is unfortunate and for that reason we're coming forward and talking to you about it. >> she announced she was going to refuse the plea deal. she would not take the witness stand in the case against gianni van if it meant you had to plead guilty. the >> principle of what they're asking is to plead guilty to something i am not responsible for. it's essentially something that i cannot accept because it would essentially be a lie. >> plus, she said, a conviction and prison sentence would
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destroy your professional reputation as a psychologist. >> this is not america. this is not justice. this is abuse of power. this is the persecution of an innocent woman, who was never hurt anyone. >> the news conference struck a nerve around the world. she was the one who said things in motion. >> patricia quickly game supporters who saw her not as a suspect, but as a rape victim charged with a murder she didn't commit. the day after her news conference, patricia appeared in court. after she officially turned down the prosecutors plea deal, the judge issued a ruling. >> i do find that the circumstances have changed, this matter is going to know. bail >> patricia was handcuffed and sent back to jail. her husband gave her one last hug as she was led away. and with his wife behind bars, he soon return to europe with ariana. >> how do you explain to a four year old daughter, what's happening to her mother. when she asked me where mommy is,
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i'm unable to explain it to her. so i just tell her, mommy will be back. mommy will be back soon. and i'm committed to do everything to make sure that that. happens >> jorge work to drum up support for patricia. thousands of people signed a change.org position. >> is there any doubt in your mind, that she was telling the truth? >> i believe patricia story immediately, there was no doubt in my mind. i knew her heart, i knew her soul, and i had no doubt that patricia was innocent of any wrongdoing. i wanted to know the facts, i want to understand how it is that she was entangled in a situation like that. >> she had told her ever-changing story to police, to the prosecutor, to the husband, but how much would she be willing to tell us. >> it haunts me. it has haunted me for the rest of my life. >> coming up. >> he was still alive when they brought you to see him? >> yeah.
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>> what was the truth? >> i was dragged, pressured, intimidated. >> her first solar ad, last. >> he destroyed the rest of my life. when dateline continues. (asaad) when i was little, my mom would take care of me. but since she got cancer from smoking, it's my turn to take care of her. [announcer] you can quit. call 1-800-quit now for help getting free medication. ♪ ♪ fight fleas and ticks with seresto. eight months continuous protection against fleas and ticks. it's effective and vet recommended. seresto. learn more at seresto.com. ♪ ♪ trisha's buyers a, the
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psychology professor, was now an inmate wearing a blue jumpsuit. she was allowed to change your clothes for our interview. we sat down just days after she was ordered back to the orange county jail in 2013. >> do you ask yourself, how did i get here? >> oh, absolutely. absolutely. i rewind so many events in my, life i rewind so many things in my mind. especially being here and having so much time to think about how things
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progressed. i, i just ask myself so many questions. >> she said every year, she answered prosecutors questions, and even testified before a grand jury. we >> i had no idea. i had no idea i was going to revisit that night, again, and again, and again. during this last 12 months. it's been, it's been so difficult. because i feel retraumatized every time i talk about it, in an unsafe setting. and i feel that, i am taken back to those moments, and i get flashbacks, and i started to feel panic attacks. and i have to really contain myself, and bring myself back. >> the herd cooperation led to murder charges for her ex husband gianni van and two alleged accomplices, prosecutors say were involved in the death of ramirez. but what about patricia herself? what was her role in all of this? the prosecutor said she was legally responsible for the
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murder, because she said it in motion, when she identified him at the club. patricia told a very different story. that she was an innocent victim, at the mercy of gianni van. >> i would go home to my mother's home on the weekends. and that's when he took the opportunity to drag me through that whole night, and the chain of events that took place that night. >> but trisha told us, that three weeks after the alleged rape, gianni suddenly showed up to her door. >> he said let's talk. let's continue to see where we can't go. i got in his car, and once i was in the car, he took matters into his own hands. >> does he bring ellen into the picture at this point? >> yes. yes. >> does he tell you his intentions?
