the panel called back to the hill from recess to present new evidence and witness testimony. the big question, what has the committee learned that seems to be so urgent? >> really, as we take a live look at 5:59, almost 6:00 a.m. on the east coast, just absolutely beautiful shot of the united states capitol. you can guarantee -- you're guaranteed that it's going to be another dramatic day of hearings there. the january 6th committee has just revealed things about that day from trump supporters that i >> we have jackie al mainly standing by to give us the latest. federal agent makes move in another key figure in the january 6th investigation. we'll have the latest developments concerning john eastman. >> the feds took his phone.

mika, the feds took his phone. >> that's never good, honestly. he's the architect of the attempted coup and the feds have his phone. >> you know, we were asking, how could this guy not be in legal trouble? apparently he -- seems he may be. the battle over abortion hits the states, many are wondering if there's anything the federal government can do to protect services for women and what is the state of women's rights? we'll be talking about all of that. willie is with us. good morning. willie, joe and mika, together again. the team is back. welcome to "morning joe." it's tuesday, june 28th. along with joe, willie and me, u.s. special correspondent for bbc news, katty kay, and pulitzer-prize winning columnist and associate editor of "the washington post" eugene robinson. >> willie, yesterday, i'm here working, we're doing a show on i think the most -- one of the most significant -- other than bush v. gore, perhaps the most

significant case of this supreme court in half a century, and i get a next from somebody with breaking news about yesterday being the 15-year anniversary of something. want to take any guess on what actually somebody wrote about 15-year anniversary? "morning joe"? >> no. what is it? >> it was when mika tore up -- >> oh! >> shredded -- >> oh, yeah. >> and burned the paris littleton script. >> is that right? >> let's truly not that big a deal. >> we wouldn't have been working yesterday. >> yes. >> we're not saying it is a big deal, mika. obviously. i'm surprised somebody sent it to me yesterday morning. >> exactly. >> and somebody wrote it up, saying this changed -- whatever that changed. that changed -- >> willie -- >> the face of cable news was in serious trouble. yeah, that was 15 years ago.

>> wow. >> the amazing thing is, it was just all off the top much her head. she happened to have a paper shredder there. my favorite part is when you were trying to pull the lighter away interest us. >> yeah. >> no. i never stand in the way of whatever mika is doing. but when there were pyrotechnics presented, i felt for the safety of the crew and studio, i should probably remove that from her hand. her point was well taken and i think that was the last time we did a pop culture story like that. >> the lead. >> by the way, they did, the people at the desk, sent that because at the beginning they used to send us the news and say these are the news stories and read them. that stopped quickly. it stopped then. but they actually -- we had all of this news out of iraq and that was the lead story, paris hilton, getting out of jail. my lord, how things have changed. >> things have definitely changed. >> the stakes have been raised, that's for sure.

>> guys like -- >> little higher. >> okay. let's get to the news maybe because we love it. new polling shows the swing back toward democratic candidates ahead of november's midterm elections. it is the latest survey from npr, pbs news hour and marist. 48% of voters say if the midterms were held today, they would more likely to vote for the democratic candidate. 41% say they would vote republican. that's a one-point increase for democrat since last month and overall a 10-point swing from april when 47% said they would back the republican candidate. in the same new poll, 55% of all voters say they oppose the court's decision to overturn roe, although the majority of republicans say they support the ruling. i want to see a poll of republican women. >> yeah, you know, it is -- it's not -- it's not as wide of a gap

as democrats might believe. i think the majority of republican women probably support the ruling. you know, willie, and we can -- i would love to get everybody else's insight on this -- but there's a tradeoff here. it really does depend on who is inspired to go out for turnout, but there's going to be a tradeoff. this is -- donald trump hates this privately and he's complaining about it privately because this will hurt him. this will hurt republican candidates in the areas that cost him the election in 2020, in the suburbs. we talk about the suburbs of north atlanta, the philly suburbs, the i--4 corridor, but those suburban areas are areas republicans have been losing over the past several years. this is only going to cause,

especially women in the suburbs, to move away from them more. on the other side hispanic voters who have long been more traditionally pro life than a lot of democrats have given them credit for. you may have a break towards republicans on that side of the margin. then, of course, as always, there's a split in education. college grads, people with post-grad degrees, they're going to move toward the democrats after this ruling, if you believe the polling, and those with high school degrees, those who have formed the backbone of a lot of republican surge over the past 20, 30 years, they're going to most likely, if you believe the polls, move to republicans. i don't think it's clearcut. i will say something has happened over the past two, three months and maybe it's the gun debate, maybe it's the leaked memo, that in several polls have shown democrats picking up 10 points in the

generic ballot test. this is a little tighter than some of the ones i've seen, but there's some others that show democrats surging as much as 10 points. >> if you think about what's happened in that time, as we look down, we should be clear that this does not include the last week when the roe decision officially came down, but as you said, we heard the leaked memo and saw the details of it and assumed this is going to happen, maybe you can factor that in. democrats increase enthusiasm with the january 6th trials that come within this poll, then as you said the gun debate as well. gene robinson, this roe versus wade, as you look at the enthusiasm among democrats, is something after it came down that speaker pelosi and president biden said our recourse is here to go vote. if you don't like what you saw at the court on friday you have to vote. do you expect this to be a galvanizing issue, democrats go to polls in the fall? >> well, look, i think, first of

all, the major impact of the decision is on humanity, it's on people, right. >> of course. >> who will be making that decision. in terms of the politics, yes, i expect it to boost democratic candidates and, in fact, i will be very interested to he see what those numbers look like when they do figure in last friday. the day it actually came down. it was one thing to know it was coming, even to read the draft opinion, but to have it just sort of land friday, just have it happen, i know that just anecdotically people i've been talking to, it personally hit them really harder than they would have expected, knowing it was coming. i wonder what impact it's going to have. i also wonder, you know, i look at those numbers for independents and, you know,

democrats and republicans are now -- well, together, they're the majority of the population, but the largest segment of voters consider themselves independent. if they break substantially toward democrats, then this could be a he very different midterm election from the one that a lot of people were expecting. >> that's what we're looking at in the polls. you're right, gene. look at those independent voters and see there's wild swings. look at, for instance, they're called independents for a reason, look, for instance, at governor whitmer's numbers up in michigan. she's doing very well, according to a poll i saw yesterday, with independents, where joe biden is upside down. again, they're not as loyal to party as they are to who the individual candidate is. katty kay, the question is, about in these national races, this is already been this great

sorting and donald trump has done it. the question is, who voted for donald trump who after roe is going to say, i think i'm going to vote democratic in the coming years. i don't know that that's the case. we may be talking again on the margins. we may be talking about these independents. we may be talking about 2% or 3%. the question is, once again, whether the democrats are going to be able to work the ground game enough to make this a difference so people who are adversely affected by this and fear the loss of their rights in the future, reading the thomas conquering opinion, whether they're going to register, vote, organize, outwork republicans, get people to the polls and make a difference. i haven't seen a lot of evidence that democrats are really good at that anymore. >> i think you're right, joe. we're probably only talking about the margins and only

talking about a few districts and only a few states. i spent the last month traveling around the country and the only thing people are talking about when i ask them what they're going to vote on in the midterms is $5 a gallon for gas. that was even the case over the course of this weekend. i was in pennsylvania during the weekend and when the ruling came out and i spent the time talking to an abortion provider, a doctor who actually said, look, there's a potential that this galvanizes the other side, too, in a state like pennsylvania. yes, it might galvanize some democrats and may persuade some independents to get out and vote democratic, but make no mistake, it's going to be a galvanizing factor on the right as well because they see a state like pennsylvania and they look at the gubernatorial race there and the chance that pennsylvania is a republican -- if a republican wins in november could also ban abortion and you'll get -- you'll get pro life conservatives turning out to vote in bigger numbers too. it could galvanize people on both sides.

democrats are certainly hoping that come november, this boosts their numbers in critical districts and critical states. the moment my reading from traveling around the country is that the economy is trumping everything, and in november, there's still a momentum there, even though over the course of this weekend we heard the outrage, we heard men women, families, all democrats turning out, appalled and saying that they will vote on this. it's the only option democrats have. they have to say they're going to get turnout up, because what else do they have to run on? what else do they have to say about this? >> that's -- they're going to be face something headwinds if things stay the same with inflation, with gas prices, with food prices. they are going to have to organize. they are going to have to really figure out how to get people out to vote. one other thing meeshgs ka, it will be curious to see how conservatives, how republicans

respond to this. i remember back in 1989, 1990, 1991, when the soviet union fell on christmas day 1991, i think most republicans expected, you know, take a victory lap for quite some time. >> yeah. >> after the soviet union fell, and thought that ronald reagan and george h.w. bush would get credit for it. voters responded far differently and said wait a second, now that we're beyond the cold war we can take a risk on a guy like bill clinton. we don't need a world war ii veteran. since so much is driven by negative partisanship in american politics these days, so much is driven by what you're against than what you're for, i am curious -- and i know some republicans are talking about this too -- whether it's the party that's aggrieveded,

whether it's the party that's aggrieved that's in the minority, in this case, the democrats, that are compelled to vote, while those who won may not have as much of an edge. >> it's so interesting. >> we'll find out this fall. >> there's four, five really key issues that, you know, democrats could run on, but the economy, that's going to hang heavy over the elections to come for sure. but there is obviously abortion. this is obviously guns. then there's january 6th. and let's turn to that now. speculation is swirling after the abrupt announcement from the january 6th committee that it plans to hold another -- a sixth public hearing today. the only thing the committee has reve is the hearing will, quote, present recently obtained evidence and receive witness testimony. "the washington post" reports that even some senior staff have been kept out of the loop. three sources tell the "post" th secrecy is due in part to credible threats against a

witness. the committee announced last week it was taking a break until mid-july and yesterday gave just 24 hours' notice about the hearing scheduled for 1:00 this afternoon. also consider that congress is in the midst of a two-week recess so they're entire rupting the recess. let's bring in investigations reporter for the "washington post," there is reporting on who today's witness will be. >> that witness is expected to be cassidy hutchinson, a senior aide to former chief of staff mark meadows. hutchinson has played a pretty pom nent role in these hearings with her recorded depositions being played throughout the past five hearings. she's also been a key person for this committee in terms of the full scope of their investigation. they've released, excerpts of

her closed door depositions that revealed some pretty damming charges against the former president, including that mark meadows was warned directly of the potential for violence on january 6th. we've previously reported that she overheard mark meadows come back out of the oval office on january 6th and say that he heard the former president express support for the pro-trump rioters who were chanting "hang mike pence." she could have some even more, pretty bombshell revelations today. we have heard actually that some of the -- as you just read, that the reason why her testimony has been so closely guarded is because of massive security threats in the last hearing she did say, reveal, that marjorie taylor greene, she heard marjorie taylor greene asked for a pardon and you can only imagine what that does in terms

of elevating her name and potentially causing far right extremists to levy some of these credible threats that have come her way. >> marjorie taylor greene, not the only name she mentioned regarding the pardons at the white house. this is an extraordinary move. we thought that we were on a break of three or four weeks here before the committee you was going to come back. to have members of congress come back from recess and sit, this is as close we're going to get to the president. if you don't have donald trump or mike pence or meadows, if you have the senior aide to meadows who had eyes and ears on these conversations, she's seen and heard a few things that would be significant here. to have this hearing reopened a few weeks early, do we have any sense of what she's coming in to town to tell them today? >> we don't. but we have had people previously tell us that if there is anyone going to be the john

dean of this investigation, cassidy hutchinson is the person who is the most likely to be that person in terms of her access to the top figures in trump's or birth and her proximity to the former president and what she was able to overhear, the people in and out of the oval office on january 6th. but it is important to note we're not sure there's another witness corroborating her testimony today. there is -- there was clearly a sensitivity and urgency to her testifying today, and you've got to think that it's in part due to the security concerns, but also because they're worried she might potentially back out. this is not a small thing for this individual to come forward, put her career on the line. obviously she's being compelled. there are subpoenas at play. several individuals like bill stepien who didn't appear were subpoenaed to appear, but this

is a big thing for her. she's in her 20s. she's a young person with, you know, little institutional support in terms of the other people who she used to work with cooperating with this investigation. you know, we'll see what she's going to reveal today. >> the hearing is at 1:00 eastern time in washington. we'll take it live on msnbc. "washington post" jackiemainy, we appreciate it. another name john eastman the lawyer and trump ally who helped to advise the former president on efforts to overturn the 2020 election said he had his phone seized by the fbi. in court documents an attorney for eastman said federal agents executed a search warrant as he was leaving a new mexico restaurant with his wife and friend last wednesday night. according to the filing, agents patted eastman down, took his phone and, quote, forced him to

unlock it. he's now fighting to have his phone returned, arguing the seizure was unlawful. this took place the same day federal agents searched the home of jeffrey clark, the former justice department official. trump briefly considered appointing as acting attorney general before that was thwarted. joe, obviously john eastman wrote the letter, drew up the documents showing mike pence how he could overturn the results of the 2020 election, not certify that election. he is a central figure not just to the committee but looks like to the justice department. >> well, and we said last week that the two people that looked like they were going to have problems were clark and eastman, and it seems the feds have confirmed that. let's bring in right now to discuss this and the court, recent court rulings, professor emeritus at harvard law school, laurence tribe. thank you for being with us, professor. let's talk about the seizure of eastman's phone. what does it mean?

>> it means that eastman is definitely a target of investigation by the justice department, although the actual affidavit connected with the subpoena was drawn up by -- other than the justice department. it was the inspector general. it's all coming into focus. eastman, clark, a number of people immediately around the president, advising him that he basically didn't need to worry about having -- whether he really did or didn't believe he won the election, we have it covered from every angle as his son once said. >> yeah. so professor tribe, you wrote a book on abortion one time talking about how it balances, too, the most critical issues of our time, and that is, liberty versus life. there's always been that balance when it comes to roe, when its come to abortion.

talk about the hearing or talk about the ruling and what it means not just for abortion, but other rights that many americans have taken for granted for the last 49 years. >> the ruling didn't strike a balance. it erased women and their bodily integrity out of the equation all together and said that the other side represents potential life. now, the moment you say potential life is entitled to protection, even at the cost of basically forcing women to bear a life, that immediately turns to contraception and to other issues like that and what court said about abortion is that the word doesn't appear in the constitution. well, that's true of parenting, it's true of the right to have a baby, it's true of same-sex marriage, it's true of a lot of things. also the court said, it's not based in the early traditions of

our republic. well that can be said of saim sex marriage, homosexuality. thomas, who wrote a conquering opinion, left no doubt about it, even though justice alito's majority said not to worry, it's only women we're going after, that's how hi translate it, thomas says, sorry, all of those rights, rights protected by what lawyers call substitute due process, rights of personal liberty, personal choice, integrity, dignity, all of those, unless very explicit or deeply embedded in our history are up for grabs and basically inviting challenges to the contraception decision,ing roe v. wade, same-sex marriage. he didn't mention interracial marriage, but loving versus virginia is also based on rights not written into the constitution. unless you say that liberty and equality covers it all, then it

should cover the women's right to control her body and life as well. >> katty kay. >> justice thomas was the only justice to seem to indicate that the court might go after those other rights as well, other members of the majority didn't support that position or don't seem publicly to support that position. what do you read into what appears to be a split in the conservative majority over this? how do you read it? is it going to go the way that justice thomas is suggesting, or the way that perhaps justice alito seems to be indicating? >> i think it's going the way justice thomas is suggesting. of course justice alito would say don't read too much into our opinion, we're not reaching those other cases, but the only reason he gives for thinking the other cases are different is not a reason at all. just the definition. this case involves potential life. duh, of course it does. i think it's clear that court is

going all-in. what's especially interesting is that nothing significant has changed since 1973 on the issues. all that's changed is the faces of the people on the court. that's what led the dissenters, breyer, sotomayor, kagan, to say, don't believe it. if this were limited this would not be an exercise of judicial power. it certainly has implications for all these other areas and if it doesn't, that reaffirms the fact that this is just judicial fiat and what it looks like to me. >> professor emeritus at harvard law school, laurence tribe, thank you for being on the show this morning. we appreciate it. we'll have more on this ahead. president biden is facing criticism from his own party after the supreme court's decision to end roe v. wade. we'll talk to dnc chair jamie harrison about how this issue is

going to affect the midterms and what democrats are going to do. plus, ukraine's president is calling it a daring terrorist attack. a russian air strike on a crowded mall in ukraine kills at least a dozen people, and many more are missing. we'll go live to the scene where crews are searching for survivors. you're watching "morning joe." we will be right back. you're watching "morning joe." we will be right back.

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at least 18 people killed and 59 injured when russian missiles hit a crowded shopping mall in ukraine yesterday. president volodymyr zelenskyy says more than 1,000 people were inside the mall at the time of that attack. in a telegram message zelenskyy called it, quote, one of the most daring terrorist attacks in european history, adding the number of victims is impossible to imagine. local officials say the death toll is likely to go up as rescuers scour the debris. leaders at the g-7 summit

condemn the attack calling it a-bomble and vowing support for ukraine. the u.n. security council scheduled an emergency meeting later today to discuss the attack. joining us from the scene of that attack in central ukraine, nbc news correspondent ellison barber, what can you tell us? >> reporter: willie, let me show you what is happening here because rescue teams are literally going inch by inch throughout this debris, sawing, shoveling, moving whatever they can out of the way. they are looking for evidence here. they are also looking for missing people, families of 40 different individuals have reported their loved ones as missing. right now we have been told that this death toll is at 20 people dead, and you have close to 60 people injured. half of those injured people in hospital. as we watch today as these crews just keep working, keep pressing on, they're pulling out bits of fragments left over from

missiles, trying to collect evidence. the general prosecutor for ukraine, she was here this morning. she told us they believe this could potentially be a crime against humanity. the russian federation, the russian defense ministry, they claim that they struck a factory nearby the shopping center that was actually housing weapons provided to ukraine by both the u.s. and eu. they claim that once they struck that factory, those munitions detonated and caused a fire at this shopping center a shopping center they claim was inoperable. but the numbers of the people injured, the video from the moment the attack happened, shows you how busy this area was. it was an open shopping center. we watched more -- both hours and hours now. i spoke to a local official this morning and said there is a factory behind this area, but he claims that it's a factory that

has nothing to do with military objectives or weapons. he says that it is a factory that is essentially working on construction related to roadways. this is a heavy industrial area, and there's a lot of infrastructure related to transportation here. he claims that that area that was also struck, had nothing to do with military action. ukrainian officials say two missiles directly hit this area. russia is claiming it's just a fire here. we have watched -- i can show you over this way if we have time, these are some of the fragments they're collecting to make that case that this was a direct hit by two missiles. ukrainian officials say they were russian missiles, and they are just going through everything bit by bit. i was asking a local official if they had any sense of how old the victims were here. right now they're not sure but they believe there were at least some teenagers among them. >> 18 dead, and as you said earlier, they expect that number to go up. the russian military says it was targeting that factory you

mentioned as a weapons depot and that mall was collateral damage. obviously what you're seeing behind you tells a different story. ellison barber, in central ukraine, we'll be back to you soon. mika, this happened against the backdrop of the g-7 and president biden next today going to the nato summit where the subject will be the war in ukraine. >> absolutely. there is this duality, joe, where you have ellison with her great reporting, literally spelling out for us a missile attack on the mall, the reports, of course, of the attack in kyiv, even a kindergarten was hit, that russians are being aggressive, they're making sure their killing is widely known and very public. at the same time, these reports that russians are sort of running out of gas, what they're doing is unsustainable. >> this may be a sign of desperation because, again, you look at western analysts, what they've been reporting over the

past several days, they believe that putin's war machine is exhausted, that he's running out of the supplies needed and running out of troops unless he constitutes a draft in the country which would be extraordinarily unpopular. russians have failed. i mean they've failed at just about every metric that you would use to measure this war. strategy, an f. troop morale, an f. political support across the world, an f. blowback has been extraordinary. you would have to say, the one area where the russians seem to be exerting their will as, again, here's "the washington post" headline from this weekend, russia will soon exhaust its combat capabilities, the strategy and logistics have troop morale f, political

blowback, f, the one thing they have continued to do is commit war crimes and they've done it against maternity hospitals, they've done it against cancer wards, against kindergartens, against malls, and they do that as so many military analysts say because they can't do anything el. >> yeah. do you remember when we see that theater in mariupol where they had the word children written outside and it was clear there were children inside and the russians bombed it, and i think that gave us the preview of what their tactics were going to be leading up to this shopping mall attack that we saw over the course of the weekend. as the russians feel they are losing militarily or at least strategically or suffering strategically, they tend to get more -- i think the only word

atrocious in the way they act militarily by attacking civilians in shopping malls. it's an indication of the frustration that i think vladimir putin is feeling in the way the war has not gone the way he planned. that "washington post" headline about them running out of missiles and ammunition is interesting. there are mixed reports, i have to say, that i've been getting in speaking in conversations with european diplomats, some frustrations at americans that really the only look we're getting inside the war is what ukrainians are telling us, and we may not be getting the full picture from a ukrainian intelligence in what is happening. there is less visibility what's happening inside the russian military. if the assessment is the russians are running out that's a little bit of a change from a couple weeks ago when the fear was it was the ukrainians that were running out of ammunition. but the russians have been throwing ammunition and people, i mean, vladimir putin seems to care nothing for his own soldiers either. they are expending personnel in

the military as if it was water. there seems to be no care for russian soldiers at all. then, of course, as things are going badly we see this kind of attack we saw over the course of the weekend. the atrocities keep mounting in the country. >> well, you look at -- you look at this from 30,000 feet and you look at history as a guide, we remember paul kennedy's landmark work in i think 1987, the rise of powers, from 1500 through the 1980s how you would have countries rise and fall and could predict the outcome of a war based on their gdp, the rise and fall of the gdp over the preceding decades. look at what's been happening in russia, they once had a fairly strong economy in the soviet union, even though it was, again, though economically in

many ways it was always a basket case, but if you just measure by the gdp, it's now dropped to, as we've been saying since the war began, a gdp smaller than texas' gdp. it's only gotten worse since this war has begun. you look at another "washington post" story from yesterday, where china has cut their imports to russia and so while china is not going along with the eu or the united states and some of these sanctions, they are in a de facto sense, isolating russia even more, and you just look at this and you look at the war crimes that vladimir putin continues to commit. zelenskyy wants the war over by the end of the year. it's getting harder and harder to figure out how vladimir putin strikes a peace deal that allows him back into the world community when he's committed