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>> never. never. >> she said she was too frightened to do anything but go along. >> i was traumatized by the rape, i was still depressed, i was still weeping, i was still in distress, and he took advantage of that. any took advantage of that. >> did they take you to the bar? where you admit gonzalo ramirez? >> i don't want to revisit details of that night. my lawyer has advised me not to revisit, in the interview. >> patricia did fill in the blanks for investigators about the rest of that night. gianni and the other she said, drove her to the club. they went inside and insisted she pointed out gonzalo ramirez, when he walked by, she told gianni it was him. when they left the club, she watched as they rear-ended his truck. when he got out to check the damage, the men forced him into the white man. and drove him to the transmission shop. patricia
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said she waited at a nearby bar, and then later that night, she was driven to the shop and let up a small staircase to aloft. >> did you see him being be in? >> now. no. i didn't see when they were actually beating him. they made me witness the aftermath of the beating. >> so he was still alive, when they brought you sam? >> yes. >> and what kind of shape was? ian at that point. >> from, nine in good shape. >> did he know as you? did he remember you? >> i don't know if he did or did not. i just, at that point, i just knew that they were doing all this to punish me. they were mad at him, for way he did, but they were also punishing me. >> where were they punishing you for? >> for having allowed it to happen., for somehow not stopping it. >> were you able to say anything to him before he died? >> no. no. i was in shock, and i screamed, and i was in fear, i couldn't. i couldn't
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possibly. i was unable to. >> patricia told, us that was the last time she saw can silo. his hands were tied with changing the loft of that transmission shop. she said she did not find out he had been murdered until much later. >> what i can tell you is that, i was pressured and bullied and intimidated, into that night
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when they actually gonzalo kidnapped him, beat him up, and ultimately killed him. i never saw him dead. but i was terrorized by the violence that i witnessed. for me, these people were so foreign to me, i didn't know who they were. i just knew that they were dangerous, and they were violent. and that scare the living daylights out of, me i feared for my own life. >> did you tell gianni you wanted to seek revenge on gonzalo ramirez? did you convince him to go there that night to kill gonzalo ramirez? >> she said she too is a victim that night. >> he destroyed the rest of my life. the rape was difficult, but dragging me through that night. it haunts me. >> do you wish now that you would've gone to the police? >> i wish that at some point, this whole cycle have been stopped, either by an adult, or
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by myself, but when you are traumatized. when you are raped. when you are terrorized. when you see which you saw, win these people are a mob, in violent, i don't see how i could've possibly stopped, if it wasn't something coming forward and helping me. >> patricia said she was still willing to testify in his trial, but as she said before, ahead to be on her terms. she was not about pleaded guilty to voluntary manslaughter. >> perhaps it's 18 years, later but i don't think it's too late, i don't think it's too late to seek justice for him. and to seek justice for myself. the only justice i can obtain, is to not be wrongfully convicted, and taken away from my daughter's life. >> some might say it's quite the gamble, to decide not to take the plea deal. and as view is a three years, when you could get life in prison. why take that chance? >> i never wanted him to be harmed. and i had to look deep within myself, i had to reflect on who i was. think about my
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conscience, and what i could live with. and i can't live with the guilt, i could face life in prison, i will be stripped for my daughters lay for the rest of her growing years. and that's a risk. but i'm trusting that the district attorney will know, that we are both seeking the same goal. that we both want justice for the men who raped me, and justice for myself. we are both unfortunate victims in a horrible series of events. >> a horrible series of events to be sure. but patricia, a victim? the prosecutor was not buying it. >> she's a very educated woman. -- coming up. another woman there that night, with yet another revelation about patricia. >> she's using other people to exact revenge. >> some might describe patricia
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as, a mother, a ph.d., a waif. >> you can still add to that list, murder. >> when dateline continues. as against fleas and ticks. it's effective and vet recommended. seresto. learn more at seresto.com. ♪ ♪ moderate to severe eczema lestill disrupts my skin.. despite treatment it disrupts my skin with itch. it disrupts my skin with rash. but now, i can disrupt eczema with rinvoq. rinvoq is not a steroid, topical, or injection. it's one pill, once a day, that's effective without topical steroids. many taking rinvoq saw clear or almost-clear skin while some saw up to 100% clear skin. plus, they felt fast itch relief some as early as 1 week. that's rinvoq relief. rinvoq can lower your ability to fight infections,
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orange county jail, there was another inmate who also face charges in the murder of gonzalo ramirez. her name was diane tran. and would put her in jail was patricia statements to investigators. she said there were seven people involved in the murder, and one of them was diane. >> from outside of the door, right outside, a male voice said, should we kill him? i heard sort of a resounding yes from everybody. but the one who struck me in saying yes, was diana. only because i didn't expect i didn't expect her. >> remember the transmissions shop where patricia saw council in chains -- diane tran own that shock with her husband cody, cody too was a suspect in the murder but died by suicide before the investigators to charge him. >> that left diane -- how is she doing? >> she is under so much pressure, the loss of her