all of the mass atrocities americans and europeans have seen on their tv sets every night. >> yeah. it is difficult to imagine him, you know, the g-7 once again becoming the g-8 and putin going to a meeting with the leaders who have just met in bavaria. that's unimaginable. but it's also unimaginable exactly how the allies stop putin from committing these war crimes. russia may run out of smart munitions, cruise missiles and the like. i think it will probably be a long time before they run out of dumb bombs, and they can lob them at shopping malls, lob them at kindergarten, anywhere in the country, at will, and that seems to be -- it may not just be a spasm of frustration, that may be putin's strategy going

forward, to keep the pressure on that way. he's not going to get into the world community, but on the hand, he considers himself personally untouchable. he thinks he's secure in power and he's going to continue with this war, allah peter the great, so how this ends has always been the big question and that question gets murkier the longer it goes on. >> the only reason, mika, this war is going on right now is because of oil prices, because russia is still making money with their oil. i've got to say, the united states has got to get serious, we have got to get serious about alternative energy sources. i read about this in a book about the future of conservatism in 2009 and they talked about how critical it was that we dominate in the area of alternative energy sources if the future so we didn't have to

rely on petrol dictator. here we are all of these years later, when democrats have been talking about that for such a long time, we've got to get serious. go back again to barack obama's approach on energy. it's all of the above. we need to continue while we're bridging the gap between where we are and where we ought to be, we've got to continue being the number one producer and exporter of oil. we've got to build nuclear plants. again, something we've been saying for 20 years. we also, though, have to double down in our investment in alternative energy sources that will move us from where we are to where we need to be. when we get there, petrol dictator can't fight these wars anymore. they can't have the influence they have. they can't bribe the leaders in

the west. they can't exert the radical theology. it is -- >> that's what's happening all over again. >> it is it is a national security issue that we aggressively move towards alternative energy sources. it's not going to be clean, it's not going to be neat. there are going to be a lot of mistakes along the way. there are going to be investments that don't pan out. but we have no other choice. that's where we need to get to. >> 100%. all right. coming up, new reporting on the growing frustrations inside the democratic party. activists and even members of congress are upset with leadership following the supreme court ruling on abortion rights. we'll discuss the state of the party with its chairman jamie harrison joins us next on "morning joe." e harrison joins us next on "morning joe."

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47 past the hour. a beautiful shot of the sun coming up over the white house in washington, d.c., this morning. following the supreme court's decision to overturn roe v. wade, "the washington post" reports frustration is growing among democrats about perceived inaction from the top of the party. the report in the "post" reads, to an increasingly vocal group of frustrated democrats, responses by party leaders have been strikingly inadequate to meet a moment of crisis. they criticize the notion it's on voters when they say

democrats are unwilling to push boundaries and up end the system in defense of hard won civil liberties. the paper notes some progressive lawmakers are frustrated. democratic leadership has appeared unwilling to yield their power. one ac vi vist interviewed by the "post" talked about similar hesitation by party leaders on issues like police reform and voting rights, saying, quote, it's very similar to what happened in 2020. go back to the voting booth. it always comes back to now you the individual do something, but we have elected these people who are in office at this very moment to take action on things like this. >> you know, willie, we have a senate that's split 50/50. you've got a senator from west virginia in a state that donald

trump won by what, 68, 69 points. you have a senator from arizona who actually has pretty high approval ratings inside of arizona because she's charted a moderate to conservative course. it's calleddemocrats. not exactly sure what they expect joe biden to do. >> yeah, and the reaction is always tear down the institutions. if we don't like the way something is going. i don't think everyone in the party agrees with that, but let's turn to the chairman of the democratic national committee, jamie harrison. he's here with me in new york. mr. chairman, it's good to see you this morning. >> great seeing you. i want to talk specifically about that ruling. is there frustration in the democratic party with this president that he should be doing more than saying you have to go vote in the fall? >> listen, i think there's less frustration -- there's not the frustration with the president. it's the fact that these things are happening right now. for the first time in my lifetime, i'm 46 years old, we are seeing america take away rights instead of add and

protect rights. i mean, that's just galling. i was raised by my grandparents, and my grandfather and my grandmother couldn't always vote. my grandmother didn't always have choice over control over her own body, and i thought my kids, we would be building on the rights that they have gained over those years and instead are tearing them away. what we are seeing from this court is just a relentless assault not only from the court but also from republicans in state houses and congresses. what i think you're seeing is the frustration from folks, particularly the young generation what is this? i have never experienced this in my life. we should be moving closer to the ideals of the founders instead of moving back, and i think that's that frustration. but what we have to do as democrats is to bottle that frustration, take that and make sure that we build the infrastructure to protect american freedoms, to make sure

that long-term that we never get to this place again. we have to be at -- we have to be more relentless in terms of protecting democracy than the republicans are in terms of tearing it down. that is the charge of the democratic party over the next few weeks and months and the years to come. >> a lot of these trigger laws already going into place, including your home state of south carolina, you can't get an abortion after the point they can detect a fetal heartbeat. what is your sense of whether this energizes the -- your job is to go out to get people to vote. women whose attention certainly was grabbed by what they saw on friday in this ruling. do you expect women to go out and vote on this issue including some who may not have gone to vote in a midterm election? >> i think we are seeing right now an energy and an activism particularly amongst women that we have not seen since the election of donald trump and the march -- women's march.

you know, what we are seeing is we have this joint effort with the dccc and the dsec, we've built out this website called the finchoice.org we are seeing a record number of activists signing up. they want to make phone calls, send text messages. they want to make sure we secure their right to control their own bodies. and i would not be surprised, i grew up in the south in south carolina and many times in some of those communities men and women vote -- the husband and wives vote the same way. i would not be surprised that in this election cycle you get women, particularly in areas like the south where we have all these laws and they end up pulling a very different lever than their husbands. >> we will see. joe. >> i'm just curious mr. chairman, your reaction to these progressives who are saying stop saying it's on the voters. stop saying it's on us to get

people out to vote. i just want to say, you know, remind our viewers that republicans picked up, what, over a thousand state seats, legislative seats from 2010 to 2020. there's a reason why republicans control formerly democratic states like wisconsin, michigan, pennsylvania. there's a reason why crazy legislation is passed into law. that's because republicans did the work on the ground. would you encourage those who are saying it's not up to us to get out and vote? would you encourage them to refocus their efforts instead of criticizing joe biden? actually, doing it for the next ten years what the republicans did over the past ten years. >> well, joe, i would tell everybody we need to do what queen beyonce said, we got to get in formation. we need to build the infrastructure, and that's what i've been trying to do as chair of the dnc. you know, you don't get a whole lot of headlines, but we've been

rebuilding the infrastructure of our state parties. at the end of the day, what we are seeing is republicans have been able to chip away at rights on a state level, and then that has been able to amplify on a federal level. the only way you combat that is to build an infrastructure to stop that from happening. that's strengthening our state parties again. joe, in 2018 we put $30 million on the ground as the dnc. we have already committed $70 million on the ground. for over a year we've been building our voter protection efforts. we have voter protection teams across the country, organizers on the ground across the country. you don't get a whole lot of headlines about that. those things are happening right now and have been happening for a year. what we have to do, folks, is focus our energy. the enemy is not within. we have to make sure that we push back against these republican efforts to take away american rights, and you do that on the ground, and that's why we've been focused on

registering, mobilizing, supporting grass roots groups like planned parenthood and narol. we want to see record turnout this november so we can then on a state level make sure that we protect roe but also on a federal level do all that we can to make sure that we codify that. it's not just roe. it's a number of other things as well. >> this is gene robinson, republicans spent 40 years packing the supreme court with justices who would make these rulings, who would overturn roe, who would -- who were against basically all gun control, who had no respect for voting rights. they spent the past 20 years turning these state legislatures from blue to red, and so is that what democrats are now looking at? a 20-year, 40-year struggle to get back to where we were, or is

there -- is there a way to do that more expeditiously, and how do you sell a long march to the democratic party? >> well, it's hard selling -- it's good seeing you, gene, but it is hard selling a long march because many times our folks are focused on a cycle. they're just focused on what we do in 2022, what do we want this party to like in 2032, 2042. what's going to be the next georgia, the next arizona. how do we build up state power in states like south carolina? how do we regain and energize people in south dakota? how do we mobilize the native communities? how do we go back and strengthen our connections to latino communities across the country. that is what we're focused on. because sometimes people don't see the end results right now, they get frustrated and i understand that. i've been doing this for a while. i get frustrated as well. we got to take that frustration, and we have to bottle it and make it and turn it into action. our focus at the dnc right now

is building a stronger infrastructure so that this party isn't built around a personality or an individual but long-term it's sustainable and they can fight back against these attempts to take our rights away from us. >> dnc chairman jamie harrison, thank you so much. and coming up, we appreciate your being on -- new reporting on the capitol attack investigation ahead of today's surprise hearing. the select committee is now focusing on conversations among donald trump's children and top aides captured by a documentary filmmaker weeks before the 2020 election. plus, congressman ruben gallego is calling for justice department action based on the panel's proceedings. the ads democratic joins the conversation in our fourth hour. >> i like what he's saying. i've been talking about it for some time. don't call him super maga or whatever. they're freaks, weirdos and

insurrectionists. call them by their names. nice in washington this morning. >> beautiful day. ames nice in washington this morning. nice in washington this morning. >> beautiful day this is going to get tens and tens of views. ♪ but if you don't have the right auto insurance coverage, you could be left to pay for this... yourself. get allstate and be better protected from mayhem for a whole lot less.

it is the top of the hour. the january 6th committee rushes back to capitol hill from recess to present new evidence and witness testimony to the american people. >> mean, thiss pretty fascinating, isn't it? 7:00 a.m. on the east coast as we take a look at the capitol, just an absolutely beautiful

morning on capitol hill this morning. this is a committee that wasn't going to be back in session until july. we got news overnight that they're going to have an emergency hearing today. >> 1:00. >> and very tight-lipped about it, right? >> yes, tight-lipped about what the information is. there are some clues about who will be testifying. we'll have that new reporting for you. welcome back to "morning joe." it is tuesday, right? is it tuesday? only tuesday. the bbc's katty kay is still with us along with willie, joe, and me. willie. >> let's get to that surprise january 6th committee. the committee did not reveal a topic, even name any witnesses. nbc news has confirmed, cassidy hutchinson, a former top aide to trump chief of staff mark meadows will be the one to testify. the committee announced last week it was taking a break from hearings until mid-july. we thought there was a long break here. congress then left for recess only for the committee to return

today for its january 6th hearing. joining us now congressional reporter for "the guardian" who has been all over this committee covering it inside and out, hugo lowell. good morning, it's good to see you. so cassidy hutchinson, punch bowl news first reported this last night. nbc news has now confirmed that. what more do we expect to hear from her? we know we saw her in some of the videos, the taped statements that she made naming names in terms of republicans asking for pardons around january 6th among other things. what more can we expect to hear today at 1:00? >> i think we have to still wait and see. it's very, very difficult with cassidy hutchinson to know where the story goes next, i think. but if you look at what cassidy has said in the past and if that's any indication of what's to come in the future, then we should probably expect some bomb shells. as you say, she was the star witness who testified about republican members of congress seeking pardons, that they went to the white house counsel

office seeking pardonens and she overheard members of congress trying to get pardons through her and other members of the west wing. she has also testified about documents that mark meadows was burning at the white house after meeting with scott perry, of course now the chairman of the house freedom caucus. so there's all sorts of interesting things that i think cassidy has seen during her time in the final weeks of the trump white house, and it sounds like a lot of this may come today. >> yeah, i mean, she was in the room for so many of these conversations including all that back and forth in the state of georgia where the president of the united states was looking for votes, more than 11,000 of them. tell us about your reporting this morning about the documentary filmmaker who we've gotten to know from these hearings named alex holder. we had him on the show a few days ago, he had incredible access to this white house. he was there in the room with cameras for so much of that and recorded a phone call that eric trump made. tell us more about that.

>> it's not just eric trump as it turns out. he went and testified last week thursday to the select committee, and it was because jamie raskin, a member of the select committee got a tip that alex holder had sat down for these one on one interviews with the former president himself and a number of trump's adult children. now, what also emerged during that deposition is that the documentary film crew got access to the trump hotel on the 29th of september of 2020. that was the night of the first debate, and that's really significant because alex holder was able to record don jr. and eric and others on the phone and having candid private conversations among each other about strategies with respect to the 2020 election. it also comes the same night that steve bannon was doing an interview with our friend john heilemann who of course is the host of "the circus" on hbo, and he was telling john about how he

expected the outcome of the election to come down on january 6th or later. but either way it would be decided in the house of representatives in a contingent election. so what the select committee is trying to establish is there a line between what steve bannon was saying and don jr. was saying. we know they share advisers and they share people close to those two, you know, in their orbits. so they need to establish was there some sort of plan that the trump children knew about for somehow stopping the certification on january 6th as bannon was predicting. >> yeah, ivanka trump of course testified and we've seen some of that testimony, but eric and donald trump, we need to know more about what they were doing around those days, and these cameras from alex holder may help us understand that. hugo lowell, thanks so much as always. joe. hey, joining us now contributor to conservative website the bulwark and host of not my party on snapchat, tim milley, author of the new book titled "why we did it: a travel

log from the republican road it to hell" and here we are, tim. >> you like that, tim? >> i like that. in my formative years, you know, i always said the guy who i thought was the most effective governor was jeb bush, a guy you know very well. you look back not so many years ago when you had republican governors like jeb bush, mitt romney, george voin vich. i could go down the list, and now we find ourselves after this decision, this supreme court decision on abortion, which looks like it will go into contraceptives, marriage equality, et cetera, et cetera, going back to states that even david french says are run by legislators who are passing some of the most extreme right wing legislation ever. what's i mean? >> look, i think one of the core

things that i try to tease out in the book is that what we've discovered over the past 12 years, this is something that we probably should have known in 2008 with sarah palin was the first red flag, then 2010, but there's this republican political class in d.c., that's who i focus on and who i write about in the book, and they are, you know, more in the mold of all of the people you just laid out, mitt romney type republicans in their personal life. and i think they have felt like they have the strategic acumen to use who you called in the last segment the crazies, the extremists, you know, the ultra magas to their ends as far as, you know, cutting taxes and strong national defense, et cetera. and what really has happened is the opposite. it's that the crazies have been dragging along the establishment with them and taken over the party essentially. what i tried to figure out is how do these people who have not left the party like i did

justified to themselves sticking around for this when it's so obvious that i is, y know, as hillary clinton called them the deplorables who are now in charge. >> you know the remarkable thing is you have all of these people who are in the republican establishment that when i was in the republican party, when i was in washington, i would look at them as being too establishment. >> right. >> too much in the bush camp. too -- you name it, too chamber of commerce, too establishmentarian, and they were these self-dealers. they always said you're too radical, scarborough, you're too this, too that. they're the trumpists now. i start with jenny thomas. i raise you matt shlap. these were the most establishment republicans there were, working for the bushes inside the white house. now all of a sudden they're the fire breathers who are saying

why don't we just take down the federal government because our guy didn't power. it was all about money, and the weird thing is it's actually kind of more pathetic than being about power. it's being about being around power. >> exactly. >> these characters are so addicted to being in the room where it happened so to speak, and they become obsessed with that, and that's how they made all of their decisions. my old boss reince priebus, i asked him about this. we were in miami right after it was clear trump was going to win florida and i said to him, we were friends, he's my former boss. i said chairman, you got to bail now. you got to let trump put in one of his own people because he is going to tarnish you forever. he said tim, i promise you, we need to have good people in the room. we need to have somebody around, and if it ever gets out of control, then i will be -- then i'll jump off the ship and raise the flag. we know that that didn't happen,

and so matt schlap, we can go on and on giving these examples and they all have different reasons, and that's what i try to tease out. >> for tim and myself, it's so disconcerting because we've been in the room when decisions were being made, when people like paul ryan was in that room and others were in that room who -- they're like, okay, yeah, they make the right decisions. something happened when donald trump came town where people who -- again, i knew paul when he was 23, 24, when he was actually working on staff for one of our groups in washington, and you have paul on maybe a tuesday saying that donald trump is a racist, and he endorses him the next day. there is no explaining that. >> no. >> and it not just happened to paul, i'm not picking on paul specifically, it happened to just about everybody that tim and i knew.

i mean, this was simple. and let me just say how simple it is, when donald trump brings up a muslim registry in december of 2015, at that point u say i'm out. i'm out. oh, wait, they're doing the same thing that the nazis were doing in germany in 1923. this is a good time to jump out of the plane with my parachute on. and nobody did. i did. i'm sure tim did. nobody else did. >> yeah, it started for me with an insult to john mccain in july of 2015 and you thought, okay, he's done. mccain's an icon in the country and certainly in the party, and it didn't hurt him. this will be interesting to watch. then a muslim ban. it goes all the way to staging a coup, an attempted coup against the united states government, and still, tim, those people that you just mentioned don't abandon him. you write a lot about elise stefanik in the book who wants to be speaker of the house. she was sort of a conventional establishment republican, worked

on the romney campaign, worked in the bush white house, and now here she is saying that the january 6th committee is a witch hunt and using all of president trump's language. clearly for her that's about power. i guess the question a lot of people always have, how do you look yourself in the mirror if you're ted cruz or marco rubio who's been insulted during an entire presidential campaign, but still to bend a knee to donald trump. where does personal pride ever come into this? >> i found there wasn't a lot of personal pride. there's a lot of rationalizations. this is what i had to grapple with. it was so obvious that he was unfit and beyond the pale. i looked at these people who i know knew better. i got a text yesterday from a far right reporter who got an early copy of the book and despite the fact that i tag him and his ilk at breitbart as big gots and extremists, he's like you got it right. we are in charge here, and all of these guys, all of the elise

stefaniks are getting drug to the extremes by us. that's what makes them kind of the ones that are so -- that it's so hard to grapple with, right? it feels so gross. elise wouldn't talk to me, buzz she was more than just a conventional republican. she was a moderate. when she first ran, she was like a tim miller republican. we had to deal with climate change, gay rights, immigration, you name it, we've got to reform the party. here she is now as trump's number one cheerleader and nativist. so i had coffee, i had drinks with one of my friends who worked with me on john huntsman campaign, and she went all the way to the insurrection. she was there at the mall, and so we had to meet and i had to just pick her brain and say how is this possible, and what you find is a lot of these folks have decided that the left is so evil that that justifies anything, and the only way i think to break this is to try to, you know, get them to, you

know, step back from the precipice of these tribalist fights that we're having. >> as i'm sure you heard over the weekend some republicans say after the roe decision that's why i voted for donald trump. three justices on the supreme court overturned donald trump, that's from a are pro-lifer's perspective. the question for someone like elise stefanik, which person is she? is she the person who you knew way back when, or is she a nativist? does she believe these things? >> she's just a scriber. it's as simple as that. i do think her core beliefs were the moderate, you know, center right beliefs that she espoused back then, but i think when you go back and look at her career, which i did. i interviewed all her friends, what you find is this is just somebody who was just addicted to being on the path to the top. >> yeah. >> and so when she had to change paths to do it, she did, and it didn't matter if she dropped all the people that helped her get there. her original team that was all around her on that first campaign where she was going to be a new face, a new welcoming

compassionate face for the party, none of them are with her anymore. and some of them had very hard falling out because, you know, she just, you know, was not going to let anything stop her. and i think that she's going to be on the short list -- if it's trump especially, i think she's going to be on the short list for one of the three people who could be the vice president of the united states. this is the hardest thing to grapple with throughout all of this. unfortunately it's paying off for her, and that's why i think it's so important to expose how shameless it is and how fraudulent it is. >> it is shameless. it also has happened for quite some time. you know, newt gingrich ran as a rockefeller republican in 1974 he lost, he ran as a rockefeller republican in 1976 he lost. he ran as a fire breathing right winger in 1978 and the rest is history. he won. >> yeah, i guess my question would be is, you know, in recent years this kind of started with

trump and trump fed this movement particularly in the case of somebody like elise stefanik, but to what extent, tim, has this got bigger than trump? particularly around issues around democracy and elections and 2020, and the insurrection up on the capitol, i wonder where the movement, the genie is out of the bottle and were trump to disappear from the political scene tomorrow, i'm not sure that much would change. i think this -- particularly around election denial, i think it's out there, and it's now become a sort of creed in and of itself that is almost bigger than trump is. >> i basically agree. i think trump has a couple of unique traits that make him particularly dangerous. his shamelessness, some of that i don't think would continue. here's the thing about donald trump, everything on this panel knows this. this didn't have to be the kind of campaign he ran. he was a totally different guy in the '80s and '90s with a

couple of exceptions of issues that he cared about. this is a bottom up thing. this is what i really had to grapple with in the book. i went back to 2008 when i was a young staffer for john mccain in iowa and thinking about the crowds that showed up to those rallies. i really should have seen this then, and i interviewed people that i worked with back then and we all kind of saw it but compartmentalized it in a box. it's coming from voters. it's a demand side problem, and, you know, they're the tail that's wagging donald trump, not the other way around, and so i think to your point that shows that this is going to continue until, you know, some leaders return to washington who are willing to buck the most extreme parts of the party, and unfortunately i don't see too many people who fit that bill right now in washington, d.c., on the republican side. >> it's such a great point because we sit here asking how could republicans do this, why aren't there -- say it all the time, and i'm wrong all the time for the very reason you said

because before donald trump got into politics, he hung out with reverend al sharpton. they'd go to boxing matches, right? >> right. >> he would condemn right wing republican freaks, right? he was far more comfortable socially with nancy pelosi, with hillary clinton, with bill clinton than he was with mitch mcconnell or paul ryan or kevin mccarthy. he has so much contempt for these republicans because he doesn't really understand them socially and culturally because he was far more comfortable with left wingers, with liberals, with elites. i mean, you look at his campaign for the reform where he's talking about campaigning in 2000, he was pro-gun control. he was pro-choice, and he was really comfortable in those positions, so you're right. when we keep saying why, you know, when we keep looking at these republicans, the officeholders, it's not them. it's not even trump.