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freedom, to say it's a shock is an understatement. >> according to diane's attorney, cody was part of the group that killed gonzalo. but diane was only at the shop because he forced her to be there. >> cody tran was a very, very difficult character to live with. very volatile, violent. i would say that, she was subject to his commands. come to the shop. come with me. we're going. >> in other words, diane story was much like patricia's. she says she wasn't unwilling participant, a wife who went along out of fear. >> diane had nothing to do with this. at all. >> so one picture shy as far as
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i turned down her plea deal and refused to testify, a door open for diane tran. >> you're willing to plead guilty to the new charge in the enhancement and receive a possible sentence of four years in prison. >> diane made a deal with the prosecutor, pleading guilty to a reduced charge of voluntary manslaughter, in exchange, she agreed to testify in the case against patricia. and her testimony would be explosive. diane said, patricia wasn't forced into anything, but instead took part in the plan in planning the murder. >> yeah he was talking about wanting to find this guy, and
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retaliate. according to diane tran, those discussions about retaliation all began immediately. miss tran also indicated that there were conversations, that took place, where she was president, where ghani talked about killing gonzalo route ramirez. we're misses far as it was present. and mississippi are as a new that the plan was to kill gonzalo. >> a claim, remember, that patricia strongly denied our interview. >> and, does he tell you his intentions? >> never. never. >> investigator dean falter, believes patricia not only knew would ghani was plenty, she may have orchestrated it. >> when you start pulling back the layers, you find that, there was an individual who was, i think, a very manipulative person. kind of pulling the strings, trying to be the victim. while she's using other people to exact revenge, because she feels he raped her. >> but many people did see patricia is a victim, and a movement calling for her victim of freedom was building. supporters attended hearings with ring t-shirts that said, set patricia free. >> we're here to stand in solidarity with her, as well as other sexual assault victims across the world. >> many saw on accomplished
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woman, who had overcome terrible trauma, only to be victimized again by the legal system. >> there are two victims here. and i hope that the da finds them as hard to strengthen this case and really get justice for those who committed this crime and, stop persecuting the other victim in this case. >> but that didn't seem to face the prosecutor. >> i knew that she had, hundreds if not thousands, of supporters, who had never read a single police report. never listen to a single taped interview. she had them all convinced that she was being wrongfully accused. and that somehow, if she was a victim of a sexual assault, that she couldn't therefore also be a defendant in a murder case. >> so much time and passed, she didn't actually commit a crime, why would you not willing to let it go? >> they left, a man on the side of the road like garbage. why did the fact that she -- be in any way mitigating? to me, it's aggravating. she got her time. she got to live as if she had
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never been involved in this incident. >> some might describe patricia as, a rape victim, a mother, a ph.d., a wife, someone who has done good things for the world. how would you describe her? >> i think all those might be accurate, and yet you could still add to that list, murderer. >> a tough prosecutor part poised for trial, with one more move up his sleeve. >> it's another one of miss--lies. >> coming up. >> did you tell patricia i think we can win this? >> i did tell patricia i thought we could win the case. >> 18 years of secrets. one momentous decision. >> did you plead guilty or not guilty? >> when dateline continues. --
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with murder, she turned down a plea deal it was no longer cooperating with the orange county district attorney's office. >> patricia flip the crime on its head, by calling herself the victim. that she had to witness this brutality, do you think that's a fair assessment? >> i definitely think it's a fair suspend, because patricia would be the first to say that she would never want anyone to think that this was done in her name. but that's exactly what the prosecutor believed. in his mind patricia initiated the murder, helps planets, that obstructed the investigation by marrying the prime suspect, so she would not have to testify against him. >> prosecutor believe patricia lied repeatedly for 20 years. right up to the time of her arrest in 2012. remember, she told, us she was on her way to the u.s. for a conference. >> i was coming to the u.s. for professional travel. >> it turns out, says the prosecutor. she was really
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flying to boston, to meet a former boyfriend. >> a gentleman arrived at the airport, and that gentleman said he was there to pick her up. and that she had agreed to come and stay with him in connecticut for a week. at his home. >> that's kind of an interesting turn of events. >> interesting, not particularly significant to the murder investigation. but interesting that she continues delight, whenever it suits earning its. >> and there was another inconsistency that was relevant to the case. patricia told us, you may recall, that gianni van forced her to marry him. >> i feared for my life. but take a look at these photos of patricia and gianni, a seemingly happy couple. all of them were taken after the murder. after they had secretly married. and, according to the