you're right. it's the base. >> yeah, and really what it's come down to now, trump is the grievance, and i think that is what's driving both him and the base and what connects him to the base, and you know, and i think that unfortunately where i felt complicit during my time as a republican operative is we fed into that. we fed them this red meat, but we didn't really feel their grievance in the way that donald trump does and now donald trump's mad that all his old buddies, all his -- you know, the al sharpton and all the actors and all the hollywood types, they don't like him anymore. now he has that in common with his base. i think that is one of the things that connects him, they hate these elites that have shunned them. >> let's look forward. >> yes, please. >> what potentially breaks this fever. as you said, this is deeply rooted. this is not about one man, donald trump, when we moves on it will still be with us. is there something -- you would have thought an attempted coup

would have caused some people to step away from donald trump or at least give them pause. it hasn't really happened on the republican side, certainly on capitol hill. what breaks this fever? >> look, i don't think among the voters there is a fever breaking thing. there's a silver bullet. we need people to start acting responsibly in washington, and look at today, we have this young woman cassidy hutchinson who's going to testify. what was it that broke her, right? it was all these rationalizations for her actions didn't work anymore in the face of what happened. and i interviewed alyssa fara who was his communications director. she build after the election because she said i want my kids to look at me and be proud of me and be proud of my actions, and i couldn't do that anymore after the election. and i really think the only way out of this is not -- is to try to break this bottom up fever within the party and to try to promote leadership in washington where the incentive structure is different, where the incentive is to act like alyssa did and cassidy says she's doing today, and not the opposite. >> the leadership is riding this

trump wave wherever it takes them. this is such a good book. it's out today, a must read from tim miller. great to see you. >> absolutely. >> mika. still ahead on "morning joe," dozens are dead after a suspected migrant smugging operation in texas. federal officials say it appears to be the deadliest such incident ever in the united states. the governor of texas is pointing the blame squarely at president biden has quickly drawn criticism for his remarks. we'll show you that and what the white house is saying. plus, it is primary day once again. we're breaking down the biggest races ahead. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back.

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25 past the hour. three people are in police custody after at least 46 people were found dead inside a semi truck in san antonio. a scene the city's mayor called a horrific human tragedy. authorities were alerted to the scene last night when a worker in a nearby building heard a cry for help. first responders say the worker found the trailer with doors partially opened and a number of people dead inside. >> at this time we have processed approximately 46 bodies that have been triaged and tagged and declared deceased at this time. fortunately we were able to transport 16 people, 12 of those are adults and four pediatric.

all of them were conscious at the time upon transportation. >> authorities say they are unsure of the exact number of people originally inside the trailer adding that a more extensive search of the surrounding areas is expected to take place in the coming days, and joe, i mean, this is -- how do you try and stop this at this point? >> well, you know, sadly these tragedies are going to continue so long as the united states keeps sending the message that people can come across our border illegally, that we're not going to treat all immigrants the same and we don't have laws that, again, do what kamala harris tried to do, tried to say when she went down, i believe it

was to guatemala, which is stay home. don't come up. it's too dangerous. and it's one thing i don't understand. it's kind of like when i talk about homelessness, there's nothing progressive about having people sleeping in ten-degree weather sleeping on grates. that's not progressive. there's also nothing progressive about encouraging migrants to risk their lives going across the desert to come into the united states illegally. immigration, i mean, it is who we are, and all immigrants around the world should be given an equal chance to immigrate to america legally. immigration, it makes us stronger as a nation. ronald reagan, it was one of the last things that ronald reagan said before he left the white house. it is who we are, but we have to

get it right. we have to encourage people to do it legally. we have to stop sending a message either by our words or by our deeds that you can risk sending little children across deserts to come to the united states. the second they figure out that's not going to get them into the united states, there are going to be a lot of lives that are going to be saved and we can do it in a legal way, and you know, willie, one thing i don't really understand is democrats for quite some time have made the mistake -- and i say for some time -- for decades thinking that actually encouraging legal immigration would hurt them with hispanic voters. i always go back to barack obama. under barack obama and joe biden's administration, by the time president obama left

office, immigration -- illegal immigration, illegal border crossings were at a 50-year low. it spiked, of course, under donald trump, and it's continued to spike, but it was a 50-year low. we heard a lot of people calling barack obama the deporter in chief, and oh, his immigration policies were so awful. barack obama held mitt romney to 27% of the hispanic vote. he got 71% of the hispanic vote laws. they want us to enforce our laws. they want us to encourage legal immigration. they want these type of tragedies to stop, and there's only, unfortunately, there's only one way to do it. >> yeah, i mean, for all the tough talk from donald trump about walls and the racist

rhetoric, it was barack obama who was known as the deporter in chief, and there was a special election just a couple of weeks ago down along a border district, a place where a republican hadn't won in a very long time, and a republican took that district, so we've talked about this with progressive pollsters, by the way, who say this idea that latino voters in america are all in and they have this open mind and they're go with democrats wherever they go on immigration is just wrong. it's just folly, and it's not true and it's patronizing in many ways to make those assumptions. so yeah, democrats will have to reassess. some of them may not want to use the word crisis, but that's exactly what it is down along the border when you have customs and border patrol having 7,000, 8,000 encounters and apprehensions a day on the border, that is a crisis. and it bore its ugly teeth yesterday, mika, when we saw the story and the images and hearing

exactly how those poor people looking for a better life died in the back of a semi truck. >> well, texas governor greg abbott tweeted, quote, these deaths are on biden. they are a result of his deadly open border policies. they show the deadly consequences of his refusal to enforce the law. in response to that, msnbc's mehdi hasan asked on twitter, quote, remember when republicans lecture everyone about not politicizing deaths? the white house is declining to comment on the tweet from governor abbott, but a series of tweets from alejandro mayorkas who said he is heartbroken from the loss of life and placed the blame on human smugglers whom he called, quote, callus individuals who have no regard for the vulnerable people they exploit and endanger to make a profit. >> the only thing i'll say about greg abbott, he certainly wasn't

talking about that during donald trump's administration blaming donald trump, katty kay for getting, again, the lowest rate of illegal border crossings, he inherited that from barack obama and then it spiked. but this is -- i've got to say this is something democrats and i've said it for some time and people don't like hearing it, they need to hear it. this is something that democrats need to get their arms around. we have to have laws at the border that can be both humane but also that can support legal, safe immigration. sending a message to poor under developed countries and to people there who are struggling for a better life, if you risk your life, if you risk your children's life, if you risk your family's life, you just may get into the united states. there's nothing progressive about that message. there's nothing humanitarian about that message.

we've got to do a better job along the border. >> yeah, and it's really bad at the moment. i was down in arizona recently, and everybody is talking about the situation, and many actually talking about the tragedy of the situation of women getting raped as they come across, of children getting separated from their parents, of children getting raped as they come across. the people smugglers really taking advantage of what is seen as an open door policy, and the message gets back very fast from people -- from, you know, the u.s. to other countries that at the moment it's easier to get in, which seems to be why we are seeing more people coming across the border. as you say, barack obama did have a surge in cases. donald trump had a surge in cases at one point, and now joe biden is having a real surge in cases, and it's going to take more than kamala harris going to the water known as the triangle countries, the countries that send from where most of these people are coming because she went and she said the message is don't come to the states. nobody seems to have heard that

message, and they're still coming. there was a thinking at one point that this is just covid and covid had exacerbated the economic situation in those countries. that doesn't seem to be the case because people are still coming in huge numbers and we're ending up with this awful tragedy of what's happened in this truck of people just being piled in and bodies and it seems like there were children in that truck too, and you're right, joe. the administration has to do something about this. >> all right. coming up, more nato and u.s. troops could be headed to eastern europe. we'll have the latest developments as world leaders meet overseas. plus, the fight for abortion rights, shifts to state courts. we'll break down the legal battles that are already underway. and why some legal experts are comparing the fallout from the supreme court's decision on abortion to the civil war. "morning joe" will be right back. on abortion to the civil war. "morning joe" will be right "morning joe" will be right back

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groups in the east part of the alliance up to brigade levels. we will transform the nato response force and increase the number of our forces to well over 300,000. >> that is nato's secretary general yesterday announcing what he calls the biggest overall in the alliances defenses since the cold war. his announcement came hours ahead of a three-day nato summit in madrid, spain. president biden on his way there as we speak. president biden plans to announce an increase of american troops in poland while he's in europe for that nato summit. according to several officials, the decision could affect the number of troops deployed in the baltic states of lithuania, latvia and estonia. the president may announce the expansion of the u.s. navy's presence in spain by adding two ships over the next few years. joining us now former spokesperson for the u.s. mission to the united nations, agar shamali, she worked at the

national security council and treasury department, and senior fellow at the atlantic council, a former spokesperson for the organization for security and cooperation in europe. good morning to you both. it's great to see you. michael, let me begin with you and go back to what we were talking about a moment ago. this missile attack on a shopping mall in central ukraine. the russians saying we thought there was a weapons depot there. there was a weapons depot there. the mall was closed. that's flatly untrue. we know of 18 deaths so far. the fight that has been in the east for so many months appears to be coming back to places like kyiv and into this mall. >> thanks for having me. i was in ukraine for the past three months and i'm about to go back there via madrid. this is horrible. horrible, horrible. you know, it makes you wonder where are the red lines? how far is russia going to be allowed to go to -- you know, in terms of inflicting this horrible civilian toll. this is the second time they've

gone after a shopping center of that size. i was at the first one in kyiv, which was bombed in march, and i've seen destruction. i think the -- what the russians need to understand is, number one, no one believes them when they say there is a depot, and number two, the west has to be very, very clear about what the red lines are because what is it a shopping center? what is it going to be tomorrow, another maternity hospital? it's great to see what nato is doing, increasing its forces and so on, but i hate to say it's a little bit too late. at least that's how a lot of ukrainians feel. one more quick thing, the only way this will stop these indiscriminate bombings on their shopping centers, maternity hospitals, if ukraine gets what it's begging for, the ability to close its skies to those long-range russian missiles. >> and what would that mean exactly? we've talked about no fly zones, why those are a nonstarter for

the united states. what does it mean to draw a red line? if you say vladimir putin, if you target another mall we're going to do x and he targets the mall, what's the world prepared to do? >> right, the only red linish so far that we've heard of is in regard to use of chemical weapons against ukrainian civilians, and the problem right now that you're facing that michael has pointed out and that was the first thing i thought of when i saw this attack on a mall is that russia is sending a message, right? this is during the g-7. this is during the nato summit. this is during an increase in military aid to ukraine, though not fast enough, and he's sending a message that we can terrorize whomever we want, whenever we want inside ukraine, and we're not going to hesitate to do it. and the reason they behave that way is because they know that nobody wants to militarily engage russia except for ukraine's people and military. and i'm not trying to say that we should all just jump into world war iii with russia now, but the reality of the situation

is that there is no amount of sanctions. there is no amount of unity among the allies that will stop this kind of behavior. the language dictators understand and i saw this from syria, from handling syria and it's out of the same play book. the only language they understand is the threat of military force. if we're not going to do it, we need to let ukraine close the skies as quickly as possible, and we have to do that before people get compassion fatigue, before we run out of money to support ukraine. the white house sees that. you see them beefing that up, but it's got to be as fast as possible. >> we've heard katty kay, president zelenskyy on that point saying please don't ignore us now. we know you have other problems in your country. we need you to stay with us on this. it appears through the rhetoric anyway at the g-7 summit and now at nato that the world is thinking that way in terms of supporting ukraine. >> yeah, willie, that's something that ukrainian officials apparently are concerned about right in the very first days of the war.

they were aware of the possibility that this war could go on for a long time. and that the west would start to lose attention. michael, you've spent a lot of time in ukraine. i am sure that it is something that ukrainians are watching. what's ukrainians' sense of how united the rest -- the west really is until its determination to keep up its support at current levels for ukraine? because it's going to have to be at current levels if ukraine is going to carry on tackling russia and beating russia back in the east of the country for the next four months right through the winter even potentially. do they think the unity and the commitment is there? >> great question. the problem is i think we have huge gaps that you could drive a truck through when it comes to unity and sanctions. what i mean by that is, for example, turkey is a little bit on its own path. it's starving, for example, for russian tourists. israel, by the way, now is not allowing ukrainians without visas into the country, even

those that want to flee. i think we have to get to that point where if you're a russian oligarch or anybody in mr. putin's circle, the only way -- the only place you can go to vacation is perhaps pyongyang or those illegally built chinese islands in the south china sea. the problem is they can go to a lot of the gulf states, places like that, so i think we need to pull them on board as well. that is something they will understand is that isolation. i was at the ukrainian permanent mission the other day, and you know, we talk about this western unity and diplomatic isolation. they told me in the general assembly and votes regarding russia, russia still gets 100 plus votes. what kind of diplomatic isolation is that? >> not much. one of the takeaways from the meeting of g-7 nations that just wrapped up was a move to capping the price of russian oil. according to a u.s. official, the group of seven leaders are aiming to further restrict putin's cash flow as well as

bring down prices at the gas pump providing greater stability to energy markets. g-7 leaders seem to be focusing on the way russian oil is shipped, but no additional details on a potential price gap and how it would work were immediately available. biden's national security adviser jake sullivan said the delay of the agreement had to do with the novelty and the complexity of the approach and that a price cap would be, quote, one of the more significant outcomes of the g-7 summit. hagar, what kind of impact would this have if they can get it together? >> if they can get it together, this is a big one. as you know, i worked in sanctions a long time. i worked at the treasury department a long time. this is a unique idea, but we don't have a lot of details as to how they would implement this. i've seen a lot of articles now, a lot of reporters saying this is insight into how sanctions are not working.

that because china and india is purchasing russian oil at a discounted price, but they're purchasing a lot of it, that sanctions are clearly not working. except that russia just defaulted on $100 billion bond. that is just a sign of how isolated russia is from the international financial system. if this were to work, it would be amazing. it's killing two birds with one stone. they're going to hurt russia financially, and they're going to help the energy markets, the increasing price of oil around the world, something that's affecting -- it's affecting people everywhere. but i just -- i have yet to see a similar example of something like this happened, it would take a lot of partners jumping in, the private sector shipping, energy companies, governments to actually make a cap work. other producing companies, sorry, countries. so i'm cautiously optimistic, but i also would add that sanctions take a long time to work. that is normal. europe has committed to

decreasing its oil consumption by the end of the year. they're doing it as fast as they can. it's not fast enough, but it is what it is. >> michael, before i let you go since you spend so much time there, just the people of ukraine, this war has changed that country forever with refugees scattered across europe, many of them displaced internally. it seems foolish to ask how they're holding up, but what does the future look like to the average ukrainian? >> i used to be spokesperson for unicef. whenever we had this emergency on this scale, the worst thing the world could do is avert its gaze from happening. i spoke to the head of the ukrainian ngo this morning, and she said we're already feeling it. the decline in donations and the interest. what they're doing is they're creating semipermanent housing for those refugees or migrants who want to stay in ukraine. again, what the ukrainians are begging for is the ability to close their skies.

i will repeat something that mr. zelenskyy and other ukrainian government officials said is inch of ukraine can be considered safe until ukraine has the ability to close its own skies. whether that takes something that washington, d.c., has and others talk of it right now or even something iron dome system which is really advanced. ukraine needs that sort of thing now. i'm going to be there for the next few weeks, and you hear the air sirens a few times every day in some cases. and even if you don't have the missiles coming in, that anxiety, imagine what women and children are feeling. >> even if some of the world's attention has moved away, it's still there for the people of ukraine. great conversation. we appreciate you being here. >> coming up next, a live report from capitol hill ahead of the surprise january 6th committee hearing now scheduled for this afternoon. we now know who the witness will be. >> plus, we're watching another round of primary elections across the country today. steve kornacki will be back at

the big board to break down the biggest story lines, the biggest races today. "morning joe" is coming right back. "morning joe" is coming right back ♪ and party every day. ♪ ♪ i want to rock and roll all night ♪ applebee's late night. because half off is just more fun. now that's eatin' good in the neighborhood.

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it is 54 past the hour. and amtrak train with more than 240 passengers onboard derailed in missouri, after it slammed into a dump truck, killing three people and injuring more than 50. nbc news national correspondent miguel almaguer has the details. >> the very passengers riding the derailed amtrak train recorded their own harrowing escape. through broken glass and twisted metal, survivors climbed to safety any way they could. some stunned and without their shoes on, made their way to the

top of their toppled passenger cars. 255 were aboard. there are dozens of injuries and at least three fatalities. >> everyone is screaming. i, of course, am yelling. people are on top of one another. >> after first responders reached the wreckage in rural missouri, some of the injured were rushed to local hospitals. it was 2:42 p.m. when eight of the train's cars and two locomotives derailed after slamming into a dump truck at a public crossing. horrified screamed filled the train headed from los angeles to chicago. >> i have been in bad car accidents. this is beyond comprehension. >> with the cause of this crash under investigation, it's been a deadly 48 hours for amtrak. sunday, outside san francisco, three were killed and two were hospitalized after another train loaded with passengers collided with a car on the tracks, also at a public crossing. now, it's happened again. as authorities piece together what went wrong. >> nbc's miguel almaguer with

that report. and still ahead, nbc news has confirmed that a former top aide to mark meadows will testify during today's last-minute house select committee hearing. we'll have the very latest from capitol hill. >> plus, the supreme court's decision to overturn roe v. wade has sparked calls for expanding the court. one of our next guests explains why he believes life tenure on the nation's highest court has outlived its time. "morning joe" is coming right back. g right back those who tried me felt more energy in just two weeks! (sighs wearily) here i'll take that! (excited yell) woo-hoo! ensure max protein. with thirty grams of protein, one gram of sugar, and nutrients to support immune health. ♪ i want to rock and roll all night ♪ ♪ and party every day. ♪

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in you're never responsible. for unauthorized purchases on your discover card. it is the top of the third hour of "morning joe." as we look at capitol hill live this morning, breaking news this morning. nbc news confirms a former aide to trump chief of staff mark meadows will testify today at a

surprise hearing of the house select committee investigating january 6th. welcome back to "morning joe." it is tuesday, june 28th. this is big news, willie. especially given the fact they were in recess. >> yeah, you have a group of congressmen and women on this committee coming back from recess, back into town from their home districts twr this hearing just announced yesterday, scheduled for 1:00 eastern time this afternoon. the committee did not reveal the topic or the name of witnesses, but as we mentioned, we can confirm now, it will be cassidy hutchinson, a former top aide to mark meadows who will testify today. we saw her in recorded testimony over the last couple weeks. now, the committee will hear from her in person. joining us now from washington, nbc news capitol hill correspondent ali vitali. good morning. good to see you. why the urgency here around cassidy hutchinson to rush back to washington? >> because this was certainly a surprise. for those of us covering the committee, we expected them to

take a short break for several weeks and then pick up again with their hearings in july. that postponement of continued hearings seemed to have happened because they were getting new testimony. we also know they had been reaching out to and subpoenaing other people they wanted to talk to, including that documentarian they spoke to last week who had footage of trump and others inside his orbit on it days around january 6th. so of course, that's material the committee wanted to be able to see. but late yesterday, then, of course, this news breaking that the committee was going to be adding a surprise hearing spontaneously for today. some members flooding back to town because, again, members are on recess right now. we have reported now this morning, our sources confirming to us, cassidy hutchinson is going to be the surprise witness today. you're right, there's a lot of urgency around this. when you see a committee like this one popping up different hearings on less than 24 hours notice, it certainly perks your ears up, especially when we know cassidy hutchinson was someone who was in a lot of these

critical meetings inside the white house. she had a lot of access to, of course, her boss, the former chief of staff, mark meadows, but also to the president and others inside of his orbit. she was someone who, for example, in the last hearing that we heard from the committee, spoke to the fact that she knew that lawmakers had asked for pardons from the white house in preemption of whatever happened on january 6th. of course, begging the question, why are you asking for pardons if you're not sure that you're doing something illegal? clearly, she had a lot of access at a lot of the moments that the committee would like to tease out further. we know what she's told them already behind closed doors, but the point of today is we're told there's going to be new testimony she can offer and it could be any number of things, but we know the committee's goal is to try to get as close to the truth and as close to in these rooms where critical conversations were happening as they can. cassidy hutchinson allowing them

to do more of that. >> ali vitali, thank you very much. of course that hearing is at 1:00. we'll have special coverage here on msnbc, 1:00 eastern time. >> now to the legal fight over abortion rights happening now at the state level, after the supreme court overturned roe v. wade. yesterday, judges in louisiana and utah temporarily blocked trigger laws that ban the procedure following lawsuits by abortion rights advocates. according to "the new york times," there are at least 16 states that have trigger laws in effect or that will take effect soon. we should note that wisconsin's ban on abortion stems from a law still on the books from 1849, but the state's governor and attorney general have said they will not enforce it. abortion rights groups have filed lawsuits in several states, but legal experts say the challenges are only likely to delay the laws from taking effect. let's bring in contributing

writer at the atlantic, james fallows, the author of the breaking the news newsletter, and his latest dispatch is entitled, a branch of government self-destructs. you write in part this, the point that bears emphasis on june 24th, 2022, the day roe v. wade was overturned, is that the court's power ultimately depends on legitimacy, and its current majority has failed its legitimacy into a big heap and set it ablaze. any democratic system must in the long run match the general will of the people, with the general actions of the state. that's how you know it is a democracy. we are now closer to systemic rule by a minority rather than respect for its rights. a democracy cannot forever function this way. james, let's take it a step further. i heard a lot of people talking about when the draft opinion was

leaked that confidence in the court was really being broken. and if we could develop on the notion of legitimacy, what has happened to it, and what's at stake? >> what's at stake, i think, is every politician, every public institution has questions of its legitimacy, but for the presidency or for the congress, there are built-in checks. there are elections. people can be turned in or change. the supreme court is the least accountable branch of government, that is largely by design to have something stand above day-by-day politics, but over the last generation or two, it's drifted away from the kind of caution and sobriety that you would think an institution in that place would need, and here are two illustrations i would offer. the last time a democratic president appointed a chief justice was in 1946, that was harry truman. most americans now alive have

never been alive when there were a majority of democratic appointees on the supreme court. this is partly just by luck of who happens to die when. it's the luck of which presidents get which openings. jimmy carter for whom i worked had no appointments. donald trump had three. it's the trick of legislation as well. but it's branch that is less and less sort of connected to the working public. >> james froze. okay. we'll try to get him back. >> we'll get him back. when he comes back, we would love to talk about his idea. he actually has an idea to reform the court to try to take out some of, well, some of the setups that actually make it as partisan as it has, mika.