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prosecutor, it's possible the biggest lie of all was the reason for the murder in the first place. that patricia had been raped. >> she claims that she told the nurse from the clinic, at the college, that she was raped. >> but there is no record that she did. according to the medical records, patricia was examined by both the doctor and a nurse that day, but the notes from the visit only said patricia had unprotected sex, and wanted a morning after pill. no mention of a rape. we contacted the college about her visit to the clinic, they told us, that given the two decades and personnel changes since patricia was treated, they had no further information. >> what was your gut telling you, about the rate? did you believe that patricia was raped? >> anybody who sexually assaulted, it's a horrific experience. i can only imagine, i don't know, there just isn't enough evidence. it's inconclusive. >> patricia and the prosecutor
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remained at odds. and he pushed ahead for her trial. >> the air is playing hardball with her. >> he was playing hardball. >> did you tell patricia, i think we can win? this >> i did tell her i thought we could win the case, but i also told, or i'm not the one who does the time, i was able to raise my children. that's not a decision that i have to make. >> meanwhile, the date was set for gianni van, patricia's former husband, to face a jury. patricia is running out of time, and a possibility of a plea deal would have to come before ghani's trial. so she could testify for the prosecution. so, she instructed her lawyer to see if the deal is still possible, the clock was ticking. >> was it tearing her up? >> she had a lot of traffic in
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her mind about what the decision meant to a lot of people. including her husband, her family, groups that were supportive of her. so it was a very difficult decision. >> you have any questions about what you're doing here today? >> no. >> patricia's decision came and the same day that the trial for gianni van is set to begin.. >> you have an opportunity to read this plea agreement. did you discuss it with your lawyer? >> as to a violation of count, to voluntary manslaughter, of gonzalo ramirez, how do you plead? guilty or not guilty? >> >> guilty. >> guilty of voluntary manslaughter. patricia had back down. who sends under this new deal, six years in prison. according to the prosecutor, everything they had learned, made the case against patricia stronger. >> she turned down the initial three-year plea deal. she ended up getting six. does she regret that decision at all? >> of course she regrets it in that way, that was another discussion we had. because you have to live with yourself. >> do you feel like justice have been done? >> that's a hard question the answer. did i feel like there was some closure with regard to miss aspires? a yes. was it justice? no. it's the way, in
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many cases. you solve crimes. i don't think it was necessarily justice, for gonzalo ramirez, it is brothers or his daughters, but it's what allows us, to move forward with the rest of the case. it's what allows us to move forward with the trial against gianni van. >> gianni van long delay trial began in april, 2015, 20 years to the day after gonzalo's death. the evidence will show that the defendant acted as judge jury and executioner. >> the prosecutor said ghani committed murder to avenge the rape of patricia. not so said
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his defense attorney >> even though, he was upset about the rape, he never had a homicidal thoughts of revenge. he is the one who prevented the fights, not instigate them. they were known to be honest, they always knew him to be a good-natured kid. what, happened in april of 1995, was way beyond anything, that gianni van could've ever imagined. or could've ever even possibly conjured up. >> patricia testified for the prosecution. ghani took the stand in his own defense. he said the other people in the transmission shop that, night where the true killers. after just one day of deliberation, the jury reached a verdict. >> we the jury in the above entitled actions, find the defendant gianni van, guilty of the crime of murder in the first degree. gianni van with sentence delay of imprisoned without the possibility of parole. patricia was released in june of 2018 is part of an early release program, after serving less than five years behind bars. gonzalo ramirez brothers say they were disappointed by the sentence, cause it was her story that led to the murder. >> she's very start in this a
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criminal mind. she's a criminal. mine she don't have to play with people,. >> and so all these years later, the murder of gonzalo ramirez, may be solved, but a big question remains, who is the rear patricia aspires? >> throughout the investigation, i saw her as potentially a victim. but as it progressed in time went on, and i learn more, the only word i came up with was manipulative. she can manipulate people. >> but to those who support her, she is a woman who beat tremendous odds. went from poverty to a ph.d.. became a symbol for victims rights. a role she now embraces. >> the reason i went into psychology was try to heal people from the traumas that i experienced. i think that's enough to be terrorized, it's enough to be abused, it's enough to be traumatized by a rape. and i've tried to seek a
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meaningful life. or i can actually change peoples lives, and that has been my objective. it i'm going to put this behind me. i need to put this nightmare behind me. this sunday, making the case. >> our democracy came dangerously close to catastrophe. >> january 6 testimony that president trump knew he had lost the election but continued to argue that it was rigged. >> i thought boy, he's become detached from reality if he really believes this stuff. there were suggestions by mayor giuliani to go declare victory and say we won it outright. >> and the unconstitutional plot to overturn the election. >> i said are you out of your effing mind? this is completely crazy. >> this is constitutional mischief. >> puttingic
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