and so that's -- hopefully we'll get james back. >> ken dilanian spoke with various legal experts who predict the supreme court's decision on abortion is likely to set off a wave of legal and political disputes among the states and federal government, unlike anything we have seen perhaps since the days of the civil war. those legal experts point out that with some states allowing private lawsuits against out-of-state abortion providers and other states prohibiting cooperation with abortion investigations, the issue is likely to pit state law enforcement agencies and court systems against one another in dramatic fashion in this scenario, it is conceivable that a person could be wanted for a

felony in an anti-abortion rights state, but protected from extradition in a pro-abortion rights state. the governor of massachusetts has set up rules prohibiting officers from cooperating in investigations. california's governor seeking to provide protection. texas law, however, lets private citizens sue out-of-state abortion providers, and missouri is considering a similar law. >> it certainly is going to be rather complex. we're going to be getting into areas we haven't been into much lately. i think we have james back. so james, you wrote an article some time back that talked about a good way to reform the court in a way where it's not luck of the draw. it takes away a lot of the heated rhetoric. this sort of zero sum game. and if i remember it correctly, it said each term, presidential term, gets two appointments. there are term limits. and that's the way you insure, again, that people don't look at

every nomination as a fight to the political death. >> yes. sorry for my disappearance. glad to rejoin you. this is a proposal laid out in most august detail by a group called the american academy of arts and sciences, based in cambridge, and it's really as respectable of an organization as you could find and they said the answer would be to switch to a scheme of 18-year fixed terms for the nine justices that would come up every two years. and the huge advantage, one advantage would be just avoiding all the vagaries of somebody deciding that he or she will just stay there forever. the more important advantage, i think, as you said, joe, it avoids every single fight being to the death because every president would know that he or she would have two shots at appointments during his or her term, and the next -- each election would be about the next two appointments, not what the

next 40 years in the court would be. there are ways this could be done with purely constitutional consistency as long as the judges after their 18 years had jobs in other courts, other parts of the court system, et cetera, but it's worth reading this report in detail as a way to drain some of the poison out of what had become a really distorting part of our legislative and judicial process. >> you also have written about just the fact that we have people well into their 80s that stay on the courts when it's probably in everyone's best interest that, again, they get cycled out, their 18-year term limits, there's not this gruesome death watch on aging members, as there was with rbg, to figure out if she can stay alive until a democrat is in, or i remember sandra day o'connor being overheard when it looked like al gore was going to win,

saying to her husband, oh, god, it looks like we're going to have to stay in washington another four years. >> yes, and if you consider how important the supreme court has become in the clock wheel geometry or machinery of democracy, it depends so much, we all have to place so much trust in it, to have its workings be dependent on these accidents of health care and of people's guessing about mortality, it would be much more normal and stable to have a way to have each administration have two appointments and then it would be another part of a regular trover, i should say also, i'm aware of no other supreme judicial organization around the world that has life tenure in democracies. they all recognize the need for some kind of refreshing in that role. so i think this could be a good step for us. >> james, you also write in the piece about expanding the court, which is an idea we have heard in recent years from many

progressives. others say progressives aren't getting their way so they want to change it fundamentally. what's the argument for expanding it and how would you begin to go about it? >> the argument for expanding it would have constitutional legitimacy in these two ways. as you all know, the house of representatives itself used to expand its size after each census to keep the number of representatives to population more or less constant. it only stopped expanded about 100 years ago. you could have the argument first that a modern house should be bigger than it is. they should have 100 more members or so, which would make fewer really polarized districts. the supreme court has expanded over the years, and originally, the idea through the 1800s was as the number of circuit courts expanded, so too would the number of supreme court seats. that reached an equilibrium with nine circuits and nine seats. there now are 13 circuits.

it would be perfectly logical and historical to say for a whole variety of reasons the court should expand to its natural 13-member role, consistent with the number of judicial circuits. >> james, thank you very much for coming on this morning. >> let's move now to georgia. the split over the overturning of roe v. wade could shake up the state's attorney general race. republican incumbent chris carr is petitioning the courts to allow the heartbeat law to go into effect in the wake of the supreme court decision. the bill that was blocked by a judge in 2020 would ban all abortions at just six weeks. carr is running against democrat state senator jen jurdin. her floor speech in opposition to the bill went viral in 2019. here's just a bit of it. >> i have been pregnant ten times. i have seen what many of you in here have called a heartbeat ten

times. but i have only given birth twice. i have lost seven pregnancies in varying points of times before 20 weeks and one after five months. her name was juliette. i have laid on the cold examination table while a doctor desperately looked for a heartbeat. it is not for the government or the men of this chamber to insert itself in the most personal, private, and wrenching decisions that make every single day. my experience wasn't about abortion. but it is what's at stake here. it's about the fundamental right to privacy of women. matters such as a woman's ability to decide whether to terminate a pregnancy involve the most intimate and personal decisions a person can make. >> and state senator jordan joins us now. so welcome to the show, thank you for coming on. why did you decide to run for this office?

and what's the fight going to look like? >> look, i think i started to run in large part because of the fight we had in 2019. i mean, the policies that have been time and time adopted by the leadership in this state in particular, you know, they're not policies that protect women. they're not policies that protect families or children who are really being left behind. and in hb-481, georgia's six-week abortion ban, kind of personifies that. listening to the speech now, it's almost chilling because everything i laid out there, they're going to be the real legal consequences that women are going to face here in georgia. and i think a lot of people are stunned by it right now. >> what are you hearing from women as you're campaigning, and is part of your strategy to try to talk as well to republican women? >> i think it's about talking to women, right? i thing this isn't -- or it

shouldn't be a partisan thing. the ability to control your life and your body and your decisions has nothing to do with whether you have an r or a d after your name. look. i am at a point where i will never have to think about having an abortion in terms of my life at my age. but i have a daughter. i have a daughter, and really, this fight is about her and the women that i'm talking to, like i said, it's not a partisan thing as much as it's a very personal thing. and the law and the political sound bites and everything that people have been saying are completely incongruent with the lives that women lead every day that are tough, that are hard, and the decisions we have to make, you know, when we decide to become mothers or when we decide not to. that's what i'm hearing and this is one of those issues that are going to bring people together and specifically women together regardless of partisan lane. katty kay.

>> there are going to be a few key races in the country and an awful lot of focus on those races in the midterm elections. there is a lot of anger around this supreme court decision now, and people seem very motivated. do you thing they still will be in november to turn out, to try and protect those rights? >> yeah y thing specifically, and i can speak to georgia, hb-481, which is the law that we passed in 2019, i mean, it's likely to go into effect in august or right before september. it's at that point in time that i think the consequences are going to become very clear to women here. i mean, part of what 481 includes is personhood, which basically recognizes that a fertilized egg is a citizen of the state of georgia and has all the rights attendant to any other person here. if you can think about the pandora's box that is going to be opened with respect to that

in terms of legal challenges, it's pretty stunning. i think as we go into november, i think it's going to become clearer and clearer just how bad this law is. and the impact on women. and i think women are going to be angry and this is always going to energize young people. >> we know and all of the data is there on what happens when abortion is banned. poverty rates go up, inequality goes up. particularly for women from poorer communities. does the fate of women in those communities resonate, when you're talking to women around georgia and perhaps to slightly more conservative women, are they concerned about that? are they concerned about the impact this is going to have on poverty rates in the state? >> i think maybe they're not even thinking about poverty rates as much as they're thinking about their neighbors. i'm from south georgia, rural georgia. a come from a fairly poor community. that's how i was raised. at the end of the day, we care about the people in our community. and with respect to this, the

people in rural georgia outside of atlanta metro and some of the urban centers, they're going to be the ones that are affected the most. we have one of the highest maternal mortality rates in the county. half of our counties don't even have an ob/gyn now, and we passed law that says a doctor if you provide appropriate and necessary care to your patient, you may be facing jail time. that is the wrong answer to the problem. and i think when we start talking and when i'm talking to women, outside of atlanta, in these smaller communities, in rural georia and try to make it clear this really is about the life of the people that they love and their neighbors and also the ability to safely bring children into the world, they get it. they get it. >> candidate for georgia attorney general, georgia state senator jen jordan, thank you so much for coming on the show this morning.

>> thank you. >> five more states will hold midterm primary elections today. primaries will be held in colorado, illinois, oklahoma, utah, and new york. mississippi will hold run-offs today, and nebraska's first district will hold a special election. in illinois, mega donors are spending millions of dollars to influence which republican candidate will face the state's incumbent democratic governor, jb pritzker. one of those big spenders is pritzker himself. the billionaire governor have been trying to bolster a far right candidate just endorsed by former president trump. meanwhile, another billionaire, the founder of the hedge fund firm citadel, ken griffin, has spent $50 million to get a more moderate richard irvin through to november. irvin's candidacy hasn't taken off, and griffin announced he was moving his company to

florida. in new york, kathy hochul is facing two primary challengers. congressman tom suozzi and new york city public advocate jermaine williams. four republicans are running to flip the state, including congressman lee zeldin and andrew giuliani, the son of rudy. meanwhile in colorado, two republicans are running to unseat michael bennet. joe o'daya is running a moderate campaign while his opponent ron hanks is a vocal election denier and was at the capitol on january 6th. that's special. similar to illinois, democrats in colorado have tried to push for more extreme conservative candidate to win the recounts a

the cyber idiots or whatever their name was, the group that went out to do whatever they did. i mean, every recount has shown the same result. yet, you have these election deniers, and they go on, one was on fox news yesterday just repeatedly, just repeatedly lied about the election being rigged. and was allowed to use the airwaves to spread that lie repeatedly. >> in a big way. in our fourth hour of "morning joe," we're going to bring in steve kornacki at the big board for a breakdown of all of these races. >> still ahead this hour, russia is attacking civilians again. this time at a shopping mall. what we're learning about the missile strike and how the ukrainian predis responding.

plus, a horrific discovery in texas. dozens of bodies found packed in a trailer after a cry for help. also ahead, we'll talk about the strategy going forward for the democratic party, with dnc chairman jaime harrison. you're watching "morning joe." we will be right back.

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inside. some of the children's toys, backpacks, and a soccer ball remain. a strong smell of fire is everywhere. investigators are on site, too, collecting evidence of possible war crimes. it's illegal to deliberately bomb civilians. ukrainians say that's exactly what russia did and is doing across the country. the mall was so crowded because the area had never been hit before. people felt safe. earlier, we spoke with president zelenskyy who accused russia of trying to break ukrainian spirit. >> translator: they cannot break us, even if they decide to bomb us all. and all our cities. they cannot break our nation. >> why do you think this is happening, that there are now thousands of allegations of russian war crimes here, thousands of them? >> translator: thousands. >> why? >> very difficult question.

i think that is not even a question. something was, you know, something was broken with mentality with them. something. >> translator: the entire beast lurking inside of them has erupted out. >> that was richard engel reporting. >> coming up t may be one of the deadliest cases of human smuggling in decades. the bodies of dozens of migrants discovered in the back of a truck in texas. those disturbing details are next on "morning joe." voltaren. the joy of movement. ♪♪ ["only wanna be with you" by hootie & the blowfish] discover is accepted at 99% of places in the u.s.

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welcome back. federal investigators are on the scene of a tragic discovery in texas. dozens of migrants found dead in a suspected case of human smuggling. nbc news correspondent morgan chesky reports. >> a sweltering summer day in

texas. where the temperatures top 100 degrees, contributing to one of the country's deadliest human smuggling cases in recent history. the tragedy unfolding monday, in a rural part of san antonio. 46 people found dead in the back of this stifling truck. the first calls coming in just before 6:00 p.m. >> the truck driver is running southbound on foot along railroad tracks. >> police say a local worker made the terrible discovery after hearing cries for help. authorities found the abandoned semi truck with its doors partially opened. >> we're not supposed to open up a truck and see stacks of bodies in there. >> officials say the likely cause of death, heat stroke. incredibly, 16 others survived, including several children. but they were in extremely weakened states when they were taken to area hospitals. >> the patients that we saw were hot to the touch. they were suffering from heat

stroke, heat exhaustion, no signs of water in the vehicle. it was a refrigerated tractor trailer, but there was no visible working ac unit on that rig. >> this horrific scene echoing a similar tragedy in san antonio, where ten people died crammed inside a tractor trailer back in 2017. this year has already seen record numbers of border encounters in the southwest. according to u.s. customs and border protection. texas governor greg abbott tweeting, quote, these deaths are on biden. they are results of his deadly open border policies. san antonio's mayor with a different perspective. >> there are that we know of 46 individuals who are no longer with us, who had families, who were likely trying to find a better life. >> that was nbc's morgan chesky reporting. coming up, it's a headline from "the washington post." frustration and anger rising

among democrats and many are fed up with their own party's leadership. so what does it mean for the november midterms? our conversation with the chairman of the dnc, jaime harrison, straight ahead on "morning joe." n "morning joe." the unknown is not empty. it's a storm that crashes, and consumes, replacing thought with worry. but one thing can calm uncertainty. an answer. uncovered through exploration, teamwork, and innovation. an answer that leads to even more answers. mayo clinic. you know where to go.

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leaders have been strikingly inadequate to meet a moment of crisis. they criticize the notion that it's on voters to turn out in november when they say democrats are unwilling to push boundaries and upend the system in defense of hard won civil liberties. the paper notes some progressive lawmakers are frustrated, democratic leadership has so far appeared unwilling to wield their power in a way they say that is often done by republicans. one activist interviewed by the post talked about similar hesitation by party leaders on issues like police reform and voting rights, saying, quote, it's very similar to what happened in 2020. go back to the voting booths. it always comes back to, now you, the individual, do something. but we've elected these people who are in office at this very moment to take action on things like this. so i don't know.

it's kind of a good point. >> really, we have a senate that's split 50/50. you've got a senator from west virginia in a state that donald trump won by, what, 68, 69 points. you have a senator from arizona who actually has pretty high approval ratings inside of arizona because she's charted a moderate to conservative course. it's called democracy. i'm not exactly sure. i understand it's very frustrating for all democrats, not exactly sure what they expect joe biden to do. >> yeah, and the reaction is always tear down the institutions, if we don't like the way something is going. i don't think everyone in the party agrees with that, but let's turn to the chairman of the democratic national committee, jaime harrison, here with me in new york. it's good to see you this morning. i want to talk specifically about that ruling but just get your take on that story. is there frustration in the democratic party with this president that he should be doing more than saying you have to go vote in the fall?

>> listen, i think there's less frustration -- there's not frustration with the president. it's the fact that these things are happening right now. for the first time in my lifetime, i'm 46 years old, we are seeing america take away rights instead of add and protect rights. i mean, that's just galling. i was raised by my grandparents. they couldn't always vote. my grandmother didn't always have choice over how to control her own body and i thought my kids, we would be building on the rights that they have gained over those years instead of tearing them away. and what we are seeing from this court is just a relentless assault, not only from the court but also from republicans in state houses and in congress, a relentless assault on american democracy and the freedoms that we all enjoy. so what i think you're seeing is the frustration from folks, particularly the young generation. what is this? i have never experienced this in my life. we should be moving closer to what the ideals of the founders are instead of moving back.

and i think that's that frustration. but what we have to do as democrats is to bottle that frustration, take that, and make sure that we build the infrastructure to protect american freedoms, to make sure that long term that we never get to this place again. we have to be more relentless in terms of protecting democracy than the republicans are in terms of tearing it down. and that is the charge for the democratic party over the course of the next few weeks, few month, and the years to come. >> a lot of these trigger laws already now going into place, including in your home state of south carolina where there's a fetal heartbeat law, you can't get an abortion after the point at which they can detect a fetal heartbeat. what is your sense of whether this energizes the people that your job is to go out and get to vote? we're talking about not just democratic women, probably some republican women, independent women. apolitical women whose attention certainly was grabbed by what they saw on friday in this ruling. do you expect women to go out and vote on this issue including some who may not have gone to

vote in midterm elections? >> i think we're seeing right now an energy and an activism, particularly amongst women that we have not seen since the election of donald trump. and the march, the women's march. you know, what we are seeing is that we have this joint effort with the dccc and the dsec, we built out this website, and we are seeing a record number of activists sign up because they want to make phone calls, they want to send text messages. they want to do everything within their power in order to make sure we enact change and we secure their right to protect, to control their own bodies. and willie, i would not be surprised, you know, i grew up in the south, in south carolina, and many times in some of those communities, men and women vote, the husband and wife vote the same way. i would not be surprised that in this election cycle you get women, particularly in areas like the south, where we have

all these trigger laws and they end up pulling a different lever than their husbands. >> coming up, live reporting from capitol hill ahead of today's january 6th hearing set to begin just a few hours from now, but first, one of our next guests is not on board with the term ultra maga to describe trump supporters. in the words of ruben gallego, quote, we should just call them a bunch of weirdos, adding, anyone obsessed that much with any politician by nature is kind of weird. the arizona democrat joins the conversation straight ahead on "morning joe." nversation straign "morning joe."

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52 past the hour this morning we've been discussing the major shake-up to the country's political and legal landscape. following the supreme court's decision to overturn roe v. wade. the latest survey from npr, pbs news hour and marist, shows 55%

of voters oppose the court's decision but the majority of republicans say they support the ruling. joining us now, former republican counsel for the house oversight committee, sofia nelson, the author of the new book entitled "be the one you need, 21 life lessons i learned taking care of everyone but me." i love that. can't wait to talk about it. i want to talk politics and the law first. but we'll get to the book for sure. sofia, i'd like to get your reaction to the decision to overturn roe v. wade and also what you think democrats can do to bring republican women to their side at least to vote in the next several elections. >> well that is a great question, mika and thank you for having me. i was a republican woman for a long time and became a never trumper and i am considered pro-life but i'm appalled at the

supreme court decision because i'm pro-liberty first and i think there is a hypocrisy going on that the democrats will have to be very clear and very straightforward with the american people about, which is how can people say they don't want to wear masks, they don't want to take vaccines, you're hurting my body, you're taking away my liberty, but then you want to take away a woman's right to have autonomy over her own body and i think the democrats have to make that case and that is how you bring moderate independent republican women to the democrats side but they'll have to get a lot tougher and a lot meaner and more clearer or they just may lose this fight. >> and we just spoke to jaime harrison a couple of hours ago and he made that exact point, this is central to the message in the midterm elections. you said, you were a never trumper right from the beginning. we talked to tim miller in the show who has written about the book, the old way, conventional establishment republicans who with donald trump came along, he

didn't recognize. >> yeah. >> what have you seen in among your friends? what do we see now, after clear evidence of the last two and a half weeks of an attempted coup. are the people you know still hanging on on that? >> i think it is pov moving the needle. i think the hearing is interesting. and i grew up in christy top whit map and george herbert walk you are bush and those republicans exist any more. so i think people like me have left the party and become independent and they're gone. they don't have to be con verted and i see people saying donald trump is the problemment which is i suspect they're booing to do. they're going to push this off on trump and they're going to get rid of him. he's not going to be the nominee. >> why do you say that. >> i think he's too damaged. i think desantis is the guy to watch. he's a different kind of trump. he's a more clever, not as scary

kind of trump, depending on how you see it. but people think they could fix this just by getting rid of trump. he's not the problem. he's was the pied piper. this is brewing since 2010 and the supreme court codified how it is. >> and before we get to the book, you said democrats need to get tougher. i'm going to agree with you. and tell us how. if you were advising democrats, for the midterms, for the next election, what would they need to focus on, how would they need to say it. >> think about this. mitch mcconnell is the minority leader in the senate. and look at how powerful he still is. the gun legislation is a perfect example. democrats capitulated and said we have to get something. and the democrats have shown this selves this president to want to be bipartisan. they need to stop that. we need to get mean just like mitch mcconnell and the republicans and realize they're in the majority. they have the house and the senate. and the white house. they need to start acting like

it and they're not. and that is my advice. start leading like you're the leaders. start governing like your the majority. particularly in light of roe, i think it will galvanize young women. this is a big issue for them. and they're not happy about it. >> it certainly is. so let's get to your book. i love it. >> thank you. >> you write in part this, as i reflect on this work, i wanted to do more than just dispense advice. instead what i've tried to do with these life lessons is to give you a window into my life. human-to-human. a window that a-a lous to you see what happens when we do not face our life traumas or our past. a window into the stumbles we all make in life and the recoveries that are still possible if we will just practice good self-care. a window that may have given you glimpses into yourself and in so doing inspired you to make better life choices and to break

free of the often painful bonds of tomic family ties, broken relationships, shattered dreams, or disappointments. whatever it is, that holds you captive, stuck in place or feeling like you just can't catch your breath, my challenge for you is to live and tell me more about why you decided to write the book. it seeps to me also that you're seeing to address things so you would move forwardestly. a lot of people practice avoidance because it is easier. >> well two things. first i want to say thank you to you. i know you're value for featuring everything i do and for having me on. that means a lot to me. sister hood matters. but think it was covid for me. covid was a wake-up call. i got covid not once but twice as you know. and i was very sick the first time. deathly sick the first time. i have damage to my heart and my lungs. i don't look like it but i've had to work on that over the last two years. so it makes you consider your

mortality when you lay there and think have i done the things i want. the three questions what, do i want, what do i need, houp am i feeling and this isn't just a book for women. it is for men and all of us. we all feel it. we're all worried and fearful and angry. there is a new eruption of violence. our political discourse is toxic and we all feel it. workplace burnout, you name it. so i'm trying to give the benefit of 55 years of age now, i hate to admit that but it is true and i know some things to be true now, mika, just as you do. because we've lived and we want to they're sha because hopefully people will do better and that i learn from our mistakes, our stumbles and our triumphs and live better lives. deeper self-care. >> katty kay. >> i think there is flog wong with being over 50rks right mika. >> we all look really good by the way. we're awesome. >> that is true.

>> we're fine. >> what does it look like in practice? because i think a lot of people have come out of covid like you thinking it is time for a re-set. they've realized they didn't like the whole set up of 24/7 in offices that necessarily didn't work for us. but what does it look like in practice in self-care. how could people do it. >> catty, it is good to see you. one of my book endorsers as well as at that than we are because they're socialized differently. but when ask you yourself those questions, what do i want, it forces you to change some things. and so if you talk about practical self-care. >> i'm not talking about going to the beach or spa, that is respite. that is great. i'm talking about doing the hard work of dealing with those things from past, your family drama, the things you vchbts resolved or still want to do to